 Natural resources. I'll start again. Hello, everybody, and welcome to The O'Neal DNA Project. And today we're going to talk about the developments of The O'Neal DNA Project. My name's Sean O'Neal. I'm one of the administrators of The O'Neal DNA Project and we have two other members of the administration group, Fred Mulholland and Dwayne O'Neal. And we also have Ed O'Neal who didn't travel and we, we'd like to thank i'w wneud yw'r gwaith o'r eu cyfnod. Edd was y tyfio'r ffondor yma o'r dynnill yma yw'r dynnill. Mae'n cael eu papur ar y dynnu'r Gweithgaredd, ar gyfer ddechrau'r dynnu, yn ddynnill o'r dynnill o'r dynnu a'r dynnu'r dynnu'r dynnu'r dyfnod. Mae'n cael eu dynnu i'r dynnu'r dynnu'r dynnu'r dynnu'r dynnu'r dynnu'r dyfnod. Fredd a myself joined the project a few years later and that progressed very well and this is followed on by Dwayne, who followed a few years later. Coincidentally, all four of us are engineers, which is something. So the four of us coordinate the project and what we try to do is match up the genealogy of the One Eels with the DNA that we find. And we try and encourage people to select the correct tests so that we can match the DNA to the genealogy. And we try and focus in on new DNA tests as they become available. So just move on. So at the moment we have 645 members in total in the project. 480 of those kits have Y DNA tested, 170 of those to Y 111, 90 to Big Y and 10 kits were still waiting Big Y results. The development of Big Y has been a very significant step for the DNA project and Dwayne and Fredd will talk in detail about that. The remaining kits have also done Family Finder and MT DNA tests, so that's all good. So I think without further ado I'm going to introduce Fredd and he's going to talk to us about the first part of the project. And I'd like to welcome everybody who travelled from America and from Canada, so far it's all yours. Thanks. Well, with luck this thing's going to stay around. Let's see. When Edd started he did have a good starting point better than most of the other projects did. We had genealogy, I call it the barge recitation of the kings of England which led us to have these lines here. You can see the Herman line, the Herbryd line. There were four very distinct groups of O'Neill, each one had an O'Neill founder, the namesake. So they were all related way back, but then they were distinct. So that was a very good thing for Trinity College to work with. Can we actually break out these four groups of O'Neill to say they're different? And they actually came up with a signature, and this was when they only had 37 STRs. They were saying each of the O'Neill's, this is what they are. Now also as part of this, the most famous person within the line of kings that people knew was O'Neill of the Nine Hossages, O'Neill Nile Nar. And so they looked at that and he says, well, if you need to have the SNP M22 to be related to him. Now M22 is older than him, so some of his cousins would also have that. So it doesn't necessarily mean you're absolutely descended from him. But if you don't have it, that means you're absolutely not part of that descended. And the other thing they discovered when they looked at all the O'Neill's and they did that, is group that didn't match anything at all. But they're all up in Ulster, close knit group, didn't match anyone. So they did have to work with that and figure out what that was. Now he talked about the paper that Ed worked on and published about 2005. In that paper he says, let's call this just O'Neill variety, just so we have a way to reference it. So that's that unknown group. Now when you look at the YDNA and you look at the poplo trees that are coming down from R, when you come down six levels, you get down to the M269. M269 is what today Family Tree DNA will give you when you do your very first DNA test. If you're going to be part of these lines, you're going to have the M269. There are, in the group, there are some that are actually, they're not R, they're I. There are some that are not M269, they're another branch. But these are the ones of these four lines all fit under the M269. And then you can go down further. Now the thing about M269, now that Family Tree has put out their Y hoplo tree, you can go in and see how many people there are. There are approximately 77,000 people that have done and became M269. Of those, about 15,000 have done nothing else. They're just stuck there. They have not done any further testing. So that's where it would be good to get a little further testing, move down the tree. Now all of these groups, again, are down the tree and other five levels to the P312. So again you're just coming down closer in time. And that one, if you go over to the big tree, they actually have dates on there. And they put on a date of their 2675 BC. But you actually have come down in time closer to the present. P312 is where things split off the first time. That's where this O'Neill variety goes one direction. Everything else comes its own way. And they call the first branch they have is the Z290. Then it goes down and gets up with DF13. And that, in the meantime, to the common ancestor, you're at 2145 BC. You really came a lot. But that's where then everything starts breaking down into what are these four groups that were part of the original genealogy. Now, again, the dates are from the big tree. They have a way of calculating dates. But dates you have to take with plus or minus 25%. So although it gives a date here, that's approximate. You can't be