 Okay, good evening everybody. My name is Dan I am the director of development and programming for the bed for Playhouse. And I want to welcome you all here this evening for what I'm sure is going to be a really fascinating conversation. We have a lot of people registered for tonight which is fantastic. So I won't take up too much time just to go through a few really quick announcements. For those of you who are not familiar. We're asking if at any point during the evening you'd like to post a question for the panel. You can do so by using the q amp a button, which is found at the bottom of your screen if you are on a laptop or PC. If you are on a phone or an iPad, I believe it's at the top of your screen. But you can ask at any point a question and during the q amp a portion of the evening, we will get to as many of them as we possibly can. Please refrain from using the chat feature. It tends to get a little bit confusing. And we want to make sure that we get everybody's comments as possible. If you have other quick things. If you enjoy this program this evening, or if you think that this is important you'd like to see more things like it. We ask you please consider making a donation. All donations are going to be split equally between all the participating organizations tonight you'll hear more about them in a little bit. We're going to be recording this evening and we're going to be following up in the next couple of days with an email that will contain not only some additional resource material. Also a copy of the link that you can share if there's anybody who perhaps could not tune in tonight to to hear the talk they can watch the recording. And we will also leave the donation link and the link to the film you can also get the link to the film if you haven't watched it yet. We'll see you next few days through Monday Martin Luther King Day. You can send an email to programming at bed for playoffs.org if you need the link for the film. And to make a donation you can just go to the bed for Playhouse website, which is bed for Playhouse.org. And there's a button there for support and just click donate, and we will make sure that everything gets distributed equally. As I said, I would like to introduce to you to the moderator for this evening, Reverend Kim McNair is the descendant of enslaved Africans and Jamaican immigrants. She's a community organizer and trainer with the People's Institute for survival and beyond the director for community engagement and organizing at my sister's place, and is a clergy woman at Antioch Baptist Church in Bedford Hills. It takes full time for a domestic violence agency based in Westchester as the director of community education and organizing, and she's a member of, as I said the Antioch Baptist Church. She is a fan of Star Trek Star Wars enjoys sci fi and Afro futuristic books where the protagonists are women. Please join me in welcoming Reverend McNair to tonight's conversation. Thank you so much Dan. And it is my pleasure to introduce the panel this evening. So first, we have Servena Carr. And many of you know Servena she says one of her proudest accomplishments was the organizing of Bedford's rally for black lives she is a proud Bedford resident and a senior at Northeastern University where she is currently completing a bachelor's degree in sociology and communications with a minor in political science. She's not sure what particular career path she wants to pursue post grad, but she has always had a passion for social justice and advocacy so please welcome Servena Carr. Thank you so much Kim and thank you Bedford playoffs for having me. And now we have Sam Kuhn, who was raised in Katowna, and is a graduate of John Jay High School after college. Sam worked for four years at the National Network for safe communities on the Department of Justice project to reform police departments across the country. Sam will graduate from Yale Law School, where he represents formerly incarcerated Connecticut residents as a clinical student with New Haven legal assistance in May, please welcome Sam. Thank you so much I'm so glad to be here. Thank you. Sarah Yacouche is a junior at Yorktown High School she's been part of Westchester Youth Alliance for three years, and a part of Westchester Youth Alliance's teen leadership for two years now as well please welcome Sarah. Thank you. Glad to be here. Thank you. Marcus Andre is a student recently received he recently received his associates in science for criminal justice. And he's currently serving on the peak skill police reform collaborative, as well as the peak skill youth, he's a peak school youth group member. Marcus Andre says that he's an eager young adult looking to create a significant change not only for minorities who are currently not receiving justice, but for every last ancestor that never received theirs either. Please welcome Marcus. Hi everybody thank you so much I'm so glad to be here. Thanks Marcus. Omar Jackson is the director of stand against violence East Harlem, also known as save. Save empowers high risk youth ages 16 to 24 to make positive changes in their communities by working to change their mindset, and they provide supportive services as an effort to reduce the rising numbers of shootings in East Harlem. Omar is a community leader who understands the importance of engaging in community service, and he stands by the community 100% and lives by the motto you are either part of the problem, or you're the solution. Welcome Omar. Thank you good evening everyone and thank you for having me it's an honor to be a part of this conversation. I have Dr. Anderson Smith, he received his PhD from teachers college Columbia University, and he teaches creative writing in both medium and maximum security prisons in New York with rehabilitation through the arts also known as RTA. He is a facilitator and RTA is diversity, equity and inclusion training with staff, board and other teaching artists. He is currently researching the effects of literature, when used in service to people with criminal conviction histories, post incarceration. Good evening everyone thank you so much for having me. And thank you so much for being here all. So, you should all know that I sent the panelists a series of questions that we're going to cover tonight. And I did tell that I threw the panelists a little curve ball I told them just be prepared to answer any of the questions. But I know this group and I'm sure they'll do just fine with these questions. The first one is for everyone and anyone who wants to answer. And it's really just to open the conversation. I'm curious to know what challenge you're thinking or understanding of this country's history what did you see in true justice that challenged you. And what did you hear that was new to you and I'll start with Sam. So, thank you so much again for asking this question and I'm really excited to see this event sort of come together. It's not something that I would have imagined when I was a student in a resident of Katoma and Bedford growing up. And from the movie I mean there's so much to, to unpack here I mean I think one thing that always really strikes me is the work that that Brian Stevenson does to confront directly, the racial disparity in our criminal justice system and the services on the case McLeese give you camp where there was