 To this special broadcast on I-24 News, I'm Khaled bin David. It's the first day of 2024, but it's day 87 of Israel's war against Hamas, the terror group bringing in the new year with a 20 rocket barrage in central Israel. But the IDF's still pushing deeper into Gaza today, killing a commander in Hamas's Nukh Bafos, who played a key role in the attack on Kibbutz Kisufim on October 7th. The IDF also confirming the death of Kibbutz Bairi resident Ilan Weiss, who was reported as missing since the day of the Hamas attack. Now in the North, an IDF air strike hit several his ball of positions in south Lebanon today, including a squad trying to launch a drone attack into Israel. That's as the Iran-backed militia continued its war to fire just in the past few hours reports of a few soldiers injured there. And there have been some important developments on the home front. The Bank of Israel cutting the key interest rate by a quarter point. The first rate cut since 2020 is the economy starts to sink under the weight of the war and the Supreme Court's long-rated ruling striking down the so-called reasonableness law. It's the only measure passed by parliament of the government's controversial digital reforms that had divided the nation until October 7th, put politics on hold at least until now. Let's go now to northern Israel with some breaking news from correspondent Robert Swift that border area continues to be hot or Robert, some developments that seems just in the last few minutes that seems more on the Syrian side, what's going on up there? That's correct. So this is at the far eastern end of the border, unlike much of the activity we saw earlier today, which was elsewhere. Now there's two incidents which have occurred. The first was those reports about 10 minutes ago of two rockets being fired into Israel from Syrian territory. Now the rocket alarms did not go off because the system identified that these rockets were landing in open areas. However, in the last minute, there has been two more alerts, again, rocket alerts this time going off in the south of the Golan Heights. Now we don't have any confirmation on what has caused this, but due to its location, it's possible that this is an additional occurrence of fire from Syria. Again, like I said, we don't have confirmation of that. But in the past, we have seen that rocket alarms going off in that part of the Golan Heights has tended to be due to Syrian fire. So we may see that these two incidents, one occurring just a minute ago and one about 10 minutes ago, they may indeed be connected. All right, Robert Swift there on the Israel-Lebanon border. Thank you for that. Still with us in studio. I see a diplomatic correspondent, Owen Altman, and joining us now with retired Colonel Richard Kemp, CBE, former commander of the British forces in Afghanistan. Richard, always great to have you here. Let's look at that northern front because it seems to be no let up, maybe even an intensification by Hezbollah, even though Israel is intensifying its strikes within Lebanon at Hezbollah targets and certainly intensifying its rhetoric. Doing it, the message, as we've been saying, it does not seem to be getting through to Hezbollah. What more has to be done is there more the international community could be doing. They're trying his fate, Amos Hockstein, the US envoy in Lebanon supposedly searching for a diplomatic solution. But is there more pressure that has to be put on Hezbollah for that to even have a chance? Well, I think that there's little, in my view, little chance of a diplomatic solution pushing Hezbollah north of the Lattani River where they should be, or even non-existent, even better, but at least north of the Lattani River. I think there's a little chance of that. We don't know, maybe, maybe. But I think the message really should be going directly to Tehran. And it's not just about the Hezbollah. It's also about the Houthis as well, another Iranian proxy. So I think it's very clear who's behind all of this. And that's Iran. And that's where the diplomatic pressure should be. And not just diplomatic pressure, but very, very severe sanctions as well. I think ultimately, my guess is that ultimately, it will require significant military force to deal with Hezbollah rather than diplomatic action. All right, well, you mentioned the Houthis. And in fact, the sinking of three Houthi attack vessels by US forces in the Red Sea, just the other day, seemingly has opened up a new phase in the fight against the Yemeni rebels to disrupt shipping lanes in one of the world's key waterways. Now come reports that the UK will take part in military actions by the Naval Coalition that was established by the US, the British Foreign Minister David Cameron tweeting yesterday that he had spoken with his Iranian counterpart. And, quote, made clear that Iran shares responsibility for preventing these attacks, giving their longstanding support to the Houthis. Now Iran, perhaps in response, has now reportedly moved one of its warships through the Bab al-Mandab straight into the Red Sea. Here's what the spokesperson for Iran's foreign ministry had to say today. Activities by the United States and Britain in the Red Sea are in line with the road those two countries have in intensifying instability and insecurity in the regional waters, especially in the Red Sea. Such moves will not help the region's stability and security at all. Their acts will raise regional and international concerns about the security of the region. There was breaking news this evening from pro-Houthi media in Yemen. They're reporting explosions in the Red Sea, reportedly from exchanges of life fire between some of those Houthi attack boats and US warships stationed in the area. So things do seem to be heating up there, Richard. But how far do you think this US-led coalition, how far is your country, the UK, prepared to go? Beyond defensive actions, such as we saw and we did see that taken to efforts such as striking Houthi positions within Yemen or blockading one of the Yemeni ports that the Houthis control? I think that's overdue and I think there needs to be strikes against Houthis in Yemen, including their missile launches and their radar sites and other coastal installations they have. That should have been done before now. This is just showing timidity and weakness and it encourages further and further attacks by the Houthis. I don't think the defensive actions of the coalition is going to cut it, frankly. And also I think if there is severe military action by the coalition against the Houthis that also sends a message of resolve to Iran which could reverberate into Lebanon as well and perhaps will be some form of deterrent against further action there. But there is a weakness in Washington over this and I think I believe if the US decide that they're going to carry out serious offensive action against the Houthis, Britain is going to follow suit. I think it's very unlikely Britain would not do that. But unfortunately, there aren't too many other countries who are willing to take part in the coalition. Not only those countries most directly affected, the Arab states like Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, who are the ones that really are the ones hurt, certainly more than Israel by what's happening there in the Red Sea. Right. And as far as I know, it's only Bahrain that's willing to take part in the coalition there, sorry? Among Arab countries. Right, exactly. And I think one of the problems there is that this is associated, of course, with Israel. It's portrayed as being an attack on Israeli shipping and many of the Arab countries, even though they no doubt are right behind Israel's offensive against Hamas, do not want to be publicly and openly associating themselves with Israel by joining a coalition that's seen to be working, albeit it isn't really the case, seem to be working as part of this Israeli operation. I mean, listen, just obviously the problem of free riding, right, of all of these countries that have everything to gain by traffic going through the Red Sea. A lot of them, of course, border of the Red Sea. And Egypt has the Suez Canal, which is badly hurt, right, if the shipping lanes are blocked. At the end of the day, I tend to be optimistic here. This is a problem that the United States is not going to allow it to go and solve, can't allow it to go and solve. The economic hit over time is too great, right, with what, 10 to 15% of global shipping going through these lanes. And for that reason, I continue to be confused about what exactly the Houthi strategy is, what their end game is, what is in their minds, propelling them to take a step like this. If the Iranians had some view that this was going to force concessions or force the United States, what pressure on Israel to allow this to open, it was, I think, quite clear from the beginning, that was not the most likely scenario to say the least. And it's not the scenario that's pulling out. It's having the other effect than it's forcing countries like the United States and the UK, which wanted to tamp down and keep the conflict in Gaza from spreading regionally to force them to act and involve them in a regional conflict. But oh, and Richard, it seems like Iran is doubling down on this, if you want to put it, somewhat questionable strategy, as I mentioned. They've moved one of their warships now into Red Sea waters. That's going to be seen as a clear provocation by this US-led coalition. So again, I agree with what you're saying, but Iran just seems to be thinking on a different mindset here. And I don't understand them. Mr. Richard has to say it seems to be a big strategic mistake. The balance of power in the region and the world is not going to allow for this. This is taking on the entire global economy. This is not just shooting it lonely Israel. I definitely think that the reason this is going on is because Iran still believes and rightly or wrongly that President Biden's number one objective is the JCPOA, re-establishing JCPOA, appeasing Iran, which he's done all the way along, including since the 7th of October massacre. And I think they're reading it that way, whether they're wrong in doing so or whether they proved to be right in doing so, we'll have to see. But I think it really does indicate the need for very serious aggressive action against the Houthis in order to at least send a message to say Iran. And the next step is to Iran. Right. Well, we'll see if that message is get through in Washington. By the way, I'm just going to note that Washington Post report last month, criticism, there's some defense Pentagon officials criticizing the White House for not being more aggressive in responding to attacks by Iranian-linked militias in Iraq and Syria on US forces in that country. So that dynamic is playing out not just in the Red Sea, but in places like Iraq and Syria. Gentlemen, stay with us. I'm going to want to bring the discussion back to Israel and back to not the war itself but one of the consequences of Israel's war against Hamas. Now, until October 7th, Israel had, which you can call a surging economy and of course, concurrent inflation as well. That led the Bank of Israel to boost its key interest rate up to 4.75% via 10 consecutive rate hikes. But what a difference a war makes. The Israeli economy is now expected to have shrunk by 2% over the last quarter of 2023. And to boost growth, the central bank today reversed costs and made its first rate cut in almost four years, reducing that rate by a quarter percent. But will that be merely enough to help an economy that was been clearly crippled by having so much of its manpower drafted into military service, among other things? Well, joining us for now for more is Professors V. X. Dean of the Tiamkin School of Economics at Rehman University, head of the Iranian Supereconomic Policy, also Deputy Governor of the Bank of Israel. Professor X, thank you for joining us. Well, I think everyone expected a rate cut at the very least here, a quarter point. The question is, are we now going to be in a reverse direction going forward, interest rates coming down because it looks like this war is going to extend it, and the impact on Israel's economic growth is going to be profound? Yes, I mean, but the war is only one aspect. I mean, actually in Israel, the inflation rate, which was the main cause of the increasing rate, has been going down almost as faster than the US. It's now expected actually to get into the below 3% only in this quarter, in the first quarter of 2024. And the Bank of Israel forecasting that reduce the interest rate and also the war is reducing the demand. So prices are going down, the shekel gets stronger, so that push prices also down. So it's not only the war, it's also key aspect is the decreasing inflation rate that caused the Bank of Israel governor to reduce the rate by 25 basis points. Right, and the problem was likely the first of other cuts coming, but prezzakstein, there's only so much the central bank could do with using monetary policy. There were other consequences severe of this war, just the loss of manpower, because so much of the workforce is being called up for military service, the hit on service industries, the tourism industry, leisure industry. What has, for example, the government should be doing more to prepare the country for the shock that's coming? I believe they said that economic growth in Israel was projected to shrink down down to just 2% during the coming year. And that's all that's a preliminary figure, could be worse, which is a big notable drop. Should the government be taking more actions beyond this to help the economy? Well, perhaps it's because demand went down, also people from the North and the South are on place and also the workplace, and the effect on the down of the economy, which is probably going to grow between 1% to 2% in the next year. And quite a severe, what I would say, a minor recession on the Israeli economy. And the Bank of Israel is one aspect, but the governor of the Bank of Israel also said that the government should take action. And the main problem is that the expenses of the army, especially the whole war, generate a huge deficit, which would basically increase the debt to GDP to close to 70%. And that required the government actually to reduce expenses that are unrelated to the war efforts. And in this way, basically compensate for the increase in expenditures. And that's the main issue, is that the government should take action to reduce the risk of the economy to go into a financial crisis due to the war. But overall, the Israeli economy