 Okay. Well, let's get started. Welcome to Science Circle Island. Welcome to the question-and-answer session on the viruses. We have Dr. Robert Hendricks with us today. You'll see a tagline there. And my name is Phil Youngblood. I'm a university professor, but I'm in computers and cybersecurity. So I know more about computer viruses and do research. There's a display here with us. You can take a look at it in detail. But the idea for the session today is please ask questions. Please share things that are going on with you or concerns. Please share information you learned here today. This is something that is global. It affects all of us. And so, and remember to stay connected socially. That doesn't mean touching. It means things like this. So we're glad to be able to sponsor this today before the conference begins. Okay. So without further ado, I'll let turn it over to Dr. Robert Hendricks. And if you have any questions, please ask them in chat or you can even jump in with voice. If English is not your strongest language, then go ahead and ask them in whatever language and we'll try to sort that out. Again, welcome to SineCircle Island and to this Q&A session on the novel coronavirus. Dr. Hendricks, would you like to say anything? Go ahead, Taglan, if you have any thing you'd like to share with the audience. I'm sorry, can you hear me now? Yes. Yeah, go ahead. I had started talking and I didn't realize it wasn't on. There was a question from the previous session. I'd like to address first actually two quickly. One was coronavirus seems activated by phosphoric acid to reduce dopamine. Can increasing dopamine reduce brain damage? My answer on that, frankly, I don't know of any medical reports of direct neurological damage from this coronavirus is SARS-CoV-2 or COVID-19. By the way, those two names arose about the same time. I think the WHO named it COVID-19 and then shortly after the International Committee on Taxonomy of Viruses, ICTV, named it SARS-CoV-2 and it's SARS-CoV-1 is the SARS virus from or SARS for acute respiratory distress syndrome from 2002-2003. Those are very similar viruses. They have a similar spike protein that sticks through the envelope that gives the corona appearance on electron microscopy. But I'm rambling a little bit here but at any rate those, to me, either name is interchangeable although the formal official name of it by standards now would be SARS-CoV-2. And from what I read, I think the distinction, as you just mentioned, is that the SARS-CoV-2 is the name of the virus and then the COVID-19 is the name of the disease. I think that's the way they're breaking it out now. I see. Well, it wasn't that clear to me but I think that if one uses either term most anyone's going to know what you're talking about as long as they're aware of it. But at any rate in terms of the dopamine and brain damage, I think brain damage in these serious cases arises from cytotoxin storm causing massive severe inflammation of the lower respiratory tract and influx of fluids and inflammatory cells that fill the alveolar sacs and interfere with gas exchange and technically individuals die of respiratory failure suffocation. And so I think brain damage would be secondary to anoxia. There was one other quick question about an individual uses a copper vessel to drink from a copper water bottle because of the idea that copper would purify the water. And I don't know about that. Copper is a trace metal. It has biological function. You don't want too much of it. I have a copper fountain for birds that I would change the water quite often because I worry about the copper ions being toxic to the birds if I leave it too long. But one element that's used in materials like this that has antibacterial and protective effects known since ancient times is silver. And if you want to drink out of a silver cup you'll impress your friends but that actually might have more bactericidal effect. I don't know that copper would have much protection for you. I know copper is being used these days in a lot of stuff like bracelets and things. Oh someone's telling me my mark is on. So any other questions? Let's see. Max asked a question about whether someone who had the earlier SARS, SARS-1, might have some immunity against this one? That is a good question. I don't know. And they are clearly related but the umbral immunity, which would be the main thing that would protect you, I think. Humeral immunity meaning production of from a stimulated starting off with a naive immune system gets stimulated and you go from a new infection or acute infection to a convalescent stage. You produce antibodies like IgM antibodies initially and then the IgG antibodies for general systemic immunity in your serum. Those are against the spike protein and now MERS is distinct because the spike protein on it goes to a different receptor. It goes to DPP4 or diaphenyl, dipeptidil, peptidase 4. It has a gene that codes for it and that's a cell membrane receptor. But apparently both the SARS-1 and SARS-2 go for the angiotensin converting enzyme receptor ACE-2 receptor in the lower airways. And it's quite conceivable that there could be some cross immunity. I wouldn't count on it being very much though and I haven't seen anything published about that. A lot of what's getting out there right now is from past research and recent communications and a lot of things have not been and not had time to get into the journals. So I bet you that'll come out eventually but as far as I know it's not been addressed specifically yet. Okay there's another question about if someone with ulcerative colitis is more susceptible in getting this virus? I think and I would suspect they are. I would suspect they are but especially if there's anything that they are taking for it that might have immunosuppressive