a stated disregard from the Supreme Court for the fact that there is a four to one disparity in terms of death penalty and death sentences for people who are prosecuted for, for killing black people and I thought that was a real turning point in his career and something that really focuses are all of our minds and I think everybody should go ahead and look up the the baldest study. Thanks Sam. And Sam can you turn your camera on you went off camera for a minute there. There you are. Thanks. No, no problem. Anyone else what challenged you just name one thing that challenged you or what was something new that you learned from true justice. Okay, sorry about that you can go ahead. I mean, particularly just as a young person I'm 22 years old. And for as long as I can remember I've always had that part of me that's a big dreamer. I've always been so excited about my future. I had this feeling of believing like there was so much of my life left, and that there was so much so many years left for me to make my impact on this world, and to enjoy myself. And so, in particular, in the documentary, when it talking about how the system of mass incarceration has particularly failed young people. When Brian Stevenson would go into these certain neighborhoods and communities, and young black men would look at him and say, I'm probably going to be in jail by the time I'm 21. That was particularly striking to me, because I've never known what it feels like to not look forward to the rest of my life. And so that was something that definitely challenged my thinking and definitely brought in my perspective on the different frameworks in which people live, even those who are my age. So that was definitely something that stuck with me. Thank you, Serbina. Dr. Smith. Yeah, thank you so much. First, I'd like to thank the folks at Bedford Playhouse for having such an important and timely discussion. Next I'd like to take a moment to discuss the organization that I represent as a teaching artist, rehabilitation through the arts, some of you may be familiar with the organization. And for those that are not RTA uses transformative power of the arts to help people in prison develop skills to unlock their potential and succeed in larger communities. RTA opens many eyes to the awareness that prisons exist in their communities, which included Teconic, Bedford Hills, and in Westchester Sings and Correctional Facility. And there's this awareness that there are actually people behind these walls. As I consider your question, and what I found most striking from Mr. Stevenson was the argument that while the North won the Civil War, the South won the narrative war. I would necessarily say that the South won the narrative war, I would argue that the narrative is still being written, and a war against equality diversity and equity, we see a continuous pattern of racism and injustice and, of course that racism and injustice that's in society is found within our legal system. And I will say more, you know, as we continue with the discussion but as I watched this documentary against the backdrop of, you know, the recent insurrection against our democracy I can't help but feel that we are at a place in history right now, where we finally have a chance to, to change that narrative and plant these seeds especially with discussions like these in the minds of people so this way they could actually plant seeds in reality. Thank you. Thank you, Dr. Smith. So Marcus Sarah and then Omar. What challenge you what did you learn something that really, again, thank you so much for having you tonight. Something that really stuck out to me was this iteration of the school to prison pipeline. You know, when we speak about the school to prison pipeline in the rhetoric that I've heard of it it makes it almost sound like this is some new idea that, you know, it's only now we realize that black individuals seem to go from school to prison at a very young age and through this video you start to realize you know, throughout history they've kind of realized that the prison system from the get go was meant to incarcerate and enslave black citizens you know through through the documentary explaining how they made simple things like not having a job or or loitering felonies during the beginnings of reconstruction or towards the end of reconstruction towards the end of the gilded age and, and we see that, you know, in this new form of slavery, this new form of slavery that has been continuing and hasn't changed since it started in the 65, you know, is a big part of the issues we black Americans face. And, you know, it's, it's, it's hard it hits it hits you different when you realize one out of every 10 people that are on death row were innocent. And it shows that there's a lack of care of empathy or compassion in the criminal justice system to even do the bare minimum and make sure that you got the right person, you know, or, or this history of police failing to to, you know, actually uphold justice. Those were like the really big takeaways that I, I felt. Thanks Marcus, Sarah, and then Omar. Thank you for having me again. So one large takeaway that I took from this was like, I kind of connected that in a sense the incarceration was like a sort of slavery in a way because all of the higher power and like all those who had roles of like leadership were like the area and like everywhere pretty much. They were all white people. So it was like just like white people ruling over black people and I know it wasn't like slavery but in a sense it was and it kind of just like appalled me that America was once this way. Omar. Yes. Again, thank you. Thank you for having me. For me, it wasn't anything new, but my challenge was more personal when Marcus just said, it's you different. For me it hit me different because me being a part of the formerly incarcerated population watching this film kind of put me in space. And when we speak of the empathy. I know what it's like for not only myself but for so many others to be wrongfully convicted to be illegally sentenced. African Americans this is this has been happening to us for so long. And what this film does it shows us the current state that the US criminal justice system is in and convictions are based off of, you know, illegal represent, excuse me, you know, representation which we can afford inadequate representation, and more importantly, there's no poverty and race. So, you know, watching this film, it kind of put me in a space that that it's great to see that it's great for me to know that this is there's some light being shed on this, and, and that is being exposed, it's a long way to go. Mass incarceration is an extension of slavery of slavery. Um, you know that that's just what it is flat out. Um, you know, 13th Amendment, you know, slavery was supposedly abolished but there's loopholes with everything right. So, if you're incarcerated, it's kind of like modern day slavery. So, you know, again, I didn't really see anything new from the film but for me the challenge was personal. And it was no surprises really the history of incarceration for black men and black women. It's just been treated unfairly and wrongfully convicted for so many years. Um, then lastly, just, just knowing that in Alabama, the way that, you know, that the system is ran out there, it just, it kind of