 Okay, well officially called to order the annual retreat work session for the Historic Preservation Commission a lot of month Can we have a roll call please? Commissioner Sidley. Here. Commissioner Fenster. Here. Chairman Lane. Here. Commissioner Doreen. Here. Commissioner Jacoby. Here. Commissioner Barnard. Here. Okay, great Full commission here So next would be welcoming introductions Jennifer do you want to introduce our guests? Sure, and Josh will give more detailed introduction when he When it's that item on the agenda that we have Josh Alhada who is from ARES Associates They are the consultant who is working on our survey plan. So big chunk of our agenda today will be devoted to that one more housekeeping item I should say is to use your projected theater outside voices so that the camera can pick it up Okay, thank you All right Next we'll have public invited to be heard. So if there's anyone In the audience who wishes to make a comment now is your opportunity There's no obligation Okay Seeing no one who would like to make public comment I'll go ahead and close the public invited to be heard and we'll begin our discussion items First order of business is quarter second quarter of this year's meeting time Yes, so It was brought to our attention. Just to probably know the U.S. safety and justice building is undergoing some very extensive repairs So they are going to be moving The courthouse or the courtroom operations to the city council chambers starting in April and while they are Hoping to be finished at five o'clock every day. There is a chance that it That they may not be or that it'll just butt right up to our meeting time so just wanted to make everyone aware of that and Suggest that we might want to consider pushing the meeting time to a six o'clock temporarily They anticipate it would be for April, May, June, May, July. So basically all of the second quarter and Obviously as construction projects go we just never know How this happened, but that's what they're conducting right now. If anyone needs a pen, I have to ask for a separate pen please Any thoughts from the commissioners over here for the six o'clock time better Sitting in the room for four or five minutes waiting for the room to be ready Yes Easier, all right. I will adjust. I will adjust the meeting invitation All right, so just when uh, if we And then he whether it's jennifer or maria. I just make a request that when especially that first Meeting that changes over You know All right, great That will be fine. All right next on our agenda would be the recap of Accomplishments and progress in 2023 So Looking back at what we've done in 2023. We actually Have Accomplished quite a bit. I think and have made progress on other priorities. I've been identified over the years The diggins barn Transfer has officially is officializing last week when we finally have the flat record. So We're still you know, there's still some final details on that But that property has been Has been donated to the city. Um, so the next step is to use day validation The barn knows the structural work that was identified by a structural engineer that we retained last year to do an assessment So we'll be looking at doing that Ask the question about number 40. So Would it then make sense to to proceed with a landmark that was the next thing on Okay There are basically two next steps one is There is a pot of money that the that the Who's developer dedicated to the city as part of the As part of the barn donation and that money is specific to using the stabilization So we have a head start on that the next step would be Landmark status for alternate legal state grants um That is something that kind of dovetails into the And because also with that particular barn, we have several different There were a couple of different cultural resource surveys done. So we have it's very well documented that it's more than knowledgeable for landmark status Given its association with the diggins and the alley families who were significant to the founding of the early days of the city of Longmont Dovetailing with that is a tower compassion. So we did have that story. Excuse me. Yes with regard to the barn is their Before its designation actual designation does it have any vulnerability to zoning or Renovations or no because it is now city property. We own it. Oh, okay So it was in a portion of there's a there's a piece of property at the corner around the east side of town the northeast corner of us Lincoln Drive and Kencraft Boulevard highway 119 and so Basically when that property was purchased for development the original owner basically told the developer No, we aren't carving off a little bit. You have to buy the whole thing And so a big slot the property was in flood flooding. It was adjacent to green lanes So quite a bit of that property is going to the city. So we own it. There's no issue at all. We just have to get the work done So we'll be working with kind of the parks and facilities for us to Stabilize it to secure it You know to keep digrants out of the building. It's been pretty well secured already So, um, yes in the next step we'll be landmarking it as well. Um, kind of like I said, dovetailing with that is The tower of compassion. So we did that survey And finding other sort of significance. So we have that We're now discussing internally to start that land working process And we need to see the manager next week to actually get this ball rolling. So, um what Our assistant city manager Jenny Marsh and I were discussing is maybe we just Tackle both of these landmarks concurrently and just get it done. So, um, so we're moving forward with that as well Don't have a time frame for that but I am You know, we are meeting with city manager demigas Early next week to discuss that and what the process would be I noticed that there is a neighborhood that has a banner Display Which is titled tower of compassion. Is there some a special interest of that Right off collier street. I actually am not familiar with that. So Um, I know the the park that that tower is located within this is part of the south more neighborhood. So, um It was you know, it was donated as part of that parks development And the subdivision was developed by the kind of a family. So, um I'm not certain Is there any reason why we should inform The neighborhood leadership because that neighborhood seems to have leadership. I would be working with what we're doing I would be working with with as as we proceed through this process. I will definitely um coordinate with Our neighborhood services or any of our coordinators the NGO like coordinators I'll be coordinating with them on this as we move forward. It's an area south of collier. Okay I assume there's a verification process as part of the line work Sounds really similar to if there is a here at public hearing. I believe so. Yes. I haven't dug into the the nitty gritty of it So it's been a while It's been a while. So I just need to go through that section of the code again. There is a plan notification process Um, but yeah, so the next step at this point, like I said meeting with uh, sitting together with the media is to Map out that path forward to get this taken care of Um speaking of collier street. That was another I think big win for the commission is um at the february 13th meeting of city council They did uphold the commission or the historic preservation commission decision To deny that window replacement and also deny the significant hardship based on the fact that the applicant had not submitted the information so that we could not make Make it render a decision different than what we would what we would originally Rendered so I would say they upheld the the commission's decision. I'd say that's a big one for the commission as well You know, I think they're getting a little more educated on the sort of preservation processes And as we move forward from the landmarking though the landmark projects, they'll continue to be more familiar with it. So and then the other final thing is Going into the next agenda item is we have started working on the subject plan So we've got some of the initial gis work done so the initial mapping work and at this point We're using this retreat to really get in the commission So with that if there are any other questions from me on kind of 2023 recap So, um, I know our landmark one is actually pretty like this. Yeah, it's very like is that following me like who's actually doing that work? I Yeah, so in the other thing the other good news is we do have I have we do have a couple of new associate planners on on board Well, Neske is one of them. She is They're both going to be doing a lot of development with you as kind of their initial merchant on morning But she won't be doing that assistance in the long range work. So I should have some Assistance so it's not only Since I'm also doing a few other things So so we are working on doing staff. So she she started a couple weeks ago. So like two weeks ago. So Yeah, she's still very good And so we are working on we're very we're slowly but surely getting staffed out. So So stay tuned to be yes, uh, landmarking for landmark So At least for the time being since you brought up staffing The status report on the community Let's go on the planning development director. Um, so I I don't actually know My understanding is they're doing what we're probably doing ahead of them, which is typical for that type of position Um, currently Grant Henland is an interim director He was our development and he's our development review administrator But he is an interim director And the assistant city manager Jenny March who was previously planning and development services director She is going to take it over runs a lot of us in this thing a fair amount of time as well So she's they're going to tag team a lot of director type activities. So we're making it work So, um, you know, we're making it work, you know I'm thinking of a lot of other a lot of additional stuff as well. So, um, we're all kind of sharing it So we're working on it All right, any other comments or questions regarding Rebels from Russia All right Are you All over So With that, I've got term for term for the joshel hava to give an introduction of Who he is and what errors is and does and he's going to lead us through Some discussion and exercises on he's your right one I'm gonna stand if that's okay. You can all see me. Okay. I block this table But I appreciate you all inviting me here to have worked with you today on a wonderful Saturday It's so nice. So I'll be respectful of everyone's time too. And I know you have some other agenda items So we'll move through it as quickly as you can So my name is joshel hava. I'm our western planning lead at ears associates ears is a multidisciplinary firm nationwide firm we have offices here for Collins and Cheyenne And I work out my own office and really most of the time, which is really nice For my family and