 If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go Mind pump, mind pump with your hosts, Sal DeStefano, Adam Schaefer and Justin Andrews In this episode of Mind Pump, we actually give a little review on our friend Ben Greenfield's Nature bite bar. I actually wasn't even planned, but I just had eaten one and was talking about it. And it was delicious We're talking about Adam's journey with his training. He's on a new journey. Find out what it's all about We talk about primings and why priming is the biggest game changer We talk about my training and justice training and we talk about the importance of rounded back lifting and then we get into some Interesting questions about 22 minutes later We talk about what fitness fads and trends are happening today that we think people are gonna be laughing at in 10 to 20 years We talk about how to be more objective about yourself and your training You know how sometimes you work out and you overdo it or underdo it because it's difficult to be objective in terms of You know what to do with your training for how your body is responding We're gonna talk we talk about that in that particular question We also answer the question on whether or not using a spin bike at high resistance with squats We'll make your legs grow faster and finally the pros and cons of going into management of a big box gym instead of Remaining a personal trainer. Which one is better? Find out in this episode. Also, don't forget This month we have our summer starter pack. We actually put this together because we have a lot of new listeners Coming from some of the interviews we've done another podcast and what we did is we put everything you would need to get started on a fitness journey in one Package that includes maps and a ball like our foundational workout program maps prime which has a self-assessment tool helps you correct imbalances and Teaches you had a prime your workouts. We also put a nutritional component in there the nutritional guide and the fasting guide And then we give you access to our forum so that we can help you and our community can help you along the way You find all of this at mind pump media comm That box of bars that Ben sent over they're all gone right who ate them all I eat like three of them Yeah, they quite a few did you eat you've had some yeah, I've had quite a few about you Doug you yeah I've had a couple so They're pretty good They suit my taste actually. They're actually not bad at all. They taste pretty good in the macro breakdown is So an entire bar is 200 calories 210 calories 13 grams of fat 10 grams of protein 19 grams of carbs. I guess Ben said that's the that's like the like the most the best kind of profile total for like Energy or whatever for the kind of stuff that he likes to do. It's not bad at all I actually think it's really good and the ingredients are legit The thing that here's I mean, I'm not a huge bar guy, you know, I never eat bars Well, I'm definitely a bar guy and what I don't like about like quest bars and bars like that They taste so good and the sugar in them and stuff is what makes you want more of them and more of them and more of What I find with this bar is it's very satisfying. It's healthy So if you think it's gonna taste better than a cookies and cream cookies and cream, you know fucking or cookie dough Quest bar you're you're not gonna. It doesn't taste fake No, yeah, if you're a if you're a health conscious person You like healthy food you want to put healthy fuel in your body That's like one of the best like bars you can can for health purposes. I think it's amazing It's got you know, hydrolyzed gelatin protein in there pea protein isolate. There's no dairy There's no so I can eat it. That's what I like about but here's a deal When I really respect somebody and they say try something then even though I'm like I said, I'm not a bar guy But you know Ben's Ben knows his shit. I mean we've said this before so I tried it and it's not bad at all and We should now that I'm talking about it. We should have some kind of an affiliate code, right? We do We do have one. We do. Yeah. Yeah. He said a subtle one. Yeah Yeah, he set us up. In fact, he set mine pump up with that was the deal You don't remember me strong arm in him. He said that He said because I think oh, yeah, here's a deal bro. Remember that we're homies we're friends So you better hook up the discount for Mine pump better than anybody else because I don't want to be like just like everybody else like because you got the homie hook Up here if you're a mine pump person you get 15% I know all his other affiliates are 10% Oh, really? Mm-hmm. So take them two years to develop the bar That's what you're saying and I guess they're selling pretty well. He was telling us sweet how well they were doing So what's the what's the code mine bump? That's it perfect I tell you dude. Do you get oh, yeah, of course you guys in a workout. Yeah, it's too early. What do you mean? I'm I finished just yeah, just oh, yeah, you've been doing morning workouts, too Huh? Yeah, man. What are your workouts looking like right now? Are you still doing are you still doing the intense? Yeah, I'm doing like like mainly two intensive moves and then I'm still incorporating a lot of my unconventional training Just because I want to make sure I keep that into the routine so I'll do more, you know may spell swings and in Indian clubs and Make it sure to keep that rotation in the mix So let me ask you this when you're doing your mace swings and clubs as part of your workout because When I've done them, it's part of my warm-up right, but you're doing it was part of your workout I do what do you do you time them or do you count rotations? I go base off a feel for the most part really. Yeah, yeah Before I fatigued completely, you know and are like my form diminishes I just set them down So and I and I'll do them sort of almost like a super set right now I'll do them between doing like a compound lift. So I was just dead lifting this morning. I was doing. Oh, wow That's more and so you do I do you have to keep my Like keep that rotation in that that that fluid sort of mobilizing my shoulder joints So you do you like mace swing swing swing until you kind of start to feel fatigue Yeah, then I rest then you go. Oh, you know, and then I'll go back So well what I mean is I'll do that You know in conjunction with the deadlift So will you do that and then go straight to deadlift or rest and then go deadlift and then repeat that? Well, if I'm super said I'll go straight to deadlift. I that's a I've never even thought of that That's actually sounds I did the reverse. It actually sounds good. I I've done the opposite too So I typically deadlift or squat a heavy a heavy barbell movement and then right afterwards I'll go do the mace and just and I'm not really trying to go to fatiguing that I just just for those exact same reasons I'm just trying to keep that rotation in there because when we're doing all these sagittal plane Yeah, everything in the front of you. Mm-hmm. So I that's a lot of what I was doing this last I'm not doing it as much, but I'm still these are some of the things and this is a good point bringing this up is a Lot of people are asking me what's going on with my training and stuff while I'm going. Yeah, what's going on with that? I see I'm glad you brought that up because you are looking different. I'm not gonna lie, dude You look you look like you're you're you're building a little bit. Thank you I'm in a good way, too. Well, I'm actually I'm right on the exact same way I haven't I haven't moved your compositions for sure. Yeah. Oh, yeah So that's the goal So I'm trying to show people that I can that you can do that right like I'm trying to Not go through this big massive bulk or massive or crazy shred cut is I have plenty of body fat to lose And I have plenty of room to grow So I'm you know trying to slowly build and slowly cut body fat at the same time now I just started literally yesterday My mini cut So I'm on a mini cut right now. How long is what do you mean mini? Well, I'm asking you because I know there's listeners who are like, what do you mean by many? Is it does that mean a small deficit or does that mean a short period of time or both short period of time and both actually? So it's the mini cut will be somewhere between two and three weeks And the reason why I say somewhere between is because I typically go off of how I feel So if I'm trying to keep this as honest and real as possible on this journey I know it makes more sense for me guys to sell you guys something only oh, this is the formula do this And uh, like I will I'm gonna stay in a cut until I feel like it's a good time for me to transition out That will be somewhere within. I know I'll stay in it for at least a week It's rare that I come out of it in a week unless I see myself dropping just way too fast And I won't stay in it longer than three weeks So it'll be somewhere between one and three weeks more likely fall right around two weeks And then I'll transition out of it And when I do my mini cut, I'm looking for only about a 250 do a 500 calorie deficit And that will be created either through my nutrition or increased volume and movement So and the goal is to lose fat but not lose any muscle. That's why it's mini. Yes, and that's why too I'm not pushing really hard. I'm not trying to I could reduce by a thousand calories and watch myself shred out faster But I don't want to do that like I want to just Just create enough of a deficit that it forces my body to lean out a bit And I also are still kind of building at the same time too. So now what about your training? Is it uh, is it it's more structured like like you're doing more maps aesthetic type training so focus sessions It is but if I'm completely honest with everybody I have maps aesthetic is the foundation of what I'm doing right now But there is definitely a flavor of uh maps green and uh prime involved there So prime is essential. You're doing a sexy athlete combo almost. Yeah, it's kind of but I you know Again, I to be completely honest. I'm not following any of our protocol to a T I am kind of implementing all of those tools. Well, of course, you know, your body. Yeah, and this is what I think You know, this is what we always recommend to people because I know we've had I know people said this before like Oh, the boys don't even follow their own program Well at one point we all did like I think that's I think it's important that everybody follows some sort of a Structure at first because that creates a certain