makes me feel like, you know, it shows us actually that the system is a system throughout the country. Right. And, and it's created by man. And, you know, it needs it has to be fixed by man. So, you know, um, this film is very powerful and I know I said it once and I'm gonna say it again. It kind of like put me in a space to where I was a little uncomfortable but I was very much educated on some things that I didn't know as well. Yeah, and you know the theme that I'm hearing through all of your comments is there's two themes here one is the history. So this is not the history that any of us were taught in school. I'm a graduate of Fox Lane, I don't remember hearing anything that was mentioned in this film at Fox Lane and I'm going to assume Sam and Sarah that you have not heard that at John Jay or Yorktown right this is not the history that we're taught, and there's a reason why we're taught it. Imagine if we knew the true history, how much more empowered we would be to address the systems that are crushing black and brown people in its gears right. The other thing and, and Omar you mentioned this and it's not a question I asked for the panels, but but I want to make this comment is about the trauma. The experience of being treated as if you are not human the experience of being treated as if you really are just three fifths of a human. We saw that with Mr hinting we saw that with Mr McMillan that they both experienced this and to live your life knowing that at any given moment. I want to tell you again that someone could just say, you're guilty. And then the system sucks you in. So I just want to and Omar, especially for you I want to acknowledge your share of being a formerly incarcerated individual, and also acknowledge that your trauma response is a right response. What's wrong is the system that causes that response I just want to acknowledge your share because that's really important. And we want to be supportive of not just you. But if everyone that Sam is working with and everyone that Dr Smith is working with and you know all the people that we're advocating for in some way or form by having this conversation. Let me move on to the next question, because it's already 822. It's about being complicit and I want to read this quote from Brian Stevenson, and there's a question for Omar and Dr Smith but there's also a question for the, for the youth contingent. And so Brian Stevenson says the people who perpetrated these lynchings weren't people wearing white hoods. There was no need to wear a hood, you could actually pose with the victims body. They could carve up their body and collect souvenirs. This was actually a point of pride. Everybody was complicit. And in a lot of the work that I do we talk about how silence is being being silent is being complicit. So let's start with the young people. In some of those pictures that we saw and some of those pictures I've seen before and this may have been the first time that you've seen them. I saw the faces of young people, young people, your age Servena and Sarah and Marcus and Sam and some younger who were protesting against integration who were witnessing lynchings looking into the camera. And I want to know from you, how are they complicit, even at that young age. And what does that tell you about holding your peers accountable. What does it tell you about holding the adults in your life accountable. I'd say that they were directly complicit in, you know, preventing integration. You know, I think that every single one of those high school students, which by the way, as of now are no older than like 60 years old you know these are our grandparents we're talking about you know we're not talking about our great grandparents or a great great great. These are our grandparents who are in these photos, you know, you ever heard the saying a white person said we all have that one racist grandparent it's because they were the ones who were protesting in those photos. And so, you know, a lot of, or a lot of many white people in our country, feel that we're long since removed from that. And we're not, you know, and, and, you know, in many ways, especially the ones where you saw people hanging, you know, in pictures of bodies hanging and swinging, you know, those were accomplices and murders. You know, every single person that stood there and watch that person get lynched is an accomplice to a murder. You know, all those kids that didn't want integration or accomplices to are directly using racism, you know, to prevent the group of people that they deemed inferior. You know, like these, these individuals were very much, you know, racist and not only that but their kids became racist because they didn't grow out of that. And the, the, the issue is, especially with older people is although now are, although we've been fighting for integration and equality for a long time, I find that our younger generation to date is probably the most accepting of different types of people. And even now there are still white individuals our age who are racist. So Marcus. Marcus. Okay, I know you're on fire, I feel it, like, we all feel the burn we feel, but, but I want to spread it or I want to spread the fire around just a little bit, but I appreciate you, I appreciate you. Meena and Sarah, how, how, so how do we hold, how do you all hold your peers accountable. Yeah, I mean, I can hop in, because I feel like I'm going to complete the sentence that Marcus was, you know, heading towards. But when we talk about this idea of being complicit. I think that the narrative is shifting, because we have seen progress in racial equality injustice. We certainly have not seen enough of it. I think, because of that progress, it's often easy for white people, non people of color to say, you know, I'm not complicit in racism, because I don't stand for X and Y and Z. But the reality of 2021 is that being complicit doesn't mean that you're racist, like it's not enough to not be a racist, you have to be anti racist, and the whole notion of, I'm not a racist that's kind of a passive position to take. You know, I don't bully that person because they look different from me so I must not be a racist. But when we talk about justice and social advocacy. There's nothing that's passive in those definitions. It is a tiring. It takes energy. But in that way, when you consider am I complicit in the system that we are operating under. I do urge all of us to ask ourselves, what am I actively doing every single day that dismantles the system that we are currently working in. And to, I see you Dr Smith I want to let Sarah and Sam answer this question. First, but I also want to add. Well one thing I want to just encourage people to put the question in the q amp a just want to remind people. And Serena I appreciate it both you and Marcus, pointing us to, like, what, what are you doing because and it's, you know, when you said that Serena actually the cadence of your voice made me think of Angela Davis. You know, it's not enough to in this society, it's not enough to say that we're, you know, non racist that we have to be anti racist so what are what exactly are we doing. And to push that a little, you know, those of us who are non white, we don't have a choice about thinking about this. For people who are who have come to be known as white they, you can you