 Chair, you are now live. All right. Good morning members, officers, and members of the public who may be viewing the live stream this morning. Welcome to this meeting of the Grants Committee, which is the 25th of September. My name is Councillor Joe's Hales, and I'm the Chair of the Grants Varsity Committee. For the information for members of the public, the role of our committee is to consider and make recommendations to the lead cabinet member for finance, Councillor John Williams. You'll see it down the bottom of the beard. One applications made under the Council's grant schemes, Councillor Williams then makes his decision taking account of our recommendations. Members, please, can you remember to mute your microphones unless you are called to speak? You will need to unmute your microphone in order to speak. Okay. So we go to the agenda now. Agenda item number one. May I have apologies, please, Aaron? Yes, Chair, thank you very much. We have received apologies from Councillor Claire Deltafield this morning. And do we have a substitution? We do, Chair. Councillor Bill Handley will be substituting for Councillor Deltafield. Thank you very much indeed, Councillor Handley. So I'm going to go through the roll. Aaron, you could go through the roll, if you don't mind, actually probably better. Of course not, Chair. Members, I will read out your name. Please, could you confirm that you are present remembering to unmute your microphones before you speak? Councillor Donton. Yes, President. Councillor Ellington. President, good morning. Councillor Handley. President, hello. Councillor McDonald. Present. And Councillor Hales, clearly we are aware that you're present and Councillor Williams has been briefly introduced, but if you could just briefly introduce yourself again. Good morning, I'm Councillor John Williams. I'm Lead Member for Finance. Thank you, councillors. Aaron, do you want to introduce the members of staff? Of course. So we've got several members of staff here presenting reports this morning. We have John London, who will be presenting the Community Chest Report. Hello. We have Jay Clark, who will be assisting with that. And we have Leslie Mufalen, who will be presenting our reports on the mobile warden schemes. And I'm not sure if Leslie has her camera on currently. Oh, I have. Yes, she has, yes. Apologies, you're just hiding off of my screen. And in the background, we have Jonathan Malton, who will be assisting us with the streaming today. And myself, for Clark's meeting. Thank you very much, Aaron. That's really great. Much obliged. OK, members, agenda item number two, declarations of interest. Do any members of the committee have interest in declaring relations with any of the business on the agenda? Councillor Ellington. Chair, I would like to declare a non-pewnery interest in the application for a mobile warden scheme for Lollworth and Fendrake. And they're part of my patch, my ward. And I have been discussing with them their best options. Thank you very much. Councillor Henley. Similarly, Chairman, I, both of my villagers over in Willingham have applied for mobile wardens. And I have been engaging with officers and the parish councils to put it into place. So I declare a non-pewnery interest. That's fantastic. Thank you very much. OK, members, agenda item number three, this is the minutes from our last meeting. I'm going to go through the usual process. So if you could access your minutes. I'll just go through the page numbers. If you could sing out if there's anything that concerns you or you believe that should be changed. So that's page one. And I beg your pardon, this was the 28th of August. So page one, page two. And obviously page three is just a sign off. Is everybody happy with that? Agreed. I'll take the silence as an affirmation then. So I'll sign those off then, yeah? Thank you very much, Cindy. So is that clear, yeah? Yes, it's me. Yes, just one small point. I sent an apology for absence and Bill Handley was my substitute. I don't know whether that needs to be noted that Bill was my substitute so that it's clear that someone was in my place. And it's still as present. You did have a full compliment. OK, Aaron, would you make those adjustments, please? Thank you. Terrific. Okie dokie. Item number four, community chest. Gentlemen, John or Jay? Who's going to be? Is that you, John? It is indeed, if that's OK, Chair. Please, thank you to crack on. Thank you very much. Our first applicant is a deferral from the Global Learning Idea Exchange, G-L-I-E. This is, you'll be familiar, the hook cards of the company design time for educational resource application that has come to the committee on two previous occasions. The last meeting that I was at, we asked if it was for them to explain exactly what they're about in their own words in a concise manner. So Antonio has watched the livestream from the previous time that the committee looked at his proposal and has prepared this statement. Hook cards are designed to complement the great teaching and learning that takes place in school. They subtly encourage learners to discuss and consider issues regarding sustainability and equality in turn building compassion. The County District Plan highlights its determination to assist communities becoming more sustainable, building the skills required for that to happen. I wholeheartedly feel that the most impactful way for that to happen is through schools. Our hook cards and the resources assistance we provide for free will no doubt build skills and knowledge regarding this. Schools can decide the time that they commit to implementing to our resources, be it a 15-minute discursive activity per week to an actual lesson within Classes Weekly timetable. The resources we provide will all evolve around our hook cards. It is our intention, should our application be granted, that 100 South Cambridgeshire schools and community groups will receive a pack of hook cards. Highlighted as a courtesy of the District Council. With the cards, I will include an invite for schools to access free online learning slash training that will show how they can teach their children, how they can live sustainably and become fair, inclusive and active members for their community and society. This is a project which costs £630 and change and they have applied for the entirety of that project cost. Thank you very much, John. Over to you members. Has anyone got new comments? It has substantially more information than we've had in the past, to be fair. And it's quite clearly laid out now. So I'm looking at all your faces now, thinking who's going to speak first. I think, I think, I think, Jerry, it gives us, it gives me any way, the information I was looking for and I'm satisfied. Thank you. I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna pressure you now, Councillor Wellington. I just feel uncomfortable. The, the right words are being used about sustainability and compassion and equality. But I am always quite concerned about things like in whose judgment and whether there is an element of brainwashing in any sort of, I do have an MA in education and my concern all the way through has been that when you teach people, you are influencing their judgment and you have to be extremely careful about making them bias in any way. You can give them facts, but you shouldn't be imposing your, if you have a very strong view about things, be imposing that. And so there's just an inkling around there that just makes me feel uncomfortable. Sorry. Don't apologize, that's what this is for. Councillor Daunton. Yeah, I have some very practical questions still. And in the piece, in the text provided, the pronoun moves from I to we and I'm not sure who the we is, how many people are involved in this organization if it is simply the person whom John has just mentioned because the text ends with I will include an invite. So that's one question. How many people are involved in this global learning idea exchange? What kind of organization it is? And then under organization type, the CIO is mentioned, but the application is still pending and they're not CCVS registered. So if we gave a grant to whom or to what would we be giving the money? And I still think that we don't have that very basic information. And then finally, on a piece of information, have we actually seen what a hook card is and how it would work? Thank you, Claire, that's great. Councillor Henley? I feel very much in the same way that Councillor Daunton does. I don't have the benefit. I haven't got the benefit of having heard about hook cards before because I wasn't in the meeting. I didn't attend the meetings where it was discussed previously. My wife works in education. I've never heard of them. I'm like Councillor Daunton. I'm not sure I can support this, to be perfectly honest with the information that I have in front of me. I wouldn't want to say, I wouldn't want to dismiss it completely. That might be unfair, but certainly what I can see here and what I've heard, I don't think I can support it. Fair enough. I'll give you my opinion. I was very much airing on the side of Peter. Councillor Macdonald