 Hi everybody, it's John Farr back with our third installment of Virtual Classic Tuesdays brought to you by the Bedford Playhouse in beautiful Bedford, New York. Tonight we cover Toons of Glory directed by Ronald Neame and starring Alec Guinness and John Mills. You know, there's certain special movies out there that never quite get the attention and adulation they deserve and I think Toons of Glory is one such film. When it was released in 1960 it ran counter to what was in vogue at the time in Britain which were those gritty black and white kitchen sink dramas of working class life. Movies like Look Back in Anger and Saturday Night and Sunday Morning that made stars out of Richard Burton and Albert Finney. Well, in the midst of all that, here was a military drama about an elite Scottish regiment shot in color but set mostly indoors and without a single battle scene. Toons of Glory began its life as the first novel of a 28 year old Scotsman named James Kenoway. Kenoway had served in a Scottish regiment called the Gordon Highlanders and drew from his own experiences and crafting this tale of two diametrically different officers competing for the loyalty of their men. Now Kenoway started adapting his book into a screenplay for Ealing Studios with Jack Hawkins slated to star as Jock Sinclair. Now that would have been interesting. However the studio had issues with his first draft and by the time he came back with revisions Hawkins was unavailable and Ealing had basically lost interest. Enter Ronald Neame who by this point in his career was an established director. He'd started out as a cinematographer and then become a highly successful producer in partnership with David Lean, best remembered today as the director of Lawrence of Arabia. Ronald Neame was basically born into the film industry. His mother was a famous silent film actress named Ivy Close and he got his first job at 18 working the camera for Alfred Hitchcock in a movie called Blackmail. You know they used to say Hollywood was a small town but it was immense compared to the British film industry of the time which resembled a small tight-knit club. Unlike Hollywood where people might be working together for the first time on a given film on tunes of glory most everyone had a history together in particular the major players and the history that existed with Ronald Neame, Alec Guinness and John Mills also had to include David Lean. First Ronald Neame produced the film that put Alec Guinness on the map 15 years before an adaptation of Charles Dickens Great Expectations from 1946 directed by Lean. Great Expectations was the production that first paired John Mills and Alec Guinness. At that point Mills who was six years older than Guinness was already an established star. Neame had first met Mills in 1942 while serving a cinematographer on Noel Coward's war drama in which we serve. Mills co-starred in that film which also gave David Lean his first chance to direct up to that point he'd been an editor. Anyhow after the success of Great Expectations David Lean and Ronald Neame decided to do another Dickens adaptation. Their Oliver Twist released in 1948 featured Alec Guinness again as Fagan, unrecognizable and heavy makeup. Well this role cemented Guinness' stardom and opened the doors to a series of classic comedies at E-Link Studios. Fast forward nearly a decade to 1958, Alec Guinness is at a career peak having just one best actor at the Oscars for playing the upright Colonel Nicholson in David Lean's war epic, The Bridge on the River Kwai. He can now do most anything he wants and what he wants is a change of pace. Now by this point Neame has been directing for about a decade. In fact he'd already collaborated with Guinness on a rather tame comedy called The Promoter back in 1952. Now Guinness was reaching out to Neame about adapting a novel called The Horse's Mouth, a humorous tale about a highly eccentric painter. Neame knew the book already. Actor Claude Reigns, best remembered as Captain Renaud in Casablanca, had already approached him about doing a film adaptation. Well Neame had passed on it, but now Alec wanted to play it and even do something he'd never done, which is write the screenplay. Well with the great Alec Guinness so fully invested in the project this time around, Ronald Neame said yes. The resulting film of The Horse's Mouth featured one of Guinness' most inspired performances including the actor and Oscar nomination for best screenplay would be actually the only screenplay credit he'd ever receive. Well that production had been a happy experience that made its director and star want to work together again. So when tunes of glory entered Ronald Neame's orbit shortly thereafter, he loved the story. And at first thought Guinness would be perfect for Colonel Barrow, the uppercrust by the book officer. To his disappointment, Alec wasn't interested. It felt way too close to another currently just played, Colonel Nicholson in Bridge on the River Kwai. However, if Ronnie would let him play the louder showier role of Major Jackson Claire, he would be all in. Now Guinness would really be playing against Type Here, which was both a challenge and a risk. But Neame trusted his friend to the degree that if Guinness felt he could pull it off, that was good enough for him. But now who to play Colonel