have to make that choice right and so Sarah and Sam, what are the choices you're making in holding your peers accountable and then Sam I want to ask you what are the choices you're making and holding the adults around you accountable, Sarah. Well, personally what I've been saying is I come from a school like that is very largely white. And I see that a lot of people are like against racism but never really take action like they see people saying racist things and doing racial acts but they turn a blind eye. And I think that's not enough at all to be able to say that I'm not racist like you have to go and confront whatever is going on in order to be able to say I'm not racist. And a quick little personal story here that kind of relates to this is so on New Year's Eve I was with a bunch of my friends it was like 1am, and we were at a gas station and two of my friends went behind the gas station to use the car and a cop car drove up and they saw my friends walk behind it they saw us standing outside and they're like oh like do I even want to know what's going on like have a good night please get home safely. And the second that cop car drove away I turned to my friend and I was like, this is white privilege. I was like, could you imagine if we were colored people standing at a gas station at 1am watching the road as our friends went behind a gas station I was like, it just blew my mind I was like, and I had a conversation with all them and I kind of had to explain to everyone and show everybody like that is white privilege and like you have to realize things like that in order to start to make a change. Hey, so Sarah, I just want to help you with language a little bit. Yes, people of color. People of color. We haven't been colored for decades. Yeah, so it's people of color. Just want to help you out with some language there. No problem. No problem. Sam, how are you holding the adults around you complicit because you're you're in a you're in a place like high school is behind you colleges still here you're out in the world. You're doing this work so what does that look like for you. Sure. And I, I appreciate being included with the young people here. I'm actually well out of college and almost finishing up law school here. But, but no, I mean I really appreciate for Venus distinction between sort of being not racist and being anti racist and the idea that you need to actually exert some energy here. I think back to being in high school and the extent to which I went to a school that was really vast majority white, and, you know, like, incredibly economically segregated because of the way racial wealth gap we had very few people of color in our in our school. And then to which I was not sort of directly involved in any kind of work to try to change, you know, our property tax funded education system, or, you know, affordable housing in Westchester which I didn't know that there's been a consent decree entered in 2009, you know, to require more affordable housing in Westchester and it's not being enforced like that's not something we're ever taught. And so, you know, I think if I was in score now. I would like to imagine that I would be involved in some kind of efforts to try to teach around some of these ideas and actually confront the sort of homogeneity the racial homogeneity of the surroundings and sort of why why that is and why that's problematic. I can't, I can't say definitively that I would because I was not that way in high school. And, you know, I feel that, you know, since since high school I've had a number of experiences and also the country has sort of had, you know, black lives matter movement began in my senior year in college and, you know, after Trayvon Martin was killed and that was a real sort of moment for me and for a lot of my friends frankly and so in terms of how this is sort of influencing how I interact with with my peers and sort of older older people in my life. You know, I'm, I'm involved in lots of conversations about really specifically like, you know, what are these aspects of policing policy and what should we be doing and stuff like that and, you know, I'm going to move back to Manhattan after I graduate and there's a Chinese race going on right now and there's a lot of interesting advocacy going on and like I'm willing to be a hub around sort of knowing what what some different issues and positions are around criminal justice in New York. But I also think that there's some deeper deeper work and deeper conversations to be had. And those are really, you know, need to be grounded in everything from sort of movies like, you know, true justice and books like just mercy. But also like really, really trying to confront the extent to which and reflect on the extent to which like, these are not conversations that again I was having, you know, 10 and 15 years ago when I was a high school student. And so, you know, we have a long way to go. We do and we have up and there are opportunities in front of us, you know, and, you know, some of them happen at the Thanksgiving zoom meal, and some of them happen at work and other places but the, the, the opportunities are there in front of us and so to Omar and similar question around being complicit. So this is the question for you all since and Stevenson says that millions of white Americans oppose integration. So, what does it mean for you as adults, leading organizations and also as black men. What does it mean to be complicit and how do you hold people accountable and who are the people that you're holding accountable in your lives. I was wanted to go for a little bit, especially going here and what Marcus had to say. We'll start off with this quote and it says it's from Albert Einstein it says the world will not be destroyed by those who do evil, but by those who watched them without doing anything. So as I think about being complicit. And I think about my role as an educator, and just this conversation that we're having I view these spaces as our kind of battlegrounds this is where we can do the educating we have to start to think about education outside of the classroom and how we can use it and the way I hold people accountable. Is by giving them the tools that they need to to address. All these conditions that we have seen going so I want to give you all a definition right now, some vocabulary it's called critical humility. What critical humidity is is the practice of remaining open to the fact that our knowledge is partial and evolving while at the same time being committed to speaking up and taking action in a world based on our current knowledge, however imperfect. What it says is that you're not you're not going to have all of the answers but your willingness to engage Sarah, your willingness to point out what white privilege is and showing it to your peers. That right there is the beginning that's that's that's what we need to do. And that's how we continuously encourage those voices to speak up. It doesn't need to be perfect. We need to expose our vulnerabilities we need to be be there and live in that and help others expose their vulnerabilities. And that's how we, we have changed, we need to start to engage in these difficult conversations. Yeah. Thank you. Omar. Thanks. So I want to start out with a quote as well. My quote is the quote that you read when mentioned