 Gene Dinkins. Also like to introduce staff, the zoning administrator Rachel Bailey and Hannah Slice, associate planner. We're also assisted by Andrea Wolfe, the land use board coordinator. The board is charged with hearing applications for special exceptions, variances and administrative appeals. All testimony is recorded for the record and anyone wishing to speak will need to be sworn and must come up to the podium to speak. No testimony will be taken from the floor. When you come up to the podium please state your name and please speak clearly into the microphone because the meeting is being recorded. For those of you who plan to speak, you must be sworn. So if you're here as an applicant or here to speak on any of these cases please stand up at this time and raise your right hand. Do you affirm or attest that the testimony you will give today is the truth and nothing but the truth? Thank you. Now I'll turn the meeting over to Rachel. Good morning. So first I would like to go over the meeting format. Applicants with requests before the board are allotted a presentation time of 10 minutes. This time should include what is not limited to an overview of the project, case history, and any pertinent meetings held regarding the request. This time also includes all persons presenting information on behalf of the applicant. Any member of the public may address the board in intervals of three minutes or five minutes if acting as a spokesperson for an established body or group of three or more. The applicant then has time for rebuttal. So the board reserves the right to amend these procedures on a case-by-case basis and we will be using timers this morning. So first on the agenda is the consent agenda. So the board uses the consent agenda to approve non-controversial or routine matters by single motion and vote. If a member of the board or the public wants to discuss an item on the agenda, that item is removed and considered during the regular agenda. The board then approves the remaining consent agenda items. So the first matter on the consent agenda this morning is to approve the March 13th, 2018 minutes. So item number three on the agenda, 1108 Barnwell Street, Utility A. That's a special exception to establish a wireless communication facility, a cell node on a utility pole in a residential district. Item number four, 2018-0021. This is 2231 Lady Street, Utility A. This is another special exception for a cell node. Item number five, 2018-0026, 1701 Pendleton Street, a variance to the side yard setback requirement. Item number six, 2018-0027. This is for 104, 112, 116, 120, and 124 River Ridge Road, variance to the side yard setbacks. Is anyone here on any of those properties would like to have those taken off the consent agenda? Please come up to the podium now, raise your hand and let us know. I see no one that objects to not keeping those on the consent agenda, so I'll entertain a motion. A motion to approve the consent agenda subject to all conditions that were in the staff comments. A second. You have a motion and a second. All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed. The consent agenda is carried. This next item, I'm going to have to recuse myself. Our company is involved in this property, so I will be stepping down and Mr. McMeakin will be taking over. Thank you. All right. First item on the regular agenda, item number seven, case 2018-0013. This is 3006 Divine Street. It's a variance to the off-street parking requirement for a proposed restaurant use. The applicant is here and is welcome to come forward and speak. Thank you. Thank you all for hear us. My name is Frank Cason and Cason Development Group. We are the owners of the building at 3006 Divine Street, bought it about six to eight months ago. With the idea of repurposing the building, we felt like the highest and best use of the building was a retail use. So we've been working to find someone to come into this space. We've talked with a number of different folks just for some degree of background all around the city as well as outside of the city and around the state and outside of the state. We found the one tenant that we were the most interested in. We felt it was the best fit for the building and the area. It was a tenant by the name of Back Streets. This is a restaurant out of Hickory, North Carolina. It's family owned and operated as you can get. We went and personally visited the restaurant ourselves in Hickory and walked in and mom, dad, brothers, sisters, everybody's there working in the kitchen and the front of the house, etc. So they've been in business for almost 23 years I think and this will be their first location outside of Hickory. They have a son who will run and operate this location. His name's Casey and Casey's here today and able and willing to speak if you guys would like. He went to USC. That's how they're familiar with the area and the market as well as Divine Street. So just a couple of things because I think there's been some misinformation as can happen with these projects that has been put out there. They are a restaurant. I think they'd be okay with me saying that they 20-something years ago restaurants named themselves Bar and Grill and now that's not really very common. So this restaurant would be called Back Streets. Not Back Streets Bar and Grill, just Back Streets. They do have a bar but the most comparable restaurant that I have to compare it to is Harpers or was formerly Harpers. You guys are somewhat familiar with and that they are attempting to appeal to a wide range of age groups and they have a big menu with a number of different items on it. So it is family-friendly. That is their core. That is their focus. That should be evidenced by the fact that a number of people have asked them why they have not looked at the Harpers building. I know there's been hot topics somewhat recently and their reason was they don't want to be in five points because this is a more of a family-friendly area. So to me that speaks to who they are and who they are trying to be in this market as well. Oddly enough in Hickory, Cher, Park and Lott also with the church. I think you all provided with a letter from that church that was a strong recommendation of support for them as well as a number of different community members. I think the sheriff of Hickory maybe wrote letters and folks like that. So they're very well respected not just community members but restaurant in Hickory. I think their track record speaks for itself. A number of people have asked about things like closing hours and a lot of concern. I think we've been roped into a lot of the concerns about five points and late openings and late closings rather and that is not their intent at all here. A number of people have addressed the fact that in Hickory they are open till 2 a.m. and that is not what they're going to do here. Their plans are to close at 11 here. So they have no desire or plans to open past 2 a.m. closing time which they do in Hickory but that's not the case here. So we have the building currently has 18 parking spaces on site. As you can see this is currently an office building rematch as I said. To the left on this slide is urban cookhouse and then to the right is Sadler Insurance Agency. So our variance request is for a reduction of parking. The required number of spaces is eight spaces per thousand square feet. We have four spaces per thousand on site right now. I know that you all are not able to make decisions based on what else is on Divine Street. We did do a study of our own. It was in a formal parking study but we looked at other restaurants on Divine Street. The average today that we found was about 4.4 spaces per thousand. So we're right on that average. We have more gross parking spaces at 18 than any other restaurant on Divine Street with the exception of Urban Cookhouse directly next to us. But we also we were concerned ourselves as well as the restaurant about parking from day one. Wanted to make sure that we had enough to accommodate the restaurant and the neighborhood what we knew would be neighborhood concerns about overflow parking. So we do have secured three different locations for all site parking that two of which are immediately adjacent to the site. One to the right behind Sadler Insurance Office. One to the left behind an acupuncturist and one block down the street behind Riverside Church. So all together that was 10 spaces to the right 9 to the left and 12 behind Riverside Church. So that is a total of 49 parking spaces which is way more than anyone on Divine Street has access to that we're aware of. And it puts us at about 10 parking spaces per thousand square feet if you include all those spaces. I think there are renderings of the building. The plan for the building is to use the existing footprint of the building that and that alone. We'll push back the front to have outdoor open seating that will be covered but outside. And any other questions that you'll have for me or the owners of the restaurant. Let me ask you a couple of questions. So the hours of operation will be from when to when. Do you want to do you want to come up to the podium just so I can thank you. We currently