level of awareness. There's no program design That's going to be perfect for your body The goal is we have to evolve and we've always told people when you enroll in one of our programs Follow it to a T first do the full, you know, however long it is Then go through it again And then start to learn your body and modify so you get you know better with that And I think the only way you can learn is to be on some sort of a structured regimen Just like I believe that if if our goal is always to the ultimate goal is intuitive training and intuitive eating Uh in order to get there there has to be some sort of structure and tracking at one point To truly get all the way there. Otherwise, it's not objective. Otherwise. Yeah, otherwise you're bullshitting yourself You're you're you're guesstimating that that whole time so you can't and that's why when you don't veer off too far either So, you know, like with the the skeletal structure of it looks like and so now you can modify but keep it within You know the same frame of it still and you have you have true measure balls now, right? So now you can if you're really truly following something structured You can say hey, wow when I'm in phase three every time I seem to get in a phase three my body just responds really well It's crazy. My body just really likes that adaptation, right? So, you know, you'll and some people will be like, whoa, and I'm in phase one My body just responds and so everyone's gonna be a little bit different And so, you know, when you start to pick up on things like that you realize like, okay Well, maybe I'm gonna spend maybe a week longer in this phase and maybe I'm gonna cut this phase Shorter, but I'm gonna or maybe I'm gonna run this one more time than I would run the other phase Whatever, you know the point is that, you know, you follow a structure first and then you can start to have fun and play with it This is also how I you know, keep things Fun for myself, too If I was always following the same program over and over and over Jesus Christ, so it would be be annoying, right? I get tired of that this part of what we do and we love to do is experiment So part of what I'm doing right now is experimenting with a couple things one of them is this maps aesthetic is the foundation So, you know, I have focused things. There's certain muscles. I'm trying to kind of develop and bring up Meanwhile, my main main goal though above even bringing up muscle groups Which would normally be the main focus if I was competing the main focus for me is keeping mobility through this process So it is very important to me as I build this aesthetic physique. Yeah, you don't want to go back to where you were Yeah, I don't want to lose that, you know, because I'm because I'm so heavily focused on aesthetic So I'm trying to be focused on it, but not losing the mobility along the way. So I've Implemented some things one of these because I hear here are a few things that I'm starting to do right now And I'm trying to do my best to share this. Hopefully if you follow me on instagram Am I it's a story you're you're piecing this together Uh, by the way, it's a lot of work for me to to do that So I hope to god fucking people appreciate it because you know, it's one thing to be somebody who tracks and logs and follows Everything it's another thing to do that and to make sure that I snap it share it You know with everybody too every single day. It's a major commitment for me to do this So I I really hope and I do appreciate when people give me feedback that it is helping you through your journey Which I have got a ton of so I appreciate those that have reached out So during this process Uh, every every week I will make sure and you guys saw last week I was doing the the um the stone, you know the the sandbags I'll pick like a movement like that that just normally would not find its way into my programming because it just doesn't really have a place I'm not competing for a strongman, but it's such a great functional movement You know that requires me to have to be able to get all the way down in a really deep squad And a rounded back type of pulling up so it's totally a great functional movement Like the one I just posted Day before yesterday with uh, you know reverse reverse lunge to a balance with the barbell So totally not a normal movement that I would incorporate into my routine But because I'm trying to do things that are going to promote Good movement. I'm going to you're going to start to see me Incorporate these type of movements sporadically and intermittently into the programming. It's not the staple. It's not the foundation It's not like map screen is a lot of that right where I'll I'll intermittently drop Uh exercises that we would have in map screen into my maps black to help keep that that functionality in my body and that good mobility Plus You know it is to me a priority now right now Always to do my prime stuff and my fortification sessions above all other things. That's such a game changer Yeah priming properly was for me the biggest game changer for me in the last Few years easily. That's cool. Yeah, you've been logging that especially I've noticed the prime movements that you kind of highlight and you showed which test you went through and then kind of like Show people like your process with that too because that's such a valuable tool I wish more people like took it seriously dude. It's applied. It's their workout. It's a game changer I got I had a message from someone who is using prime before Their uh basketball games Sweet, so what they'll do is they'll do the priming, you know like the 10 15 minute priming Yeah before their game and they're like dude, they're like usually it takes me You know more responsive. Yeah, they're like I hit right away I'm playing like I was like I like I'm ready to go and I just feel I feel connected to my movement I feel like uh, I have good agility. It was this whole long message. I didn't even say I should send it to you guys Yeah, yeah, it's a it's a game changer. Well, it's not only is it a game changer But it's become such a priority for me and it it's what got me to where I am now as far as my mobility that I've promised myself that even though I'm heavily focused on aesthetics right now That if if if it comes down to me going to the gym and you know, something's going to give It won't be my priming. It won't be me working on all my my movements to keep good mobility What will I will sacrifice is that you know extra set of chest or that extra set of shoulders because That will become a priority. So in other words, I never miss That now it's it's always starting all my routines Routines and if maybe I only had 30 minutes or maybe I just wasn't really feeling like a big hard one hour workout I'll spend that the entire time just doing priming movements at least Above anything else versus in the past what I would do being the you know Bodybuilder guy and who's always trying to shape and sculpt the body It was like sometimes I'd hit the gym and I knew I had to hit the gym I needed to put the work and I need to get the volume And so I would go there and it's like, I don't really have time to warm the body up I don't really have time to work on my 99. I don't really have that time right now I'm just gonna go over and hit some, you know, chest press real quick and do some shoulder Shit and try some shit and then get out, you know, like Where I won't do that right now. I've told myself that if it comes down to something like that Well, if I go to the gym with that mentality, then it will be okay We'll get in there do your 90 90 do your froggers do your leg swings Do your, you know, thoracic mobility stuff and your shoulder mobility like do that stuff And then get out because that was what we agreed. You're what I've made a pact to myself is I'm going to keep during this process Yeah, love it. My so my training's changed a lot. Uh recently also I've started incorporating I hate calling them circuits because it's not really like a big circuit, but I'm I'm pairing exercises together in odd ways So like last week what I did was I one of my workouts was I did Uh, I picked a weight that I could do five reps with the deadlift with that was kind of easy So I put 315 the bar for me. I could probably hit if I really wanted to go for it I could probably hit, you know, I don't know 15 reps with 315 So five reps isn't that hard, but I would go five reps there Then I go to dips then I go to pull-ups and then I'd rest so it was like it was like a heavy exercise with some lighter ones And then I'd rest a little bit and or the other day what I did was I did a heavy double with squats So I did a heavy double with squats to like a heavy overhead press to Uh, a light cable row So I'm doing these kind of odd combinations And then what I've done since this weekend because I I tend to move and do some kind of exercise every day Is I've only done bodyweight movements this entire weekend There's a park across a kind of across the way from where I live and they have Like parallel bars and they have like monkey bars and what you can do That'd be awesome for you to go through like, uh, you know, just all You know calisthenic or like bodyweight movements for a while just to like experience that for a couple months Well, so that's what I've done the past three days And so like today this morning's workout, um, because I'm not able to work out Anywhere else because that right now my kids are in summer camp and it starts late So it's kind of pain in the ass. So what I did was I walked It's probably a quarter mile from where I live to the park Which isn't which isn't far at all except I was carrying a 50 pound kettlebell and doesn't sound like much at all But when you're carrying a fifth a 50 pound kettlebell for a quarter mile Yeah, uh, that's a quick you feel things working And so that that was the beginning of my workout was to walk with that in one hand and switch off And I was feeling all these different muscles activating and fatiguing up up in my back like Up in my ribs and then in my core and I could feel my hip Firing and then my my hands were getting a little tired. So that was kind of cool. So I walked all the way over there with that Then I did one set of walking lunges All the way across the black top So it was like this super long distance that took me like I don't know 10 minutes of walking lunges with a 50 pound kettlebell Which a lot a lot more difficult than it sounds because I'm looking like oh, I can I could do that No, it was pretty hard Then I got on the bars and did a bunch