 Welcome back it's still the breakfast and plus CV Africa this is quite a very controversial subject but I'm sure to make for an interesting conversation well Paris Saint-Germain and Borocco defender Ashraf Akimi left his wife Hiba Abouk shocked following a divorce application she filed over allegations of infidelity about Abouk who is 36 approached the court to seek the dissolution of their marriage and demanded half of Akimi's property half of his wealth in a divorce settlement however it was discovered that he had no assets no single asset. Now the 24-year-old Borocco international had registered all his property and assets under his mother Sadia Moot's name in her name. Ashraf Akimi's wife had taken the court for a divorce case and wanted them to separate the assets and divide them in court when the divorce took place and they agreed to share the assets they realized that Ashraf Akimi had no assets and neither did the bank. Have anything in his name? Ashraf Akimi had put all his fortune in his mother's name a long time ago this are the words of Stard Football Club it's a publication right there in in Europe. Now reactions however from a wide-ranging section of the public in Nigerian around the world have varied with some questioning the action of the footballer famous Nigerian Catholic priest Reverend father Chinneye Oluoma said that one's mother sister or any other person is secondary to his wife. Now the pair started courting in 2018 got married in 2020 and have two sons she filed for divorce in March 2023 and of course this like you say the rest is history now is this approach or this approach rather by Hakimi one that husbands should adopt in this increased or this age of increased divorce especially in sub-Saharan Africa and in Nigeria in particular. Joining us to do justice to this and other questions is Julie Mogul who is the family-bound nurse Justice Vazoum Prabhu. Julie nice to have you. Coffee is the name. Yes it's all right it's all right but Julie interesting and I would like us to listen to a pastor and this is Pasalaunri of House on the Rock, Podhakat and we all love Pasalaunri I know him personally and he he shared some thoughts in his ceremony church recently which has gained some attention on social media we'll use that as the basis for our conversation as well as some fuel for what we want to talk about so we'll roll the tape and when we come back Julie we continue with you so one is asking me in a control room Hakimi's mostly why we bring it here because every other person including those who are Christians and those who are non-Muslims are also saying ah there's something I can do so but Julie should Nigerian husbands and generally husbands in general to this use the Hakimi option let's call it that. I think thank you very much for bringing this topic up I think it's something that needs to be addressed since the news broke out with the divorce issue of Hakimi and his wife there's been a lot of reactions on social media across social media platforms I think that the first thing that Nigerian husbands should do and even before they become husbands what they should do is to have an understanding be sure that they know very well what it means to be married because that is where we have a fundamental issue if you do not understand what marriage is it's definitely going to bring a problem so if I were to answer that question directly I would say that Nigerian husbands go take another look why would you want to tell the Hakimi's pathway what kind of wife are you married to what kind of family do you want to raise what is your vision of your family what were your thoughts when you got married in the first place why did you get married in the first instance so if you're able to answer these questions I'm sure they will find an answer to themselves if this is actually the path to go and I'm sure that the response also the reactions will be different from husbands whose wives are already comfortable so why would you want to tell that path if you know that you're married it's not like it's not like it was in the in the past the things if the situation is different now so it's different from how it was when we had our moms and our grandmoms so it's not a question of whether to show their path or look at your peculiar situation and then you decide for yourself if that's the path to take especially when children are involved okay so this is a straight no from you this is not a path to tell is that what you're saying it's not a path it's not a path to tell it's not a path it's not advisable all right and we're looking at the Nigerian context also looking at the you know global context then divorce is really on the increase in this part of the world in Nigerian Sub-Saharan Africa would you agree with that as a family-bound nurse yes it's it's been on the increase we actually had a discussion I had to raise it on a Christian platform somehow these discussions are not fully delved into they are not dissected on some Christian platforms it's been a topic of discussion in in some churches in some groups but I had to raise it on this platform and some reactions they were like okay divorce is not an option for certain religious people in this context the same for Christians divorce is not an option and I told them I said hey let's face it it may not be the standard that we are taught by all that we are we are asked to live by but it is happening there's been an increase I think in legacy the loan especially during the lockdown there was a massive a massive increase in domestic violence and then there was a record of the number of divorces that was that was recorded in Ikea alone I think they had about 90,000 90,000 divorces so there's been an increase in divorces in Sub-Saharan Africa in Nigeria in different parts across religion there has been but they are separated but even going outrightly to divorce completely it's been on the increase thank you very much so you're saying basically that I hope I got you right the divorce is on the increase in this part of the world and what accounts for this this this you know tilt towards divorce in Nigeria if it's such a high you know it's that rate is increasing you're a family boner so I'm guessing that you you give some therapy you know to families and all that and if you've dealt with families marriages of couples going through difficult time what are the major issues driving the increasing rate of divorce in Nigeria today so with the experiences that I have had as a nurse I decided to work with families to nurse relationships in order to improve