 Ableton On Air is sponsored by Green Mountain Support Services, empowering people with disabilities to be home in the community. Washington County Mental Health, where hope and support comes together. Media sponsors for Ableton On Air include Parkchester Times, Muslim Community Report, WWW, This Is The Bronx.info, Associated Press Media Editors, New York Parrot Online Newspaper, U.S. Press Corps, Domestic and International, Anchor FM, and Spotify. Partners for Ableton On Air include Yixard, New York, and New England, where everyone belongs, The Orthodox Union, The Vermont Division for the Blind and Visually Impaired, The Vermont Association for the Blind and Visually Impaired, The Montpelier Sustainable Coalition, Central Vermont Habitat for Humanity. Ableton On Air has been seen in the following publications, Parkchester Times, New York Parrot Online Newspaper, Muslim Community Report, WWW, This Is The Bronx.info, and www.h.com. Ableton On Air is a member of the National Academy for Television Arts and Sciences, Boston, New England chapter. Welcome to this edition of Ableton On Air, the one and only program that focuses on the needs, concerns, and achievements of the General Abel. I've been your host, Lauren Seiler. And on this program, we're gonna talk to Morgan Brown, Montpelier resident, former homeless task force, member of the city council about his advocacy and about mental health and homelessness. But before that, we would like to say special thanks to our sponsors Washington County Mental Health, Green Mountain Support Services, and many others, including the support from the Division for the Blind and the Visually Impaired, Vermont, and the Vermont Association for the Blind and Visually Impaired, and the Montpelier Sustainable Coalition, the Sustainable Montpelier Coalition. Welcome, Morgan Brown to Ableton On Air. Thank you. So, tell us a little bit about your advocacy and your activism with mental health and homelessness. And why is it important to do that kind of work? It would help if I had a frame of reference about where to start. Okay, well, I'll tell you what, why don't you start by saying the kind of work you do, you know, the kind of work you do, you know, obviously, advocacy is a thankless job. So why? Well, first off, it's not a job for me, it's always been a labor of love, and I've always done it on a volunteer basis. I never have been tied with other organizations but yeah, I network a lot, you know, share information, things. But I've always been an independent operator. And, you know, basically when I get started, mostly I just observed and, you know, listened and watched what's going on and obtained information, especially when I started going up to Stay House in 1991 after I moved to Montpellier. One thing I knew to do instinctively is just go sit in on various committees that I knew that certain legislation would come up before those committees, you know, down the road. So I'd go sit on those committees when they're taking up certain bills and stuff that have nothing to do with the things I'm interested in necessarily. And what that helped do was I was able to learn what was important to certain legislators. What kind of questions do they ask? And that helped with a number of things, including, you know, some people, when they go to the legislature, they go like a bull in a china shop. And they're saying, we want this and we want that. The legislators go, yeah, uh-huh, and okay. And they don't necessarily listen to them and stuff. If you go in prepared and you've done your prep work, you're not gonna get all excited necessarily. And you go in, you go and come, and you just let, you know, develop relationships and stuff. And the other thing that helps is they get to see you. They don't necessarily who you are or what you want, but they've seen you. And that helps. And the other thing, a real important thing is you go to the cafeteria and go have lunch. And it's open to the public. Yes, well, this is before COVID, but yes, before the pandemic. And so you go in there and you have lunch and you meet people, including legislators. And you don't talk shop. You know, you just develop relationships slowly and you have conversation. And, you know, they're human beings, you know? And so that kind of thing helps, you know? And that's what I brought to what I did. And then when I'm ready to kick into advocacy gear, you know, I'm not going in like some people, you know, where they're getting, you know, very demanding and all excited and stuff. And they're total strangers. They haven't done any prep work necessarily, you know? They haven't necessarily met with their legislators or other legislators beforehand and had conversations with them. And it doesn't have to be about what you might be asking them for down the road, you know? And those kind of things are important. And right off the bat, I want to mention that I've always been concerned about many different matters, what other people call issues. And I did that purposefully because for one, I'm very concerned about a lot of different matters. But, you know, people oftentimes the way I approach when I do focus in on homelessness or affordable housing or mental health and disabilities, it can seem like, you know, that's the only thing that I'm interested in because, you know, I focus very hard on that. And, but it's not the only thing I'm concerned about. But when I am focused on it, yes, I am, you know, I can be intense. One, since we mentioned homelessness, I wanted to, you know, there's a big thing on the table while I say on the table, you know, you were former homelessness, you know, you were a family homeless, and now you're housed. Yeah. There's a big situation with motel vouchers and that motel or hotel that was recently bought or purchased by Good Samaritan Haven. And I'm noticing here, my computer here, your op-ed or commentary about homelessness can you explain the problems with or we don't want to call them problems. The situation with that hotel, the homelessness situation and, you know, why in your, because obviously in other