 Good morning, everyone. Welcome to the House Human Services meeting for Thursday, July 21st. This morning, we are going to be taking up the COVID-19 response for child care, for children and families, and the supports and services and programs that support them and continue to do so through our pandemic. And just want to welcome everyone here. And I have to first say, Amy Schoenberg, you have the best picture up that I've seen in a long time. It's hard not to comment on it, so. Thank you. I couldn't resist. It's just for this week. It's good. It's good. So welcome. And Commissioner Brown, welcome to our committee once again. I think you'll be spending a bit of time here. It seems like this session and committee members and other folks, the commissioner needs to move along to appropriations after our committee. So I'm going to ask if we could just let him get through his presentation and then save our questions till when he is completed. So the floor is all yours, Commissioner Brown. Good morning and thank you, Representative Wood. I appreciate the opportunity to be here today. You know, we were asked to come in and report out on the status of the child care system. And there were some questions asked in the invitation. And so we've tried to answer those questions in our presentation today. And so we'll walk you through our presentation. Happy to answer any questions that you have. I believe you have the, do you have the PowerPoint, Julie, that you can put up and share on the screen so we can walk through it? Yes, one moment. Committee members, you can also find that on the committee page. Sorry, it's going to take me a moment. And then while we're waiting, I'll just introduce the team that we have here with us today with me. We have Sarah Truckel, our Chief Financial Officer. Also, Melissa Regal Garrett from the Child Development Division, the leadership team there. And then also, we have Miranda Gray, who we've borrowed from the Economic Services Division, where she's the Deputy Director of the Reach Up Program. We brought her over to work on the hubs project last fall. And so she'll be here to kind of answer any questions and present the data we have on the hub system in response to the questions from the committee. So if you want to jump to page two, Julie, please. So one of the questions from the committee is what's been the impact on the child care system with the pandemic? Overall, as you will see from the data on the chart we provided here, overall, the impact has been about a 1% drop in the number of slots. If you look, we've lost about 319 slots statewide since the pandemic began. In December of 19, we had just over 32,000 slots. That would be either licensed providers or registered home providers. And then at the end of December of 20, we had 31,700. I think the story on this chart would be that the impact has really varied across the state. I think the pandemic has had an impact in certain areas of the state. If you look at Newport, Newport has taken a pretty big hit overall. They've lost over 15% of their slots overall in that year's time. Middlebury lost almost 6% area. The Montpelier area has lost almost 4%, and Rutland approximately 3.5%. And so I think while other states have gained a little bit or a very minimal loss, overall, four districts in the state communities had been hit disproportionately, and those would be the ones I just reviewed. The other thing I would caution is that we're still in the midst of the pandemic, and so there could be impacts still to come that we just can't foresee at this time. Although, as you'll see later in the presentation, we have certainly done a lot as a state to prop up and support the child care system. Julie, if you could move on to number three and then just looking at over the number of slots, this is just a look at how many child care programs have closed, so some programs could have reduced and reducing slots but stayed open. This looks at a historical trend of programs that have closed. Every year we do see programs open up and programs close. We saw a large number of closures in the 2016. Over the last couple of years we saw a decline in the number of programs closing. We're not seeing an uptick in closures due to the pandemic. I think what we're seeing is just more of the historical trend for the last couple of years where some programs open up and some programs close. Melissa, I didn't know if you wanted to add in anything here from your perspective. Must be she's not been able to jump on yet. If you look at what we've looked at the programs that have closed over the last year, some of them in about 16% indicated it was due to low enrollment and then also some impacts of and 12% it was due to some impacts due to the COVID pandemic. We do have and working with our providers, we know some of our providers fall into what we would consider a vulnerable category in terms of age or underlying health conditions that make working in a child care setting risky for some of them and some chose to close as a result of that is what we have heard as well. Then moving on to the next slide, impact of the pandemic, what is utilization looking like? Right now, utilization is at about 78% if you look at the chart compared to other years. Utilization is down, what we're seeing is that there are families are many families are now working remotely and teleworking from home and I think many have chosen to have their children stay home with them and not access child care. We're currently at 78% of what we saw in state fiscal year 20 and we're at 75% of what we would have had for utilization in state fiscal year 2019 and what you will see in that underutilization as we testified in our BAA the other day, there was a 4.8 million down in our subsidy line item in the Budget Adjustment Act as a result of this underutilization across the state right now. Then Julie, if you could move to the next slide. This slide highlights the investments the state made in response to the pandemic to stabilize and preserve the child care system. We started in early March with the Child Care Business Stabilization Funding Program that ran from mid-March through the end of May where we allocated out approximately $8.4 million through the stabilization program for child care providers. Also through mid-March, through the end of May, there was an essential person child care and incentive payment program that was almost $5.7 million invested in the child care system and then in the summer we did a restart program, restart stipends to support programs reopening and and in complying with the health and safety regulations to reopen. That was about $6.6 million invested and then late in the summer and into the fall there was the organizational or operational relief grant program where $11.2 million was provided to our day care system. There was also other money that was allocated that went to the CIS providers, Childers and Integrated Services providers and the parent child centers. This total is just the money that went to the child care providers and there was a lot more flexibility in terms of what providers asked and needed in the operational organizational relief grant program that could have used it for building improvements, staff salaries, supplies. I mean there was a lot more, there was more flexibility, it wasn't as targeted as some of those other programs so I think it was very well received and we're hoping as we'll talk more in the opportunities we are in line to get some more federal stimulus money for the child care system and our hope is that it could be used in that flexible manner as well to support our providers and then we allocated approximately and spent $3.8 million for the hub system and then also for tuition for families who qualified for CCFAP payments for their children in those hubs and then also we had providers take part in the Department of Financial Regulations hazard pay program. It was about 750,000 allocated out to providers which covered the period from March through June 1st and then also this fall we implemented the child care workforce stabilization payment at what really looked at covering and stabilizing the workforce in the fall in the fall time period not looking back but for the current time period and there was almost four million dollars allocated out to providers and their staff in that program as well. So all told we in the last 10 months have provided approximately 40 and a half million dollars to child care providers to support them in response to the pandemic. I don't know if there was any questions I can pause for a moment. There any questions on this slide or I guess any of the previous ones since now you've opened yourself up Commissioner. I have a question. What have you noticed in terms of barriers or have you noticed any particular barriers in terms of the two things both the reduction in the number of registered homes as well as the reduced utilization. I mean is it do you point to anything besides the fact that there you know we're obviously dealing with a pandemic like shortage of workforce for instance was one of the things that I was wondering about. Sure and I believe Melissa's been able to finally jump on the hearing and so I'll have Melissa jump in here and speak to what they're hearing from providers and seeing on the ground. Okay thank you. Absolutely. Good morning everyone for the record. I'm Melissa Riegel-Garrett. I'm the Policy Director for the Child Development Division. So we've actually been tracking child care closures for years and we publish a report each January on the child care closure and capacity for the system and we as we look are looking at those numbers and preparing that report for this year what we're really seeing is similar trends to what we've seen in prior years and similar reasons for closing. In fact we saw probably about a fifth of our closures over the course of the year occurred prior to the onset of the COVID crisis and closing the system down. So we have seen some impact of the COVID crisis on closures but it's not as significant as we thought we were going to see by it and we do in fact credit the money that was infused into the system with really stabilizing it and keeping that system going. Thank you Melissa. I guess the follow-up question is since you have looked at that data over time do you see a difference in those registered do you see a difference in the proportion of registered homes versus other licensed centers? So are there more is that a higher percentage of the closures that are in registered homes this year? So we've been trending for years with more registered homes closing than licensed programs closing and what we saw this year was the trend line for registered homes remained steady. So yes there were closures in registered homes at a higher rate than there were in licensed programs but the trend line remained steady this year from what we've seen in prior years. We did have an increase in the licensed centers closing this year that then after school programs as well that surprised us a little bit and we are digging deeper into that so that when we're able to publish that report we can really you know look into that and tell that story behind that data and whether COVID impacted that or not. Okay thank you and we most likely will invite y'all back to discuss that report when when we get it so Representative McFawn. Thank you. I'm a great supporter of child care and what I saw in this these slides is got me worried. We put $40 million in and more to come and maybe I'll ask the question this way what's the prediction in terms of the future of centers places where these kids can go reopening or more utilization. When we're talking about 80 percent of the closures were from COVID that I'm just one it's almost like the school system you know there's less kids and we'll put more money into it and now I'm worried that we're doing the same thing here. You know that's a great great question and concern you know the child care system is a market-based system a little different than schools and what we saw as the economy shut down completely in in March and April and into May you know that really could have significantly crippled the child care system which is critical you know for for working families and families have a support system for their children as you know we stabilize and reopened you know we still are working for those that are able to work remotely and are choosing to do so and because of the way schools have opened up and some are fully remote many are a hybrid model and some are open full times it's really made you know predicting what the long-term prognosis is for the child care system. I think the goal was is to preserve it and stabilize it get through the pandemic and then understand how how the pandemic might you know change our work the way we work and live in the future and is another going to be long-term ramifications for the child care system where there needs to be you know given it's a market-based system are there going to be corrections that are long-term or is it going to bounce back and I think given we're still in the pandemic it's too early to say you know what it's going to look like long-term and I would and I wouldn't look at at compare it you know to you know the school funding system and the cost per pupil would you know certainly the demographics are not Vermont's favor right now and you know similar how it impacts the school system but the infusion of dollars into the child care system were for a very specific purpose to stabilize and preserve the system so when we came out of the pandemic the economy could thrive and parents had the opportunity to re-engage with the child care system we didn't want to see mass closures of child care businesses just given the impact it could have on the economy you know you know just like in other areas of the economy you know like there's all real concern many of these businesses aren't going to be able that you know non-child care businesses like the entertainment industry restaurants are going to really not survive and that can really have a long-term impact on the overall economy we could have seen the same thing like you know the child care system is you know the foundation of our in many ways of our economy and supporting parents and and that whole system economic system we have and so it was really important that we preserve it so that we could you know have it available and then and then determine what those long-term implications are for the system once we're through the pandemic. So what I hear you say Commissioner is it's it's too soon to tell right now. Yes yes thank you represent Whitman and my apologies to represent Whitman and represent Small I realize that you haven't seen some of the people