 On the eve of the Anambra elections, the gubernatorial candidates sign a piece of cord and IPOB makes a U-turn and cancels a citatum order. And also, Governor Babajideh Song Waluw inaugurates a six-member panel to investigate the cause of the Iqoyi building collapse. This is PLOS Politics and I am Osaogye Ogbong. Welcome once again to PLOS Politics on PLOS TV Africa. Candidates of the Anambra Govnorship election have signed a piece of cord. Chairman of the National Peace Committee, General Abdul Salami Abu Bakr called on candidates and political parties to abide by the letters of the piece of cord to ensure a free, fair and credible election in the state. He urged that aggrieved parties should not resort to violence but follow the judicial process. And in a surprise and turn of events, the leadership of the indigenous people of Biafra IPOB said it has cancelled its planned one-week sit-at-home across the southeast. Joining us to discuss this is Lalitpur Johnson, a legal practitioner and Ms. Alex Obunna, the National Publicity Secretary, Arnaz Endigbo. Good evening and thanks for joining us. Good evening. Thank you. Great to have you. Thank you. Arnaz Endigbo. All right. So I want to start, you know, and I think both of you would have to answer this. I'll start with Ms. Obunna. Do you, what are your thoughts on the idea of having to sign a piece of cord for something that should be as simple as an election? This part of the world, our own brand of democracy, the part that that cord has to be signed, because sometimes people have put the parties with crude minds, and because of that, you have some elements of violence associated with the election. So it becomes necessary that piece of cord has to be signed, but it's in order. Okay. And Mr. Johnson, do you agree? Do you think that this is simply just because of the, you know, the type of elections that we run here in Nigeria? Or would you say that this is a failure of Nigeria's system to, you know, to punish offenders? Well, it's a bit of both. We've, since 1979, what have we learned, you understand, if at this stage we have to be signing a piece of cord before an election, then it is a shame. It shows that we really have not learned a lot, we have failed, or we are regressing. We haven't made the progress we should have made. At the same time, as Mr. Obunna said, our Chief Obunna said that it is reflective of the times. We cannot bury our heads in the sand and say that we do not know the situation in the country as a whole, and especially what has been happening in a number regarding violence, events, and what have you. So it's a good, it's a step in the right direction, whether, I mean, that would keep the food soldiers, as it were, civil, after the results or during the elections, is left to be seen. It's good that the candidates themselves and the parties have adopted that, but I hope that it spreads down to the followers and supporters. Chief Obunna, would you also have suggested or thought that maybe, you know, a particular group who aren't necessarily contesting in the elections should have been part of the Peace Accord. And I'm talking about the IPOB now, who have called off their citatome order. Should they maybe have been brought into this Peace Accord discussion? Yeah. The way, the kind of politics we play here, we have the leadership of every political party is expected to be in charge, and it's always at the, by the structure of the political party, the leadership will now give a structure to the followers. So I think the Accord is signed among the leadership, especially the contestant, so that they will now talk to the leadership of their better parties, and the leadership of the better parties will now go down to the grassroots. It is difficult also to organize the followers, the grassroots all together in the Accord. So I think the appropriate leadership to key into the elements and the spirit of the Accord and then find a way to make sure that it goes out to the grassroots, for them to key into that Accord. So that's it. So, evidently, any person who are serving again for this, we always know that sometimes they go to eat with desperation, do or die. And because of that, do or die, there's desperation, political fight in trying to secure votes. So it's important that the Peace Accord was signed. Thank you. Absolutely. And I'm going to stay with you. May I? Oh, Mr. Johnson, go ahead. I think you want to share something. Yes, may I just say that from what you actually said, it's difficult to, it would have been difficult to have included the iPod in the arrangements, which is what you're referring to, I believe, because it's a prescribed group. If you have termed a group that they're terrorists or what have you, then it's difficult to sit down and discuss with them. But if that hadn't been done, it would have been a good opportunity to have brought them to the table. But then, I think having called off the sit at home, they are actually thinking the way they should do. But it would have been difficult to have called them to the round table because they are not recognized by government. Well, I'm going to come back to you on that. But I want to go back to Chifogbuna now on IPOB. Like Mr. Johnson has said, they're a prescribed group. But even as a prescribed group, I'm sure that we can all tell or can all see that they have a really loud voice in the southeast, maybe even louder than the voice of the political and traditional leadership in the southeast. So Mr. Agbuna, what are your thoughts concerning they deciding to call off the sit at home order? They have also been criticized because this seems to happen every time that there is a major election coming in the southeast. They declares it at home. They say, oh, you never want to boycott the elections. And then a couple of days to the election, they call that off. Yeah, anybody who have been following on this, they will realize that on this, they have been opposed to all this kind of boycotting elections, sit at home and things like that. On this, they have also shown concern over the because it is not the way that the on this conduct is not the better approach to some of the problems we have in the southeast. Four years ago, the iPop also came with a threat that there wouldn't be any election. We presided them, we had a, it was a prolonged one, eventually they had to key in. This time around, almost a day to the time, they also canceled the sit at home. So we are very correct in what you are saying. The important thing is that they have canceled it. But I also want to let you know that when you