effects. But the same for Crohn's disease I think. But okay and the another question was will herd immunity like we hear with vaccine eventually defeat the infection? My understanding of these things is that obviously it has to have a host and as soon as you've either removed the host or everybody gets it that it can't spread but you're the doctor so please. I heard some figures on this and they probably arose from modeling but the conclusion someone came to was that if 25% of people in a fixed population isolate it will reduce and that's supposing and people are mingling casually and not having too many super spreaders that it will reduce 25% reducing their exposure. Markedly will reduce the spread of the infection by 64%. The take-home message is probably that there's a big payoff in any isolation we can get between people. It's a compounded payoff. Only a few cases in Africa. I know there's some cases in Nigeria and other places and I suspect that there are more cases than you would think that aren't recognized at this point. They're testing everyone in Iceland and they found that 50% of the positives are asymptomatic that Viking genes I guess. That's one of the problems. You have all these people who can have this longer incubation period apparently than SARS-1 and they can be shedding virus but not necessarily be ill from it or feel ill. So that's how you get community spread or transmission without attribution to a specific source. Well that's actually a very good lead in since this is a second group here. Why don't you tell, in other words everybody is affected by isolating and why don't you give them a good idea about what that will do? In other words why are we doing this? Why should people do this? What are we trying to accomplish by not going out in public and to hospitals unless we're really sick and that sort of thing? Can you give us a good idea of that? Yes. I described this this morning at in many times in my practice, in a surgical practice here's no straight headed neck surgery and I had cases sometimes that went $16 during my career. I needed intensive care beds for those. I sometimes had to cancel patients or had to transfer patients in some cases to other hospitals because ICU beds weren't available and I've seen times when I went through the emergency room if I got called in and people were in stretchers in the hallways waiting for a hospital bed. In other words the resources, medical resources, aren't that abundant and which may be one of the reasons in the United States at least that they have tried to prevent everybody from having great access to them. But if you have, as I heard someone on CNBC I think it was a financial program I put it on for a few minutes and one fellow was saying everybody should just go out and get infected, get it over with and then the economy can go on. Kind of a narrow-minded view and if that happens then 80% may be fine but you're going to have 20% that get seriously ill and need higher level medical care including hospitalization. 20% of the people requiring hospitalization right now are 25 to 40 or 20 to 45 that is. So if you have people not acting responsible or responsibly and going ahead and living life as though nothing was going to interfere with their happy times they're not only putting everyone that they come in contact with at risk but they're going to further spread this and have faster onset of new cases and the hospitals will be overwhelmed and you may as well be in a wilderness if that happens. Anyone with ordinary run of the mill and I'm not downgrading the significance of these problems like cancer, insulin-dependent diabetes, heart disease, stroke they're not even going to be able to be seen. People are going to be triaged for we'll try to save this one and triage that put them in the tent and so I was encouraging people this morning and I'll encourage all of you as well be the hero for everyone around you be the leader that we need. Everyone should stand up to leadership right now step up to leadership and do everything you can to prevent this from spreading too fast and even if eventually everybody or most everybody ends up getting the infection at least the catastrophic excessive demands on medical care won't be reached and you may well have more chance of having a treatment if you yourself get into trouble and anybody can there have been teenagers that died of this and the original physician in China who wrote to colleagues that he thought there was a new virus that was much like SARS-1 and the authorities paid him a visit made him sign a confession that it was a fraudulent statement and untrue. He died of coronavirus he was 34 years old I think he's pretty young so so what we're trying to do as Dr. Hendricks is explaining is the flatten the curve you can see the display up there if let's say for example this we're back in 1918 and there were not global communications there were antibiotics like we have today or medical facilities like we have today. What would happen then is essentially like some people have said it would and it is an extort moment I've asked people like my dad is 89 and other people and they've never seen anything like this this is very different of course there's not a lot of people from 1918 still around but the idea is that if we did not do anything and no one did anything and they went out and did whatever they normally do is it would probably affect it would probably go through the entire population back in 1918 as you may have read that means at that time 30 or 40 percent of the world got infected and 50 to 100 million people died and even if you think you're healthy and may be able to resist this that's a whole lot of people that you have helped to infect so we all have to kind of bear with our individual inconveniences for a time to be