in this in this committee virtual committee room so if you wouldn't mind just taking a moment to introduce yourselves represent Whitman then represent Small. Of course hello everybody and thank you Madam Vice Chair. Dane Whitman representing Bennington District 2-1 and my question was for or I'll let Taylor introduce herself as well. Thank you representative Whitman and hi everyone my name is representative Taylor Small representing Winooski and a sliver of Burlington. And for the rest of the witnesses all the rest of us are the same ones you saw the last two years. Okay represent Whitman. Thank you. My question's for Commissioner Brown looking at these programs it looks like some of them were specific to closures like the full closure that we saw in March. Assuming that God forbid we don't have another full closure that we're able to kind of keep the pandemic under control which of these programs could you see continuing into 2021 and which of these closures would you consider or which of these programs sorry would you consider more sort of one-time costs that we won't that we won't see again. You know we as I indicated earlier you know the state's been allocated we believe we're waiting for the award letter from the federal government. We believe around 12.5 to 12.8 million dollars to further stabilize the child care system I think and it is targeted to the child care system. You know I think all of these separate programs that we ran really met a specific purpose at the time. I think the one program that I think moving forward would continue to benefit the providers and give them greater flexibility in terms of meeting what their specific need is as a provider would be the relief grant program. You know there was a lot of flexibility built into that program based on you know to meet the needs of that specific provider and so that it wasn't a very you know it wasn't targeted to one specific aspect of the child care system. Providers had a much more flex flexibility in terms of they had a structural building need they needed to meet or or systems like a HVAC system you know there was a lot of different things of expanding their playground you know their play area outside play area for kids to make it more safe because they were going to spend a lot more time out there and upgrading it. So there was just a lot more creativity and flexibility that providers had and I think moving forward that would be how we would like to target additional funds just so that it allows providers to meet their specific needs and I think we're going to start the conversation with our with our partners in this area about how we can you know roll out those new dollars just to make sure we are meeting the needs of providers but I would say based on our experience it's the relief grant program that would have a lot of value continuing with these new dollars that are being infused into the system that are coming our way from the federal government you know and just as the you know the Biden administration indicated before they took office that they're proposing another round of stimulus in the near future and in my from just reading up on a high level there could be even more resources coming to the state for our child care system and so we'll have to wait and see what what that looks like when it happens but we do know we're in line for about 12 and a half to 12.8 million dollars thank you commissioner and just a quick follow-up the could you tell talk a little bit more about the child care workforce stabilization I saw that that was going up until fall 2020 yeah you know one of that one of the areas of concern when we were standing up the hub system you know for schools that were that were going to be remote and had a place for kids to go during the day you know we were you know the child care system staffing levels are challenged even in the best of times you know recruiting and retaining staff and by expanding a new area of program which it was the hub system you know we were really concerned that we didn't want to you know start taking staff from the child care system and having them go into the hub system because we were you know you know providing startup money to the hubs which infuse cash and and and some incentives for for for recruitment to bring staff into the hub system and so one of the objectives was just to make sure that we were stabilizing and make and making sure that that staff weren't moving between the the regulate the child care system and then this new hub system which was really meant to be a temporary solution during the pandemic and and we don't envision that at this time being a long-term solution in vermont and then also just recognizing that you know our child care providers have really stepped up during the pandemic and and the providers and their staff you know there's a lot of risk involved you know you know with the spread of the virus and you know and as you'll see many providers weathered through it and stayed open they were deemed essential early on and so I think the stabilization program was a way to recognize their commitment and sacrifice to you know that that they made to vermont and vermonters to you know continue to stay open and provide you know critical care to children as essential workers and others continue to you know to be able to work thank you commissioner commissioner i have one question in regards to you know essentially all of these covid allocations are one-time one-time dollars you know through relief packages and and the the 12 and a half million coming our way is also one-time dollars although we we have heard the incoming administrations speak to the intent at least of trying to shore up child care across the country so i guess one of my questions is as as we look to the state funding that is in child care and and we know that there is going to be some sort of change in the workforce habits after post covid because there's there's just been you know the ability of people to to figure out how to work from home and we don't know how much is is going to return to our our host programs so i guess one of the things that i'm urging if this is more of a statement than a question one of the things that i'm urging is that the state not be too quick to adjust in a downward fashion otherwise known as reducing the base funding for child care programs you know going forward you know i know we've seen in about close to five million dollars in the budget adjustment for this year and and i know i know that as a state we're committed to child care i'm just you know some of those funds could be used to increase increase payments made to programs to further enhance qualifications of staff and things like that so it's it's just we're all in this together trying to figure it out and you know trying to sort of hold the reins as close as we can until we get through this so it's just a little i know you're thinking about this going forward absolutely point well taken in you know we would agree that you know it it's this is not the time to to to you know think that what has happened in the pandemic is a long-term trend or or or or correction in the in the system i think you know we need to be very measured in how we approach this and and really let you know data and in the system stabilize once we come out of the pandemic to understand you know how the pandemic has changed our lives and the way we work and and how we adjust our our different systems of care to that and that needs to be very thoughtful and methodical on how we approach that i would agree thank you so i think what we'll have you do is just to continue through recognizing that we have limited time with you so um thank you sure and then moving on to the next slide there was um some questions regarding um the hubs and all that um randa kind of walk you through the hub grant program and and we're where we're at with it right now good morning for the record my name is marianna gray i'm the tanif deputy director for the economic services division this fall i was temporarily reassigned to be the project manager for the school age hubs i'd like to begin by saying that the school age hub project was a success because of strong collaboration and teamwork from after school with a dedicated and thoughtful partner that hit the ground running when we engaged them in conversations in mid august about setting up hubs let's grow kids the agency of natural resources the division of fire safety the agency of education our licensing division within the child development division and the department of health as well as many community members made establishing hubs their priority it was because of this teamwork that we were able to establish 43 hubs and i'll pivot to our data the first point of clarification i would like to make is that we reported previously and in testimony last week you heard from front after school that we had 44 hubs however only 43 hubs actually served children one hub in the retland area notified me in early november that they were no longer going to move forward with standing up a hub last week you also heard that we had 102 sites which at one point we did however not all site and sites ended up opening for various reasons some of those reasons included the site ended up not being a good fit for school aged children or the hub was unable to recruit enough staff to open additional sites the number of sites 43 is also smaller than we thought we might be needed so that is due to how schools chose to reopen no hubs were established in the areas of the state where children were in person learning five days a week or children were in person for some portion of their day as of last week we had 82 locations actively serving children however i will mention that this is a moving number as schools bring children back to in person learning there's less of a need or no need for a hub of these 82 sites 66 of these sites are regulated programs 16 are unregulated or exempt programs which were approved to continue to operate beyond december originally the grants were just to go through children's winter break these unregulated exam sites have the ability to serve approximately 300 children 11 of the 93 sites have closed now and 80 of these sites eight of these sites were exempt sites who requested to close or no because there was no longer a need to operate the hub grants got funds to programs to support them and making adjustments to serve school-aged children many sites were existing regulated programs with available capacity because infants toddlers and preschoolers were not attending this led the legislative change allowed existing providers to serve school-aged children full day on remote learning days which resulted in children and families having the ability to experience continuity of care this committee wanted to know about the ability for programs to continue operating and we feel because 66 of the sites are regulated programs they will be able to continue to operate and serve school-aged children as needed i will now turn the testimony back to commissioner brown thank you we'll open it up to any questions regarding the hub program and where we're at with that um thank you um randa um so i thought that we heard in testimony that funding for the hubs ended in december um so um is that accurate or do i have a misunderstanding no that is accurate um madam vice chair and the hub were um to start they work for start-up costs um the first months of operating costs so um if hubs chose to if they have the ability to remain open they um they could but the funding gave them with just for that first month and so um our how are they being funded through cc fab uh education how are they continuing to be funded after school dollars it's a combination of all the above that you've mentioned and as well as private pay um we have families that do not qualify for cc fab so they are private paying these providers um but i do believe providers have also from reports from them that i have received also tried to access um other funding opportunities that they could in community grants if you will okay are there questions from committee members okay i'm not seeing any hands go up so um thank you thank you um julie if you could move to the next slide up you know uh vermont just a highlight vermont was recognized nationally and we've included some links to different articles and and news outlets that you know kind of touched on vermont and the programs and the success of our programs um and so just so people want to check them out but if we were nationally recognized um as a model of of uh states responding to the pandemic and supporting its child care system i think we should all be proud of of the work we've done across the board everyone played a significant role on the providers our community partners like let's grow kids vermont after school the legislature um you know in allocating the funds out our teams here at dcf really strategizing and you know how to implement these programs and then implementing them there's certainly some bumps in the road along the way for sure um but i i think overall we should all be proud of the work we've done um but we also recognize that we're still in it and we still have a ways to go and we'll still dedicate the same um you know uh you know drive to making sure we continue to support our providers and our families and kids in the state um through the rest of the pandemic and hopefully as we begin to reopen as well and then um on the next slide um you know we were asked to kind of uh touch on uh lessons learned um and you know if there's anything we could glean from our work in this and you know if we could go back and do it again um you know are there things we would do differently or what or what really worked um you know and so what i would say is as you know we do have an opportunity with this new money that's coming in that i mentioned in the stimulus um the the 12 million um you know as i indicated before the operational relief grant i think was a was a real success because um it awarded it awarded funds out in a lump sum manner and you know based on the request of the provider for them to to meet the specific need they had it wasn't like money targeted to everyone for the same purpose it really had some flexibility um and so i think you know that's how we would recommend structuring um future programs when funding's available particularly for this next 12 and a half million really allowing the provider some some flexibility um you know to meet their fixed cost and any increased operating expenses that they had you know certainly um complying with the new health and safety regulations to continue to operate as a as a child care provider um you know there really were um expenses and technical expertise