 The true greatness of truly great artist is my God in their work. There they put much more than they knew in their person. Take Wagner. He said all possible vulgar antisemitism. But take an elementary look at Wagner's work. What's the central Wagnerian hero? Figure of wandering Jew, my God. Everything changes immediately you see it's more. But now more serious. We had a certain reading here which was that. Mahler went through that. How should I put it? Zero point of absolute void and saw the end of the world and saw the holocaust to cut it short. Now if you allow me just two three minutes to make this point with all agressivity. Listening precisely to this last movement now of the fifth symphony I claim if there is a thing that Mahler emphatically didn't see it was this. Because you know, okay we know how history of music goes very vaguely. First we have pre-modern music where you have all those references to the harmony among the all those referring. Then Bach is the first radical modernizer. He saw no harmony in the world you have to invent impose rational order on to music. Then romanticism where you have this struggle with material with romanticism that's how I read it very naively. You cannot do it like Mozart. A beautiful melody is there. You must struggle for a long time so that the melody must arise through this density. But that's not the end I claim. What happens with Schoenberg and afterwards it's something much more terrifying. It's really like moving from classical physics with dense matter to some more quantum space where you see that. Like you know you have sometimes the feeling when I am listening to Schoenberg and my favourite Berg of course. You know this nice science fiction topic where you think you are reality in reality but then somebody tells you. But we already live in artificial reality and then in one of the much better than matrix the 13th floor. You have the scene where the guy goes to the end of the world and sees reality dissolving. Instead of matter you get just geometrical lines. I claim that in modernism radical modernism from Schoenberg onwards. The very material it's dissolving in this way. That's the true modernism. This is what you, this is why I claim if we already talk with this elementary parallels. Definitely not Mahler. What he is doing in this last movement. This is the tradition vitalist strategy of you know. I am ready to lose it all but then it returns in triumph and so on and so on.