 What's up everybody welcome back to for the minions the uh What the hell jelly? Why are you already laughing? Cuz I was gonna cut you off and say you're ready to fuck this pig What's up everybody and welcome back to for the minions. Let's fuck this pig. So Usually a weekly podcast Not so much recently. It's more of a whenever there's updates podcast And we do have a few updates this week. We got some stuff for over prime We're gonna talk about their delayed early Access announcement the website's kind of down and they a new face skin concept That's pretty cool Fault had a small patch and then they announced crunch and then predecessor just a howitzer and a calari vid So we're gonna get into that. I'm your host the man who's joining me as always is my friend and co-host with his little co-host jelly knees and smudge What's up man goose dude? I'm happy to be back with FTM I always people all the time because we do ETE always confused ETE and FTM Mm-hmm, right and I was always like no, it's this right and then the second we started up FTM They're always crossed in my head now. It's like this is it's we're in ETM FTE, I don't know one of those two shows but with us this week. We've got stunt back Welcome back stunt happy to have you again always great to be back and to be honest with you I even confuse those two shows Because you guys are a co-host so when you're giving updates on ethereal, I'm like wait, is this for the minions or? It's whatever you want it to be Let's not go ahead and tell us how you got started in the pair into a paragon and your history with it and all that shit your favorite hero I got started with everybody's favorite the dirty five stacking It was it was a game. I was always playing with the family of friends And it was one of those games where if none of us were able to join we didn't play like if one person missed out on that day We didn't we didn't jump in but What got me into paragon was the trailer that my cousin set me in the beginning That's what got my attention their trailer was amazing So to clear this up your favorite hero is a dirty five stack There you go No, I thought mangers. I thought he said 35 stack for a second Is there some meta that I don't remember the whole family plays like you're in charge of the queue you're in charge of WASD you're in charge of the old You get to move the mouse Sounds like a great video It's like reminds me jelly on that time you played fault with our voice commands exactly Geez awkward with voice commands. Yeah. Yeah, it was insane. He played chimeric like Q. Oh Man um Well before we get to the updates this week I got something a little serious to talk about epion a member of the community He streams fault for the most part, but he does play all the other games He is part of our community got to a major car accident. He's a firefighter It was a head-on collision somebody fell asleep at the will and drifted into his lane. So he has multiple fractures He's in a bad way. He's he's he's stable right now. He's gonna live but he's Really bad off right now and there is a go fund me for his family to help him through his recovery effort So if anybody if you are in a financial position where you can give and you would like to give I will have that linked in the description below as well as we pinned Comment below for the go fund me if you do want to give some money to help epi out, but um With that with that out of the way, let's get into these updates starting with overprime Now I did a video specifically about this last week, but we still haven't discussed it on the podcast, which is the announcement coming out of overprime talking about how they're going to delay their early access release and um Do why they were doing that and everything so uh jelly, what did you think of the announcement coming out overprime? I honestly was pretty sad to hear that this was what was happening, but at the same time I respect them for it, right because I and I think a lot of us felt this way Had way more fun playing overprime during their last open weekend than I expected Right and we've talked about it mangoes at length prior to that test of it feels it looks like it's way too fast It looks like all these things, but you didn't feel that playing the game at all In the majority of cases so I'm of course sad to see it be delayed because I want to get back into overprime as soon as I can but it makes sense and I think it shows a level of professionalism on their part that A lot of these other companies can emulate and and keep in the back of their head going forward They've been by far the most polished product that we've had out of all of these games so far And the fact that even they're unhappy with it and pushing it back I think is lays a good foundation for these other companies to do the same thing I don't know if I agree that they have the most polished product, but they're definitely the most professional company out of All of them. I think they handle things very professionally in this particular announcement was handled extremely well So what did you think of the announcement? I was actually surprised surprised in a sense that they had the ability to pop out so much content in the last few months, you know what I mean and if A company like overprime is actually stepping back and saying hey We have some some more work to do on this game before we release it It just brings up the question how out of the other games. How many of them have Just as much work if not more if somebody has polished and as professional as overprime in the backing that they have Actually stepped back because to me it was always that feeling that after that open weekend We might see an early access or some kind of alpha or beta that we'd be able to get into and and the message itself was shocking What they did was perfect. We've always talked about this about giving us updates if you're going to extend the time Let the community know so they're not