with the information's come in and that's great and we've ticked the box and what have you. But having listened to both Sue and Claire speak, so eloquently, the pair of them, with regards to their own knowledge and the questions and doubts, I'm very much airing on the side of the four of you. Peter, go ahead. Yeah, thanks, Chair. The only bit of I don't disagree or I understand like Councillor Hanley's, Councillor Daunton's reservations, but don't forget the arbiter of this is the school. These will be provided to the school. There is no obligation on the school to use it if they don't feel it's appropriate. My guess is, and it's a total guess, I haven't seen the book cards, I must admit, that some schools will say, oh, this fits very well with the curriculum and other schools will say it doesn't. But they will be the arbiter's really addressing and I know where Councillor Allenton is coming from and I think we have to trust the schools. Okay. John, London. Thank you very much. Just as an aside, I'm trying to find the email. I've had a large number of communications with Antonio. He has given the names of two other people who he has said is on the council. I don't have any direct contact details for those people. The only communication I have had is with Antonio, the main person. I have been communicating with, but he did give names of other people in one of the emails. Thank you. Do you want to take your hand down, John? Oh, sorry. Okay, Councillor Williams. Yeah, to be honest, Chair, I'm not happy with this application for the reasons that were given by Councillor Dalton and Councillor Handley. First of all, there's no guarantee that any school will use these cards, in which case the funding will be wasted. I would have liked to have been reassured that they have been in touch with the schools as part of their business plan so that at least they know that some schools would be using them. It does appear from what the information we have. It's really much a cold canvas, a cold call on the schools. So our money just could be completely wasted. So I think I would like to know what schools will be using these cards, or if, you know, we don't need to have the detail of the class or anything, but we need to know that the schools have signed up to using these cards, I think, before we can agree to give them the money. Okay, Councillor Handley. Just would like your advice on this. If we were to reject this application now, there's nothing to stop Antonio from applying in the future with a more comprehensive application. Is that true? I believe that's the case. Aaron, correct me, or John? Sorry, Peggy Bowden, John. That is correct, yeah. They can apply multiple times, yeah. Yeah, they can learn from their mistakes and come back to us if they can give us a good case. We can consider it again. Yeah, we have done a lot of work trying to tease this information out. It has been long and tedious, and this is the culmination of what we have. So that's all we can present to you. Thank you. Okay, all. Sorry, Chair, it is a case of, I have significant signs of A4 paper with regards to this, but there has been some difficulty, perhaps, collapsing that down into a meaningful, bullet-pointed set of information for you. Right, okay. Okay, members, am I, I think, unless Peter's going to vote differently, we'll just go to the vote, shall we? Could you put your hand up to show support for this grant? Those are, Peter, thank you, and those who are going to reject the grant, that's myself, Claire, Sue, and Bill. Okay, so that's a vote for rejection, I'm afraid. Aaron and John. I'd like to say thank you very much, actually, to all of you for that, and the way that you all spoke about it. I think it was, it's a testament to how much we've put in with the officer's time as well, and what have you, and the thought process behind it. So I'm extremely grateful, and I think we've done the decision justice. So thank you. Yeah, can I say to John, when you go back to them, could you say to them that really, what's missing is the agreement of at least one school, that they will use these cards, so that at least then we know that there is a project there that's going to happen, and we're not just going to give people money to produce something that's going to be wasted. Thank you, Councillor. I will add that to the letter when I send that letter. John, if I can add to that, if I may, Councillor Williams, if we have the school actually signing up to it, but it would be nice to have their opinion as to what, rather than just say, yeah, we're going to sign up, but actually the school to write back and say, we think this is blah, blah, blah, blah, so actually like almost a curriculum based response. That way that should justify and help placate Sue, because he made a direct reference to that, and then obviously the other bits and pieces for the rest of this. Okay, thank you very much. Were you ready, John, number two? Number two. So, the next one is a Orchard Road Community Group, and I believe you should be able to see something on your screens now with regards to that, is that correct? Certainly can, thank you. A map and a photograph. Fantastic, yes. So, this is a group set up by Sean Furby, who has assured me that if he gives his name some members of the, we'll know who he is. This is a small piece of land on Orchard Road, which in Hisnan and Impington, which is owned by South Collins District Council, which is just mowed on a regular basis by the council, which has been informally adopted with permission by the Orchard Road Community Group. They have already placed picnic benches on this area and they are hoping to also install two 50-litre litter bins. When these bins are installed, the Orchard Road Community Group will undertake to empty the bins and to make sure that that happens, and they have a verbal, they've had a conversation with the parish council, but the parish council has said, if the bins are well used, then the parish council would look towards adding them to the list of bins that they empty around the village. The Orchard Road Community Group is an unconstituted group of 10 members of the local community, and this is the second piece of ground in the village that they have started to sort of take over and try to improve. They are applying for 160 pounds towards these bins, which is a total cost of 270 pounds, and they've already received 110 pounds by contributions and donations from local residents. Thank you. Thank you very much. Members? Can I ask a question, Chair? Do we know if the opinions of the local members have been so on? This isn't a huge sum, and we shouldn't spend a lot of time on it, but do we know if the local members are supported? I don't, but John may do. I need to apologise. I believe I omitted to ask the local members, which is the 20 years ago. It's not the end of the world, John. It isn't a huge sum of money, but yeah, it would have been nice if we'd had their support, wouldn't it? Would it make it a much clearer application, I think? Yeah. Councillor Henson? I'm very supportive of this. I just wondered whether there was an opportunity for one of the bins to be a recycling bin in order to follow our ethos as trying to be more eco-friendly. I said that's lovely. Anybody else got to speak? Yes, please, Chair. I'm very supportive of this. I'm particularly the principal. I'm just sort of anxious about the litter bins and the fact that it depends on people's goodwill to empty them. And I just wonder if advice has been sought from Trevor and his team from the local waste management officer on that, because it does seem like a very good community group, but community groups come and go dependent on the goodwill of the community. And I would love to support it. I do in general, but I just have this anxiety about the emptying of the bins. John? Hold on. I'm pulling up the information. No, sorry. Wrong, John. Biggypong. Councillor Williams is my fault, sorry. Thank you, Chair. Sorry, John. Yeah, that was the question I was going to ask, actually. Who's going to empty these bins? These beams are actually going to be on South Cam's land. So will we be emptying the bins free of charge? Because they are on that. Normally, if they were on a parish council land, we would be charging the parish council to empty them. So are we going to be charging residents to empty these bins? If they're on our land, should we actually be charging anybody? And should they be collecting ourselves? If that's the case, is there anyone told, Trevor, that we're going to put two bins here and we're going to expect him to collect from them? So I think we need to find that out before we go ahead and allow them to do this. And do housing know they're going to do this? Have they approached housing and said, we want to put litter bins on your land? So can I have some information? I mean, if they haven't, then I think before we can go ahead with this, we really do need assurances that the emptying of the bins has been sorted before this goes ahead. OK, thank you, John. John, you're on. And if you could add into your thought process, that's John London, Sue's comment