everything but In our development services where I'm housed we have planning economic development landscape architecture And then also environmental our team does a lot with brownfield revitalization We work with a lot of communities on plan updates code updates We provide on-call support services, which is what we do here in long month We started that about a year ago based on the need from the city of just Having some extra support so they could pick up the phone make a call And that's kind of where the survey plan Approach kind came from was that you know, we're on staff. We're here to help and Able to help you guys as needed with different tasks that may come up And so my background I have been with ears for really three years this june prior to that I worked for over a decade in the public sector. So just like Jennifer I worked as a planner for municipalities. I worked up in Windsor for five years And I also helped oversee some of their historic preservation activities I was involved in early on on helping like the mill project Kind of transition into the new ownership a lot of downtown revitalization SOD programs things like that I worked on I also did a lot with survey tours and Surveying old historic churches and other items there. So a lot of experience in historic preservation from that perspective After winter I was down in roomfield For about five years similar kind of work planning and preservation support kind of revamped and helped overhaul their preservation program there and Got it kind of moving forward and then shift over to what we always call the dark side or the private consultant side. So But happy to be here again to work with you all today before we dive into Kind of the project and the goals and everything we're going to talk about if I could go around get Have your name promise. I probably won't remember it just takes me a while with names As long as you sit in your seats But also curious, you know, how long have you been in Longmont? How long have you been on the commission and maybe, you know, what's your kind of special skill or interest in historic preservation here in Longmont, so I'm holly lorton. I've been in Longmont for over a decade long Been on the commission for a few years I don't remember exactly how many and I am the state W of historic preservation Okay, so you know, Tamstrow and some of those individuals. Yep. Yep. Awesome. Very nice, you have someone from the state on your commission I agree. I've been there I don't ever claim to be the expert in anything But it's nice to have resources like that So, thank you all Yeah, I'm great. Um, Shikobi, I've lived in Longmont 30 years maybe now and maybe this morning And do I have any special skills and not particularly, you know, I'm a retired doctor I live in a historic home and beside historic district and I've I've researched a lot of the history of the town So I I know what the next standpoint could put out a little tour and stuff Also passion and interest for preservation of the community also As Doug I'm Doug Gardner and I've been in Longmont From just before COVID And I got lucky For down here My main interest is The history and the history of history And so I study history And I practice it And I've just been involved in A lot of public efforts over the years and Identified this one as something that kind of brought some of my skills together so kind of the non Historical preservation person Learning and growing Each meeting Thank you Doug I'm a her professor. Uh, I'm About the 89 and I have degrees in architecture and civil engineering And A master's degree in economics and a law degree and I practice law in Washington for 60 years A part of which I commuted from here because I moved out here to colorado 19 79 and That's my dad Thank you Steve Lane, I'm the current chair I'm an architect I've lived in Longmont for about 13 or 14 years now And a portion of my practice has been historic preservation adaptive reviews everything from true historic restoration to You know, loft bender down down bender loft, you know Back and we're back Awesome, thank you Suspensively, I'm an interior designer. I've lived in Longmont now for about 10 years And I got into start preservation That was in college because I used to train so many times and we were taking some master's classes Well, this way undergrad and preservation um, but Uh, lots of interest and antiques and overcomes and a lot of renovation and stuff. So Yeah So very diverse group. I'll be make sure I don't bash architects at all Or the attorneys I'm actually an archaeologist It's always kind of the joke in the planning landscape art director and your world and all of each other. So that's fun It's all good fun, but no appreciate having everyone here in your perspectives Um, so our approach here kind of taking a step back with kind of the survey plan As you can imagine, there's a lot of different ways to go about doing survey plan work and strategies things like that You can do it, you know kind of a quick hit win You can also spend a year plus and get this really thick detailed document My approach with any work and preservation work has always been kind of that right-sized approach and being more Refocal targeted to help kind of move through the implementation get to the actual doing stage of things And so the way we've kind of set up the scope working with jeff her and the team is We're kind of like a strategic plan approach with the survey plan and identifying, you know, what's what's existing So kind of that existing analysis snapshot the work that you all have been doing and continue to do Obviously a couple of examples presented earlier Um, but then also diving into the what are the future opportunities Within the community are there existing survey properties that need to be resurveyed? Maybe maybe not are there new neighborhoods that we need to consider obviously with you know 50 years it seems like every year it just keeps ticking along, right? It's harder to get caught up on all the older neighborhoods But then also with long months development pressures And you probably all have seen that where you've seen homes or neighborhoods get raised or get added on to and you're like Oh my gosh, I wish if only we had XYZ done this at this time, but Um, so again our approach is really to look at for more that strategic plans You know a concise document that covers that history kind of the next steps But then gets you more of a strategic action plan of identified neighborhood areas What the costs are roughly with that? So I have a colleague Who Holly kind knows Tim Strow. He's a architect by trade preservationist by trade very knowledgeable on history and architecture and buildings and the area So he'll be kind of helping me on the side with the analysis once we identify some of these neighborhoods He'll come out and we'll be driving through some of the neighborhoods Just to get a feel of what there is what are kind of the characteristics of each of those neighborhoods Not the full detail, you know Reconnaissance or windshield survey or anything like that, but more of a was this place feel like what are some of the attributes we want to protect or Keep in mind with a survey with a future survey effort And then we'll work with a few preservation specialists that do a lot of the detailed survey work Or the designation work so they can provide a general idea of costs That is associated with each of those areas And then kind of a prioritization and funding opportunities, which of course Holly will know all the funding opportunities. So Appreciate that So so that's kind of how we're seeing this this survey strategy plan I mean I can probably say like eight words that are the whole title, but more of that strategic plan approach So really excited to be able to do this Taking shape over the next couple months The goal is by kind of a mid end of may to have some draft Back over to jennifer review probably come over to this commission to also review and then be able in june to come back and present That report in board the final stands and again thinking Some page type reports not going to be one of those really big detailed Have all your history redocumented and other documents Because one you probably already have that in a lot of places and two About going to the more detailed survey where they actually do with each of those So again our goals to get you into the doing stage of work, which I know that's what you all want to do here so Any questions with kind of the approach and the timeline and scope and I heard Holly say that's fast and it is really fast So it's super fast. Keep your me busy Yes What will you have divided? wama kwa wama into neighborhoods so that if we wanted to Have arbitrary necessarily arbitrary histories of particular neighborhoods We would have some basis for doing that So that's going to be part of our activity today that we're going to do a little bit We're going to be looking at some maps and you're going to help us define What are some of those target areas? I mean, you know the neighborhood better than I do You know that you wear those kind of lines roughly are drawn And again when we do kind of our kind of quick drive around for a day here in this next This month later april probably because it's already two weeks away from april We'll drive some of those targeted neighborhoods that you all helped identify today to understand where some of those edges Roughly are understanding like we may not have the exact like it's at this street or this alley But this is the area the neighborhood area and and then what are some of those new characteristics that we're looking to preserve based on Time and architectural details So that's part of our exercise today that we'll do and we'll get that out into your So other than talking about the draft And so this one that generally is as part of the The commission's means so kind of open means since it is more of that strategic plan approach And it's really helping you identify those and then I think the next stage when you get into the full detailed survey planning efforts That's when you'll pull the community in more because that's one of those you can go a lot different directions And that's what we kind of agreed was probably the best approach for this again to get you into that next step Getting some funding opportunities things like that To work with the community Because of course you want to document like what do they know right as property owners and everything like that They have more insights than even you guys here at the table. So So, yeah, that's that's when you'll take that deeper dive into the next phase And work with some of those specialists that really work in that because you know, it's one of those I could say I could do some of that survey work like the Neighborhood survey details, but there's people that specialize in that they do it efficiently and oddly They just know their stuff. So it's like rely on them. That's