Barrow? Alec Guinness didn't hesitate in answering, what about Johnny Mills? Well Neame countered that Mills was known for playing lower deck characters meaning working class types to which Guinness responded in his deadpan way, but he is an actor after all. Well he was indeed enjoying a busy career while watching his younger daughter Hailey Mills become a child star. Well when Neame reached out to him, Mills quickly accepted. He relished the chance to work once again with his old compatriots. The director then rounded out the mostly male cast with a fabulous group of character actors including Dennis Price as Major Charles Scott and Gordon Jackson as Captain Jimmy Cairns. Back in the small world department, Dennis Price and Alec Guinness had co-starred in perhaps the best of all the Ealing comedies, 1949's Kind Hearts and Coronets. Price specialized in playing slightly blasé upper-cross characters. And watching the film again I was struck by how good he is in this. Gordon Jackson was a familiar, highly prolific actor who'd go on to appear in movies like The Great Escape and The Ip Crest File. He'd also win an Emmy Award in 1976 for his role in the TV series Upstairs Downstairs. Finally Duncan McRae is memorable as Pipe Major McClane. Beyond his acting chores, he was assigned to instruct the cast on the proper etiquette for wearing a kilt, including not spreading one's legs too far apart while seated. To play Jock's former mistress Mary, Neame cast Kay Walsh, a superb actress. She'd appeared with Guinness before in Oliver Twist and more recently in The Horse's Mouth. And she, Neame, and Guinness would also reunite ten years later for the musical Scrooge, starring Albert Finney in the title role. Walsh also happened to be the ex-wife of David Lean. See what a small world this is? Finally there was the key role of Jock Sinclair's daughter and for this they chose an unknown 19-year-old actress named Susanna York. Later she'd recall how quickly it all happened. She'd been summoned to London for a screen test and had run lines with Alec Guinness himself. He had gently counseled her not to push so hard. Returning home by train, she remembered staring out the window and saying to herself in shock and wonderment, I just performed a scene with Alec Guinness. Well the actress quickly became a star appearing in movies like Tom Jones and A Man For All Seasons. Now the opening of the film depicts Sterling Castle which was the headquarters of the Argyle and Sutherland Highlanders. The original intent was to shoot within the castle. But when the regimental commander saw the cover of the tunes of Glory Paperback with Jock's mistress sitting on his lap he was deeply offended and withdrew his permission. Well after much begging he did allow Neem to shoot the exterior of the castle but now sets would have to be used for interior scenes. Early on in the shooting schedule Neem realized that John Mills' voice sounded a bit too soft. He asked Mills if he'd ever met Bernard Montgomery, one of the top generals of World War II. Well Mills in fact had met him. Neem then suggested he build in some of Montee's voice and mannerisms into his performance. Mills was forever grateful for this piece of direction. Seen today, Tunes of Glory is a master class in screen acting. It's hard to overpraise Guinness' performance here. A contained, extremely private man Alec Guinness once said of himself, Flamboyance doesn't suit me, I enjoy being elusive. Though a gifted character actor fully capable of disappearing into his various roles he often played quiet restrained characters more in tune with his own natural persona. With Jock Sinclair this actor who usually avoided Flamboyance had to be flamboyant in capital letters and I think he brings it off flawlessly. In particular the way he expresses his deep-seated irrational anger towards Barrow evokes the class resentment at the heart of the story. Essentially Jock is a man who had to sweat and toil for his position. By contrast Barrow's noble birth literally destines him for the rank and assignment he holds. So yes Alec Guinness is amazing here but John Mills is every bit as good and a part that's just as challenging. In portraying a man consumed with self-doubt as he confronts a job he's dreamed of having since childhood it would have been easy to overdo his gradual disintegration but Mills underplays it superbly. Really the genius of the script lies in the fact that neither of the two central characters is completely good or evil in various times we like and dislike both of them. Ultimately it's this prevailing shade of gray rather than black and white that makes tunes of glory so fascinating. On the film's release Bosley Crowther in The New York Times praised the performances in the script stating that quote this is a picture that gets around to saying some things about military traditions that haven't been said so aptly and eloquently for years end quote. The British Academy of Film and Television Arts known as BAFTA nominated tunes of glory for best film and Neem, Guinness, Mills and Kennaway were also nominated for their contributions. Kennaway's script was also Oscar nominated and at the Venice Film Festival John Mills won the prestigious Volpe Cup for his performance. A decade later Mills would win a best supporting actor Oscar for his