states, there's a bigger homelessness problem or globally there's a homelessness problem. Explain your take on the situation. It's all yours. Okay. So, well, you're asking a lot there. But that's fine, go ahead. So I'm gonna hone in on what's going on, say in our region, okay. In our region. Right. So there's, as I understand it, about 300 or so people that have been unhoused and there's some of them that are still in the motels. However, as I understand it, they might not necessarily have access to the motels or hotels, you know, come towards the end of this month. I don't know how many might be able to be maintained in motels, if any. But right now in my period, if I understand it, I think it's my period. There's about 40 people who are unhoused and living outdoors, as I understand. And then there's gonna be more, you know, they'll be leaving the motels or hotels. And then. Is there more problematic in the winter? If I may answer the first question. Yes, sir. Okay. And then you also have evictions now coming down the pike, in addition to that, okay. So, you know, being unhoused is problematic anytime. It's even more problematic during the winter. But for me, when I was living unhoused, you know, I really had time during the summer because I don't do good in the heat and the humidity. And then some summer is kind of wet and maybe even cool at night. And, you know, that can be tough. But, you know, having to live outdoors, you know, when you don't have any other option or choice is very difficult. And then on top of that, if a person has health conditions or disabilities and the like, it's even tougher. And even if you didn't have health problems or other disabilities or other struggles, you can end up with them. And, you know, housing is essential, you know. And a lot of people take housing for granted until you don't have it. And I like the housing first model. Pathways for my is an example of that. And they do real good because except that people come through a prison correction system, there's strings attached. You said corrections? Corrections, prisons. There are strings attached. But if people aren't going from that system, there's no strings attached. And people are offered services on a voluntary basis. But there's no strings attached for people who are, you know, coming through the correction system. And- I'm gonna ask you, what do you mean by strings? I'm sorry. Strings. Strings. Conditions. Conditions. Okay. And so the people that don't have conditions, they can accept voluntary services and not. But they still get the housing even if they don't want their services. And that's important. And even if they don't accept services, but they accept the housing, there's one essential ingredient that they still get. So the question is, what is it, besides the money that it takes and the housing and other things to support all that, there's one essential ingredient that helps people get house and maintain housing. And that's relationships. And that's one of the things that housing first model provides because the relationship is created, between somebody who's working with them on the person's own terms within reason. And that's important. That relationship is essential. And that's what helps. Now, I didn't go through a housing first model program, but it might as well have been because I had people working with me, including family members and others, and they helped me get house. It wasn't housing first, but in essence, it sort of was. And it made the difference. It's people working with somebody who's in need, but as an equal, as a partner, not as trying to fix me or trying to make me jump through hoops to do this. If that was the case, if there were strings attached and conditions, I'd still be out there or dead. No, you don't want that second option. No, but I could have got locked up in the C-Hospital. I could have ended up in way worse condition than I even was, and I had been real bad condition at times or dead. And that happens, it happens to people. But people interceded and worked with me. Okay, not trying to do it for me, but they worked with me and made all the difference. It's important to have a support system. Yeah, it is. That's the point of this. Well, yes, but, and when I say relationships, other people are uncomfortable with that term and they want to say connections, but it's relationships. It's meaningful, healthy relationships. And those, that key ingredient that makes the difference. That's what helps people get housed. I've read up about this a lot over the years, and it's so important. And the other thing is Pathways for Not, for example, the one of the housing first models. You know, they work with people who everybody has given up on, including the person themselves oftentimes. So what do you do? And the relationships help because it builds trust. And if a person's lost hope, maybe they can borrow some from the other people if they're comfortable doing that. And if the other people are comfortable. One thing I always say is don't promise anything though. You know, the people working with somebody don't promise anything because people have been burned. They've been promised stuff and then it doesn't work out and then the person ends up feeling even worse and usually about themselves. You know, people don't understand what people have gone through and why people oftentimes end up the way they do. And you know, think about if people need to think about what if it was you, you know, or somebody you care for, a family member or a dear friend. You know, what would you want for yourself or for them? You know, and- Let's see your point. And any question that you wanna ask? Go ahead. That all depends on, you know, what it comes down to isn't necessarily about funding as people often say, oh, we don't have funding, blah, blah, blah. It's about political will, exercising political will and making things a high priority. You know, anytime it's funny. They often say they don't have money for this and that but when they have some pet project, something that they, you know, is important for them, you