those are not hard dates that you can set in stone. So this actually does kind of match up with the bargery citations a bit. If you think about about a 1690 or so. Now, as an American, I can never pronounce that name so I'm not even going to try. But that's your first branch. And again, these snips, all the snips have a name. And the first letters say who came up with it. And then they just number them so that they make no sense whatsoever but they're there. So that branch, then the unil branch goes down another way. And then what you didn't particularly expect was the Thoman and Leistor come together one level down before they branch. And that's not really what was expected. But that's the way it has ended up going. Now, within the project, we break it into groups. And the first group we had there was one A, the unil. And in there, what happens when they say it's an M2222, that's actually a block of 15 snips that happened we all assume sequentially. And if you look at those and say, well, how long did it take to get those mutations? It's about 2,000 years. So you have about 2,000 years where there's no branches. This just goes from one point down to the other. Now you're 140 BC. And again, this is before Nile of the Nine Hossages. And naturally, this is at this time. And at his time, you're still well before surnames. Now in doing the big Y test, we had this large group. And it appeared also everyone was going to be what's called a DF105109. That's because Family Tree DNA uses one number. The Big Tree uses the other number. So you put both down there. So that way you'll be able to find it. That brought us forward to about 390. I think there were only two that did big Y within the large group of the M222, which did not follow this path. And so they're still sitting there at the M222 level. Now in looking at the DF105109, all of a sudden you look at them, more people did the big Y, more did the big Y. Half of them fell into this other SNP. So we broke that out and put it out separate. And so we formed 1A1A. Therefore you can say it's branching down. But that's one of them. We have the other people left in there. And there's five different SNPs where they could come down. So you've got six branches there. I've only identified one. The others have one, maybe two there. So we're still trying to build up enough people to say there's enough to really have a branch. One of the things I hate is to look at here, and here is a branch with one person. I don't like those, so I try to avoid those totally. So make sure that there's a couple of people in there. The other thing we found here is that if you look at a person who's in this group, and we go to his page and say, well, how many matches does he have, and then how many are in the O'Neill project, two to 15% are in the O'Neill project. So there's a lot of people that just haven't bothered or joined the O'Neill project, which could help identify and tie this together closer. Particularly if anyone has done a big Y, you need to try and get those that have done a big Y grouped together in the same project, and preferably the O'Neill project. This just shows essentially what I was saying, where things happened. You'll notice under the 39, 589, they're on the left, I got a slash. That means there are some branches before you get down to M222. Under that, I have number of people. And again at M222, you're before surnames. So in 1A, there's 63 people of those. 39 or O'Neill are some variant of that. We broke out the 1A1, there's 24 people, only four are the O'Neill. 1A1A, there's 14, there's only three. So this is not necessarily the best branch for the O'Neill surname. It turns out, as I said, there were six branches, this is one. This is not the branch with the most snips underneath it, there's another one. But right now within our group, there isn't enough really to break out another group. But if you look at the FGC triple 134, there's only 20 in there, but 19 of them are O'Neill. So this is a group where the O'Neills are joining if they're in that group and going in there. But again, it's only 2-15% of the people that have that snip. Then I show we got the breakout of the Thoman and the Leinster. And when I put, it's like a 1D, a 1L, that is the group. If you go to the O'Neill project, you look at the groups, that's the group. Now as they've been doing the big Y, and I look at that and say, well, I probably need to move some people back and forth. The 1D is the one that was identified at first, that is going to be Thoman. But with that same snip change, there was another group whose STRs didn't quite match, which is why we have a 1L. So the STRs don't quite match, but they both come down the same snip tree. But you're quite far back in time. So it's hard to say. You're still around 1600 BC. So you could have some changes there. And then we have the Leinster, which again, here we have 15, with a surname of O'Neill or their variant out of 22 in the group. L513 is a couple of groups there because their STRs don't look the same. And we don't really know what that group is. What are they? They're just unknown. They have shown up. They're in here. But again, there are some with the name O'Neill, but they don't seem to fit these categories that were created. DF21, there's the COLA. Now the three COLAs were assumed initially to be part of the M222, but they are not. And the COLAs have their own website that goes in the whole thing and explains where they came from and the fact that they came over to Ireland