 So we're here with Kana2. So who are you? Yeah, I'm Erkis Soininen and I'm Kana2 and we show you here some touch sensors made out of our carbon and butt material. So what is this? Oh, this is a 3D shaped touch device and with this one what you have you you have here a slider function and you have a wheel and these wheels and sliders can be used to control different functions. There's also a button function to switch the device on or off. So this is just to show off your sensors. This is like a demonstration device? Yeah, this is a demonstration device and Well, how do you make it? Well, the way how we make it is that we start from foils, like initially we have flexible film on top of which we coat our carbon nanobud material in a continuous roll deposition mode. After that we pattern it to sensors to make it a sensor, a flat sensor after which it is thermo formed into the desired shape and after that we can print some decorative coatings on it like in this example and after that we back mold it with with with a plastic which is injection molded. Like in this case there was polycarbonate injection mold. So that means this device which is 3D can have all kinds of sensors around? Yeah, exactly. Anywhere? Yeah, that's true. Yeah, and so if you look inside this one for example if you hold this one and behind, can you show this one? What do we see here? Some kind of circuits? Yeah, what we see here is this is how it looks like from behind and our material is here. This is a transparent area, but then you can bring the signals out using using normal metal conductors like silver which can be printed. So how much of this is on the market? Are you still showing some things for the for the future market? Yeah, all of this is pretty new and we have launched our film products during the past year. But the first products will be coming out to the market next spring. Next spring? Spring is the one before summer, right? Correct. Yes. So here we have and what is this? The first products will be this kind of flat products for portable electronics. Something like a tablet? Maybe. Something like a tablet and that kind of products. And what's different from the other tablets? The difference here is that our material has zero reflections. It is carbon-based and therefore it absorbs all the light instead of reflecting. So no more reflections on the tablet? No more reflections from our material from the touch sensor. From the touch sensor? But there's still something else, right? Yeah, there's still something from the front surface and but our materials help reduce the reflections overall. Can you have a front surface without reflection also? Well, you can you can make practically zero reflection front surface by using anti-reflective coatings. So that is also possible. Something like matte or whatever they call it. I don't know what it is. Well, it is anti-reflective coatings are normally not really matte, but it's more like just killing the reflections by anti-reflective coatings. So your technology is in that kind of product and in this kind of product? Yeah, so the technology is in this kind of rigid tablets, type of type products, but then also it's in thermoformable products, which can be rigid but in 3D shapes, or then it can be also in entirely flexible formats. So in the future, maybe the tablets will be 3D? There will be three like different shapes inside? That's true. They can be. How? Well, you need a flexible display for that and then you need flexible touch sensor like ours and then you integrate this together and then you can have tablets that can be rollable, or foldable, bendable. Stretchable? In the long term, stretchable also. All materials can actually be stretched, but there are not yet the displays which are stretchable, but this is something that the industry is working on in a little bit longer time frame. Just a few months more, right? A few months more, yeah. So how long time did it take to make this? You say one year is the company? Oh, the company was actually established already in 2004. So there is a long period of R&D behind these materials. Before starting to launch samples? Exactly. So like we started our commercial activities four years ago, and then we have now built the first product capability and the manufacturing capability. What are you showing over there? Yeah, so what we have here is here we have a demonstrator of a dome-shaped touch sensor. There's too much reflection in this display. Yeah, you need your technology in there. Yeah, yeah, we would need it. So here what we have is we have a multi-touch sensor, and you can have up to ten touches and it is in a dome shape. So this demonstrator you can have a full matrix functionality in the 3D shape. Nice. So what do you think about this conference, ID Tech X? Oh, this is a very useful conference and then a good place for all the players in this printed electronics to come together in there. I thoroughly enjoy it. And this printed electronics business is going to grow very rapidly in the years to come? This is actually something where we have done a survey, an online survey, because we have wanted to see that what do our customers think of where the industry is going and we have just now published an online survey results for wearable devices and what we found is that 98% of our respondents, they said that there's going to be a large growth in the wearable technology industry now in the coming years. And you will be part of that? We will be part of that and we'll be the company that will be enabling the touch there. Where are you based, the company? We're based in Helsinki, Finland. All right, so looking forward to