Monday through Friday open at 11 a.m. again it will be different here our closing hours and on weekends we open at 11 30 a.m. and like you said we're shooting to serve up until 11 p.m. what my assumption is is that DOR has authority and would be involved in this but given some different cases and what's going on in the city so y'all are going to provide I think enough food to that that's not going to come into question that there's been some questions with some different businesses in different parts of the city that aren't currently meeting that requirement my assumption is it's with y'all being basically a restaurant or looked on your website and I see liquor on one slide but it's a restaurant but that's not going to be an issue is meeting that requirement that the DOR. No sir in NICRI we are over 70% of our sales come from you all have copies of the leases what what is the term of the lease if you don't mind me asking Frank between you and back streets. Seven years seven years y'all have leases that you can provide us with with these different offsite places that y'all are making arrangements for and again so if you're you're talking about 49 in total and the request is to reduce the 18 to 9 that's what makes sure my math works so it's 40 other spaces that are 30 other spaces 30 where'd the 49 come from that's with what we have on site okay that okay we can provide confirmation from all three owners that we have leases in place with you have that with you today yep you've got what are the those leases what are the terms of those leases the time parameter of those have to be honest we're advised not to share the specific terms of those leases none of them are the full seven years and that was for everyone's risk factor with that they're already tied to a pretty pricey long-term lease we're hoping for the best and making provisions for the best meaning best case scenario the restaurant does really well and we need all that parking but worst case they worst case they go out of business of course second worst that they they don't do as well as as we hoped and don't need all of that parking which that parking that we just mentioned was over and beyond what I guess the concern the concern can be as if and you're going along where I'm thinking so in the first 12 24 months restaurant doesn't perform as everybody hopes and it's a 12 month lease then what we've given you permission to do you know with the reduction in parking how do we ensure that that that because I think that that that's what a lot of people have got concerns about is where does that come after you open so what happens in 12 months you know 12 months in a day and the restaurant's not hitting its numbers or you are hitting your numbers where's the teeth that people are gonna hopefully have some some comfort level with there's gonna be ample parking we can we can provide evidence from the owners that we have leases in place I can tell you they all have automatic renewals in them as well can we sit here and guarantee 49 spaces for seven years the hope is that we need those spaces and that means that it's a good restaurant that I guess again just kind of my thought pattern do well after the first 12 months and you need those spaces but the lease expires you don't have to renew them so there's a need for the spaces but there's no requirement to maintain them see where I'm going yeah I mean again I'll go back to what I said to start with the need for spaces is as much as it may be more important to the restaurant as to residents because we don't have parking and people want to come they will not come and one of the first things he said to us we talked about lunch traffic and Casey said honestly lunch traffic is dictated largely by the parking the amount of parking you have because if you don't have the parking they go somewhere else right so the need for spaces is critical to the restaurant as well so I can assure you that is something that if they're doing really well and eat all the spaces they're not gonna back out of this back out of but at the same time they have to have some flexibility if things don't go perfectly and I think the requirements here are 8 per thousand square feet do think it's worth noting that's not necessary that's not the requirement for every area of the city of Columbia Main Street for example is zero parking spaces North Main where we've done a number of restaurants has a 20% reduction from that the Vista as well I mean so the 8 per thousand although a city the current city requirement it's not necessarily a requirement that applies to all restaurants in Columbia and again as we showed we've got a parking and I can hand that out to y'all as well as spreadsheets showing there's not any other restaurant on Devon Street that has that amount of parking right now okay should you should you do well and should you continue to operate that we set up some sort of a condition that would require you to keep maybe not the 49 spaces but the 36 which would be what would be required anyway I would advise against that zoning would not really have a mechanism for enforcement for that as a condition to a variance we have a special exception for a least parking and that's our enforcement mechanism for that also with that that and as part of a variance that now I want to make sure that so Rachel help me with this so when we've had different applicants come before us that are go pick one on Devon Street some to Lula Henry's whomever and they have to provide off-site parking was that part of a variance or did they have to get a special exception first and then come get a variance to rolled up in one that that's where I'm just still unclear and without those approval approvals in front of me I'm not sure but if done correctly it should have been required to get a special exception to enforce any off-site parking okay I think which is big somewhat educated to to Lula specifically which is a large arrest is about 5300 square feet versus 4500 they have 15 on-site parking spaces we have 18 and they receive the variance for parking as well they do not they do not provide any off-site parking at all they don't have any parking was that something that the lights had prior to to Lula's or is that no it was when they came in as a new restaurant because Diane's had been out for so long they had to come back for a new variance so they do provide ballet parking they don't have any additional parking lots again we have more parking spaces than they do and we're a smaller okay anybody else from the board that would like to this point this point you know why don't we hear from the public those who if you haven't been if you came in late weren't sworn in you need to be sworn in let's open it up for discussion those who are opposed and thank you for I'm Bob Hallman and I've lived in Shandon for about 48 years live just around the corner on capital place in the first block off of Divine Street and if I might as I start if I could ask for five minutes I'll try not to take it all but I am representing a group of people three who were here last time on our block that cannot be here today and we have two others here that don't plan to speak but if I might start out by saying that this just does not fit our neighborhood it doesn't fit the neighborhood for lots of reasons but dealing with the parking that you gentlemen are charged to decide it really is smoke and mirrors here that they're asking to get a variance because they have this other parking in other places they do not the reason is that behind them where they say that they're going to have an agreement with that lot back there or with the doctor the acupuncturist he already has that agreement with eggs up arabesque and Zod's it says so on the sign it is packed every day every night lunch and down the street at Frank's and Cantina's they flood the streets down there so much so that they've had to put a red light in there it was not a red light for traffic it was a red light to keep people from getting run over why because there's no parking back there on that little dead-end part of Holly Street they go across the street and flood those neighborhoods I had one woman tell me because I've been out meeting some neighbors that I had not met and this one woman told me that I can't even have my friends over she said I've had tried to have friends over and have them tell me they had to park two blocks away just to come to my house they park in front of my yard and I just feel trapped in my own house the lady behind eggs up was literally tearful when she talked about how it's affecting her the gentleman that's right behind urban cookhouse is here and talks about how it affects him there's only three park to parking spaces on that whole block on the street of Sims there so I would urge you to start by recognizing there are six restaurants already in a one and a quarter block up to urban cookhouse they now want to put this bar and grill in there squeeze it in there it backs right up to the fence of Shandon and I'm asking you to consider that we need to protect the neighborhood this is one of the oldest very interactive very healthy feeling neighborhood I used to joke that people come