 Security agencies are ready for those issuing threats against a number of governorship elections, says the National Security Advisor, Babagana Mungunu. And as tempo for the 2023 presidency increases, a South-South group canvases support for Minister of Transportation Rotimi Ameji. This is Plus Politics and I'm Mary-Anna Kuhn. The National Security Advisor, Babagana Mungunu has warned individuals intending to cause conflict to behave themselves as the governorship elections in an unberest state draws close. He said the law enforcement agencies will not sit by idly and allow innocent people be terrorized, arding that anyone who wants to disrupt the process will be brought to book. He added that all security agencies have been told to conduct themselves well and exhibit the highest level of professionalism and restraint and operate within the confines of the law and not be in any way or acts in any way that will jeopardize the exercise. Well joining us to discuss this and more is Francis Chilaka, a political affairs analyst and Terence Kuanu, a security expert. Thank you very much to our gentlemen for joining us. Thank you Mary-Anne. Alright, I'm going to start with you Francis. It's very interesting, yes we know the premise of this conversation is the security threat and of course the need for there to be free for credible elections devoid of any violence of any kind. But let's start by looking at the reasons why federal government seems to be very interested in a number of states. We remember where there was an insinuation or a statement that was made by the AGF that was termed was referred to a lot of people, referred to by a lot of people as out of turn when he somewhat said that there might just be a state of emergency declared in Anambra which also got reactions from even the governor and other political parties including the PDP and you know APCA. Why do you think that the federal government is so interested in the Anambra elections? I mean other than the fact that there's an APC candidate in that election, what is responsible for all of the threats that's been coming? Of course we know that iPop has its own issues and the citizens home order but is it that serious and needs the federal government's intervention? Well I think first and first is that the issue playing out in Anambra state just as what's been playing out in the entire South Eastern state is not an issue for threats by anyone in government. It's an issue that calls for dialogue and that is an avenue the government is not exploring. The government should explore a dialogue at this point in time. Even if you're issuing threats, iPop for instance is saying sit at home and if all the citizens, all the indigents, everybody in Anambra state decides to sit at home there will be an election. So the point is that I think that it is politically motivated. The federal government, the APC-led government is as well because they want to take over Anambra state at all costs and that is why they are not looking at the issues on ground, the issues of security threats. You can't be calling for an election in an environment that has been threatened by security and unknown gunmen over a period of time. But that's why they came up with the idea I guess of you know saying we might just have to call for a state of emergency because we think the things are getting out of hand and you're also somewhat saying that well you can't be calling for elections if there's insecurity. So the government may have been right if when they were you know saying let's have a state of emergency maybe that might quell the situation. I'm just saying. The question we should be asking this government is what steps are they taking to unveil the so-called unknown gunmen that has been terrorizing the entire southeastern states? That's the first question that government should answer us. Who are these unknown gunmen? And how come the unknown gunmen that have been terrorizing the entire eastern states operate and disappear before the security operators will appear? You know so deploying the entire police force to an Ambrastate. The question we should ask him does it solve the security issue in an Ambrastate? Does this solve the security issue in the entire southeastern states? It does not. So the government should sit down and dialogue and find a way out of this. It is only dialogue. Nobody know at this point in time who can't be saying okay the government exists and the iPod takes another stand. No. What we need to resolve every crisis that has been you know terrorizing the entire country is dialogue. Government must come down from our high heels to sit down with people and dialogue and find a way forward. Kwanum, you are a security expert. It's very interesting when Francis says government has to come down from its high horse. And when we say government here I'm guessing that the state governments also have a role to play because this is happening in their backyards literally happening in right before them. It's happening every day. Whether it be in Emo or whether it be in Anambra. So if there has to be a dialogue should that not start with the state governments before we even get to talk about the federal government? It's quite interesting that the situation in Anambra has taken this turn. It's for all of us to learn from it. And then we should be able to know how to handle the situation because what we are dealing with today is the creation of this government and in Anambra cannot today is the creation of the Buhari government and they have these hand up to the whole situation to the stage we are today. And thanks for this particular election and we are receiving all the streets. First we are moving the entire police force like 3 DIGs, like 14 commissioners of AIGs and NYSYZ. I think those number of police people to go and be involved in the civic duty alone. We intimidate the goods people of Anambra state to be scared of coming out to perform their civic duty. And two, I don't understand the level of dialogue that the federal government have had with the stakeholders of Anambra and to a larger extent the South East and that it has gotten to the level of the threat. And so for every security situation there's every need to consult the stakeholders that are on ground to be able to profile solutions based on the recommendations they will give you because they are the locals living there and they are the ones that know