 Larry, maybe thanks for your time. We might start by having you tell us a little bit about your background. Well, my background. I'm Canadian by birth. I grew up in Canada, educated in Canada, and joined the military out of university. I spent 20 years in the Canadian military in a variety of roles, finishing off as a legal officer in the Canadian military before transferring down to take a position up in the New Zealand Defence Force, where I spent seven years doing a variety of positions as well, legal positions in the Defence Force, before joining the International Committee of the Red Cross, the ICRC, in 2004, about six and a half years ago. That's quite a fork in the road almost, Larry. What prompted the decision? Well, it's interesting. I'd always wanted to go to law school, but I joined the military in an operational capacity as an Armour Corps officer. When the opportunity presented itself to be funded to go back to school, I seized the opportunity and went back. And of course, after getting into the military legal business, I really took to it. I enjoyed it, so I was doing a variety of things. You talk about Forks in the Road. When it came time to leave the Canadian forces, I had the option of going into a private law practice when the opportunity came up to go to New Zealand and I just couldn't see myself doing that. So I decided to come to New Zealand and carry on with the military side of things. As I further specialised in international law and sort of for overseas deployments for the military, I lost any real desire to go into a private practice and billable hours and chase ambulances and that kind of thing. So you get quite specialised. So yeah, that was sort of the decision-making process. So it would be fair to say, Larry, that you're a people person and not a numbers man. It never really has been about numbers. I would have left this business a long time ago if it had been about making money. So I enjoy the work. It's exciting work. I'm not an office person really, so I enjoy the adventure. Having been involved in peacekeeping, operations of different types, I enjoy that type of work. Maybe it's part of my Canadian heritage, but I really enjoy the perception of what peacekeepers are supposed to be doing when they go into a difficult context, a difficult country. And I enjoyed being part of that. I enjoyed participating in the planning and the deployments of those operations. The transition from being in the Defence Forces to the Red Cross, was that a difficult one? It really wasn't difficult. The more I specialised in the military in international and sort of international law issues and specifically conflict-related issues, I began to look maybe beyond into an international career in that area. So when I looked at my options, there aren't many organisations that you can actually practice this type of law. And with my military and legal background, the ICRC seemed like a perfect fit because of their mandate to work in conflict situations, their specialty in laws of war which coincided with my experience, my background and my training. So how have you found your time with the Red Cross so far? Look, I've found it immensely rewarding. I've had the opportunity to have different missions in some difficult contexts and a variety of roles in South Asia, working in India, Sri Lanka, Bangladesh and Nepal, then subsequently in Iraq and then in Israel and the occupied territories, and now in this region. And it's a constant challenge. But look, it's work that's really good and it's work that you can feel good about because of the purely humanitarian sort of focus of the organisation. The work is similar to what I was doing before. The focus is obviously different. But it was a surprisingly easy transition into the ICRC. The transition was easy, but you say there are challenges once you're there. What would you explain as the key challenges? Well, I think as a military officer you're programmed to accomplish a mission in a finite period of time and with certain constraints. But things are more defined. In the ICRC, because of the nature of the work, you're into areas and regions that conflicts have been going on and there's been a lot of suffering caused by these conflicts. And I guess the frustrations that I would experience is not being able to make a big enough difference and having frustrations not being able to accomplish maybe in a defined time frame an improvement of those conditions for sort of victims of conflict in those areas. So are you ever in a situation where you feel effectively like your hamstrung? Look, when you go into prisons in Iraq and in Israel and Afghanistan, our delegates are often faced with the frustrations of those prisoners or the populations who are the subject or caught up in these conflicts. And they always ask, why can't you do more? Can't you do enough? And the old hands in the ICRC explain it like this. We try to make a difference in the long term. It's an incremental difference. It's an evolutionary process. But we don't measure it in terms of days, months or years. So we have to look at it like that. And as we often say to people, would the situation be better off or worse off if we weren't there? And I think if you look at it like that, you can more easily justify a longer term view of things and remaining in a difficult context. So are there some long term key messages in regards to organizations like yours? Well, I think for a humanitarian organization where unfortunately there's no shortage of work around the world, I think you have to take a long term view. You have to do what you can. And you have to try to force other governments and other organizations to do their part and to fulfill their obligations in those contexts. So I think it's important work that needs to be done. Your ex-military now working for the Red Cross, are there any conflicts of interest? Well, my current role is to develop relations with the military and countries in the region on behalf of the ICRC. I see it as a sort of a dual role. One is to educate the military about the organization and our work to allow us to work and do our work in operational contexts like Afghanistan and Iraq and Sudan and Congo and others. The other half is to educate the organization about the military. And look, I have the greatest respect for the military and the time I spent in it. And I think that they do a good job. They're following the direction of their political masters. And I think genuinely their motivation is good. Sure, their shortcomings. But they're fine people in the military. And I think that the more that we can have interaction with them and we can understand each other's roles and maybe some constraints, I think the better it's going to be for everybody. From a personal perspective, Larry, are there any mantras which you live by that help you deal in difficult times? Well, that's a difficult question. I don't really think about it. I don't worry about my own safety. To be perfectly honest, I'm not in dangerous situations very much if at all, given my role. I do have the utmost admiration of the ICRC delegates are actually in the front lines and working on the other sides of conflicts when the conflicts are ongoing. So I don't know if I can really say that I have a mantra. I just try to keep focused on the work and the reasons for the work. What are the reasons for the ICRC work? Well, the reasons for the work are, as the organization says in its materials, it's to preserve the dignity of civilians and other victims of armed conflict, to protect them from the effects of armed conflict which they're caught up in through no fault of their own. And I think that if you keep the focus on that and not any sort of overriding or overlying political or military sort of reasons and don't try to overthink it, I think that keeps you focused. How do you train personnel to deal with difficult situations? Well, there are several difficulties. There's a difficulty of managing expectations of people that you're there to help. They always are demanding more. Oftentimes the ICRC delegates are the only people they get to see, so they often vent their frustrations generally at the ICRC and they inevitably want their lives and situations to be improved. So that's a very frustrating thing, whether it's a detainee that's in a jail in Iraq or Afghanistan or whether it's somebody in Gaza who's just gone through a horrendous experience as a result of conflict there. So those managing expectations, I think that's a big one. I think there's also a psychological tool that delegates have to pay. It's immensely stressful for them. They're often in situations where their lives may be at risk. They could be in danger of kidnapping or being caught up in the wrong place and caught up in the conflict and they really have nothing to protect themselves except their negotiating skills, the Red Cross, the emblem and the reputation of the organization. So I think it takes a psychological toll on a lot of delegates when they're in those situations. Now that's not all context, but in mid to high intensity sort of conflict situations, that is a psychological price that every delegate has to pay. How much can an organization prepare its people for deployment? Look, I don't think you really can. You know, our delegates, when they come in, some of the general delegates are 25 years old, that's the minimum age, and they're screened. They go through an integration course in Geneva and in the field where they go through scenario training and there is a bit of psychological preparedness that is part of that, but they really won't know how they'll react until they get into the field. The organization does have some tools for psychological debriefing and counseling, but you never really know how someone's going to react until they get in the situation. So I think delegates will quickly decide whether they want to be operationally focused in those situations or whether they want to go into some of the more technical sides of the organization. So I think the culture of the organization also helps. The fact that everybody is so mission focused and having 150 years of history also helps because there are methods of operation that are developed that are standard any way you work and I think having experience from more senior delegates and being in a culture where it does this and has a rich history and tradition, I think it really prepares people a little better. Just like in the military, training and previous experience, there's no substitute for that. Larry Mayby, thanks so much for your time.