needed that could continue to stay open and so you know funding is critical and resources are critical to to meet those needs um also it provided the ability to backfill a loss of revenue so that they continued um and were able to sustain as a as an actual business um due to decreased enrollment as as we've talked about you know we're at um like 78 percent of capacity from the year before um you know that impacts their bottom line as a business and so it's important that we make sure that they stay viable um and then also you know um and you know we've seen sporadic you know throughout the pandemic you know we have seen um the virus appear um in in child care centers and so in response some of them you have to close temporarily um and increase your infection control measures and and so you know there's an impact there in terms of having to shut down and a complete loss of revenue and so there's flexibility in allowing the funds to be used that way and then also um you know and this is was an issue before the pandemic but I think it's just been incredibly magnified um is you know there's expense in recruiting and retaining and supporting your staff um in in this work and so allowing flexibility of the funds in that area um as we did um I think it just provides the flexibility for child care providers and centers to really utilize the funds to meet their unique situation at that time and that would be our recommendation moving forward as we target additional relief that we do in a way that provides that flexibility to providers because each provider is different and what they need and what they're experiencing at any one time. Commissioner would you would you anticipate using some of this learning that you've had over the course of the last um 10 and a half months uh not only in pandemic relief coming but in how the program is further um redesigned as we go through the process after the pandemic? Yeah I think once we're through the pandemic and we had and and you know and we're not operating at a hundred percent every day you know many hours of the day I'm in response to the pandemic our team you know across the board of providers and our teams at DCF and our partners you know everyone's been working incredibly hard and I think um once we have the ability to kind of look back and reflect and really dig in and analyze what occurred I think there are going to be lessons learned in um and uh and experiences that we can draw from I think to improve our system moving forward just in normal operations. I can't input what those are today but we have but you know given our experiences um there are things that I think we can capitalize on um and leverage once we return back to normal whatever that looks like. Okay nice I see you represent fromstead has a question you're muted represent fromstead. Okay okay it said that I was on muted um thank you I Commissioner Brown I'm curious I guess I have a couple questions what on number one and two sort of go together um are you thinking that centers would apply for these funds based on the um the bullets underneath you know that they would have they would sort of need to justify what they want to use the funds for or are you thinking as one sort of says is that you would distribute them just based on how much you have divided and everyone would get a little more a chunk of money to use in a way that makes sense to them. How we structured the the original uh relief grant program is that providers did need to apply and identify the areas where they were experiencing a loss or had additional expenses or needs like building a new a new play facility outside for kids or maybe a new gazebo where they could have kids come in and do temperature checks in the morning I mean there was a lot a wide variety of things I think that model worked so we understood what you know it helps us collect data of what providers are experiencing and so we understand that and we get visibility into that um and then it also allows us to capture the total need that's out there because when we were operating this program and trying to allocate out the money we did learn some lessons immediately like the need was greater than the funds and so we were able to go back to the joint fiscal committee through you know through that process and get additional funds you know and to do some of these programs so that we could meet most of the need or all of the needs in certain areas and so I think that model works just because it does increase our data collection and visibility into what uh providers are experiencing versus if we just allocated and divvied the money up because if you dive down into you know who received what there was a there while we have averages there was a huge swing of who needed what and for what purpose and I think we'd want to retain that flexibility okay I just thinking of your own staff time that makes it a little bit harder because you gotta go through everything and people might race to get the money before it runs out I will say that um we reallocated a lot of of uh project staff and program staff from other areas of the department to create a team to kind of work through and and and stay in touch with providers and if we had questions regarding their submission and so it was an incredible DCF team effort we really did utilize staff from many different departments and divisions uh or divisions and offices within DCF on some of these relief grant programs because they it was a massive effort and we just in cdd just needed that extra you know boost and resources to really get the work done and we're prepared to reallocate and and and because those those staff are now experienced in this area and really learn from from the experience as well and so I think we're well situated to continue to meet the needs through this type of program that's great and I agree you guys did do a fantastic job and we heard that from centers um I also wondered if you had considered putting in your recommendations maybe a number three which would say to have a better um well done not even sure of all the right words but it system and updated upgraded better system would be a in my question and then b would be have you spent any time thinking about what it would cost I know that there's been lots of numbers floated out there about what it would cost for that but have you thought about that at all yes we think about it every day just in terms of the normal operation of the child care program and cdd as you know our it system is quite dated it's quite rickety and unstable just on a on a somewhat regular basis that you know the the subsidy payment system has a hiccup and we have to devote significant staff resources to manually enter you know the the you know to pay providers and so that happens every couple months um the reason it's not here is because that was an underlying concern before the pandemic and you know I'm happy to report that we are moving forward on the first module of the new building of bright futures information system known as b-fist um you know and we do have those analysis of what it would cost to build out the remainder of that system that work has been done and we're happy to share it it um I think is around 4.8 to 5 million dollars as much as just speaking from memory um sarah truckl if you're on when you want to jump in here I think you probably know those numbers a little better than I do yeah so the level of effort that we submitted um in our report I believe last year uh put the price of the program at I believe it was 6.7 million uh the original estimate for the first module which we're going to actually provide an update on further in this powerpoint is uh 2.2 million dollars leaving us with a 4.5 million dollar um gap from the original level of effort it should be noticed that um as we're approaching a modular system we're no longer doing a complete build at the same time so um what the original estimate was based on doing the entire system at once and that might pivot slightly as we go through a module approach that's terrific thank you for that information you're welcome okay let's um continue moving on um and then moving on um to the next slide um I think you know I think we've touched on on um okay I think I missed the slide in my thing here hold on I apologize here we go um just some further highlights uh you know as I indicated before you know the child care system really stepped up and responded to meet the needs of our monitors I think I can't speak enough of our providers and how they really did step up and our partners you know who provided assistance and support as well um you know across the board this you know the system just um responded in a way that it was just phenomenal um I think you know and as I indicated we should all be proud of that uh you know I think also in um in terms of responding to the pandemic and the health and safety needs and responding um um you know and trying to stand up the hub system very quickly this fall um I think it really strengthened and broke down some uh relationships and broke down some silos um within state government and outside of state government in terms of our work with you know with uh department environmental conservation regarding permitting um agency of education our licensing unit as Miranda indicated it it really was this incredible team effort across the board to really respond quickly um to the demands of the pandemic and to get results as quickly as we did I think those are the lessons we would we really want to draw from um at when we've returned to normal as we don't want to go back into that old environment where where we were bifurcated and siloed and in communication didn't always occur as as often and as quickly as we would want I think we want to continue to leverage those relationships and processes that that we establish in response to the pandemic um so I I think that's something I'd want to highlight and one of those things that moving forward we really want to capitalize on um no matter what happens so the other thing I would say um is that you know we've had teams working um you know across the board in response to um you know our a child care solutions based team um you know that really focused on recovery strategies um you know that that really led to a lot of these programs and services that were were provided um you know and then I think we also want to uh you know kind of to to your representative uh madame vice chair you know those lessons learned moving forward and how can we um while we responded well um it wasn't without its hiccups and how can we be better prepared for further um events you know emergency or pandemic events or whatever those you know um catastrophes could be we want to be better prepared and and leverage the lessons learned and those relationships we built and processes we built so that we are in a better position to respond in the future if something happens I think that you know that that's the work that needs to happen as well um and then Sarah I'll have you touch on the on the on the next bullet here in the highlight Sarah Truckel um happy to do so so the latest round of federal funding not only provided additional dollars to CCDF and the which we expect to be 12.5 to 12.8 million dollars for Vermont's allocation but also had a slight increase in the CCDF base um so I think what it highlights is just a continued investment from the federal government with regards to uh child care and um we've seen several more minimal but increases in that funding which ultimately means that we receive slightly more money every year which is great and so what would be Vermont's share of that 85 million we don't know I can tell you that the FY 20 federal budget the share is 600 and I believe 60 thousand dollars and that's the money that's being used for FY 20 and FY 21 to support the first module of the BFIS system so we're using last federal fiscal year 20 and federal fiscal year 21's increase to fund the first module of BFIS in addition to the remaining one-time funds which the legislature appropriated several sessions ago um of a million dollars of which a hundred thousand was used for planning and nine hundred thousand dollars will be used for development represents small thank you madam vice chair sarah can you define BFIS for me sure BFIS is um bright futures information system and bright futures is a term that's often used in child care so uh for it we tend to refer to it as BFIS but it is the existing um data system within the child development division that houses data related to um child care financial assistance program so it's the the program that pays our child care financial assistance tuition to providers on behalf of eligible families it also houses the professional development and credentials for our child care professionals um as well as a bunch of other information so a lot of the data you've seen presented today is pulled from that system wonderful thank you back to you commissioner sure and then moving on to the next slide you know there were some questions from the committee you know when the financial supports you know regarding all of these programs we run will the market constrict to below pre-pandemic levels what we do know is that well we've been able to maintain the current system it goes to our earlier conversations we have we have infused over you know 40 million dollars into the system um it worked we've seen some restriction but but nothing out of line with what we don't experience historically in the system given it's a market based system so I don't think we know how the system's going to respond once we get back to normal I think there's so many unknowns like how our family's going to continue to work um you know our our business is going to continue to allow staff who have the ability to telework to telework our parents who then are able to do that are they going to continue to choose to have their children stay at home with them and kind of juggle those dual demands of caring for their kids but also telework um which many of them are doing now I think we we don't know what the answer to those questions yet and I think you know that's some of the work we're going to need to do well once we start coming towards the end of the pandemic is to start working with our partners and um and surveying families and understanding you know are they're going to be permanent or semi-permanent changes to the system based on changes in behavior in response to the pandemic once we come through the other end of it um you know we do know um you know that um you know low enrollment really does stress the system um you know providers need revenue to stay open um you know and you know and some of that's due to families making tough choices of having their kids stay home