role in yet another David Lean film Ryan's Daughter. Ronald Neem would continue working on and off for the next three decades. Having negotiated a piece of the profits for directing 1972's wildly successful The Poseidon Adventure he never needed to worry about money again. Neem's son Christopher would also enter the family business becoming a film producer and Christopher's son Gareth Neem would do the same producing a rather popular franchise called Downton Abbey. Finally in 1977 Alleghenous would find new fame and fortune playing Obi-Wan Kenobi in the original Star Wars a film whose success he never fully understood. The money was very good though. He took a lot more satisfaction in portraying spy master George Smiley in two BBC miniseries Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy and Smiley's People. Next month we will transition to a bi-monthly schedule so we'll be doing these every other Tuesday. On May 12th join me to discuss another classic screwball comedy 1941's The Lady Eve written and directed by Preston Sturgis starring Barbara Stanwyck and Henry Fonda. Please mark your calendars. Till then have fun and stay safe. It's John Farr. Well here I am. Are we on? You are on. I am on. Wonderful. Hello everybody. I was watching myself. I was quite, I thought I was terrific. God, I've said no, I'm sorry. I sound like the president now. A big pardon. I have a few questions here and then I'm hoping that you all may have a few additional questions. And I think the first one is fascinating. And here it is. Although we are more or less led to sympathize with Alleghenous's character and view. Oh, I'm sorry and view John Mills as a nitpicking prig. Isn't Mills really the better soldier? Well, that's what I think is so fascinating about this movie. Because I didn't really sympathize with Alleghenous's character myself as much as I did with John Mills, this character. I feel terrible for this man. He's in an impossible position and he's ill equipped to deal with it. So it's so funny the way a great movie can have so many prisms that you can leave and somebody says, well, I felt for, you know, I was on his side and I was on the other guy's side. That's what's great about it. When I talk about how there's no, there's no, neither of these men is evil. They are in a situation that's extremely destructive. And it's really a series of actions that escalate to a conclusion that nobody intends. So there's this nuance to it that I find very interesting. I actually, it's funny because I always thought, oh yeah, Alleghenous is so wonderful in this, but he's not. I don't really like his character very much. He's a bit of a blowhard and he's got a lot of anger, a lot of unresolved anger. And boy does he directed that this man who is, is going down. Now, you know, the whole thing is that Guinness character can't see just how emotionally vulnerable Mills is because he seems like such a prank and such a, you know, upper-crust officer. But that's why the John Mills performance is so good because you really do see all the way through that he's, he's not comfortable. He's not, he's not having a good time. And it gets worse and worse. And the ending, which is so for me at least is very, very bold. It doesn't come as a, it comes as a shock, which it's intended to, but you believe it because he's been totally emasculated and humiliated and his position is untenable. So that's a long way of answering it. But I honestly, this time out, certainly I was more sympathetic to John Mills than I was to Alec. So just so shows how you can see things differently. Okay. Next question. Can you talk about Alec Guinness's character and bridge on the river Kwai versus tunes of glory? Well, yes. I mean, we've just seen Jocs and Claire. Colonel Nicholson is basically a man who has to hold on to his officers bearing and his discipline, ramrod strict discipline, or he will go mad. So whereas Jocs and Claire is, is a soldier soldier in that, you know, he gets up in the morning with a hangover and knows how to salute and, and do his rounds. He's still a man's man. He likes to party likes to have fun. He enjoys the camaraderie. You don't sense that about Colonel Nicholson. Colonel Nicholson is more like Barrow, which is exactly why Alec Guinness didn't want to do the part because he would have been repeating himself. And so it's a very, very different part. And indeed, as I think I mentioned in the talk, my talk is that Alec Guinness hadn't really played a part like this before. This was not his persona. He tended to play very wily, quiet, contained characters. This big, you know, bluff Scotsman who likes to drink whiskey and cavort with the ladies. I mean, this was as far away from anything Alec Guinness had ever done as you can think of. And the fact that he does it so well and brings it off so well, well, he knew he could do it. And so did Ronald Neame. Like Alec, you say you can do it. I trust you. You just have, you know, you just want an Oscar. So you can, you know, let's see what you can do. And of course he does, he does it very well. So, but they are very, very different characters. I hope that answers the question. Oh, now somebody admired the actor, John Fraser, who plays the Pipesman, who's the boyfriend of Susanna York. And so now the question is, what other movies was he in? We