is very strong because the high tech sector is still working very well and it's expected to work over this year. And also the exports are very high. So overall, we think that the economy is really suffering from the war, but it's not an extreme impact, as some people say. I understand, but let's just talk about maybe certain areas. I'm thinking particularly the southern border area with the Gaza Strip, of course, which has been hugely hit, that border area. And of course, in northern Israel, where people have been forced from their homes. So I'm just asking you, how is the government going to be able to balance compensating those residents, compensating those businesses that have been impacted? And as you say, manage to maintain, keep a lid on that deficit. I mean, sometimes the war requires extreme measures and that requires a big deficit in the government. Well, that's true. But the government is really reshaped, supposed to reshape the 24 budget in the next few weeks. And in doing so, they have to shift about 1% of GDP, something like close to 20 billion shekels from unnecessary expenditures into supporting the war and supporting the expenditures of the army, as well as the expenditures on supporting business and families who had to leave their homes in the south and the north. So I think if the government would shift expenditures in the right direction, that would help overcoming the increasing deficit. And maybe if we in 25, where the war would reduce to a level that it's more, I would say, not a war, really, but actually taking care of the Hamas and the Hezbollah murder impact on Israel to be in this way, then the people in the north and in the south will get back to their houses and the economy will come back to the experience in the past. Bank of Israel is expected a 5% growth in 25. This is really very high, assuming that actually the war in the north and the south and in Judea and Samaria would be contained by the army. Right, well, hopefully that would be the case. Professor Sviaksi, thank you for joining us on I-24 News. All right, now I just want to say, when Professor Eckstein was being a little circumspect there, when he was saying the government should keep to necessary expenditures. In fact, the government has been criticized rightly or wrongly for some of the expenditures, especially Prime Minister Netanyahu for some of the spending that's been done on what some people have seen as nonessential, basically political spending, to members of his coalition for certain sectarian interests to keep this government together. Right, at the height of the war, no less Kalev. Look, as with so many of the issues we've been talking about, right? Should the Supreme Court publish in the middle of a war a hugely controversial decision? When should we hold elections for municipalities? Again, it had originally been scheduled for the end of October, as of today, pushed back again toward the end of February. What are the parameters for normal politics and what politicians should be saying? And how much they should be fighting with each other? And also in terms of budgets, how much of normal budgeting should go on? These are all questions of how to balance democracy in war. Of course, not unique to Israel, other countries have faced issues like these, but they've taken place over a longer time frame than Israel has known in the past and obviously under more extreme conditions. So these issues continue to be hashed out. And yes, the answers today on January 1st may be different than they were on December 1st and November 1st and certainly on October 8th. So again, these are issues that continue to be hashed out, the economic, the political and the judicial. Right, and at least one good sign the universities did go back finally to school this week. Let's get back down to the fighting in Gaza. Thousands of soldiers have been wounded there since the beginning of the ground operation. It's been the quick transfer to hospitals and immediate medical care that saved their lives. Doctors dispatched to the battlefield, along with the IDS combat search and rescue extraction unit have been able to deliver the wounded to hospital within minutes using unprecedented lifesaving innovation. More about that in this next report. On the battlefield, every second counts for wounded soldiers. A minute can mean the difference between life and death. With that in mind, these doctors are raising the bar on trauma care. With state of the art technology that we are supplying to the doctors, they are able to give medical care to the wounded on site within minutes. We are the most advanced Western army that gives blood transfusion on the battlefield. Blood is life. It's what the wounded need to survive and we provide it almost instantly. The time span is very short. On average, it takes one hour and nine minutes from the moment of injury until the soldier arrives. The process is relatively new and is rooted in cooperation between the Air Force and the Israeli medical forces on the ground. With special equipment meant to keep blood fresh and ready to be used, the doctors can carry it with them for at the scene transfusion. They use units of blood type O, which is universal, eliminating the need for a lengthy testing process. We have managed to implement this protocol to all our forces on the ground. So far, we have provided 95 units of blood to soldiers critically wounded, whose lives depended on it. Our teams on the ground communicate with the Air Force to transmit information to them in real time and shorten intervention times as much as possible. Since October 7th, the number of seriously wounded soldiers who survive is higher than we've seen in the past. According to Dr. Zivan Avi Abder, these new intervention techniques make it possible to save soldiers who in previous wars would have almost certainly died on the battlefield. Richard, one battlefield death for Israelis is one too many. And 173 over the almost now coming up to 100 day period is a hard bill to swallow. But given the fact you've been on the battlefield, you fought in conditions in Afghanistan, not dissimilar to some ways to what Israel's the idea of having to fight in the Gaza. Your assessment on that, if Israel has, as we've seen in report, managed to conduct this operation successfully while keeping fatalities to a minimum. I would say that the casualty level, although it's terrible, is actually probably less than most people might expect. Given the length of fighting and the intensity of fighting and the length of time that Hamas had to prepare the battlefield with ambushes and mines and the tunnel system. So obviously it's a bad thing, but I think, it's not as bad as it could be. I hope it's not going to get too much worse. But the report we just had about casualty extraction, I joined an IDF casualty extraction unit a few weeks ago and I was deeply impressed by what I saw by the way that they were dealing with casualties, the way they were speedy, the way they were evacuating them. I don't think any other army is going to achieve quite what the IDF achieved, albeit the distance is involved. For example, in Gaza, much smaller than most of the battlefields we fought in. Right, Afghanistan is in a place like Afghanistan to get to a medical facility. But are these techniques and innovations that other militaries are going to be looking at fighting, looking at future conflicts? I think there'll be many lessons to be learned from this by other armies, not only casualty evacuation, but incidentally, I visited a British soldier who was seriously wounded in Afghanistan a few years back, very seriously wounded. His life was saved by Israeli battlefield medical technology. He was administered a blood clotting agent, the best in the world that stopped him from bleeding to death. So for many years, the British forces, certainly the Americans as well, have been learning from these kind of very innovative Israeli techniques. But as I say, it's not just medical, it's so many different areas. I was in the Gaza Strip earlier on today, myself visiting the Ghilani Brigade today, and the way that they have integrated the intelligence, all the different fire systems, tanks, infantry and their technology, the IT that they used to do. I think, I don't believe the British Army has anything like that sophistication. I don't suppose the American Army even does either. So I think there's a great number of lessons that will be learned and picked up from this conflict. All right. And I think, I will say that I think we've even seen that learning process go on with the army, even from sort of week to week, month to month. And there has been, and we see it reflected in the changing tactics there. Well, I was talking to one of the divisional commanders today in Gaza who told me that they've quite dramatically changed many of their methods and tactics just since the war began. So they're learning fast and adapting. The lessons, the lessons that need to be done. Richard Kent, both ultimate stay with us. We are going out for a brief break. We'll be back with more in just a few minutes. Welcome to this special broadcast on I-24 News. Israel's war against Hamas, day 87. Now, while the war with Hamas may have scared most tourists away from Israel, it has attracted here a stream of foreign volunteers, many of them, of course, Jewish, but not all of them who have come here to pitch in and help in this challenging time for the country. Now, one of those was 82-year-old New Yorker, Rochelle Marshall, who came to Israel as part of the SARL Volunteers Program. Now, she was interviewed last week for I-24 News by our correspondent, Emily Francis. And at one point, she gave her unvarnished, I would say, New Yorker-style view on a couple of international organizations that have been critical of Israel, a clip that has since gone viral in a big way on social media. Let's take a look at that. They thought I was too old to come here this year. And let me tell you, they made a mistake thinking that this one is for the Red Cross and this one is for the UN. And they deserve it. Well, Rochelle Marshall is back in New York City, but she joins us from there now. Rochelle, thank you so much for both coming to Israel and, of course, making that. First of all, I want to ask you the reactions you've got from that clip, because I'm seeing it all over on social media and Instagram and Twitter. What kind of reactions have you been getting there? Well, so far it's all positive, which means that I'm in a good crowd and that I have the right friends, because everything I've gotten so far has been positive and supportive. I'm in a congregation that's very pro-Israel. And although there is anti-Semitism around me, I have Israeli flags in my front yard, and some of my neighbors do also. And so far, so good. I know that around me, there's plenty of terrible things happening. Israel is very important to me. And I think that the UN and that the Red Cross have behaved abominably. They could have stopped this in the beginning, and they chose not to. Right. Let me ask you, you say in that clip, who said you were told? People at Sarell or some of your friends or your family, who was discouraging you because you clearly proved them wrong? None of my friends or family would dare to tell me I'm too old. But Sarell at some point made the decision that 80 would be the cutoff, and that was something new. They said because of the circumstances. And to keep me away from Israel at a time that I could do something and that I wanted to be there so badly, I felt was just cruel, because it's almost like when you have a sick friend who's far away and you want to be there to help them just to do whatever you can. And although what I can do is not very much, I needed to be there. And I'm so glad that I was able to do something. Right. Well, tell us about how we felt among the, did you feel that spirit among the volunteers that came here and that were with you there in that particular program? The volunteers are so dedicated and so caring about Israel. They felt the same way I did. That's one of the reasons why I need to come to Israel so badly, because I'm surrounded by people who are of the same mind as I am in something that's so important to me. All of the people who were there as volunteers were there because they cared deeply about Israel. And I'm very upset about this, what's happening now. But we are surrounded by Israelis who are giving up so much, whose lives are being hurt in every way. And you feel kind of like you don't deserve their thanks, because what they're doing is making sure that there's an Israel for me to come to. And with the way the world is now, it may come to that. Well, let me ask you about that, Rochelle. I'm in New York myself, but it's been many decades since I left. But seeing some of those scenes that we see in the streets of New York, some of these demonstrations, these people ripping off the postages of hostages, some of the anti-Semitic acts and invective. I'm glad you have within yourself a supportive community, but how you feel about in the bigger picture of what some of what we've seen in the US and even in New York City since October 7th. Well, even before that, when I saw a Nazi flag being raised in Charlottesville, my heart stopped. And it's just gone downhill from there. Now it's unbelievable when we see the most important universities in our country supporting Hamas. It's just beyond belief. And it frightens me. It frightens me very much to see this in my country that people have, I don't know, they just don't seem to understand after what happened with Hamas, that these people can go out with flags supporting Hamas, saying that they're supporting the Palestinians when it's Hamas that's forcing the Palestinians to be in the front of the firing. It's unbelievable. Maybe they just don't know, but I just think it's very frightening because it seems like Jewish lives just don't matter as much anymore. And when things like that happen, I look to Israel because that's where it doesn't happen. And that's why it was so important for me and the other volunteers to be there so that we could be surrounded by people who get it. All right, to Rochelle Marshall, we thank you for joining us here in Israel. We look forward if you come back and maybe come to the studio here, we'll host you at 24 News. Rochelle, thank you for joining us. Well, thank you very much. It's an invitation I will take you up on. Okay, thank you. Thank you. That's a refreshing to hear, gentlemen, that kind of spirit. But I do want to note, I mean, on a more serious note, concerns that she's