from can then just a jog in Shandon it's a it's a fun neighborhood but if we start eating away at the age at the edges this is not a dense area it is not other than that one car or divine street and if we start eating into our neighborhood degrading those properties they go downhill that's going to eat back into the neighborhood so I urge you to consider that I did a little man on the street parking analysis and I've given it to you gentlemen an email that I wrote but there are currently 46 minimum based on your regulations 46 spaces that are not provided for these restaurants so these are the people that are going back into the neighborhood Sunday morning I talked with a gentleman that two blocks back on Sim Street he said my streets full Sunday morning so it's not just in the evening the but I would urge you to look at my where I broke it down by restaurant and what's what's happening there the lot that was built behind the acupuncturist which you can see is directly behind the blue square it provides 37 spaces but those spaces are already jam full there's no place there to say that back streets is going to be able to use X number of spaces in there likewise his neighbor who I think he says is going to give him some spaces in that lot that there's no guarantee that he's not going to get fed up with broken beer bottles and stuff in his parking lot and say that five minutes already okay can I ask a question and you said you provided I might be missing something but is there Mr. Holman said that he had done a traffic study but is that somewhere I would like to bring up something else they said in their presentation our track record speaks for itself I say it does I asked the Hickory police department to send me the police calls that have been made to their restaurant there they said we can only go back to 2004 and they sent them to me they had 382 police calls during that time frame 60 of them was the alarm going off I'm assuming in the middle of the night you don't have a lot of attempted break-ins in the daytime so we're just right across the fence from this so here once or twice a month or once a month you're going to have police coming in there you're going to have a siren blaring in the middle of the night they had 125 calls for DUIs accidents hit-and-run property damage and another 200 that included fights drunks assaults those kind of things the building that's there that's been there since 1967 is an office building just like the office building next to it and next to it and next to it that's what belongs there I'll bet you there hadn't been one police call to that office building they bought this building the current owners bought it in August and maybe the maximum use for it is to put a restaurant in the maximum profit maybe for the restaurant but it's not the best thing for the neighborhood the church is here directly across the street probably less than a hundred feet from their front door I don't know it's now in the road but how do you get an ABC license when you're way too close to a church I want to be sensitive to time I don't want to but we just we need to be consistent in the hearing and so let me give you another minute or so but what I don't want to do is I won't even take that I don't know whether it's it's procedural but the applicant didn't sign the application so the applicant didn't make the applicant of being a mr. Darity didn't sign the application nor did he give an authorization that I'm aware for somebody else to sign the application so maybe that's a procedural bar for for the matter even going forward but I would urge y'all to consider that this is a domino effect we're down on the corner where Lascaux certain already currently it's another building just like this one it'd be a perfect setup for another bar so what do we do give them another variance because we gave this place a variance and then push more cars into the neighborhood this is a really enjoyable neighborhood I'm not against drinking I'm not against bars but it just doesn't belong here please don't prove this bear thank you I'll be very brief I'm Lynn Phillips I live at 610 capital place which is in the first block mainly I want to make the point and I know it's just been made but I want to remake it that there are currently six restaurants in a block and a half six back streets will be seven restaurants in one and a half blocks that are already saturated with cars and saturated with people going to divine street pedestrians I mean if you if you lived in that area you will have had a situation where you went oh my god almost hit that person because there and you will I will have also seen people who are a little tipsy going back and forth so that's a serious problem our neighborhood we are first one of the oldest streets in Chandon I mean we're a historic area we have some of the oldest houses on capital place in Sands there are reasons as you know I don't have to say there are real reasons for having these regulations wise reasons I was on Chanda neighborhood council years ago and you know we look to you all to help protect our neighborhoods and that was the case very frequently back then I asked you to please help protect our neighborhoods now we depend on you we depend on you to help with that and to not allow creep to occur in an area where it shouldn't occur I would hate to think this is a done deal we are already suffering our quality of night of life in the neighborhood from the number from the lack of parking and the kinds of businesses and I'm real concerned about noise pollution you know what's to say there's no promise anywhere I couldn't hear the young lady I wish I had but I think oh it's okay it's not your fault it all goes straight up I couldn't hear the details of the regulations I wish I could have but I don't I can't fathom where there is any promise where there's any promise in these lease plans for spaces you know what's the promise that somebody doesn't sell Sadler real estate next door move etc. I just don't see assurances on any of this kind of vague stuff that they're saying real concern down at Henry's they have bands outside sometimes we can hear them at our house almost two blocks away I don't I would love to know what he's talking of what Mr. I think it's case and is saying about a church letter we don't know anything about a church approving anything so I like for y'all to ask them that question we have Lutheran church represented here and it certainly didn't come from them so how do we have any kind of reassurance regulations written down that they don't choose to be opened or to their only other example of a restaurant is open until to how do how do we have any idea that they don't decide a year in that a bar fits you know that they're getting bar traffic but not food traffic and they stayed or too which we know is already a problem the parking plan and the last thing I would say the parking plan is an very impermanent plan we have no assurances of anything we will have glut that we already have glut you know of people in cars into our streets and I just ask that you please do what I've had the experience of y'all doing in in my past with the neighborhood council is please protect us please you know development is one thing and I'm all for good development but we ask that you protect the character and the peacefulness and the family-oriented nature of our streets appreciate it thank you hey good morning gentlemen I'm Keith Mueller I live at 614 Sims Avenue so I'm literally at the house it's right next to the acupuncturist parking lot that everybody keeps talking about this morning thanks for the opportunity to talk to you today Shannon's a great place to live it's great because it still has the old town feel you're speaking of ma'am you get to be near some cool businesses and walk to things and do things so you accept a little bit of noise however what we're seeing already is that balance between business and residential it's already out of whack you've heard about the problems of parking all up and down Sims on Sunday mornings I can tell you right now in the acupuncturist slot every weekday night it is full up especially between probably six and seven thirty and I know this because when I look out my living window I can see it and so if a car alarm goes off if any of those noise events happen where we're very aware of what's going on that parking lot are you in the stucco house that's yes sir okay yeah I kind of pink with the gas lamps up front yes sir that's us absolutely but that keyword really is is balance and maintaining the balance between the residential area and the business area when urban cookhouse first opened we saw the problem the parking problems actually exacerbate pretty quick despite the number of spots they actually have other businesses leveled off a little so it's not quite as bad but if you look at the police record you'll see it just two weeks ago we had so many ticket in front of our house whose bumper was hanging into our driveway so to speak so those problems still exist and what we view is another restaurant especially a restaurant with these parking challenges will only increase those parking problems up and down Sims and