remember, well, obviously he was not a very big star, but he did have a roughly five year period where he did some interesting films. In fact, he won an award that same year. His prior film was something called The Trials of Oscar Wilde, which is one of the first movies ever to talk about homosexuality. And it starred Peter Finch, who was a network, starred Peter Finch as Oscar Wilde, and Fraser plays Lord Alfred Douglas, rather different part from what he, what he is here. But obviously he was a very handsome guy. And so that sort of, he had a big, he was like the big hope in 1960. And then he was in El Cid, which is a very good gladiator picture with Charles Neston and Sophia Loren the following year. And then his big year was 65. That was his peak. And he did two movies that year that I really recommend. One is called Operation Crossbow, which nobody knows. It's a war picture with George Papard and Sophia Loren is the star, but she's on screen for about 15 minutes. But it's a good, it's a very good movie. Trevor Howard's in it. And then the more famous movie and role is he's in Repulsion. And some of you may remember that movie. It was Roman Planski's first English language film, and it's a twisted movie. Captain Donov plays this very repressed woman who's having a psychotic break and she kills all sorts of people. I mean, it's great. I love the movie, but it's dark. So he was in that. I'm sure he was a victim. I'm trying to remember his character in that. But yeah, that is John Fraser. He is still alive. He's still with us and he's going to be turning 90 next year. So that's John Fraser. And so now, if there are any other questions. There are we have a couple of questions that have been submitted. The first one. What about the psychological slash psychiatric implications of the film. Sinclair has anger issues and Mills is obviously vulnerable. Can the film be viewed as a look at male stereotypes, i.e. the military and deep psychological disorders with the notion with the follow up that the damage that a sense of honor, quote unquote, honor can do to a person. Dan, that's deep. Do you remember when Colonel Barrow talks about basically being waterboarded. So these are both men who have seen combat. And, and Major Jackson Claire was decorated for it came up through the ranks for it. Mills was going to get there anyway but he too has suffered he was taken as a prisoner of war. So you're dealing with two characters who've seen that from different angles. Sinclair kind of glories in it Mills wears it almost like an open wound he's so he's so repressed. And the, that notion of his obligation that he's had since since his birth to take this post that's been in his family and do it honor is is weighing on him so heavily that then these other factors are coming in with again is this tremendous anger and resentment at his no bless religion has you know sense of entitlement that it it forms this toxic cocktail. And if that answers the question but I just that's why I find the movie so fascinating because to me it's so believable. You understand why these two characters who, you know, in other circumstances might have been okay with each other but under those circumstances, given what they're where they are then and what where they came from. They're going to have a deadly conflict. You did answer the question. Oh, well thank you because I could go on for an hours for hours. No, no. It was we asked and the person who asked it says you have answered it so that's, thank you. All right, we have a couple more questions. Is it possible that both Mills and Guinness characters are failures. Since he forces the leader of his unit to commit suicide, and he shames the unit and himself. So are they, I guess the question that it's asking is, is it possible we can see them both as failures. I don't see Mills as a failure. I see Mills as a victim. I see him as a very unlucky man who goes to a post that he thinks he's inherited at exactly the wrong time, with exactly the wrong person there who's going to make it as difficult for him as possible. And, and he is a victim. Guinness. He's a failure, he's a failure, but he's a failure in, in a way that where you sympathize, because he does have this anger that he's carried his whole life. That is the class struggle in Britain and it's not a lot of working class folks have it, I'm sure have had it towards the, you know, the upper crust in Britain because the class divisions are just so stark there. They don't understand where he's coming from to but he basically tortures Mills to death. I mean this is to me there's no question about it he's torturing, he's humiliating and torturing and he's doing it because that's all that's left to him because he can't, he can't run the regiment, because of, you know, where he was born. I mentioned this, you just touched on a minute about the class structure in Britain so this next question is, do you think that Scott switch from his camaraderie with Sinclair to the support of his new commanding officer is persuasive. Is it motivated by class orientation or by military discipline. It's a very interesting question. I suspect a bit of both. I suspect Scott is a, is a guy who likes the military because he can take orders and go along with the status quo and position himself with the least fuss. That is