about the recycling bin. It may be a different cost, the $160 quid here. But if you want to go to a recycling bin, they may be somewhat more expensive. So where you go? So I can confirm this is not from talking to Trevor directly. This is from talking to Sean Furby that we have said that we won't put bins in ourselves because there's no evidence of a requirement of bins in the area. And from Sean's perspective, the reason why there's no evidence of a requirement is because it's currently not a space that's being used. They've only just put in the park benches. It's only just starting to be used by the community. The people who he has been speaking to previously with regards to the previous piece of land that they worked with was Southcams Housing. And they've already applied for grant to Southcams Housing for the improvement of that previous piece of land. And when they approached housing for the improvement of this piece of land, they were told that they can't apply for more than one set of funding and was advised to put in a community chest grant. So they then also went to the parish council and the parish council's response was, well, if Southcams don't think that these bins are going to be used, then we're not going to empty them. However, this was in a conversation rather than a formal email, the parish council then said, or according to Sean, the parish council then said, well, if you have evidence that the bins are being used and you empty them for the first year and they are being used, then we'll take them off. Okay, Bill. Yeah, thanks, I'm inclined to, it is a relatively small sum. I do understand and respect John Williams' views on this. I do understand that, but it's a relatively small sum of money. And I'm willing to get, and he does say in the report that the parish council will be empty in the future. So I'm inclined to support it. Sorry, Bill, but parish councils don't empty bins. They get us to empty bins and they pay us. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So let's look at it as an agreement plus to empty the bins, I'm not happy about this. I'm not happy about this. I'm not, until we have a assurance that these bins are going to be emptied by someone on a regular basis, then I'm not prepared to agree to it. Okay, okay. I think we should check, can I suggest that you approach the head of housing and ask the head of housing to sort this out? I haven't heard, I mean, I do not know of a policy which says that local communities only get one chance of getting money from housing. I'm certainly not happy with the response from housing. And if necessary, I'll be happy to get involved with this. I personally think these bins should be supplied by housing and I think we should pursue that first before we agree to this. That's what I'd like to see. Mudget walls, that's excellent, Bill. Thank you, Gechers. Having heard, John, I'm willing to support John's view on this now. Okay, Jay, you're still muted, fella. Oh, you've just come off, I think. Sorry, I had to be the first. I'm more than happy to take this forward with housing and Trevor's team to try and dig a little bit deeper into what the issues are. So I'll take that forward after this meeting, if you wish. Thank you. Right, members, I'm looking at all the faces and the temperature of the room, if you like, is that we defer this waiting on John and Jay's research and what have you with other departments and other information, et cetera, et cetera. Is that any yes? Thumbs up, please. Joes, could we say that in principle, it's, we like the idea of the community involvement, but we want to look at the very important practical details. Absolutely, and to be fair, where Sue mentioned the thing about the recycling, it might be something that I'd like to ask the Sean to see if that would be of benefit and how we can work through that at the end. All right, that's fantastic. I hope the message goes from our officers to this. These people is encouraging. That's what I would like. Yes. Okay, thank you. Over to you again, John. Thank you very much. Could be the Swaybz Memorial Hall. Can I declare an interest, because it's my patch, but I have nothing to do with it. Okay, thank you, Sue. Thank you very much. Again, you should now see the picture that was provided by the George Long Charity for Swaybz Memorial Hall. This is an application for the can, to buy a cycle shelter. There was, it's a project cost of a little over four and a half thousand pounds, and they are applying for one thousand pounds of that. The cycle shelter will be one of a variety of styles, the example of which is shown here from the comprehensive information that was provided on this application. The applicant has stated that they've consulted with the Hall's users, and that the Hall's users have all agreed that the provision of a cycle shelter would be useful for them. And the applicant also says that the shape of the village is such that it currently encourages car use because certain areas of the village are really too far to walk. However, they are very, very short car rides or short cycle rides. So the opinion is that if a cycle shelter is provided, it would definitely help move people from their cars into bikes. And the opinion was also given that the local cycle infrastructure is such that even people from other villages that are coming in to use the Hall would be able to cycle rather than use the cars. Thank you very much. Thanks. Could you take the screen down for us, John? Yeah, sorry. Thank you very much. OK, Councillor Henley, I see you've got your hand up. I'd like to support this wholeheartedly. Swavesy is a linear village. Those who don't know it, it's long and thin. You live at Boxworth End. It can be a good 20, 25-minute walk to get to the Memorial Hall. So people tend to drive. And often you get to the Swavesy Memorial Hall and the parking carparks fall and they're all parking on the road. Encouraging cycle use has got to be the right way to go. So I'm 100% in favour of this. Thank you, Councillor Dalton. Similarly, I think it's a good application for a good purpose. I'd support it wholeheartedly. Thank you, Councillor Donald. Yes, I'd agree with the observations from Councillor Henley. It seems ideal for Swavesy. Superb, Councillor, and I'll come to you last. Obviously, could you declare anything to say? This would add quite a lot to the Memorial Hall. It is hopefully going to be put in a very narrow area, which is frequently full of cars and it makes it very difficult to get into the main carpark, which is down the bottom. So it will be very prominent and very easy to get to and will serve more than one purpose and I would fully support it. Thank you very much. I'll take that then, ladies and gentlemen, as an affirmation of support then, shall I? If you would, in the spoken favour. Thank you, John, if you could make a note of that. Thank you very much. And when you're ready, go to item four. Thank you. Item four is an application from Milton Colts Football Club, which is for the part funding of a Perot roll cart travelling sprinkler to allow irrigation and maintenance for the pictures, which you can see in the image and the piece of equipment is the red wheel thing that you can see on your screen as well. The applicant feels that with the right irrigation, the pictures can be returned to an improved condition, allowing more games of football. And apparently, according to the applicant, the Cambridgeshire FA have rated the pictures poor due to the hard nature of the ground. They have stated that they have raised £400 towards this project from other sources. The source of that £400 is not immediately obvious. However, having gone through their accounts, I cannot see any record of a grant from Milton Parish Council. At this point, I should say as well, unfortunately, I made an error in this. So the total project cost is £1,430.82. That 4,000 figure is actually the cost of the Memorial Hall carpark. So with the total applied for is £1,000. They already have the £400. So this will be for the total remaining sum to buy the roller. Thank you very much, members. We'd like to go first. Could I ask? Please do, Claire. Yeah, thanks. Well, we need to know what Milton Parish Council is going to contribute. Can I answer that, please? Jack, go ahead. We have attempted to contact Milton Parish Council, but there you haven't responded. Is that correct, John? Yes, we phoned them. Have we written to them? That's a stupid question, but the Parish Council? We have not yet. Right, OK. This isn't going to be exactly... I'll come to you in a second, Sue, just so you can put your hand up. It's not going to be absolutely desperate at the moment. It's going to be coming into the rainy season, so to speak. So we do have time, I'm sure, to sort this out. But I wonder if the Milton Parish Council are working from home, so to speak, and not answering the phone, just doing emails. It might be given the circumstances. OK, Sue, please. And then Peter. I just wonder if the district councillors involved were supportive. Thank you. Peter. Can I just check with John the total amount, John? Did you say it was 