 You're welcome back to the breakfast on Plus TV Africa. So it's a bit of a good news to share this morning about the Emiah of Kajuru being released from captivity after he was abducted on Sunday. And joining us to discuss this is the Galadima of Kajuru, Mr. Dahiru Abubaka. Good morning, Alhaji Abubaka. Good morning, how are you? Fine, so tell us what is the mood like in Kajuru Emirates regarding the release of the Emiah? It was children that were attending the radical Islamist group during the time that the Emiah returned all abandoned places, everywhere the Rajs, even married women in their various homes from Rajs, from the palace. Free for the best. They arrived, O Allah, before Emiah. OK, is there any information you can share with us with regards to his release? Initially, we had heard the bandits had demanded, or kidnappers rather, had demanded about 200 million Naira. So is there any information you can share with us with regards to payment of ransom or negotiation that led to his release? Actually, we don't have any information regarding whether money has been paid because he's released abruptly. I knew there was discussion between the children of his royal highness and the kidnappers. As he said, they demanded in the first place about 200 million Naira. But the good things were going on and on and on like that. Up to the time we left the palace around 5-something because we realized visitors that come to condole us actually seemed to be coming because of the security threat. So I was about to reach my home when this news broke out that the Emiah had returned to the palace. Converges of so many people there would not allow us to discuss anything. So we decided to allow him to rest, to provide him with more today so that he would be able to address people. But later on, the government actually invited him to join us for thorough medical checkups. He has not left the castle. So we didn't know if it had anything to do with whether money had been paid. Okay, Allah Javubaqah, we're aware he was kidnapped alongside with his wives and other members of his family. Some news reports say 10, others say 13. Can you confirm for us how many people were kidnapped with the Emiah on Sunday? And did he come back with any of them? Or was it just the Emiah who was released? In the first place, the number of people who were kidnapped alongside his parents were 14. So he himself alone was the only person that returned. We are given assurances that the rest are on their way. Expectantly, we are even expecting that they will come yesterday. But after this time, we are still expecting we are leaving another person on their arrival. Okay, could you also walk us back to Sunday? What, can you hear me? Allah Javubaqah. I can't hear you. Okay, I want you to walk us back to the events of Sunday. What exactly happened? Where did the Emiah need to be that he had to leave? Regarding the kidnap. And how did you hear about it? Somebody actually was a cop. They sent him a long message that he should deliver to the Emiah much later. So I mean, there was prior information. But he had decided to support the security people. But unfortunately, no strategy action has been taken to safeguard the happening of every Kapani on Sunday. So unfortunately, everybody bled down around midnight. They come back on the town of Kachuk, like a military soldier. Every look and cringe on how the Kajuru were covered by them. We don't have actually exact number of the terrorists that can call it. But conservatively, we think they are more than 200. The modern 200 carried out the attack, or there's modern 200 in Kajuru? Yes. I'm trying to be clear. Are you saying that it was more than 200 of these bandits or terrorists that kidnapped the Emiah? Or are you saying there's more than 200 of these people in Kajuru? They came from that number. But not that number from back on the town. They have made their own strategic arrangements and learned so that nobody would come or what he said, when they tried. You understand? Yeah. So I want you to... Nobody would ever come to give any help. So that's how they succeeded. Violent. All right, Aladjabubaka, I want you to share with us. The Emiah, I beg your pardon, should have some level of security. So if he can be so easily kidnapped, what exactly is the situation like, or the security situation like in Kajuru, Emirates? Is there the presence of any level of security? Do the people feel safe? And now you're saying that they are rejoicing. Is it rejoicing temporarily until the next attack happens? No, we don't hope for the next attack. Actually, there is a military output in Kajuru. Do you know how they learned there? They had been monitoring and they knew how they would do it. And they did it. Our only consolation and thankfulness is that they have not killed anybody. Nobody was injured. They did it silently and went away. Okay, thank you. Aladjabubaka, can you hear me? Yeah, I can hear you. Okay, so what steps are the people of Kajuru, especially the Kajuru Emirates, doing now to ensure that there is security in that town to ensure that there is no recurrence of such an invasion? Like every other thing, Aladjabubaka, who have learned a big lesson, careful will