expressing that we've heard and things that we've seen in New York and things, Richard, we've seen in the streets of London and other streets in the UK, of course, that she is referring to. And that are worrying as supportive as the governments are. And we've mentioned that the US and the UK, just on the, there is sometimes of a dissonance, I don't know to what degree between what we are seeing in the halls of government and also on the streets of these capital cities. I think Britain is one of the worst offenders here when it comes to anti-Israel demonstrations and anti-Israel action. And I don't believe that the noise that's made by the protesters is reflective of the feelings of the population in general. It obviously reflects a section of the population. But I think I would say the majority of the population of the UK is behind Israel. I've got no polling data to base that on, but that's my instinct. And of course, our government is firmly with Israel on this, behind this conflict and the opposition as well, which again is quite unusual, you know, in considering where you're referring to the Labour Party, where it's been in some of the past years, when a former leader said he called Hamas and his friends, I believe is the exact word. You're right. And that's a complete about turn. I only hope and I suspect that in Britain, we're going to have the Labour Party in power in the next election. I think it's very likely. I only hope that their stance on Israel is not purely designed as an electoral tool. And when they get into power, if they do, that they maintain staunch support for Israel, if this conflict is still going on or any future conflict. Right. All right. Now, gentlemen, stay with us. Prior to the events of October 7th, there was one, speaking of volunteering, there was one 20-year-old who was working on his event organizer app, as many do in the Israel, the so-called start-up nation. But following the Nova Music Festival massacre, of which he survived, he changed his app on a dime from event organizing to fundraising. On New Year's Eve, they caught their first big fish, raising money for the now 21 Israeli children who have been made orphans at the hands of Hamas terrorists. Our Emily Francis has his story. Shalom. Good evening to everyone. My name is Arad, and I'm not supposed to be here. A bittersweet New Year's Eve, to say the least. I wish for everyone not to lose hope, not to stop improving, and not to stop finding ways to help. The Jaffa Hotel was a scene of hope, as hundreds found a way to celebrate life in the midst of darkness. And the message that we send from here to everyone is that our enemies will not define us. They will not stop us from living our lives. The Echoes of Hope fundraiser raised nearly $3 million for the Israeli Children's Fund, all going to the nearly 350 children who became orphans on October 7th. And so we all had mixed emotions about coming tonight, but we stand here united on one cause. And this one cause was all made possible because 21-year-old tech entrepreneur Arad Fructur is still alive. It's like feeling born without knowing how it feels to be born. It's like this kind of feeling that's like everything and nothing at the same time. Because it's like I won life. I won the opportunity to live again. Before October 7th, Arad launched his event planning app called ZYGO, which has now morphed to fundraising at the same time. My passion was my app and becoming a better person. I feel like that's my essence of being, becoming better and better and better. Arad's resilience is a testament to the will to live and prosper after going through the biggest trauma since the Holocaust. He was among the 4,000 people at the Supernova Music Festival on October 7th. 629 missiles. I was in the dance floor with one of my friends. He pulls me away and he says, listen, I have to, we have to find all our friends. You have to find everyone. And I'm like, okay, okay, okay. I want to like lay on the ground and cover my head. We go to all the people, all our friends and one of my friends starts screaming, we have to get into the car and drive. On that fateful morning, Hamas terrorists killed more than 360 people at the festival and kidnapped about 40 to Gaza. I was scared. I told him to drive. We started driving and seven minutes after we started driving, we hit the first point. We got the car, it was four lanes, became two lanes, started seeing bodies and cars all over the road. I scream at my friends, they're shooting at us. We all ducked. They started 10 terrorist, maybe I'm not sure exactly the amount of numbers, started shooting at us. Arad's friend got shot in the leg and a heroic off-duty IDF soldier, Edo Saad, managed to get Arad and his five friends to safety in a banana field. We entered the banana field and we sat down because my friend was bleeding and he was like excruciating and crazy pain. Gunshots, gunshots, gunshots. We walked more inside. Gunshots, gunshots, gunshots. Till we got to the end of it. We got to a point where there's nowhere else to go forward and we were just sitting there, like sitting ducks and we're just waiting. We were calling the police, no one to answer, no idea what to do. We're just sitting there. Sitting there, everyone is praying for their god. There's like this saying, there's no a-fist in a pit hall. That's exactly what you experienced and we're just praying. Please, something happened. My friend is bleeding and bleeding and bleeding and we're just starting to, we're just hoping to find someone to come and save us. The person we were with, he called one of his friends that was, that lives there in the area. He came with his car, picked us up in the car and drove us away. And the way back, we go to the first place that Israel kind of like, was outside of Stilot. We started and we started seeing all these bodies. Rod's father, Ari, a social entrepreneur, could not be more proud of his son and the miracle that he is still alive. I was really, really lucky that I was sheltered from all that potential anguish and grief, knowing that my son was in danger, because I didn't know he was in danger. I knew he was at a festival, I didn't know which festival, and at 6.30 in the morning and my phone blew up from the rockets. You know, I waited a bit, turned the TV on and see what was happening. At 7 o'clock, I realized that she's really crazy. I need to check to make sure my kids are okay. Did you think you were going to die? I was positive I was going to die. I knew I was going to die, but I was saying like, my grave is digged, so I don't know what to do. I was like, I had this thoughts, okay, I will call my parents and my family to say my goodbyes. I was saying, if I call them, it's pouring the dirt on myself in the grave. And a Rod right away messaged me, saying I can't talk. So I figured he's at a festival, having fun, he's dancing. And it was Simcha Torah, so I said I want to go to the Baik Knesset. And I really want to go to the Baik Knesset, it's actually the bomb shelter. Nearly three months later, a Rod is going through a healing journey and says that laughter, the gym and work are the best medicines. My routine kind of made myself feel like I'm a person. This experience is not who I am. I'm me and this is something I experienced and my life is going to continue because I'm not going to let my life be stopped here. How have you changed? I think I became a more wholesome kind of guy. I feel like I'm showing more love to people. I'm taking on more risks. Now that you know that you were close to death, does it make you less afraid of dying? It makes me, it makes me okay with it. Because I feel like I'm okay with the situation, I'm okay if I'm going to die. But I'm going to have, I'm going to do what I need to do now because if this second is my last second, I want to say I'm okay with it. I don't want it to be. I want to be, do more. There's always more to be done. But I've done enough. I didn't let myself down as a person. I'm okay with who I am and that's really how I want to live my life. This experience really taught me that. Thank you everyone and I wish that 2024 will be full of echoes of hope. In Jaffa, Emily Francis, I-24 News. Gentlemen, we've seen the spirit of volunteering both among, at least from my perspective, the young and the old. There's no age limit either for the young or on the older side as well. Right. Presumably Rochelle won't be making any apps. So I wouldn't put it past her given her energy, Caleb. But great to see a rod on there and to see his dad Ari and to see all that he's been able to do coming out of a horrendous experience, obviously. And he talked about just how horrific it was, but able to come out of that and to be able to do some good. Obviously, tremendous, tremendous success story. Going back to Rochelle for a moment because this dynamic of diaspora Jews coming over to Israel over the year-end holidays in the countries where they live is a mass phenomenon here in Israel. Thousands and thousands of people. I met many of them just over the course of a few hours in Hostages Square with our channel last week. It's a huge phenomenon and it speaks again to the depth of feeling and you heard it in Rochelle's voice. You know, Caleb, there's this debate in the United States about what is anti-semitic, what is not anti-semitic. At the end of the day, one important part of that is what feels anti-semitic to hundreds of thousands and maybe millions of people, whether it objectively has crossed the line or has not objectively crossed the line in at least some senses is less important than the felt experience that so many people are going through. What does that mean on the proverbial day after that we've talked about so much? For some people, especially I think the younger people on campuses who have been involved in pro-Israel activism and have walked through this literally day in and day out. This is something that is going to stay with them and we can speculate about how it's going to change attitudes and behaviors, maybe with examples from other communities like in France or in South Africa, communities that have dealt with this going on for years at a much deeper level to some degree, maybe in London as well, though to a lesser degree there. We can speculate and try to project that onto the American experience, which may still be different. But this could have real profound changes on how American Jews see themselves and how they see America and how they see Israel in a number of different directions, but certainly for a significant minority, maybe even larger than that of the community, experiencing this the way Rochelle is experiencing it again in many different ages, at her age and at younger ages. And what that means is something that I think we're going to be speaking about for a very long time. We should, I'm just going to note that the 1967 war of course was a form of thought about that for American Jewry. And by the way, Aliyah to Israel from the United States shot up for the three years. I thought this is a very different experience in that collab, but in terms of its dimensions and its depth and its impact, it's absolutely on par with that, may even exceed it. I want to go now there are some news reports breaking this evening regarding two discussions or about a possible hostage deal that have been in the air. Reports have been about also Israeli delegations to Egypt, Egyptian delegations to Israel. Let's go to our Middle East correspondent, Ariel Osiron, who was down by the Gaza border this evening. And Ariel just fill us in on some of the latest, some of these reports coming up, claiming maybe there's some flexibility on the side of Hamas we haven't seen before. Indeed Kalev. So as the reports in Arab media of an Israeli delegation currently in Cairo for discussions regarding another hostage release deal this evening, Israeli media reporting or quoting Israeli officials saying that they're seeing some minor flexibility on the part of Hamas to engage in these negotiations because we should remind the viewers that Hamas has adamantly claimed that they will not negotiate any additional hostage release deal until there is a permanent ceasefire in Gaza. But indeed, this indicates otherwise. Now according to these reports, the willingness by Hamas is to a Egyptian and Qatari mediated deal based on three phases. The first would be, and this is in line with reporting earlier today with the Shankanausat humanitarian release of hostages. These are women, elderly, sick people, and also minors following that the release of soldiers. And after that the release of bodies between each phase is expected to be a month or two months. Now one of the main obstacles for that, and this has been the obstacle until now we're leading to Israeli refusals to to proposals until now is that Israel withdraws its forces completely. Israel has said that it plans to engage in an operation in Gaza for at least another six months. And so this is not quite clear how it will be solved. But indeed, these are the latest reporting multiple reports coming out amid a potential second hostage release deal. All right, Ariel, I'll surround there by that border of Gaza with, of course, these 129 confirmed hostages are still being held. Thank you for that, Ariel. Richard, a non-starter for Israeli withdrawal of, I mean, the softening of Hamas is that they were said they were only going to even discuss a hostage deal, only after Israel had stopped fighting or withdrew from Gaza. Now they're saying, well, talk about it, but that's still a condition non-starter probably for Israel. But if there is any kind of hostage deal, it will likely involve a ceasefire or a pause considerably longer than the one that we saw at the end of November. And the question is the impact, what impact that will have, of course, their considerations, I'm not asking you to weigh in on whether that deal should be accepted or not. But what kind of impact would that have on the military goal of defeating Hamas if it was in effect delayed for weeks or potentially even months in order to get hostages out? Of course, this is exactly what Hamas wants, they want. Their equivocation on this shows, I think, to an extent their desperation. And I don't want to be over optimistic here, but certainly there are signs of the population of Gaza, some of them turning on Hamas, and speaking out against Hamas in a way that was inconceivable before. And also, I gather a lot of the prisoners that have been taken by the IDF tend to be overly cooperative with the IDF in a way that perhaps you wouldn't expect. And it shows a sign of the weakening