with them we we hope the system rebounds we want the system to rebound the system needs to be healthy um you know to support families in our economy and and and you know really um help our children develop you know in healthy ways um um you know but we but one thing we do know is that the pandemic has only made the challenge of recruiting and retaining and and and support that much more difficult during the pandemic you know those issues um certainly existed before the pandemic but they will continue they they they've just grown during the pandemic and we expect that those will continue to exist after the pandemic and I think it you know we really need to focus on that as well is how do we support um you know our our providers and their staff um you know and if the and if we continue to experience low enrollment after the pandemic you know I think there needs to be a larger conversation about how do we respond to that as a system what are our priorities and I don't think we have the answers to those questions yet I think we just need to wait and collect some data to help inform those conversations that really do need to occur once we get better information and data or how the system's going to respond once we start coming out of the pandemic. So um commissioner one thing popped into my head as you were talking about the future and um made me think um what kind of uh collaboration do do you have with um say the uh ACCD and Department of Labor regarding um you know where the most what part of the state where the most job losses are or what part of the state where they're you know they're gaining jobs in in order to try to figure out is there some way to um you know try to match demand um you know with where there's job growth or job loss and you know how those those intersect and then uh after that we'll go to represent Bromsted. Yeah there is work that goes on in collaboration with ACCD you know recovery task force that that that really is looking at at that you kind of get into the heart of your question um mad vice chair and so you know we will continue to work closely with all of our state partners um not only on just you know the nuts and bolts of the child care system but also those broader um you know system issues of employment and where there's job losses where new jobs are coming and where do we see the demand I think you know just the data that we we looked at earlier on the first slides regarding you know that we've only overall lost like one you know one percent of the of the system slots in the system over the past year we do know there are certain areas of the state um that have been hit really hard and and the worst hit area was Newport and and you know and they struggle economically already and so if you want to grow a you know an economy in that area you're going to need child care providers and what can we do to support child care providers in those areas you know Middlebury you know has some a strong employment now it has the college there but um they've lost you know taken a hit in some of their child care they have the hospital there they have a lot of other businesses in that area and you know you need a child care system that can meet meet the demands of that of that economy of that area and a loss of providers can impact that and so we we do need to be connected in those areas to making sure we understand the needs and the losses and where we need to develop resources to help build up and support new providers coming online to meet the demand that that's likely there thank you represent from stead thank you um i i really like these questions i agree these are things that have been floating around in my head as well and um representative wood's question was part of my question the other part is this is all really the questions around the market but i think that the other question is to think about the the people and what families are thinking about feeling comfortable having both members going back to work based on what they can afford as well and i i think that we want to be looking at both of those issues together um and so it's great to think about working with commerce i think also we have um building bright futures that is um straddles sort of public private and convenes groups and it might be a great some of these um questions could possibly be got at a little bit through that process as well because i think that the pandemic has changed all of us to some degree and um and i really appreciate all of the information that you've put out here today to have us think about these issues and then watch i mean we have we still have time that we have to figure out how we're going to get out of the pandemic hopefully sooner rather than later and then and then look at behavior sort of um what happens next and so much in front of us so i i i super appreciate this thank you any other thoughts or questions from committee members here okay commissioner sure so uh we'll go to the last uh the committee wanted an update on you know we've touched on it a little bit in our conversations because i think you know an it system is central to any um trial care system and having a state of the art system is is crucial and and you know it's fair to say we don't have a state of the art it system right now and it really does pose some challenges um in our work and but as we indicated you know we are um in the process of working on our first module you know we've gone out to bid um and uh selected a vendor and are now in the process of negotiating the contract and bringing that vendor on board to start the work that first module uh will include the the ccfap eligibility and payment functions of the system which are really challenged right now just you know day to day and in in our system and so that that will be a a significant help for us um when we hopefully roll that module out um in the fall the end of september early october that's our goal um you know we had we did have five responses to the rfp of companies bidding we selected one um and you know and so we're going through that process i indicated um our goal is um is as i stated to to have that module functioning and in in use um it but by uh the end of september october 1st um you know we do really need to meet that time frame because we will be out of compliance with our system with federal requirements on october 1st with our old system it just won't meet meet those requirements and so we have to have it live by then so you know it's all hands on deck and doing whatever we need to to make sure we have the resources to meet that time frame on that first module you know and then uh you know and then once you know we do have that in place you know that that module is critical for us to continue and support the governor's five-year plan you know that's out there regarding the child care system and and rate design and and rate structure you know and sarah chuckle can speak to that a little bit the committee would would like us to but you know we're encouraged we're you know we're finally moving forward on on a new it system a new beefy system um you know but this this is just the first module and there's a long ways to go and as we you know from other it projects they're complex um there's you know there's uh you you hit roadblocks at times that you need to work through things don't always go the way you anticipate and so you know there are lessons learned there for dcf and and it's ie and e work um you know but but for us you know we're excited that we are working on that first module and that's starting and so that that is exciting you know and we look forward to you know sharing our progress on that um as we continue as we build out that first module so um for folks who uh the little bit of alphabets soup here abs is the agency of digital services yes um just as a reminder or new information for some folks so i have a question uh commissioner um so we're familiar with things that are sort of being built in modules these days and so when when you think about um this new module will you essentially be running sort of two systems parallel to each other um and then by the the the follow-up to that is by the time we have completed all of the necessary modules will that replace the current bfis system so in other words are we really updating that system or are we really creating a whole new system module by module yeah we're building a new system module by module and so as as we stand up a new module this will take the place of the functionality that exists in the other system the module approach is not without um you know it's concerns and i think you just identified one is you know it's you know like that you know the what they call the waterfall method or the big bang product where you drop a whole new system at once um you know that's not this approach we're doing a module so when you are doing a module you know you're using the functionality of your new system you developed in that new module but yet you're decommissioning those functions in your old system but then using your the remainder of that existing system um to for your other functions and that's not without risk too because that system you're using is unstable to begin with and that's why you're trying to build a new system and so while you're trying to decommission some of those other areas of it you know there's risk there as well as destabilizing the other areas you need to continue to use and so it's complicated um but but the module does reduce your risk of when you do a big waterfall or big bang development whereas like if you drop it all at once and there's problems your your whole system is that you know so to uh committee members have questions about about the status or any updates around this new system represent from sorry to keep asking questions i was hoping you were almost at my last question um representative wood with your questions um so if you were to uh all of a sudden have enough money to do it all in one as the you say the big bang system um and you've already hired a consultant to work with you on the or um contractor to help you with the first module would that contract i mean would you would it is it an easier is it how difficult is it to move into a change if money were to appear well we would have to um go back out to bid i mean the other piece of a modular system is is that you have flexibility to leverage different vendors based on the the module and the functionality and different expertise that different vendors might bring to that specific piece of technology you're trying to develop um so we would need to go back out to bid um but well you know and whether we would bid out each module at once as a package or continue then to to go out module by modular so that we could leverage different vendors based on their expertise it's kind of the approach we've taken now in the IEE system where um and it allows um you know in and i'm just speaking from experience in the IEE world and having been very involved in my prior role as deputy commissioner in that project um what when you bid when you bid out bigger chunks of a of a project like uh like all that once or or multiple facets of it you tend to get the established big companies that that operate in that space to be the only bidders you receive like like the deloids and the CGIs and in those and in those other big companies versus if you break it up you open the market up in the technology up to smaller companies that that that can maybe have the the expertise and also the the staffing to manage that size of a project versus it wouldn't be able to manage the bigger project because that's just not who they are as a company and so you know we've experienced some successes in IE and E working with some different companies that we never worked before like with the uploader because we broke it up into chunks and we and there were companies that really specialized in that area and were able to to manage that that project really well and deliver results um just given the flexibility of that modular approach and how you bid it out and chunk up the work okay okay I think I think I understand the pros and cons and I'm by no means an IT expert but just I'm just speaking from my experience is in working in that other realm I understand I know I have someone at my house who's constantly scratching his head about the the IT that might be an understatement representative so uh commissioner it looks like that you're at the end of your testimony I just want to check in with you to see if any other members of your staff have additional um additional testimony that they were anticipating giving or you're just kind of doing it all as one I think we were you know we've kind of went through our prepared our presentation I think our team I know Sarah Truckel and I both have to jump off for the um our 1015 testimony and house appropriations but Miranda and Melissa can stay on if there's further conversation or questions the committee has great thank you so much for being here we appreciate all of this information and these updates and thank you again for the outstanding job that you've done um to date through this pandemic we we see the results of it so thank you so much thank you okay and good luck with appropriations thank you okay um folks I I think that um what we're going to look at here and hopefully the witnesses will bear with us but um trying to make sure that people have a little bit of a break after sitting for over an hour welcome and representative wood thank you very much for starting us out after our brief cause this is again house human services um and uh our next witness um in continuation of how are the children um is holly moorhouse thank you madam chair uh for the record my name is holly moorhouse i'm the executive director of ramon after school we are a statewide nonprofit that specializes in positive youth development we work with programs serving children and youth from kindergarten all the way through young adulthood um all across the state and um we really focus on the time that children and youth spend outside of the classroom outside of the school day if you're new or to the after school issue when I use the phrase after school I'm really talking about any of those hours outside the school day so it could be before school it could be school vacation weeks uh summer's really important it could be the weekend I'm also talking about a wide variety of programs from licensed child care programs to schools teen centers park and recreation departments community organizations um serving that that full breath of of youth um thank you uh to your committee for the time uh to speak today um madam chair would it be okay if I share my screen to show my slides or okay thank you um absolutely uh thank you um can you