a that is a very he is, I mean Dennis price is so good in that role he's such a scumbag excuse my language, but you really he is just venomous and cold. And yet there's something inside of him, where he regrets what happens but he's the one who delivers the coup de grace. And, but he's the kind of guy who doesn't, he'll cause the conflict, then he's going to run out the door before he's caught in the crossfire. What he wants to do is get along and go with the prevailing wind and get through and be left alone and have a drink and, you know, the next day comes I mean he is a, this is not a courageous character. And he's a weasel and, and yet there's a touch of humanity to him. And that's why Dennis price was perfect for it. I'm glad people noticed that character because he, he, I hadn't seen the film in some time and it really hit me how good he was. This next question is, what do you consider Alec Guinness's best film, how do you feel about our man in Havana. So now, Alec Guinness's best film, it's like saying what's the best movie ever made. I think it's very hard to argue with either kind hearts and cornets or bridge on the river quiet. But he did lots of others, including this one I mean he was just so masterly and whatever he did. He was such a beautiful actor he had such a beautiful voice. He was so expressive, and yet he never overacted that that but those are the two that I would mention. I think bridge on the river quiet is a movie that you can see, you know, once every few months and it's a joy, particularly if you see it on a big screen. And kind hearts and cornets is everything that that Peter Sellers did in Dr. Strangelove. Now he just took on all these different characters and did it, you know, knocked it out of the park with Dennis Price as the sort of the straight man, the sinister straight man. That's another movie everyone should go and see again as kind hearts and cornets. Can't do too many of these British films because we have America think about that. Did I miss part of the question? No, no, you answered it. Well, the person who asked it was voting for Iron Man and Havana. Oh, Iron Man and Havana, I think is good. In fact, I want to see it again. You know, it got mixed reviews. But it was partly because the people who did it did the third man. I mean the third man with Orson Welles and Joseph Cotton and Carol Reed directed it, same guy. So our man in Havana has always been compared to it. And I don't think it's quite the movie the third man is, but I'd like to see it again, Ernie Kovacs. I mean, my God, he died about it a year after a few months after that movie was made. I'm interested to see it again and I'm a big Phantom Noel Cowards. We mentioned him before in terms of in which we serve, which was this incredible propaganda war film with John Mills directed by David Leen with Ronald name as the cinematographer. So, you know, that sort of small world of the British film cinema was amazing in those days. So this one is more about you're talking about Britain versus America. So, doesn't the conflict between Sinclair and Barrow and their personal crises reflect the post war decline and collapse of the British Empire, meaning, meaning that those who were on top are now in second or third place or they've been reduced. That's a very interesting observation and it may have a lot of merit but I hadn't really thought about it. I thought about it more in terms of these are both warriors quote unquote in peacetime. And when you come back from war, I mean this is supposed to take place and I'm not sure I made this clear but I think it's pretty clear that we're dealing in in the immediate post war, World War two period. That's when this is supposed to take place. So, that's the other part of this is so fascinating this come this combustibility. Well, yeah, they've just been in combat for five years and they come back and they go to their regiment, you know, their regimental castle and they're supposed to act like everything's normal. You know, it's, it's just another but that's a that's a very interesting point I got to do a little more thinking on that one. Next question is do we know what David lean thought of tunes of glory. I don't, but I'll tell you something. I would bet any amount of money that he liked it and admired it. I just would bet any amount of money a all his best friends are in it. Be it. It's as good as it. I mean, it's just such a good movie. And it's got a literate script. So now I bet you lean was a fan and in fact now that you mentioned it, I will go to my friend our friend Bob Harris who's on the Playhouse board and ask him because I bet you Bob knows how David lean felt about that movie. And Bob knows tunes of glory very well. So, but I would be shocked if lean had anything other than praise for it. Okay, the next question is wasn't Mills character of failure by moving from the court martial to handling the incident internally, thereby losing any authority he might have had. That depends on how you look at it. It's funny because the book supposedly didn't have. The book had him not bending. And that made him less sympathetic. My view of it is that Mills was trying to find a way to one last grasp at trying to find an accommodation where he could still keep the job and and deal with Sinclair and that Sinclair just might