even wrap around on the blossom that exists behind our house as well most importantly what I'm scared of which the previous speaker hit very well is a precedent this sets you know we talk about places like Tallulah who already exist in the average of 4.4 parking spaces showing that we're already out of whack and some places like Tallulah and Georgia have set up ballet parking to try to alleviate that so they do have some type of off-site parking however even with those mitigation measures in place they're not guaranteed and they can still affect our quality of life in the area I guess in the end I think the rules that you guys have in place to exist for a reason they exist to maintain that balance and I'd like to see that balance maintained so I'm with the other residents of Shannon I ask that you please don't prove the side variants thank you do you affirm that your testimony will be the truth enough about the truth yes sir thank you I'm Jim Daniel I'm a big fan of Frank Casey and he and I have worked on several projects in the past he does quality work very innovative tenants but I'm here for a couple reasons one part of the concern that I see is they never quantified is the parking that they haven't gotten lined up just for after five or is it from opening of the restaurant to the closing of the restaurant they never said what time the bar would close they said the restaurant would close at 11 does the bar close at 11 or does it close at some later time I think that needs to clarify there's a building two doors down from this location that's presently for sale what if somebody decided they wanted to buy it and then do the same thing Mr. Casey's do they could have gone for a special exception which would have tied down many of these issues that the residents have raised but they decided not to I'm really here because I'm president of one of the neighborhood associations that participated in the correlation of joint neighborhoods around five points in trying to deal with the bar issue in five points the bar issue in five points did not start yesterday I mean you can look it back I've been in this town a long time I can remember when there was a movie theater on Hardin Street it's now a bar but if you look at is at least 13 to 17 establishments in five points that at one time retail that are now a bar they got a variance for parking over a period of time like these people say it bills on top of each other so where do we draw the line this is a very nice upscale restaurant is one that I would be happy taking my family to based on what has been presented but the bigger issue that y'all got to face is which is next is it the building two doors down the street they get sold and they want to do this or whatever but there are five if this is past the five restaurants in one of a block eggs up grill is only open at breakfast so move that one off the table but you do have counting this one for within what baseball throw so my big concern is there's no way to really define long-term parking that would have been done through a special exception staff says that y'all keep grant exceptions there's always an exception to an exception my succession was suggestion was okay but lunch hour you cut the needs in half after five you have the full needs but the acupuncture people have already committed to other things so how can you count that anyway that's what I got to say thank you question Jim Jim question it's part of the the discomfort that and I don't know that the applicant would be willing to do this but is is you know what if there's a scenario where their lease is in place you know somebody raised to point earlier you can't I'm not a lawyer so I'm not making this assertion but you can't know in residential real estate if I've got a property for sale with the lease with it the sale does not nullify the lease lease runs with the property same as commercial so if there's teeth in it where they're required through a lease to provide parking that should be some of what ought to be teeth in it I think any hang on I don't think anybody questions mr. Cason's integrity and he might not want to do that and and he might not you know get the variants if that's a sticking point if that's how it's proposed but but is that some of the discomfort is it that there's is too loosey-goosey as it's being presented you had does your comfort level go up if you've got something recorded lease at the courthouse that that that says that you know that they've got and then again I don't see how somebody is gonna come before us and give us a lease if the spaces are already taken by other restaurants I mean I just I've got to believe that that somebody's not gonna come and and be fraudulent with with something like that particularly an applicant like this as you say who we know a little bit about this track record coming in front of us but does that make your comfort level go up at all if there's something this enforceable about the parking I'm hearing what the neighbors are saying is that they're not comfortable with the situation as it is you could have applied for a special exception which would have required written leases required some restrictions on the deed and some other things he decided not to you know one way to solve the problem perhaps might be getting a letter from each of the organization specifying they have something in place for a certain period of time for a certain number of spaces but the church has already changed ownership three times I gather in the last three or four five years so what's to say the next guy doesn't change the acupuncture place these folks are saying is already committed to the ones across the street so you're back to the same scenario but I think one way to solve it would be yes have something in writing confirming that these spaces are actually set aside for them but then the bigger question are they set aside just from 5 p.m. to the end of the day or are they set aside all day long I like urban cookout and I made it a point to go after the 130 rush because the only time I really gone two times I've gone at 12 o'clock I ended up in the parking across the street I don't recall anything in the restaurant that says for off-site parking you can go ABC how do they go confirm that so but I guess the answer your short answer your question is something in writing from the person who is granting that lease specifying that they have it for a certain period of time I would think at least one step in that direction but I don't think that would pass on to the next in the next person who might end up with the property I thought she said at least runs with the property well I'm sorry that you're right at least would run with the properties I'm right unless there's something in the thing that says the least gets a lot of times you'll put in a lease if the rights get terminated if the property that's how we protect the neighborhoods is by when people come and maybe it's the most restrictive and again maybe the applicant won't go for it but if it were a scenario where it was you had to have X number of spaces for your hours of operation and hours of operation is 11 to 11 meaning you open at 11 and you lock the whole thing down at 11 just trying to figure out if there's a balance where I would seem to be the only resolution I could see for this particular situation right but again we look at five points as a template these folks can continue to have to come before you people and five points didn't get where it is it took it 30 to 40 years to get right but I don't know that it's applicable to make five points the template for Divine Street why not pick the Vista why not pick what's going on on Main Street and the success that parking garages in the Vista parking garages in Main Street none in five points there's no parking garage you see it well the city has bought two lights but there are no garages but you know right but I think that's probably you got to check with these people but it would seem like me that would be the logical situation but it's not here today right thank you is there anyone else I think what I'd like to do if you don't mind is to have and I'm trying to take some notes myself but but if we could have everybody then you come up at the end and try to address and I'll try to be sensitive to give you time to respond to what's being offered I'm Teresa Boykin with Incarnation Lutheran Church and we did provide a letter to the zoning council saying that we're opposed to any any consideration for the variants we are challenged with parking ourselves as a church during the day we operate a child development center from 7 a.m. till 6 p.m. Monday through Friday we also have a very active scout troop that's active on Monday and Tuesday nights and parking is a challenge it continues to be and we would appreciate consideration that we're opposed just want to make sure if you could come up to the mic please we just have to have you on the record I just want to make a quick correction I'm very grateful for Mr. Daniels comments but I want to make a correction in that there are currently six not four or five they're currently Zaz eggs up arabesque cantina 76 Henry's and urban cookhouse