1,600? I'm very sorry. The correct amount should be 1,430 pounds and 82 pence. So in other words, if we make the grant and they have raised themselves 400, although it's not from other sources, then that means no contribution from the parish. That is a logical conclusion. So reference the previous question. I think in all fairness to the other parishes, we have to say there has to be some match funding. Yeah. Councillor Hanley. I don't need to take any time. John has just said what I was going to say, so I won't say it again. Thank you. Can I ask, and this is a general question. Please, I'm sorry. Sorry to interrupt. Go ahead, Claire. OK, sorry. OK, on these forms, which I really like, the new style forms, where it says documentation status, and then it says incomplete, and in the previous one incomplete, what does that mean? Does that mean that you haven't had the information from the parish councillor or what? There are four pieces of information that are required, including the mission statement of the organisation, a budget from the organisation, a quote from the organisation, and also a statement of... I forgot my correct terminology for it. Intent. Intent. Safeguarding statement. All of these have not yet had the safeguarding statement yet, so they are technically incomplete. But with Milton Colts football club, the only thing that has not been received is the safeguarding. Sorry, I just want to follow that up, Joes, because I think it's relevant to others. So, does that mean that where we to agree, for example, in this case, where we to have agreed this morning that they would get a grant, they couldn't get the grant until they had the safeguarding statement? Yes, councillor, that's the letter that we send out, the form letter that we send out, basically states that these things need to be provided and that it's a conditional grant based upon receiving those things. Right, John and Jay. As Claire has already said, the new style for the application, I think, from our point of view, is extremely good. I really like this. I just wonder where you say documentation status and then you put the word complete, incomplete, whatever. However you want to do this, I just wonder if it's only four pieces of data that you're going to be looking for, can that just be put in here the ones that are missing in that box? Chair, we are in the process of updating the online form. It's not that it would be impossible to make an application without all of the information. So hopefully by the next time that this comes to the advisory committee, we won't need to put in any box with regards to documentation status because it would be impossible to make an incomplete application. Okay, now just on the basis of what Claire said with regards to these last two we've seen, some of the first two incomplete as well. And I'm assuming that the public open space, the ultra road community play area, that certainly needs a safeguarding document. And so if they're unconstitutional, that's going to be a bit of a tall ask potentially, unless they've got one for the other space in which they can then use for this or whatever, adapt it. Okay, right. So there's work to do then, yes, with the Paris Council. Can I add one thing, Joe? Yeah. I mean, this may be something that you as a committee think about every time, but I firmly believe you get an application like this. The Paris Council have got to show support for it. I've come across it many times in Paris Council meetings where they say, well, we don't need to give them any money. Go and speak to the district. Yeah. And I really do feel that as almost as a policy to be expecting Irish councils to be supporting this kind of thing before we support them. That will be my first video. The policy is that there should be much funding from the Paris Council. So I'm assuming that they haven't approached the Paris Council or the Paris Council have rejected them one way or the other. So that's for this applicant to have that conversation again. Jay. Thanks, Joe. I just wanted to say that the reason why we take applications to committee that are incomplete is based on what has happened in the past. And we have been asked to bring applications to committee whether they're complete or not because I think the idea behind it was to sort of move the applications through as fast as possible and just because they haven't responded with their safeguarding statement shouldn't mean it holds up the actual decision because it makes no material difference because if you awarded the grant and they didn't provide it then we wouldn't give them the money. Do you see what I mean? So that was the idea behind it. But we're more than happy. As we said, we've looked at the web form and we found a solution that we can actually get all of this information up front to mean when we come to you we have every box tick which I do think is a better idea. But just saying the reason why we do this this way at the moment is because we're trying to push the applications through and we will make sure all the conditions are met before we award the money. But yeah, that was why I just wanted to say that it's based on a previous decision to operate like this. Yeah, I totally appreciate that, Joe. I mean, this has been a review of this when you came in to take over the review of it and I think this is terrific that you've done it. I mean, yeah, hats off. I think we're always conscious, all of us, we're always conscious of the amount of time that we spend and we've only got four applications. And I think that's probably what's driving the comments from members as well is that, you know, if the parish has refused Point Blank or whatever, I suppose you could argue then bring that with the basis that the parish have refused flatly to put any money forward. But if they haven't been asked or there hasn't been any kind of engagement between the group and the parish, then that's wasting our time, if you like, here where when we have the new applications and we'll sometimes have five, 10, 15 of them in a row. So rather than have to go through that, I think the new system is going to be excellent in weeding out that process for us and you, I suppose. John. Just to say I did yesterday go through all of the parish council meeting notes from Milton Parish Council for this year and I cannot see that it was ever brought to council as an application for funding. Thank you. And now, Jay, that's another example where officers are going over the extra mile and I think John, Councillor Williams, this has to be noted. Okay, officers are going extra mile to try and help applicants do the best they can with their applications. But that's a fairly onerous task of thought to go through all that lot and hats off to you, John, for doing it and thank you. But this is probably where Claire is coming from in regards to why haven't we got, why haven't they done what they meant to have done and I think the update of the website and the requirement to have that information in place will do us a whole pair of good. Claire. Yeah, so I just wanted to follow with that what I think John London that is. Thank you very much for checking but also I think it's always useful and props will save time to email the local members saying and ask them do they know about it and they mentioned it to the parish council. As it happens in this case, I think two local members are members of Milton Parish Council. So if they haven't heard about it that would be a good way in. I suspect that they've not heard about it. OK, in that case then before I go to Jay and then John Williams, can you take your hand down please, Claire? Yes, I have. Thank you, John. That might be another little entry have local members been. Is this this this this form that we're looking at now is that computer generated from the website? No, so that's that's hand filled so to speak. No, we what we've what we've done behind the scenes as it were is previously this was going through several different departments of officers. So what we're doing is we've collated all of the information together on to an Excel spreadsheet and then this is this is basically sections from that from that master spreadsheet that is then reformatted to give to you. In that case, could you add another line because I think there's probably room for the local members. Whether or not they've been contacted because that's been a theme this morning. Local members contacted yes, no or can't be bothered to answer. Let's put the others on there. Let's put the others on us all because I had. Yeah, I was in Melbourne. He'll see I'm not responding. So I've just stitched myself up and put my head in the news. OK, Jay. Thanks, Jase. Yeah, just just to reassure you that at the same time we actually bring applications through to grants of committee, even if they've only been, you know, we've taken grants here that we've only received sort of five days ago before. So that's often why all of the information isn't yet received, but we didn't ever see that as a barrier to decision. But anyway, I think that's self going forward because we will have all the information. None of what's been