 Let's get one and everybody I'm calling to order this meeting of the design subcommittee of the Jones library building committee we are proceeding pursuant to chapter 20 of the acts of 2021 meeting remotely. I'm going to ask you to signify your presence at the meeting when I call you just say yes or Sharon here George here. Christine here and we are joined and I'm Austin I'm I'm here and we're joined by Ken Romero from Collier's The first item of business is the election of the chair of this subcommittee and I would love it if someone would nominate make a nomination to serve as chair of the subcommittee. I would like to nominate Christine Gray Mullen Fabulous. I know she's excited to hear that. Are there other other other other nominations. Okay, so all so what I'm going to do is again ask you individually to vote yes Sharon. Yes, George. Yes. Christine. Yes, Austin vote yes Christine the gavel is yours. Oh boy. Um, Well, I'm fighting with my other computer right now to have my agenda up. If you could clue me in on just what the next agenda item is that would be Review the subcommittee charge. Oh, we can do that. Oh, and okay, I can do this. All right. And that would be sharing So yeah, so the design subcommittee charge is in the packet. It's on the town's website, maybe on the library's website. And so here we all are. I thought if you all would allow me, I thought I could share my screen and go over Basically, a really quick update of how we got to where we are today and and in how we're going to move forward what we have in front of us. Is that okay with you all. Sounds great. Oh, there's a hand. Austin. So I think if if it if it's okay Sharon or Christine, I think you should read the charge. You should just read it now. Okay, I know it's available, but we might have people who are participants who would not have seen it. So if you could read it, that would be great. Sure. In addition to the chair of the JLBC as a voting ex officio member, the design subcommittee shall have three voting members appointed by the chair of the Jones library building committee. The focus of the design subcommittee shall be to make design recommendations to the JLBC during the schematic and design development phases of the project, along with refinements to the programming. The design subcommittee shall work with the project designers and OPM on all aspects of the design of the building project. Investigate and recommend to the JLBC temporary locations, taking into consideration the recommendations of the outreach subcommittee. Massachusetts Historic Commission, Amherst Historic Commission, Disability Access Advisory Committee, Jones Library Sustainability Committee, Burnett Art Gallery Committee, and the Jones Library Gardens Advisory Committee. Revise the previous schematics to address concerns identified by the Jones Library staff and the Massachusetts Board of Library commissioners for consideration by the JLBC. Respond to questions or concerns raised by the JLBC. The design subcommittee shall provide input on the designs proposed by the design team and explanations for the recommendations to the JLBC during the schematic and design development phases. And here and seeing Are there any concerns or questions about this subcommittee charge. I'm not seeing any. So at this point that this has been finalized with the town and we just move forward with this. Sharon. Okay, I'll share my screen. I want to bring you to so So here we are. So this graphic that I've got on the screen is how I envision this project. All decisions we make must lead to the big yellow circle in the middle. So we're, our goal is to build a safe, functional and welcoming to all library. And so in my mind. I also see many different special interests and I don't use that phrase in a pejorative way. So these are the smaller blue and green circles surrounding the big yellow circle. So these are all the different program elements that that we as a subcommittee will be considering And as you all become intimately more involved with these designs, you're going to see how difficult a job or architects have So we're limited financially. Our footprint is limited. We're limited by zoning setbacks and having to work with the charm and idiosyncrasies of this 1928 building. It's just not easy. And so we've got a lot of square pegs that just don't fit into these round holes. So it's just, it's a complicated project that we're working on and please hold go. Where are you scrolling. Okay. So in this in this handout back in 2017 A group of us met with members of the NBLC. So this was after we had been awarded the grant we were put on the wait list and the normal process is for the NBLC to share with our design team. Their comments about our designs that we submitted in the grant application. So the NBLC, the Massachusetts Board of Library Commissioners, they're very similar to the MSBA, but it's a little less structured. But that being said, all of the decisions that we make that the building committee makes has to be run by the NBLC. The NBLC has to approve our designs. They're not going to approve To approve any decisions that we want to make that will adversely affect the goals that are in that big yellow circle. It's got to be safe. It's got to be functional and it has to be welcoming to everybody. So I'm not going to read everything that's on this sheet. So for example, the NBLC did require that we moved the large meeting room. Originally, the architects had it on the first floor and now it's in the garden level. Ground level comments included several, several thoughts they had about special collections. They wanted to see glass walls for the exhibit room, more table space in the work room. Things like that. On the first floor they commented about the circulation desk at the time it was in a different location than where it is now. So we've made changes to that. The existing the staircase, the 1928 main staircase in the front