able to defeat this thing would you agree with that yes I have a couple of comments about the 1918 situation and to distinguish it from our current situation and to emphasize how we can avoid getting in in as much trouble it was toward the end of world war one one of the major factors a major vector in the spread of this were troop movements troops being taken from one side to another across countries or across bodies of water and infecting populations they said that half the British army and on three fourths of the French army were infected with the influenza virus H1N1 there was another aspect of this I saw Chuck Grassley said the Spanish who never insulted it was called Spanish flu and it was kind of ignorant because the Spain was neutral in world war one and world war two and the journalists from France and Britain and probably United States and such were all being restricted and censured and what they could say they were carefully writing stories to keep positive upbeat tone about how the war was being won and our boys are doing great and all that sort of thing they did not went bad news the only journalists to speak of that reported on the flu that started to spread and kill so many people were Spanish journalists and so they called it Spanish flu there I'm not going to get into there's a another demographic that one Chinese one Canadian researcher thinks was the source of as a group of people that were working behind the lines not not in combat that might have been the source of the influenza to everyone else there was a bacterium called Pfeifers it was a German doctor Dr Pfeiffer and Pfeifers Baxillus that they didn't really understand viruses they didn't know what they were dealing with mostly they just had they had different from this people 20 to 45 they would be perfectly healthy no no problems at all they would get this and they could be dead in 24 hours gone and lungs filled with fluid wretched death and when they did autopsies they found Pfeifers Baxillus Pfeifers Baxillus is a hemophilus influenza bacterium it was a co-inhabitant the pharynx in a lot of people and in people that got ARDS and they had you know necrosis of all these lining cells in their lung this was substrate for this bacteria to grow and this was before penicillin this was really before any antibiotics could be used and so they died of horrible pneumonitis and most of the mortality was felt by some to be attributable to a co- infection not only with H1N1 but that along with this hemophilus influenza now we have better diagnostic ability and better understanding of the pathophysiology of this whole thing and also better treatment these days but if it's overwhelmed you know it's like having food in a grocery store but you can't go in and you just starve outside so we're depending on everyone to like i said be responsible and keep your distance socially and doesn't mean to not to look out for each other and reach out to each other and to make sure everyone's okay and have what they need i'll get through this but it's going to be psychologically hard on a lot of people but two meters two meters y'all keep your distance physically it's a new form of politeness so um anyway that's that's one point i wanted to make about Spanish flu there's been so many comparisons to it that uh uh it the times were different and fortunately we're not in a world war like we were back then and it wasn't until 1930 i think that Schof used a Birkenfeld filter i think it's called um which could filter out bacteria and he took filtrates from the um fluids from uh people who had this infection and showed that the filtrate which was bacteria free was still infectious so they began to understand this isn't a bacterium this is uh something smaller that can go through a tiny filter that would block bacteria from spreading okay and why don't we talk a little bit about what people can do in other words the idea is that um as you mentioned in the first session is that when somebody has coughed or sneezed there are very small aerosol particles that do stay in the air for a bit but in general it's not really like a fog um so you can go out jogging or walking or bicycling or other things provided that you don't touch or inhale particles from infected people in other words staying inside um absolutely inside may not be absolutely necessary would you agree or how would you state that differently no i think that's true i think you can go outside and it's healthy uh to do so especially during daylight um i mentioned this morning i worked and actually before i went to medical school quite a bit with the tuberculosis patients and uh with the mobile tuberculosis unit that went about and took x-rays and gave gave i did the x-rays i was trained to do that and give skin tests and i also sat with this pulmonologist and read the chest x-rays because he liked me and he knew i was going to medical school so i was i was already accepted i just had a job ahead um but uh from reading even back then eight seconds of ultraviolet ultraviolet light from daylight will generally kill bacteria in the air including tuberculosis um and i would think that it should be effective against viruses um uv will the old days people used to hang their laundry out you know and used to air out things in the sun there there are some practices which we may have forgotten that may be beneficial yeah although you have to watch for mosquito larvae and things if they're really wet mosquitoes can lay eggs in them and things like this you get yeah there is that too or where i'm living now it would uh your clothes would turn yellow from pine pollen but uh generally if you can leave your windows open and have air exchange in your house you'll probably be better off and uh uh yeah sitting outside in the sunlight or taking walks is uh and uh