on on the wire just just waiting for it, but But it was shocking for sure. It was it was a surprise to me and I think Coming out of that last open weekend at least for me The biggest things that I wanted to change before I played the game next Was basically all balance fixes Right that it was it was Respawn timers for certain things it was mana consumption for certain things The itemization being a little bit better, but those are relatively Easy things to to change. It's not reworking an entire system reworking an entire mechanic It's not any of those things. So I'm I agree with you son that I was surprised to hear They're taking a step back from it instead of just making some of those balance changes even as a first pass And putting the game out there. Yeah What about you man goose? What were your thoughts? Well, I think they I think they developed the game to their taste and what they wanted within within the The developers and their internal testers and then they got the feedback from the community Realized that the community wants something a bit different than what they had in mind But they're willing willing to bend on their on what they're what they want to do Which is really cool to see I've seen that before from them. They were talking about travel mode because a lot of A lot of the western audience hates travel mode. So they're willing to look into that and maybe Remove the travel mode if it is a problem, but At end of the day, they'll make their decision and go with it and um Like we've already seen the western market is very small for them compared to the eastern market So I don't think they really need to cater to north america and EU To be successful, but Like I said in the video too, I had no idea they had planned their early release for this winter like I'd never seen any announcement or anything on their timelines that said early access this winter Just just that it would be this year. So I was like, okay It's not going to be it's still going to be this year. So it's not really a delay as far as i'm concerned, but Whatever And I mean they said that they're going to have another test very soon. What that means is up in the air, of course Um, but I would assume depending on how that test goes They're going to have a lot of these major changes that they want to that they delayed because of in this next test And we could see something pretty quickly from them than they're after maybe even a summer release And uh, it's supposed to be a much longer test this time too. Thank god With a day and a half and then suddenly servers were out and you're like, wait a second Wait wanted to play more With overprime statement too, um Like when it comes down to traveling mode It shows how difficult it is for this community to get satisfied I mean, you have a game that gave you travel mode and no boot items And then you have a game that has boot items that people don't want You know what I mean It just shows how difficult it is For developers in general in the mobile to to satisfy their community It just I don't know if it's it's the west side of the world or it's just north america, but It's it's hard because you get both sides one person doesn't want travel modes and one person doesn't want boot items How do you how do you fix that situation? Yeah, and then at the end of the day the Developers just need to make a decision and go with it and make it work Yeah, you can't please everybody. So you got to please yourself I think an extension of their willingness to change things That i'm curious about that I don't have a comment necessarily one way or the other on is their loot boxes and What a what their monetization is going to be because that will determine How responsive or how much people dislike the loot boxes if it's a dollar a loot box Maybe will be more lenient if it's ten dollars a loot box Maybe less so right and so it's Finding a balance there, but the western audience hates loot boxes, right? There's going to be no question that the western audience is going to be upset about that when it comes out So i'm very curious to see how they respond to that Or if they just say our western audience isn't the audience that we have core Sorry, like it's just one of those things. Yeah As long as it's just cosmetics and loot boxes. I really don't care that much I would hate to see anything locked behind loot boxes at all To where you you can only acquire via loot box. That would be terrible, but Yeah, I don't I don't see items in loot boxes. That's for damn sure Yeah, if you give me a way to earn the loot boxes for free. I'm even further lenient Right, then then it really is a choice of Me spending money or I just play the game a little bit longer and get the thing anyway Yeah, right it sucks that it's random, but at least I have the option to get it for free So with my understanding the gold that they gave us during the open weekend where we were able to open loot boxes Isn't that the gold you get out of game or is that the purchase like out of pocket money? Oh, I have no idea. I don't think that if you can collect gold like that. Yeah If you can collect gold like that, I agree with you jelly that hey if it's cosmetics And it's behind the loot box makes it more interesting. It's like a gamble Hmm. I think there's a better I so fault took all of the Epic made skins and made those purchable purchasable with in-game currency Which is great. I think that's a great idea for them to get people to get skins However, the grind to get to some of those higher skins is kind of insane at the same time. Yeah Right the fact that I mean I've got almost two. I've got over 200 hours in the game I think I've only afforded one of the highest tier of those free free skins Right feels kind of bad and it wouldn't feel as bad if it wasn't a skin that you had already owned in paragon You know what? I mean like yeah already fucking grinded this skin in paragon. Why the fuck do I have to grind it