of the building that is going to stay. But the NBLC had concerns that it's creating a pinch point there because many patrons will come in through the front door. The young adult room needs to have double doors, things like that. Whoops. In the children's room, they had a lot of feedback there. They wanted better sight lines at the time. It was a long walk from the front door to the children's room. And that has been updated. And at the time the circulation desk was a was a little circular. So it was a little awkward. And since then that's been changed. Second floor sight lines. Sight lines are a big thing. The stacks were too high. The restrooms were tucked away at that point. And that's been changed since. And then on the third floor they were talking about the boardroom being able to be used as a staff conference room. And they were concerned about the size of the staff lounge. So now I want to show you an updated set of designs which does include staff recommendations. So these these designs that I'm going to show you now have been sent to the architects and I feel like this is our starting point. So I'm going to start on the second floor. You probably can't read read the words. This isn't high resolution. So don't don't try don't squint your eyes. I'll just talk you through it. So I'm starting on the second floor and some of the highlights include here where my cursor is staff have added staff offices here because one of the concerns having to do with this rear room, which is the adult nonfiction. There was no staff oversight at the time. So we put offices here so that there will be some eyes happening there. Over here, it will be the reference desk. We've got computers. This is administration here in this darker bluey purple color up here up front. This is all These are going to be the adult reading rooms. It'll be a very quiet space. In fact, this entire floor will be a very quiet floor. The one big change that staff are really advocating for is ESL being moved to this floor. They wanted so we need classrooms for the literacy project, which will also be shared with our ESL department and the tutor rooms along with the ESL collection. And again, here, there's a couple more staff offices for more staff oversight of this space. So the staff did when when they were making these suggestions. They did take into account the square footages. So we know they will fit here. It'll just be up to the architects to see whether or not, you know, aesthetically, they'll like it. Down to the first floor. So down here where this big cloud is that's that's the main door that that we have now the front door onto Amity Street. So you would walk in. On this side, this pinkish salmon color is that's the automated materials handling system. It's where the director's office is right now. The reason it's located here is because you need to have an exterior book drop and an interior book drop. And you need those two spaces to be close to each other so that the conveyor belts on this handling system are minimum the number of conveyor belt. The length is minimized. The smaller it is the less maintenance that will have to occur over time. So that's why it's here. All of this space in the yellow is the entire children's room. So the children's room is being proposed to be partially in the 1928 building and partially to have its new the new addition. With the children's activities room and circulation desk and so there's the there's the kids room all in the yellow. The teen space is here and in the orange. They'll have their own space glass walls so we can see in we can see what they're doing. There's also young adult librarians in there overseeing the adult circulation desk is here in this more more of this pink. And and this is also a space. So we've named it a gathering space. It was originally a cafe space and I want everybody to understand that it's a place you know the flooring is hard. It's a hard surface so it's easy to clean. This is where this is going to be a noisy space. This is people walking through checking out their books talking to their neighbors. This is where there will be cafe table type seating so people can bring their own food and drink and study and chat and whatever it is that they want to do. It's not going to be a place where the library is going to be selling stuff that that's not the that's not the goal. It's bring your own. There's the first floor and then I want to bring you down to the garden level. So here special collections is all on this right hand side. We have tech services here tech services that's our department that processes all of our materials. The benefit of it being here is that the delivery person FedEx and UPS will be able to come in through this existing door we call it the barn door now. And so deliveries will be able to come in there that's where all of our new books are delivered. Again special collections now at the front of this building this is all maintenance and storage. This is all underground there aren't there aren't windows here so we were lucky that we got to put all of the you know mechanicals down there. Up here so this is the door that another what I envisioned to be another primary entrance really because the CVS parking lot is back here. I think that a lot of people are going to want to park in the CVS lot whether it's a garage or not and just walk through the garden and come in through this door. One of the things the architects needs to need to do is is really focus more on making this a beautiful grand entrance and they they know they have work to do on that. But right here in the big blue. That's our large meeting room that was moved from the first floor down to this garden level it will be available nights and weekends will be able to lock off this floor and people will just come and go this way and they won't be able to get to the other floors in the building. There are restrooms here. There's a small meeting room which