later and they were not part of the original group that came over. And we only have two in there. Glen of Ahelo, that was a group that sort of self-identifies as we want to do this. They do show up separately, if you look at the DNA. Interestingly enough, the one down at 3G at the very bottom, turns out he should be moved up there because he's done the big Y, it shows that he matches back into that group so we can move him back up there. And there's 3E. We just don't know what it is. Where'd he come from? Now we're going to talk a little bit about O'Neill variety and then I'm going to hand it over to Dwayne to go into the gory details about this. But the real question was, where does this sit on the hopla tree? And a number of people, including me, were very frustrated for many years because we're stuck at 312. No SNP below 312 until he got big Y. Then they started doing things and they came up with the DF-27, was identified, now we can have a branch. After a while, they came up with the pH 2047. Hey, there's a branch under that. Then they came up with the Z1513. This group is Z1513. Everyone in the group will be that, although many of them still are stuck at M269. If they test, they will come down to Z1513. Okay, so here's a group. What are they? Well, it turns out that they replaced the Tyrone O'Neill line. That if you start looking, coming down the line of the kings of the O'Neill, who's in charge, who's the lead, the O'Neill, all of a sudden it switches over and becomes the Z1513. So if you look at this group, and this happened before the Clannaboy's split, so you got the Clannaboys, you got the Tyrone, you got the Fused and the Exchange, all fall into this category. So this is after the O'Neill name was in place. We have some O'Neill name M222, and then all of a sudden this one takes over. Where it came from, we don't know. One of the things is, this is another one where there's a block of 25 snips, and there's no branches. So you're going back 3,000 years. Where has it been for those 3,000 years? We don't know. Now I put on some guesses here. Scotland is Spain for two reasons. One is, my assumption has been, which is good as anybody else's assumption or is bad, that they brought in warriors to help the Irish into fighting the war. If they brought over, typically they would come maybe from Scotland. The reason I have Spain there is double because Spain and the Irish worked together fighting against English. And if you look at the DF-27 project, there's a lot of arguments about the origin of that, and there's a large group that says, my God it is the Spask in Spain, up in northern Spain. So it could be. My assumption is, which is pure assumption, is that they had this people come over there helping to fight. One of them was a very natural known good leader, good fighter, marry him off to a daughter. He's got a foreign name, change it to O'Neill. Two generations later it's all O'Neill's. But that's a company that might have happened. You just don't know, and we probably never will know. But I like that one. And now I think it's time for Dwayne to get into the gory details. Thanks, Ryan. Get the focus of my portion of this presentation will be on the O'Neill variety group. And the O'Neill variety is associated with, as Fred mentioned, half a group Z1513, which is downstream of P312 and DF-27. The O'Neill variety groups are 1B and 1B1 and the O'Neill surname project with about 117 members in total. The main group of about 29 members is negative for the downstream SNP BY3292. The BY3292 positive subgroup has about 24 members. In addition, there is about 64 members that are very likely said 1513 positive, but may or may not be positive for BY3292 since they've only tested to 67 or fewer SDR markers. This is a slide of the big tree for Z1513. About 25 kits so far have upgraded to big Y and this is currently the Z1513 clade representation on the big tree. The Z1513 SNP block, as Fred mentioned, also named FGC 49734 on the big tree, has about 25 SNPs. That's shown right there. Oops, I hit the wrong, there we go. At present there's four subbranches including BY3292. I'm good to that second time. We just show them there. Then another branch, BY32400. Then a larger branch, BY3127, I'm sorry, this is BY32400. Then a third branch, this is BY31270. I'm going to practice this. Then there's a fourth unnamed branch here. A niche analysis for the most recent common ancestor of Z1513 was completed and it was done based upon taking the average of the unmatched variance plus the name SNPs for all the kits and using a range of 100 to 144 years on average per SNP. The most recent common ancestor estimate for Z1513 was 832... OK. Thanks, Morris. The age analysis for the most recent common ancestor for Z1513 is 830 to 1170 AD. Then using a similar approach for the most recent common ancestor estimate for BY3292, that would be right in here, would be 1250 to 1465 AD. This is another representation of the Z1513 big Y kits. 14 kits have completed big Y testing for this quad that are BY3292 negative with results from another three kits expected soon. Most of the kits have an O'Neill related surname with some of the kits specifically identified from the fuse and the McShane branches. Note that the eight big Y kits under BY32400 is once in here. OK, don't have any SNPs to identify potential subbranches. One would expect that one or more SNPs for each of these potential branches since SNP variants occur on average, as it mentioned, every 100 to 144 years. It appears