of Hamas. And of course, they know that if Israel continues with its current tempo of operations, the inevitable result of it is the destruction of Hamas, and they want to avoid that at all costs. So I think that they would hope by achieving some kind of prisoner exchange that we would see a ceasefire and that then pressure put on the international community or pressure from the international community to make it permanent. That's obviously something that Israel can't tolerate. In terms of the IDF side, I do think that a lengthy ceasefire could be detrimental because, of course, it gives Hamas the opportunity to regroup and to prepare the battlefield for the IDF when they recommence. On the IDF side, it does give them some opportunity, I think, to consider the lessons that have learned and to adapt their own operations. But the overwhelming positive is on the Hamas side of any lengthy ceasefire. Right. And as Richard said, this is obviously a strategy. I mean, Hamas knows this kind of discussion is going to be had in Israeli society, and that is legitimate for the families. Owen, but at some point this government is going to face increased pressure, especially if Hamas starts to reduce some of the demands that are non-starters at this point. Yeah, absolutely, of course. I mean, the pressure has never fully gone away, but you're right, if the demands are non-starters such as not even talking until the war is over or demanding the war is over before freeing any hostages, obviously, that's not going to get the discussion started in Israeli society. But you're right, we're Hamas to become, want to quote, more flexible. I'm just again struck by how little interest they seem to show in the prisoners, right? In past deals, and even if you look at the statement issued on October 7th itself, one of the two goals that Hamas cited in its own statement for unleashing their quote Al-Aqto flood was to free the prisoners. Free Palestinians. Free Palestinian security prisoners, right? And that's just not on their agenda at all in terms of this deal. They just seem totally uninterested in it. Interesting to ask why one of the comments made in our studio is maybe they've gotten all the support they need in the West Bank. They've topped out what they can do in polls there. So by the naked strategic logic, they don't need to free any more prisoners to get any more supporters in the West Bank because the reservoir of support for them is already there. But at any rate, it's a very striking feature of this negotiation that they just seem not to care at all about the prisoners, which at least in past exchanges, my other own statement has been core to their objectives. Well, I think when you're back as to the wall and you're concerned about your own imminent survival, suddenly the conditions of others somehow evaporates from the mind pretty quickly in this regard. And that certainly tells you something about where Hamas's true interest lies when it comes to the Palestinians. I would like to thank Richard Kemp for joining us again and wish you happy New Year, Richard and Owen Orton for joining on this broadcast. As I said at the beginning, this is the first day of a new year. But today, 87 drawing to a close on Israel's war against Hamas. Let's just hope that as the year progresses and as the next year leaves us, it ends on a more positive note that most of all will see the return of all the hostages in Gaza back to their homes. Thank you for joining us. Israel is in a state of war. Families completely gone down in their beds. We have no idea where she has. Our soldiers are fighting on the front line, but the general perception is something that certainly needs to to be fought as well. He news edition. I'm Benita Levine coming to you live from Tel Aviv. Israel has decided to withdraw some troops from Gaza on day 87 of the war in what looks like the start of a new phase of lower intensity operations in the northern strip. But it says fighting is likely to continue all year. A U.S. official saying the move to withdraw five brigades from Gaza reflects the success of the Israeli military in dismantling the Hamas terror groups capabilities there. Several experts suggesting these reservists will rest and prepare to be moved to the northern border with Lebanon at a later stage. The Israeli death toll in the retaliatory ground operation in Gaza is now at 173 confirmation that Sergeant First Class in the reserves, Amichai Israel, Yohushua, Oster, was killed in fighting inside Gaza. It's more than 12 weeks since the Hamas terror onslaught in which more than 1200 people were murdered in southern Israel. Most of them civilians. 129 people remain in captivity inside Gaza. Reports out of Qatar suggesting an Israeli team is set to join a meeting in Cairo to discuss a possible release deal. Meanwhile, Israel's defense minister, Joav Galand, has announced plans for a gradual return for residents of the Kibbutzim in the Gaza envelope in southern Israel close to the border. He and other officials conducting a situational assessment. Let's take a listen. I have now returned from the Gaza Strip. I have met the fighters. They fight with their faces towards the enemy and with their backs towards the communities surrounding Gaza. They know their mission. They execute it perfectly so that here, in the Gaza envelope, life will return to its course. According to the recommendation of the IDF and the security establishment, we will soon return the communities that are within a range of four to seven kilometers in the north of the Gaza envelope to their homes. A first group of seven settlements has already been determined. The Tkuma directory, who is responsible for this national mission, will also take care of the issue of education and other issues so that a gradual return will be possible. In the first stage for the seven settlements and later for all the other settlements. So, for the latest on the ground, we go first to our Middle East correspondent, Ariel Osaran. He joins us from southern Israel. So, Ariel, what a start to 2024 Hamas launching more than 20 rockets towards central and southern Israeli cities just after midnight. No one was hurt. What is the latest though? What update can you share from southern Israel at this hour? Well, but into the latest is that here in Israel's southern border communities, the situation is quiet, a tense quiet, since that midnight New Year's barrage that you just described. Situation inside the Gaza Strip is a lot different. Fighting continues across all sectors, also from the north, also the north, also in the central and southern parts. A lot or two more intense of fighting, such as in areas such as Nusrat or Direl Balach in the center and Chanyounis in the south. That is where the majority of the fighting is concentrated. But earlier today, Israel's head of southern command, Yaron Finkelman visited the north-eastern outskirts of Gaza City, where there has been significant fighting, telling the soldiers on the ground that they should expect development or evolving battle in new methods and in varying intensities. And this describes also this movement towards the second phase or the next phase of the fighting in Gaza that you referred to earlier. Also confirmation earlier that the IDF has uncovered another massive weapons cache in a kindergarten inside Gaza. Also, as we heard earlier from your Afghan groups of reserve soldiers expected to return home from the battlefield, the IDF saying though, once that happens combat fighting would likely continue for the whole year. So unpack for us what it is likely to look like as that fighting continues inside the Gaza Strip and more and more evidence is uncovered by IDF troops. Right, this evidence is going to continue. I mean just another example of the IDF sharing footage from a Hamas GoPro camera that was found on the body of a dead Hamas terrorist who was killed in fighting with IDF forces showing how they portrayed themselves as ordinary civilians in civilian clothing, walking around with RPG launchers against tanks covered with blankets walking the streets. This is all part of Hamas tactics and these unveilings will continue by the IDF. But as for the way we should expect the fighting to continue in the Gaza Strip, at least according to Israeli military and political officials, is that there will be some sort of not necessarily withdrawal, even though there are reducing amounts of forces, but a repositioning of forces in a more defensive way, a way that allows more surgical operations, more pinpoint operations that explains also the newly employment of the commando brigade, mainly in Chanyune, so to expect more special ops going on down south as the operation continues and the civilian population there, the strain continues. Israel trying to find a way to juggle those at the same time. Thank you so much. Live from southern Israel, our Middle East correspondent, Ariel Osirin. Thank you, Ariel. And from the south to the north. Let's check in with our correspondent, Robert Swift. He joins us from northern Israel and draw up much activity up north, red alert sirens on multiple occasions, including Kiryat Shmoner, again, Roshan Ikrah, again, and Shlomi, again, and responses too. So let's start on that front. What is the latest up north? So the latest event is rocket attacks that came from Syrian territory. There was initially there was this occurred about an hour ago. Initially, there was two which fell in open space, and so no alarm was triggered. And two other additional alarms went off shortly afterwards. Now, there is reporting in Syrian opposition media that Iranian backed militias operating inside Syrian territory were responsible for this activity, and that the IDF has responded with fire. But this is just one of the incidents taking place this with regards to the Syrian border. But there was much more activity on the Lebanese-Israel border. Now, a number of these incidents occurred earlier in the day. They turned out to be false alarms, the IDF cancelling them subsequently. These were a series of sightings or possible sightings of aircraft moving into Israeli airspace. But there was confirmation that one incident of this nature did occur, and that was the Kiryat Shmoner incident that you mentioned, just to the north of where I'm standing now. Again, rocket sirens sounded on this occasion. That was due to the interceptor missiles that Israel fired. Separately, further west, in the community of Adina, five Israeli reserve soldiers were wounded in a rocket attack that took place earlier in the day. And, Rob, we also know the U.S. is set to move its aircraft carrier group, Gerald R. Ford, from the eastern Mediterranean region, after, of course, being sent there to deter further attacks on Israel. Is that confirmed? And what is being read into that move by the U.S. Day 87 of the war? So this is a reporting which is coming out of U.S. media. We're waiting on confirmation for this. There's lots of speculation as to what does it mean. First of all, I think it's worth bearing in mind that this is one of two aircraft carriers that the U.S. has in the area. So it's not like they're suddenly reducing the amount of firepower that they have. They still have sizable forces in the area, and U.S. sources seem to be stressing that they retain flexibility and capability in the region. But it may signal a shift in their stance to what's going on. It may signal that they are encouraging Israel to move on to the next phase. But it could also just be a mere logistical move. It's normal for carrier groups to be stationed in location for a certain amount of time and then to return for resupplies, et cetera. So it may be connected to this or it might signal a wider significance. Thank you so much. We will be coming back to our correspondent, Robert Swift, live from Northern Israel. Appreciate the update. Thank you, Rob. And now for more reaction and insight, it's a pleasure to welcome to studio Shiri Fine Grossman, member of Forum DeVora, Women in Foreign Policy and National Security and the former head of regional affairs in the Israeli National Security Council. Shiri, thank you so much for being here in studio. I would like to say a happy new year for the start of the year. But what a start it was, we cannot ignore that just as midnight struck, heralding in the start of a new year on the calendar, a barrage of rockets was sent. What did you make of that message and that timing? It was very much expected. A lot of us were, I was waiting for midnight to see if there's going to be a siren. They want to go to sleep. You know, the whole concept of Hamas and radical Islam is against Christianity, against liberalism. So new years and the celebrations that come with it is totally a part of that. And it's a strong message. It's a religious message in Hamas view of this being a religious conflict, us being Jews on a Muslim land that we're not supposed to be in. So I'm not at all surprised. But unfortunately, yeah, it wasn't a good way to start the new years. But luckily, no one was hurt. We know they have a few more hundreds of long range rockets. So they have a few cycles like that they can do. And then they're waiting for the right time to make the psychological effect and make the media effect. So that's to be expected. And that's not very it's it's unpleasant. But fortunately, we have the iron dome. So we're safe. And again, it's worth pointing out that the Jewish New Year is not at this time just an interesting anecdote for another day. We have a lot of Israelis that do celebrate formally from the Soviet Union and Russia as well. So it's kind of a national holiday for them. The significance of the timing was certainly not lost on anyone. No doubt about that. Some brigades, some troops are being sent home from Gaza that certainly is being read as a positive sign that the Israeli Defense Forces saying that there are brigades that can go home certainly hugely for their families. But some security experts suggesting it's time for them to rest. And then eventually they will be sent up north. And we heard there from Rob about the simmering tensions that continue on day 87 of the war in terms of what's going along that front. What do you make of the move right now bringing those troops home at this point in the war? So there was a much a lot of criticism in recent weeks about many soldiers dying. Every day we wake up to a few soldiers dying and feel like we're falling into this Hamas trap. And there were voices saying, Hey, we should and I want to say today the IDF spokesperson came out. I think about 30 soldiers died from friendly fire