is the Amherst room that's down here which can also be used nights and weekends and the Burnett Art Gallery again we also want to be able to use that nights and weekends for receptions and things. Right now another important piece of this puzzle is this are the Civil War tablets and they have been planned to go here. Again we're looking for we haven't gotten much farther in this process so we haven't been able to the architects haven't been able to really run wild with how a display could work here for the Civil War tablets, but that's the goal right now. So I think I think that's everything that this is where we'll be starting we do have to hire the architects and the first thing we'll have to do is meet with the MBLC to do exactly this to go over our designs and to hear their feedback. I think that's where we are maybe so my next slide actually brings us to a timeline of tasks and I thought I would hand it over to Ken to talk about that but maybe I should I should answer questions first if you guys have questions. That sounds good. Thanks Sharon, obviously a lot of thought has gone into this and there seems to be reasons for almost everything why something is somewhere or not somewhere. Thanks for that. Does anyone else on the committee here have a question for Sharon about what she's shown us. I see Austin has a hand. Thank you Christine. Sharon, it would be useful if you could just remind everybody of the status of these drawings. So your presentation reference things that quote the staff added. So, I want to make sure that everybody understands what these drawings are and what it means quote that the staff added them. Can you just remind us what is the status of these drawings, what does it mean when you say quote the staff added. And could you also just talk a little bit about the relationship with MBLC going forward. So you said we meet with the MBLC to review these these these diagrams could you talk a little bit about what MBLC involvement will be going forward. Those were a lot of questions. So, okay, so what I mean by the staff added so the designs that we have posted on the website are where they stand with the architects officially and that's those are the plans that the MBLC have seen. But because we ran out of time and we didn't have a contract with the architects. The architects couldn't do any additional work it didn't make sense because you know town council had to still do the vote and then there was the referendum. So, additional work needed to be done. That being said, there were several things missing from the latest architectural designs, including the Burnett Art Gallery, and, and added spaces for special collections. So, the pause in the work that the architects were doing, gave staff a chance to sit down. Gosh, probably a year ago at this point. And we worked through all of the issues that we were having and we are focused really 100% 99% on functionality. So for example, the other in the other designs. I think ESL was on this garden level. And it wasn't making sense for the ESL department to be on that garden level. And I'm not even sure why clustering ES a ESL would be ideal. So I'll go back and look at my notes for all of these reasons. George wants to raise his hand. Go for it. I think one of the main reasons was that they were concerned about accessibility as far as being able to find it, and ensuring that everything was together at one place because when we had them in the basement. I believe the collection was in a different location than the, the tutor rooms. Christine may I clarify my question a little bit. Absolutely. So, I just want to make sure that we all understand that what we're looking at are not the approved schematics. That's very important for people understand these did not the approved schematics. But what you're showing us is as you nicely described it, a kind of something in between. The question of what, of what this committee and the building committee think about any of these proposals is yet to be addressed so that the staff thinks that this ought to be here or that ought to be there. It's just that it's the staff's thinking. That's, is that right. Correct. Yeah. Okay, because I just want everybody understand these are not the approved schematics, and these are not binding in any way on the design subcommittee or the Jones library building committee. And so at some point once the architects are hired. This committee is going to have to look at these things and say what we think about them. So that's an important clarification. The staff just had so many concerns with the, the approved schematics that even the architects admit we're not complete. That the staff just said, okay, we're going to give our recommendations and here's the here was where they were going with it. You had also asked about MVC MVLC involvement so they're going to be, they're going to be our best buds for the next three years they have to approve everything. So we're going to start by meeting with them, and then they will let us go and do our work with the architects and then we will have to meet with them again so probably before. So we still have to finish schematics that we're going to go into design development so you know at each, at each milestone we will have to check in with them they will say yes or no and make recommendations for changes. The building committee the time manager the library trustees will have to approve everything. At the same time where you know thankfully we have this amazing outreach committee that will also be you know gathering input from the community. And with the help of the opm and the architects to be able to say, you know, basically from day one from today. These are the kinds of things that can be changed and these are the kinds of things that can't be changed. So we don't get people's hopes up. So I think that will meet with the MBOC. I would think this committee the design committee. Great. Yeah. I