do whatever we can to make preparations for our own private arrangement as far as security is concerned. Not only on the leadership or the hierarchy of the traditional administration, rather, all in the country in Kajuru will try to be both ways and means that we can make any particular one. Can you share any examples of some of these tactics that you may need to employ now to protect the residents and the indigents of Kajuru? If I am to reveal this, I will be preemptive. Security doesn't play in that way. We intend to oppose it, but we will not do that. You said about 200 stormed the Emirate or the community that day to carry out this attack. Is any of these 200 that might be familiar to people in the community, does anybody know who these people are? Are they members of the community? Are they members of the local government? Or are they foreigners? Most of them are not indigenous people. They are not indigenous. Because some of our youth that live through the cold in their windows can see them. Some of them are so tall, but they're all young men. All young. So their identity cannot be established. But sources confirm that they are not the normal people that we see around. Alajjabubaka, I think this is a very interesting case for the Emir of Kajuru Emirates to have been kidnapped in such an invasion of over 200 bandits. Do you have any idea why exactly the Emir might have been a subject of attack? Precisely, I cannot say. As far as I know, our Emir has been very kind to all and some that reside within our domain. Miraculously, we don't know what they have to stop for. Maybe they have something against him who is also here, so I don't know. But I know he's somebody who is actually a committee. Anybody, no matter if it's just tribal affiliation, no, he's always welcoming anybody for some time. All right. So do you think other Emir's should be scared right now? Do you think other Emir's should be afraid for their life? Seeing how easily they just went into Kajuru Emirates and abducted that Emir? Oh, you see, he's not the first person, the first Emir, the first traditional ruler that has been abducted. The first one in Kajuru Lokal was a woman. He was abducted though, he's not from the south. He was on the highway. Later, he was killed. So he's not the first time. So are you saying this is now normal? Like, you know, you now accept this as a normal thing in the northern part of the country that an Emir can just be kidnapped and nothing would be done about it? What's going on in Kanduna State? I'm not hoping for that. What I'm hoping is that this will be unleashed with the authorities' consent so that they should take necessary drastic measures to get the occurrence, only occurrence of that they're suddenly at on the traditional institution. Well, there's a lot of these emirates. There's the first class, the second class and the third class emirates, according to, you know, how Kanduna State is structured. Let's talk about the government now. A few times we've spoken with the commissioner of security and home affairs, Samuel Aruan. You know, of course, speaking on what the government is doing with regard to security. But let's hear from you. Do you think the Kanduna State government is doing well enough with regards protecting the indigens of the citizens of the state? Now, what more would you demand of Governor Erufai? That question, I think I'll go straight and tell you that the Kanduna State government is doing what is good under the circumstances. That is totally up to it. And we have to be mindful that the security arrangement in the country is listed in the federal government. The state does have security out in their own. For all these things, for him to give orders, it has to be led back to the federal setup before it is required back for action. Unlike a certain way apart, you give much order and we carry it out. But I don't know, the situation is so rather tense. And most of the state government, not only Kanduna State government, becomes hand tight as far as security is concerned because they don't have the parts. And that's directly that work under their command. Okay, well, would you then also, let's move to the federal now, would you say that the federal government might have failed with its efforts concerning security? And do you think there's going to be a point where the people of Kanduna State and the rest of Northern Nigeria will be able to say enough is enough? But remember, than the humans, but there are still a lot of calls and agitations for state police, state police, whatever. So all these, if there is adequate arrangement for the personnel, security personnel on the ground everywhere, and who are doing their jobs that are such an extraordinary, I believe that people who say for this won't have a right. So it will indicate in point to that directly that if nothing is done on the part of the federal government, state will now take a legislative process that will entail the emergence in our country of state police. Okay, so you're saying basically at the end of the day that the mood in Kajuru is not one of fear amongst the residents that these bandits can invade again, but they're simply happy that the M.A. is back? Yes, because