introducing me, which is either you're part of the problem, or you're part of the solution. I live by that. I truly believe that it's like it's no in between it's no gray areas. It's like, you know, Savina said, it's not about, I'm not a racist is my anti racist. So I'm the accountability piece for me being a leader of a community being a leader of an organization. I tend to hold my peers accountable, my staff accountable and anyone that I come across to them to hold them accountable if you're able to make decisions, you know, you got to always know that there's consequences and repercussions that may come with those decisions. One of the things that I'm currently working on, as far as accountability piece is I'm part of a committee that work that's working to, to bring a better relationship with police and community. And how that works and what what that would look like for me is police being accountable for their actions for way too long. We've been over abused in certain communities by police. And when it happens, it usually gets swept under the rug is usually no, no, no consequences behind it. I could mention the Ramali grams I could mention the Eric Garner's I can mention, you know, George Floyd. Although we see what happened with the George Floyd incident and, and you know, I have my reasons for why, you know, actions was taken and I think it's because of the pandemic but that's a whole nother conversation. But accountability is so important. And, you know, me being a part of that committee to where as I'm having conversations with police, and you know, trying to implement things to where as you know, first, one thing is, when you're coming into certain communities such as mine, and the work that I do in the East home community. We, we, which we're trying to create a no touch point where police, you're not coming in and just arresting our brothers and sisters. If there's an issue, allow someone such as myself and such as someone from my organization to try to resolve the issue without there any beat, without there being any police contact. And that's a part of the, the work that I'm doing and save, but a part of the behind the scenes means is just me saying, you know, you guys have to be honest with yourself first. And if you're not going to do that then you shouldn't be walking out into our communities and addressing these issues, because you know we know that there's racist police, but we also know that some of these police may not come into the force, in the way that they are but this is what's around them so they're kind of forced to be the way that they are these are learning behaviors so when you kind of spoke about the youth that was taking pictures and and being complicit in being involved it's like, you know, these are learned behaviors, and you know we all can come up can come accustomed to what's around us and begin begin to think that's what's normal. That's what everyone else is doing. So, um, just just to reiterate like me for the accountability piece. I am big on holding police accountable. I have a, and I don't want anyone to take this the wrong way, but I have a relationship with the police to where as I can sit down with them, I think they will listen. I think they do have their own agenda but hopefully, as, as these changes are being made and we making these steps toward being free and equality that you know they'll listen. Thanks Omar. Yes, I wanted to add a couple things so you mentioned George Floyd, and I also want to make sure that we bring in a Tatiana Jefferson that we bring in Brianna Taylor, right, and you know the film focused on mostly men being hung. Women were lynched as well. We know that women have been unfairly incarcerated since Toya Brown was incarcerated for murdering the man who trafficked her and sexually assaulted her and so, you know this this is an issue and it's not. And I'm not implying that you're playing gender Olympics here, but we really have to understand how this impacts black and brown communities across the board. The other thing I want to mention is history so you know the history that we learned in true justice like I said is not history that we've ever learned in school. As an anti racism organizer, the more I am plugged into a collective of people who are also organizing to be anti racist, the more history gets unpacked. And the more history I learned the more empowered I feel, because I know what I'm up against. Right and and that goes back to the choices of holding people accountable and so in a way without telling them. We're holding our educators accountable by even having this conversation, because I know out of all of the participants who are watching this there are some educators who work in the local schools who need to hear us say, This is what you need to teach you know these are there are books that we need to be reading there are conversations that we need to have so we can all feel a little more empowered empowered and the accountability piece is really about relationship. And you said that Omar like you are in relationship with law enforcement right so we can't hold people accountable that we're not already in relationship with. And so yeah Sam you didn't have those conversations back in high school, but you've got people in your circle today that you're in relationship with to have these conversations and then we have to go beyond courageous conversations we just have to be bold and speak our truth. And. Yeah, it might make us a little uncomfortable but you know this is a place where we might have to go. Alright so. This is the last question I want to ask you and I'm still giving people some time we have one question in the chat. We have one question in the Q amp a. Brian Stevenson is an incredibly hopeful man, I am, I just I watch him work and I'm just like how like, how does he, how does he maintain his sense of hope how does he maintain his, his sense of wonder, because if you heard him at the very end when he was at that the opening celebration for the DJI for the. It's more than an exhibit but the, the lynching museum, so full of hope so full of energy so full of wisdom. So my question to you all is, what is the role of hope and creating a future of racial equity in our nation, and what is your hope for the future. It's very easy to look at video of last week at the capital and lose all hope or momentarily use it so what's the role of hope and creating a future of racial equity in our nation. And what do you hope for, and I'm going to start with Servena, because you're right there in my in my, you're right there so yeah. Thank you. I will say that. And this is something that as I've grown and learn and particularly have grown into my identity as a black woman. I just understood how hope has been so instrumental if not the most instrumental aspect of these different movements. Because if we even jump back, okay, to slavery, one of the greatest atrocities to ever happen in the history of the existence of human beings. And my ancestors and I don't have to go that far generationally to get to those who were enslaved within my family's timeline. But as they're working under these terrible, awful inhumane conditions. You know what are they doing while they're out there and while they're working. They're singing hymns gospel. And my grandmother, who was born and raised in the