what we're getting utilized Their knowledge to help identify the cost as part of the strategic action plan So if you think of kind of like that matrix table structure is kind of what we see the last part of the overall document And obviously the more we identify neighborhoods and prioritize and understand Okay, this neighborhood is feeling development pressures. This neighborhood is just Getting old and no one's put money in your efforts into it We should probably document what's here before that wave comes in and changes what could be there or The western side of the community right well fire impacts You know, those that are in areas that are at risk due to wildfires or flooding Which I think inhale kind of three core things here in the long line. I think outside some help, but And I probably can make one little comment about the you know, because you mentioned development pressure a couple times And I want at least this is my perspective I wanted to ensure that this Exercise is not necessarily about um Preserving everything that's over 50 years old right Because we do have it's it's development pressure, but it's also like affordable housing pressure Right, and so that when you say affordable housing pressure doesn't make it sound as nasty as But those are things that are going to compete and I think it's going to be important if somebody goes in and just tries to do a project in an area that You know where the homes are over 50 years old, but they don't have a massive amount of significance They don't have a richness that they don't end up getting bogged down and A bunch of the rest because they just happen to be over 50 years old The goal is to really identify the pieces and parts that are that are that would be really critical to save and Understand that that is not going to happen at the work preservation history versus old Yeah, right Yeah, and when I say development pressures, it's you know redevelopment revitalization Reinvestment it's kind of all those pieces. I'm just using kind of broader terms So I think I just want to because that has a tendency if you look at it And that's what we're going to dive in with a couple of her answers It might be a higher study higher analysis just hey This neighborhood was created during this time. I had this rule in the community And maybe that's it and it's great for new housing opportunities for affordable housing Does we have any role in deciding whether it's going to be preserved or scraped? So I think that's a little bit I'm asking in the most general sense. Yes So I would say it starts here with some of the activities we're going to do We're going to talk over some of your goals some of your challenges you see With preservation and your effort as individuals on the commission And then we're going to file some maps and you're going to start to draw some of those areas That you think we should focus on that we should identify and look into a little bit further Make a part of this strategy plan to prioritize And we'll probably visit back with you all in that May timeframe to go over that actually make trips and Help prioritize those areas and then I think your work with the survey plan and designation of work That's where I think them as commission has that opportunity to decide some of that. Yes. Are you going to do all? So we're looking at generally the whole city area So if there's certain properties, you know way out in the edges of the community that may be 1980s or 1970s like even though they may not exactly hit 50 years It's quite good to have on radar And it might be a lower priority for something by 10 years Let's let's focus on looking at this because this is an important part instead or something else I always think it's a good idea to not just say If the years are cut off because by time you do that work now we're 20 more years and it's like oh shoot We got to go back and we missed something. So it's always kind of looking ahead to And one of the starting points we'll be the maps out is you do have a map where Basically that identifies everything in the city that was planned 50 or more years ago. So that's we figured that would be a really good starting point Just to kind of give us give some reference Yeah, we have the subdivision side and then we took from the assessor the year built Which of course is as close as you can get Basically knowing there could be some variability there But each parcel then is color coded based on your bill So you can get an idea of where the concentration is or those outliers that you may be like Maybe we need a look at that. I don't know what's out there to see if that's important So that's going to take up I know just wandering around town biking jogging through it. There are old homestead houses And so this system will That's our that's our anticipation. Okay. Yeah, you could have just a spot in the surrounding of a suburban neighborhood that you You know, this doesn't have any significance, but maybe that one does great Yeah, and you wanted to take a deeper dive into it as a commission Yeah, so I think my I think this sounds wonderful My only concern with the direction we're going to have to identify neighborhoods and properties is that this is not a very diverse group And We might know some different things about Neighborhoods Yes, I think that's a good question. Um, I think it starts here with just the discussion and if there is more needed I think that's an conversation that Jennifer and I have to decide you know, we need to Reach out to a subject matter expert in that area or in that part of the community That this is good representative of that community and can provide us some of those insights Because you know a phone call is very easy a quick one-to-one. I'm really so for me It's not hard to come down. Our wife has some family in town. So it's it's nice anyways Um, come down does it so yeah, I mean those are the kind of things that what's that's what's nice with The idea is we scoped everything we have kind of a budget idea Has been proved if there's those little add-on things that add value to the overall project The fact that we have an on-call relationship is that we can look at okay a couple more trips is This let's wait till we get towards the end. See if we just need to modify the budget You know a minor amount Cover some of those additional tasks Which we're happy to be flexible with and understand and we can definitely you know on my side I plan to touch base with our engineering folks and um, yeah In terms of you know looking at that as well Just making sure when our yeah as we get you know drafts together talking about the way and get in here going Yeah, what are we missing are there areas that we haven't walked on other communities? Yes, do you have some predetermined protocols for managing neighborhoods which contain institutional buildings Schools is one example of that but not the only one schools libraries, et cetera Um, so in terms of like partnership or conversations with those people how large the neighborhood should be what should it contain Um, what are the limitations? So I think that gets into More of just identifying the area of the school help to kind of establish or that public building help to kind of Create a certain neighborhood area that I think we start to identify those boundaries as best we can At this level and drive some of those areas. I know Jennifer your thoughts on how that component Public buildings And look at the area that those buildings would serve Um, in the case of schools, you know, kind of the neighborhoods in the store could serve Um, so that's that's going to be something that we will look at and and I do know a couple of our neighborhood schools are A couple of our historic schools are landmarked already. So probably kind of yeah, so we do yeah We do have a couple landmark schools already. So, um You know, so we do have a little bit of a basis for that. So Questions before we dive in Well, so the first activity is i'm gonna have you all strive if you're able to if not Let us know never, you know, I can my spritual writing but it doesn't do justice But um, what we're gonna do is hand out some stickies the first thing we're gonna do and you're welcome What we'll do is we'll use this one to start I wasn't sure if you guys need something else. So, um, the first thing I want to do is understand What are your as an individual goals? With moving in through the survey strategy plan and moving into surveying properties and also designate properties to have a multi-tiered approach there But looking at it from your lens, you know as as an individual in this commission You'll what what drives you what's your motivation for establishing Kind of that that process in those steps And so we'll give you some stickies write a few different thoughts on those and then we'll talk about them as a group So we'll kind of take the next five minutes For each of you kind of write those out individually and think through that And then we'll move into the next So everyone have puns otherwise I have some too. I think Jennifer has some Here Is Yeah, just thinking of like what's your goals what's motivating you as part of the survey effort What do you think that does for the community right going through the surveying process going through the designation process Yeah I'm not aware of anything if I had existed in here I'm sure it would change I was you know the stick answer. Should I say this is my new process? I don't think you're going to let the stickies fall It's all I think I want to hear Unfortunately Oh This Is Any questions Who looks in the last stickies being written It's like my favorite night And then you get a report out that's even better as you get a kind of scribe years and don't get stick up on the board Says A couple more minutes You never want to cut someone off from writing, but of course if you have other ideas while we're talking we can definitely capture those You hear something from someone else that triggers something Definitely capture that I Was there a reason why you gave us such a small path to write on yes Oh So you could be concise and break it out if you need to in the multiple cities Sometimes I give a sometimes I give a sharpie because you can only write so small with that It's quick ideas. Yeah, it's the brainstorming when I do an all over the three's new process mapping Because I'm all about efficiency and to build the review processes and stuff So I'll do process mapping on you know the big Butcher board paper to cross the walls and so he's a sticky a sharpie And I say about three to four words. You know that sticky. That's it. You have to be concise on your task and very and You start to see the and and like those are all different stickies So and then they start to see the process like I'm talking about I just think that's what the development community is experiencing when they work with you text the consultants and the developers so There's always that light bulb like