and yeah That that can really get under your skin And then you get situations like this where a hero comes up now You have to worry do you want that high-end skin with that matter or do you want the hero? Yeah? Yep. Yeah I mean if just be a partner like me and you have access to everything Oh, just be a partner like me It's so simple just put in an application and they approve it right away I'm gonna go fucking Oprah on y'all just become a partner Um Then also hear that. Okay strange matter man. Just is saying make me a partner. There you go. Just just do it And stun he wants to be a partner just because he gets to play the new hero 30 minutes before we Look after got that sweet-ass decker skin for free. That's why Um, there it is So the and then the website too it went to like really bare bones there for a while where it was just A picture of Revenant and like their logo and there was nothing you could really click on except for their social links And uh right now it just says under maintenance. So there is no over prime website right now. Um That could be a good or a bad thing. I know their old website they It it wasn't it didn't match what was in the game like they had The fey as a play as one of their heroes But they didn't have certain other ones and yeah So I can kind of see why they took their website down. They probably wanted to make it match Match up to what the current game is like And something interesting little thing that i'm not sure actually means anything necessarily But i'm the king of finding things that don't mean anything. Um, is their url used to be over prime.co.kr Taking you to the korean address. And now it's over prime dot net marble dot com So it's there's been a transition there of some kind that maybe for the western audience They are changing the look and feel of the website and they'll have two different versions. Okay i'm not too i'm not too worried about the website being down but It was nice to be able to hop on there and look at stuff It could be a good sign too if the website is something they're working on Maybe that open weekend they're talking about or free weekend, whatever the beta weekend is around the corner I mean, I wouldn't prioritize a website build over other stuff on end the game But if they're updating it or giving us something they might be Putting more links up for sign ups and stuff like that. So i'm interested. Yeah I wait, I mean the website right now says it'll be up by the time this video goes up Or that the maintenance will be over by the time this video goes up So by the time this goes up, it may be a whole different story the website's not down It's got all the things it's got all the information Right, so we'll have to wait and see and then um They're working progress tab and they're discord, which is like my favorite tab in any discord ever They had a a concept for i'm i think it's a skin for the fey I can't think of anybody else who it would be a skin for but it's called cute b and it's like a So good so good. Yeah, it's so good Okay We'll have a picture of it up there right now Stuff did you see that? I did I did and I think what threw me off was seeing Uh a clean without makeup face on fey like that face was threw me off If I hadn't seen those wings or I just pulled up the picture It's like dude, uh, what is this? Is this a new hero? Because we're not used to we're used to seeing that glittery blue like The glowing eyes eye shadow and stuff So That clean face and the skin very creative very creative One of the few name changes. I don't really mind they went from the fey to tiana, which for Some reason makes sense to me I think it's because it's close to the soul caliber fighter that always that the fey always reminded me of The one that had the big hoop Yeah, do you know i'm talking about fey always reminded me of her. I think her name is similar to tiana Fey remind you of her. I think it's just like the the weird wraps around the legs and and like the tattoos and stuff I don't know All right, man. You sure sure. Whatever you say the fey has always reminded me of her always has I think the crazy thing the the props I have to give to overprime Is that for characters? I don't even play and have never really played I look at some of their skins and be like I'd buy that. Yeah The this face skin is one of those skins that I saw along that hero now My heck I was like, this is great. Well, I would buy that 100 if if I played fey one time and had a good game I'd be like, you know what? I'm buying a fey skin right and then go right for that one because That's just I think that skin is that incredible and a lot of their skins fall onto that for me as well. Yeah The prime the prime was that skin was out of this world The giant scarab beast bud called it bionic mushroom monster or something like that Um I think that's that's all the updates we had for overprime. Did you guys anything else you wanted to say about overprime before we move on to fault? Nope All right, so moving on to fault. They had a very small um patch just patched a few items um a couple balances a couple um Sound effects and stuff like that. I think the main news about this patch was how small it was and what that means for Fault as a game because I think it's a good thing that they didn't have to have A massive amount of changes In this patch like they didn't have to fix this on the map or that on the map or they didn't have this going insanely wrong Theoretically it means they're approaching that further state of balance where then Balancing new items and new characters become the primary focus going forward and not tweaking maps or tweaking everything here in And making the game feel new and fresh and focusing on that Is a bigger priority for them, which I think is great Any opinions on the new patch stunt you play fault probably more than uh Any of us I'm enjoying it. I actually am uh, I still kind of get frame drops if Google chrome is open