deep south of Mississippi, who was very much a part of that system and cycle of a racial and economic injustice. Even in the face of just atrocious threat and evil. She broke up every Sunday and put on the most beautiful gorgeous hat and incredible just beautiful clothing, and she went to church and she's saying, because she was happy to be who she was, and to be fighting the fight that she was doing. And so here I am 22 years old, a result of my beautiful grandmother and my mother and all of those people who came before me. It's a tough fight, and it is easy to get lost in it. But when I go to Antioch Baptist Church, as you know, Reverend Kim, I'm going to sing and I'm going to sing loud, because being blast black is exhausting, but it is the greatest honor that I've been given in this life. I'm going to take those songs that Antioch has instilled in me, and I am going to sing them not only in the church but I'm going to sing them throughout my life as I continue to attempt to do this work. Because the reality is is that, if there's no happiness if there's no hope if there's no joy. Then I believe we will have failed those civil rights activists that came before us, because no matter how tough things got they always saw that sober lining. And I will always see it as well. Thank you, Savina. I'm actually sorry that I asked Savina to go first because I don't know if anyone wants to follow that but Omar, what is the role of hope in creating and moving towards racial equity. And what do you hope for. In the beginning of the film, Brian Stevenson, he, he stated and don't quote me because I might not say it word for word. It's all good. I don't think we can be healthy. I don't think we can be totally free until we're totally honest. That's it was something of that nature he said. Yeah, yeah. And what that means to me, and I'm gonna get to the whole piece is that, again, these conversations that we're having. We got to be honest, we got to start out. And you know in this conversation has to take place on all levels, on all levels. For, for, for me, I see that there is hope. I think we are better in a better place than what we were years ago, but we still have a long way to go. Such as true justice gives me hope, because as I stated earlier it sheds light on the injustices of us black people. And it does leave me feeling like things will get better. In order for that to happen. I think that there's so many things that need to take place, as I said on so many levels. We have to engage the infected the population that's affected bodies and justices. So, you know, when I stated that I'm having conversations with NYPD, and that's on that level and as I say there's so many different levels. I can tell them what I think they're doing wrong and how they handle certain things wrong and how they wouldn't do this in a, in a, in another community, but you'll do it in this black community, and they may not like it. I don't think I'm going to tell them that because, again, it's that honesty is that me being honest. What else has to happen is, we have to establish and understanding of racial equality right as we all speak. I may think, you know, racism is something totally different than what someone else may think it is. So here, Savannah say, I'm not a racist. It's a different between anti racism and saying I'm not a racist and that's just that's the truth. So we got to establish like what is, you know, racial equality, equality, what is it. Also, identifying strategies. Like we got to come up with strategies and figure out, you know, the resources to look like what's the root. What's the root of the of the of the problem. Why are we here. Why did we get here if we cannot identify that then you know we may say okay, oh wow, I'm here because you know, my uncle or my granddad, he was this person he was the head of the clan and and this is that learn behavior that I'm talking about. Omar, Omar, what do you hope for. I'm telling you I'm getting there. And I kind of, I mean, yes, all of this is going into what I'm hoping for and then, you know, all of this stuff that I'm saying these steps is like, these are my hopes. So conducting assessments of laws and policies just knowing that we're not going to always get these laws and policies right. The first time, we may have to make changes, and we got to be willing to accept that we didn't get it right, and that accountability piece and I can go on and I'm also, I'm also charged with watching the time and I want to make sure that everyone gets in. You know, and, you know, when we send out a follow up, hold on Marcus when we send out a follow up email to everyone will include contact information organizations all that kind of stuff. But I feel you, I feel you. But that's what I'm. Okay, if that happens, I think we will be in a much better place. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. So Sarah, then Sam Marcus and then Dr Smith close it up what role does hope play in achieving racial equity and and or what do you hope for very briefly. Sarah. So hope is like motivation without hope. I think a lot of people wouldn't be motivated to do anything so in order to achieve this racial equality, you have to have hope that it can happen. And that hope will motivate you to take the steps needed in order to someday get a racial equality. Thank you. Sam. Samuel either. I really appreciate what Sarah just said is sort of hoping an engine for progress and what's being said again about hope has sort of been homage to the people who have fought for us to be where we are today I think recognizing through lines of oppression. Doesn't mean neglecting that progress progress has occurred. And that's a really important lesson that I take from Brian Stevenson. And then I also would just say that I find hope in concrete action so it's my hope that everybody who's on this on the zoom call will call up your representative, if it's Sean Patrick Maloney, he has not cosponsored HR 262, which is to represent the federal death penalty. It's representative Pressley's act and you should call up his office call up the switchboard send him an email and get him to sign on. So, I hope you all do that. That was fantastic Sam right let's make it practical right. I want to switch it up because I want to hear Marcus last so Dr Smith. What role does hope play in achieving racial equity and what do you hope for briefly. I hope for future of racial equality I think it's a multi layered. Thanks so I guess I would like to simplify and talk about my particular population but just to simplify my response is my hope is that people would remember and recover simply. I think about the population that I serve and what we do, especially through RTA and the arts and though the arts doesn't directly address a structural changes. Everyone needs an opportunity to look inside themselves grow and learn. And the arts is a level is the playing playing field. One without academic requirements and as a way to nurture, not just creativity, but learn actual life skills. So that's my hope. Marcus. Last question and then we're going to go into our Q&A. All right, I'll try to be as brief as I can so we spoke about how in order for this to work we have to speak our truth, regardless of how what that truth is. And for me, the word hope leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Because