Well, let's go ahead and start reporting out and of course keep writing your thoughts if you have them if you hear other things Go ahead and I can grab the stickies are you welcome to bring up and stick it down. So We have this board here. This can be kind of our goals motivators drivers et cetera that we're going to place all the stickies on so Soon you want to start to discuss each of yours and you can either come up or I can do it As if you want to get a stretch or not. That's your choice. Sure. I mine head All sort of are probably the same thing anyways. I'm when I got involved in the commission on I live on the northwest side of town and my house was built in 68 and my my Experience with reservation and always been in All the stuff from 1800s and so civil war and whatever and that's all great. I'm But when I moved to my side of town, okay, it's terribly, you know, there's not much money Much interest or anything like that. What do we do with all this stuff? There's crazy hotels that are, you know, invested with meth And once we're cool and like really cool Exactly So there's some really neat stuff and some old historic signs and whatever and You know, to your point earlier that everything needs to be preserved because there's a lot of junk You could just go away on the flip side. What are some creative ways to deal with this? I'm Yeah, because again, not that I want to see anything good and great in old downtown get removed Right, but those are areas that at some point so we can get a lot of tear down and so that's kind of That's my great thing. So that's probably like four state news And uh, yeah, what else oh and the other thing too is really to educate on different Errors and different types of history because there's I've been in Colorado now for 12 years I'm in my mind about 10 and You know, there's a lot of things that are very different here from where I grew up outside of Detroit And so That's a big thing like what is this stuff all about? And so I think for This is a an area that is growing so fast and there's people from all over coming in They don't know those things and so they need to Because I think that you know with that knowledge, hopefully that comes easier to see what it seems. Um, so yeah It's awesome. It all ties into also the housing scouts being earlier about four blocks And how did the housing come to be what it was and why was it size away or built away? It also do with the workers at the time and the needs at the time and the evolution of the community You know, it chills me. I work for it's about a builder right now And so all of our houses are now three stories tall and he may or may not have a garage He may or may not have parking And I would live in this like old, you know, dumpy area that yeah, I I used to go to your garage. I don't need to worry about hail. I have been with parking and so You know, maybe those things haven't been Unusual or different but you know, there's there going to be So so what do you do with it? You know, awesome. Yeah, great insights. Josh Yes, sir. Just before we keep going around Could you maybe explain to me the outsider What the survey is Yes, so I can start I'll let Jennifer and Holly correct me and or fill in So the intent of the survey that the base understanding of the survey is to identify The historic properties and those properties that have historical integrity within the community that really kind of lead towards either a designation Or understanding the history of an area or a neighborhood or a community And so you can do surveys at a lot varying levels And a lot different Needs, you know, if you're looking at property survey versus neighborhood survey So that all kind of leads into those different things. So it's really looking at the history Kind of the evolution of how those buildings came to be as we just talked about with housing in general How that schoolhouse company was the history behind it Who are the important figures in the community maybe at the time that were associated with that? So it all ties into those various categories that are part of kind of the designation criteria of properties Both from your local ordinance as well as the the national Register criteria of the secretary of interior standards. So other thoughts to build off of that I have a question that's on that. Um, so as you guys are identifying these different neighborhoods and developing strategic strategic plan Are you looking only at what would be For our local ordinance or you like this neighborhood is Local to their state because of the national register neighborhood It's all on the table. It's all on the table. And likewise, you know that neighborhood versus the individual property if there are individual properties that you're aware of within neighborhoods that We don't have surveys on or you might need some more documentation Indicate those as well. Let us know what those are. Yes Yeah, because there are some things that are very unique to Longmont, right that fit more Longmont's ordinance versus maybe the state or the federal ordinance You know based on integrity or relevance from a historical perspective. So it is important to understand from all lenses Like if there's like a weird, I mean, even if there's just something weird for me, I mean, I think back to my hometown There's this one dive bar on a weird highway that just looks like a cinder block building But it's where Leonard Skinner played their first show So it's a little significant to the city's history, but in outsider, but I feel like why is the cinder block Fox So kind of that kind of cultural that local cultural knowledge. So Relate tangent that everyone see Leonard Skinner is easy topper coming to the blue right now There are color bands now because there's not a single original member. I have a opinion I know Any other questions or comments on on soon thoughts And insights so kind of I just jotted a couple nodes, of course We have all your details there, but really it's preserving those key history Preserve key history and integrity, you know, really identifying those key elements that make up Longmont's history and the culture here Over the various decades and times that may or may not Be the Sexiest-looking things or the most traditional-looking things, but things that are important here For the community of that large and also the education portion of those with that We're kind of the two big things. I kind of pulled out of Your really great notes here Yes, sir. What? Kind of a product or you or we Were together Are we going to produce? Is it going to be a product that it has a physical embodiment document the set of documents? Yes that are available to the public and Do are we at a point yet? Where we can begin to frame its content Yes, so I have my colleagues who are helping me with the reports in the history Analysis and background analysis They've created an outline structure that we're kind of working through and as we get more information We kind of adjust that but it is a report. Is that going to be our structure also? What's that? Is that going to be our structure also? So working with Jennifer, we're going to talk through what that structure looks like based on our scope for the project And that's where we're going to do more of that introduction kind of where the goals of this report Dive into existing conditions in one of those existing neighborhoods have been surveyed the areas have been surveyed and community some maps So some of the maps here that we'll go through will be refined Make the look really nice for report Some graphics some photos some illustrations there And then we'll dive into kind of the work we'll do there today or here in a little bit Which is more of a what are those potential next neighborhood areas or properties that should be identified for further survey work And then we'll have that action matrix. There'll be a couple pages at the end Is are you gonna Are you or we going to produce a product? That will be available to the public Yeah, the public can carry around to identify as it drives or walks Through various neighborhoods where it is and what the significance of okay where it is So that'll be part of the next phase that This will help inform will be that more detailed survey or reconnaissance Windshield survey or full detailed historical survey on those specific properties and neighborhoods where you will have The photos the the whole breakdown the form that you fill out for a property Um, and so that's more of the detailed survey that this project will inform Something like we we are going to produce a product that is useful to the public Absolutely Yes Yeah, these are these are like think that like this is phase one Of probably three phases or four phases. So phase one is a strategy plan And you're seeing where should the city and you all identify and target your resources and pursuits Because i'll help you as you go pursue grant funding to say we've studied we've analyzed this as kind of our priority list And you'll be able to start chipping away at that phase two would be that more detailed reconnaissance Full historical survey of either neighborhoods or properties based on your priority list Phase three could be designation It could be or it could three and four could be their designation of those areas Education could be tours walking digital walking tours So you kind of have a lot different iterations a lot great deliverables along the way that are fully public Yeah, this is the first step. This is the first tool that blocks that we're putting together. So We should probably start Going through just interest is mine because i'm i'm the yeah great conversations though. So i do love this I was just wondering if it might be helpful to um remind a certain donation commission So we keep saying buildings more than 50 years old, but let's not make that but we have four criteria So we're interested in buildings that are important to our social history may have been Related to important individuals in our city's history that are architecturally or engineering That important In the monoclonal theology So three three criteria, so that's What what neighborhoods is moving forward? We need kind of those three criteria of importance Does that help? Because we still always and I think that's the fun such things because of historic preservation is we we have to align with the historic The preservation act and what their criteria are. Is that helpful? And that helps you to kind of go between the old versus reservation Yes Um Or engineering and I mean that's like the The mill Also have an area that have a unique Situation. Yeah. Yeah, those are great points. Sorry Made some assumptions this on you guys or you all probably knew some of the criteria So thank you. I think we do but we don't say Exciting exciting like exciting like so, uh, so let's keep rolling around. Um, everyone else's insights. So, yes, sir for chairman so, um I mean my vision would be That we end up