in the background or if like I try to capture a video For like youtube or something like that. I still get frame drops and it's Pretty bad. It'll go from 120 frames down to two in a matter of a second But in general the entire game itself Uh, it's pretty well balanced. They're they're getting there. They're actually uh, I think they're catching some of the issues before Players are catching them. So um, um, I like that I like that they're they're able to look know what they're looking for looking for If they're doing an update know what might have an issue and they fix it right away I like how they enjoy invalidating my videos a week after I release them. That's always fun because I did that video about Grimm they immediately fixed that next patch This time I took a clip from easy ads twitter and our, um, twitch And posted it with counters flapping her arms as she flew down That got fixed that got fixed in this last patch Welcome to the club man goose. That was me with a theory a year ago Release video literally six hours later. They're like, oh, well, that's not a thing anymore. Great. Thanks guys much appreciated. Fuck you guys Now The biggest news out of fault They announced their new hero Mangus isn't excited at all for this hero. No, I could the worst hero in the game. I could do without him It's just crunch. That's I mean, yeah, I mean wukong would have been way better Yes, fucking crunch Oh, I mean they have richter they've had my favorite for a while now but um They don't have the fey yet, but now they've got crunch So they got my they get they're getting closer to the top three for me A lot of people predicted this based off of How excited I was for the new hero because I knew who it was going to be for a while And uh, I think jelly you knew who it was because you're a fucking warlock. That's me, dude Five months ago was like, oh, yeah crunch is coming. Yep So stunt what do you think about the addition of crunch? I think every time I see your name in the solo lane using crunch. I'll just alt f4 Oh, I'll be in the jungle too, baby I I think deep down I said I was waiting for crunch deep down I said aside from my like mains like rampage and stuff I To me it was very interesting what they were going to do with crunch I think crunch has the most Combos in in the game, right like in any combo like I wonder if they're gonna bring that into this game Or they're just gonna have their own own kit running the way they want it. So I was excited. I really I really really hope they go with the combo route because That was part of what made crunch so fun in paragon. Oh god. Yeah was pulling off those combos It's like talos and ethereal is the same way pulling off those combos and weaving your abilities and doing it just right and getting the right thing Just feels so good But I feel like four people that played crunch originally If fault changed it to just have a normal ability set I feel like that would just feel off like I I wouldn't be able to play crunch anymore the same way because it wouldn't be crunched to me I would be irate if you didn't have combo. I'm sure I'm sure you would It's a rarity where we have an fcm where mangoes doesn't bring up crunch the fey or rikters. Oh, I would be so angry Um, I'm just gonna be a very dangerous hero, especially with faults like Q ability where you can cue the next uh next attack When you're sweating you're spamming the buttons It's he's gonna be a very dangerous hero to play against as long as I can auto cancel I'm sure I'm sure they they poorly put that in So here we go. We'll do this. I think we should do this for all the games going forward, but On release crunch is he gonna be broken balanced or terrible broken? Broken for sure. Yeah, I completely agree There's no way she's not broken going into this weekend Especially if they don't give it a a limit to his his abilities or his combinations. Yeah So It's gonna be crazy As happy as I am to see crunch coming into the game. I love crunch Love seeing him getting added in to the roster. I think it's a little weird that we just got feng mal. Now we're getting crunch Like feng mal is an off lane jungler and then we're getting another off lane jungler to follow him up I think that's a little weird And so I don't know if that was necessarily Go ahead No, you go ahead. All of all of the releases have felt that way of like what's what kind of order are we actually getting these in? Right, because we any initial release was grimdecker Then you had so great both of them in the dual lane perfectly fine then after that was Grux moragesh, right like calari was in there somewhere too and then I think it was calari and then they did the final two Morcish and Richter came together. I think because it was the christmas time Oh, you're right. Okay And then it must have been Grux calari and then something else, right? So we've had a lot of emphasis on Supports and a lot of emphasis on off lane junglers and yeah Mid lane has been kind of lacking and even carries have been kind of lacking and so it's this weird Thing that you kind of end up seeing and we've seen off lane Dominate because of the amount of picks that they have That they can kind of transition between and them being broken on release as well in the majority of cases So it's this interest. I'm curious what their thought process is in what roles they're releasing into. Yeah Again, this is just my thought but I think crunch Isn't it wasn't picked because of a certain uh Order they were going in I think crunch was merely picked because it's a it's a fan favorite A paragon favorite. So I this it almost feels like this is where like that Marketing aspect is kicking in because they're saying hey These other three games or these other two games that look like us don't have this hero yet I'm gonna give it to you guys. Yeah, come try it out. I think that's that's the only thing that goes to my mind That they would have actually put crunch ahead