health outcomes so whether it's relationship within family members or within the nurses the doctors and their patients on the word everyone has some form of connection so if we have healthier relationships we have better positions to have a more positive experience as we live daily so what would I say is the cause in the in the cause of my work with families with individuals and all the practitioners we have discovered that there's something for the mentally wrong with how we were brought up now let me explain so you see that there's a young boy and a young girl in the family it's okay for the boy to hang out with the boys to stay out late at night and come home whenever he likes in some homes the boy is the first to kind of get a car and maybe to get a job while the woman the girl is being groomed to be a wife when she coughs it says that how you're gonna cough in your husband's house when she dresses when she walks is that how you're gonna get married you want to go get a job you want to buy a car you want to do this one you want to travel you want to live by yourself so constantly the girl is made to she's groomed she's conditioned to be a home person she's conditioned to be a wife to be a mother she's trained that way that was how many of our mothers and some of us were trained so the guys were left on their own many of them were left on their own if a man is family friendly even man is an involving father he probably was taught well or he took a personal responsibility to be a better father than his own father if you check very well so we need to check again how our children are being brought up so the guys are left on their own the girls are made to be homemakers and we grow up that way then let's go into relationships or some form of sexual dispositions so it's kind of okay for the man to have a fling to flutter around it's okay for the husband to like many would call it play away match so you're having mistresses you're having concubines and all that it's okay but when you come to the woman she's castigated just check the case that we are looking at many are fast and quick to cast the blame on his wife they're quick to say that he but is at fault he buys a gold digger they didn't go to check what her own net worth is who was she before she got married to this guy she had a life of her own so generally the mentality is kind of screwed is something that needs to be checked how are we brought up that's one then secondly we we do not understand that it is not people that get married values get married is not enough to get moved by your emotions or the hormones flying wild within your system you need to check you need to find out do our values align what does it believe what's his thought what's his thought about working what's his thought about children many do not discuss these things way before I got married I went into conversations with people that were married and you find out that two months into marriage three months six months into marriage and they're saying that they want out they're saying I don't even understand this person and marriage you then I asked the question what were you guys discussing while you were caught in while you were dating so that the usual practice is jumped from one e3 to another go streaming go watch a movie and all that but the very critical things that was that would prove keep your marriage and prevent it from breaking many dating couples or dating partners don't say that don't sit down to discuss things so one for the mentally is our bringing the boys are brought up differently than the girls are to not understanding the purpose of marriage three the belief systems and their values about certain things that has to do with the other individual because these are three things a lot more but let me let me pause here all right you've had a lot of stick for the husbands in you know the reasons why divorce only increase but I'm sure if you have more time yeah I'm sure if you have more time you would also say some things for females as well in there you know but let's look at the issues at stake now we have a difference in culture as to what happens when a divorce happens in the West that we call it Europe America and so North America and so on and what happens to a divorce couple in Africa you can see she's 36 years old so obviously older than her Kimi over here when a divorce is carried out you know is affected in a marriage and what does the wife and the husband what did it go away with because I've seen abroad that if the husband doesn't have much in his account he can he was filing for divorce I've seen a case where the husband is giving you know some part of the wives wealth I've seen a case like that but more from the knot is the man who bears the the brunt you know he has to share his wealth in in in two we know what happened to Tiger Woods and Heidi Klum there's a recent recently a celebrity I can't remember the name readily now said that he was paying child support and the amount of child support was paying every every month was he said it was too high you know if you want to look at all the things that he was had to cater for his kids even when he was their father that the money was not going to the kids that the mother was the one spending it with her boyfriends so what are your thoughts on this practice of of splitting the man's wealth that he's garnered over the years and for for his wife when the divorce takes place whether she has a child or she doesn't have a child apart from that wealth being split he also has to pay child support and this may be reason why some of these things like what Hakimi has done now will be done okay so thank you Kofi so before now what has been the practice is that once there's a divorce the woman is completely or not totally completely stripped of everything that she has even the one that she bought with her own money it is perceived that she acquired that through her husband or it's by a husband or is a husband that acquire those things for her without people going to discover to know to find out to be sure of what woman had that has been the practice and being in a country where before before you get the law to speak for you it takes time on some people wouldn't want to even go through it I if I'm not mistaken when there is a divorce with a married couple that whatever properties that is acquired within that marriage is actually for both couples if you acquire that property within marriage is for both couples but then when you have a you have a thought the reason why you go marry in the first test as you can actually