of dips and pull-ups and Suspended push-ups and body rows and I walked across the parallel bars and did monkey bar type of stuff and Remarkably great workout. So I'm going to be doing more of that kind of stuff just kind of improve my because I have You know, I never do those movements in my workouts I'll do chin-ups and dips, but I never really just do body weight movements. So feels good Yeah, I'm gonna start doing it more Yeah, besides the deadlifts too like so with uh with squats like I'll I'll do my heavy loaded squats And then in combination with that I'll do like some cossack squats or I'll do something like that where You know, it's a little more challenging functionally, you know, try and really get depth and like So I guess I'm really trying to preserve You know that type of mobility and movement Uh, same thing with like bench press then I'll kind of come in and then I'll do some You know rotations with indian clubs with that to make sure that you know, I'm functioning on that capacity as well Well, we had a good discussion. I mean, I think it was friday when um adam you were telling us about lifting the 200 pound Sandbag off the ground and putting it up on a platform Which is kind of like it's like the atlas stone, right? But they they make them into these training bags now And you were talking about how sore Your back was and we had this great discussion and Rounded back lifting rounded back lifting and I'm not talking about rounded back Like your like your lumbar spine is super rounded to where you're at end of range of motion I'm talking about rounded and you're like bare hugging Yeah to where your scapula is spread because you're hugging something and then you're having to lift it And because when we deadlift We're always in this kind of tight upper back position Which is proper form that we never really strengthen those muscles in their spread out position And uh, that's why you got so sore. That is a very important part of training. It's why zircher squats are so important Yeah, it transitions way better to like going and grabbing a real life. Yeah heavy awkward object I mean, it's just not a lot of times where you got a nice even bar that's in front of you and you arrested on your shoulder When does that ever happen right like from ever in that posture normally you're picking up a couch, right? Like and you're in that rounded back position to lift a couch up or carry something big like heavy bag You know duffel bag or so it is a great. It's a great, you know and shame on me I should have known better, but of course this and you know, we here we go there's a good I'm glad you brought this up because this is another example of If I was programming correctly if I was really being mindful of the best approach at this I would have not done a 200 pound sandbag the very first time I decided to do a movement like this like I hadn't done zircher squats in a very long time I hadn't picked up a stone like that Probably picking up a hundred pound stone probably would have been a better You know if I was if I was trying to maximize my results without getting oversore and to where it would hinder my workouts following that It would have been wiser for me to just do a hundred pound now The reason why I didn't was my buddy who just recently posted that he put a challenge out there And was telling me that probably less than 10 people in this entire gym could even lift that up and do that one time And he's like, you know, the record is like two minutes and 55 seconds 10 times And so of course I have to try and see where that was at So that is a good example of times where even we Do not do what's best for my body. That is not that would not be I gone lighter Yeah, I should have I should have trained with a 50 to 100 pound sandbag for You know a couple times and then moved my way up to 100 then 150 But what ended up happening was my bice and it was actually my back was sore Which felt great. It felt like a good sore But I actually felt almost like a strain in my biceps, which I should have known better because I was in this extended position When was the last time I held 200 pounds and extended position because I don't curl 200 pounds when I curl, right? So I'm not my my biceps aren't even used to that And I didn't even that I I knew my back was going to get sore from that But it was more my arms That was really what hindered my workouts going forward because they felt strained to where I was like it hurt to do I will say this though, man. It like I'll I mean every single time I've ever Done any type of strenuous You know normal activity like moving, you know, and you got to move like furniture and Shit out of a house or whatever and I go do this and my dad will come help I'm and I'm like I lift weights man. I do that for a living, right? I'm pretty strong I can live with my dad kicks my ass and he doesn't even work out because he's always lifting shit He's always moving things that was his job for you know, most of his life So when we move a couch or a fridge like He can like balance it and grip it and his fingers don't hurt and you know Meanwhile, I've got gloves on because I'm a pussy like Like it's like it's it's good to do that kind of shit man. It's nice to be able to like Yeah, man go out in real world and do shit that you know, like that requires some strength. That's not a barbell Yeah, heavy objects like I highly suggest you do that. Exactly. Yeah, that's why I lift logs and shit Bring the bird Bearded man and all you bearded ladies This quads brought to you by big top beard company whose all natural beard oil products not only make your beard smell amazing But feel amazing too They're organic essential oil blends transport you to manly places like the mountains the desert the sea and beyond All while encouraging a lot of beard nuzzling the boom Buy it for yourself or as a gift for that special bearded someone at big top beard company dot com Enter the discount code mine pump for 33 off at check out mn2 ak What fitness fads and trends today? Do you think you will be shaking your head at in 10 to 20 years? Oh, what ones haven't we addressed? So I'll tell you 10 to 20 years Well, if you guys don't have any I can start I see go ahead start it off So comes the mine right there's probably quite a few actually So I called this like emerging trends right now that are going into I called this early on in mine pump If you don't believe me go listen back to some of our early episodes, but I called this And that is that we put protein into everything protein water Protein cookies protein fucking anything with protein makes everything better according to the marketers And this is because the fitness industry has done a very effective job at demonizing everything but protein and protein In fact is the magic magic or nutrient and so they throw it in everything and I'll tell you this much right now Excessive intake of protein over long periods of time is not good for you I'm not saying people are doing this But at some point we're gonna laugh when we look back and see Protein gummy bears and we live well, that's kind of stupid So that's one of them and here's a couple more that I already see happening right now And it's happening literally right now The gut health trend and I called it a trend because it's very important and taking care of your gut is very very important but now The fitness muscle building industry has gotten their hands on it and you're gonna see Supplements that are geared around gut health that are probiotic based or whatever That are for fat loss or for muscle building So it's like, you know this special probiotic formula that's been that's for fat loss And they're gonna sell it and it's gonna have the same kind of labeling as their pre-workout And it's gonna be all ridiculous and the third thing is ketones and And ketogenic dieting and again, you're seeing it right now Supplement companies are already coming out with their gotta be an easier way to get to ketosis Yeah, they're protein powder with the exogenous ketones added to it and ketones this and ketones that and again It's magic and it helps with everything and There's there's some truth to some of it But like everything that the industry takes it and just turns it into shit And I think those are the things we're gonna laugh I think we're gonna look back and be like, wow, we put probiotics and everything Like that's not really necessary and we put protein and everything and just throwing ketones and everything doesn't necessarily make it I definitely I definitely agree with the ketogenic. I already see it happening right now And I and again, I felt like we called that one We first introduced it to our audience and said, you know, hey, all the great benefits was Right away, you saw like this huge flux of people doing it to the point where people are like, oh, I don't feel good on it What is what should I do? It's like, well, stop doing it, you know, like So I think that it's become it's got a lot of Great benefits, especially since I think we're we're carb heavy and carb addicted as a as a whole So I think that something the opposite of that is is really good For us, but I think that it's just like anything else will go to extreme And you're gonna see and we're gonna be kind of shaking our heads like, you know, this is just ridiculous people Drinking drinking coconut oil and fucking living off of just avocado like that You know, I think that's going to that trend will end And I think we'll kind of shake our heads a little bit I also think, you know, I'm gonna go away from nutrition and like some of the the gym trends I see So, uh, one of them being the weight belt thing. I think that that is a Needs to end The walking around and and this is just fresh in my mind Is literally yesterday I was at the gym and watching a a dad train his son And they were on they were doing lateral raises on at the machine and he had his weight belt on and I'm just thinking myself like Son, you got to protect your back. Yeah, right. So I put on your belt. I think that I think we're gonna we're we know enough now about that. I think that we think that's kind of silly I think the elevation mass Will be another one that we kind of just kind of shake our head at Unless you're just like some extreme athlete where that actually makes sense where you would be doing that I think a lot of these the people that you see in there using that that will go and it'll be funny when we look back at that Like oh, remember how silly that was used to like suffocate yourself while you train to try and get a competitive