it's a kind of a generic recommendation but uh most everything i read includes exercise or being trying to remain fit as a uh positive factor in survival okay here's a question actually max if max is still in the audience here yeah she is okay is that my understanding uh is a virus uh which is really small it's not alive in that it's um it needs a host to replicate which is part of the reason why this helps it it can't just sit around uh it needs a uh uh cells other cells and humans to replicate that's one of the i guess the good things about viruses it'll die of it uh after a while if it just sits around true or not yes also it doesn't uh take in uh sources of energy to construct uh its life processes uh or support its life processes like cells do in uh higher organisms um it's a thing uh i don't think viruses are alive they are a thing that gets in and it's uh i i made an analogy something i woke up this morning thinking about you know you play a poker uh the ordinary deck of cards you've got 13 suits um 52 cards i know we have some people playing with something short of a full deck uh we've all known people like that but the um coronavirus is a type four uh virus by the david baltimore classification from 1979 generally viruses are classified according to their genetic machinery as that's comparative molecular uh studies um like seeing how close sequences of the genome uh in one organism or to another organism are the best way to know how closely related they are uh it has a single long strand of RNA 30 000 bases they're not base pairs it's a single strand it's positive sense so if the uh virus spike can get in contact with the ACE2 receptor and there's a peptidase action there it has two parts to it and um so there's some changes there that are being studied by cryo electron microscopy which allows flexible molecules to be um captured and imaged in all these different shapes they take um by um um plunge cooling of um a wet uh you you put a small specimen in water and you um plunge it into super cooled uh hydrocarbon and it will form like a vitreous or uh amorphous water uh environment that basically freezes activity it doesn't damage the molecules and you can see what they're doing so any rate um once uh the virus attaches there and goes through its steps for uh being taken into the cell and then uh uncoding and c-o-a-t-i-n-g releasing its one long strand of 30 000 um uh bases uh it can start to uh use your own machinery your own retosomes it your your own cells think it's messenger RNA and the first thing it'll do is to make uh a couple proteins that um act as reverse transcriptase and uh polymerase it's an RNA RNA dependent polymerase that um forms in complexes and it forms a mirror image negative strand RNA and that gets transcribed into two things a complete RNA genome and also seven or so short um positive sense messenger RNAs that the your cells will then start to translate and form viral proteins thinking it's your own um i point in is is life is short we think in small numbers whether we like it or not um we be elegant with finite mathematics um in theory and with uh uh practice and uh dealing with probabilities like in poker and such but nature is playing here with uh uh there it's holding a hand of 30 000 cards and everything that's possible that can happen in nature if it's physically possible eventually that roll the dice will come up it'll happen however complex it just is a matter of time and nature is on uh cosmic clock and we're on our little pathetic mostly less than a hundred year clock as humans so it's hard to appreciate but uh why is a virus like this show up because it can and because we happen to be here when it does and one thing we mentioned about this uh this morning this is not something to be blamed on any demographic or any particular race except the human race i think the race i would uh claim it on is the human race it reflects human patterns of uh how we deal with food and you know human expansion into every um habitat and uh stealing uh wild animals out of their habitat that aren't bothering anybody and then cramming them into markets uh or butchering them with 30 hands and uh wiping our faces and uh bats if they're brought in they uh they get stressed and will tend to urinate and uh also they'll be more inclined to get sick uh there's a lot of cruelty in the way humans handle animals and if you want to avoid uh this kind of thing happening again i would recommend avoid warm-blooded vertebrates you don't have to eat them i don't eat them and i'm pretty healthy and uh so at any rate nature's playing with a huge deca cards this virus alone is playing with it i guess you could say a deck of uh it's a it's a a hand with 30,000 cards dealt from a deck of 120,000 uh that's and that's how you get that particular strand of uh a base basis so ergon's question yeah there's actually a couple questions let me uh field them um there's one by max is one by barragon this one by a couple other people is that uh what are the symptoms and what leads to death in other words um the virus you know what what what in the body leads to death my understanding it's it's mostly pneumonia and stuff but what it what are the symptoms what leads to death okay the first off symptoms um when they occur um uh are generally uh sore throat it's sort of typical nonspecific upper respiratory symptoms of sore throat i think so much runny nose but cough and uh if somebody said they had a runny nose too it wouldn't be surprised oftentimes people with bronchitis have a runny nose simply because they have so much stimulation of their airway and it's it's not in a direct effect on it's like a synthetic effect on the nasal mucosa and um uh malaise uh chills uh constitutional symptoms of fever and uh indication that your immune system is having