that for about a 300 year period no SNP mutations occurred resulting in each of the potential BY32400 subbranches not being identified by SNPs. Not shown on the slide are additional 12 kits that are part of this group based upon signature STR markers. Both the big Y and the STR kits are shown on this slide with some signature STRs at it. The first signature STR is DYS435 which is highlighted in green near the top. This one here. The modal value is 12, but it mutates to a value of 11 for the BY3292 branch which is shown on the right. Next STR DYS534 in general has a value of 14 for the two leftmost subbranches rather than the value of 15. The DYS449 in general appears to differentiate the center branch from the two on the right. Finally DYS715 values appear to differentiate the two leftmost branches. So, in essence here, we're using a combination of SNPs and STRs to put in the overall form of branching for Z1513. Now, this here is a slide shows a very simplified version of the traditional genealogy for the Tyrone McShane fuse branch. The Clannaboyl Neal and the Tyrone McShane fuse branch split about 1,200 AD with the sons of Lazy Youth O'Neill. Lazy Youth is here and so then there is the branch here for the Tyrone fuse McShane and the second branch for the Clannaboys. You may recall that the Z1513 most recent common ancestor was estimated to be around 830 to 1170 AD which would have been prior to these two branches forming. And you also may recall that the BY3292 most recent common ancestor was estimated to be around 1250 to 1465 AD which is more recent than the two branches forming. Some of the Z1513 kits that are BY32 negative have also been associated with the fuse and McShane branches. Next we'll look at the BY3292 positive plate with 24 kits as shown in subgroup 1B in the O'Neill project. This is the O'Neill project listing for 1B1 and then as shown on the right are most of the BY kit, big wide kits on the big tree. So this next view combines the big wide results with STR and SNP results. So I'm not expecting you to take this all in at once. So what I'm doing is doing going to do three slides over next to how it builds up to this one here. So it will build up by overlying big wide results with signature STR results and finally specific SNP results. This slide shows the 11 BY3292 big wide kits and the likely position of the three kits with big wide test results pending and those kits are indicated by the yellow and green box colouring. So we're expecting within the next few weeks to get results from these three kits and we're expecting them to maybe form subbranches as a possibility. So there's three branches. One of the branches in the center has two subbranches and the third branch, which on the right may have three subbranches. It's likely that the leftmost branch which will form one or more subbranches when the latest big wide results come in. Note that the big wide kits have on average only 2.5 unmatched variants with some kits only have one unnamed variant. All these kits then have common ancestors that are within the range of traditional or genealogy research from the late 1700s. As you might recall that SNPs on average develop every 100 to 144 years. Here's a summary with all the 24 BY3292 kits and you might recall that all the Z1513 kits that have tested positive for BY3292 have a value of 11 for STR-DYS 435. Let's state it right there. And so that's how we've been able to identify that all these kits are likely BY3292 positive through the STR number 111. Kits that have tested to 111 STR markers all have value 11 and been added to this year. And the ones that have just done STR markers are highly played with the yellow background. Another STR-DYS 710 is highlighted by the yellow line. In general, DYS 710 has a value of 35 for the Latinose branch being BY31266. And the value of 34 or 33 for the two rightmost branches. In addition, there appears to be specific STRs whose values are associated with some of the BY3292 subbranches. So in using these signature STRs we've been able to then using the signature STR marker values we've been able to serve all the BY3292 identified kits we tested for specific SNPs related to a branch based upon the signature STRs. The kits that complete and confirm positive for a specific SNP are highlighted in a teal collar. These ones down here, they just tested for a specific BY31266 SNP and they were positive, certainly with these kits here. That leads us back to the slide that we saw three back. And as indicated, but half of the kits have identified their ancestor with an O'Neill family surname and the other kits have identified their ancestor with another family name. Just less than half of the kits have identified their ancestors of being born in Ulster. Five of the kits are associated with County Antrim. Three are from County Tyrone and another kit from County Dairy. Most of the other kits have identified the United States as their ancestor's location. One of the kits in FGC 3726 in this area here has their ancestor connected to Feilmbach O'Neill who died in 1533 and is the ancestor of the O'Neill's of Eden Duff Castle. The three kits with ancestors identified from County Tyrone are all from the leftmost branch, BY31266. County Tyrone is typically considered the traditional territory of the Tyrone O'Neill's so further investigation is required to reconcile how the BY31266 and other BY3292 branches are related through genealogical research. This here as a slide shows a very simplified version of the