talk about iPop of now, apart from the leadership of the iPop, most young giveers, teams of support what they are doing. So it is very difficult to say these are the members of iPop. I don't know who are the members of iPop. Are you getting what I'm saying? Yes. I hope you are following. Yes, yes. So apart from the leaders, most people, most people boys, look at iPop now as a savior. Because it's like agitation that is very common in the whole southeast Nigeria. The agitation that is common, they look at them as being excluded from the government. They look at them as being marginalized and they are alienated. They look at themselves when you think about number of states, number of local government areas, amenities, road infrastructure, job opportunities, a lot of other things. So when compared to what is happening in some other zones, they get frustrated. It is that frustration that is now, they try to agitate against it. And that agitation is manifestly gaining weight and momentum because of reality on ground. So any person who is in form of depressed, in form of depressed in a way, losing by way of not getting unemployment and other forms of alienations and deprivations, all of them are key into the momentum of iPop. So it is now difficult to say these ones are members of iPop and these ones are not members of iPop. One can classify the society, the South East as two, the elite on one side and also the masses on the other. The masses this time now, those who are unemployed, those who are huge, who feel sidelined, who have one kind of problem or the other, and who feel that the only way to gain attention is to express their feelings and agitates. It is of that extent, you know, you classify them as a one or group or the other side. The masses now will be supported because of the reality of their condition. I hope you understand. Yeah, I mean, I get your point, but I'm trying to focus on the idea behind declaring an election boycott, declaring a seat at home, and then calling it off 24 or 48 hours before the election. It's happened over and over and over, and this has continued to lead to voter suppression in the Southeast. And of course, I've started to see people who say that the IPOB might be working hand in hand with certain groups to create that, you know, voter suppression and of course, then give the election to a particular group. Yeah, like I tried to, I support what you, understand what you said. And I cited four years ago when Obeano was to go for a second term. It happened this time again, it happened. I don't really think they are, it's a machination for one part for a particular political party. I don't want to believe that. I only believe that they say it because of the reality on ground and because of the pressure that often come, they cancel. But unfortunately, they cancel their seat at home so late in time that people have already made up their mind on the seat at home. Secondly, eat a map of mispronouncement like cancelling the seat at home. You see some, if you see some other LMS through the Afra group and they're going about to implement it. So people who are sitting at home now, it's not that they are in support of seat at home, but they fear, fear and trepidation because sometimes the security of, prefer a security of presence. They are not a great number to protect, they are to protect them. So most of them to be on the safe side, they just stay indoor. Not because they like to stay indoor, like if you go to the market or the rural women that serve matomato, pepper, green vegetable and so on. They are countering waste of all kinds. They are not happy they are countering the waste. But then the fear is that if they come to market today, they may have some other actors, not state actors that will destabilize them and of course they will counter greater waste. So because of that, they are sitting at home. They are sitting at home, it's not a compliance with iPop structure. But I try to be on the safe side. So that is what we find here. All right. Ladipo Johnson, let's bring you in on the same question. Would you agree with those who say that AIPOB may be working on the background with certain political parties in order to achieve voter suppression and be able to push the election victory their way? Well, you could understand that actually because really it makes no sense. If you are fighting your group, fronting and fighting for the emancipation in quotes of your people, you would not do that four years ago and do that again four years after, calling it off just the day before. You leave room and you begin to lose credibility amongst the people who are following you. So I begin to wonder why they would do that because surely, surely, they must have known that they would call the sit at home during elections off. I don't think it's because some people have gone to talk to them that as Chief said, maybe put pressure on them because they've known this and it's happened before. If it hadn't happened before, then I'd say, OK, yes, maybe Chief is right. Maybe pressure was put on them by people trying to negotiate for the elections to go on. The bottom line is that when people look up to a group or up to a person for leadership to leave them out of what they feel is a disadvantageous position, they begin to lose interest and begin to doubt the credibility of that group when things like this happen. So as Chief said, I'll say I'm not sure, I'm not certain that they're actually in co-hooks with any political party or political pressure group. But I would say that it is easy to believe that because of the actions they've taken. And of course, the sit at home have also not been able to convince anyone to release their leader. And that's also not very likely to happen. But I want your thoughts on the IPOB instead, playing things out in the other direction and that is convincing their members, convincing people of the Southeast to get registered for the election, get their PVCs and vote a candidate that they think would be better for them and for the Southeast. So Mr. Johnson, do you think that should be the message the IPOB should be preaching? Exactly. That ought to have been their message. That should still be their message going, heading towards 2023. Because if you're saying that you want the country to let you grow as a player or maybe some are saying that you want a referendum or what have you, your work becomes 100 times easier. If say you have some three of the state governors, members of the states, houses of assembly, the speakers or what have you, who are your sympathizers or your members? So