said is a criticism, Jay. She's only got to help make the whole thing smooth. Yeah, Williams. Yeah, what used to happen is that I seem to recall that the local member used to get an email asking if we supported the application. Do we not do that anymore? Yes, we should do that. This is where I need to apologize for for being effectively. I was off sick last week at the time I would normally have done that in the lead up to this, so I apologize for that. This is this is this is a piece of process that should occur that hasn't. Great. Cancer Dornton. I don't think I had anything else to add other than that. I mean, I think it's a good application and it's exactly the sort of thing that we should support. But I do think that we're missing the information about the parish council. Okay, just your hands up on my screen, Claire. Okay. Two people haven't said much. Peter and Sue. You're still muted, my friend. I only said fiddle sticks. I can lip read, Sue. It was true. It was true. I think the application is fine. I do think we need to know whether the parish council agree. I do think we need to know whether district council has any member has any thoughts about the application. Great. Thank you. Peter? Yeah, nothing else to add. I think Sue's identified the two key issues. Okay, then we'll leave this with officers in here. So we're kind of essentially deferring this for information. Okay. Thanks. Right. I think that's it on the community grant. John, yeah. Thank you very much. Thank you very much for your time. And Jay, thank you very much for the effort and everything that the team have put in. It's superb. No problem. Mind if I excuse myself for the meeting because we've got some COVID stuff to sort out. Yeah, have a meal. Okay. Great stuff. Thanks, mate. Cheers. Thanks, John. I'll also excuse myself to go deal with children if that's okay. Yeah, porridge. I think it wasn't. Yeah, that's it. Bye. Okay. On to the gender item number five which is the Mobile Warden Scheme Expansion Grant Applications and I believe this is very firmly in Leslie's section. Over to you, Leslie. Thank you. Morning, everybody. Yeah, so two papers this morning relating to the expansion of the Mobile Warden Schemes across the district. In the first paper we're asking committee just to formally recommend the decision to award the procurement delivery of service to Age UK and then in the second paper we're recommending committee to award grant funding to the Parishes of Gamlingay Longstanton and then a joint application for Loewis and Fen Drayton. Thank you very much. Okay. Members, does anyone want to go first? This is a piece of work that we've been working on for a while. It's been backwards and forwards and I have to say from having discussions with Leslie the procurement process has gone remarkably well and obviously the work that we've all put in and especially Leslie and the team with regards to getting it all sorted and very nicely the sum of money that John's provided. That's even better. Bill? I fully support it chairman and as you say it's been an excellent piece of work and it would have been probably brought before you much earlier if I hadn't been for Covid so it's long overdue really we need it and fully support it. Thank you. I think we didn't get it earlier because Leslie had to die off first when it was really. Claire? Could I just ask about the age limit, the age cutoff the 70 age cutoff if you could just talk us through the reasoning behind that Leslie? When we looked at I think when we looked at the data from the JSNA the joint strategic needs assessment and we use the fingertips tips. Who does the joint strategic needs assessment? It's the Cambridge research group based at County Council so they collect all the data and they produce the JSNAs and they also look at the population data and they build the information that's on the Cambridge insight which looks at you can look at parish level data so numbers of households age range employment number of people that own their homes number of people that live in poverty so you have all that level of data and what we used the 70 year cutoff as an idea of I think there are 65 year olds and there are 65 year olds so there are some very very healthy 65 year olds and if we use the 65 year old cutoff I think that we would have had a much greater number of strategic sites so in order in relation to the amount of money that we had to spend we had to be really clear about where those priority sites were so we used the 70 plus cutoff for that but of course the service is available for anyone that is either vulnerable so it's not just for the 70 plus that was just really to identify the strategic sites so you don't have to be 70 plus to apply to you know become part of the scheme it's for anyone that's vulnerable and living either living alone they can be living in partnership with someone else but they have to be vulnerable okay thank you that's very helpful and I just wanted a very quick follow up question on that so the J SNA or JNSA those statistics that data how often is it updated annually good thank you so thank you I'm very supportive of the mobile warden scheme we have one in Swavesy which works very very effectively and I heard from a mobile warden how she has adapted to meet the needs of Covid and the needs of very isolated very lonely people during this last period but the one thing I wanted to draw people's attention to is the Fendreighton-Loworth one which is in my patch and I think it really does set precedent in that it is going to be cross boundary with Huntingdonshire because it will be covered the whole when it comes together will include Fendreighton and Fendreighton are finding the majority of the money to support a warden so Loworth which has 78 people living in it not all of them over 70 I have to say but seeing as I went to primary school with most of them they are all about that age and Fendreighton who are not that much bigger it really is an example of how we can work together for our really small villages where they have a lot of people who have lived there a really long time and want to go on living there until they die and this will support them and when you think Loworth has one road in and it is the same road going out very little in the way of public transport very little in the way of support from anybody else they look after their elderly to an extent and that people do for them I think this is a real example and we should see how well it works and try and build it into the conningtons the tiny little villages that we have in our patch well said well said Peter thanks I really wanted to talk about the options because when we are making this decision we have to look at the options because of the surplus the 11,982 and implications of that so I just wanted to speak to that I would like Leslie's view but personally I would like to go for option 3 which is recommend a second round of grant funding because it would be easy to just top up the funds for the existing schemes and there may be a case for that but it really would be nice to see it extended wider take your hand down Pete Claire would you like to speak yes I'm very supportive of this I have been all along this extension of the mobile warden scheme I mean the discussions have been around now for two years at least John well John Williams correct me on that but I think that's I've been around so it's really good to see it coming into fruition and on the options I would like to support Peter's recommendation as well Bill I I agree with what Peter who I called John earlier sorry it's for Peter Peter's view I support I couldn't be more supportive of almost okay I'm obviously in the same ballpark I'm fully supportive I'm not sure whether or not Aaron I have to declare an interest as I'm a trustee of a mobile warden scheme in Melbourne but seeing that we're not getting any of this money anyway it's kind of irrelevant perhaps but perhaps just for the record yep I can see options option three is probably going to be the best once people start to see this being rolled out that they're the grass is always green and people go I wish I'd done that so there would be their money for them to come and do this I would kind of like to just broach the subject of adding in number four as they measure given the fact that a lot of these schemes are going to be dealing with extreme loneliness and isolation especially being exacerbated by the COVID situation that we've suffered this year I just sometimes wonder whether we're not we just need to have that in mind that some of the existing schemes may just need a little bit of help just a little bit not saying thousands and thousands because there's correct me if I'm wrong Leslie there's the 11,982 and then there's the 45,000 yep so we have absolutely so yeah an additional 56 yeah I'm not suggesting anywhere near that as supplementary payments and what have you but I just think if we can leave the door slightly ajar Councillor Williams just in case that these these things hit the fan so to speak it might be it might be advantageous but I do absolutely support the idea of going out again for