do that or julie can you make holly yeah good yeah did that work it absolutely worked for what it's um we are seeing your presentation part as well okay um great you know I might so if you start from current slide or present slide or custom slideshow you should be able to get that part go away unless you want it yeah perfect um so thank you uh I'd like to start with you know one of your questions was how are youth doing in vermont and uh we have some data from october vermont after school is uh has been partnering with researchers from the university of rickovich it's part of the planet youth project um iceland has been doing tremendous work around positive youth development and primary prevention for about 20 years and two years ago uh vermont was the uh and vermont after school we were the first state to sign on in north america uh to pilot uh their primary prevention model here and we're in year two and a major portion of the project is to survey our young people in seventh through twelfth grade um every fall and to use that data to work on strategies in the community cross-sector to improve the lives of young people so the data i'm sharing um this morning uh is from that survey this past october just a few months ago it's from five communities it's not statewide the pilots in and uh five communities right now it is all seventh and twelfth graders and all the and all the schools in those communities um were invited to participate in the survey uh you'll see uh some of the data um um has you know can uh give us a great feeling a good feeling on 91 percent of our middle school students report that it's easy to receive caring and warmth from parents a 93 percent of high schoolers uh say their parents know where they are in the evenings um another high percentage say their parents know the parents their friend these are all protective factors around youth resilience um you'll see about three quarters of middle schoolers feel safe in their community um 46 percent you could look at that glass half full glass half empty um you know would like to live in the same community in in the future so there are some positive indicators even with covid um the survey um looks at multiple dimensions it looks at school community family life and then peers and and then these are just a few of the indicators uh this year in the survey we also worked with the Iceland researchers to add specific covid um and mental health questions and this is where I think we need to really sit up and pay attention um in the past month almost a third of youth never felt confident in their ability never felt confident in their ability to handle personal problems and 29 percent felt like things were never going their way 38 percent felt like difficulties were piling up so high that they could not overcome them sometime or often um almost half 45.5 percent of high schoolers say that covid has made their mental health worse uh there were some follow-up questions um we see similar levels of increases uh for their own concern for their own mental health but they're also concerned about the mental health of those around them uh 47 percent of high schools report that covid has worse in school connections and 57 percent of our 11th and 12th graders says hurt their educational experience over half say they're more lonely due to covid um and about a um half as well feel that they're more anxious um this last bullet points also concern me 41 percent um of youth report nervousness in the last week and over a third are um having sleeping problems um so definitely concern come concerning numbers and I think that as we talk about childcare and the needs of working families and we talk about education and and learning loss we really need to be elevating and paying attention uh to these indicators as well and what supports and programs we have in our in our state uh to help address them the I also um uh submitted a written report and and these slides really talk to those points um but I thought it was easier to speak from slides than from text um but in looking at those numbers and what's been going on the field uh I will say that the after school and I'll say after school and youth serving organizations have responded in a number of different ways uh as we heard with the hub testimony you know they've responded around both child care and learning so when you look at after school it fits you some of the programs are regulated child care programs some of them are not some of them are serving children that are too old um they're beyond age 12 or 13 uh some are school based and have exemptions and aren't licensed um but many of them fit into that that space as well I would say that every program high quality program is looking at both child care and learning um they have stepped forward during COVID to provide child care for essential workers they step forward in the summer even when school buildings were closed to run summer programming because they felt we all felt was so important for children to get back where they could um will our rates were low uh they have worked with schools especially the ones who ran summer and child care um programs worked with schools to help many schools reopen and figure out the processes that they needed to run um we don't hear about that as much but it's happened across the state um then we heard about the hubs so they stepped forward in places where schools could not open and provide those services and even in places where schools did open many after school programs ran extended hours so schools would open till 11 a.m. or 1 p.m. and sort of a reduced schedule and it was the after school program that was picking up uh the slack there and running you know from 11 to 4 or 5 or 6 in the evening um the school's after school programs did a lot of connecting with families to make sure they had resources around food and mental health uh offered those extended hours um many of them uh switched over and started helping with the school food delivery programs they were on the buses delivering the meals uh they were sending home enrichment packets with materials and supplies for science or art uh they switched to doing virtual programming and they offered many spaces and continue to offer spaces for young people to connect to find agency um agency is so big right now right when you're feeling helpless and you're feeling anxious and you're feeling disconnected and you're feeling lonely finding areas for our young people to engage important conversations to connect with each other I can't emphasize it enough um a number of programs worked with us over the summer we had 50 young people come together to work on the idea of a state youth council a representative Diane Lamphers introducing a bill around that um we have another 10 communities are piloting youth councils and participatory budgeting um to for youth to find solutions during COVID and um they all have $9,000 to spend on stipends and on resources so a lot of important resources and response from the field what we learned during COVID is this strong network of providers is so important in places where there was not an after-school program existing or a community partner are you serving partner to step forward it was harder to create a hub when you need a childcare hub it has been harder for schools to restart and meet the needs of families with the modified schedules um it's been harder for families to find the resources they need school and community partnerships are really important we've had places where from the beginning schools and after-school programs work closely together around the schedules Representative McFawn you had a question earlier about sort of the underutilization of the system and part of that is is I would say is due to timing and lack of communication um you know if a school rolls out of school the opening plan or changes a schedule pretty late in the day and the community partners in the after-school programs don't have time to adjust then they can't open the program on time and um and parents need to know ahead of time because they'll they'll move forward we saw this some in the fall they moved forward with other options before that some of the hubs were open because they had to um so the more as we think forward this winter and spring of how to meet the needs of children and families the more we can pay attention to timing and communication um I think is really important um I think that we also learned some assumptions about um funding and flexibility and Commissioner Brown spoke to that um really eloquently um earlier this morning um there's also some assumptions uh not every school wants to run after school or wants to run childcare they don't they didn't with the hubs they don't always want to do it not every employer many times they wanted to run a hub let's say or an after-school program but when we got further into discussion maybe they had a space but they didn't actually want to run it themselves right they wanted a community partner the Y or a community organization to come in and run the program um they wanted to happen but they didn't want to to run it themselves we had very few hardly any that that step forward to do that so um but on the other hand not all of our after-school programs are part of the regulated system you know so how do we develop solutions um that really support the the full field um cross-agency collaboration was also spoken about I can't say how highly I have valued and treasured the collaboration with DCF and CDD through the fall especially around the hubs and the work to support the childcare field we work with a number of state agencies and both the collaboration with Vermont after-school but also across each other was really what helped make things move and then I will say for the after-school field as a whole I think the childcare field it's in the 30% I guess the capacity has been lowered after school especially with the summer was about 50% but that's taking into account as well things like teen centers and some of the non-regulated programs where we're still seeing gaps as I said there were many after-school providers and youth serving organizations that have extended their hours um they they didn't have remote learning days they didn't qualify for hubs or if it was too late in the fall and a hub couldn't be established or now in January and they're running extended times there there isn't an easy way to pay for that and often the participation fees um I think represented from from said you had a question about that it really does fall on families and we've seen that over and over again even in some of the hubs where the hub was in a school building where a child normally attended school the parent was now taking them to the school the same building right sometimes with the same staff and now having to pay for that care um and and that was you know often hard to reconcile and you know paying for six to 30 hours of care um that you weren't expecting to pay for is a heavy burden um so I'm hoping any solutions moving forward can to really focus on um alleviating those costs and those fees the other thing we learned is you know middle school youth also need access especially on remote learning days um the the hub program ended at grade six and we had a number of parents and families looking for care for seventh and eighth graders and it's the same with our child care system that ends right around like 12 years old or 13th birthday um middle school students are prime for risky behaviors right um and when you look at all the primary prevention and I know that something this committee cares about deeply and there's so much research about how after school helps with primary prevention um but they gotta have programs um and they've gotta have supervised and supportive programs and um those are really key years when we when we don't necessarily want them home alone um the focus on mental health resilience youth voice I think is going to be important um on the next year and um and I will say the demand uh there is a one of the handouts I gave you is from the after school for all report it came out in December 2020 um it's a national study it's based on a parent survey and it found that Vermont there's about 26,000 children and youth who would be in programs today and found that the largest barriers were availability so there's areas of the state where there are no programs affordability the fees are too high and accessibility and they talked about transportation so those were the three main barriers um I will also point out um if you look at that handout it's America after 3-1 that Vermont was ranked um in the top 10 in the nation for the second time in a row last time was in 2014 for after school programming uh but we were ranked 51st in the nation for the percentage of kids who were in after school programs to qualify for a free reduced lunch meals so low income kids we have the lowest the first DC was in the mix um the lowest rate low children in our programs and that is related to the fees and accessibility uh look on recommendation please please please please please um as we have learned during COVID when you child care excuse me um Holly you're having or at least I'm hearing problems I'm wondering if you could take your picture yourself off your own video your your own picture off and just talk for a while am I the only one committee who was having a little trouble no I'm having trouble too I'm sorry I think it's well it's either I've usually when this happens we suggest that people go voice only and I think but I'm now looking at other people who know things more than I do yeah just stop your video Holly okay is that better yeah okay sorry about that um can she share her um screen or she has to do it all video Holly should be able to share her screen as well okay yeah okay it takes a village thank you all right well I appreciate the support um so recommendations um once again just this committee for thinking about that full range child care throughout code um at you know especially the elementary school um but also I would say and up through grade eight at least um and continued parity for the after school field alongside the early childhood and child care field um both in and in vaccination um and I would say that all day teachers um I'm also hoping that as these plans in schools around uh remediation and enrichment opportunity um that uh they continue that they include after school early um and often those plans um that as we look at the cost of running programs for child care and learning outside the school day that we stay in recovery dollars um so full burden to all the parents and families over this year um finally I'm hoping and am I envisioning this year we being about that youth resilience piece and addressing