kind of mapping out these neighborhoods, right? And we have this, you know, Again, I'm a graphic person or visual person. It'd be nice to have this like graphic where you have But no different colors. These are the different neighborhoods and how they develop, right? So you could really absorb it really quickly Um in terms of timeline and then within that you could document, you know, the typical architectural styles of those particular neighborhoods, right? Based again on timeline Identifying high value properties within those neighborhoods and and particularly on the fringes that might be one-offs like these old You know, agricultural properties, you know barns on, you know, the edge of town sort of thing And aren't necessarily a part of the neighborhood development Uh, and then finally, you know, one of the end goals is With all of that expansion to then educate people in those neighborhoods that hey, there's some resources that are actually available to you And to to your property to maintain, you know, it's It's significant to maintain its integrity over time, even though, you know, with You know in the historic east side or something this all this stuff is still available to you I think education is something that is a commission you're always doing because There's always a bad example of something that happens or an extreme community example for somewhere else That we won't name communities. We all right now. We're talking about but right they then Completely skew that mentality where then you're like back to the drawing board. You're like, no, this isn't what it really means This is what it is. So really appreciate that. So All right Over to you sir, you know Well, I've stated already some of my objectives but um Before I launch into that I live in an area that's called Fox Ridge And Fox Ridge is a series of buildings two-story high at most some only two-story all wood frame and spread out over a large area So you have a rental property there that covers Maybe 20 20 acres. Okay. Uh, and uh, it never would be built again because of its lack of density Gotcha and uh, it has And historical significance for just that reason Is a two in three story frame series of structures But it has great future significance for that reason And I'm wondering whether we're going to pick up some of these Long month peculiar Areas And and that that one really is peculiar In this survey so that people will realize Even if they're not looking at history quiet history They are looking at an area that has a particular significance Because it's not reproducible Yeah I think it adds something that's what's really interesting with a lot of communities in the ground ranges as they've grown Right they started with some of these more rural estate type neighborhoods around the perimeter to kind of create that band right that that transition band That is the population is constituting the increase in Revitalization into communities than that that growth has occurred Which then is either taking up some of those neighborhoods or leaped over those neighborhoods and they've become kind of a pocket And then a lot of people wonder what why are they here? And it's like well, they played a part in terms of framing the community at one time They were like that that edge if you think of urban planning There's always a core then there was a first tier kind of ring around the community then a second ring and it just kind continued out Over the years and so it does play to the community's history and and what was Considered kind of the growth edge and the transition to the rural interface so it is important from those elements So that's perfect Awesome anything else over all right Doug So I'm not sure whether these fit in or not I think the Question of local Getting getting current on local Projects so like local preservation projects that are in play right now and seeing where those fit into the Sort of looking at the status and timings are We talked about a couple more already today But there are others out there and they kind of Pop up here and there and I think we had a central area for all those that would be quite helpful into the public too And that would include things like you had A lot of different inputs on the sugar mill Uh and It was it was part of the one of the Things that people voted on Was how you was the possible use of the sugar mill that was voted down. So now That's all back in the air And there's other Open space areas like that that we get We hear about every once in a while Some of these could be historically significant So I think that's just one general area whole concept of Local preservation And development projects the other thing is I think survey should have some whether it's what I know which stage it would be Some tracking of changes of public opinion Over time that we measure the the effectiveness of various initiatives and programs So where we are now is a good baseline What public opinion is right now And then as we move along a year from now or whatever we would then We measure that talk about ask about what do you think of this or what do you think of that and see if it's having any change And that would by and I don't would include what what holly's talking about Which is that when we're tracking public opinion, we're careful to make sure it's a diversified response. So we're getting it may not be polling. It may be local Discussion groups. It's not so targeted discussion is discussion groups And that would come back in the last one, which is feedback from residents businesses and other stakeholders I think those are great elements and I I see those kind of Tripling in a little bit here and then really as you ramp up some educational efforts in that next Before you move into that next wave Because I think that's what's great is you know what we're going to provide with the main trips in the priority list It's your living document and it's going to be given to you in a way that you can go in You can adjust your priorities if there's public input and a shift in Perception or interest into other areas or some high risk Thing happens in two years that we don't know about you can go in and adjust that so that way you can prioritize For the commission for the community. So I love that those insights. Thank you so much Yeah well Two stickies I put down here first the Opposite of each other one is flesh out research of old homes in the historic west side neighborhood And I wrote that just because I don't know if any of you have gone and you can point this is accurate But this is the cultural resource survey. It's done in a long month Oh, it's just disappearing because my battery's dying. Oh, shoot. Let's see come back So if you look at this You can see the east side and you can see the west side. There's nothing researched beyond pratt street And the west side historic district is much larger than the east side and So I know the east side has been very active and has gotten grants to do some of the research and has worked with the city Promote other grant other research So surveys have been done multiple times on the east side The west side is way behind And if it is again a historic district that there's no restrictions on developments with the historic district We really need to research that to recognize. What's there to appreciate it to preserve it So that was the first thing I said flesh out research on the historic west side and then Expand recognition of houses and neighborhoods outside the historic districts because certainly that's that in all That's do everything I have to do everything And One of the goals of this whole process should be to encourage awareness of preservation options with the recognition I think one thing the first step is to recognize what's out there and to document it Yes, but I think what we really have to do Is encourage the community to recognize it and so preservation can continue that was This one recognized common homestyles with unique features So things like you know ranch homes are a dime a dozen But we have a little neighborhood over here where all the ranch homes are tilted on an angle And it's it's unique. There's all kinds of theories why that's there It's something that I think could be missed in some surveys, but again little things like that Make neighborhoods unique and so looking for stuff like that I think would be a goal Uh, I wrote down here highlight hispanic history of long months, which has been long neglected and other minorities At the uh saving crisis conference Fort Collins had two tiny little pamphlets one on the african-americans in fort Collins and one on hispanics in fort Collins They were tiny for a city, but it's a 250,000 people We don't even have enough information for one little pamphlet on every minor I don't think in one way that it exists right now as far as I know So I think encouraging more information there Uh, what is this? Recognize disappearing or unique Media mage structures that are not yet old enough to be special yet Because certainly, you know things go from being new and pretty neat to being kind of old Ignored to being downright dumpy and then it's old enough to be special We have to find those dumpy things that are kind of unique and in their own past How is this Middle-aged tones. There you go. I'm gonna make something Those are perfect and I think Hey, what I'm hearing is there is that kind of education components and I again I think that is always so critical and that's something that I always push as a staffer Let's work on our education. We kept building new information Then revised and building information. So I don't know what the rest of you guys' agenda after I leave is but I'm sure you guys will talk probably over your education strategies for for this year and kind of your approach. I think That'll be fantastic and hopefully this tool that we're providing will kind of help with that visibility and You know, what's the commission doing? Well, hey, this is what we're doing. We're Wanting to document the history. We want to understand those those unique neighborhoods as unique properties And hey come along with us for the journey at this next stage Awesome holly Last but not least. I think that I've gotten my thoughts boiled down to One I think I think ultimately Um, what I would like to see as we move forward is that historic preservation should align with some of our Other goals as a city, right? So the city is interested in affordable housing. The city Um, that has interests in the environment is concerned. I think historic preservation Has a role in all of those things. I I feel like this is my personal perception historic preservation in general kind of our commission For some reason like we always kind of sit apart from other things that are going on It's like we've got these little sideways So we're not part of that larger conversation and I don't That's a lot to ask of one survey But in some of that I think is continuing the education