of let's say another mid laner possibly a howie eggy. I mean Yeah, absolutely And I think also now that I'm just thinking about this I I really hope that that youtube account named crunch is watching this video and it's like super stoked about it Because I remember sure he is that account all over the place and so now like the justification of having that youtube account is back Oh, yeah, I can't wait. I can't wait to play with him. It's gonna be so much fun Yeah, I think I think crunch the person is going to be pretty happy about Crunch the hero hopefully And uh, I think I think it's about all I had had for fault unless you guys had anything else you wanted to say I think so. Oh All right, uh, let's move on to your predecessor not much coming out of processor. We had a howitzer video of him using his um ultimate and then um a kalari video where she zirps through like a hole in the wall and side lane and And deletes somebody so again, it's just Um, I'm happy to see these videos. I just I again, I want more meat and potatoes out of them. I want I would rather see like a long boring Like coding thing that I barely understand Then these videos at this point like was it the howie video that was showing the ping system Was it well really? I think it was either howie or I have a gideon video But I think it was the howitzer one that he he goes up in the air and he pings a character And it switches transitions to another character's perspective and there's a ping on them And so it shows that they've got some kind of I would assume it's a middle mouse ping system because no like wheel came up on Screen. Oh, that'd be so I'm curious to see what that is Uh, but that's the biggest thing that we got out of both of those videos and I wouldn't call that big necessarily Howie pinged the gideon admin league there it is now the only confusing part about that pink too is if five different teammates ping the same hero Is it gonna give me five? different pings from every direction Or is it gonna cancel everybody else's ping almost like hey that one person is pink You see what I'm saying? It's it. Hopefully that pink is gonna be pretty confusing Yeah, hopefully they go the uh Apex legends route that if somebody acknowledges your ping by hitting the ping button It kind of pulses for a second and basically either it has a voiceline and apex But for me the ping would be enough of it's someone confirming. Yes. I'm going on this person Right just the little detail there, but it's not full on getting another flag or another ping or whatever it is, right? Hopefully they've got something like that in there Because it'll drive the jungler. Sorry for cutting off macros, but it'll drive the jungler crazy If i'm trying to gank carry lane and i'm getting pings in mid and in solo And my map has all these little pings on or or my vision has all these little pings over people's heads Yeah, absolutely. I don't know how that's gonna work Only the jungler's allowed to ping and how it's her Oh The house or video does kind of illustrate something that we already knew but a lot of people may not Understand his ultimate has been changed like you no longer Has the reign of missiles that come down He just he gets to fly for a little bit and it gets a lower cooldown on his q his r2000 rocket So he can kind of spam those while he's flying around in the air so That's kind of different for people that didn't know that And then the kalari video that was kind of a cool concept where she kind of zirps through a hole in the wall to to get somebody so It shows their hitboxes are really clean, right? Their collision is also super clean as a kalari main I loved seeing that. I was like, heck. Yes. I can pull flashy plays like that. Absolutely The weird thing to me about that video Is it looked like it was a lock-on? Because she zipped through that and was instantly doing damage. She didn't like go through them to deal damage It to me felt like she locked onto the person And used that to go through the hole and perfectly deal the damage and kill them And I don't know if that's a Uh, I assume that they're doing that in the sequencer and unreal engine So I don't know if that's just the sequencer making it look staged Or it being really staged and all those things or what the deal was there Um, but I'd be very curious to see if it is lock-on now or not. Yeah Hmm. Kalari becomes really dangerous if that becomes a lock-on If she locks on that ultimate over prime I know that was my exact Over time over prime was more of a like a combination of stuff I'd understand the lock-on but a kalari with With an ability like that and alt that where she twists or turns or whatever towards the heroine you lock that on automatically Mm-hmm And she's got double 30 kills a game She's got double daggers and predecessor. So You can slow people twice and then lock on to them with your ultimate. Oh, yes, please. Where do I sign? I I think this is great. Don't ignore stun guys. I think lock-on the way to go Uh, I would love that. Thank you but only for me I ultimately kalari is not allowed to lock on major knives lock-on too. It's with those daggers lock-on I like this. I like this plan. I mean people hated kalari and Paragon hated kalari and fought might as well do it to the other games exactly see Jelly will screw up calari pretty sure they hated kalari and over prime too I think I think you should make it her knives reset when they hit So you just get unlimited knives every time you hit somebody. Oh my god. No problem. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. There you go Be like, uh, I mean that sounds ridiculous, but that's how wraith's fucking snipe worked. Yep If you got it if you killed it even a minion with it, you got all the mana back and it reset the cooldowns You can just Loudest fucking hero on earth because it is ridiculous because it was ridiculous on wraith. It really was Um, uh, that's all I got for processor. Let's let you guys have anything else you want to talk about I don't think so All right, uh, ethereal nothing out of ethereal nothing you got. Well, you guys been quiet. What's up jelly? I don't know man. We're just being quiet. All right We're just hard at work on let that roadmap stuff. We talked about it in the last community corner if you guys didn't see it Um, we put up a roadmap a lot of the information that's on there We're kind of being a little more dormant while we work on a lot of the information So we can come out the gate swinging when we come into that next test and go really hard on all that stuff right on It's not anything to say about ethereal The whole new world ethereal is a different game. It's it's amazing ethereal is fun Yeah, for everybody out there that was like There's a lot of people that seem to think that Paragon should just be laid to rest and just do not disturb rest in peace But they still want like a third person moba Check out ethereal because that's that's exactly what you're looking for a whole new experience in the third person uh moba genre And you guys haven't even played on the new map yet. It's literally a whole new world man. Like it's it's crazy If you're bored with easy concepts and spamming bugs try it There you go. Yeah Yeah, if you want to pull some flashy fucking plays go go play some ethereal. That's for damn sure um So I think that's going to close it out for all the updates Uh, I'm not I'm not even going to worry about the poll. I'll I'll I'll try that again next week I didn't update people about the polls. I nobody really voted. So we'll move away from the poll Uh, the discussion topic Now what we're going to be talking about we already talked kind of touched on it a little bit when we were talking about crunch Is who would you like to see? added into the Any of these games next? Um And I kind of wanted just from different perspectives Uh, I told you guys to pick one or two in case we each picked the same one So, uh, let's start off with our guest stunt Stunt, who would you pick to be added in next? I picked this hero revenant for one purpose Because revenant in my opinion out of all the heroes has that one alt That these companies can get really creative with I'm curious to know How they're going to pull it off because it's not easy Uh, I didn't play revenant too much in paragon. I don't remember if you altered A person and you were under tower. Did you still get hit by the tower? No, did you get damaged? so I'm curious to know how The other the three games fault over prime and predecessor are going to pull this off Like all the other heroes obviously the abilities are pretty close a little tweak here a little tweak there We kind of know what's going on So revenant I picked revenant just for that purpose because he's a very difficult hero to To code very difficult, especially with that alt The over prime has already shown that they like over prime had revenant So they've shown that they can at least have a version of the ultimate I thought it worked pretty well. I didn't you really I didn't I'll think I touched revenant Other than you know beating his face in with steel, but I didn't play him personally Scott vangus Scott And what's his name shade his name shade in over prime, isn't it? So shades ultimate I believe what it did it rooted people to it didn't just transform to another world it rooted them and they Took damage over time. I believe Is that right jelly? I know you played a little bit dealt a burst of damage. I think as well. Okay If you were on the other side of that alt how easy was it for you to catch up to revenant and hit him? Did it oh did it stop very like? It basically relied on you having some kind of gap closer to because his distance that he could use his ultimate was fairly large actually and most of the time the only time if he was trying to get away from me and use that to Give it give him just a little bit more space. The only time I caught up to him was on kalari Or shinby because those two have the longest dashes or dash resets That allow you to do that, but if he wanted to get away, he's gone Because I didn't play him. I mean, I don't know if he gets An energy boost or he gets a health boost when he's in that Alt form He does extra damage. I think it is. Yeah um That's one of those ultimates that can easily be overloaded Or underpowered right and so I think I think over prime did a good job of kind of finding that balance I don't think revenant was necessarily balanced outside of the ultimate But I think that ultimate itself was relatively balanced. I think he was overtuned or undertuned I would probably say overtuned by a hair. Really? Really? Okay. I think I think he was it's one of those skill things over uh revenant to me Was a complicated character in that you have to manage his bullets But his kit was straightforward outside of that Right to because you had that that balance. I think revenant and over prime His kit was a little more complicated to use effectively But when you did it just destroyed people because I was by the end of that open weekend or that or that test The revenant players that were playing him all weekend were destroying consistently And so that's I think he's overtuned for people that know how to play him But then just slightly too high on the skill cap for people picking him up for the first time I think his ability to reload where you have to press a button is what confuses a lot of Paragon players because you're not used to that. You're not used to having to reload Murdoch doesn't do it. Nobody does it. So When I tried in the practice arena at the moment, I like dude by my bullets ran out. What next? What do you do now? Reload this though that way I give four shots all game. I have 20 minutes four shots I think revenant is also a good choice because uh kind of what we talked about with crunch a little bit You have fan favorites Then you have cult favorites. I think like