those concerns that data that we looked at up top up front about stress anxiety lonely mental health um and that when we build our replants for recovery that we don't only talk about us it's really important but we also about community kitchen I would lower plan number to start now um and to include apple and child in those conversations with schools I think there's going to be important um I would love to increase support now families and and children throughout the winter spring and then fall um I will stop there share and um be to take any questions um and just to say some of the other handouts that gave you I gave you a fuller packet with data on the Vermont youth project um I also shared a handout that has some resources on the connection between after home resilience um especially for those who are new to committee um after school there's so much data in Vermont around um dissipate in our school programs having lower risk behaviors and so it's really of a key you know primary prevention strategy in our state and that handout just points to some of that those numbers say Holly Holly thank you very much I want to see if um what the questions are because you have presented us with some very um interesting and thought-provoking information especially as it relates to um the middle school kids or whatever um I used to say that there's about a two-year period of time max where parents don't have to worry about risky behaviors and just when they don't need child care you they really can't be left alone for a while um uh representative Redmond I believe you have your hand up and you are muted no I don't have my hand up madam chair a representative wood and small oh you have oh that's because um it was my cursor was on your I apologize okay representative wood and then representative small thank you madam chair um Holly um I wrote down something and I think I don't know if I misheard it or I misunderstood it um uh did you say that there was a reduction in capacity of after school programs of 50 percent I did say that um not most surveys that we did over summer um there were uh and it also included so not just the the regulated child care so the school run and the community based on the teen centers um a number of um we're not able to run um ran into a difficult summer as well um access to space especially wouldn't allow to use that space and um am I stuck am are you able to hear me again am I it is sort of stuttering a bit oh speaks I don't know what helps what else would help on that I'm so sorry um all right um here um so has that come up has that come up at all now that schools are at least partially in session you know use of their facilities and things something's better um something um there are some that felt um that they uh never wanted to all services during COVID uh they felt that families were stressed enough so even with virtual learning allow their programs to run um it's it was kind of a district district uh disson um on that and then often the program the older youth some of the teen centers and so forth and the health data is different for the older youth so that also does in some of those decisions um okay um and then I just had a quick question I took a quick look at the remote youth project um data summary that you provided and I'm just curious if that is coordinated with the um youth behavior youth risk behavior survey that the department of health I think believe does it's it seems like um a lot of similar information and I'm just wondering if that's the same survey or a different survey or if it's coordinated in some way um if it is a different survey it is um it's in partnership though we work closely with the department of health on that project the remote youth project uh the folks of the remote youth project survey is a little bit different um the youth risk behavior survey is national surveillance tool so it's about checking at a point in time and it takes about a year and a half or two before we get that data back the deal with the um remote youth project bay and the work plan at youth that it's a real time spent and it's meant to be a strategy identifying survey do the survey in October we get data back within weeks and then the whole series of work that we do um with the community to use that data to improve strategies in those different domains um school family um peer groups and um out of school they have slightly difficulties um there is they do um things that align there are questions that align um but I will say the the planet youth survey um really tries to get it not just smoking but why you know are you turning e-cigarettes or where are you accessing alcohol so it gets me like what would drive some of those strategies so it's not just what are the behavior what are the risk and protective factors leading those behaviors are you good representative wood thank you madam chair um representative small thank you madam chair and thank you holly for your presentation um and looking at the data here I'm not seeing pieces in relation to racial equity so wondering if there are disparities within our communities of who is able to access these services in regards to identity and the second piece kind of coming from the wunewski perspective here is knowing our new american families are hesitant around engaging in child care services because of the cultural competency as well as language barriers that exist and wondering if there are any considerations moving into the new year that we should be aware of that is a great and I'm really glad I asked it thank you um so I don't have data from that survey but we do have a search um analyst staff and uh we've been looking at the equity and inclusion data for the after school field for a few years now I will say that the the main group uh that rises top concern is the lgpqi um they're really uh significantly underrepresented in uh after school programs and the participating um also do you see some racial disparities um certain areas since as far as the english language learners and new americans times the participant um is actually higher uh when programs really reached out and are providing supports uh for those student populations um we'll also say that there is a new inclusion tool we we're working with on the next foundation um and that programs across the state highlighting this year really look at you know the structure of their program their outreach their communication um how they reach youth how they interact with families they can do around staffing and so really um emphasize inclusion we've also been running a diversity inclusion series of community practice year long for the entire field so we're hope to um really raise a where um and I do appreciate your question thank you holly and now building on the information that you shared in relation to lgbtq youth um uh do you understand why the disparities exist with child care providers and access I'm not sure I have answer to that yet um have been um with some of our youth and our youth councils um around this issue uh we really have to respect um the work that outright verman is doing um with young people and their youth council um and I would say now we're really to elevate the issue and try to understand it I'm not sure we have all the answers yet um uh representative Whitman has a question and then representative brumsted has a question as well thank you madam chair and thank you holly um I just wanted a quick clarification I heard you mention a statistic that we are 51st in the nation as far as providing um I don't even want to attempt I had something to do with uh food assistance programs and participation in after school could you just clarify that or tell me where I can uh if that was included in your documents or anything like that yes yes one in the hand up some thank you the question is from the america after three and that's the report that um says ninth ninth in the nation for after programming our high ranking is based on parent parent satisfaction and the quality of our programs that we came in 31st um for its percentage of children who are in after school programs who qualify as low income so that's the way right it's not the rate of low income the state who are in after so when you look at the number of kids in a program that's the state of what percentage qualify and um nationally believe uh that percentage is around like 45 or something and and we're at 15 thank you very much um thank you uh representative brumsted and then representative mcfaun thank you madam chair I was going to leave mine in the chat I'm sorry I just a quick and a quick question and also want to mention that Amy Schoenberger just put in the link to that report that we asked for so that's great too um thank you Amy um Holly I just wondered if the um the survey information that you have been talking about if teachers especially middle school teachers are able to um see that information and process it a little because they're working with all these kids too yes thank you so last week actually we brought the five communities together with the lead researcher alfair christian from iceland um to dig into the data with their planning teams so each community is their mini level data there's a whole separate set of that the school and those go to the super events um that's who we sent to and hopefully they show the principles um one of the things that we try to be careful with the data is that we don't have with one community um comparing us to another community and sort of like well we're been so and so now or the other thing we don't want to run into is um so much having the community just look at the school you know the school is the problem and the school is going to be the one to find all the solutions part of the Vermont youth project model is that it is not all about the school it's about the community about the family it's about out of school time right and so part of how we actually got communities to sign on to pilot the model is by explaining to schools that it wasn't going to all be on them we have to survey through the school because they have the youth um and you know we like young people but we don't want them to be ones that are responsible for all the strategies or answers so the data goes to them and then they can share it um they want to and the community why you know where schools are all mixed and averaged out in the community's hands um and they're going through a prom now rolling out and sharing um across their communities thank you Holly as a past school board member I love that you're looking at all the broad perspective on this and um all the things at play that is just terrific thank you um representative McFawn was I calling on you and you didn't have a question or you do have one um no I I had a question and it was answered oh okay great um Holly thank you thank you very much um and committee there are lots of reports um and more information that she has um given us and I think that um it will be interesting for us to look at who are the five communities um etc in terms of where the data's been brought from I do want to um comment that it is 11 o'clock and um if we want to give anyone time for lunch we would be leaving at 11 45 um and so our next um want to welcome um sherry Carlson who is the chief programs officer of let's grow kids and Sarah Kenny who is the chief policy officer of let's grow kids and um let's grow kids have um testified a lot um a lot in front of this committee they also testified um or presented all sorts of data and their report to the women's caucus and so I would ask that they not do the same thing here today um you have both of you here I'm not sure who is speaking thank you madam chair we're gonna um do a little baton pass here um thanks for inviting us to be here today we recognize that there are still lots of witnesses to get through so um we'll condense um we I just want to start by saying that um sherry is the parent of two young adults and I have a middle schooler and I just want to reinforce the data that Holly just shared which really reflects a lot of what we're seeing from our kids contemporaries um so we're really we really value our relationship with the Vermont after school and our partnership and um the work they're doing is so important so important to think about our kids across the age spectrum so we've been really happy to partner with them in a couple different ways through the course of this pandemic um and we just wanted to share with the committee today some of the insights that um we've been able to glean through all of this work over the past 10 months and then a little bit of what we're seeing in terms of opportunities moving forward and sherry's gonna kick us off thanks Sarah again for the record my name is sherry carlson i'm the chief programs officer for let's grow kids and as most of you know let's grow kids is a nonprofit organization on a mission and we're working to ensure affordable access to high quality child care for all Vermonters by 2025 so over the past seven years we've grown into a small team um with this mission in mind and um into a movement with over 30 000 supporters from all walks of life this includes families early childhood educators business leaders health professionals and vermont community members who realize the essential role that child care plays in the lives of vermont children and families for our communities and our businesses and for our economy so um even before the pandemic vermont as we've talked about before had faced a child care crisis three out of five of vermont's youngest children didn't have access to child care they needed and research had estimated that vermont would need an additional 2000 early childhood educators to meet the demand and as we've talked about before COVID-19 has exacerbated these challenges so in order to address the challenges pre-pandemic and even more intensely post-pandemic a very um or not post we're not post yet god soon a very big part of let's grow kids work is our direct support of child care programs so over the years we have been mentoring and supporting the state's early childhood educator and child care programs and helping them to strengthen their programs to expand existing programs and also to create new ones and we've been um able to dramatically increase that work thanks to investments that the administration and legislature have made over the past two years in expanding a child care capacity so just to give you a little some numbers um over the past three years we've been able to pay our state investments with philanthropic um philanthropic dollars and invest almost four million dollars in additional high quality child care spaces in vermont so these spaces and investments have really helped to counteract the widespread closures