know, like the Mapeer pool, for example. Yeah. Or- That's not really, I mean, is that really- For some people, huh? For some people it was. And so guess what? The city council got that thing open, you know? And then, you know, when it came to the Gertin-Pox structure that some members of the community and city council was concerned about, you know, they focus a lot of energy and time and political will on moving that Gertin-Pox structure because there was a certain population using it that made people uncomfortable. Well, why don't they take that energy and address what the root problem is. And take money, take the money from the pot and use it for more- There wasn't money in the park, okay? No money in the pot. Oh, pot, okay, yeah. So the thing is, if they wanted to, they could find the resources and the funding but it's all about political will and exercising that. That's what it's about. And making things a high priority. But they don't even bother because they've already decided that it's not doable. So do you think that- So if it was made a high priority and they exercise the political will, yes, they could end homelessness, period. Do you think- Do you think- It's being done elsewhere. Since you said that, since you said that, I'm gonna ask you a question. Do you think that you can answer this however you want? Do you think- Cause globally, there is a homeless problem. It's not just local, it's global, it's everywhere. Do you think politicians should really concentrate on getting their priorities straight, if you get my point, and concentrate on the matters that are handed instead of going everywhere else? In your opinion, this is freedom of speech. Go ahead. I think I've sort of already answered the question. Yeah, okay. Gotta piggyback off it. So I think what they need to do is to make affordable housing and homelessness a higher priority than they have. And exercise the political will. And then one of the problems with homelessness, just like with mental health, is the populations are treated as if they are the problem. Or third-class citizens. Well, not even that, okay? And what they need to do is realize that people who are unhoused are part of a solution. And we need to treat them as partners. And not as a problem, not as something to be done with or kicked aside or kicked down the road and or do this too, do that too. But create a system that treats them as a human being as they are. And because a lot of times the systems at play whether it's homeless, this or mental health, it can be very dehumanizing. Understood. And it also institutionalizes people, even if it might not be brick and mortar, but it's still institutionalized. And we need to, you know, we need to, you know, we need to, you know, we need to work with people to support them to be able to live as independently as they might be able to at any given time. And not put in place things that deprive them of their ability to live independently. You mean stumbling blocks? All kinds of stumbling blocks, all kinds of conditions and all kinds of requirements that you got to do this and do that. That, you know, the average person who's living in a certain kind of housing rental or whatever, doesn't have to do. And, you know, those kind of things add up, you know? And can you explain some of the stumbling blocks? I mean, of course we're going to go over it's fine. Can you explain some of the stumbling blocks that might be in somebody's way? Well, for one thing, like I already said, if there had been conditions placed on me, I wouldn't have got a house. When the funding was, when the housing was made available and the funding was made available in the weren't any conditions, that was agreeable to me and I got a house. And then, you know, there's all kinds of conditions and things that I wish I could give a big example, but there are all kinds of conditions that are often getting on somebody's way. Somebody's way. I mean, you know, and people have had enough stuff, we should make it more difficult. And, you know, it's like we're punishing people, you know, because they've had hardships and we're blaming people, you know? Like finding fault. Well, what did you, oftentimes I've been asked, oh, Morgan, how did you end up homeless? My answer, oh what, you mean the first time when I was 17 years old and fleeing severe abuse, you know, physical, emotional, and so on? I didn't feel I'd get beat again. That shut that person up, you know? And the thing is it shouldn't matter how or why. You know? The point is you got through it. Well, no, the point is, Larry, that it shouldn't matter how or why a person ended up there in that, you know, trying to find fault with the person, you know, because we think that's the root cause. You know what the root cause of homelessness is? Poverty. That's the root cause. Poverty. That's the truth, yeah. That's the truth, go ahead. And high rents. Yeah, I agree, yeah. You know, low wages, high rents, you know? But, and here's the commentary and the thing. If America is so rich, we're a rich country, right? Why is it that we have homelessness? Why is it that we have people on Medicaid, people on food stamps? We shouldn't have that. If other countries are dealing with giving people free healthcare and treating people better. And meanwhile, you've got millionaires, millionaires, corporations, and businesses that aren't paying anything in taxes. Amen, brother. And then, you know, don't get me going on that. No, go ahead, go ahead. It's the floor, it's, you have the floor. Go ahead, continue. If those who have more than their share of wealth contributed to the tax base, we wouldn't have these problems. Okay. And with that said, anything else you would like to add? Now, we're going to briefly talk about your mental health advocacy. How do you help in with that? And why is it important for that piece? Well, so, my mother ended up in that mental health system and I was separated from her within my first year or within my first year or thereabouts. I hadn't seen her till I was 17 years old and I cut up with her. And, but she had