edge like how silly Right, so I think we'll kind of laugh at ourselves about that one. Um, I think the squeam one has to be It blows my mind that it's still happening right now I thought mind pump did a good job of making fun of it. I feel like it's reversing a little bit. No, it's not Are you sure? Yeah, I'm sure of it. Oh really? Yeah, it's just it's reversing from maybe where you're look standing But when the men's physique world and women's bikini, it's uh, just as just as live and well as it's always been so It's not going anywhere. So I think that Uh, is another one that we will shake our heads and laugh about And I don't know get back to me. I'm sure there's more I think so this this may be totally wrong You know, like I'm open to that but uh the way that things are evolving if I'm going to predict like 20 years from now or even like 10 um, I see a lot more gyms, uh, I see barbells being like dinosaur for a lot of gyms. Oh, whoa Yeah, I see people moving away from that a lot, um And of course I'm coming from the performance in and I'm you know from like athletics and I see a lot less emphasis on on barbells and more on Uh, this functional training again to where, um, you know, a lot of people are sort of going against You know balanced loading and they're they're more about you know lateral loading and um, you know body weight and you know explosive moves So this is my caution because I feel like you know like at some point it's People are going to sort of go against it Whereas it's such a staple thing to me that uh, I don't I don't feel like I want to caution not to do that and to stick with you know that as being the foundation because Uh, I could see like all these different programs coming out and they're all just like all that like the movement is crazy Right the movement has gotten a lot crazier and the bar Like we've gone away from like the the barbell training that got the strength established to then You know take with you into the sports. So Um, there's a lot of crawling and there's a lot of like monkey movements and you know, this like you know movement coach Is a new term that's out there Um, and you see like your connor mcgregor's of the world and all these things kind of highlighting this new Uh thought process of like movement is everything a movement a movement But you know I caution because I see it getting to the extreme in 10 20 years where You know, we're gonna forget about how important it is to establish that you know You know strength that raw strength. I'm gonna I'm gonna touch one that's gonna that probably might My anger a few of our friends, but before I get into that one I'll I'm gonna point one out that I think it's hilarious cupping Cupping where you go and I've done cupping many times. It's where you go to an acupuncturist and they I thought that's something you do with your buddy. Yeah, exactly Where they put the suction cups on your back and um, and then you get the massive hickeys Up and down you're just talking to about this and I was then Ben had cupping up and down his back Remember here, right? So So here's why it's hilarious to me. First of all cupping's been around forever So I'm not here to debate whether or not it does something or not But what is funny to me is when you have some kind of a You have an athlete or a celebrity Who takes a shirt off it becomes like this advertising It's it's it's like if you go get acupuncture nobody knows the next day But if you have cupping you've got a row of hickeys all over your back. I find hilarious So now you're an olympic swimmer or something and everyone's talking about it and next you know, everybody wants to do it Because you know, michael felps has very visible, right? It's like free advertising and here's why I think it's funny Because cupping is in my opinion One of the things that may give you some benefit But it's not going to go it's not going to be anywhere near the benefit of just proper nutrition and training And you're gonna and I've already seen this where I see like these people who don't know how to exercise eat shitty And the hickeys all over themselves and then I ask them. Hey, you know, it looks like you went to cupping You know, you know, and I'm thinking maybe they're doing it for anxiety or a part of that I'm like, oh, no, it helps with my performance. It makes me stronger. It helps me Oh, if you're gonna go there, you have to go with grass and then to you have to Because I feel the same thing about that's what's happening right now in the men's physique and bodybuilding world is Some pro bodybuilder and again, it's all about the markings, right? How much freaking ruin your skin and this is why I find it hilarious is that It's going of course. There is some science to support the benefits of it There is too deep tissue massage and fascia releasing I mean, there's of course there is and they're and they're all very closely related by the way So the difference between someone doing eldoa and fascia release somebody foam rolling getting a sports massage Massage and or doing like very very similar So if you look at the studies and the the improvement that it's made and what exactly it's doing to the the tissue and the body Very very similar. It's not like they're grossly different. They've all been around for and what I think is funny about it is It's now turned into like being a martyr again Which always ends up happening in this industry where people take it to the extreme and now it's like these battle wounds like Who can show who can go get it done and look more fucked up from it? Which is just hilarious to me like why do you want all these rashes and hickies all over your body? And you're splitting hairs on how much it's really truly important well when you talk about body work because I know some exceptional body work specialists exceptional and I've worked with a lot of them And what they'll tell you is a good deep massage is going to hurt a little bit But it shouldn't be so painful that you're getting bruising or you're freaking crying That's the equivalent of me saying it's over intensity. It's like training exactly It's like you're not what you're doing is you're creating this kind of uh response in the body We're trying to protect itself and if you're trying to loosen the body up you're doing the opposite of it of loosening the body up by hurting someone by Doing something so intensely that it's so painful. But again, it becomes a badge of honor Here's the one that I think might piss a few people off and uh Some some people might even be surprised that I'm going to say talk about this, but we're in the midst of a revolution in public opinion on uh psychoactive substances And I'll start. I like that. You know here. I'll start with marijuana. Okay, marijuana Wasn't that long ago where the majority of americans believed it should not be legal For medicinal use and definitely should not be legalized for recreational use. It's gonna be the next wonder drug all of a sudden You know over the course of 10 years very short. It was very fast movement That happened But now more americans support it for medicinal use and for recreational use, which is nothing wrong with that I fully fully support that I think the war on drugs has caused way more harm than good. However, I am now seeing People on the pro side Who literally literally will tell you there are zero negatives to marijuana. There are zero night. It's good for everybody It solves every problem. It's a miracle cure. Yes I've gotten messages from Women who are pregnant who are telling me Hey, you know, I like to you know, is it okay if I smoke marijuana while i'm pregnant? Because I know it's relatively safe and it's i'm like, what are you doing like first of all? No Not a good idea. Um Is it safer than other things? Maybe but you are Putting cannabinoids it's gonna influence in the brain It will influence or affect your own your body's own cannabinoid receptor production Uh, excuse me. Endo cannabinoid production and you will influence your developing fetuses brain because that could tell the brain to make more or less Uh cannabinoid receptors. That's just fucking. I mean, that's just black and white We also have studies that show that it affects the developing brain in adolescence And if they smoke a lot of weed, they probably may affect their IQ later on If you smoke it it does lead to you know more frequency of infections in the lungs because you are inhaling smoke and It can cause it can trigger psychosis. It can make people anxious It can cause more stress on a lot of people Can you abuse it? You definitely can't but no, there's people who are like marijuana Can't do nothing wrong or whatever and that's just not true. Everything's got it I'm really glad you said this because I think all of us we we talk we talk highly of marijuana We all smoke marijuana So I I think it's important that you people understand that there is a side of that that we have balance I am by no means going out and telling people like oh you should take it because it's the answer for all Oh, you have aches. Oh smoke this. Oh you that doesn't oh smoke this No, it's just it's an option for some people and for some people it's a better option and it is non-toxic So it's better than certain things But it's not this panacea and we are also seeing this revolution and other psychoactive substances Substances especially the psych the psychedelic ones. Yes, you're hearing people talk about uh, ayahuasca lsd, psilocybin as if they are the uh the answer To humanities problems. I've I've actually heard people tell me this like if everybody just did mushrooms There'd be world peace everybody would get along nobody would kill each other It's not that easy and Uh, there's Adverse effects. There's people. I know personal people who've done who who thought all this stuff they weren't ready for the first experience or They never experienced it before they were in a bad setting whatever the case may be and they actually got post-traumatic stress from Doing the psychedelics because it scared them so much, right? So, uh, and that's a revolution that's happening right now It's like right now you can see just like some people just have such a profound You know experience through it that it's just really hard to see the other side of it, you know, it's just like It highlights things that they didn't even know we're there and A lot of times like I don't know and that's why I caution because it's I mean There's a lot of work we have to do all the time and accountability wise and self-reflection and being aware of your own habits and