um that other states have seen because of the pandemic and we're on track to reach a total of over 2000 additional high quality spaces located throughout the state by june um 2021 and we have even more projects and spaces in the pipeline another big part of our work is being a resource for child care programs we have a team of experienced early educators who provide technical assistance to programs with technology business solutions shared services their program practices and working um to advance early childhood workforce to be recognized as a profession over the past year we've provided some specific ta to help um child care programs reopen stay open respond to the operational challenges of doing business during a pandemic and i just will you know it's been said before but we've had a firsthand look at the many incredible ways that early childhood education programs have adapted and innovated since the early days of the pandemic and i don't want us to forget that 30 percent about 30 percent of the regulated child care programs have stayed open throughout the pandemic and we're providing care to um children of essential workers last spring as programs began to reopen um some shifted to outdoor classrooms or others invested in major structural changes to keep children and staff safe and adhere to the state's health and safety guidelines early childhood educators got really creative and helping children adapt to the new world where faces are covered where sharing is no longer encouraged where parents aren't allowed in the building at pick up or drop off um their amazing adaptability and creativity and resilience um has truly shown over the past year and they do all of this as we know for little pay no health care benefits and often no other benefits now the pandemic has added to the existing challenges and created nuance it is also highlighted some of the deep inequities in our child care system families have had enormous child care struggles over the past year on many levels here again some of the important investments that the legislature and administration have made both before and during the pandemic have softened the blow for many vermoners the investments the legislature and administration made in child care financial assistance in 2019 meant that low-income families were better able to afford care and yet we know and knew we have so much more work to do while some of the closure information shared by commissioner brown brown can seem daunting vermon's child care system has fared better than most all other child care systems in the country and that's thanks to the remarkable investments made by the legislature and administration since COVID-19 hit so on behalf of let's grow kids i want to thank you for your hard work and dedication to supporting vermon's child care system during this unprecedented time our work in vermont your work continues to set a standard for the nation and how to sustain this essential industry and because of swift thoughtful and consistent action vermont's fragile but essential child care education system early education system avoided what could have been utter disaster and programs in families and early childhood educators did receive some crucial supports so as we heard earlier child development division is working hard on plans to design a program for the new federal COVID-19 response funds that we expect to come to vermont totaling what we hear is about 12.5 million these funds will help but they won't solve our bigger structural problems which existed prior to the pandemic and i'm turning it over to sarah to touch on a few of those we're not going to spend a lot of time today talking about those bigger structural issues that we need to solve together because i'm hoping we'll have more opportunities to do that in the coming days but commissioner brown specifically highlighted a number of initiatives in his testimony earlier and it's always so nice to be able to come to the committee and say we really agree with the child development division in reflecting on some of those challenges and challenges and some of the opportunities we have moving forward and representative brumsted earlier highlighted this key question about affordability for families and we did the investments that you made have meant that there's more support for families who are enrolled in the child care financial assistance program that eligibility was expanded slightly and that has really helped families especially as programs were closing and reopening and families have been having to make really hard decisions about whether they're going to send kids back for how long if they even have a choice in that and so we can look forward to continuing to work with you all on that five-year redesign plan in the meantime during the the early days of the closure period during the pandemic the state made an important change which was shifting to paying programs based on the number of children who were enrolled in the child care program as opposed to who was attending in any given week um and that is national best practice in general and it meant that families didn't have to worry about paying tuition unexpectedly when ccfap wouldn't cover it if their kids were and actually in the program it provided a consistent source of funding for programs through that period and the state switched back to paying based on attendance once the programs were allowed work were all encouraged to reopen and that's a switch that we would recommend switching back to especially during these coming months of continued pandemic response but but moving forward it's really best practice and it makes a huge difference for families and for programs then when we think about access and quality for programs as sherry said we've been working in close partnership with cdd thanks to the support that you all authorized to build the capacity of programs um and it's really critical and i think you all have had some really good conversation already this morning about we don't really know what's coming in terms of how much capacity will be needed but everybody we talked to is really desperately waiting to be able to get back into their healthcare program so we are not anticipating that there will be a huge drop-off in demand post-pandemic for child care capacity and now is really the time to continue investing in that capacity in large part because a lot of those investments result in stable programs and reduces the level of turnover we see in programs where some are closing new ones are opening higher quality programs are stronger and better able to weather storms and pandemics like this one so now the time to continue those those infrastructure investments um we also agree with commissioner brown that the relief grant program the operational relief grant program was a really helpful resource for programs once you all helped to smooth out some of the wrinkles in the application process for that program um thank you for that too we are looking forward to working with the administration to um to support them and thinking what that what this next round of funding can support um I was pleased to hear some of the ideas that commissioner brown floated this morning for that um we did hear during the operational relief grant program cycle this past fall that the applications were really difficult for a lot of programs um and so we'll recommend that um that the department look at the division look at some of the more streamlined applications that they use for other other relief programs that they operated during coven I think there's a way to do the level of data tracking that the commissioner is talking about which is important and also make it easy for programs that are just juggling so much and are so far under water right now and trying to manage everything and lower tuition lower income because fewer children are attending um we want to make it as easy as possible for folks to access those programs um I was also really pleased to hear commissioner brown reference um the the challenges that programs are facing and recruiting and retaining staff and the just the incredible level of commitment that sherry highlighted that we've seen from early childhood educators over the past year the best indicator of quality in a program is the expertise and the professional preparation of the early childhood educators who are in that program and we knew we had to work for shortage even before the pandemic and that has only been widely wildly exacerbated by our current situation so um we really need to support people who are currently in the field um and support access to care into the future by continuing to shore up the workforce in early childhood education programs um and there are lots of investments that we can be making there with these new federal funds and with other investments to support access to professional preparation to um workforce stabilization and other wage support programs um and to professional learning opportunities for folks I think early childhood educators have literally been on the front lines of responding to children's and families needs and I'm glad you're going to hear from one of the parent child centers because they've been really involved in that as well um and having a skilled workforce that's well versed in the impact of trauma and creating equitable classrooms has never been more important than it is right now and so providing those professional pathways for folks to develop those skills is critically important and then it wouldn't be Sarah talking to the Human Services Committee if I didn't circle back to the issue of IT which you all have talked about at length this morning and is so important um and you know we have seen yes we knew before the pandemic that the IT system at CDD was fragile and it has really compounded the difficulties in being able to manage supporting programs through the pandemic so it has definitely impacted pandemic response I would say so we know that that you all have discussed with Commissioner Brown already the fact that the underspend in the child care financial assistance program for this current fiscal year is almost exactly the amount needed for the IT system we still are hopeful that there might be a way to move those funds forward into the coming fiscal year to continue that build out of the modules that Commissioner Brown was describing this morning and even if it's even if that's not possible there are definitely other ways that the the child care system needs support right now and that those child care dollars should be directed to continue to support child care purposes as opposed to dropping the bottom line in the general fund so thank you all so much we know that our recovery from COVID really depends on us getting child care rate and we're so happy to be working with you all on this we're happy to take questions and and also looking forward to um hearing from Building Bright Futures who has a a lot more data to share from folks around the state right now represent McFawn Thank you madam chair um I'm going to go back to a question that I asked earlier um it made this statement that people are waiting to get their children back into the child care programs did I hear that right yeah what I meant by that was I think they're waiting for it to feel safe for them to send kids back or for them to be able to go back to their workplaces and then needing child care or for their kids to be back in school full time so that they can actually go back full-time work I was just at the the commission on women did an event last week and shared some new unemployment data that indicated that 74 percent of the unemployment claims are women in Vermont and that doesn't include all the people who just temporarily or permanently stopped looking for work because they have to be home with their kids right now and a lot of those are people at least in my universe and a lot of folks I talk to are people with school age kids who need to be home anyway and so are also keeping their younger children yeah that that's happening with with one of my daughters at this point um my question is this at this point in time um do you feel that we are going to have the capacity to meet that need going forward with the problems of recruiting staff and the problems of facilities not reopening no I mean we didn't have the capacity before the pandemic represented and it's only that's what I mean you have you you've tuned into one of the things that keeps sherry and me awake at night sherry i don't know if you want to say more about that so we know that all right we're all in agreement so what can we do about that we've got a ton of money and how can we use that money to build that capacity that's that's what i'm looking for we have a lot of ideas represented in mcfon and i'm she can't tell but i'm looking at your chair because i know we're going to be talking about this specific question more in the coming days so we can talk about a little bit now or we can know that i can wait i can wait as long as we're all going to get on that page sometimes because it's it's nice to talk about everything that we've done and and all of it is great and it's nice to talk about the support that we did during the pandemic what we have to realize is the situation that we're in today as we're sitting here is worse than it was back in march in terms of the pandemic so uh i know that's going to get better with the vaccinations and as this need comes up we need to be ready we need to have the capacity to deal with it so that's what i want to talk about when we get to it not today because we don't have time to really do it right thank you representative pew you're muted sorry thank you thank you representative mcfon um uh sarah i have a question for you we're looking at the budget adjustment and that's um as i've said before that's rearranging the deck chairs um and uh there's a little bit of money right now that in the um proposed budget um related to child care it's going to go to the bottom line so if you had to make a choice between putting it towards it or to um uh switching to the um switching the way of reimburse of delivering um cfap which is your preference which do you think would make the most difference in um to families and what a great question representative pew um i actually am glad that melissa regal garret is still online because i don't know what the overall cost would be or how far four point eight million dollars would get us if in switching back to an enrollment based system for child care financial assistance and i don't know if i don't know if cdb knows that number off the top of their heads either but i think it would be really great to look at um i'm not talking money i'm talking what is the better um what what is the better policy