throughout our history as Americans in this country, we've hoped and we've hoped and we've hoped. And although it's we've made some move it we've moved forward a little bit with how long we our ancestors and us and ourselves have been in this country. We've moved barely an inch from where we should be and and I the reason why I hate that word hope is because we use as as a crutch to say well we didn't get it this time but I hope next time we get it and for me, I don't want it next time. I want it now. I'm like, I believe it was the boys who wanted change right now. I want it now. And that word hope always tells me later. Interesting point. The only, however, I also understand the resilience of our ancestors and the fact that I shouldn't be here. My ancestors were slaves. There was a high probability that I wouldn't have been here in the first place. So the resiliency of my ancestors to get us here is what I appreciate and and and and do hope that our generation continues that and sees more progress. The last thing I'd like to say on this is that in my personal opinion from the history that I've learned, not only the new history, but the that that that has come since I've left high school and educated myself and gone to college. Because the history that they did teach us that in order for black Americans to be treated equally is we have to gain some sort of power and the civil rights movement was for political power. And although we've gained some status in that until we've gained power in the other three sections which is economic and social power. There's no way that in this America with the education system education system that we have. And the reluctancy to want to change that us as black Americans will ever be treated as equal. And it's only until we thrive on our own economically socially and politically that we then can be on a standpoint that says I don't care what you have to say because we're equals now and in every sense of the term. So there's no way that you can say I am there for lesser. And and I want to bring this up because there are a lot of people on this call. And there's actually a realistic way of this being possible. Ashley Scott and Rene Walters Marcus recently bought 97 acres in Georgia and I recommend. Yeah they did. And that's right and that's a hopeful thing they bought all that land and they're building their own town and I hope that they are able to thrive there. Right that's that that's the hope and thanks Sam for putting that in the chat. Okay so there are some questions in the in the Q&A and a couple of them I just want to get to really quickly the first thing. So the question was and I didn't want to correct anyone in the middle of your answer because I asked about the role of hope in racial equity, not equality, equity and equality are two different things so equality is, you know, I get to go in the store Sam gets to go in a CVS and not be followed I get to go in the store not be followed. That's, we're both treated as equals and that's a simplified version for the point of this conversation. Equity is addressing my position and addressing the need of my position so when we talk about pay equity. We're looking at the disparity in pay and making sure that based on need and based on in my estimation, the, the systemic oppression that we're trying to bring people into a place where they're receiving the same goods, receiving the same pay receiving the same respect so it's easy to get them conflated but Korra I hope. Thank you for bringing that into the Q&A because there is a difference between equity and equality and when we talk about racial equity we're talking about how we treat black people and people of color and indigenous folk. There's a question here and the question is so you think racism in the US is solely based on the color of your skin, or is it also religious and cultural. So I will say as a anti racist anti racism organizer and trainer. Yes. If you look at the papal bulls of 1452 and 1455. You can see how Pope Nicholas sent people out to across the globe. So the race construct didn't come into being really until 1775 with Blumenbach. We know that race, the race construct in this country is based on color. It is also based on who has access to power. Now the question about religion and culture. I can be as bigoted and prejudice as the next person. And I'm also privileged let's be clear. I'm a privileged black woman I have access to the internet. I speak English. You know that's that's a privileged position. I'm a Christian that's a privileged position. I can drive a car. That's a privileged position what I don't have is power. I don't have access to institutional power and I'm not treated as I have legitimate access to that power. That's where and that's where we we talk about racism so yes it is based on the color the race construct is based on the color of our skin. But the religion and the cultural pieces are impacted by systemic racism as well. And that's that that's one position maybe candy might not agree but that is that's the position that I take on systemic racism. I'm here for Servena and Sarah. And it's the education question. If we want schools to teach more about the history of our country and our present circumstances what should schools teach less of Servena Sarah. Yeah, I'll hop in. The, the humanities person into me is like take out math, but of course that's not the answer. And hold on just a second. I'm going to ask folks to limit your comments in the chat so we can focus on the conversation that's happening in front of us. Thank you. I would say that when it comes to education. I don't believe that there necessarily has to be a compromise on learning less of one thing as opposed to another. I think it's just a matter of making every topic that has been discussed thus far, more full. When we talk about in US history, economic prosperity, not just talking about, you know, how the US was brought out of the Great Depression but also learning about Black Wall Street, and how thriving that was. You know, there's so many narratives that are just left out of what we're learning in our schools. And I think the most teachers and educators in every single field it's not just limited to history. My high school course teacher who is so so incredible. He's made it a point. Since Black Lives Matter took off this summer to not only teach his students the Star Spangled Banner but also to teach the Black National Anthem lift every voice and saying it's that easy. You know, to create a more full narrative and there was nothing he had to change. There is nothing he had to take out. It was just about making sure that every face of every student that's in his class feels like they can see themselves in what he's teaching. But I don't know maybe, yeah. No, and that's that's such an easy lift. Right, just teach it teach a different song or add another song. Thank you. Sarah. I really agree with everything that Sorvina said I don't think that there should be a compromise but I think that a lot of teachers choose to teach to the test and only teach like what the students are going to be like question like what's going to be on the test. So I feel like they should hit more of like the importance of like, like what Serbina said the Black Wall Street, things like that like in social studies