exactly what is happening on ground and so they should be able to give you the right you are going to use to be able to end those crises. And so we expected them to have ensued in the dialogue with the stakeholders to avoid this level of threats and this level of... I think we lost his connection. But let me come to you Francis. Again when he talks about Intel I remember speaking with the information commissioner in Anambra state yesterday about you know the rumors of the elections not holding, iPop saying that they're declaring a sit-at-home. iPop has also come out to say that they're not saying nobody should go out to vote but if you want to go out to vote go ahead but they themselves would be sitting at home. And he did say that the the atmosphere that seems tense is being stirred up by the opposition and that they're trying to make the situation look bad even though it may not be as bad as it seems. But for someone who's from the southeast I do not know how when was the last time you visited the southeast but is it as bad as you see or you hear of it in the news? You see when you talk about sit-at-home I think this is where we all need to be very very careful. The whole idea about sit-at-home declared by iPop the people themselves are now the ones implementing the sit-at-home. It's no longer an issue of iPop asking people to sit at home. You know my mother just came back from the east and you know she told me clearly she said Mondays everybody sits at home you don't need anybody to try you to sit at home. In other words what we have playing out in the southeast which is what has played out even in the north not east where you have Boko Haram and all of that. The difference between them and iPop is the fact that Boko Haram and the bandits are you know going about killing and all of that. But the southeast they are saying sit-at-home and the sit-at-home is now no longer being enforced by force. The people on their own are beginning to sit at home you know and then if you look at it you know with all the number of military personnel police personnel that has been deployed to Anambra City who do you think would want to come out to go and vote? People will be more scared because you're creating more fear than you know dousing the situation. So rolling out all the policemen and all of that to Anambra City is still not the solution. It is not a solution because when you put so many policemen and security agencies on the street in other words you are helping iPop to even achieve its sit-at-home instructions because people will be so scared to come out to vote. So it's not a matter of whether it is that test or not. The truth of the matter is that there's a lot of issues going on in the southeast and the truth of the matter is also that the state government and the federal government have failed to sit down and address these issues by dialoguing with everyone involved. Now let's talk about voter apathy. I hope that Quernum is back. We'll go back to him in a bit to talk more about its security but back to Francis. Let's talk about voter apathy. I mean already you said from what you said that most people are now even implementing the sit-at-home by themselves because iPop has come up to say well you do not necessarily have to obey it. Go about your businesses. But how does this play into voter apathy? Of course the politicians need the votes of the average and I'm brilliant and again to avoid hanky-panky for want of a better word. People need to go out again vote and protect those votes. So let's talk about the issue of voter apathy and all that's happening. Most people might say that all of this exaggerations of insecurity in the state might be playing you know on the mentalities of the voters so that they would be scared and stay at home. Some other people are saying well this should also push people to come out on election day to protect their votes. Where do you stand? Well you and I know that the National Redition Agency and INEC have not done so well in educating the Nigerian people when it comes to voting and carrying out their civil rights. They have not done well at all. And what has happened in the last few months in the Southeast, a lot of people are not interested in voting. A lot of people are not and as such a lot of people don't even have voters card even when INEC said they were you know going through the process of you know getting new people to register and validate their voters card. How many people really came out? So we need voters education in Nigeria. It is very important not only for the Southeast, not only for Nambra election. Unfortunately everybody goes to sleep after the elections. It shouldn't be like that. We should have a situation where after the elections the National Redition Agency, INEC, you know the Ministry of Information and all of that should be out there educating the people from their rights to vote. Unfortunately also and you guys believe that their votes don't count. That's a mindset that needs to be changed. People believe that their votes don't count. I mean between you and I you know we've seen several what has happened in some elections where some in some states where people claim this is who we voted for and then the courts will decide who becomes you know the person that takes over. I have a different perspective and you might not you might not agree with it but if we keep saying that our votes don't count how come the the politicians are interested in buying it if it doesn't count? You know the thing when you say politicians are interested in buying it. But they do buy it. Some people sell them. Well the thing is that politicians provide money for people to not give their consciences. At the end of the day most people will tell you I believe in votes and I vote. I have always been practicing it but there are people who believe that it doesn't count and a lot of Nigerians believe that. I don't think Nigerians believe that. Let us just get the money we need from the politicians at this point in time and go home. But I do tell Nigerians so when you collect $5,000 to two to model of rights and all of that from the police. You have not get your conscience for the next four years and that is why it is difficult for us to ask them to be accountable, to be transparent and to give us good governance. So we need to look at electoral laws. This is a resource back to our electoral laws. We need to look at our