because it's tragic indeed. So there was a lot of criticism and there was a large kind of sentiment that we have to move to the next stage. I have to say I mean from the timing it's a perfect timing because we're ending the end of the holiday season and diplomats are back to work and the pressure if we stayed in the same intensity will mount. And I think it's a good time. I think it's a win-win for everyone. And what they're going to do, they're just in very simple terms, they're going to step back, but they're going to do surgical operations, more tactical operations where based on intelligence and not just walking from the streets of Gaza looking for tunnel shafts. So I think it's a good, definitely a good step forward. And as for the north, it can go in many directions. It can be that now Hezbollah says, Oh, the intensity has calmed down. I would calm down as well. That's one option. Another option, it will escalate to something a little bit more active. But you have to wait to see. And definitely there's also the economy of Israel, which is very much reliant on the reserve duties. So it's good that they're coming to rest and the economy needs it. The country needs it. They will just rest up before the next stage continues. And while that fighting continues inside the Gaza Strip, obviously top of mind for the whole nation is waiting for word on the 129 hostages still somewhere inside the Gaza Strip. We know reports out of Qatari media of a meeting happening in Cairo. Apparently an Israeli delegation is taking part. We don't have many details on that front. But do you feel this is something that could be resolved diplomatically in terms of another hostage release deal? Or do you think that the fighting needs to continue to send a message that the goal to eliminate Hamas stays regardless of what happens on the diplomatic front? So it's an excellent question. It's not an easy one. It's definitely something the hostages are on our mind. There are a few options here. The first one is that we continue fighting and Hamas will stay, hold his ground, saying as long as the fighting continues. And every time there's a Qatari, some sort of information about some sort of development in the hostage deal, we're hearing Hamas saying again and again that there's no deal on the table until the fighting stops. So I want to be very cautious as to say there's a deal on the table. But obviously there is a time limit here. And a good scenario will be that in the next few days, weeks, or maybe one month to two months, the Hamas leadership will understand that that's it. They can either surrender or, and that will be the end of it. And then they will release the hostages. Any time sooner than that, they will have to come some sort of a deal where the Hamas leadership and thousands of Hamas terrorists leave to another country. Certainly something we are watching to see exactly how all of that unfolds. Shiri Fine Grossman, stay with us more to discuss right now, though, in the immediate wake of the October 7th terror assault, Israelis reached an instant understanding. Normal politics were to be put on hold. But that understanding has frayed, especially in recent days. One example is key figures in the ruling Likud party, who are more willing to take on their own party's leader, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. But beyond them, as our senior correspondent Owen Ultiman explains, two other key players from other parties are waiting for their chance. Let's take a look. Rumblings around the government table in Jerusalem. Rumblings of the day after that's coming. Not only the day after in the Gaza Strip, but the day after in Israel's own politics as well. We give full backing to our forces. They are doing amazing work in a difficult war. Last week, they eliminated over 100 terrorists. Politics have creeped back into Israeli life, and Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu will be watching the decisions of two very different players. The first, Itamar Ben Gvir, the leader of the far-right Jewish power party, has laid the groundwork for bolting the government, attacking the government's own war cabinet, warning that the war must lead to a decisive win, and demanding a say in planning for the future of Gaza. Part of the Israeli public will end the war disappointed. Ben Gvir will want their votes. When you want to defeat Hamas, you don't let in 200 fuel trucks. When you want to defeat Hamas, you don't transfer money to any official. And then Benny Gantz, who brought his centrist national unity party into the government in order to help run the war. But who has said his party will leave the government once the war ends? And if the war has no clear end date, then Gantz will come under pressure from his voters to declare when he's out. We started strong, and now we need to turn it up and continue. The next steps in the fight will also be powerful, deep, and surprising. Ben Gvir and Gantz have both polled well since October 7th, giving them an incentive to leave and get to elections. And take on a weekend, Netanyahu. Meanwhile, it's a monumental move in the political world in Israel. Remember that reasonableness clause, a key part of Benjamin Netanyahu's judicial reform, and an issue that sparked mass protest action across the country in the past year. Well now, in a highly controversial decision, the High Court of Justice has struck down legislation passed in July that curtailed judicial oversight of the government and nulling for the first time in Israel's history an element of one of its quasi-constitutional basic laws. The President setting ruling establishes in legal precedent the High Court's contention that it has in limited circumstances the right to a null basic laws. Justice Minister Yarev Levine and coalition officials slamming the High Court, but saying the war effort comes first. So for more insight, we now welcome Ariel Kahana, diplomatic correspondent at the Israel High Yom Newspaper, joining us from Givab in Yamin in the West Bank. Good to see you, Ariel. Thank you so much for joining us. A stunning move at a curious time, the High Court Justice is striking down this law, repealing the so-called reasonableness clause. It's an issue Israelis haven't been discussing during wartime, nor have the media. Talk us through this landmark ruling. What can you tell us? Hello, Netanyahu. It's good to be with you. Yes, as you suggested in your opening remark, as this clause or this decision actually today by the Supreme Court is very highly under disagreement in the Israeli public. Yet because of the war, I think, I mean, actually, I could see it from all the replies by the politicians and the leaders, no one is actually going to deal with this decision. It's going to be, it's going to stay in the way it is for the coming months, maybe years. I don't know for how long, until the war will end and until we will return to regular, to normal life. And again, it might take a lot, a lot of time. It's, I mean, you showed the pictures or the videos from last year. It looks as if from a different world. And by the way, the Supreme Court is under fire, not only because of the substance of the decision, but also because of making it during some, of course, from the right wing leaders are saying, I mean, okay, you have your position, you believe you have to cancel the reasonable chapter, but why are you doing it while there is a war? And you know that so many Israelis disagree with you. You should have been much more careful. So, but in any case, it's, I mean, because you were talking before about politics, to me, the replies, the statements from the politicians, from the ministers, after the decision showed me how much the government is stable, because no one from the rights, no bank deal, Rotman, Smotry, none of them is not even beginning to make any threat, not to leave the government and not to force a change. It's very clear to everyone that what the Supreme Court decided is going to be, we stay the way it is, again, for quite a long run, because now everybody are focused in the war. Well, to that exact point, Yarev Levin, the Justice Minister, the architect of this judicial overhaul accusing the judges of taking into their hands all authorities that in a democracy are split between the three branches of a government. He also says the government will continue to act with restraint and responsibility during the war time. Why now? Why during war when it's such an emotional time for everyone across the political spectrum, for the whole country right now? Why do this? It's a very, it's a very good question by Minister Levin. I can tell you that some soldiers who are now in Gaza sent me their feelings after the decision and they said, we feel that this decision by the Supreme Court hurts us. Why couldn't they wait for a few weeks, for a few months? And why they had to do it just now? And again, in this case, I'm saying that's what soldiers are saying, not politicians. So now it's not for me, I mean, to decide whether the Supreme Court had to make the decision now or not. To me, I find it offended as well. I must tell you, I mean, in my personal opinion, they shouldn't have waited. I have no question about that. But they had their decision. Actually, actually, the president of the Supreme Court, Esther Hayout said that the court has to keep going even during the war and say what he has to say. Okay, that's her point. But somehow, you know, it works because of the war although the decision makes so many people so angry because of the war in the public and in the political arena. Just people are saying, we will wait. We don't like what you did. But we will wait. And this problem will solve some sometime in the future. Maybe, I believe in unity government, when it will come, if it will come in probably again, in a few months, in the most years. But now, again, everyone are focused in the war. And some people regret why the Supreme Court made a decision during the war in so difficult days. Just such an interesting timing issue. Politics has largely been out of the phrase since the start of the war. That clearly is changing as we speak. Thank you for now. We will watch to see what happens. Always appreciate your insights. Ariel Kahana, diplomatic correspondent from Israel. Hi, your newspaper. Thank you for speaking to us. Thank you very much. Thank you, Benito. And still in studio, Shiri Fine Grossman. So, Shiri, what do you make of all of this in terms of the moral? Soldiers on the ground, not so much about the political development, but the fact that this is day 87, we spoke earlier about this high death toll in terms of soldiers who are fighting. Some are getting to come home, but many are staying on inside Gaza. And then you have political shenanigans on the sidelines that, as we said earlier, have for the most part been out of the public arena during the war. Your thoughts? I think if I was a soldier coming back from Gaza, I would look at everything and everything would look like a bunch of nonsense. And what are we actually dealing with? And I just hope this whole chapter in Israel's history will be able to put to bed very soon and just pass on. And there's a trend now among soldiers that's saying to politicians and to the media and everybody saying it's on TikTok. It's like, if you don't have something that is unified to say, just don't say anything at all. And that's the spirit that is coming out of the soldiers that are coming out of Gaza. And that gives me a lot of hope and optimism that we can make a change. I think the soldiers who fought in this war will be very crucial to Israel's future and its political future and the experience they had there and what they will bring when they come back. I think it will be with us for a long time like we experienced in 1973 with the Yom Kippur War. Thank you so much. We always appreciate your insights. And with that message, we thank Shiri Fine Grossman. Thank you very much as always for being here in the studio on this day. And with that, we wrap up this edition of our Breaking News coverage. I'm Benisa Levine. Our rolling coverage continues shortly. Stay tuned. This is I-24 News, Breaking News Edition. Israel is in a state of war. Families completely done down in their beds. We have no idea where is she as our soldiers are fighting on the front lines. But the general perception is something that certainly needs to to be fought as well. This Breaking News Edition, I'm Benisa Levine coming to you live from Tel Aviv. Israel has decided to withdraw some troops from Gaza on day 87 of the war in what looks like the start of a new phase of lower intensity operations in the Northern Strip. But it says fighting is likely to continue all year. A U.S. official saying the move to withdraw five brigades from Gaza reflects the success of the Israeli military in dismantling the Hamas terror groups capabilities there. Several experts suggesting these reservists will rest and prepare to be moved to the northern border with Lebanon at a later stage. The Israeli death toll in the retaliatory ground operation in Gaza is now at 173. Confirmation that Sergeant First Class in the reserves, Amichai Yisrael Yahushua Oster, was killed in fighting inside Gaza. It's more than 12 weeks since the Hamas terror onslaught in which more than 1,200 people were murdered inside the Israel. Most of them civilians. 