a reaction to something you know there's a difference between uh the presence of a pathogen and having an infection and infection implies that your your body's immune system is actually reacting to an inflammatory response and some people this will proceed to uh acute respiratory distress syndrome cause um or severe acute respiratory distress a rds or SARS uh because of massive inflammation and it's called since the avian flu of 2009 um uh cytokine storm cytokines are uh peptides that they were discovered around 1957 and um lymphocytes were the original source and um uh interferons and those sorts of things are cytokines uh there are cytokines uh their their purpose is uh cell to cell signaling signaling in other words messaging from one cell to another and they are sort of like hormones like a telephone line or something between specific kinds of cells and um there are pro inflammatory cytokines and the response is really marked in some people and will result in um um basically the lungs getting filled with fluid and inability to have gas exchange which is the fundamental uh use of the lung tissue for you to have a way for carbon dioxide to get out of your body and fresh oxygen to get in and if you can't do that you die pretty quickly so the and you can go on a ventilator and have positive and expiratory pressure and end up on 100% oxygen and get vasopressors like dopamine when you're in shock and still die and it can happen at all kinds of ages so you want to avoid the infection and you don't want to give it to anybody if you get it the reproduction ratio r0 it's also called r0 is two to three in other words every single person on average who gets infected will infect two or three other people and that's how these pandemics go if it was a r0 of one each person infecting one other person it would not become a pandemic it would be just a flat curve or a flat prevalence but at any rate the more people that get sick the more people you can expect to get sick and it'll quickly get out of control because it's got a it's got an exponential growth and max asked earlier max asked earlier about whether um this might be more infectious or effective but if you might be able to catch this more than a dna virus oh well this is extremely contagious it seems to have a long incubation period during which people are shedding virus and so that's how you get this community spread um i think i don't know if the virulence you know it's how many organisms it would take to get a person infected uh i suspect the virulence of this would be pretty high um it's probably sorry she actually i'm sorry she actually asked about the mutation rate where do you think that there may be a higher mutation rate than other viruses you know wouldn't have thought so but i saw an article and i um i'd want to see more of the support of this but in spain which has been a pretty hard hit uh they're talking about it looking like a different virus from what came in but they can trace the lineage of infections by a comparative studies of of um as the um virus mutates the virus will do will make mistakes and throw it out there it's producing thousands and millions of virons uh virions i should say uh with uh you know every infection and so if it throws out some uh mistakes and they happen to be more virulent they'll take off on their own perhaps um i i can't answer the mutation rate better than that it's certainly faster than uh mutation rate as one expects in general evolution because the number of progeny virus are so great okay so another question is uh if they don't have a fever do they still have to be concerned that they could have it yes you could have it without a fever you could be totally asymptomatic although there is a uh a really fascinating thing going on there's a kensa health dot com um i think it's called uh and it it's a product they sell thermometers these thermometers sort of smart thermometers uh they um are connected to the internet and so they will track your temperature and it also goes to the kensa health dot com to database you can go on kensa health dot com and you can see their map and they will pick up in real time fluctuations that are abnormal in average temperatures and they can point out where um something infectious likely is going on and they're a week ahead of the cdc and being able to do this nobody's having to write it down and report it on friday to the cdc it's going in real time into this database and i would encourage everybody just for edification i'm not pushing a product i don't own this i've just found it very interesting um there for sale i can amazon but uh let's see let me see if i can find it here real quickly in a moment uh yeah otherwise if you don't have it i can find it while you're there okay i let's see when i have second life on my computer won't do anything if anyone could look up kensa health dot com and see if they can find the website i'd appreciate it but yeah it's good to track your temperature if you get a little variation you may not feel it constitutionally you might feel fine but you may have a little bump in your temperature it brings to mind another thing that bats have wide fluctuations in temperatures i actually love bats i think that's really cool i uh had a bat that uh was in my son's window my sons passed away but i had a feeling like it was him coming back to see me and uh he was outside the uh their maternal colonies generally and they're protected animals they're beneficial animals they have their own niche and spend a lot of time high up in the air eating bugs that would otherwise maybe sting you or bite you and give you infections and disease and so at any rate their body temperature can drop and and they'll go into torpor where when it's really cold they'll go like hibernate but when they go out at a half