you have people that everybody like like decker decker is a hero that everybody New and liked and she was just a well-liked hero But she didn't really have the following that say shimby had or somebody like that Revenant's one of those that had a following like people That loved revenant fucking loved revenant and would play the game just because it has revenant Absolutely I'm sure every I'm sure every hero is like that like has a small following But I think revenant's following is probably Bigger than say a decker following that they're that that's the one that people are waiting for is decker I think 100 there's yeah way more people waiting for like crunch or revenant or whatever you Yeah, absolutely All right, man. Goose. You want me to go first? I want you to go first All right, because I got a bit of a controversial one actually. Oh god. It's gonna be wukong Yeah, actually I really I I do want to see wukong as the next hero for these games And I have a kind of a specific reason as to why is wukong I think Will show very quickly what the capabilities of the balance department and their game development departments are Because wukong is overtuned as all hell in paragon And there was a reason that they couldn't nerf him far enough to keep him down Because great you've now nerfed this thing that was oppressive great. There's three other mechanics that are oppressive now Oh, you nerfed all three of those great. This one's now oppressive to the point. They basically had to completely gut him And then he was unplayable Right and so but then they didn't like that so they had to bring stuff back He was a balanced nightmare and I think from that perspective. I want to see Wukong implemented into these games to see where they go with it and how they address that balanced nightmare Because wukong had a cult following not as much as like revenant or anything But those players you're gonna have to appease those because they'll come back to the game for wukong Even if they're the the edge lords that just wanted to stomp on towers all game for in a five minute game But you've also got the stance switching For wukong and I think that's something that none of these games have Gone too far into grim and fault. I really love because of the stance switching But it's kind of a very base version of that Yeah, whereas wukong was way more fleshed out in this full stance switch And I think that as a concept That is very difficult to balance in and of itself And so I'm curious to have a stance switcher in there that really rewards the high skill cap players That's that's interesting stunt with like Stunt with with a programming challenge you went with a balancing challenge As far as adding like add this so that we can that we can see that you can do this like Add revenue so that we can see you can program his ultimate add wukong so we can see that you can balance your gain and I think For me a close second. It was hard to pick between the two wraith is the same way And that I would say wraith falls under that balance that you have to have a very key understanding of what the balance is in your game For wraith to be put in the game and not be oppressive or useless all the time. See that's my pick, but There you go. Perfect. Then we'll get into it right now We'll let let we haven't given stunt a chance to talk about wukong and I have a few things to say as well Even though I played with wukong to me When you have a hero that Has the ability to escape And has the ability to attack And in perfect in a perfect condition like he didn't he didn't have issues to me A good balance of wukong was get rid of the ability to escape Get rid of that stance and just let him have pure power You know, I mean so people Actually learned how to pick fights. I mean how many times we've all experienced it a wukong jumps tower hits you All to you leaves his little clones behind and and is out of there before you can even move Yeah pinballs you around and by the time you realize which way is up. He's already gone I think absolutely and that's um Something about wukong is we were talking about you know the cult following that'll bring people into games I think wukong is the only hero that would push people away from a game Oh, yeah, like oh they added wukong. Oh fuck that. I'll wait And I think wukong is The worst version of kalari Because kalari also had that same issue where she could go in and get out with no strings Right that. Oh, okay. I envis to get in I dagger you I ult you I do whatever I need to do Double jump in this and where what are you going to do now? You can't yeah, right? And so wukong took that to a whole other level And people were already pissed off about kalari. So then wukong just absolutely floored people in that regard Yeah, yeah kalari's escape And boris is perfectly Uh Perfectly assembled kid Because boris was like that too that kid Is overpowered no matter what you do boris is still Do whatever you want. Yeah, well I say he had four he had four ultimates and one basic ability. Yeah He's been boris has been toned down since then but uh Yeah, I don't know it would be nice to see wukong just to see how they could balance him. I like that like that choice Uh, you guys what do you want to get into mine? You want to talk about mine? Let's do it Let's do it. All right. So I mean jelly art brought it up wraith wraith would be my pick Not because I was a huge wraith fan or anything. I did enjoy wraith, you know He was he was a fun hero but I would I would like to see wraith get added because of the variety of roles that he can play he could be off lane mid lane ADC or support you don't see many that could be adc or support You know what I mean and wraith could do both because of his rewind ability was an excellent support tool to keep Keep your uh, your adc out of trouble and he had his ward just on command And um, he would fill it and then you could just take him to mid lane You can take him