chart your own course as a couple you are a father your your children are going to be taken care of if you happen to have a divorce do what is best what what is in the best interest of your children of your child you have to do that so that they are well-being they are as less affected as possible by the divorce so I think I believe that it is important for properties to be shared for this especially where children are involved but Julie sorry to interrupt you Julie yeah I would just want to add that like I said earlier and the practice more often than not in the West is that after they split the property 50 50 or however however the court sees it you still pay child support every month in thousands of dollars if the hundreds of thousands of dollars tens of thousands of dollars yes because it's not one of you have to be constantly involved in the growth of your children their development so you have to so for the for the child you it's just like paying fees when you think you're not done fees is not just what the child needs there's so many other things that require funding as the child goes on the daily basis so it's still part of your responsibility that your divorce doesn't mean you're not you're not a few seeds to be the father anymore but you give a loan some doesn't mean you're gonna hands off completely I put what I do not support is where the money is made to pay an extremely high amount the woman has a responsibility to play as well she is a partner in this game she has to end her own income as well the problem is just that because of the way we had our parents marriages women have not taken it overboard so they said they want to make their own money no money is going to come mess them up yes it might be a good thing but do it from a positive side do not do it from a from a bitter standpoint these married couples or if you're divorcing your partners already so whatever it is you're doing should not be to hamper the growth of the well-being of your partner of what game would it be if this you decided to come together you're deciding to go apart let them just go freely if you have to show your property do it if you want to take care of your children what are you contributing there's emotional contribution there's a financial there are other there's a social so you share what your responsibilities are allow their access to children except where one partner is seen to be we seem to be a danger to the children if the person is not mentally fit to take care of the children then other means will be sought just to ensure that children are okay I do not support and making the man alone pay for child support or making him pay extremely high amount of support and woman crossing her legs no the woman is equally a partner in this game she has to bring something to the financial table and also be responsible in other areas alright so we're looking at this this Hakimi option like I said let's picture the paint the picture of a scenario Hakimi is a Moroccan you know a football of Moroccan origin born in the Netherlands grew up in the Netherlands so European in outlook starts football from an early age of course we know he used to play for Ajax FC and stuff like that in all these footballers they start very early they signed contracts from the age of 18 and all that you know so builds his wealth and he goes to big clubs like Dortmund you know you have Inter Milan you know PSG these are big clubs in Europe and he ends his money over the years now this marriage was you know was solemnized I think in 2020 like we said earlier so it's about three years old all right in last three years and how are athletes celebrities like Tiger Woods like actually for keep who spent their years sweating it out okay try to make a living putting your life on on the line how they're supposed to react or feel when they someone comes in along and marries them sometimes it's just for the money sometimes it's just a plan not all the time but we know some of the popular stories you know and then within a year too they say what they want to divorce and they want 50% of of the pay and how do how do they protect themselves against losing everything we've seen what happened to Tiger Woods he has never really truly recovered from that episode I'm not saying he was innocent you know but I'm sure Haiti has her own issues as well and so I won't take sides here but both men and women celebrities how do they protect themselves from from gold diggers I'm not saying she's a gold digger in this Hakimi's case but from a situation where you know you marry for one year for two years and then you have to have what you work for over the long span of your career because of that marriage for one or two years how do you protect yourself against losing everything well I would say that one may not be able to 100% protect themselves from incidents is like this why because the intent and the state of man's heart one cannot know the extent to which man would go to get their own selfish desires met or granted we never can tell so we can't give 100% assurance on this particular thing however I would want to say that it's important look at the celebrities you are a celebrity you want to go get married to a flashy model or one lady who is seen as a queen and all of that but you take time to study to know the person you're about to marry because I want to marry someone like them so they can flaunt their ways when they go out to events and all of that need to do your due diligence before this is for those that are yet to get married do your homework know your partner then when you come together before you even get married what is your vision what what do you want to be a what kind of family do you want to build you want your life out there in the public there's some celebrities that you don't even get to know about the personal life so what kind of family do you want to build you want you want to be in the media do you want to be in the news every now and then there's there's no there's no nothing we do on the surface of this ever doesn't come with a price so if you get married and a divorce happens there will be a price I mind you like you said it's not that these things just happen there's a cause for it now if a woman should come out and say oh I am not doing this again maybe that's just one out of many perhaps she's gotten into her field and she cannot to her limit and she cannot handle it anymore that could be the cases of some of those women and they are those that just come yes the one who dig so what should celebrities do that's a tough one I will not