an hour after sundown they'll fly out of their little niche and this one like to go up in this window because it would squeeze up between this the storm window outside in the screen screen was up just a little bit i always left it up for him um and like to go up and see him and um uh when they're flying about their temperatures can go up to 100 the equivalent 105 or 106 degrees fahrenheit which is like a high fever um and um so some infections a fever will change physiology and make the infection um have a harder time continuing for this particular virus having uh originated from bats as did the original SARS probably uh it came from via civet cats civet cats are kind of cool that they will their omnivores and they will eat bats if they can get all of them and uh apparently in china at the wet markets uh they had civet cats that they were um sometimes would butcher there and um that was probably a source of the SARS-1 uh but at any rate um this particular virus which is a beta coronavirus uh uh is happy uh to continue its processes with higher temperatures so when a human gets high fever this virus doesn't care it doesn't slow it down a bit because it exists in bats without and pretty well tolerated okay can you talk about what you have read um uh regarding touching things in other words people have talked about should i have take out food should i what about money what about packages from delivery all of those sorts of things like that in other words from a medical standpoint what would you say well i would think um if if you can wash your hands after handling anything uh that's going to be a ground basis for staying healthier uh in terms of mail one thing you could do is open the mail outside and uh put the envelopes in the recycling bin or but don't handle them bring them in on your counters and things and um uh you can um if you don't have gloves and you're really concerned uh you you know going out you could actually put a bag over your hand like a plastic bag and um you can mark one side as the outside of it and put it over your hand and then use that to grab a hold of things as needed and put them in so you don't handle them directly if you're really concerned about where you are and what it's a very public place or if you're touching buttons or whatever and then you can turn the bag inside out so that the contaminated side is down inside of there and eventually discard it there's ways like that just to protect yourself if you had a little rod of some sort could be almost anything to could be a piece of plastic from a ballpoint pen or and you kept it in a bag or a tube with alcohol and plastic and a cotton ball at the bottom so that the tip of it is in the alcohol the alcohol will kill an enveloped virus like the corona virus and you can use that for pushing elevator buttons and such so there's ways to avoid but fundamentally wash your hands have hand sanitizer if you can get it and wipe down your steering wheel and your car handles and things like that the areas that are most concerned are porous like porous countertops because the virus can get down in there and if they don't dry out they can survive so okay we got other questions here which are interesting is the one that a lot of people ask is about surgical masks including the N95 and and such you mentioned that in the earlier presentation about what who should wear masks and I think health care workers that are directly exposed I think that if someone's sick and they're out and about and they have a cough they should wear a mask almost any kind of mask helps reduce the aerosol and that was one of the points that I learned even back several decades ago when I was involved in taking care of so many tuberculosis patients which I fortunately never converted but that everybody wanted to wear a mask to be in around us tuberculosis patient but the tuberculosis patient was the one who should wear the mask and I think it's the same thing here that N95 mask that is kind of an ultra filtration mask to wear it if will feel like you're suffocating but you can survive with it but it's not a real comfortable thing to have on for very and it will help but it's not failsafe the other question was and they said this it's not a joke they're wondering if drinking alcohol would kill the virus my understanding is it has to be about 60 percent that would kill you first yeah maybe something stronger than whiskey no I think and and you know what and traditionally in bars people have to drink and leave the glass and the glass gets kind of dipped in soapy water and turned upside down it's not washed very thoroughly and people tolerated that for a long time to my surprise but I would be concerned about that just as I think you could go to carry out restaurants to help them stay in business and help their employees to have a living during this because this is going to be a hard time for a lot of people but go to places you trust where you know they take care of hygiene but I think surfaces and handling things like public pens and pushing the buttons on things that read your credit cards and that sort of thing that's that's a concern you need to really carefully wash your hands after that I'm gonna feel the one there's a question about how good authorities and governments around the world underestimate the risk for so long actually they haven't if you I've talked to the right people I mean I've been reading about a possibility of this for a very long time and what it could do and such like that I'm not sure how many people yeah I'm not sure how many people realize what kind of impact we would have in other words how people would react but kind of everyone knew this was coming at least as far as scientists goes would you agree with that yes and I've noticed that the well for instance the people at the