all these kinds of things like Like constantly having to figure stuff like that out how to Get in tune with myself like it like that takes work that takes a lot of work to um to work on yourself, right? and so You know just just caution yourself or check yourself If you need A substance to to provide that well I just I think again the message right now that i'm hearing some people say is that it's like it's all good There is no negative no potential negative that everybody should do it and That's not true of anything. I can't think of a single thing that that's true for I think it's it could be a tool I don't have tons of experience with it with myself. I'm just based off of science, but you again Well, I have nothing wrong with it. It's just like, you know Here's a big one like if you're an advocate for the legalization or at least the decriminalization criminal criminalization of some of these psychoactive substances You are doing the movement a massive fucking disservice By pretending like it's it's all uh, you know rainbows and freaking, you know fluffy clouds You are because here's what happens. Here's what's happening with marijuana Uh, because that's been around that's everyone's gonna push the limits on everything not only to push the limits But you go you see some of these dispensaries selling fucking gummy bears Or a bag of gummy bears has 100 milligrams of thc And it's gummy bears like yeah You leave that on eat that you it's a fucking if I put a bag of gummy bears on the table And I'm an idiot parent and my kids see it and my kids eat it There's going to be a report of an adverse effect and next thing you know people are going to call for the government to Hammer down on it again. Um, I mean you can look at the names of marijuana. Look at the strains It's a bunch of fucking stoners that don't consider that naming something fruity pebbles Is going to delegitimize it as potential medicine, which it is it totally is so I see I think 20 years from now We're going to look back at this era and we're going to giggle and be like, oh my god Look at them. They thought they were saying how everything was like it was all like I like that. I like that call and people are gonna have to wait They're gonna have to wait quite some time for that happen because we're right on the we're on the verge of it Like rising right now. Oh big time and we were the be the 20 year one And it's and it's I know the question was for fitness, but it is the fitness and wellness industry That's no, no. Yeah. No, it's it is it's the fitness wellness meditation mindfulness people that are are advocating it and You know and I think again like the the cannabis thing also again, all of us are very pro Everything like we buy believe that everybody and anybody should have the choice to do and try whatever the fuck they want As long as they don't harm somebody else like if you if that's your journey, that's your journey But what I don't like is how much uh things become cult like and I don't care what what we're talking about Whether it be a substance or a brand or a thing or an ideology or a modality of training like You know people get so fucking cult like about something. It's like awesome I'm so glad that you tried this and you had this amazing eye-opening experience for you Like it was for you, you know that was for you good for you and like and I I have noticed this is really popular amongst people who Did not grow up around any sort of like religion or spirituality or anything like that It's got the same pull it is it's got the same it's the same You know and I grew up around all that stuff So I've seen the like slain in the spirit and people like speaking in tongues and like Just I've seen a lot of crazy stuff or what you would think is crazy as a kid growing up That actually was snake handling became became very normal in my life And so you know people talking and sharing these spiritual stories and and awakenings and you know things that they Processed and god speaking to them and it's very similar when I listen to some of these people talk about their experience through psychedelics And it's and I'm not here to say that either one of them are wrong It's just that I think those the same people need to learn to objectively pull themselves out of it and look at it and think like Oh, well, maybe that that's just my experience because I was able then to tap into something I was never able to tap into before And it's and it's not the end all be all for everybody and the way I look at it is this if something has enough power To profoundly change you in the positive It also has the same ability to profoundly change you in the negative and we can use religion again Religion has done some amazing things for some people, but it's also been wielded to do some Horrible things excellent psyched elix same fucking thing people don't know this But charles manson used psyched elix heavily with his cult and brainwashed the fuck out of them to do crazy shit The cia is investigated heavily and their studies on how to use it for brainwash like It's got positives it can have some big time negatives So I see that I see again 10 20 30 years from now We're going to look back and laugh like oh my god. Look at all those podcasters talking about how yeah how all these Revolutionary how they were so awesome. They were going to save the world Yeah, for sure Quick interruption by our sponsors you guys lots of people have been asking us how they can support the mind pump mafia family Our first one is our chimera coffee that we love you guys go to chimera coffee dot com That's chimera with a k for 10 off. Don't forget mind pump at the checkout We also have our big top beard company dot com for 33 off also mind pump at the checkout check out Also brain fm. We talk so much about this for sleep and meditation. It's brain dot fm for 20 off Also mind pump at the checkout You guys we also talk a lot about books on here all the time We're using that audible you guys can get a free trial 30 day trial plus one free audiobook If you go to audio audible trial dot com forward slash mind pump And then last we get lots of people asking about ben greenfield cbd supplements So we hit him up to hook you guys up you go to get natured blend dot com forward slash mind pump for that discount The next question is from microwave refrigerator It's a good combo. How do you learn to be more objective about yourself and your training? So About for me. Let's see if you like it. It feels good Check yourself. I'd say I always if there's something I really love or drawn to And I I find myself man. I love this or oh man. I'm good at this Right. Yeah, those are those are always the ones to check yourself on because that's a good point because it's usually the opposite, right? You know like oh, I don't like this. Ah, right I'm gonna do this over here And so if if you're truly being objective about your training Then the things you like the most that you you swear the by the most that gives you the best gains It works the best for you. You probably need to look deeper into And uh that and that's just a little bit of you know from experience and of training thousands of people that You know, we take we typically gravitate towards the things that we are good at And we avoid the shit that we're not good at and normally what is best for your training and what is best for your body? Are the things that we avoid the most and the stuff that we need the least is the stuff that we probably already do the most and you know Here's the thing with being objective and why it's so difficult is because uh, we're very subjective About pretty much everything. It's all based on You know, and we we trick ourselves into thinking that we're being objective and it is it's a very very powerful Uh, you know Deceit that we do with ourselves when it comes to our training. I still do it Something that I started doing about 10 years ago That was one of those moments where I was like, wow, this really made a big difference was I started writing down My workouts as I was doing them the amount of reps I did the lift I did the sets How much weight I lifted and I gave myself a score in my workout One meant it was bad A two meant it was okay and a three meant it was awesome And I only used three numbers because At first I was doing like a scale of one to ten, but that was so like what's the seven compared to an eight or whatever So it was just three You know, was it shitty? Was it okay? Or was it awesome that I feel great? And what I realized is I would go into my workouts And uh, I would go in thinking like I'm gonna fucking lift so heavy today I'm gonna crush the bar or whatever then I'd look back at my workout and they'd be like, oh wait a minute Last workout I did that I had a great workout and I did hit a new pr and I crushed it That's the last thing I should do this workout this workout I should go lighter and do more reps and what and when I started doing this I started noticing that my tendency Was to lean towards kind of like that phase one style of training and mass metabolic that heavy type stuff And I would move away from the other stuff, but I and as objective as I thought I was I didn't realize it until I started writing this all down I also realized that I would do certain exercises like crazy and I wasn't doing other exercises You just don't realize this until at least I didn't until I started writing them down And then I was able to kind of flip through the pages and be like, well, I haven't done Uh a lateral lunge in four weeks You know what I'm saying like that's something I should be doing every single week Or I haven't done anything for a single legged movement for two months You know and the only way I would really know that objectively is by going through this book And seeing exactly what I do. Yeah, it's tough because I mean obviously that like I look at it a lot Like how we look at nutrition too with like our levels of awareness So that's that's something that you know, you want to make sure that you know what you're doing and you have a schedule and you have um Like you know what your workouts look out whether it's writing it down or you know Premeditating writing it down before you go to do your workout, you know, whatever it is and you stick with a plan Uh, and then you get to a point where Okay, now I'm going to be a little more experimental and I'm going to get into other things. I'm probably not good at Uh, you know, I'm going to venture, you know out in that direction, but Then you have to kind of realize like what your goal is or you