at present in a one-and-a-half block area back streets bar and grill would make seven in a one-and-a-half area so I just wanted to make that number thank you anyone else that would like to speak in support of an opposition to this variance not I'm all close testimony from the from the public if there's no one else that like to speak and then let the applicant address the concerns that have been offered thank you just start with I think Mr. Daniels brought up a good point and that a lot has changed in the last 40 50 years and one of those changes is people are desiring to move downtown and it's happening in droves and and another thing that has changed is in 2015 restaurant sales surpassed grocery stores sales for the first time in history that's a major shift and the younger population does want more restaurants and there are a number of people here who are opposed to a restaurant I want to clarify that I believe you all know but a restaurant isn't approved isn't approved used already in this building so we could do a restaurant here it would just have to be a size of a restaurant is an approved use for this for this site but we've seen a number of residents in the Shannon neighborhood also who are in support of this and who have said things to us like we're so excited about the opportunity to have another option for our family to go to for a meal a number of people have said that to us and a number of letters I think if we're provided to you on the packet so but a couple of just points of clarification based on some of the things that were that were said just something to note the church across the street actually had a parking arrangement with with this building as well because they they needed all site parking as well so there was an there was an arrangement in place for them to use this this space as all site parking too so there's some precedent on the other end there as well it should be noted too there have been two restaurants that have closed recently on Divine Street too so we are adding another restaurant and I recognize that it is in a pod that they're focusing on but two restaurants Divine Foods and Harper's have closed and recent recent history as well Divine Foods being one that had almost no parking I'm not suggesting that that means that deserves a variance here but that should be noted that I had maybe four parking spaces that were split between them and other restaurants so that restaurants closed and of course Harper's is closed as well some inaccurate information shared I'm not sure why just to clarify the acupuncturist lot is different than the lot that eggs up arabesque and Zahs uses they're two different owners that they're absolutely correct that the lot that is that is directly below us that actually separates us from any residences is not owned by us and it is not under agreement by us that the lot that we have parking on like four white cars that building on it just the back corner of our lot so we have met with them we have an agreement with them we have an email right here that says that we have nine parking spaces from him he has told us and all we can do is go by his word and what he has signed with us that he has no agreements with any other park with any other restaurants not urban cookhouse or eggs up or arabesque or Zahs that doesn't mean that people don't park that right now but he he does not have any arrangements in place and we also have something from Sadler that shows that we have an agreement in place with him too so just to clear those that misinformation that was inaccurate there are almost to spend the time parameter it was mentioned that there's like two parking spaces on the street here we counted 12 on street here between us and I think about three but four buildings down someone mentioned Sunday morning parking in the neighborhoods and they're like three churches right around here too so I don't know that's fair to put that on the restaurant all the restaurants over there especially since only one is open in the mornings and that's eggs up eggs up owner has also is in support of us I think he's written a letter to us to you all as well and we've had extensive conversations with him and attached to that the Divine Street Merchant Association believe you all received a letter from them they are in support of this this concept in this variance request that we've met with them and they've had a unanimous support we met with the Shannon neighborhood Association they chose to not take a position on it they didn't vote on it we did there was some opposition and some four at that meeting but they did not vote on it trying to think a couple of other things that were mentioned the police complaints they could the owners are hearing can certainly address that just Brian is here and if you if y'all want to hear from him he just said the sheriff of Hickory told me if you've got any problems tell him just give me a call on my cell phone so there's I'm not sure where that information came from I have no idea the accuracy of it or what it is related to they were both they both had no idea what those incidents would have been and the bar closing time Mr. Daniels mentioned as the bar closing time different in the restaurant closing time that's there's no there's no difference it's that's a hard stop for the bar in a restaurant so just want to clarify some of those some of the inaccurate information yes you Frank do you have a problem because I think it's a comfort level and I don't think it's a comfort level with you or perhaps your your back streets but think that that that maybe a way to get everybody's comfort level up is to have some leases you know you can redact the part of the leases it would be you know made available to the public but I think that the terms of them would go a long way in I mean this is how you do business in Columbia and I can say some of this are reiterated and in board discussion but it's just a tricky balance I mean the church for what it's worth years ago bought houses on Kirkwood with strawmen and knocked houses down it happens I mean as the city grows and I get the concern I mean I applaud the neighborhood groups and I applaud the five points crowd for for trying to make things better I don't think it's equitable to necessarily compare the divine what I call the Divine Street corridor when I get out of town clients in the car and I'm selling Columbia because somebody's coming to you know maybe be a surgeon at Palmetta Health or maybe go to Raleigh or wherever I mean that's something that I try to sell along with five points in the vistas at Divine Street corridor because it's a lot of mom and pop shops and frame shops to me is what five points used to be and I think what a lot of people want five points to get back to be to be in and so I understand the concerns of kind of the five points crowd so to speak creeping up Divine Street but there's just a part of me where to strike that balance I mean you oppose to having leases that are in place that would hinge on this variance this just something that I think gives a comfort level to the public and what the staff about about about how we would potentially hinge this but but to clarify are you suggesting it as a condition to the variance are you I think I'd be comfortable hinging this on this variance I mean I don't have a problem with zoning would have a very difficult time enforcing that in the future I get that but where I'm just Rachel where I'm hung up so on Saluda I can't remember it was either gelato shop or a coffee shop or something like that on Saluda where we do these kinds of things and so where where people have to go out and secure parking from other places and the thought that that's just never going to be enforced or never has been enforced it's just I'm just wrestling with that I don't understand why I know I've been on the board a long time but between Mark Malott and Brian Cook I mean if it's not enforceable then then you see what I'm saying I mean then then how do we how do you enforce it with a special exception that's written into our code with conditions so that would give us grounds for violation so that it not happen it has various conditions that have to be met and it goes more specific it requires specific parking has to be for this use only hours have to be given document has to be provided on a yearly basis just gives more enforcement and more meet that enforcement have it where we would have grounds for violation that it go away there'd be more grounds under 1735 then that might be the way to go but I just want to make sure that that is what I heard you say it's not an option for us to hang specific I would strongly it is an option but let me ask a question this way do we as a board put ourselves at risk by because I know we put except you know we put certain parameters on variances when we give them so what I'm saying is is I mean if he had to get a special exception first and why are we here today why don't the city look at an applicant and say you can't do that you've got to have a special exception to move forward with that so it leaves me to believe I mean can we do that yeah it was advised of that that that was a strong option but