traditional genealogy of the Conaboy branch. The Conaboy O'Neill and the Tyrone McShane Fuse branch split around 1200 and as I mentioned before with the sons of lazy youth O'Neill. You may recall that said 1513's most recent common ancestor was estimated to be 830 to 1170 AD which would have been prior to these two branches forming and also as I mentioned before BY3292's most recent common ancestor was estimated to be around 1250 to 1465 AD which is more recent than the ancestor of the Conaboy's Hugh the Bones ring. So the estimate for BY3292H is in around Hugh the Bones. So various Conaboy's seps are highlighted on the slide so these are just some of the ones that have been identified through traditional genealogy. This here is still a simplified version of some of the Conaboy's seps from the 15th century onward so it includes the O'Neill's of Lisbon and the O'Neill's of Eddinduff Castle which is called Shane's Castle now in the past few hundred years and the O'Neill's of the Dommel of the Braid and then even more recent than that are some other seps of the Conaboy O'Neill's as indicated here. So we'd like to identify the Conaboy's seps that are associated with BY3292 sub-branches so connecting traditional genealogy with the genetic information we have. So we're in the process of recruiting members to upgrade to big Y that have documented O'Neill lineage. This would be very helpful in matching the O'Neill seps to the SNP branches. Some of the specific Conaboy lines of interest include the O'Neill's of Lisbon and the O'Neill of Viva and the line of Hugh O'Neill who may be the son of Brian John who immigrated to Virginia in the 1700s. We're encouraging all O'Neill variety kits to upgrade to 111 STR markers. This would confirm that the kits are either BY32 positive or negative and provide information for further SNP testing. We'd like to assist kits that have hit the Irish traditional research early 1800s brick wall through appropriate DNA testing. That's why I agree there. Finally, per summary, the project is just one example of many surname projects that have made significant advances through broad based STR and big Y testing. I'm certain that there's members here within other surname projects that have had similar results. We are now very close to relating identified HAPO groups to specific O'Neill seps. I'd like to do a sincere thanks to all the kits in the FTDMA O'Neill project especially those that have completed big white upgrades. We feel that we're in the golden age of genealogy research by using a broad range of genetic genealogy tools. Thank you. Thank you. Sean, c'mon up here. Have a seat, Dwyne. Thanks very much for a fascinating project. The O'Neill plan is just such and the O'Neill surname in general is fascinating surname because it's one of the oldest in Ireland. In fact, what I'm going to do is I'm going to give you this and I'm going to take that so that you don't bother fiddling with it because it is very, very fiddling. So it's great to see the big strides that you're making in the project. Where do you get most of your genealogy from? I'm directing this at Sean because I saw him with a big book earlier on. I'm very happy to announce that my dad did the genealogy of all the main branches of the O'Neill and I have a copy of it there. People want to see it. Unfortunately, it's out of print at the moment. So it covers all the main branches of the O'Neill and we're trying to actually find the DNA associated with all the main branches so that when people come and approach us, we can say this is what you want. If you want to do a test, here's a test to do and from that test we'll be able to identify which branch you're associated with. Thank you, Sean. You can hold on to the microphone. This one's working fine now. Now the O'Neill's have spread out of course all over the world. So are most of your membership coming from America, Ireland? What about some of the places they went to? Because they went to the countries in Europe that they would not possibly be speaking English. They went to the Caribbean where you've got O'Neill's in Puerto Rico. So where are your membership coming from? The majority of our members are from the United States but we do have significant numbers from Europe specifically the UK. Obviously we have loads of members in Ireland and in Northern Ireland. We also have members in France. We have members down in South America. We have members from Russia and I'd like to welcome Lydia from Russia. So we are spread around the globe. In many ways the O'Neill diaspora is quite unusual in the sense that most of the Irish diaspora would have been if you like poor people emigrating to find a better life. But the O'Neill's had to kind of flee the country. It was the flight of the Urals. So you actually went to places that maybe a lot of other Irish people wouldn't have gone to. I'm not a historian but we did. Obviously we went to Spain and we joined the armies there. We went to France and joined the armies there. As a result we fought in lots of lots of wars around Europe and I suppose we also fought in the United States as well. So which of you guys speaks Russian then? You speak fluent English I'm sure. But have you actually found that you've had to use Google Translate a lot for example? Not really, no. I think a lot of lots of people speak English and put the rest of us to shame. Questions for the O'Neill team. So we have one from Jared here. I'm going to use my microphone. You can hold on to that. Yes, a few suggestions and a question. I have a volume at home. It's a great book of Irish genealogies. 