know If your goal is just like to be awesome at movement in general and just be kind of like I have a general goal of that You know, maybe I will keep in that direction where I'm constantly like adding new variables into my workout I'm trying to experience these things or do you want to be really good at something? That looks totally different. If you want to be really good at something You have to incorporate those movements constantly, right? So it's like, you know, you can make the argument that um, You know, I'm benefiting my body by doing all these different things But now I'm you know my meter for being awesome at that thing is is slightly going down So I look at you know, the workouts is like What's the why? That's exactly what I just going to interrupt and say You're why right the same thing you said earlier was You know finding your why with the business thing. I think the same thing applies here for training is Truly understanding your why because a lot of times You know people are doing exercise and I think this is also where I think people get really defensive Like when we point out things like oh, that's a stupid exercise And you know what it comes off bad because we say it and it's probably not the best approach Right to say an exercise is stupid because there's a place for everything, right? There's but There's a place for stupid exercises There is there really is there and I was talking about the whole thing with johnny It's called plant fitness these isolation movements is no it's When it's your when your why doesn't match it is when I think it's stupid So if and it was like I brought up just recently how you know A lot of these girls that are trying to build their butt you see them doing the you know, you know Assisted pull-up machine and they're doing the step-downs right to build their butt It's like well if that's your why and that's your priority Like you would be way better off doing probably sumo deadlifts, which I've never seen those girls do before It's like I've seen you do the the gravatron fucking push down with one leg a million times But I've never seen you go do a sumo deadlift or a conventional deadlift or even a deep full range squat Which I'll tell you right now if you want an ass Like those things are going to build you an ass more than that thing ever will so Understanding your why and the same thing goes for guys that are training Like I see a lot of guys that are trying to you know Get big and buff and then they're they're doing things that are counterproductive to that Like what we brought up with the cardio thing the other day like you know If your goal is to build and get bigger like Doing cardio two to three times a day is not advantageous for that So you got it you don't understand if that's your why now If you're somebody who wants to be good at doing cardio and efficient And maybe you're training for a spartan race or maybe you know that then yeah Then that makes a lot of sense or you know Same thing like when you see a lot of these guys doing these high intensity training like a crossfitter Like if your goal is to be a crossfitter and you want to go to the crossfit games Are you a one day or you want to be able to hang with a crossfitter or maybe that Translates into like spartan type racing and so that's your mentality. Well that makes sense But if you're going to crossfit to build a more aesthetic physique then that's not the ideal way to do it Like you know the wrong direction. It is it's not it's not it's silly thinking now Does that happen for some people? Of course, there's genetic anomalies that have great physiques that do anything And they're going to look a certain way. So you're going to find those in all sports But to train like an athlete but then want a bikini body or men's physique body They're counterproductive and vice versa for the two of them Like a bodybuilder does not have any business being inside a men's physique Facility or I mean a crossfit facility trying to get ready for his show. That just doesn't make sense, you know So understanding your why is a great way to be objective to your training Our next question is from mark wools What are your thoughts on spin bike at high resistance alongside squat to help grow legs? So let me tell you why this one's very interesting because we talk about cardio and how that's counterproductive But he's talking about spin bike at high intensity And I will sprints. I will tell you this much Bike sprints. Yeah very effective at building size in the legs In fact, some of the more most muscular legs you'll ever find on anyone aside from people who lift weights like ice skating Yes, but yeah The biggest most muscular legs you'll ever find on anybody aside from people who lift weights Are anybody who sprints whether it be Sprinting on land like running or sprinting on a bike or even ice skating sprinting those people have incredible Incredible muscle mass on the legs. So high intensity sprinting with squats I believe is a very effective way to build muscle. I'm going to challenge that a little bit though. Wow bring it. Well, this is How i'm going to challenge that is It can somebody absolutely can somebody do and there's great examples of Sprinters like we're saying right now if you compare most your elite level sprinters versus a marathon runner look at their quads I mean incredible that explosive training you I think there there's something to be said about that now That being said most of those guys were genetically built to become sprinters and are going to adapt and build that way And they're going to respond incredibly to that and training for training cardio high intensity is not going to affect them the same Now somebody who their primary goal is to build their legs Okay, so this is a Similar goal to mine right now. Like I'm I'm wanting to build my legs right now I would not go do sprints on on a bike now. Does that mean that it I think it's bad Does that mean that I couldn't benefit from doing that every once in a while? No, I'm not saying that I'm saying that a barbell lunge if I'm going to do squats with a barbell lunge instead of sprints I think I'm going to build more muscle than I would doing sprints I would caution the the damage factor because of like you're mentioning these people like it's the frequency principle, right? That that makes that so effective for like your sprinters and your You know your ice skaters and people like that because like what he's talking about is a technique So if I was to like interrupt my normal process and then do that technique, I could over train like really quickly I think you would be surprised. I think you would be shocked at how much muscle Here's a and this is interesting because you gotta think of this though too think of okay The person who's asking this are you asking this because you're taking a spin class and then you're cranking it up to full That's different. Yeah, when I say sprints, they're they're short Yeah, and that's it and you're done They're short and you're done. They're short and hard and you treat them like weights and 30 seconds It's also like doing vertical jump. Yeah stuff like that right before But here's what's interesting about the legs the legs in my experience and this is complete anecdote Both on myself and on my clients The legs more than any other part of the body Seemed to build muscle pretty well with higher reps like if I do sets of 20 with barbell squats That just makes logical sense because we're on them all day long It does it does make logical sense But uh, I don't know if there's any science to support this necessarily But I mean, I'll tell you what I love training in the one to four rep range on barbell squats Do you know what happens when I take a lightweight and do squats for 15 reps? My legs blow up. Yeah, my legs blow up if I want to make my legs grow I'll do sets of that shit and they just fucking yeah, but I see I'm gonna I'm gonna counter that with That was I had the same exact experience because I was a very High rep guy and when I started squatting one to three reps with you guys my legs exploded in comparison So part of the reason why you get that experience is because if you ever grow to grab different It's different from what you typically gravitate. So this technique in that and that terms Would be good because yeah, if you're not doing that And I think that's where we can all agree is if you don't if you don't typically take a spin class And you decide to intermittently put that in there for your legs to respond. Absolutely I think it's a great technique to I think a spin class is too long But that's see now. That's what I think he's doing So I think he's asking this question because he takes a spin class And because he probably likes to take take the spin class and he's thinking Hey, if I crank the spin bike up, can I get the benefits to help grow my legs? And here's the problem with that is if you're doing spin for 30 minutes plus The signal you're actually sending your body more than for your legs to grow is we don't we exactly endurance We don't need very much muscle because we're we need to ride on this bike longer So understand that when these guys say that that's the only way that i'm going to agree with him on this Yeah, they say because he just was talking about raising his resistance, but we're talking about sprints So sprints is a very short period of time that you know, we're delegating to doing these sprints and then rest Yeah, rest is very much a part of that The way I would do it is I would do if you were going to incorporate this is I would do squats And then I'd finish off my workout with some short uphill Hard sprints on a bike where you're like, huh, I mean you're pushing a salt bike I would do like a little bit, but you need but you need resistance intermittent sprints You need resistance and you need strength and speed and all of it and that's what's What's gonna give you the muscle and what we're talking about right here is like four rounds of 15 to 30 seconds tops Yeah, exactly. That's it four rounds of 15 to 30 second tops not sitting in a class setting For 30 minutes an hour or 10 minutes and cranking it up every once in a while because What the the louder signal that you're you're sending to your body is cardio not build muscle for your legs And so that's the reason why I took the counter with these guys is I'm afraid that that's more towards this question And I don't want you to mistake That with this idea that sprinting on a bike is better than doing some barbell lunges to make your legs grow Because there are a lot