be grateful to him. Well, of course, exactly the opposite Sinclair has only contempt for him, which is frankly one of the reasons that Sinclair character so hateful, because he should have been grateful. You know this man is basically saying, hey, I'll give you know, let's work, I will work this out if we can, you know, if we can get on with it and have, you know, and but Mills should have been much more. So this character must should have been much more assertive about saying, you know, I'm expecting things from you, although it probably wouldn't matter, because Sinclair had such an instinctive contempt for him, and he was blinded by it. And then, when Mills dies, it all comes crashing down and he realizes what he's done, and he realizes why he's done it. And it's, it's crushing. And he has a breakdown. I mean, he's basically having a breakdown there at the end. This next one is not really a question so much as a comment that you should put the horse's mouth into the top three of Guinness's roles. You know what? I need to see that movie again. It's a really quirky movie. It's kooky. He is plays a really weird character. Dan, you know, have you seen the horse's mouth? I have. It's been a while, but I've seen it. You know what I'm talking about? I mean, he is, this is a very eccentric fellow, this painter. And it's sort of weird humor. And I didn't always get it. I mean, I sort of respected it, but it didn't just, you know, wow me, but I need to see it again. And in fact, it is in my queue. I have the blue ray. I'm going to watch it. Can you just state one more time where was it filmed? What was the barracks and where it was located? The Scottish and Argyle Highlanders. The Sterling Castle. You mean where Toons of Glory was filmed? Yes. Where was it? Where was it filmed? Exteriors in Sterling Castle, interiors on a set near London. This is a good one. The United States War College sees Toons of Glory as a modern take on a classic film about leadership. What do you think of that assessment? I think it's a very good assessment. And I saw it. A object lesson in leadership doesn't mean it's showing great leadership. It can also be showing pretty poor leadership. And I think that what you're seeing here is pretty poor leadership. More specifically, the mill's character is unable to lead. He doesn't have the capacity to lead. And frankly, he's not given a chance to lead. It's not like he's welcomed. But how, I think what they're doing is saying, what, if you were a great leader, and if you were strong and dynamic, how would you have turned the tables on Jackson Clair and instill the discipline and followed through? And that goes back to our previous discussion about when he caves, when mill's character caves, should we have contempt for him? I didn't. I know. I didn't. But others might. So that makes it very interesting because leadership is about, I'm taking over a regiment with a second in command that all the men love. And I have got to take control without making this, without humiliating this man, but I have to make sure that he understands he's got to go along. That's leadership. Anyway, what do you see about connections to be made between tunes of glory and the cane mutiny in the sense of you have a commander who's relieved of command? Oh, that's a really interesting question. I hadn't even thought of those two, those two movies together. The cane mutiny is, I love the cane mutiny, but it's a much, this is Hollywood, this is big Hollywood. I mean, there's no shading or subtlety to the cane mutiny, really. I love the movie. Don't get me wrong. And Bogart is amazing, but there's a subtlety to tunes of glory with John Mills. That's why I say he underplays it with, with, with Quig, Bogey and Quig, he basically loses it on during that typhoon. And then in the court, he loses it and really loses it. So, I mean, this is no, you know, there's no way around it. He is, you know, I just, you know, so I see it as, yeah, I see it as the pressure of leadership or responsibility of someone who has been regretting for a certain period of time, but this, there's a, there's a spark that lights the flame where they really go down. And I love both movies, but one is very Hollywood, very big and, and this is very much the British way, which is a little bit more strained, but very interesting to compare those two films. Okay, that was actually the last question we had. I just want to thank everybody for coming. Thank you, John. Just for those of you who are interested, we have a couple of things coming up later this week we have tomorrow night, an author talk area law and it was written by code name Aleen will be doing a Q&A, you can get information from that on our website. And Thursday night we are back to doing trivia online. So that's coming back as well. So if you are interested in these programs and you enjoy John's talks, please consider visiting our website and making a donation so we can go from eventually being virtual playhouse back to being the bed for playoffs and seeing these films on the big screen like we were always hoping they would be. So thank you very much. Thanks again, John, and we hope to see you in a couple of weeks for the lady Eve. Thanks for coming. Thank you everybody night. Is that okay. You're good we're going to end it right now. Thanks, John.