think. Yeah, any other questions. I just want to make a comment and two comments. One is that, even though for some of you all this has been a very long process but I just want to point out that this is good. This is a good thing that staff and and others have had a long time to think about this and think about function and where things need to go because the other opposite would have been sometimes there isn't much time and Sharon was pointing out. It's hard to remember all the wise as time goes on. And I'm sure you all were very good with documentation stuff and if we be and many minds sometimes somebody remember something but anyways this is this is a good thing and I see a lot of thought in this and hopefully as you explain things. It will help the public come up to speed to because sometimes they're late in the game and they're like well I want to thought this would be here but there's already answers to come that way. So just as I'm kind of like an engineer I wonder, I'm not sure who did these drawings, and I, I recommend that on every page of every one of these always you have who made it and the date, because as these keep evolving and changing. You'll, I remember this on planning board you'll get confused is this the old one the before the. So, I know these become the record but maybe even if another set could be added to our minutes whatever that have the date on it. That's awesome. Yeah, it's, it's funny because these are, you know, these are just staff drafts so they're not real they are, they're all dated in my files but yeah this is the first time that it's been, you know, out in the public eye so yes moving forward absolutely and you know certainly I'm just a librarian. Everything that the architects do everything is dated and all of that. Right, right. And that's the beauty of digital. There is the metadata and the dates in there but I just meant like all of a sudden paper copies start to flow, especially with the public, and then it gets confusing so. Thank you. Live in the dream. But thank you that was great. Are there any other questions for Sharon on this. Austin you got any more. I'm just kidding. I just see a hand up. I just want to be clear again. There are many things in this these these diagrams that Sharon has pointed out that do reflect Christine as you said, long thinking by the board of trustees and feasibility committee I mean there are lots of people and this was kind of the, the architects version of not yet final but the architects version of schematics which evolved over time. There are things that are shown in this and these schematics that I think all of us might have thoughts about, you know, whether they're the right things or the wrong things. So, we didn't get the final schematics, and that's going to be a next task for, I think, for, for all of us. And Sharon, the now the now the Goodwin room. What is what is anticipated to be on that level. So yeah, so I don't I don't have that to share right now but yeah, that hasn't changed the third floor the top floor the Goodwin room as you said is the board room that that hasn't changed. And then on the other side of the stairwell top floor that's all the staff kitchen lounge area. Nice. Are there any other questions or we'll move on with the agenda. And if Sharon if you're all done give me a thumbs up. All right, great. So that was design overview item for will go to five, which is process overview, and we welcome guy Romeo, our owner, OPM. Hello. Hi, how are you. Good, how are you. Good. So Ken Romeo with collars. Sorry, my brain. You can all tell I'm sick so I'm doing. Yeah. And I know because it's so public this Ken and Ken so it's, I just really want to change your name I think is what it is, but no problem, but it was good we stayed with Ken to Ken. All right. So share your screen at all or anything. No, I was just, okay. No, I was just going to talk here briefly. So, as you said, it's the process and you guys hit on it several times. The first step is going to be hiring the design firm. And then, you know, finishing as I, as I'm putting it in my head and you know it might be something for the community to consider. And then we're going to have the previous programming phase, and then we're going to move into the schematic phase, just to make that clear break like you were mentioning with the, you know, dates and drawings just to make it a little easier for all of us so in my head I look at what was in the past as the programming phase and now we're going to refine and move into the schematic phase. And, you know, with that it's going to take a few weeks, you know what's going to, you know, I know there's been several discussions but anywhere from 14 to 20 weeks it's not unusual to have, you know, in a process for this. As was mentioned by Sharon, we're going to have several meetings we're going to have several approvals. So it adds on the design team might have only eight to 10 weeks worth of work to do but there's going to be all these meetings and then naturally, not only approvals but an estimate that will go on that will have to work our way through that's going to take approximately three weeks so just so everybody has an understanding there. And then we'll move into the schematic design, as you guys were noting, you know, and then that will lead us into the design development. So it's going to take, you know, on the architectural side, somewhere around 1416 weeks is, you know, our best guess at this point, and then again, you know, estimating is going to take about three weeks. And then if there's any value management, you know, value engineering that needs to go on that takes another week or two the review processes and approvals in there. So we can understand you know that one's going to be a 20 plus week timeframe and then we'll move into CDs. And again that can take anywhere from 18 to 22 weeks to finalize the construction documents finalize the specifications and move through