with the council who you know is is really paying You know great attention and really supporting the commission Um, you know, but how do we recognize that historic preservation is kind of a solution to some of these larger issues And that you know to The chairman Has to be saved how to do that strategically, but also like how Then do we have infill development and new development? Be complementary to the story that And I live in a little neighborhood on the left side. Um, my street is a little 1952 So right around the corner from us Is one of those buildings I always see on social media that so it doesn't allow anymore It must have like eight apartments in it, but And it's it's not huge, right? It's this like lovely little like eight apartment buildings right there and a bunch of residential housing You know, I feel like we talk about extremes in warlock like everything has to be saved You know exactly as it is, you know, or we have to build a 18-story Yeah To add a character, but And Questions of your hand or effort, but young spot does Have any kind of design guidelines or criteria that helps you have some of these In terms of compatible infill development We have we have something to be talking about for our last item largely On our agenda, but we have an element. We have to put it in Well, the conservation of the latest Yeah, it was kind of used and it really does get into that you know ensuring that development is Responsive to its environment Yeah, I mean in a few of this sections, there are some like residential Addibility standards So there are some components like you know, you have to have doors that face the front I mean, they're really broad and some of them are a little honestly weird Like there's some like downtown looking Sanders that are in places that don't are anywhere near downtown So like why does your building have to have a base in the middle of a cornice? Floating off from the west side of the northwest Yeah There are some sections that relate to You know commercial and this boost used to districts that are adjacent to Specific like lower density residential districts like how do you do those transitional buildings? So we have some elements. I just don't know if they're It is integrated Okay, this helps me out his word formally an idea All of this gets to the question of whether we are supposed to be finding What constitutes quote historical unquote Then for what purposes? And is the answer to that yes, or is it no Or is it something in between because There No definition of that kind has ever been laid on this at least it's my knowledge Yeah, and and just know like when we identify an area Of the community for a survey that should be surveyed in more detail in the next phase of this overall effort There might be properties within there That shouldn't be surveyed or that don't add to the overall integrity So they might be more of that quick windshield take a glance identify what's there and then you'll dive into more detail on those true Properties add to the history integrity that you look to preserve So when we talk about identifying neighborhoods, it's not like everything in that neighborhood fits x y z criteria This one might be in this category. This one might be in this category This one might be in this category, for example So it allows you to not just look at neighborhood as this whole neighborhood needs to be preserved Just as is or maybe it's this block or this street front edge that carries that historical significance because of the three criteria So that's one thing when we do the map exercise here, which we're going to pull out Yeah, I was going to say an inch was a time we should probably jump on that I think that will answer a lot of your questions and frame a lot of our discussion So we're going to pull out a handful of maps. We'll probably do a couple at a time Probably have groups of three just because it's easier to circle around A map and the goal is I want to hear from you all like I Get an idea of some neighborhoods and driving around I could guess Perception but I hear from you like what are those neighborhoods? Where are those properties that we should be sensitive to and be aware of and also Where's this bit the overall prioritization which ones are are the most critical early on which ones need to have a you know Can be a little bit further down the process So So we're going to hand out sharpies so you guys can you sharpies on these What you're going to notice with some of these is they zoom in and zoom out at different levels So let's do subdivision maybe down one side and then these down another side So what we have here for maps is one Jeffers bring it around and that's going to be on one end or side Is where the subdivision area and it shows It shows the survey properties and areas within the community But then also some of the other neighborhoods what we have down this way is that you're built Like map and we got the index up here that shows kind of the color coding per parcel And so you're going to see different layers. So this is more zoomed out Obviously more zoomed into the core and you start to see the points for designated inserting properties And then you get even zoom in a little bit further because the town core area was one area to Make sure we got the town core focused address and then zoom back out Then the other map here is more just broader context Have more aerial maps so you can use this more for reference in case anything here is hard to read with the colors And so what we'll do is we'll get some sharpies out different colors again kind of circle identify You know put a point and start draw a line and put what you see is important about that property and talk amongst your group Many groups of three So we'll have three down at that end with those maps And then we'll have three down here with a couple of these maps that you can sort through cycle through and I would say Through the maps as well Yes, so the sort of the subdivision maps individual subdivisions aren't demarcated only because some of them are very small Very weird in terms of the boundaries. So this is basically a base map showing all areas that were planted Um Okay, so and then the triangles are indicated So this is the original town. This is the original town boundary And each triangle is a property that we have or we can definitely have a cultural resources survey on Where's that map from it's the planning department And it says history Is But it it says this is the cultural resource survey for the city, right? So yeah, it goes beyond the east side. So I thought well, this must be it because it goes some to the west side and some Yeah, there's Sides that One of the sides that we absolutely have is some either either digital or they're a landmark So So, yeah, so starting your time groups of three generally and then what we'll do in about 10 minutes and we'll rotate five to 10 minutes we'll rotate And just see if you see anything different from the other group And talk through that again by some new areas and then we'll come together as a group for the last few minutes And just talk through them. So again, you know be as close as you can to accurate in terms of lots areas understanding Goals to get a general understanding on the area for us as well as specific properties that I mean And here's the history east side Neighborhood These are snacks whoever brought them That's east This is Some people can do it some can't feel free to ask us if you have questions Jeff right knows more than me in terms of areas I mean there are 17 or are they with us right here, I don't know Well, this is what I'm kind of hoping that is okay I would hear This is subdivisions pre-1974 very sober and sunset So this Yeah So I would do a circle or dash it But what is what you think is important or Well, so then what we want to do We can drive through So we know It's not filled in this whole area That's no fancy These are all You have a subdivision And there's going to be more Things here these are going to be But there's going to be brown signs, right? So people I think at the That's not helping I know that's what that's You guys got Yeah You're like, you know fun farm Yeah So Documentation Okay I Or you know, we know this neighborhood over here is really unique in the city's context and what the neighborhood's called You know anything you know about it in terms of I don't know why it's browns And that's what those If you look at the color Okay So You know What do you want us to do with this one here if you know specific areas that are out in the For you here that you think should be targeted if you know of neighborhood names Sites that are relevant for we need to consider This one's a little less Yeah So there's speak start at martin and then every store So 11 must be just west of martin 15 Out here some properties up that way They're victoria They are Very consequential There's an old stone house out here on the south side of knife Something out here. I don't know where it is Right, so And was that a stone? It's an old farmhouse Sure Yes, and there is a property right here. Okay Yep, I think Okay, you'd never know I hear these cars Maria sir trash cancels Trash bags Of things that should be looked at And These are the same victorian sound Okay So much fun Second house is that I've been making mental notes outside Yes, perfect. Yeah, go ahead I'm not sure where these others are I know But others Yeah And they made that That's a lot older than everything That's great They're So Okay Let's do two more minutes and then we're gonna rotate Two more minutes and we're gonna rotate It's an old mill Yes, it's big I don't know how well, you know, what's been documented what has been but I was thinking what the heck is this thing Anyway I have been looked at the history of Colorado was Or just good history background and information Stone that might be good to use with it So we're not reading the wheel, right? Especially because it was so hard Okay And then she'll send it to me This really needs to be looked at This is a So, yeah, so the most important Bing This is All right, let's let's rotate And of course if you get to the map where you're going and you're like, I don't have anything else to add You can go back to where you were And where you can all come together and start talking over the maps We've got probably about five to six more minutes and then we'll talk as a group So here's the year built by the parcel you're constructed based on the assessor data and then You have the districts in blue And then here this map zoomed out from that. That's where they started identifying some outliers So And these And it's like we're all the new So you have fewer things like all the claves of the county areas that aren't within the city Oh, there's that green I look forward to checking those out that sounds fun. You always you always wonder for the first time Yes, the brown is not the brown Great, it's going to be city life Oh, so