129 people remain in captivity inside Gaza. Reports out of Qatar suggesting an Israeli team is set to join a meeting in Cairo to discuss a possible release deal. Meanwhile, Israel's Defence Minister Joav Galant has announced plans for a gradual return for residents of the Kibbutzim in the Gaza envelope in southern Israel close to the border. He and other officials conducting a situational assessment. Let's take a listen. I have now returned from the Gaza Strip. I have met the fighters. They fight with their faces towards the enemy and with their backs towards the communities surrounding Gaza. They know their mission. They execute it perfectly so that here in the Gaza envelope, life will return to its course. According to the recommendation of the IDF and the security establishment, we will soon return the communities until within a range of four to seven kilometers in the north of the Gaza envelope to their homes. A first group of seven settlements has already been determined. The Tkuma Directory, who is responsible for this national mission, will also take care of the issue of education and other issues so that a gradual return will be possible in the first stage for the seven settlements and later for all the other settlements. So for the latest on the ground, we go first to our Middle East correspondent, Ariel Osaran. He joins us from southern Israel. So Ariel, what a start to 2024 Hamas launching more than 20 rockets towards central and southern Israeli cities just after midnight. No one was hurt. What is the latest though? What update can you share from southern Israel at this hour? Well, but into the latest is that here in Israel's southern border communities, the situation is quiet, a tense quiet since that midnight New Year's barrage that you just described. Situation inside the Gaza Strip is a lot different. Fighting continues across all sectors, also from the north, also in the north, also in the central and southern parts, the latter two more intensive fighting, such as in areas such as Musirat or Dir el-Balach in the center and Chanyounis in the south. That is where the majority of the fighting is concentrated. But earlier today, Israel's head of southern command, Yaron Finkelman, visited the north-eastern outskirts of Gaza City, Dalje Tufach, where there's been significant fighting, telling the soldiers on the ground that they should expect development or evolving battle in new methods and in varying intensities. And this describes also this movement towards the second phase or the next phase of the fighting in Gaza that you referred to earlier. Also confirmation earlier that the IDF has uncovered another massive weapons cache in a kindergarten inside Gaza. Also, as we heard earlier from your Afghan groups of reserve soldiers expected to return home from the battlefield, the IDF saying though, once that happens, combat fighting would likely continue for the whole year. So unpack for us what it is likely to look like as that fighting continues inside the Gaza Strip and more and more evidence is uncovered by IDF troops. Right, this evidence is going to continue. I mean just another example of the IDF sharing footage from a Hamas GoPro camera that was found on the body of a dead Hamas terrorist who was killed in fighting with IDF forces showing how they portrayed themselves as ordinary civilians in civilian clothing walking around with RPG launchers against tanks covered with blankets walking the streets. This is all part of Hamas tactics and these unveilings will continue by the IDF. But as for the way we should expect the fighting to continue in the Gaza Strip, at least according to Israeli military and political officials, is that there will be some sort of a not necessarily withdrawal, even though there are reducing amounts of forces, but a repositioning of forces in a more defensive way, a way that allows more surgical operations, more pinpoint operations. That explains also the newly employment of the commando brigade, mainly in Hanyun, so to expect more special ops going on down south as the operation continues and the civilian population there, the strain continues, Israel trying to find a way to juggle those at the same time. Thank you so much. Live from southern Israel, our Middle East correspondent, Ariel Osaran. Thank you, Ariel. And from the south to the north, let's check in with our correspondent, Robert Swift. He joins us from northern Israel and Rob Mach activity up north, Red Alert Sirens on multiple occasions, including Kiryat Shmoner, again, Roshan Iqra, again, and Shlomi, again, and responses too. So let's start on that front. What is the latest up north? So the latest event is rocket attacks that came from Syrian territory. There was initially, this occurred about an hour ago, initially there was two which fell in open space and so no alarm was triggered. And two other additional alarms went off shortly afterwards. Now, there is reporting in Syrian opposition media that Iranian-backed militias operating inside Syrian territory were responsible for this activity and that the IDF has responded with fire. But this is just one of the incidents taking place with regards to the Syrian border. But there was much more activity on the Lebanese-Israel border. Now, a number of these incidents occurred earlier in the day. They turned out to be false alarms, the IDF cancelling them subsequently. These were a series of possible sightings of aircraft moving into Israeli airspace. But there was confirmation that one incident of this nature did occur and that was the Kiryat Shmoner incident that you mentioned, just to the north of where I'm standing now. Again, rocket sirens sounded on this occasion. And that was due to the interceptor missiles that Israel fired. Separately, further west, in the community of Adina, five Israeli reserve soldiers were wounded in a rocket attack that took place earlier in the day. And Rob, we also know the U.S. is set to move its aircraft carrier group, Gerald R. Ford, from the eastern Mediterranean region after, of course, being sent there to deter further attacks on Israel. Is that confirmed? And what is being read into that move by the U.S. Day 87 of the war? So this is a reporting which is coming out of a U.S. media. We're waiting on confirmation for this. There's lots of speculation as to what does it mean. First of all, I think it's worth bearing in mind that this is one of two aircraft carriers that the U.S. has in the area. So it's not like they're suddenly reducing the amount of firepower that they have. They still have sizable forces in the area. And U.S. sources seem to be stressing that they retain flexibility and capability in the region. But it may signal a shift in their stance to what's going on. It may signal that they are encouraging Israel to move on to the next phase. But it could also just be a mere logistical move. It's normal for Navy carrier groups to be stationed in location for a certain amount of time and then to return for resupplies, et cetera. So it may be connected to this or it might signal a wider significance. Thank you so much. We will be coming back to our correspondent, Robert Swift, live from Northern Israel. Appreciate the update. Thank you, Rob. And now for more reaction and insight, it's a pleasure to welcome to studio Shiri Fine Grossman, member of Forum DeVora, Women in Foreign Policy and National Security, and the former head of regional affairs in the Israeli National Security Council. Shiri, thank you so much for being here in studio. I would like to say a happy New Year for the start of the year. But what a start it was, we cannot ignore that just as midnight struck, heralding in the start of a new year on the calendar, a barrage of rockets was sent. What did you make of that message and that timing? It was very much expected. A lot of us were, I was waiting for midnight to see if there's going to be a siren. They want to go to sleep. You know, the whole concept of Hamas and radical Islam is against Christianity, against liberalism. So New Year's and the celebrations that come with it is totally a part of that. And it's a strong message. It's a religious message in Hamas' view of this being a religious conflict, us being Jews on a Muslim land that we're not supposed to be in. So I'm not at all surprised. But unfortunately, yeah, it wasn't, it wasn't, you know, a good way to start the new years. But luckily, no one was hurt. We know they have a few more hundreds of long-range rockets. So they have a few, few cycles like that they can do. And then they're waiting for the right time, you know, to make the psychological effect, to make the immediate effect. So that's to be expected. And, you know, that's not, you know, very, it's, it's unpleasant. But fortunately, we have the air and dome. So we're safe. And again, it's worth pointing out that the Jewish New Year is not at this time just an interesting anecdote for another day. We have a lot of Israelis that do celebrate formally from the Soviet Union and Russia as well. So it's kind of a national holiday for them. The significance of the timing was certainly not lost on anyone, no doubt about that. Some brigades, some troops are being sent home from Gaza. That certainly is being read as a positive sign that the Israeli Defense Forces saying that there are brigades that can go home, certainly hugely for their families. But some security experts suggesting it's time for them to rest. And then eventually, they will be sent up north. And we heard there from Rob about the simmering tensions that continue on day 87 of the war in terms of what's going along that front. What do you make of the move right now, bringing those troops home at this point in the war? Yeah. So there was a much, a lot of criticism in recent weeks about many soldiers dying. Every day we wake up to a few soldiers dying and feel like we're falling into this Hamas trap. And there were voices saying, hey, we should, and I want to say today, the IDF spokesperson came out, I think, about 30 soldiers died from friendly fire because it's tragic indeed. So there was a lot of criticism and there was a large kind of sentiment that we have to move to the next stage. I have to say, I mean, from the timing, it's a perfect timing because we're ending the end of the holiday season and diplomats are back to work and the pressure, if we stayed in the same intensity, will mount. And I think it's a good time. I think it's a win-win for everyone. And what they're going to do, they're just, in very simple terms, they're going to step back, but they're going to do like surgical operations, more tactical operations where, based on intelligence and not just walking from the streets of Gaza looking for piers of tunnels, tunnel shaft. So I think it's a good, definitely a good step forward. And as for the north, it can go in many directions. It can be that now Hezbollah says, oh, the intensity has calmed down. I would calm down as well. That's one option. Another option, it will escalate to something a little bit more active. But you have to wait to see. And definitely there's also the economy of Israel, which is very much reliant on the reserve duties. So it's good that they're coming to rest and the economy needs it, the country needs it. And they will just rest up before the next stage continues. And while that fighting continues inside the Gaza Strip, obviously top of mind for the whole nation is waiting for word on the 129 hostages still somewhere inside the Gaza Strip. We know reports out of Qatari media of a meeting happening in Cairo. Apparently an Israeli delegation is taking part. We don't have many details on that front. But do you feel this is something that could be resolved diplomatically in terms of another hostage release deal? Or do you think that the fighting needs to continue to send a message that the goal to eliminate Hamas stays regardless of what happens on the diplomatic front? So it's an excellent question. It's not an easy one. It's definitely something the hostages are on our mind. There are a few options here. The first one is that we continue fighting and Hamas will stay, hold his ground, saying as long as the fighting continues. And that's every time there's a Qatari, some sort of information about some sort of development in the hostage deal, we're hearing Hamas saying again and again that there's no deal on the table until the fighting stops. So I want to be very cautious as to say there's a deal on the table. But obviously there is a time limit here. And a good scenario will be that in the next few days, weeks, or maybe one month to two months, the Hamas leadership will understand that that's it. They can either surrender or, you know, and that will be the end of it. And then they will release the hostages. Any time sooner than that, they will have to come sort of some sort of a deal where the Hamas leadership and thousands of Hamas terrorists leave to another country. Certainly something we are watching to see exactly how all of that unfold. Shiri Fine Grossman, stay with us more to discuss right now though. In the immediate wake of the October 7th terror assault, Israelis reached an instant understanding. Normal politics were to be put on hold. But that understanding has frayed, especially in recent days. One example is key figures in the ruling Likud party who are more willing to take on their own party's leader, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. But beyond them, as our senior correspondent Owen Ultiman explains, two other key players from other parties are waiting for their chance. Let's take a look. Rumblings around the government table in Jerusalem. Rumblings of the day after that's coming. Not only the day after in the Gaza Strip, but the day after in Israel's own politics as well. We give full backing to our forces. They are doing amazing work in a difficult war. Last week they eliminated over 100 terrorists. Politics have creeped back into Israeli life, and Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu will be watching the decisions of two very different players. The first, Itamar Ben Gvir, the leader of the far-right Jewish power party, has laid the groundwork for bolting the government, attacking the government's own war cabinet, warning that the war must lead to a decisive win, and demanding a say in planning for the future of Gaza. Part of the Israeli public will end the war disappointed. Ben Gvir will want their votes. When you want to defeat Hamas, you don't let in 200 fuel trucks. When you want to defeat Hamas, you don't transfer money to any official. And then Benny Gantz, who brought his centrist national unity party into the government in order to help run the war. But who has said his party will leave the government once the war ends? And if the war has no clear end date, then Gantz will come under pressure from his voters to declare when he's out. We started strong, and now we need to turn it up and continue. The next steps in the fight will also be powerful, deep and surprising. Ben Gvir and Gantz have both pulled well since October 7th, giving them an incentive to leave and get to elections, and take on a weakened Netanyahu. Meanwhile, it's a monumental move in the political world in Israel. Remember that reasonableness clause, a key part of Benjamin Netanyahu's judicial reform and an issue that sparked mass protest action across the country in the past year. Well now, in a highly controversial decision, the High Court of Justice has struck down legislation passed in July that curtailed judicial oversight of the government and nulling for the first time in Israel's history an element of one of its quasi-constitutional basic laws. The president setting ruling establishes in legal precedent the High Court's contention that it has in limited circumstances the right to annul basic laws. Justice Minister Yarev Levine and