 All right, how are the founders able to get the politics right with altruistic ethics? Does that suggest we could move to a lesser fit direction before objectivist ethics becomes mainstream? I think it's, we talked about this a little bit earlier, I think it's a mistake to think of it as the, to put it that starkly that they get the politics right, but in ethics they're altruist. You can't have a declaration of independence that says life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness if you're an altruist. I mean, it's just, it is so rare in the history of thought that it would be formulated as you have a right to the pursuit of happiness. So you're, they're living in one of the most egoistic periods. And I think post Christianity, the most egoistic, it's the closest the Western mind has come to rejecting Christianity. And so in that context, it's, no, they have all kinds of egoistic elements. What they can't do is put it into a theoretical framework. And that's what would enable it to endure. It would be like, here's the theory, here's why it's right. And then you would have a defense that would have was standing attack. But what they had is a lot of egoistic elements. And whenever they got to the level of theorizing about it, it became more and more altruistic because every theory in like every version of Christianity, including when it's secularized is altruistic. So the second half of the question is about the future. And so the idea is, in order to get laissez-faire capitalism in the future, will objectivism first become a dominant philosophy and then we'll get laissez-faire, or will we creep towards laissez-faire as objectivism is becoming more influential? I think the latter, we'll creep towards it. The way you creep is a little like it will be as people learn to think more egoistically, they will fall at so much government power and they will start reining in government power because they'll experience it as it's an infringement of I'm trying to live a moral life and it's infringement on me. It's the issue of freedom of speech that it's the more egoistic you are, the more it's like, who's the government to tell me I can read this magazine but not that magazine, this story and not that. So I can listen to this person but not that person that I'm in charge of my life and I'm pursuing my values and what I think is true and I'm pursuing my happiness and I'm making these decisions, not government. So people will they'll experience it personally, that government powers in the front to how they want to live. And my guess is they'll do that even without knowing that it was objectivism that moved them in that direction. If we're successful then it'll just become part of the culture slowly, that we people are articulating these ideas and it'll become implicit in the culture and they won't necessarily attribute it to any random objectivism. It'll just be a better culture and a more egoistic culture. And then ultimately the source will be known and prevalent but I think it takes, it goes in stages. What we need today, what I call the new intellectual would be any man or woman who is willing to think. Meaning any man or woman who knows that man's life must be guided by reason, by the intellect, not by feelings, wishes, whims or mystic revelations. Any man or woman who values his life and who does not want to give in to today's cult of despair, cynicism and impotence and does not intend to give up the world to the dark ages and to the role of the collectivist brought. Alright, before we go on, remind them, please like the show, we've got 163 live listeners right now, 30 likes, that should be at least 100, I figure at least 100 of you actually like the show, maybe they're like 60 of the Matthews out there who hate it, but at least the people who are liking it, you know, I want to see a thumbs up, there you go. If you're liking it, I want to see that go to 100, all it takes is a click of a thing, whether you're looking at this, and you know the likes matter. It's not an issue of my ego, it's an issue of the algorithm. The more you like something, the more the algorithm likes it. So you know, and if you don't like the show, give it a thumbs down. Let's see your actual views being reflected in the likes, but if you like it, don't just sit there, help get the show promoted. Of course, you should also share, and you can support the show at your onbrookshow.com slash support on Patreon or Subscribestar or locals, and show your support for the work, for the value, hopefully you're receiving from this. And of course, don't forget, if you're not a subscriber, even if you just come here to troll, or even if you're here like Matthew to defend Marks, then you should subscribe, because that way you'll know when to show up. You'll know what shows are on, when they're on. You'll get notified, right? So yes, like, share, subscribe, support. Like, share, subscribe, support. There you go. Easy. Do one or all of those, please.