that is all city life Yeah, it's all city life And it was challenging from a certain This is a That's like some of those And some of the I just like Well on 9th street Yes I Yeah We're so right after the Yeah That was on sale and I I Oh They've got nearby And they moved I I Always Classic 70s The architecture they redid the whole place The Yeah Well actually they used to be Oh Garvey was the guy A lot of them Which Yeah There's some Part of that Just what's what's unique about them or what we need to consider Unique small houses, I don't know because you look at the age the ages the place 30s is still you know Well, and then Lincoln Street also has the Lincoln Street school, which I think is just Now with us It could be that heart of soul. Yeah It's city own property. Yeah, like contemplating. So yes, we also want to do that. You want to look at the Lincoln school Well, I mean So kind of this It's a nice way your neighborhood there are some you need to look at the age of the home with the school You kind of start to see like there's a concentration before you get these hundreds here Right, right The 20s and 30s Do you want to do a dashed area around there? Yeah Like just make a couple of those notes I mean you can just do it this color Think bubble style Main Street, so this is the old school That has some significance on it. Right. Um, I don't know if that's a landmark or not It's the Lincoln school that does still own it, but they're um, but district offices and you watch that Well, it was landmarked and had a dot so it's not the new series. Oh, yeah, that's true That that relates to the new series And sometimes if schools are Very not sure So the green is just the age it's so it's probably a newer home that was constructed You know, they probably raised the old house there or it was a sliver that someone wants her Yeah, I think um, I think josh is looking at the right. So you're totally right. Yeah, you're looking at the green So we're getting yeah, so the green is yeah. Oh, yeah. Sorry. I was flipping those around Yeah, green means it was probably one of the earliest sites or buildings or homes Yeah, look at that. That's all of this and then on this side Okay, that's I mean perfect How are we doing over on the big map you guys we ready to kind of talk over on maybe I'll huddle up and identify some of the Things we talked about That's the goal I don't know Let's go let's move Have you in town some part, you know That's kind of let's start insulting. I guess they started researching Let's jump over here real quick All right, let's do a quick report out here So this is wrong because this is central school and maybe the latest addition was in the 70s and 80s That's true Oh my yeah Yeah, and that could be how they have it's not standing anyway. It's a recent structure A good start it's a good base to build from Also, the way they did those additions was really well done because the complementary that we can still see Yeah, that's nice. They definitely Might what they did or All right. Um, key key thoughts takeaways on the big map anything to note looks like we We captured a few homes on the north side and sites some victorian areas There's some hospitals potentially kind of along the ninth area up in that area And then we talked a few properties. We're listed over here Do we have a division of our work that's going to look at farmsteads? Not necessarily, but if we identify if some do come up we could definitely highlight those Yeah, you know because we go we pass farmsteads very frequently because we live in the outskirts of town and Some of those farmsteads I can identify as being a pre-civil war most of them are post-civil war But the architecture varies Uh, and that is of great interest to me Because we're not looking necessarily at the victorian architecture that we saw in the 1870s and 80s Sure So, yeah, if those come up, you know, just do you pop up on on the research they could be and do One thing to note is we would be looking primarily within Um, not necessarily city limits, but within the long off planning area So we have a pretty defined area of where we can, you know, where we as a city can can really work as well So would it be possible to get that one one of planning area? So we roughly go out to Airport road for the most part kind of jogs out around the airport right It goes about as far south as what we're seeing It doesn't go very far south North is generally down by 66. There are a couple little fingers that go north On east side it goes, um, you know county line road but also kind of goes, um, just When you get south of the Canadian reservoir, we do have some we do have some in local county as well So it's basically just what's great It would be pretty dark close. Yeah, our planning area is we've almost completely filled our planning area outside of a few county enclaves Yeah, the county has a lot of preservation areas to where you can't drill into Yeah, we are so we're surrounded almost entirely by permanently preserved open space So, um, things that are things that are owned either by the word county or by the city and whatnot Yeah, um, so that really does you know, and the keyword is permanently protected It should take some She made some effort for its farmsteads certain projects Those open space areas do have farmsteads on them So they would have conservation easements like agricultural conservation easements the county may actually probably owns a lot of those And they release it to farmers All right, let's move over to the detail kind of more core city map down the way and I don't know where this one kind of holds up So it's how you weigh all right. So we've got some good notes on here some good subdivision areas to look into properties Any key takeaways or thoughts on this one from the group or from individuals that looked it over or added notes so, um My neighborhood I I noted here We all call it like browns plaid something. I think that's what it is in the city assessors But so it's it's mostly like 1950s like early 1950s You know hip truth box sort of things They're cute. I don't think architecturally like they're Individually significant, but I think the neighborhood, you know as a whole might be But one thing that I think is really interesting is that we still have old apple trees from the apple farm And I don't know how much that sort of stuff is in other neighborhoods, but I think it would be important to identify Well, it is One of my neighbors has been Babying this apple tree like the poor thing died 10 years ago and he's just It's like living along You know, and I don't know if you know, and I think he's you know, we've placed some other apple trees and we've got other neighbors with individual trees, but I don't know if that's the sort of thing that the city would ever consider like Helping individuals who have those features Especially from a horticulture standpoint and yeah They're the guy in the Fort Collins that I think was one of the last Diagnosis trees Yeah, he was talking about, you know, being seeds from some of these old trees and different plants and whatnot Awesome. But yeah, the nursery in the Fort Collins Any other key things anyone wants to note that they called out that they thought was really neat or I'm surprised to them Well, just in the neighborhood thing I got going back to to my particular block They had the original Model homes on it. And so there's some cool Again, the houses themselves aren't particularly interesting. There's some cool things In there, you know, like crazy windows Can you capture this on here? I did, I marked it on there and then I marked it down Okay, perfect, perfect Yeah, cool. I've got a neighborhood with some neighbors that's been there for ever. I don't think nobody knows it Awesome. Yeah, I think too. I think I have a clue too. Like you're just the sort of fabric isn't just the sort of fabric It's just like the weird stuff Yeah, it's like and that's the best Yeah, it's just the random stuff in the city that just Kind of identifies it Like for example, in Pagoda Yeah, yeah, great. Yeah So we're just thinking about so we are talking about landmarks in Pagoda in Kanemoto Park But there's also history of that neighborhood because it was Kanemoto's farm and they ended up like the The kids decided to develop The original farm into a neighborhood Is that noted somewhere I wanted to start? Yeah You know, so it's it's sort of a weird You know Period of time because we didn't have this Japanese heritage thing, right? And so That probably needs to get thought about and then we talked a little bit about just the north North side of Wama being historically Hispanic. I really had no idea how that really developed But we do have a team of chamber commerce. I don't know. There's probably somebody that knows Yeah, you know more, but there's absolutely somebody that knows more than anyone In this room. Yes, that is. I don't know, right? The Kanemoto area Which is I guess east of Collier Is that right east of Collier? Yeah, south for yeah, they're south, right? So the Kanemoto farm they got developed And that neighborhood was That's right I mean, there might be others And and I think one of the significant things and I could be wrong because I apologize if I don't am But I think they were Pre-internet families like these were not necessarily families who came to Longmont after a machete or a camp or not I mean, they were pre-internet families Yeah, that's why I'm asking you to cover up compassion because they weren't in church But I don't know, or was it kind of a holding place before? No, no, in the southeast part of the state. Yeah. So Longmont had a number of Japanese farming families that have been here since the very early 1900s Yeah, fortunately the governor of Colorado at the time, you know, they're one of the permit camps in the state He said you're not getting my residence. Gotcha. Okay. Gotcha. Okay. Yeah It's not technically a context but CU Boulder has put out this really nice Boulder County Latino history and they talk about Different areas of the county and different histories of the county. So that would be helpful as you guys are trying to Identify both subject matter experts and So is there anything else do we have on these these now I have to mention Longmont, I didn't see that anywhere here, but you know when it was just the city founded on temperance They made north Longmont just north of night. That was that was where we could buy this. It was Priority from saloons. Oh, that's very interesting. But the water supply was from the city So they slowly twisted arms and got them incorporated in the city and they took away the saloons, but old north Longmont I think it's around all the public and there's a lot of tiny little old Very modest homes in there. Okay. Um, which might be worth looking at Very interesting. That's very cool Awesome. Well, I appreciate everyone's time. I work on this I know you got other things to get to and again, it's a