response well you know i'm an advocate so i would always of course say both and i think the it system really underpins our ability to do all of the other structural changes that we're looking at moving forward and i'm also sensitive to the child development divisions i don't know what the limitations are i really appreciated representative brome said earlier asking commissioner brown the question about but if you had all the money right now could you do all the modules at once and i'm not i couldn't completely tell if that would even be a possibility and i see melissa off the video so i don't know if you would like her to chime in on that um the answer the question i asked you was make a choice yes the answer that you gave was it i think with one time dollars that would be a logical yes melissa hi welcome back thank you so much madam chair it's great to be back um people sort of were talking about you as if you had information for us or additional information um around cost or things like that and so i thought i would offer you the opportunity to say you can respond or to say that you'll get back to us yeah we would uh welcome the opportunity to get back to you uh if you wanted to um have your assistant send us specific questions um we would be happy to follow up uh i can tell you that um the question of enrollment versus attendance is definitely a much deeper dive question around policy um than uh just a straightforward answer uh and there are many ways that our system different from many other state systems has levers that we are already utilizing that make it pretty much an attendance-based enrollment system um so uh and i would also uh stress that uh as commissioned around testified to um our staff are uh doing uh hand manipulations of our system in order to make payroll on a regular basis and any changes in this moment uh including uh trying to go to enrollment that that's actually a hand-run system for us that's how we had to do it last time during the closure period and so uh without a change in it the capacity to actually implement that change would be difficult for us um so but i'd be happy to get you and you've just gone mute you're happy to get you okay more information if you have further questions on uh policy change itself or um funding uh thank you thank you melissa um okay committee um committee i need your help um it is 11 30 we have 15 more minutes and we have three people that we have not heard from and i don't want to give them and i so apologize for having too big an appetite and trying to fit too much in um we um there is a part of me that would um give um margo homes the opportunity to um speak uh partially because i think morgan has more to say than in 15 minutes um and um uh morgan from the building bright futures um and uh amy from voices for for my children um said she has bad internet so that's sort of where i am going and i so apologize um but i will take input from one the people who have been waiting all day and listening and two from you all in terms of what you think makes most sense or whether to give everyone five minutes man chair it seems as though your direction sounds sounds good uh margo has a parent child center to get back to running so um that would seem to make sense and i think we could probably have the other folks back next next week and um amy has um voices for brahmans children has offered to submit testimony in writing um for the interim and that would be great um um and i don't see a my vote is for margo to go okay um and um uh morgan is graciously saying that she would welcome the opportunity at another time um i really thank the two of you and margo please um the floor is yours thank you so much madam chair for the opportunity to come speak with you all today i promise only to take a couple minutes of your time take as much time as you need you've been waiting all day thank you uh so my name is margo holmes and i am the executive director at the springfield area parent child center in north springfield vermont uh so first and foremost i would like to thank all of you for your support and efforts on behalf of children and families and the child care providers during the covet 19 pandemic it has made a huge difference in in our functioning during this time i also just briefly wanted to speak to the budget question that just arose um with uh let's grow kids and while i agree that both would absolutely be best i also believe that the most uh impactful thing that we can do is what is going to make the biggest difference uh in the lives of children and families and while an IT system would certainly make things easier for providers to provide care i i believe that families would be impacted most uh by a change in the way that ccfap is administered to ensure consistency of care so during this difficult time we have seen amazing strengths and incredible challenges i do have a handout uh that i hope that you all have that goes into more detail and i'm just going to highlight a few of those today uh we see that children are struggling with inconsistent schedules due to shutdowns and quarantine requirements they are dealing with inconsistent caregivers as teachers often have to be out for the same reasons and they are dealing with learning a whole new way of interacting with those around them because of facial coverings and simple things such as not being able to sing indoors or play a game of tag these things can create increases in challenging behaviors for young children with this we are also seeing the incredible resilience of children but children need resilient caregivers in order to support this social emotional minefield parents and child care staff alike are stressed exhausted and lonely child care staff have done amazing things to adapt to this by offering virtual preschool programs zoom circle times take home activities and growing in their own professional development to respond to emerging challenges they continue to do all of this with no increase in resources wages are neither competitive nor sufficient families are responding to this time by adapting to new technology learning the new ways of interacting with staff and growing in their own knowledge of child development they are doing all of this while struggling with unemployment or reduced work hours high child care bills and other expenses and parenting children who continue to have their own struggles i would like to share two stories with you in springfield we have a four-year-old little boy who was just diagnosed with a very rare form of bone cancer staff who have cared for this little boy for years cannot even give him his mother a hug we are doing our best to support them in many other ways we are cooking for them daily and delivering meals to their home we are creating zoom opportunities for him to spend time with his friends and teachers we have forgiven a child care bill and held their slot indefinitely and we are joining community-wide fundraising efforts to support them to pay their medical bills this is what child care programs do we care for children and their families also in our child care program we have an associate teacher who is a single mother of four young children in various school programs while she's doing everything she can to be at work consistently she's continuously had to keep her children home due to state required quarantines she and her children have been tested repeatedly in the last several months causing anxiety and difficulties and waiting for the results sometimes for a whole week she has exhausted her paid time off she has exhausted her support system to help her care for her kids so she can come to work or to pick up groceries for her and her children during quarantine times she's struggling to make ends meet as a conscientious employer we continue to support her in every way possible but it also creates challenges for our program we cannot increase the number of slots available in our classrooms because we know we will have this and other staff out for these reasons continuously this creates enormous reductions in income at a time when expenses are at an all-time high we continue to pay additional staff or outside cleaning agencies for extensive cleaning and disinfecting services and we have upgraded HVAC systems and physical space to adhere to safety guidelines we appreciate the COVID relief funding that has been granted to support these efforts but it goes beyond just this pandemic this was a struggling system before the pandemic and it will continue to struggle after unless we take this moment to make the critical changes that are needed we need a system that meets families and programs where they are and creates a sustainable multi-generational system of care that focuses on strengthening families so children can thrive we want to hold on to this opportunity to embrace what has worked during this time and move toward greater equity and build on what we have learned during this challenge we want to ensure that the open conversations between the state and our parent child center network will remain a regular feature going forward as the state of Vermont thinks about recovery plans and implementation we want to be at the table to ensure that the families that we serve are considered and centered in the planning we must acknowledge that child care is an essential service essential to children to families to employers and to communities and we must act accordingly as we design our state's future thank you so much for the opportunity to speak and i'm happy to take any questions margo thank you um questions for margo perpett and mcfaun i can't tell if you're looking to ask a question if you would like me to i will ask one um sometimes i do have one i really do have one i was trying to decide whether i should ask it or not um i i i don't know whether this is true or not um was one of the executive orders yesterday that was signed to raise the minimum wage to fifteen dollars an hour oh you mean answer um you mean um the executive orders that our new president signed yes um if it happened if it happened what does that do to the the wages are not competitive and we are certainly in support of raising the minimum wage to fifteen dollars an hour and supporting uh staff who are paid some of the lowest wages to be brought up um with with that ship as as minimum wages are raised the concern that it does pose is on the other end of that how it impacts our bottom lines and how we are able to pay for increasing that minimum wage if we have to increase child care expenses um and tuition in order to pay for that minimum wage uh that will oftentimes be deferred to to parents to have to pay either a co-pay even if they're at a hundred percent uh financial assistance um or for private pay tuition uh that will increase for families and that creates an enormous burden um for families who are already dealing with very high child care bills um margo um ballpark what is the average salary in your in your parent child center at my parent child center about two years ago we raised our minimum wage to uh thirteen fifty an hour we had been down at eleven fifty an hour as our minimum wage we raised it up to thirteen fifty and on average our child care staff are paid approximately fourteen to fourteen twenty five an hour thank you representative brumstead sorry i did my answer was around or my question was right around those two issues that just came up and i i guess since i'm unmuted all i can say is wow and i'm so sorry about those two fam i mean i know there are millions of or hundreds of families with those kind of stories but thank you for the work you do thank you um thank you thank you margo and you you as as well as um let's grow kids as well on some level as holly highlighted the fact that we're sort of balancing or juggling a system that before the pandemic was fragile and um with the pandemic that's sort of highlighted that um and uh part of our challenge is the pandemic has a showed us that we can't keep doing things the same way we did them before because before wasn't good it was maybe okay but it wasn't good so that may mean policy changes and so we are looking for policy changes and ideas about how to do things differently um let's grow kids has been focused on maintaining the system so what is it that we need to do differently to maintain the system and margo you began your comments with i'm concerned about ensuring that you know that you were talking about the families well so what needs to be different in order to ensure that families have access to affordable accessible child care um and after school care and um so i guess you know my my um my plea to all of you who are um listening is um what do we need to do differently um there were there were a lot of strings attached or there were some strings attached to the federal money that we got related to covid and um part of those strings were defining very specifically that the money was to be spent on the um particular idiosyncratic issues that the pandemic um um highlighted not to address underlying or ongoing expenses um if that is still if that's still going to remain or something similar to that we're not going to be able to fix the underlying issues necessarily of the system with the covid dollars so some of what we'll need to be figuring out is where are we going to what is it that we can do to um to both address the pandemic the the particular um issues that the pandemic has has provided and what can we learn as both of as all of you who testified today what what worked in terms of how we are doing and what should we continue to do um with that and that's going to be a lot of what that's going to be some of it's not some one of the multitude of one of the issues that we will be trying to to deal with and thinking about and um what i didn't really hear any of you talk about was night town child care weekend child care and or um uh things like that and um margo is is texting texting um on the chat and and directing us all to her handout which is on our web page um with all of the ideas in terms of that so um this is this is the taste test menu and we'll probably be inviting you all back this um at various pieces um but i really thank you um thank all of you for being part of this morning's um discussion sort of on how are the children and where are we going to go as a especially as it relates um to child care and we have um some very important you know feedback um and and input from um building bright futures and from voices to sort of continue that um discussion uh so um if there's no other comment from the committee or from any of you who came to testify and have stayed with us or um for the morning with that this ends uh the morning um committee meeting for house human services on uh january 21st 2021