but not a requirement to pursue just the variance on its own right and a variance can be I mean that is a condition you could give as a board if that is what you chose but as staff it'll be very hard for us to enforce that condition down the road but that's I just want to be clear because I don't want to set us up for failure but that's an option not a requirement it's it's an option it's just not okay you want to say something but just we were we were we knew that there were up there were two options special exception versus variance and we done we've done both and wait a minute you've done both not not in this case I'm sorry in other cases we've done special exceptions for offsite lease parking as well as that does beg the question on this one and I'm not saying you have to but if staff strongly suggest that you get a special exception why not to clarify that was strongly suggested after we made the application right but what I'm saying is is that if staff is strongly suggesting that the special exception is a way to go we've deferred it once just help me understand the reason behind moving forward with the variance and not taking it and that we discussed it staff council is just that it's a staff council but but but help me understand that thought process I think that was somewhat based on some of the immediate concerns they heard from from residents and we totally understand we felt like we had equal support for the project as well as presented so I think we're getting maybe a little bit off that that everyone is opposed to this project as submitted mr. Mekin so I don't think that that is the case in fact we know that the merchants association who is charged with protecting the Divine Street corridor as well is adamantly in favor of this this project so I don't want us to lose sight of that fact that it is not just everyone's opposed to this project we there are a few people who came today rarely do but those who are strongly in favor come out and speak and speak for project but I know that you all have evidence that there are people who are in favor of the variance as presented it presents an additional layer of risk quite candidly because of all the details and requirements for the for the parking which is part of why we went over and above the requirement so special exception off-site lease parking we would not have to do 49 let me ask you a question and maybe these words and maybe it's not applicable to this but if you're willing to go over and beyond in that instance is it over and beyond to a point where it wouldn't be acceptable to have these these parking leases run with the lease of your tenant because that way there is something in teeth and I'm not we need to go into board discussion you know I don't I respect and hear staff about the special exception but but you know would you be opposed to going above and beyond and having leases it run with your lease with with backstreets you're saying I have the lease term on every parking lot match the term of the lease at this time I don't think that's a risk that we were they and I'd have to discuss that with them because we have not talked about that but probably not a risk that they're willing to take right now and we can that's a total complete change of a pretty big deal that adds a lot of layers of risk we have three parking lots all of whom are charging us to park on their on their lots so it's a very substantial amount of rent and and we think we think that all three at a beneficial layer and we think we've already gone above and beyond and doing or attempted to go above and beyond and doing that one of the church specifically is intended to be specific to employees of the restaurant for example so that the ones that close to proximity could be used for patrons of the restaurant so specific to that item that's gonna be a tough one and I just I just don't know if that is a comfort level and I don't I don't know if that I guess I guess a concern that I've got is is maybe this goes back to the thought process of having to get a special exception with with some more teeth in it but whether you right but whether you fail or succeed parking ought to be consistent it shouldn't just be in the first year and that's I think I've got a little bit of a comfort level with that I'm not opposed to what you're doing I think it's a great thing you know I just think it it's just that bad striking that balance I mean you know no offense to the gentleman but if you just bought on Sims you had to have known where you're buying and you have to assume that there's you know I don't know that I'd call it risk but but but your cognizant or you should be cognizant of where you're buying any other questions all right well let's close testimony and going going to board discussion thank you I think I think you bring up some good points Calhoun I think that's sort of what I was referring to earlier that seems that the applicants stated and showing us that he potentially would have enough spaces but trying to figure out some way that we knew we had the 36 spaces then I would build comfortable with the variances about they're like have them but you can't figure out a way to do that be unfortunate because I live in the neighborhood as well very close just a couple of blocks from the site honestly I love to gather myself but we can't figure out a way to provide the ample parking I'm not sure we can do it and also I wish that more of the people that Frank stated were in favor of the project would have come and spoken to us I know it's difficult to get them to come you know often you have the seems like more often than not the people who are opposed or the only ones ever show up but I guess that's that just it is what it is and I flipped through the letters and it appears to me I haven't read them all but the vast majority are opposed to the letters that we have so I'm not sure this is a tough one well I don't think it ought to be a popularity contest I mean you can have letter writing campaigns or people pack earrings I think we've got to go on the the merits of every case and this is a tough one I mean I just don't know how you do business in five points or these different areas that don't have the parking garages or where parking is just a big conundrum it is dangerous I mean I forget when it was but someone is you know was run over at that that intersection of where there are red lights and I use Divine Streets business development I mean what I figured out is if I'm showing first time young buyers I get them to meet me at Henry's for a beer after work and it's it's a problem crossing Divine Street period I've got a buddy he's got a law firm so I never worry about it I just tell him I'm parking in his lot at 5 30 or 6 o'clock but but I think we've just got a strike of balance and you know sometimes I worry that that we send the message that that Columbia is just hard to do business with and I think it's a great thing that this is somebody from another state that's willing to come and invest money and take a chance on Columbia but I just we see a lot of this this request is certainly not uncommon and I don't mean and Rachel I'm not sitting in an apology but but it's not a bit that I think the big thing to do is to protect the public I think that is is it's one of the things that we're charged with but I also think that we are here to help people try to do business and if there's a way to do that you know again if the special exception was the path to do this to get to the variants then if it's an option and the applicant decides to do something different but I think where I'm coming down is I'm for this but but I think that my motion would be and let me just kind of Frank speak to y'all from from the up here would be to require that those leases they've just got to be more than then than a year and and I don't know you know maybe it's too prohibitive to do them to run with the lease of that I mean I'm comfortable with the hours of operation I'm comfortable with the liquor license and all that comes with that I mean really what we're talking about doing is just and it's not that we don't trust you but but I just know that that people don't go into business to fail and I know that some of them do but to me it's just a cost of doing business to provide those leases so I think you answered the question but I want to make certain I think I hadn't heard from the two other members but I think that mr. Dinkins is thinking the way I am I'm willing to to propose a variance but it's got to have the teeth in it of recorded leases and if you're not willing to do that then then I think you are gonna have to come back with another bite at it or maybe another another tenant and I don't want you to have to do that but but at the same time I mean you know I guess I am using your words if you're gonna go above and beyond to do something in this corridor then be willing to go above and beyond with all of it not just part of it so I just want to make certain so if we'm asking the question if we were to hinge this variance on recorded lease park you know recorded leases that are more than 12 months and then we can figure out what it might look like are you not