coalition officials slamming the High Court but saying the war effort comes first. So for more insight, we now welcome Arielle Kahana, diplomatic correspondent at the Israel High Yom newspaper, joining us from Geva Ben Yamin in the West Bank. Good to see you, Arielle. Thank you so much for joining us. A stunning move at a curious time, the High Court Justice is striking down this law repealing the so-called reasonableness clause. It's an issue Israelis haven't been discussing during wartime, nor have the media. Talk us through this landmark ruling. What can you tell us? Hello, Linda. It's good to be with you. Yes, as you suggested in your opening remark, this clause or this decision actually today by the Supreme Court is very highly under disagreement in the Israeli public. Yet, because of the war, I think, I mean, actually, I could see it from all the replies by the politicians and the leaders. No one is actually going to deal with this decision. It's going to be, it's going to stay the way it is for the coming months, maybe years. I don't know for how long until the war will end and then still we will return to regular to normal life. And again, it might take a lot of time. I mean, you showed the pictures or the videos from last year. It looks as if from a different world. And by the way, the Supreme Court is under fire not only because of the substance of the decision, but also because of making it during the war. So, I mean, some, of course, from the right thing, right wing leaders are saying, I mean, okay, you have your position, you believe you have to cancel the reasonable chapter, but why are you doing it while there is a war? And you know that so many, so many Israelis disagree with you. You should have been much more careful. So, but in any case, it's, I mean, because you were talking before about the politics. To me, the replies, the statements from the politicians, from the ministers after the decision showed me how much the government is stable. Because no one from the rights, no Bankville, Rotman, Smotry, none of them is not even beginning to make any threat, not to leave the government and not to force a change. It's very clear to every man that was the Supreme Court decided it's going to be, we stay the way it is again for quite a long run because now everybody are focused in the war. Well, to that exact point, Yarev Levine, the Justice Minister, the architect of this judicial overhaul accusing the judges of taking into their hands all authorities that in a democracy are split between the three branches of a government. He also says the government will continue to act with restraint and responsibility during the war time. Why now? Why during war when it's such an emotional time for everyone across the political spectrum for the whole country right now? Why do this? It's a very, it's a very good question by Minister Levine. I can tell you that some soldiers who are now in Gaza send me their feelings after the decision and they said we feel that this decision by the Supreme Court hurts us. Why couldn't they wait for a few weeks, for a few months? And why they had to do it just now? And again, in this case, I'm saying that's what soldiers are saying, not politicians. So now it's not for me to decide whether the Supreme Court had to make the decision now or not. To me, I find it offended as well. I must tell you. I mean, in my personal opinion, they shouldn't wait. I have no question about that. But they had their decision. Actually, actually, the president of the Supreme Court, Esther Hayout said that the court has to keep going even during the war and say what it has to say. Okay, that's her point. But somehow it works because of the war, although the decision makes so many people so angry because of the war in the public and in the political arena, just people are saying, we will wait. We don't like what you did. But we will wait. And this problem will solve some time in the future. Maybe I believe in unity government, when it will come, if it will come in probably again in a few months, as if most years. But now again, everyone are focused in the war. And some people regret why the Supreme Court made a decision during the war in so difficult days. Just such an interesting timing issue. Politics has largely been out of the phrase since the start of the war. That clearly is changing as we speak. Thank you for now. We will watch to see what happens. Always appreciate your insights. Ariel Kahana, diplomatic correspondent from Israel. Hayout, newspaper. Thank you for speaking to us. Thank you very much. Thank you, Benito. And still in studio, Shiri Fine Grossman. So, Shiri, what do you make of all of this in terms of the moral? Soldiers on the ground, not so much about the political development. But the fact that this is day 87, we spoke earlier about this high death toll in terms of soldiers who are fighting. Some are getting to come home, but many are staying on inside Gaza. And then you have political shenanigans on the sidelines that, as we said earlier, have for the most part been out of the public arena during the war. Your thoughts? I think if I was a soldier coming back from Gaza, I would look at everything, and everything would look like a bunch of nonsense. And what are we actually dealing with? And I just hope this whole chapter in Israel's history will be able to put to bed very soon and just pass on. And there's a trend now among soldiers that saying to politicians and to the media and everybody saying it's on TikTok. It's like if you don't have something that is unified to say, just don't say anything at all. And that's the spirit that is coming out of the soldiers that are coming out of Gaza. And that gives me a lot of hope and optimism that we can make a change. I think the soldiers who fought in this war will be very crucial to Israel's future and its political future. And the experience they had there and what they will bring when they come back, I think it will be with us for a long time, like we experienced in 1973 with the Omkibu War. Thank you so much. We always appreciate your insights. And with that message, we thank Sherry Fine Grossman. Thank you very much as always for being here in the studio on this day. And with that, we wrap up this edition of Outbreaking News Coverage. I'm Benita Devine. Our rolling coverage continues shortly. Stay tuned. This is I-24 News Breaking News Edition. Israel is in a state of war. Families completely done down in their beds. We have no idea where she is. Our soldiers are fighting on the front lines. But the general perception is something that certainly needs to be fought as well. Benita Levine is on day 87 of the war in what looks like the start of lower intensity operations in the northern Gaza Strip. But it says fighting is likely to continue all year. A U.S. official saying the move to withdraw five brigades from Gaza reflects the success of the Israeli military in dismantling the Hamas terror groups' capabilities there. Several experts suggesting these reservists will rest and prepare to be moved to the northern border with Lebanon at a later stage. The Israeli death toll in the retaliatory ground operation is now at 173. Confirmation that Sergeant First Class in the Reserves, Amihai Israel Yahushua Oster, was killed in fighting inside Gaza. It's more than 12 weeks since the Hamas terror onslaught, in which more than 1,200 people were murdered in southern Israel. Most of them civilians. 129 people remain in captivity inside Gaza. Reports out of Qatar suggesting an Israeli team is set to join a meeting in Cairo to discuss a possible release deal. Meanwhile, Israel's Defense Minister Joav Galant has announced plans for a gradual return for residents of the Kibbutzim in the Gaza envelope in southern Israel close to the border. He and other officials conducting a situational assessment. Let's take a listen. I have now returned from the Gaza strip. I have met the fighters. They fight with their faces towards the enemy and with their backs towards the communities surrounding Gaza. They know their mission. They execute it perfectly so that here in the Gaza envelope, life will return to its course. According to the recommendation of the IDF and the security establishment, we will soon return the communities that are within a range of four to seven kilometers in the north of the Gaza envelope to their homes. A first group of seven settlements has already been determined. The Tkuma directory, who is responsible for this national mission, will also take care of the issue of education and other issues so that a gradual return will be possible in the first stage for the seven settlements and later for all the other settlements. Meanwhile, as the new year begins, a new phase may also be starting in the war. Our senior defense correspondent Jonathan Regev explains in this report. There was no official statement to mark the beginning of the ground operation in Gaza. Neither should we expect one regarding the completion of one stage and the move to the next one, but even without a statement, that move is probably coming. Some of the reserve soldiers will return to their families and to their jobs this week. This will allow a significant relief to the economy and will allow them to gather strength ahead of the coming activities next year as the fighting will continue and we will need them. The reservists are the backbone of the IDF. More than 300,000 of them were recruited during the current war, giving a major boost to the army as in size and strength. No one will say it openly, but if reservists are being released, the meaning is less massive incursions such as the ones seen until now and more surgical operations that demand more precision but probably less firepower. We will need to show plenty of resilience and determination. We will try to release the reservists and bring them back during the coming year for specific periods to carry the burden of what is expected here. A more focused activity on terror enclaves carried out by units operating from Israeli territory and not from Gaza. More airstrikes and artillery and fewer large units inside Gaza, who many times are sitting ducks for Hamas terrorists. This is probably where we're heading as 2024 dawns. And now for the latest on the ground, we go live to our Middle East correspondent, Ariel Osara, and he joins us once again from Southern Israel. So Ariel, of course, that first day of the new year saw Hamas launching that major barrage of rockets towards Central and Southern Israeli cities just after midnight. No one was hurt. And then the idea of ground operation, of course, inside Gaza continuing. And it seems combat fighting will continue for many more months. Bring us up to speed on day one of 2024. Right, Benito. So as you described the year 2024 was kicked off with a barrage of rockets since 23 hours of tense quiet. But obviously there's the knowledge that at any moment Hamas can fire rockets towards either Southern border communities or Central Israel. Pretty much whenever it chooses, albeit the ground operation in Gaza is making that more difficult. Now inside Gaza, the fighting continues across the different axes in the north. We could see flare bombs going off in the northern parts of the Gaza Strip, the area of Beit Chanun and Beit Lahiya, Palestinian reporting of clashes going on in the central parts, in El Borej and Deir El-Balach, as well as Musirat, and obviously in the south, the most significant concentration of fighting in the city of Chanunis. This is also accompanied by significant airstrikes, mainly in the center and southern parts of the Gaza Strip, according to Palestinian reports. Now as this new phase is beginning, according to the Palestinians, it's begun already last week with repositioning of forces. This will raise new challenges as Jonathan raised in his report. I will just note that the IDF announcing just a short while ago that it is investigating a concerning incident of a soldier who suspected of killing a Hamas terrorist while he was in IDF captivity, while he was being interrogated. The IDF military police is investigating the incident and obviously as there are continued or the prolonged operation in Gaza and with almost 100 suspects arrested every day taken to interrogation, unfortunately there is a possibility that incidents like this could happen. But as the IDF said, they're investigating. Thank you so much. Appreciate your coverage on this day, Middle East correspondent Ariel Osaran, live from southern Israel. Thank you, Ariel. And now for more insight, it's a pleasure to welcome to studio Yosef Livner, former Israeli ambassador to New Zealand, Mexico and El Salvador, and our senior diplomatic correspondent Owen Ultiman. Gentlemen, thank you both so much for being here in studio. Pleasure. Ambassador, I'm going to start with you because it's day 87 of a war. The psyche of the nation is still waiting for word. What has happened to the 129 hostages that are inside the Gaza Strip right now? The Red Cross has yet to get to them. Their families are still waiting for confirmation, even proof of life, never mind getting medication to the hostages. We know that there are reports out of Qatar of a possible deal being secured in Cairo, but no confirmation at this hour. Your thoughts on what Israel needs to be doing right now to prioritize getting those hostages back home? There's no doubt in my mind that liberating those hostages is one of the main concerns of Israel at this moment. And I think the fact that there's so many rumors concerning discussions between us and go between either Egyptians or Qatari mediators is a proof of the concern of Israel and the will and the determination to try and find a solution that will bring back those 129 kidnapped Israelis. This is, I mean, across the board, this is the most important issue now on the table. I'm going to bring you in here, Owen, because we've been talking about this since the abductions on the 7th of October, and we're hearing more and more hearing reports from the hostages that have got home about the conditions inside Gaza right now. As we start a new year on the calendar, at least still the families are waiting for some kind of confirmation. Your sense as the meetings conducted continue right now, potentially in Cairo, as we speak, about the way it is being dealt with by the Israeli teams to make sure that those people get home and get home safely as soon as possible. Well, I think the biggest obstacle at this point, Pineda, is that two of the key tools that would presumably get these talks moving are for different reasons, not really on the table. I