everything there. And then we'll move into the bidding process. We can see, you know, weeks are adding up quickly. So the bidding process will take anywhere from eight to 14 weeks, depending on the approach that's decided to move forward on, and the timing of that, and then we'll get into the construction and that's, you know, at this point, going to be somewhere over a year and a half range, but naturally can't fully understand that until the design is, you know, developed further, as we're just in the programming phase. So, as Sharon noted, I can't can emphasize enough and BLC, they're going to be really, you know, an intricate part of this and have, you know, a lot of weight in the discussions, we have to make sure that we pay attention to the details that they provide and the insight. They are another level of experts on this, not just the design team so, you know, everything that they offer, you know, we need to make sure we weigh and understand fully what they're getting at and don't be afraid to ask questions. They are really an open group and will offer a lot of insight. Sometimes they just offer comments and you might be thinking why is that don't be shy as to ask why. And that actually is everybody here knows, you know, everybody and a few meetings I've been to isn't shy. So it'll open up and create that, you know, open design and thorough thought process which will enhance the project also. If there's any questions, you know, related to process that's again just a really big overview. And, but I'll open it up to any questions, comments, concerns. I don't see any hands yet but I'll ask. So it said like the timeline so what would we expect as I'm thinking about a couple agenda items later when we're thinking about our schedule, which we can talk about it more than figuring out a dates or dates, but what how do you see the next month or two playing out for this group. At this point, the big thing is going to be, you know, we're finding at this point I'm reaching out to a few people and trying to understand the designer, you know, procurement approach that we're going to have to take. So that's the big step at this point, and that should hopefully be resolved. I'm hoping in the next three four business days at most. And, you know, so that covers let's say a week, you know, if it stretches into, you know, the end of next week. And then that's really going to be, you know, hopefully we have the approach, and then we can, you know, step off from there into the SD phase. There are a few things out there that we have to hear back from the Attorney General and the on. Right, so take care of business, take care of money. And then when do you think we would get something to review or chew on in this group. It's going to depend on how things go with the Attorney General, because at this point we, you know, there's there's a discussion going on there on the pyramid process. Okay. So we don't have anything pressing is what you're saying, probably. There's one pressing item it's in my court, Sharon and I've talked about it and reaching out and trying to resolve that now. Okay, good to know. Thank you. All of that. Does anyone have any questions for for Ken. All right, I don't see any so thank you for that update. I think now it says I item six is Q and a I didn't make this agenda so I'm not sure what that means either Sharon or Austin, can you I, I didn't know how this would end up flowing. So I feel like we've, we've already done the Q and a chef. I just didn't want to, you know, all pistons are not firing here. Item eight is topics not anticipated by the chair. I didn't anticipate any of this. So, um, does someone else have something to add to that. I don't see any hands. I have no comment. I have not looked do we have anyone out there, we do. And I see one hand that is up I don't know if it was up before but I'll ask the public welcome thank you for being here. Do any of you all have a question that you'd like to ask someone in this group. Again, I'm only seeing one hand Bob Pam. And can we do we just unmute him or how did I don't know how this one works here. I believe I'm unmuted. Ah, there you are. Welcome, Mr. Pam. Thank you. The question has to do with public participation in this process. And there are people who I know who are interested in both the historic portions of the building. I know there are people who have been talking about the outside design of the building. There may be comments about the proposals for inside the building. So, I just would like to have some clarity as to how that gets incorporated into it because this is a very tight timeline. Going to be difficult to get everything done in the time that we have. So, but that's my question. Thank you for your question. And who here would like to. Or no, just, I don't. All right. So Sharon, do I see your hand? Yeah, I thought I could start and then I'm going to throw it over to Ken. So I feel like so much of it depends on so the architects are going to start. We'll have an initial discussion with the NBLC. And then it'll be up to the architects and to the OPM to really tell us, hey, this can change this can't and you know and everything in between. So, Ken, what do you think? Yeah, yeah, typically what we'll do is, you know, have design review meetings, and then, you know, during the schematic phase at a vision that we'd have probably to where you'd invite, you know, public input and thought to at least be able to provide something. So, you know, with that there would be parameters like Sharon said, and actually we can't change structure, you know, existing historical items that need to be maintained those type of things would, you know, we talk about and then if there are programming, as Sharon was touching on, you know, I'll say adjacencies that are required and, you know, infrastructure issues, whether it's mechanical electrical plumbing those type of things that naturally would, you know, cause