willing to move forward can I can I get restaurants sure come in on this as well and difficult to do and when this is not been discussed much but this is Brian Brian has been in business for 23 years so one of the first I just want to give him a chance to speak actually had you speak but I opened the restaurant in 1996 when I was 26 years old I raised four children there and we always have parking parking is an issue no matter where I need the parking as bad as you need to be successful so there's so many good things about this restaurant I can do it anyway I don't have to do it my son went to school here graduated here chose it again so that that's kind of a conflict with if you need the parking then we all need it he needs it I need it you need it given you I guess but what I'm saying is it's if you've got a path to get the parking then why wouldn't you sign on the dotted line so to speak I have to discuss it with him this is all new to me I'm in the restaurant right I think a non-specific way it says we would be open sure to a solid to a meanable solution is it committing to seven years of a parking lease is probably not is it we do have just to clarify that we do have leases that are signed this might be semantics but recording leases is not something that we would do for a parking lease but if you just mean showing proof that we have leases we can end to your point can we cross out some of the pertinence of some of the information in there we probably can do that we have to our attorneys but would we be open to a scenario like that yes man hopefully we've shown in the fact that we didn't just come and say we were looking for parking variants to reduce 50% we came and said we've secured three different off-site parking locations that do have leases in place right but we each of those are but you also understand and again I take you at your word but but the leases have been provided to anyone yep I do understand we can we have so I think that's where again there's this there's this uncomfortable feeling of and I don't know you know what the pros and cons and again I'm not a lawyer of a cordon I don't know that that's necessary but I think what I'm getting at is I think that there's a path for y'all to get this variance and not and and if it doesn't you know if it doesn't make sense it doesn't make sense but but I want to be clear is that you know again I think that there's a way to mitigate some of the you're going to have people that don't want you there period you're going to have the nimbies you're going to have the whatever and again and I don't and I don't get into the popularity contest of how many people can pack in an audience or letter-writing campaigns or stuff like that but but it's just that balance and I just don't think that there's a comfort level with the board as I'm hearing it I had I've only heard from mr. Dinkins or the public and I know that there are other people that support you yeah so these are two emails confirming that we have leases in place and this is an actual lease and yeah the risk of sounding like we're trying to hide something our attorneys has said as advised us right now the state's not to provide this until things are struck through it's not an attorney but but but why I'm not an attorney either but but he had to tell you why he didn't want it made public it had to be some reason to to say it's in your best interest not to release it because of a B and C we had a very we had a relatively short conversation and he said I can't buy you to do that right now so if we need to get to that point I mean without without restating the obvious you know I think that the hang up here is it appears that possibly could have enough parking and if if we could be given some assurance or some guarantee that it would be not just for the short term that while you know for the duration of while the restaurant was there that you could provide the amount of parking that you're you know stating that you have then I think we would probably have comfort with this but under these parameters it's just difficult that you know obviously our concern is what happens if something changes in two years you're still in business and I realize you say you need the parking that makes sense but you know the Nate where the neighbors are coming from is if you don't have the parking will they go park on blossom or weed or wherever so that that's that's the hang up obviously we can have a lot of discussion but there's a there's a balance that we have a need for protection as well right for for the financial investments of this as well we signed 70 year leases for three parking lots and don't need any of them and we're tied to it so maybe maybe the path because again I'd like to think that there's a path where you're open for business at whatever point but you know maybe the thing to do is to defer it if you choose to do that again I don't believe in popularity contest but it would be nice you know I know that they're different people on Divine Street be it well-named people Marion Moses or or whomever who have been in different capacities with or maybe other he's on the board that approve or other association or or other restaurant owners or or maybe you can go back and and go to the you know go to these neighborhood associations and just say look that this is what we're just sitting a comfort level and again I think that having some teeth in it maybe you go back for a special exception but what I don't but what I don't want to do is slam the door on you today by having a vote and denying it is there a requirement for a length of term on a lease for a special exception it just has to come back for approval every year but there's no specific length of time and at that review point Rachel is there does the staff have the is that the teeth in it where you can say they come and say we don't need these spaces and then but do y'all have the ability to say okay you provided you know 30 spaces now you only have to do 15 or do they have to come back for a reduction I mean what where is the teeth in it that is kind of the review period it's also for us to make sure the lease stays in place gotcha hasn't fallen through and hasn't substantially changed if numbers and that is a point if something happened in the future where you didn't need as many as you secured and you needed to revise a lease you would come back just to amend the special exception alter the special exception saying if you needed to lease more let's let's lay in the plane unless you're opposed to this I'd like to make a motion to defer this to next month's Bose a hearing and again I would just encourage you to I think what we're trying to do is to give you a path and there there's no guarantee that you'll get there but I just don't see that there's a comfort level on the board or with with the public this here today that that that we can give you what you're looking for so for a point of clarification to do are we able to change it to a special exception request if we do one simultaneous with your variance and then if you have to be posted and the time parameter does he have to be posted for another 30 days but there's if we would post the deadline for next month is technically tomorrow we can talk after the meeting I'd like to make a motion to defer this until next month's hearing is there a second motion second at all in favor say aye motion carries item for discussion is item number eight case 2018 0018 it's 1723 1725 Laurel Street this is a special exception to establish a community garden leave the applicant here and then come forward morning actually printed out my presentation you guys if you don't mind as you can see in the presentation packet there's a mission statement for the garden that I started in 2015 just as a hobby I started it at home and move the raised beds over to Laurel Street where it is now it's been it's been a pretty awesome time for me I've enjoyed the time working in the soil and growing produce for local neighbors on Laurel Street as well as a restaurant in the Vista as well as you some of the produce from the garden in their cocktails and out of their kitchen it's all gifted I'm not selling any of this produce I'm not intending on creating a business out of this project it's more on the line to create community outreach the neighbors on Laurel Street eventually developing for possibly the firefighters at the department across the street as well sure that everybody that's tried the produce agrees that it's delicious and I'm not creating anything more than a green space in the community on a property that's been grass since the two homes were tore down well over 50 years ago if you look through the pictures you see that as you get towards past our Facebook page and you get towards page seven six of the pictures but page seven is a certificate of a treasured tree that the pictures just after it on page eight of the large tree in the back of the property as well it's a very impressive large oak tree that stands out as well and it's definitely caught the eye of plenty of the neighbors I know that the property owners to the left and right of me like the garden a lot as well and would be here today but