3,600 pages of ancient genealogies. I'm just wondering how many of you think you will identify in matching the ancient genealogy to the SNP? Right? In other sources Barczewski published over 100 detailed genealogies of chiefly lines. OK. And they are all available online. The one which intrigues me is the I think the 13161 which is year 27 and we all know that I frequency the year 27 is Iberia. So have you found the Malaysian connection? Have you just passed the microphone there to Fred? No, that's where we find the fact that our DF 27 we have a whole block of 29, 25 SNPs before it shows up here. So if you look at that 3,000 years where has it been for 3,000 years? And so it probably made some path. Maybe it came directly from Spain, maybe it came from Scotland, someplace else. But we don't know where it came from and I would love to find out. It is a tantalising mystery, isn't it? Other questions for the O'Neill project team? We have several here. So I'm going to come down to this lady here. There we go. I'll hold it for you. Sean, I want to know about your little black book. Oh. Can we acquire a copy of that? I'll have to get it republished. You have to get it republished. So it's not available at the moment? No. OK. But that's something to put on your Christmas wish list, definitely. Question here. Can you pass that microphone to each other? The southern O'Neill's defendants of the northern O'Neill's are at the sitting on the same timeline horizontally. Which of you would like to answer that question? Which O'Neill's are you referring to? The southern O'Neill's and the northern O'Neill's. There's a break between the southern and the northern O'Neill's. As far as I can tell, both of them are are urgent about the same time. Both start back around the year 1,000 plus or minus. So it's an old name in both places. So is there a genetic but there would be a genetic connection at some point in time between the two. Would you think that it might be 2,000, 3,000, 4,000 year back rather than 1,000 years back? Well the connection between them as far as we can tell is the the DF-13 which dates back to around 2,000 B.C. Or maybe you can call a 1650 you know it depends. There's a margin of error there and you want to just go back to what the bar would say where it should be from Alicia. But it's well before the time of certain ends and well before the time of the game of the class. Oh yeah. Great. We have a question here from Jim. Come in, thank you. So I'm wanting to explore the possibility of putting together a SNP pack that would you know leverage the results of the big wide testing and then help you parse out the different individual results. Can you actually do that though? Put a SNP pack together for all of the emails or would you have to have several SNP packs for each of the branches? Well for for BY-32 92 positive we've had very good success at using signature STRs to recommend a specific SNP test and so that was shown in one of the slides where I think all but one recommended SNP test came back as positive. Now for the group for BY-32 92 negative being the Z-1513 group right now we had as I mentioned the branches seems like there was a SNP desert there for 300 years where the as you recall on the slide the three branches on one side don't have any specific SNPs and so we're using at this point in time STR values but we're hoping that over the next short while the more new big wide test will flesh that out. And we have a question from Patty Walton I'm trying to figure out who discovers these new SNPs I understood that BY Holding it away from you I can't hear myself I understood that BY indicated it was discovered by family tree DNA and was from a big wide but when I checked Sean on the big tree he's a BY but on family tree he's still a Z and BY-32 400 isn't even in the family tree DNA family tree family tree doesn't recognize BY-32 400 because it's in the BY-Z 19 region but the big tree recognizes that particular SNP and that's why it's shown on the big tree family tree as a branch part of what we're looking for is we're looking for places we're actually looking for additional SNPs to break it up because what we ended up with was everyone in parallel no common SNPs so they came up with one which is not a strong one but it's at least a way to show some grouping and they did say that the others did not have that so it's a weak one but it did show a little bit of a way to break it up and it's been consistent too it's been consistent too great okay well I think it's fascinating work that you're doing and the way that the project is evolving is incredible you're discovering more branches and of course the value for the people that are actually in your project is that they can hang their genealogies on your SNP slash STR tree like Christmas baugles on a Christmas tree so that's the invitation to all the O'Neils there's also another invitation to all the O'Neils and Sean if you take that microphone and just let them know everybody's entitled to join us in the land sound room for a drink afterwards if you want to continue this discussion okay thank you and on that note it just remains for me this wonderful expert panel for the incredible great work that you're doing on the O'Neil project and hopefully you'll come back in a few years with another update and bring some more O'Neils with you so ladies and gentlemen I give you the O'Neil see you next time thank you