cause an effect type items. So, but yeah, we can, we can definitely have a discussion. Thank you. And if I can just build on Mr. Pam's question. And this is because we're a new group here, our subcommittee, where can the public anticipate or be watching for meetings where they're going to be able to have some kind of like is it going to be with us in the design subcommittee or will those public meetings be when after we sort of say like we've reviewed it and are making recommendations and sending it to the larger group and the larger group will handle the public comment, are we going to try to do it in both. I hope, you know, Ken, this is probably you a little bit you've experienced these in other places, how do you see this working in our way. Typically it would go to the building committee, because you'd want the building committee everybody to have the availability and the input themselves and understand exactly what the question is or the concern that's being raised by, you know, the public. So typically here, you know, things would be brought forward and, you know, brought to that group but then the overview would be provided by the design team there, and then we can invite, you know, input by the public. So that's important for us to structure an hospital, go back to you in a sec. Is so the public can come and they'll learn a lot from coming to these design subcommittee meetings but this won't necessarily be the place where we are, you know, getting everyone, it would be better to get the public and the building committees feedback more at a time and to keep it organized. So, maybe somehow we can, I know we're going to have a website or web page or something we should make that a little clear on for the public. So expectations are sort of set like where they're gathering information and where they'll more likely have their place to give wanted input. Austin, you had your head. Thank you, Christine. I just want to remind us that we have a subcommittee on outreach. And then we are going to benefit from the work of that other committee as it thinks about how to involve communities and others and people in the community in this process. The question that Bob asks is in one sense, ours to think about but really in another sense is for the other subcommittee to think about how to reach out how to make sure that the public is involved. In particular communities that have particular interests are involved. And in the charge to our committee that Sharon, hopefully read, we're going to receive recommendations from the outreach committee about things that we can and should do. And then they will assume will follow or or have a chance to review the recommendations of that outreach subcommittee about what it is that with this group and the building committee, the whole building committee needs to do to make sure that people feel that they're fully informed, fully engaged, and that they've been fully heard. Excellent point. And I think is the next few meetings for both us and the outreach committee happen. A lot of this will become much more clear and hopefully clear to everybody else too. So thank you Mr. Pam for your question. That was very helpful. I don't see any other hands up. So I'm assuming there's no one else there who wants to ask something. And I don't see any. Oh, somehow I skipped over. Number seven, I'm doing great today regular meeting schedule so before we all leave. I'm just going to ask can when and anyone else but when do you think we should meet next. I think it comes down to the discussion with the AG so I think to schedule a meeting for two weeks and then if there is, you know, action that we can carry it, but I think it's easier to cancel a meeting that it is to, you know, schedule one quickly so that that's my input on. Okay. So, two weeks sounds reasonable to schedule something and if today's Friday the four. It would be the 18th. I'm traveling that day. I would rather it not be that I don't have to fly to later in the day but if we could. So I guess there's two points here I'm thrown out to everyone. Our Friday's good our Friday mornings good we can still sort of stick to that, but I have a problem with the 18th, or does anyone have a other preferred day, especially you can because I know you're, you know, just fitting us in all the time but any thoughts on that. Okay, I'm going to slide it. I mean so I guess if I'm asking not to do the 18th. Is there another day the next week we could do or could it wait till the 25th. I would be good with the 25th. And mornings work best for me. Okay. What about the rest of you all how would I can do you think it's okay if we wait till the 25th. I think it's okay if we wait till the next two weeks just as a, you know, around easy one. That's all. Then I would appreciate that so if I threw out the 25th at 9am. How would that work with the other members. I see. George is good. Austin's good Sharon. Can I do that can we can I put in my calendar starting on the 25th every, you know, two weeks from there. That was going to be my next question so if we're good on the 25th. The next would be. Oh my God, can it really be April. That would be April 8th and then we have 22nd of April. So we're sort of we could structure those next three for now is that and then, of course, we'll check in at the next meeting make sure this is still working for people. So. Right. We've got those three and they'll be at nine. Okay, I think that's all I have anything else last things or should be just to join a join. Okay. And I'm, I'm one I know Austin, where I just say if everyone's good with it, well let's just adjourn and you don't actually have to be too proper on this, the subcommittee. So I'll see you all at the next meeting. Thank you for coming. Thank you for it and minute taking always appreciate that, Angela. And have a good weekend. I hope you feel better Chris sorry. Yes, feel better. It's been a rough month. Thank you. Thank you.