you can't just teach what you're going to see on the standardized test you need to teach what you're going to see in real life and what you're going to experience. Nice. So another question in the Q&A. Huh. So, when it comes to making change within our own communities how can BIPOC black indigenous people of color and white people come together to do public facing anti racist work. How can we help those who are coming together to do a public facing anti racist work move forward. If they haven't addressed the racial tensions that exists amongst themselves. How can you approach this in your own work and with your own teams and peers. So how do we, how do we, and, and part of that question is also how do we get down to dealing with what we've internalized. Because we can't have meaningful conversations until we deal with what we've already internalized what's been imposed on us by a dominant culture that doesn't see us black folks as human and white folks as black or human but otherwise. You immediately yourself Dr Smith so really quickly. Two quick things the first thing I was going to recommend was you could start a book club with your peers, and take up some anti racist books I can put some in the chat if you all need some recommendations. That's one thing then the another thing that you can do is have a diversity, equity and inclusion conversation with your group, such as stuff that we have done, especially in RTA and I kind of want you to start that conversation off by asking your groups these questions and I'll just give you all one. When was the first time you realize you belong to a certain racial or ethnic group. Right. And what does mean me ask that question first, and see what she would kind of perfect for that. Yeah. Yeah, I am. I hear you on the book clubs I you know I, I feel very strongly that we should engage in because it's a Joma, a low book. So you want to talk about race is amazing and fantastic. And then get off the page. And, and like Serbina said, you know, work to be. Anti racist. Yeah. Okay last question last question because it is 908 and yeah last question. I know we could talk all night but we can't. So, after the attack on the Capitol, what conversations about racial justice do you hope to see. And we kind of talked about hope a little bit, but let's push it a little bit like in between which groups of people. And is this in small or large conversations and how do we move forward. And I want to just put something in there in that between which groups of people, you know there are these calls for reconciliation and unity. And, you know, the preacher in me knows that reconciliation can't happen without lamenting what has happened. And so is lamenting part of that reconciliation, or do we just forgive and forget and move on and hope that we don't do this again. You know, there's a really great story of Vincent Harding that Vincent Harding tells about Mississippi Freedom Riders when they were in Mississippi and Goodman Cheney and Schwerner were murdered and the white students there were making a decision about whether not to stay in Mississippi, or leave and they were told by Harding and other civil rights leaders, you can leave. It's okay you don't have to stay. And they sang kumbaya. This is, and this goes back to the real meaning of the song they sang kumbaya, which was a prayer to, and they stayed. Right, because they knew within themselves they had to do this work. They lamented over the three young men who were killed and they stayed to do the work. So, what does this moving forward look like to you, and will, and these will be the closing comments. Let's start with Sam. That is the million billion trillion dollar question right now. You know, it's anybody talking about reconciliation right now. I feel has to be as soon to be speaking in bad faith. Like Reverend McNair said, there can't be reconciliation without contrition without an awareness of what we're talking about here. We had, you know, an active domestic terrorism visited upon our country by overwhelmingly white group white supremacist group. There's no acknowledgement that that's what occurred in any way in fact, you know, there may well be actual collusion between our elected representatives and the people who ran the capital so we're not there, we're not in a position to sort of move beyond that. It's very hard to know how you move forward, honestly, if there's a group of people who feel so thoroughly aggrieved when they're so clearly being the sort of racist oppressor I mean that's I think that's where we are. And so I think it's important to say that and to be explicit about that. I think we need to expel the president from the White House and, you know, move forward from there not as a, you know, that's not that's not getting the root of the problem by any means but it's precondition for I think moving forward and having any kind of real reconciliation. But, you know, I don't, I don't have, I don't have the answer for you to be perfectly honest, I think we just have to be really aware of how I think, I think if I did have one, one sort of reflection it is sort of in the vein of Brian Stevenson's work and the truth telling of the work that we were talking about is, it's incumbent upon us to recognize the extent to which what happened last Wednesday is an extension of white domestic terrorism in this country, officially perpetrated both by by private individuals and by people who are, you know, affecting on behalf of the state, and to really, you know, grapple with that fact and you know read a book called devil in the grove to begin to understand, you know, just one instance of what it looks like to be law enforcement in this country. You know, and perpetrating domestic terror, there are 26 law enforcement officers who are at the Capitol that day in private capacity that we know of that we know of so far. Okay, I, I'm looking at the time I, and we have to bring this to a close I want to thank everyone for coming out tonight for watching the movie. Dan is going to come back and give us some closing comments but Serena Omar Sarah Marcus Sam and Dr Smith, I appreciate you it's been an honor and a privilege to spend just a little over an hour we weren't even together that long, but I really appreciate this and I hope everyone goes out feeling a little more encouraged and courageous and ready to make the choice that we need to make for this for this country for ourselves for our children. Thank you so much. Dan, thank you very much everybody I want to thank the panel this was really great. It seemed like an hour to me flew by everybody else thought that way. And thank you for everybody who tuned in and for taking some time out of your schedule for this. I'm just to reiterate what we said at the top, there is going to be a follow up that you'll everybody will receive with a link to the recording. We'll have some more details and all of the organizations participating, some resources that people can refuse as a reference point. And for those of you who have donated. Thank you so much we really appreciate it. That will, if you still, if you missed it the first time it's been for play us.org, and we will be splitting the proceeds. So thank you again for all of your help and support, and I hope we see you again soon. We'll do we'll do this again as soon as possible.