a second round could I also just in relation to what Joseph just said when we've been talking to the parishes about setting up new schemes they all love most of them love the idea of setting up the schemes but their greatest concern is the ongoing funding so you know it's great that we are supporting or providing full funding for the next two years but there is great fear from all of these schemes that well what happens after two years and where are we going to get this funding from so there's going you know if this is something if this is a priority for the council and this is something that we really support I think we really need to think about ongoing funding for these schemes in the future and at the moment we provide very little as a proportion of their total funding to those existing schemes so I think we do need to consider that as well thank you sorry yeah it was really in response chair I think to your comments and this is really council Williams call I mean the way to deal with that issue you raise with stop ups maybe being required is to place a contingency so in other words we take for example 80% of the money under option 3 and look for new parishes and you hold 20% for top ups but that's really John's call well actually fact Peter that's what we did with the money in the first place and we did the procurement exercise and the actual house with the parishes doing it themselves or whatever so that's perfect as a solution John John when you speak would you mind smiling all the time I first of all thank Leslie for the enormous amount of work she's absolutely and also I'm sure you know she's done a great job with the parishes I mean yes this has always been an issue as to how we fund this going forward and I think there was some concerned that when we come to the end of the two years there would be an expectation that we would continue to fund these schemes in fall and all the existing schemes because that would be unfair wouldn't it if we would continue to fund these schemes but not others and I think the decision was taken that we would continue we would expect parishes to contribute to be fair so it has been clear to these parishes to the common board that you know this two years gives them a chance to secure funding to enable these schemes to continue you know we will continue to fund some you know we provide some funding for them but at the end of the day we would expect these schemes to stand on their own two feet like the existing schemes do with parishes contributing or finding other benefactors to contribute towards them as well as us putting in some money as well but you know that is the basis on which we've set these up and as I say you know these parishes have two years to organise that with our support and I think any and I'm quite happy that we should go out and seek a second round but again you know this has to be on the basis that we need to talk about this within the budget because clearly we're now well into the first year of this so what happens with the second round do they only get one year of support or do we roll forward some of that money into a third year to support those parishes that come in on the second round given that we're not likely to have them on board until well into the end of this year and maybe the start of the next financial year so we need to bear that in mind as well but I hope that parishes do see the benefit of this and realise how important it is to their residents and are able to contribute something towards it to match what we're funding and also to seek other sources of funding. I mean take Tevicham for example they have marshals supporting their scheme that happens to be marshals because they're on their doorstep but maybe in some of these other parishes there are businesses that are on their doorstep I'm thinking of gambling game for example which has some substantial companies that they could approach them for funding and hopefully by the end of the two years we come to a situation where like the existing schemes there are a number of sources of funding to enable these to go forward we just have to see the problem we've got is that if Southcams were to take on this on its own and fund all these schemes first of all we would have full foul of the state aid walls and we would have to go out and tender for the whole lot so we wouldn't be able to have to come and mismatch with local support and being able to tailor things to local circumstances so we would have to go and tender all of these schemes and it would cost an absolute fortune way beyond the means of the council so we have to we have to make this work and we have to persuade parish councils and emphasize to them that the only way these schemes are going to continue is if they also give some financial support for other financial support to enable these schemes to go forward but the idea of setting these up was to show that there was a demand and that it's a worthwhile thing to do and at the end of the day these parishes can increase their precepts unlike us where we are limited to £5 a year these parish councils can have no limit so they could increase their precepts and I hope it will show that that's a worthwhile thing to do Thanks John, if you could put your hand down a minute before I come to you Claire, it's something you said earlier John with regards to the two year support that we're offering on these now if we do go out and we bring other people in and you said are we going to offer them one or extend it our mission statement if I recall was to try and bring everything in line so all the grant funding the two the three years and all the rest of it so we then start to go back to where we were with a constant I mean officers can perhaps advise us best the best way forward with that and if it's not going to be a problem then so be it but perhaps that's something that we might like to think we want to get back to where we were last year which was that we supported these schemes but we didn't fund them in total and that's what the situation we want with these new schemes but I do recognise that the ones in the first round would have the benefit now of having two years before they need to and I think it may be a bit unfair to have parish councils coming forward for the second round only having one year to sort things out and I think we need to take that into account with the still expectation that after two years they should be you know funding them along the same lines as everybody else okay I mean the question then begs if I may be sorry Claire I'm going to come to you in a sec the question begs with regard to the options then which is going to be best should it be a mix of options or should we not do the second round if we are concerned about the fairness of contributions from others in the length of time they will be supported so perhaps that's something that do we need to discuss that now as part of this acceptance or recommendation to you John can I suggest that if you do agree with three that we ask Leslie to come back to the next meeting with a paper to identify how that would happen going forward would you be willing John to have a mix of three and four as Peter suggested with a percentage yeah sure I think though that needs to be taken sorry I think I don't want to be using this pot of money that's been set up specifically to grow the scheme to be used for existing schemes I would rather Leslie comes back with a proposal that we should be upping the budget to take account of changing circumstances for the existing schemes rather than take money out of the pot for which has been identified specifically to set up new schemes see what I'm coming from I don't want to muddle the water by taking money out of a pot that's there for new schemes to support existing schemes that should be justified on its own merit absolutely agree and concur in that case could I just while we're on that particular subject Leslie would it be something that you could look at with the potential for the existing schemes because the Covid situation is already going to be an issue for them now and how they're dealing with things now so there may be extra PPE they're buying and heaven knows what else and stuff like this so there may be a financial strain on them now and so that's if that thing could be presented to you then John that would be great Clair I'm so sorry you've been waiting there patiently but you're still on mute you're on mute no right I'm ready to go now okay so a couple of questions one is that when we broadened out the scheme we wanted to make sure that there was a spread as much as possible across the district so I wanted to ask Leslie whether she thinks that is happening and where she is with negotiations at the moment how many I mean I know one at least in this ward but how many are she still talking to about the possibility of joining a scheme well in terms of spread across the county north of the A14 so the northern villages we've got a very very good spread and actually if you track it against a primary care network so if we were going for GP referrals in most of the villages around that northern what we