it's unheard of. Since the happening on this, what you call a kidnap, kidnap, it has not happened. We are so surprised as how he, in the break of the day, came back yesterday, just after the M.A. So ours, not this, in our hours, would do whatever we could in our own little ways. They got the safety in our own 70 years, one year. All right, so we wish we could get more information. So hopefully when the M.A. is back from that bed rest and all the medical checkup, we can get more information as to where he was taken, what exactly he passed or faced in the hands of the kidnappers and how exactly his freedom was negotiated. And remaining 12 also? Yes, exactly. We also need to follow up, Aladji Abubakar regarding the other 14 people that you say were abducted alongside the M.A. And exactly how they need to be rescued by the police. Aladji Dayir Abubakar, Galadima of Kajuru Emirates, we thank you very much for joining us this morning. And I give you my assurance that anytime there is new development, I want to be at your side. All right. Thank you very much once again. Thank you. Yeah, I try to imagine what it is like in a community where with the state of kidnapping and like what he described, you know, a science deal, Amir, there's also been, you know, other residents, maybe politicians, maybe just, you know, regular people in the community that have been kidnapped. And how many people have had to go into debt, you know, because they had to borrow money to pay ransom. I mean, if the paramount ruler of a community can be kidnapped, it just tells you what exactly people, you know, face. I mean, Senator Shouzani mentioned that these kidnappers operated for about an hour. Unchallenged. How did 200 people, do you know how much it would look like for 200 people to be in one place? Armed, 200 armed, you know. On motorcycles, how do, where do they buy these motorcycles? It's just, it seems funny when you hear things like this. How did 200 people stomp a community? And Amir, do you know how small that place should be or would be? And then they stomp that place and then they stomp the Amir's palace and they kidnap him, kidnap 14 other people. It's really unheard of how, you know, security has really turned into some sort of a joke in this country and the Amir returns. We have no idea how that was facilitated. If they demanded 200 million Naira, I mean, there's no way this Galadima would tell me he's not aware of, you know, ransom paid, seeing how close he is, you know, to the ruler. It's possible that they haven't gotten any information, you know, but what would be hard to believe it would be that, you know, after those resources where, you know, spent to kidnap him, you know, he simply just walks away. Just walks away, exactly. So what really was the essence of the kidnap? He supported England or whatever he really was. There's really lots of questions that we need to ask and lots of answers we need regarding this. Yes, but this also, you know, is a reminder that, you know, from what he has described, there is lots of territory in Nigeria and in Katana state that are really not under the control of Nigerian security agencies. That's what it really just says, you know, if any area that has 200 people and motorcycles fully armed is not in, you know, within the control of the Nigerian security agencies, including the army and the DSS and whoever else that you want to call. And those people have, you know, enough of the guts and the audacity to carry out whatever attacks that they choose to carry out. And that's despite the denial of the state government. And that is just in Katana state. So imagine what's going on in Zamfara and Borno State and Yobi and any of all these places. I mean, wasn't it not in Borno State that we heard about Iswap and new administrative territories? We had Governor Zundum come out, you know, just yesterday to say that, oh, that's not true. But we have facts that prove otherwise. I'm just saying, imagine what's going on and how many of these people exist in Nigeria's territory. So every other day that you hear about the army, bombing, you know, bandit territories and here that they're seen to be killed and seven were killed and some of all of that. It really, for me, just means that those things aren't, you know, in any way effective. And if you don't, in any way, have enough men on ground that are ready to give all they can, you know, logistics, you know, finances, equipment, information, intelligence, whatever it is to ensure that these people are completely kicked out of Nigeria, not, you know, arresting them and them forgiving them and saying that they've repented. You know, not having people mentioned that, you know, what they're doing is not really bad. You know, they're just kidnapping children. It's not like it's so bad. We would never really, you know, get to the end of this. And when are the people going to get tired? And that's why I was asking him. People in Kajiru, you know, who has seen the Amira get kidnapped? Amira. Okay. When are they going to get tired? All right. We'll take a short break. When we come back, we're talking open grazing, 2023 presidency and the little controversy surrounding all of that. We'll be back.