up. I think he's just a great all-around hero That would be an excellent addition to any of these games Just just to fill out the roster and have more people more picks for people for everybody Yeah, that's my only real reason I completely agree with you I think there's some things about his kit that have to be looked at right the reset on his q Of course can't be a thing right or it can't be as easy to execute in that regard His rewind was consistently too strong because of just the nature of the ability I would love to see some kind of activation mechanic rather than just let me press a button and buy right like Like have it be I have to eq them or I have to See them on a ward and then press e or whatever would give it some kind of extra Thing to get that bonus effect right have it have some kind of base weaker of version but to get the full fledged Rewind give it some kind of extra effect. I also love his ultimate Even though it's relatively underpowered as ultimates go I think it creates opportunities for coordinated play That we don't really see in a lot of these games right now Then like full-on coordinated play and by association Similar to when kalari was released in fault It forces people to learn how to ward because you have to know where people are Before that ultimate drops so you can have an expectation of what's going to happen And make it a little quieter Make his entire kit a little quieter I like the idea of an activation for his for a rewind I think it'd be cool if you marked him with e and then you had to hit them with the snipe in order For it to actually rewind them. Yeah, I think that's fine I give it give it just that that little bit of something That makes it harder. It's still relatively easy to pull off But it's not just purely hundred percent consistent, right And I'm and that would kind of take away Like one of the easier ways to play him was you see somebody low health You hit him with rewind and then you just wait for them to go back to the spot You know, they're gonna be and whack them with the snipe It provides a level of counter play if he hits me with his the initial part of his e And I know he's looking for the snipe Then I double jump his calari then I do a dash then I use giddy in portal Then I whatever the thing is to provide just that little bit of chance that I have to get away Instead of it just being I don't get to play the game for the next three seconds Because no matter what I do. I'm just going back to three seconds ago. Yeah I agree. I mean, uh, I he didn't he didn't go through my mind. I totally forgot about him, but rate has that balancing and um The coding issue too I mean Most of these games have a count is that Rewinds back from the original spot. She came from But rate to go back three seconds You know, I mean, it's gonna it's gonna it's interesting how these companies are gonna pull it off We know overprime might be able to pull it off the gideon almost did that or I don't know if gideons was just a pool or a rewind, but That right click You were brought back into the uh the center of that of that target so it's interesting rate has bought a A balancing and a coding challenge Yeah, depending on the length of the rewind you have to consistently store the coordinates of where they were Three seconds ago five seconds ago. Yeah, or every character in the game any every enemy character in the game Oh god, can you imagine being able to rewind your your allies? How fucking annoying that would be Dude, that'd be so anti fun. I would hundred percent get in the game with mangoes as my support and be like Rewind. Bye. My marriage is going in. You know, he's just gone You know what I see happening when that happens You jump in with the count as you jump in with a fang other tower You're barely out with five percent health and somebody winds you right back on their top It would be worse than phase Oh shit All right, how many times it's happened with phase That yeah pull you and you jump into tower. You're like, dude, you're supposed to pull me the opposite Not just leash on me back into power. They just freak out sometimes and pull just pull. They just pull Just do the thing I think that's about all I had to say for the uh topic the specialist She goes anything else you wanted to add to what heroes you wanted to See next No I want you guys let us know in the comments below. Let us know what hero You would like to see added to any of these games next and for what reason It can be just because you like I'm not gonna that's that's fine by me, but uh Yeah, that's going about wrapping up. Let's move on to plugs stunt. You got anything you want to plug Just by twitch channel stunt underscore v Right on he's got a pretty badass logo. I don't know if you guys thanks. Thanks to man Yeah, I was gonna say Not not only did mangoes design it it's gonna go on a hoodie right now. There you go. I'll go about that hoodie Wait, wait, wait till you see the emotes like my subscriber emotes stuff. Yeah, you go Jill you got anything to plug Not right now. I'm moving this weekend. So super exciting. This will be the last time you have this backdrop for me Uh, yeah, and so not for this week, but maybe by next week I'm sad. I'm moving the day crunch comes out. So I'm like, oh computer access all day Kind of feels so bad. Uh, I can't write jelly. He's going to void lane. You're gonna see a water It's okay, I'll come back on sunday and still already be better than man Ouch probably Checks out checks out All right, folks that is going to close it out for this week. Appreciate you coming out if you're watching the premiere This is the end and uh, and thanks for watching if you're watching this as a video This is also the end and thanks for watching. But for now This is the entire for the meetings crew signing off this pig has been fucked Man goose Special shout out to channel members foolish blood hunter jelly knees me I'll mix for men stunt farith and raven