call the northern PCN you would pretty much be able to access a mobile warden scheme apart from those as Sue mentioned earlier the Napwell, Boxworths Connington, those kind of very remote tiny villages then if you go south if you looked at the grantor medical practice actually every single parish under the grantor medical practice once we get approval we'll have approval from a mobile warden scheme Age UK have got a very I think they're pretty much covered most of those schemes to the east south east which is kind of the full born down to shuddy camps and castle camps area they're all covered so it leaves that little area in the middle which I would say is the kind of A428 corridor so one of the schemes that we will be setting up as part of this new expansion will cover the majority of those villages but it still leaves lots of little parishes so although we're under the procurement exercise we've awarded we identified kind of seven lots within those lots are multiple villages so it's not just seven parishes that we'll be getting a mobile warden scheme I think we're expanding it to 21 parishes in total but that still leaves a lot of parishes without and it would need substantial investment if we would cover all of them so I hope that answers that question then in terms of talking to or negotiating with parishes at the moment I haven't done anything for the time being until we this is settled and once I know that we've got some more money to spend then I'll go back out and start those discussions with parishes okay thank you that's very helpful I mean it would be really nice to sort of plot that on a little map yes I can demonstrate that or illustrate it on a map yeah thank you Bill yeah just one sort of final thought from the in a number of situations in the age UK scheme more than one village is involved in setting up the mobile warden I can speak only really from Owen Willingham where there is concern that if at the end of two years one of the two partners decides to pull out because they're concerned about the ongoing costs then the other village the other village is worried that they might have to take on extra costs that's a real concern with the parishes I don't know if there's anything we can do to reassure them that if that were to happen that they wouldn't suffer a big shock I think what we need to do no circumstances is to look at possibly reorganising the particular schemes so that perhaps it will then could be taken into another scheme in an attempt to keep the costs down for the parish but obviously that is a problem but as I say I'm hoping and this seems to be experience from other parishes that have set up these schemes is that I can take Tevisham for example I don't think they would ever think their big issue in Tevisham is that of course they're finding the number of customers has been falling their big issue has been trying to keep it viable because they've had fewer people taking it up so these are flexible these schemes are flexible they're going to have to be flexible to take account of changing circumstances going forward but overall people are living longer so they will need care at home more and so overall taking the district as a whole they will continue to be able to demand increasing demand for these schemes but the schemes themselves are going to have to be flexible to meet the changing situations as we go forward as I say look at Tevisham actually the number of customers is falling and now having Age UK have been having difficulty in identifying new new customers for the service so in that circumstance it could well be that you know in a couple of years time Tevisham will have to maybe Tevisham will stop but another scheme will take it over a neighbouring scheme will take it over maybe Tevisham parish council will contribute something towards that scheme but it has to be flexible you cannot say this is a situation and it will continue because we are dealing with people and as we know and people's health and age and it's a moving feast can I come back would you mind if I come back yeah okay it's just going back on this it's almost like I'm saying there was a kind of a set up cost here because I can tell you that Willingham there were objections on the parish council to putting the mobile warden scheme in and I know they're asking questions about what happens if over pulls out so now I hope to goodness that the Willingham parish council don't say we're not taking that risk and we're pulling out and we can't do that but there is a small chance of it I just wonder whether or not I could go to them or Leslie could go to them and say look there is a contingency that if that happens you won't bear the full cost of the fact that over's pulled out it's a real worry for them it really is so before I come to you please forgive me Bill this is something that's very close to my heart having been a trustee of the mobile warden scheme in Melbourne for 10, 11 years whatever it is now one of the things that we enjoy is full support from the three parishes that the scheme now runs it just used to be Melbourne it's now Melbourne, Meldriff and Sheprith and without fail those three parishes contribute Melbourne contributes something like five and a half thousand whatever it was this year so a lot of money but that commitment has to be there and I think this is what John has been saying with regards to parishes if a parish has a scheme running in their area frankly they just need to think about how they're going to help fund it there's no two ways about it the ultimate and perfect opportunity and solution would be to say to the county council oh by the way your adult social care budget needs to add in X, Y and Z for all of our mobile warden schemes I mean we are lucky in Melbourne I get 7,700 from county I think that scheme is the only one in Cambridge as far as I know Cambridge Shire as far as I know that should be rolled out a bit further that money being spent on the 50, 60 people that this scheme looks after is valuable in so far as keeping people out of residential care so the cost of residential care against the small little bit of money so this might be a conversation that has to be had I'm sure officers are all over this like a rash so that's great so I'll say no more on that but my point is you said about the parish council you mentioned I wonder why they would be that way why they would argue that if this is such a benefit to their own residents surely a small amount of money on the preset is not or however they do it is not beyond the wit of man Three parish councillors unfortunately who are quite influential were against it on ideological grounds and that is fortunately all of the other parish councillors were very supportive I suspect in two years time the people who want this to continue will hold sway but it just worries me that they might persuade the doubters to say look we might end up with a big cost after two years if over pull out I'm just wondering whether or not there is an insurance policy here that happens this will kick in I have done this to Paul Clare earlier and I'm doing it to Sue now so Sue please speak up I do apologise ladies I'm dreadful we're the age of brigade no you're not right Sue I had caused to meet the UK officer responsible for mobile wardens in this patch on last Monday and she was very keen on the schemes that are being produced provided here and the proposals that are being made but also I talked with her about some of the issues that Bill is raising and we did talk about the fact that certainly with COVID there have been more people at home who have popped around to granny rather than going to work and so our numbers in Swavesy have dropped from 1718 with a waiting list to 1415 and there's a little anxiety about what's going on here but very much what came through from that conversation was that age UK would facilitate the networking and rebirth if you like of ideas to cover the patch in order to ensure that we did draw in the little villages because I was talking a few moments ago about Elworth we feel that when that's set up and we have a warden who is toddling between Fenstante and Fenbreit and Elworth it won't be as difficult to persuade Boxworth to add a person or two and Ellsworth to add a person or two or Connington and that will be able to increase that network and cover a wider patch and I think age concern are the key to ensuring that we don't drop into a big hole and that we do continue to move forward as things develop across the patch Thank you sir Leslie Well I was going to say as well that part of the contract with age UK is that they work with the parishes over the next two years to look at options for funding in the future and the fact that we are asking parishes to work together is a much more sustainable solution than just having one warden in each parish so I would say with Over and Willingham working together it's much more likely to succeed in the longer term because they are working together and it keeps the costs down for both the parishes and having spoken to age UK yesterday they are going to contact Willingham and Over and try and set up a meeting