mean, one of the tools was this idea of a pause, right? Which was so central to the deal that we had back in November, right? Where you give Hamas a pause at that point of about a week, and it's of real value to Hamas. As I explained in our broadcast before, in the context of October and November, this pause as a tool or as a key, if you will, to unlock the negotiation made a lot of sense because the fighting was incredibly high intensity. There were very strong incremental gains made by the Israeli military against Hamas, hour in, hour out, day in, day out. So if you give Hamas the breathing room of a week, right, where they don't get that kind of pressure and the Israeli army isn't making that kind of instrumental gain, then that's of high value for Hamas. Not to mention the fact that they had these hopes that you stop the fighting for a week, you win a year, you win 10 years, right? The war simply would stop because Israel would be under pressure, the dynamics wouldn't be there for the war to restart. Well, that obviously proved to be false, right? As we know, as we know sitting here in January 1st that Hamas was certainly wrong about that. And in terms of the pause, we're now, as we all know, moving toward this more lower intensity phase of the conflict, right? And even without that, I think the sense over the past few weeks is that the pace of the military's gains on the ground just isn't what it was in December or now in January, what it was in October or November. So in that kind of world, if you're not facing the same kind of incremental losses every day that Hamas was facing in October and November, then this idea of a one or two week pause doesn't have as much value for you, right? Because you're not gaining as much by gaining that break. So that tool doesn't seem to be helping us. And second, the tool that's been the key to past hostage deals is the freeing of Palestinian prisoners. But Hamas doesn't seem to be all that interested or at least see that as having much urgency. Even though if you go back to October 7th itself in that morning, when Hamas puts out a statement explaining why they unleash what they call the alexa flood, they talk about two objectives. And one is freeing the prisoners and they just don't seem that interested. So without those, it's hard to really see what it is that Hamas could receive that would incentivize it to free the hostages that would at the same time be something Israel would be willing to give. Because obviously stopping the war from Israel's perspective is simply not an option. Ambassador, your thoughts not only on what is happening right now and A, the goal of eliminating Hamas, B, the goal of getting the hostages back home as soon as possible, but also what the day after looks like in Gaza. And the name Tony Blair has been floated as somebody who might have a role in some kind of mediation situation and also in finding up what might happen or creating avenues for what might happen for Gazans who want to leave the enclave, your thoughts on that role, something which the Tony Blair Institute is denying is in fact the case. Nonetheless, your thoughts? Well, first of all, they did not eat very vehemently. They called it an outright lie. I don't know. I think that we ought to start thinking about the day after. Otherwise, we're going to get stuck with Gaza, two million people. You have to feed them. You have to build homes. You have to make sure that people can live. And I think that this is not something that Israel wants to take upon itself. I think that eventually the Israeli government will have to come to grips with the issue of what are we going to see the day after the hostilities come to an end. And I think that serious people will probably start pushing for at least some sort of analysis, some and bring up thoughts concerning what it is that we want to see in Gaza. We know that we don't want to see Hamas. We know that we want the Kibbutz team along the border to live in safety. Make sure that they do not face something that they've lived through on October 7th. We know these facts. We know that we don't want to take upon ourselves the responsibility for two million or more than two million residents in Gaza. So yes, obviously time will come when the Israeli cabinet or the war cabinet or the limited war cabinet and apparently earlier today there was rumored that sometime this week they're going to take this issue and start discussing what may happen the day after. A couple points. First on the Tony Blair report, the original report was from Israel's Channel 12. And to talk about Blair coming to Israel and meeting with Prime Minister Netanyahu with other officials, talking about a host of a range of issues on the day after including the states in the Arab world that would absorb Gazans. That's all it said. That's all the report said. One way of reading this is, and I think you're nodding because you see this, right? Tony Blair talked about a whole range of issues. And one of them is if there are a small number of Gazans who wish to leave, that they want to find another place in the Arab world to live, then there would be states that would take them in. Not that this was a central part of the plan or there was some plan for a mass movement of people from Gaza. But that's one reading. The other reading is, in fact, this is another instance, Israel moving forward with the plans you've heard from people like Itamar Ben-Givir and Bethel Smotrich and the far right in Israel. Of course, also ministers in the Israeli government not necessarily speaking for the government or not speaking for the government. But this was part of this grand plan for a kind of voluntary or involuntary ethnic cleansing of Gaza. That more extreme reading is the reading taken, for example, by Usam Zamblad, the Palestinian ambassador to Britain. Because this was the interest of Palestinian government and they don't like Tony Blair and they certainly, and one can understand why, don't like the idea of some kind of plan to go hundreds of thousands, if not millions of Gazans to leave the Gaza Strip. So they took the most extreme reading of one sentence in this report that could possibly be taken. And in a sense, the report is talking about maybe talking about one thing and Tony Blair's denial talking about something completely different, right? Where the truth may be that this was one small part of a larger discussion and not about some kind of mass movement of peoples, which it's become clear for many reasons, is not something that's going to happen. And probably not something the Israeli government should want to happen. And certainly not something that the Israeli government should be pushing to happen. As for the day after, I disagree. Listen, we've had a robust debate in Israel for months, about what the day after should look like. Benjamin Netanyahu, at least in recent weeks, has been very clear, at least in general terms, about what he sees happening. The Israeli military patrolling the ground and some sort of local civilian Palestinian authority providing civilian needs. You can say it's a good plan or not, because it's a realistic plan or not. You can say it's fully fleshed out. It's obviously not. But as a concept that's been put on the table, it's there and beyond that, a robust debate in Israeli society about what should happen. Again, the formal discussion is inside the government and in which forum. But I do think that there's been a lot of movement on this and the concepts and the options have been debated widely. Ambassador, you're nodding. Yeah, I'm nodding because I think that we should stay away from any idea of promoting a migration of people from Gaza. Because it'll put us in a hot seat in the eyes of the world. And this is something that I don't think that we want to be associated with. As for the discussions, I think I read today or heard it today that last week, there was going to be a debate in the cabinet and the war cabinet and the prime minister postponed it and apparently it's coming back sometime this week. So obviously people in government are concerned. They know that this is something that we need to discuss. We need to analyze and eventually come up with some sort of an idea. It will help us basically with our American allies. It will help us in the eyes of the international community because it will show that Israel is not only interested in defeating Hamas but also thinking about a positive plan for the future. Certainly is also an interesting question when exactly is the day after because we keep on hearing that the fighting is going to continue for many months if not a year. I've been saying for weeks that the idea of the day after with the capital T, capital D, capital A isn't a helpful description of what's happening, which is going to be much more of a phased process. And one wonders whether that phased process in a sense Benita has already started is Hamas, the governing authority in the northern part of the Gaza Strip and large parts of it. And if not, then in a sense the day after is already here, at least in some parts of the Gaza Strip and in some ways. So this is going to be phased in. It's going to have to be and it's going to be a transition every element of the war, the day after in Gaza, the day after in Israeli politics, a major point of discussion in Israel over the last 24 hours or even over the last five hours and in the day after in many other ways. So it's going to be phased in and the question is not for some far off day, but it's a question that I think is going to start to be to be very present. Certainly something we are going to unpack in more detail in a very short while, lots to discuss. Stay with us gentlemen, because there has been a dramatic rise in anti-Semitism since the Hamas terror attacks on the 7th of October. It's been felt in major parts of the globe, many around the world expressing strong views on the war and its impact on the broader Middle East. More in this report. Hamas. Certainly Hamas and Iran backing them. The Hamas started it by invading civilian people of Israel, but then Israel is taking it to a level that is simply not acceptable. Each side has its own reasons for the war. I don't think there is someone specific to be blamed for. It's a complex situation that has been in problems for almost seven decades. I think it's difficult to say who is to blame. I think it's not about a blame. I don't blame. It's about finding a solution that those two groups of people can live side by side on the same land, because the Israelis have no right to say it's my land. The Palestinians were there first. I'm more on the side of the Palestinians. I don't know who is to blame. It's hard to live. No, they are not justified. They should not be killing. Not at all. Not at all. Certainly not. Well, I think they felt oppressed and they wanted to get back. But again, what they did absolutely wrong. So I would say they started it. I don't necessarily think attacking anyone is ever justified and killing of any people is never justified. I can understand maybe why they felt that that was their only option. I would always wish that that's never what it had come to. So I wouldn't say justified, but I wouldn't say I'm surprised that that's what they resorted to. Of course. Of course. Israel is under existential threat and will not survive unless they destroy her mass. Every country, which is a sovereign nation, has a right to defend itself. They have their reasons for it. Like I said, Hamas started it by kidnapping children, women, and, you know, the atrocities that they carried out. Very, very unfortunate. I think it's justified to take action, but I think it's going over the top now. It was provoked. It is giving a proportional response to a certain extent. But it should stop. Hamas, as I said, has done it, but doesn't mean that entire other people should be punished for the crimes of few people. They're killing innocent children and women. A conflict that is causing the death of children and women, bombing of hospitals, it is not worth killing innocent civilians. If you have a problem with a country, target the military strategic areas. You know, when you're bombing a hospital and then you find two guns stored in the basement and go bombing terrorists, that's a hard, that's a hard sort of line to sell really. You can justify anything, whether on whom you vetted first, who has the right to learn what the Bible says, you can justify anything. But the one thing that you can't justify is the blatant loss of human life. Before anything else is the humanity that should come first. The latest thing comes to an end, the batteries. A range of views in that report, still with me in studio, Yosef Levnev, former Israeli ambassador to New Zealand, Mexico and El Salvador, our senior diplomatic correspondent Owen Ultiman, ambassador. We don't have much time left, but your insights on what we just saw there. Look, this thing looks less worse than the situation itself, because we've been witnessing mass demonstrations against Israel, in which we were exposed to outside hatred and a lot of ignorance. And ignorance plus hatred is a very volatile combination. And I think a work has cut out for us. All Israelis and Jewish communities across the world will have to come to grips with this situation. Owen, your thoughts. I see a variety of views in a variety of parts of the world. A reminder to us how much this conflict touches people in so many corners of the world, who have no direct connection here, but there's something about the way this conflict resonates emotionally. That thing is really hard. There's a weight upon our shoulders here in Israel that we feel we don't deserve. We're just here trying to live our lives, trying to defend our country as best as we can, doing some things right, maybe doing other things wrong. But the idea that we have to play to this grand global audience, everyone who sees this conflict through their own eyes and in their own ways, and yet their opinions have to affect what we do is something that I think people here find devilishly hard to deal with and very frustrating. And once again, Hamas conducted this onslaught on the 7th of October. They filmed it. I urge anyone with questions to look at verified footage of what happened on that day. Everybody is entitled to their own opinion, but please take a look at the verified images, the reporting that is verified, and make sure that you are in the loop and seeing the real developments as and when they happen. Senior Diplomatic Correspondent Owen Altman, thank you so much. Former Israeli Ambassador to New York.