of other ways to make your legs grow way more efficiently than taking a spinning class Especially if you're in a class setting that you're in there for like I said 30 minutes You'll get a good stamina. That's for sure. Yeah. All right. Our next question is from Brandon Mulhall pros and cons of going into management at a big box gym as opposed to staying busy as a personal training trainer That's a great goal. Do you want to be a corporate man? Exactly. Uh, so I did this. I was a personal trainer And uh four months after being a personal trainer. I was a fitness manager Where whereas I was still allowed to actually train clients as well So I trained clients while managing a fitness department and I did that for like eight months or nine months Then I moved into weekend manager and then assistant manager very quickly and then I became a general manager So this was over the course of maybe a couple years And I loved managing As much Uh as I loved training people if not more and I'll tell you why My and this is just me personally my Personal passion is people. I love working with people and I love working with people in terms of growth And so I can do that as a trainer working with clients, but I can also do that with the staff And so I had a great time managing health clubs With the big staff although I didn't train people while I was in this as a general manager I did Coach and train my sales staff my front desk my training staff and how they would train their clients And I enjoyed it tremendously, but as a manager you're much more you're you're not connected to clients One on one so you don't get that benefit. So if you just love Personal training people and you want to connect to your clients that way it's not going to happen As a general manager you also can make a lot of money as a general manager, but uh the way I've seen certain Calm plans with some gyms. You can also make a lot of money as a personal trainer when I opened my wellness facility Um when I owned a wellness facility I used to charge rent to personal trainers So they'd come in they pay me rent and then they'd train their clients And I had several trainers making well into the six figures and all they would do is train their clients out of my facility I mean they had a great opportunity They just pay me rent train their clients and they made as much money If not more than a lot of general managers of big box gyms And they didn't have to manage nearly as much Uh, that's the other thing too like you manage a big box gym and I maybe today it's a little different But back when I was doing it it was a grind and it was pressure lots of pressure to perform You had meetings daily and weekly with your supervisors And it was all about your numbers and what you could produce and and if you were good And you did produce well Well, they were going to take your staff from you and put them in other gyms And so you were constantly building a staff on top of it. So It was I could see how being a manager Can be very stressful for some people. I had friends who were trainers Um and then decided to get into management and then went back to being trainers I hated it Because it was just it was so different from being a personal trainer. Yeah, I think uh I think an easy way to kind of figure this out is um Are you more drawn to leadership? Are you more drawn to helping others like personal training people? And I think that's uh because the the managing a big box So I was I was a trainer first for About a year and a half And then I was a fitness manager for nine years during the nine years I actually turned down the gm position multiple times and flirted with the idea Uh strictly just because I wanted to make more money And there was an opportunity to make a little bit more money on the gm side than there was on the fitness side But I loved the fitness side so much And I already felt like I was kind of managing the the the sales team anyways So I felt like I wasn't really going to get much more and they weren't willing to pay me as much as I wanted So I stayed On the fitness manager side my entire career for a big box gym But I will say that there's certain things that I found out really early that I like I I was tired of training when I left it like I I was really burnt out of You know the eight to ten clients every single day I mean I loved it building it and like once I proved to myself that I could build a sustainable business I could be successful. I could make good money as a personal trainer I became over it really quick. I I didn't feel like you know if I was going to be really really good and make a lot of money I didn't actually think I was a great trainer because what it takes to be to make a lot of money as a personal trainer You know, even if you have a really high dollar amount that you charge You've got to train quite a few people and the more people you train you your Value as a trainer starts to go down. I don't care how fucking good you are It's just a fact the more people you have to to manage and handle the less opportunity You have to service each one of those people individually. So your your service starts to suffer And so, you know, I saw that and I knew I wanted more I wanted to make more money So for me the obvious transition was to go into management And then when I got into management, I fell quickly in love with Developing other leaders And that is where I have a huge passion. So and there is the cons of it is That's where all the politics are for sure. Like you if you don't like politics, you don't like Having to deal. I mean some books that come to mind right away winning with words verbal judo 360 leader These are all books that I I love to be winning jack welch like those were all Monumental books that I remember going through and reading that I was drawn to because I I got off on that I enjoyed that. Okay Uh, I need to get something done in my facility And I know that if I just asked my boss, can I do this? He's going to say no So how do I get how do I get this done? So I actually enjoyed that process I enjoyed that struggle of how do I get to run my facility the way I want to run it even though I work for another company And all those books I just named were all great books that help you guys are so good at instagram trolling Yeah, yeah, you know how much trouble I got into. Well, it's because I was the opposite, right? I mean, I don't like politics. I don't like, you know drama. I don't like I'm pretty straight shooter And uh, you know going through management And I liked leading people so that's something I did enjoy and I enjoyed when people had questions for me And I could help them uh with their business and and guide them in a direction that would you know benefit them and Um, you know help them help clients, you know, that's a passion of mine for sure, but I just uh You know, like I was gonna have to play the games and I was gonna have to You know, um sort of abide by certain standards and rules and different things I didn't believe in and so I was just like I'm out of here and I took off And realized I could do it all myself and make my own rules for myself and Um, you know do business with people I wanted to do business with people and dump people I didn't want to do business with and you know, I can set my own standards and that excited me But it really does take a lot of a lot more work And I think the corporate the corporate way and if you can kind of deal with you know the games the politics of it You know, there's some there's definitely things that you know You can you can influence people and you can influence them for good and you could go through this this uh This setting this corporate setting where you're gonna see a lot more physical people come in and out of the door And so you're gonna have a lot more influence on those types of people Uh, if you can handle it like for me, I was just so happy to do my own thing and and realize that that was my passion So I guess it whichever direction like, you know, you feel like is a good fit for you I don't think I could I could be a manager I don't know if I could be a big big box manager nowadays. I'd have to be given. Oh really so we know why because I would if I were to manage a big box gym Let's say something happened mine pump exploded whatever and I'm like, oh fuck. Okay. I'm gonna go manage a gym The owner of that gym would have to give me complete autonomy. Mm-hmm in latitude because Uh, the way that they run them now like it's tough to answer You're not allowed to do well You're not back then see when I was doing it back then Because the company was still privately owned Because I was this like they called me a phenom, right? I'm this young kid and I could so I basically got away with a lot of shit And I mean I would have car dealerships park Cars in front of my gyms with balloons for clothes out. I'd have my staff dress up As superheroes or as disco people or whatever I'd have You know food trucks show up and give people food You know, I could I'd have dj spinning loud music in the gyms I would do a bunch of shit that I would get in trouble for that now You get fired over like now if if you manage a gym and you decide hey I'm gonna have uh una moss come and serve food If you don't get clearance from hr or whatever Like you're in big trouble. I don't ask anybody. I did all my I did it all And now uh, I would hate that like I hate to be like, okay. I've got this, you know promotion going on Here's the things I want to do it. I just like no, let me do what I'm gonna fucking do I'll show you the numbers and leave me alone And I don't know if uh, if big box gym Would be able to do that with someone like me. Yeah, I mean we're a lot of like and I mean you left the company way long before I did and all my buddies thought it was crazy How I lasted as long as I did in there for those exact reasons But I also I you know like anything else I took something that I knew was a negative or drove me crazy And I flipped it as a positive and I I found it as a challenge, right? I took it on as a challenge Like okay, how do I get the things I want to get done? How do I run this motherfucker the way I want to run it? At the same time I have to abide by all these bullshit rules that I've That they keep giving me and so I always found creative way. I don't give you an example what I mean by that I'll never forget when uh, we we started doing these Fit budgets where they would say okay You have 20 trainers and you are allotted a total of you know, 40 hours in the month That they have that you can pay them minimum wage to