they're running their businesses right now and couldn't step away the idea is just to keep building relationships and growing with the community and reaching out to local churches and teen shelters to try and look at the possibility of helping people learn vocational skills and just creating a happy environment for Laurel Street okay it's just existing just an existing garden yes sir I've been working into till the land and whatnot there are no permanent structures on the on the garden but I've been growing vegetables and planting a couple trees here and there nothing more than just row crops and a few trees no large farm equipment or anything like that goes on site why does he need a special exception is not a commercial use of the property I mean it's private use you know it's selling anything the way that our code breaks it down is general farm primarily that used to be the sole use on a parcel in that zoning district so it doesn't matter whether he's using it as selling commercially or not I mean if it was a neighbor that had a garden they wouldn't be able to sales part doesn't really play I do have a photograph it's more of a photograph of a I saw that and is there any parking requirement for this so he meets the minimal requirement that's not an issue okay so doesn't sound like any of those are issues let me see if anybody else is interested in saying something we'll go through it I'm seeing my doubts here like to speak and faithful against this application okay I don't I don't see anyone here and I'm you know I'm looking at your your application and you know I mean it doesn't sound like vehicular impact it's gonna have any impact on that or adverse lighting to the environment now there is a note by staff that you know that any you know fertilizer or anything like that would be stored in a containment so that it didn't create an odor for the neighbors I'm assuming that that's your willingness to abide by that and that you're not going to be creating a noise hazard there as well and then I mean that you know there is really no building I mean is I mean I think the environment aspect of it is very nice is a green area it won't have an impact on public safety and this certainly not a proliferation of these in the area it's consistent with the underlying district and zoning application let's say that's that's true and that location is compatible with rated uses it looks like it does have you know I mean it's a safe area have a garden for sure and not an adversely impact the the public interest it sounds like it would be beneficial to the public interest to me so with that being said I'd like to make a motion that we approve this application subject to the comments of staff based on the application the written intent in public testimony of the applicant second I think it's a good idea I think it's a great idea we have a first and a second it's my second that second okay second it all in favor see I all opposed master be carries a lot easier than the other way thank you gentlemen thank you ladies item number nine on the agenda case 2018 0028 this is 31 26 to not road it is a special exception to establish an automotive service use okay did the applicant have to leave was he here it was a gentleman that had to leave that was sitting behind you do you know who that was okay so I guess they are there to speak against it okay so you here to speak on this case okay my name is Diane I know y'all know me I'm the president Belvedere we already have six auto places right there in that same block two on the corner of Wendover and to nacho we got auto zone there was two right there on the corner of Wendover road and cross the street and we got auto zone O'Reilly and we have advanced those are repair facilities so those are retail stores right auto zone in O'Reilly's they just there but we got we got service to two right that old Toyota place there's three of them in there three of them right there used to be a used car lot there now is two places that serve cars and we have Phillips and we got two down the street on the corner behind two knots and and the dental place one rep right behind there and we got rivers Jimmy Rivers in the next block and we got Martin in the next block so that's enough we trying to get our neighborhood back together I want to get up and ask that man to come to our neighborhood and put a restaurant we got plenty places that need restaurants coffee shops theaters bowling alleys and and my thing is now it's time to revitalize our area coming in to nacho it look like a slum y'all and you know just like I said I don't want to stop people from doing things that's right in our neighborhood but we are homeowners I've been there for 40 years and all of these are my contents you know people that work and live in our neighborhood and they they are homeowners and we tired now fighting in liquor stores fighting convenience stores fighting these other places that's not right for our neighborhood and and we want our area to look like five points of vista and all those other places we tired we don't want it looking like Jack or Boulevard it's a mess down there and I'm just like I said I would love to have people come in our neighborhood that's gonna help we don't even have a sit-down restaurant and that's that's it we don't have a grocery store you know but if you can if I'm asking the staff if they can come these people come to us and ask us what do we want I wouldn't be like this I got a home there my insurance company has went my insurance policy has went up because of the crime from these different areas what this man was planning on doing I just met him did y'all excuse me for interrupting you did y'all meet with this gentleman I met him when he was starting to work on the building before it got burned it's the same man right Rachel are we allowed to can I pass this off unless you see it yeah offer to be money we offer me money and I'm not for sale like I said with him with the with the yeah yeah are we are we able to vote on this or what do we mean this is an empty that is your choice to speak the applicant had another case that was deferred today to next month the only thing I can think of on behalf of the applicant is maybe he got confused about both that deferred the convenience store the convenient store was the same applicant and that one was deferred to next month come back behind the podium they can they can bring that to us but he already has businesses and they just passed a law where they can't help but three businesses here he got one on North Main and Fair Road and he was talking about churches these business shouldn't be going cross right across the street from the church st. John is right across the street and they want to go to seven days selling alcohol and this is what he's trying to do put this little business thing that he's gonna do a service and they have turned it into a convenience store that's what they've been doing to our neighborhood for for years and it's time to stop I'm really confused with all these plans they have they have kitchens and they have it is a multiple suite it's multiple suites within the building so there's going to be he gave us the same plans for both of his applications the convenience store is on one side that one is deferred today and then there is the tire service shop that is going in there as well which is what this application is for the tire service well and I clearly believe that you are correct in your assumption that he must have thought that both of these things were were deferred to give him the benefit of the doubt and I hate that I hate that to just do this without him being here and I really hate that all these people have come here and listen to all of this and I feel terrible that that happened but I just I just feel like you know I don't think that this necessarily means the applicant's not interested I think he just was mistaken and he thought thought that all this was deferred and that he didn't have this other item to deal with today he was out there this morning he was out at the building this morning right and another thing too I want to ask the question when they come in to do services as far as getting buildings do they come in and start working on it before they come and insulted neighborhoods you know these people be coming in working and they assume that we're going to agree with what's going on we trying to get our neighborhood back together you know and two nice road is looking like it's long quite a few places y'all have gave business license to the people come back and do strip joints I don't I don't tell the police it's two of them already they operate with strip license without us what you come we'll miss ma'am ma'am okay I understand that we're not we're not talking about this is a tire service center that we're got enough tire services to make a motion to divert to deferred if we can a second all in favor say aye aye all opposed motion carries thank you just remember these people was here for this meeting the next time you know our time is valuable too yes ma'am we have one more lady want to talk make a motion that we conclude this meeting second all in favor say aye all opposed me cash