one would have thought they'd be working the other way around. That with this popularity, yes, we don't want to go into politics or we want to influence things so that we can get our people in the position we want them to be in so that we can make them what we want to make. But I think they've gone the other way, but maybe they will listen to you and begin to work towards 2023 and make sure that they get the people of the East. You know, I'm not saying I want them to succeed. I'm a Yoruba man, the Igbo's are my brothers and sisters. We want them to still remain, but in a fairer, more equitable Nigeria that works for everyone and not just for a few. Alright. Since we're not sure who the IPOB will listen to, I'm not sure if they will listen to Anez and Igbo or the rest of the traditional leadership in the Southeast to set up a conversation where they are convinced to instead convince their followers and people of the Southeast to get involved with the electoral process and increase the numbers of people who get registered and thereby putting candidates in office that would work in their favor. Chivogwana, do you think that that's what Anez and Igbo should be telling the IPOB at this point? Yes, this is played out four years ago when Chifung Nyanwood was the president of Anez and Igbo. When they said there wouldn't be a lecture in the Anambasa four years ago, we advise them that they better look into the area of the contestants or the candidates and then support one of them who they believe, who they believed would carry the apple consciousness for them and from there they begin to grow in weight and in support and with time they give more support and perhaps actualize what they are looking for. So we have told them that much before but you can see like what I told you, when you talk about IPOB, we have two kinds of people in the Southeast. It is important that you note it. One they are called the elite now and the other one the masses. And when you come to masses now, those who are unemployed, those who are having one kind of thought process or genre, you know, those who feel entirely marginalized, the youth because of reality on ground. So you say for IPOB leadership is playing on the sentiments of the reality on ground as with respect to more infrastructure. So the masses are now on the side of the IPOB. They are the elites, those who perhaps are in government, those who perhaps are experienced, those who perhaps will see beauty of the vastness of Nigeria, the diverse nature of Nigeria and the wide opposite Nigeria provides for everybody. Like myself, I live in Kano, I live in Lagos. You know, personally, I know that Iboi Geniti can better be expressed in the larger Nigeria. We continue to tell them that it is better that we stay in a restructured Nigeria where we find equity will be the major proposal and the major part of the discussion and engagement in the leadership. No, but some of them who haven't got this experience like some of us, it's difficult for them to understand it. So I think as much as we continue to all of them to understand from the viewpoint of the advantage this Nigeria provides, so you discover that it has been the point for the elite leadership to convince them to understand the very benefits the larger Nigeria provides. It has been a problem because of the reality on ground. That is why we find that this requires a political solution that requires dialogue, kind of diplomacy. For instance, assuming that we are meeting the presence, the presence is okay, one more minister for you, one more state for you, one more this and that and that. And there will be jubilation galore and it will see how it will begin to have basis of convincing some of us that things are beginning to change him. And based on that, the leadership of the elite will be more. So long as everybody appears as if there's a conspiracy for magnaalization, magnaalization or conspiracy for the nation and things like that, it becomes difficult to manage the youth. So that is really a problem. And also what I think, the whole problem was the policy of exclusion and the policy of nepotism. We are at a point that appear that most positions in government will always go to one ethnic group which is wrong. Our nation have condemned this several times. We are appealing the presence to change attitude that that one is not the best for diverse nature and character of Nigeria. For example, if you look at the service chiefs in Nigeria today, we have about 14 of them. None is, he was not condemned there. Good enough for any one of them. In fact, every other area of policy he discovered that somehow the magnaalization is very clear. So these are the things the rules are, they're trapped. These are things that make it difficult for them to convince the youth. But if we see the presence and we enter into a dialogue and he says, okay, look at the way it is. Now there should be equity. There should be issues where it begins to balance issues. Then people will begin to jubilate and it will be easier for us to convince the youth to join us in our crusade for one Nigeria. I'm not sure if that is exactly the way it will play out. But let's wrap up with Ladipot Johnson. Your final thoughts, if you can share with us in less than a minute. How disappointing will you be or how disappointed rather will you be Mr. Johnson seeing electoral figures or voting figures tomorrow looking very, very, very poor? Will they break your heart or would you of course see it as expected? With what has happened, it is to be expected. If the turnout is good, then we will be pleased that people came out to vote, to decide their futures. But unfortunately, I think that as Chief Obona said earlier, you may find that some other renegade groups would take advantage of the fact that iPop had said there should be a seat at home and still try to cause havoc and mayhem in some instances. But the security infrastructure is quite robust. So I pray that it does, that the elections go well tomorrow. And I pray that the people of the state will come out and vote for a person of their choice to lead them in the next four years. Ladipot Johnson, thank you so much for your time this evening. Always interesting speaking with you. And also, the National Public City Secretary, Johannes Ndebo, Chief Alex Obona. Thank you also for your time this evening and for this conversation. Thank you. Thanks. And thank you for staying with us. We'll take a short break and when we come back, Governor Song Walu takes a step to investigate the cause of the collapsed Iqoyi building. We'll be right back.