advise that you put all of your money with your mom no so why not as you start off let her if she's not the one I want to be a power discourse hey babes I need you to generate your income I need you to be asked financially the financially empowered and free as possible I do not think except the woman it has issues I do not think that if a wife sees that her husband does everything genuinely is interested in her growth in her financial freedom will turn around to want to stop him what's her vision what's her desire what does she want to be surprised you'll be surprised you'll be surprised I'm sure we've seen some of things that have happened I mean the recent court case that played out involving Johnny Depp we've seen a lot of things all the the allegations of rape against Neymar Hakimi's teammate he was only saved he was only saved by CCTV otherwise you know I've been behind bars by now you know you'll be surprised but let's bring it back home and Julie and we have like I said earlier and I think you've you've given your thoughts on that a different setup in Nigeria and the Nigerian woman is on Nigerian wife it's already grappling with trying to make her family understand that she has a right to inherit a father's property as well as the male children that's a battle and we will give her props and the kudos to state governments like River State government under years on Miki who enacted a law signed into law that women can inherit their family property in River State so in a lot of other states in the country it is it's a battle and what can we do to ensure and we all know you know from the Hollywood movies and all that that portray Nigerian society how you know widows are kicked out of the family property the the man's family will come in some instances and say well our brother is dead give him a property they're waiting by the side some will say that they're going to marry the wife of their brother a lot of things that we may go through you can even expansionate on that if you want to but how can we protect the Nigerian widow okay so for for our mothers who are widows and who wear widows before maybe the past on and who are currently experiencing this it's it's going to be a struggle they are left to be supported by their children my mom my mom is a widow we faced the same thing interestingly so they're left to to struggle by themselves no one's speaking for them and then the children grow up start earning a living and then they take care of their mom so the what what is going on if you observe Kofi you would see that all of us social media girls are not smiling anymore they've seen their mothers their elder sisters their aunties suffer they've seen their landlady's suffer and they tell themselves no I am not going to experience it now check the Nigerian law it's set for river states now and I don't know of any other state that has that has joined river state imagine this being in existence imagine us seeing our mothers so far what do you think would be our decision we would want to study we want to go to work we want to climb to the peak of our career before one man comes in because we never can tell we've seen it play out over and over again in the lives of our mothers our aunties are elder ones and we don't want the same thing anymore so the ladies are not waiting they are going on to make a living and to build wealth for themselves so that if any man comes and anything happens they have something to their own name and they can take care of themselves so while we call on the government to do all that they can because girls are not lesser of children than the boys they are equal they are children of that whole the man took care of them he built his wealth for them and the men themselves need to understand that your female children are equally your children they are still human beings as well so for the widows to be protected for women to be protected there has to be a law to it one there has to be a orientation on both parties because when men die not only the living men go after the widows women in the family as well will go leave my brother's house they will strip his wife of everything that she has so there has to be some kind of family education family life education for as many people as possible there has to be laws that will protect the women there has to be programs that would encourage the girls to go into to acquire skills that will enable them earn a living for themselves there has to be also orientation for the boys the boys should not be left out yes I see a lot of women empowerment program and all of that I mean also need to be empowered let them understand that when you see a woman see you could see has a business partner see her as a financial as an investor do not look down on her because she has wealth some of our ladies are suffering now because they have their cars they have their houses and all of that and no man will want to marry them but they're trying to protect themselves I don't know many men who are looking for those kind of women to marry you Julie I don't know maybe we'll do a much making session but finally before we go very in a sentence or two because we're out of time and do you believe in I would you recommend prenuptial agreements or probably known as prenup in Nigeria how many agreements usually hold I wouldn't call it pretty much prenuptial agreement I would say that families who just come together before they get married and draft a vision for your family draft the course draft the path that you want to you want you wanted to as a family just they said write the vision and make it plain so sit together with your wife with your husband ask these critical questions what do you have what do I have what do you what do you want to happen in this systems and then just put it down as a plan as a template as a framework to guide the marriage and just trust because even with the agreement they're not so happy I mean look at what is happening in our country today thank you how many go by the agreement don't want you to go to court thank you so much really thoroughly enjoyed listening to you hope to have you again soon Julie mobile is a family bond nurse and she's been a guest your there's a very close zoom connection link from the nation's capital up with you Julie have a wonderful day and look forward to having you back soon thank you okay okay we'll take a break when we come back we're going back to the fuel subsidy issue of course the federal government is set to increase salaries of government workers by 40% we'll talk about that where we turn please stay with us