between the two of them just to kind of thrash through some of those issues and get assurances from both sides so age UK will play a major part in ensuring that these schemes succeed in the long term Thank you Leslie Right, members John Is it important because we do need to go to the recommendation and where you go I was just going to ask Sue actually, she would be a great ambassador for us if she could within her own political group get support for this because I think one of the issues we've got with Willingham is that it is a political it's been politicised a bit and I think we could all probably know who the suspects are and it would really help I think taking this forward if we could take the politics out of this and just get on with it so if you could do something Sue would be very grateful I've been trying this last 12 years John come on Right guys we need to make a decision for Leslie because the poor lady is going to be going through apoplex in a minute Right So on page 16 of your agenda item number 10 Grant's advisory committee has asked to review the report and agree to award the grant funding to the parishes of Gambley Gay Longstands and to the joint scheme for Lowworth and Fen Drayton So am I to John can you put your hand down for me please thank you you're confusing the life out of me Am I to have assumed that we are all in agreement with the lead member for finance it's a nod to everyone Claire yeah and Peter thank you very much and also with regards to the options via the discussions we've just had it looks like that we're looking at number three which is recommend the second round of grant funding to attract additional parishes to set up new schemes and that's the piece of work that Leslie will be doing and come back to us to see the viability but to keep everything sweet and tidy we'll do that as well thank you very much on that one that's great okay moving on Leslie you're still on it's you number six for the procurement outcome for the mobile ward and scheme expansion so this really we're asking committee just to formally recommend that we offer the procurement application to aid UK right do we have anything to discuss it because we have really we have covered off what's happening you're still there here you are just touch me computer it went funny Claire yeah I just wanted to ask a piece of information so this is we talked about flexibility across parishes where does is the procurement for a standard service no it's not for a standard service the reason we procured some of the services was if we had offered grant funding to all parishes knowing that there were some where we really wanted to put a scheme in because of the higher numbers of elderly people there was no guarantee that they would apply for grant funding based on some of these kind of longer term issues with regards to seeking funding once full funding from us ceased so I think the way that we could ensure that we had a scheme set up was if we if it went out to procurement so that was the rationale behind that and then the additional money so that was 140,000 set aside for procurement and then the 60,000 were set aside for those schemes that weren't identified as a priority but wanted a scheme anyway does that answer your question yes it does I suppose what I'm just wondering about is we want it to be flexible because obviously parishes and areas are very different but we want to avoid falling into trap that something could be offered in one area but not offered in another you know a sort of imbalance between the offering and again you know it was there is flexibility in the service I think that even though for instance let's say we've procured a service in full-born if the numbers were dropping off in Tevesham there's absolutely no reason why the full-born in Tevesham would join in the future to make it much more sustainable so it's not just this is just to get the schemes up and running what happens there after and how they evolve there is flexibility in that okay good and I mean obviously you've mentioned two areas I know a lot about some okay does anyone got any more comments on this I'm looking at all the faces everyone's looking happy okay 20 then section 10 again item 10 the grants advisory committee has asked to review the report and formally recommend the decision to award the delivery of the service to Age UK are we happy on that one options okay here we go grants number one is to formally recommend to cabinet that all or lots minus gambling would be awarded to the Age UK for delivering mobile wardens keeping each area or two formally recommend to cabinet process be run for a second time giving reasons I don't think we want to do too I think we stick with one shall we so it's a recommendation to John that it's option one and that we approve Aiden can you put your hands up please so Aiden can see that we do so that's that's all of us Aiden that's unanimous thank you I think it's Aaron oh yeah sorry he answers to most things I think he prefers Aaron yeah I think so yeah with a capital A right okay Leslie do you have anything else to add well can I just clarify as well part of the discussion earlier was bringing another report back to committee to suggest increasing the budget for the existing schemes going forwards is that correct yes okay lots of money lots of money nothing else can I rephrase that because that actually answers putting the cards for the halls can you do a report on how COVID has affected the existing schemes and whether or not we need to increase our support financial support to them John I don't want to prejudge the outcome because the outcome could be that actually it's they're actually finding that it's cheaper to run the schemes so I don't want to I know it's not going to find that Joe's but I don't think we should preempt the outcome of them I'm not meaning we should preempt but I think there's a two subject report if you like it's the generally if we are funding schemes that we've just brought on board now for two years quite substantially if you then look at the other schemes that perhaps might get 1500 pound or 900 quid or whatever happens to be is that equivalent to the two year funding kind of process and it was that really should we look at how our existing schemes could benefit from a little extra shall we say annually especially when we go to the two or three year cycle as well as what is Covid and I'm hoping by this time next year that Covid will be something that we talk about with our grandchildren that happened and we can move on from it a little bit and get slightly back to normal in which case hopefully society will come back out again and everything will be sweet isn't there a danger though Joe's if you ask the question do you need more money I'm not suggesting that hands up who wants more money I'm suggesting that the report have two aspects to it okay are you okay with that what John has been saying and flavours from elsewhere I mean I really would be supportive of you Joe's but I just worry me that we might actually be deflecting money away from setting up new ones by offering money to existing schemes which could be supported by parish councils that's okay Bill we agree that it should be separate alright okay okay okay before we leave this item I'd just like to say thank you to the lead member finance for taking this forward and pursuing it really because we've been talking about it for quite a while and it's now come it's really going to make a difference I think so I'd just like to acknowledge John's work well do you know what I mean when I look at the screen here I have to say he's probably selfish of John but I mean he is getting on a bit so he probably could do with the help later on so this was actually not long before I qualified so joining the fall pod scheme I'd just like to say to all of you all of us the team including officers thank you so much for this it's been a bit of a slog to get and we've got here where we are now a lot of data and what have you that Leslie and her team have pulled together for us I can't thank you enough Leslie it's absolutely brilliant and obviously the support of Aaron and Jonathan in the background there for most of these these calls and what have you it's been tricky we normally do this face to face and have a cup of coffee and what have you but it's it's been tricky and it's more difficult to do it like this so I just like to say thank you so Leslie have you got anything else that you'd like to to say on the subject or are you done I believe I'm done thank you very much indeed that's superb guys does anyone else got anything to say with regards anything otherwise I think we're done and I'll close the meeting thank you you're okay thank you very much so in that case ladies and gentlemen members of the public this is the end this is the end poor old Suze needs a quick break by the looks of it this is the end of the meeting thank you very much the next meeting is on Friday the 30th of October at 10am and it will be a digital but a visual meeting as we are now on teams thank you very much indeed and good night can you feel that kill the lip feed Lee Jonathan