ended up in the mental health system. So I've been a family member, that was my initiation. My father ended up in the mental health system as well when I was a teenager. So it was double that. And then, I've lived with what gets termed as severe depression and panic attacks and severe anxiety, post-traumatic stress is what, basically, for much of my life. I'd made a sleeping disorder since I've been a teenager. And it eventually caught up with me during my marriage. And my marriage broke up and it hit me real hard and so everything caught up with me. And I ended up in the mental health system. And so there I am separated and it wasn't just me anymore. So I had to do something different. And I went to the social welfare office where I was living at the time elsewhere, Southern New England. And I'm trying to apply for benefits and I see a sign on the wall and it said, if you believe you have an emotional disability, you might qualify for social security disability. And I'm like, well, yeah, I definitely, that's no stretch. I definitely, big time. And I didn't sign up for the mental health stuff, the psychiatric stuff, although I did get a lot of some labels there, some diagnosis. But that's what I signed up with Social Security for is that. Because I've had major emotional and also I had learned in disabilities but I was never diagnosed. But I could have been if back then they tended to focus on that but I was probably on the high spectrum order. You know, I could have been diagnosed with, nowadays it's like tension deficit disorder. But actually when I was real young, I could have been diagnosed with autism. But anyway, in elementary school, well, what was it, I don't know, third grade, maybe fourth grade, I was put in a special class for students who were slow. You know, and the thing is, none of us were slow. We just. You had labeled that. We were labeled that way, but you know, it's funny. They expect everybody to think and process and memorize the same and not everybody does. And it doesn't mean that you're a necessary slower, you know, maybe there's something wrong with the educational system. And anyway, that's as far as it went, but still, you know, that's an example. And then, you know, I did have trouble. I did have some so-called learning disabilities and stuff, but anyway, there were different things. And so anyway, it all kind of caught up with me. And so I ended up, even as a teenager, I oftentimes had major suicidal ideation. What is that? Well, I felt like killing myself, you know. I didn't want to die, but I didn't like living under certain conditions, you know. And so when the marriage went down the tubes, you know, I could foresee what my life was going to become. And I wasn't feeling like participating in that, you know. So I tried to, I came real close to killing myself. And they barely could resuscitate me at one point. Oh, really? Wow. You know. But then when I came to, you know, I figured, okay. So it was a suicide attempt, is that right? Like I said, they barely were able to resuscitate me. Yeah. The only reason why I called, you know, the Good Samaritan hotline was I wanted them to call the coroner, because I didn't want my, the buddy I was talking to. I wanted them to call the coroner. Because I didn't want my, the buddy I was staying with, Couch Reference, to find me. So I wanted them to come cut me off. I didn't tell them to call the ambulance. I said, call the coroner. And because I was serious about it, you know. And then you, but then I came to and, you know, I was able to get out. But then later when I was having trouble, I'd go up to the emergency room. And they said it cut me off to the Say Hospital. They said I had a shuttle bus sale, Larry. You know, because the local hospital didn't want to deal with me anymore. So they just found an excuse and shipped me off and the Say Hospital said, what are you doing here? I said, I have no choice. They sent me in. And it was, Larry, it was funny. It was like you should have a shuttle bus. And seriously, so when I finally got disability after two-year struggle, you know, Legal Aid helped me down there. I was on the first bus of a month after I got my check. So where you were living? I was living in Southern New England, yeah, Massachusetts. Eastern portion of Massachusetts. And so I took the next bus up to, lived in Rutland for three years. And then in 1991, I moved up from up here. Okay. And I started, I was doing some advocacy down in Massachusetts a little bit for people. But it really kicked into higher gear once I moved up a month. Okay. Well, with that said, we would like to thank you so much for joining us on this edition of Able to Get On There. And please come back. For more information on Able to Get On There, you can go to www.OrcaMedia.net. And we would like to thank Morgan Brown, former member of the Homelessness Task Force for the City Council of Montpelier and Montpelier resident. I'm Warren Seiler. See you next time on Able to Get On There. Able to Get On There is sponsored by Green Mountain Support Services, empowering people with disabilities to be home in the community. Washington County Mental Health, where hope and support comes together. Media sponsors for Able to Get On There include Park Chester Times, Muslim Community Report, WWW, this is the Bronx dot info, Associated Press Media Editors, New York Parrot Online Newspaper, U.S. Press Corps, Domestic and International, Anchor FM, and Spotify. Partners for Able to Get On There include Yachad, New York, and New England, where everyone belongs, the Orthodox Union, the Vermont Division for the Blind and Visually Impaired, the Vermont Association for the Blind and Visually Impaired, the Montpelier Sustainable Coalition, Central Vermont Habitat for Humanity. Able to Get On There has been seen in the following publications, Park Chester Times, New York Parrot Online Newspaper, Muslim Community Report, WWW, this is the Bronx dot info, and WWW dot h dot com. Able to Get On There is a member of the National Academy for Television Arts and Sciences Boston, New England Chapter.