electoral laws. We need to make governance unattractive. We need to create a situation where if I am going to contest for an election I must not be excited to spend millions in order to win. We need to draw a line and this is what the president got me promised Nigerians when they came to power that they were going to give us an electoral law that will satisfy the Nigerian people. This is 2021. We do not have that. I really don't want to go into that because again who are the people who are responsible in drawing out these laws? The same politicians. So let's put a pin there. Let me go to Kwanum. Kwanum, the full weight of the police is actually in a number of states of course we will be seeing a lot of deployment as you had spoken of earlier on. But the issue of the case of the unknown gunmen is also an elephant in the room. If these unknown gunmen were to surface or if the issue of these unknown gunmen are not dealt with because again there have been times in the past where these unknown gunmen were termed as IPOP members where IPOP has come out to say these are not our people we're not responsible. All of these policemen that we have in Anambra will be able to address the issue of unknown gunmen. And why wait till elections draw near for this kind of security to be pulled to Anambra? You know it's quite sad that today in Nigeria the government in the southern states is expressing an issue of force with a group that they have declared that are in disbandment and that's why it's quite sad because what is happening in Anambra is also going to affect that election because no average Nigerian will see those heavy security and will be free to come out and exercise the security. And like I was saying before the mix-up they needed to have engaged with stakeholders of Anambra state and to largest in the southeast to be able to address the peculiar security challenges that are happening in the south. And what is the peculiar situation? The way you come on the citizens or the so-called outlaws in the Northeast they might you put on them you don't do you don't use the same commissary major in the north where it is happening and everybody is saying and everybody's life is in danger and so everybody in the southeast field what you're doing to them you're shortcheating them you're being biased to them you're not giving them their rights as citizens in this country and so an average man from the southeast believes that whatever you are doing to these people you're calling terrorists or whatever name you're giving them you are not being fair to their fellow brothers and sisters and so it becomes a calendar whatever solution you're bringing to solve a security challenge to a very sensitive your political region like the south is the news country the citizens are not believing it it means that it's great the solution is not going to come at all if possible not in good time now you have an election at hand there was every need for you to come out and then dialogue with the stakeholders of the south is for you to be able to conduct this election rather than engaging yourself into a show of force within group that you have to the entire world that you disbanded what they are doing today it's probably because they are showing the whole world that yes the iphone that they have disbanded has to control of the south is and that is why today they are forcing the people of Anambra state to come out and perform a civil duty and iphone says that woman simply gives a directive and the people are ready to obey them so it's going to be a huge challenge in Anambra and we just crossed our hands and we're looking at how to want to achieve this because i think it's a huge challenge for that exercise to go smoothly from a civil duty. Let me come back to you Francis again most of this is because you understand what's happening in the south is let's quickly look at the the people who are running for these offices come next week i mean we're just a few days away from the elections in Anambra state and i want to quickly look at some of these politicians and the role that they play within that catchment area. We know that we have an Andy Uba, we have Ifain Uba, we have Valentino Ziguo who's for the People's Democratic Party and we have the former CBN governor also on that lineup these are the four most known contestants for that particular governorship candidacy. We've seen reports about Andy Uba and you know the case that he has in the US where many have said that he should not be running but he's running on the platform of the ruling party which is the APC. What exactly would his candidacy be offering for you as a political analyst would be offering the people of Anambra? Well when you put up all the candidates like you've just done if we're in a country where we believe in justice where we believe in men that have character men of former unproven integrity um anyone that has a case to answer be it in Nigeria or outside of Nigeria should not admire the contest in an election and i think that uh i feel so sorry because over time you'll notice that the ruling party have always featured candidates not only in Anambra state in other states people with questionable character and they work kindestingly for such persons to win and then you ask you know yourself how is this man going to deliver good governance to the people so in other words it's not about the credibility of the candidate it's about the political party and we need to move from that for this country to move forward. We can't keep you know because you are the ruling party or because you want to abstain from the ruling party whatever you've done or whatever case you have is wiped out so we should have a system but i keep saying it INEC has not been fair to the electorates because INEC should be given the power to also carry out due diligence on anyone that wants contest analysis. But INEC is not a prosecutor neither are they a law enforcement agency they are an umpire. I didn't say they should prosecute I know but I'm saying in the terms and reference you know for candidacy INEC does not necessarily have the powers to say we're dropping this person because we think he has a case that's not part of INEC's responsibility is it? So long let me put it this way so long as we keep shifting the blame we keep saying it is this body that is responsible it is this organization that is responsible we will keep having mediocre in