go on the floor and then that they could go and Pick up new clients And something that I wanted to do because I I think I've talked about this in an episode before I remember having this moment where I saw these stats on the difference as far as productivity And longevity in the company that a trainer made if he was he or she was a level three Meaning they had three national certs or more and trained over 5000 hours How much more money they made for the company and how long they stayed And when I saw that I thought why the fuck are we not spending more time educating these guys and getting them to that Focusing getting in that level because of how much we get and as a company in return And I felt like it was so crazy that nobody in the company was like putting this together But yet we had all the stats to show it And and I remember thinking okay. Well, I'm going to ask my boss Uh, you know if I can actually you know pay my trainers to learn and then I thought to myself There's no way he's going to do that. I was like there's I can't do that So even though it makes total sense. Yeah a dollar, you know what you're going to get back exactly But because a corporate and yeah, right pay people to go learn. Yeah, they're like no way So I got creative and those hours that I had allotted for them to go get new business I actually organized Uh Training groups where my trainers would be teaching each other certifications to get them to the next level So they would hold these classes with each other and I had the I had two trainers at that time Both had kinesiology degrees and were already level and then I had 18 other trainers that weren't And so these guys would hold these classes and they would start to level them up And then as new ones came on those ones would now mentor the other and I paid them to study and do this And of course they were so excited because I'm like, hey, I'm going to help you guys get paid more money I'm also going to pay you why you do it So they were completely bought in on the idea and we just decided that we weren't going to tell anybody about it We were just going to do it and it was kind of like one of those like just you know Ask for forgiveness instead of for permission. Oh my god. That's my middle name And then once my trainers were all master trainers and we were you know crushing revenue because it didn't take long after that that We were out producing everybody There no one was going to say anything to me and later on I then the trainers get more money because they got more Certs like every level you will yeah, so I got I got a kick out of Thinking of creative things like that that I knew later on when I shared the story of how I did it Now lots of people later on emulated that but I and I also know that it would have gotten the kibosh There was a no way you can't do that until you run into and this is what I hate About working for other people is that you get these egos that come in and all You know it all it's all great right now from a bit from a from my standpoint if I own the company And I see someone doing what like what adam is doing and he's killing it and it's working You know what I'm gonna tell adam to do more of it. I'm gonna tell him to do more of it I'm like it's fucking working. Good job, buddy. Here's a high five. Here's five great I'm gonna give you a bonus in fact here take a couple days off because you're a badass But what happens sometimes is you get a manager that comes in who's got a massive ego And all they want to do is prove to everybody that they're in charge And I had a couple times with this I had a district manager who came in who wrote me up literally because He wanted us to highlight a master appointment book Like when their spots that were open and he wanted us to color the whole fucking page with highlighter Which was as such as it took forever to color the whole thing It the the color bled through the pages it wasted highlighters. I'm like look trainers Just underline it with the highlighter and don't worry about it. I got written up for some stupid Shit like that like and then one thing that I did was I remember I'll never forget I was at a general manager meeting and I used to you know At some point you get bored when you're doing it and you're doing it really well And you don't really have you know, and it just sounds cocky, but I didn't feel like I had competition in certain areas So I found creative ways of Of doing things and so I remember I was at this general manager meeting And there was this big meeting on how Gyms weren't selling enough apparel like oh we need to sell more retail our apparel numbers are slow or low Whatever like the top gym only did like eight grand or 10 grand in apparel for the month And we need we can we think our gyms can do more or whatever So in the in this big meeting I said hey, I'll challenge all the general managers here To see you could sell the most apparel and everybody's like okay So what I did was is I created packages with apparel And I said this is your starter package when you sign up for this membership You also get workout pants shirt workout gloves and a lock for your locker Yeah, you just want it all in again and I bumped I put it all together And I made my own presentation forms and this is the way I sold it And my gin did something like $40,000 in apparel, which at the time was Mine like nobody even came close to that and I did all these huge numbers and everybody was super excited until The powerless stupid ego, you know, uh manager management at the time Found out that that's what I was doing and how did they find out because I told them it wasn't a secret And they're like, how are you doing this? I'm like, let me show you it's really cool No, you can't do it that way. That's not the way you're supposed to do it And they basically Said that I was breaking all these rules and that I was gonna get In big trouble or whatever and it was ridiculous. It was absolutely ridiculous. It was so dumb Because it was so that's the one thing I like out of the box thinkers Oh, I could those are all definitely the cons. I mean, I also think too that You know, there's something to be said about Developing leaders versus just helping clients like you're at the next level Of of educating and I think that educating the the next level of minds that it goes on Do they go on to go impact hundreds potentially thousands of people? Is very rewarding for me And so I would and I also used to think of myself as like an umbrella for them and all the shit that's out And just talking about like that the company was going to be shitting on on on them And I was going to umbrella them and protect them that I would take all the shit To help develop them and foster them into these great minds And so probably a lot of the reason why I've maintained great relationships with almost anybody who's ever Worked for me for longer than you know a year or whatever is I continue to mentor or spend time or always I'm there to help because I genuinely cared about my people and I think If you if you get off on that you like that you love to lead and you you love developing other people Then maybe you can handle all the the politics and the bullshit and the stuff that does suck Because a lot of that stuff is true You can make as much if not more money just being a personal trainer So if those are your things that drive you then Absolutely stay in that direction because you ain't gonna worry about all the bullshit. I'll tell you what it's it's definitely school There's no you ain't gonna learn how to run a gym whether you own one Yourself or not you ain't gonna learn in any better way that I can think of than managing a big box gym Well, I It's 100% the best way to learn most of my business knowledge from that I mean because when I would get challenged with an idea Uh, I wouldn't just accept it like oh, okay. You said no, I can't do that I'd be like why well we why you need to explain that you need to spend explain the business logic to me And break it down. Well, we were very fortunate. Okay as much as we joke around and talk shit like We were a part of 20 for our fitness During its fast fast growth while it was still privately owned and we and we worked under groups of people who Implemented systems that now you see being standard in the big box gyms that nobody was doing like We learned we you know, we learned how to read Metrics for your gyms and we read them every single day and we learned how to turn certain knobs to produce certain numbers We had training systems for the staff that we would do we had we we mastered how to do A presentation and how to do an intake form we mastered how to read You know member statistics and all these other things like it was I was very very fortunate To be a part of of that particular period of time I mean when I started with 24 fitness it wasn't that short after they merged With ray will will ray wilson's family fitness and became 24 fitness before those 24 are nautilus. Yeah, and um, I mean I learned so much about what I know through doing that. So I'd say that's a great place to learn if you want to ever own a gym go manage one definitely 30 days of coaching Is available and it's free at mind pump media Dot com also if you ask us a question On our instagram page mind pump media underneath our q and a meme or a qua meme There's a decent chance we'll answer it on one of these episodes. So that's where you got to do it Also, each of us have instagram pages each one is unique and provides different value You can find my page at mind pump sal adam is at mind pump adam and justin is at mind pump justin To build and shape your body dramatically improve your health and energy and maximize your overall performance Check out our discounted rgb super bundle at mind pump media dot com The rgb super bundle includes maths anabolic maths performance and maths aesthetic nine months of phased expert exercise Programming designed by sal adam and justin to systematically transform the way your body looks feels and performs With detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos the rgb super bundle is like having sal adam and justin As your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price The rgb super bundle has a full 30 day money back guarantee And you can get it now plus other valuable free resources at mind pump media dot com If you enjoy this show, please share the love by leaving us a five star rating and review on itens And by introducing mind pump to your friends and family We thank you for your support and until next time this is mind pump