CDC tend to not say much about this but the politicization of this process of has been criminal there are all these people and you can just go on social media of any sort and you can find tons of examples of people who speak disparagingly or disbelief about the coronavirus and they've taken their cue from someone who said it was a hoax or their political convenience and even now is being ambiguous about it and it's going to cost lives it's going to cost you know the damage to the economy that's going to cost misery to people because this whole thing we've lost two months I've been watching this I think it didn't take all that much to read about it and there was a report in the federal government in the United States about this coming and in fact there was a report in the news three weeks ago before he sold stock of about 1.2 billion dollars 1.2 million dollars of stock the senator from North Carolina spoke to sponsors that were in a group that were paid ten thousand dollars a plate and told them that this was going to have immense societal and economic consequences but he didn't say a word as the top of the government was lying and being obscure and throwing out disinformation this is a time when we really got to join together and where there's a vacuum in leadership well don't expect it to come late you got to be the leader yourself be the hero for someone else you today can help save others by the actions you take and I think that's what we have to do well that may be a perfect way to end this session each of the sessions were intended to only be about 30 minutes this one's gone to now an hour and remember that you can go ahead and ask tagline more questions you can do it by I am you can ask other people we are really in this together okay and this is one of the best ways to start is by being educated to know the science not just the rumors and so I appreciate everybody coming in today and taking their time to join us please this is an international group please share the information and let's all be safe and do what we need to do in order to not in order to help ourselves and to help our communities I'd like to add one last comment and we discussed this this morning can you still hear me oh yeah please go ahead okay I I've had personal loss due to suicide and this is going to be a terrible traumatic time emotionally for a lot of people and I want to encourage you to watch out for your fellow human being your families and your friends and your neighbors and people you don't know if you sense that somebody's despondent or you get this vibes that they are sinking do something talk to them interact with them show you care show some love and you may save their life it'd be tragic for people to take their lives out of despondency because of all this even when people are dying of you know actual you know physical disease and infection this is going to be hard on people and there are going to be a lot of losses it was a gentleman Dr Schwartz at Stephen Schwartz at he was an MD PhD at the University of Washington who died yesterday and he had been there is in the Department of Pathology since 1967 and was a contributor to research on cardiovascular disease and things like that but he was 78 but even though he was 78 he still carried a lot of experience life experience knowledge and had lot to offer and he's gone he died yesterday of coronavirus so we're going to have to hold it together and carry on but watch out for your fellow man show some love that's all i know thank you tagline Dr Henderson thank you now we've all got our what we've got our alter egos here in your first life yeah avatars and i appreciate everyone's attendance and your interests and um i'm honored to have been invited to speak to you and i've been honored to work with vik here uh our phil uh as a team on this presentation so um this is a magnificent gathering uh place and i think that uh especially in this time of increased social isolation uh things like science circle are a beacon a point of light on the hill so we can be proud of it okay and if you haven't seen everything on the island how's the time to do it we're looking forward to the virtual world's best practice education events starting march 26 and to the other pre and post conferences so enjoy thank you and if you have anything share with us too as far as places go and see and if other people have information on this that's the value of this place it's very global it's very uh sharing educational place take care be safe and um do something to uh you know for yourself and for others enjoy life i'll add one other thing uh on the fourth of april um vik and i are presenting an update on corona virus that's saturday and that will be 10 o'clock PDT specific daytime uh and uh you're welcome to come i'm going to speak more about the the molecular mechanisms of attachment and replication and some about strategies for treatment that might arise from knowing how this virus attacks us so any other questions or i'm going to turn off may mic ariana's history is shown uh you can see the display above us is there have been pandemics for thousands of years and they've always been overcome and uh society may have been changed but um the human race is pretty resilient uh so yes of course we'll overcome this if we uh do it together uh just we're not sure about when as someone asked earlier or what it will look like afterwards yeah i ariana i too hope that the olympic games goes on we have no idea right now of course how long things are going to be uh i think that's probably one of the big anxiety things is we don't know as far as um how long this will be how long individuals will need to be isolated uh what um how long economic situations uh will be impacted but uh it'll be very interesting to see and we're all living it together