governance we need to have an electoral process that on its own eliminates you a system that was independent of which ever party you belong to we need to have that you can tell me that you can tell me that somebody who has a case to answer would bring himself up for election and you know nobody sees anything about it nobody says anything about it yet other people who are contesting that in other parties they have been funded by EFCC on the daily basis in other words it means that yes APC wants to take over Anambra state at all costs it's not about who is coming up it's not about the integrity of the persons involved it's about the political party we need to move above beyond that. Let's quickly run through the other candidates and then of course I have a question for Kwanum before we wrap up we also have Ifan Yuba who owns you know the football club FC Ifan Yuba he owns a string of petrol stations and he's also a member of the National Assembly he seems to be logged by many and also loaded by many because many have accused him or pointed fingers at him in terms of land grabbing so again let's look at the person of Ifan Yuba and the chances that he's the chance he has and of course what's exactly would the Anambra people be looking for if he were to be the chosen candidate? Francis? Are you referring to that to me? Yes yes well I wouldn't be on air to begin to converse with any of the candidates I believe they've done their homework and I believe that the Anambra people should by now know what they want what we want or what we want as I am from the South is what we want is good governance what we want is credible individuals occupying political offices and I think that the Anambra people are starting off to know who is still credible and who would be able to give them good governance and develop their states. I leave that to Ben. Let's talk about quickly Valentine Ezekiel before we talk about the CBN governor Valentine Ezekiel is a member of the People's Democratic Party and many have said that well he might have the support of the former vice presidential candidates of the People's Democratic Party and former governor of the state Peter Albee do we see do you as an analyst see the powers of the PDP strong enough in this election do they bring a heavy weight to this battle or is he a stronger candidate as the others who he's going head to head with? Well PDP has not redeemed this image let us let us put it as it is as a political party it has not it still has a lot of laundry to do image laundry PDP owes the Nigerian people an apology in which they have not turned that until they do that I would not sit back and support anything PDP they owe us an apology for what we have in this country today they started with them so we can just I don't believe I'm not one of those who would say three bit under the carpet boom so anybody that is you know going with PDP you're on your own okay that's my position and finally Charles Chukuman Saludo who is former central bank governor of course he's tried before to run for this office and and here we are again this time he has the support of not just the party ACA but he does have the support of his governor even though we have heard before now that rumor has it that before Obeano became the governor he worked hand in hand with the governor and Ubat to get Obeano into office and there was a gentleman's agreement that at different points these men will become governors of the state how do we see this play out? Well this is what's going to play out on the election day and it's actually going to be between two political parties you can note it down it's going to be between APC and AFGA it's not about the economics anymore it's going to be between APC and AFGA and I know that when it comes to that I believe that AFGA will take the day I believe that Charles Saludo has what it takes in this 21st century it has what it takes to you know carry on with the development of an amorous state I am not I'm not I'm not a fan of his but I just believe that yes you know his antecedent speaks for him but he's the first timer so how are you so certain that he'll be able to do it he's never really been a career politician so you see you look at what somebody has done in the past and what lies ahead and you'll be able to know if he has the capacity to do that I believe I strongly believe that a Charles Saludo would do one that's an amorous state. All right and finally Kwanum let me come back to you on security on the security grounds we've seen the NSA ask that they behave themselves we've heard the presidency talk tough you know in Anambra but if you were to be on the same table having conversations with these men at the top in terms of you know how to handle security come that day before that day and of course after that day what will be your two cents? Well the the the issue at the moment is that the deployment have been done and we can only advise them to try and be professional in the way that we do not do issues in Anambra and they shouldn't go there in the name of election and escalate more crisis for us in the South East. Anambra is one of the commercial centers of this country and should be treated very with cute glues because we have a lot to lose if there's criminal crisis from that area because any provocation in that area at the moment would bring crisis and so the deployment has been done. If I had the opportunity to from my opinion to be heard I think they would have secured a means of peace and normal elections would have gone out because very sensitive groups have come up publicly to offer what would have been solutions to the issues in the South East like Gohanese and the likes of them and the presidents have ignored them so they have gone to the level of sure force but the the beautiful men that are there should know that it is the Nigerian people that pay them they should be professional in what they are doing and they service to their fatherland and so we urge them to be professional and that's all I can say for now. Well thank you very much Terrence Kwanum is a security expert and of course Francis Chilaca is a political affairs analyst thank you very much gentlemen for speaking with us thank you all right thank you all for staying with us we will take a short break because coming on next on class politics the group in river state wants Rotimiya Meiji to contest the presidency in 2023 we'll take a short break