beautiful day. So I don't hope you don't have to stay in So at this point I'm going to say let's take a like five ten minute break. Um, I Built a little bit of cushion into our schedule like for example, reserving the space for longer than I had scheduled for the Retreat agenda So we have some wiggle room and some cushion, but let's just go ahead and take like ten and break it under chance to Disregard some of the other restrooms for us to break all this stuff down And just so the commission knows what we're gonna do is take the maps back on my team digitize it So you can see bubble areas or different areas call outs. I'll look for Jennifer. Make sure I'll I've read everything correctly And a the terminology and then I believe from there we'll we'll kind of start our next Pages internally of working on that. But of course have this also Got checked back to the group to make sure we didn't miss anything or something else popped up And anything comes up after this Oh, we've got that one neighbor Shoes ever in self-coach with any tells or get a screenshot Here you roughly Would it be possible for you to share these? I know Basic maps as PDFs I'm just thinking of like How did it's really in her head as we're running you can turn out and see something Oh, wow And I think it adds to this the notion of this being that living style document right because that's why The intent is not to build a document that all stitches on itself But it kind of builds upon so that way as you all work, you know, you can't something on a little month later You might be like shoot that one spot Okay And don't have the GIS layers and no be able to edit and change up the map and then your index You can add a new line and and start to do that. So Goals to build you the framework. So you have that tool as a resource Yeah, I mean having been a public Survey I I gave that consultant idea. Here's our real Proprietary information and you can't change anything. So boys want to provide that service This The green line is our A lot of this area is permanently competitive in space and public work. OK, so that's really a lot of work. That's, yeah, so we have a lot of permanently conservative in space around the city. That really limits how far out we can go. So anything that has a color on this map is city limits, very important. You'll see with the light, there's a whole lot left. Yeah, so there's really not a lot left. So we're really an infill redevelopment. What's the cyclotron and the list of the sites you see? This is the airport influence zone. So you have the airport right here. And so there's different. We're taking a look. We're taking a look at that zone right now, just because the way our code is written, it's very broad. There's just some deeper issues I won't worry you guys with. So yeah, so that's the airport influence zone. That extends into the county as well. That just has to do with areas that are roughly two miles about approximately from runway. So let's say neighborhood, I mean, there's, like, Yeah, so right here. That's kind of the states, roughly right there. Actually, yeah, it's right here. Right here, right there. So that's currently in a lawsuit with the county. So it was there. It was an agricultural area. It was originally owned by some of the voices of the family. There was a conservation easement that ran through the property, but it was it's what's called a regulatory easement. And it was it's not a perpetual conservation easement. So that's the that's the disagreement between the organization that's suing the county right now. They're trying to say that it wasn't appropriate to release that. I won't share my opinions on that because they're in a public Yeah, that's okay. It's not perpetual conservation. So we're saving it until we're going to use it. Well, it's the way it was. There's only a few of those in the county. So it was it's what was called a transfer development right site. So basically it's it's the kind of easement that could ultimately be sold. And that's essentially what the county was trying to do is sell easement and would then use that money to purchase additional space that would be permanently preserved in space. So that's really kind of the mechanics of it. It's one of my projects. So it's been fun stuff. With that, let's get back on our agenda. So really, the next item for discussion is really getting into our other twenty twenty four priorities. Several commissioners sent me a few topics and we can obviously add to this. We can flush this out. I'm going to go through one thing, a couple of things. Really, one primary thing with the sort preservation month of twenty twenty four. I've already been in contact with our social media phones with our communications team about you know, doing some posts. That's an ask I have in the commission because I'm only one staff person. So if you have items of interest that you think should be shared citywide, for example, historic tours, historic resources, send me that information and I'll work with our communications people to have that posted on our various source, our various sites. So and I'm also in the process of getting the proclamation, the historic preservation month proclamation for either. The last there's the first meeting in May isn't until May 13th. So I'm going to see about getting in on the off of April 30th meeting, which is the day before. So I'm in the council. What's that council? Yeah, council. Yeah. So I've just got to figure that out. Yes, sir. We we have a downtown mentality here because we're looking at the history of the settlement of the town and that focus on downtown. This not necessarily include the rest of the city of one month, which includes farmsteads. I would say any interesting things that any any items of interest. But there is it's it has its own history. Sure, sure, pre-Civil War, post-Civil War, Victorian structures, preservation of tree life, et cetera, et cetera. And I think some time and effort should be devoted to that. So it'd be because remarkably, it's part of the city of one month. So there's what I'm going to start doing, which is not so much as anything necessarily adding to this list. Then I would I would support your notion, but I would disagree with the fact with the statement that we've been downtown focused. I think we've had we've had that as a component of importance for a while. So I agree with your goal, not with your introductory statement. Anyway, how about instead of downtown, how about with a term in town? How about we call it the original town plan? Oh, OK, that's original. Yeah, but for you know, for example, I mean, the two projects that are on were on our accomplishment list, you know, Camero was not in the downtown. That's right. I think I was born is certainly not in downtown. And we've been talking about this importance of really recognizing that cultural history. So I think it's something that we're absolutely focused on in parallel. And so related to the Camero as well as the historic preservation month, I will work on putting together kind of what were based on the research done by Carl as kind of one of those cool fun facts about Longmont or I'll work with our columns group to get something about like that out. Once I have better direction, you know, there's office on you know, landmarking it and such, I'll be able to flush out a little better. Yeah, I think it would be worthwhile, you know, kind of the fun facts about the store, things about Longmont, you know, why is there this bar on the outskirts of town? So I think we can, those are a couple of things I could definitely, and you all talk to Rachel about doing maybe a series, maybe there's like a poster week about, hey, it's a historic preservation month, here's some interesting stuff, but definitely I need your help with that. So, you know, send me in for send me items, you know, if you have an article or something or a letter to the editor or something you've written in the task, send that to me and we can see if we can, you know, massage it and get it to or you know, next to your, you know, your walking tour. Have you had any contact with that Kenamoto neighborhood group? Not yet. You know, they seem very well organized. Not yet, so I'm working, yeah, that's going to be part of the project, part of the process. We're still at the very beginning stages of that, you know, I feel like now that I have, you know, a staff member on board, we'll be able to have a bit more capacity to do some of that, to do some of these things, but also it's, you know, coordination with the NGLA staff. And just like to make a note, when you talk to city manager, I think it would be a fair statement and you all could correct me if I'm wrong, that the HVC would encourage you to make note of the fact that May is preservation month and so if there's any progress that could be made by May of any notable, considerable level along the lines of those two landmarks, they would be really great, right? So we're encouraging that kind of legacy. You know, just having the applications in the hopper or direction or have had, because I think because they're city owned properties, we will have to have formal direction from city council to pursue them. So that's really something we're looking at. So, yeah, so I've already started thinking about historic preservation month. Other topics submitted by other commissioners would be improving our coordination with the same brain and historical society. I think that's a very worthwhile activity. It's an idea of improving the certificate of merit process. Again, property or outreach, that's something that we're now standpointing just having capacity for. I hope that we have some better capacity this year to do that. Better coordination with the NGLA staff. That's been one of what I want to do, so on a few different things. So it's a matter of making that happen and breaking down some of the silos and various departments. And then pursuing state grants. So, and that's something as we find, we had we had money budgeted already for the survey plan. So as we get into the actual survey activities and also doing the preservation plan, which will tie into a vision long mark as well, that is definitely something we would pursue state grants for. And additional any work that we do on, you know, once we get landmark status for the tower and for the barn, then we can also pursue grants for restoration work and we have work on those as well. You know, if we don't have anything else to do with our free time, I came up with another idea. Um, sorry. Actually, I think, it was that the meeting in Volker gives you ideas. You know, there's a great presentation by planners in Denver on guidelines for solar panels in historic homes. And it's not hit us yet. We, you know, Denver has big buildings, less trees. We have lots of big trees and smaller historic homes, but it's going to hit us sooner or later. And when someone comes to us, it would be much better to have guidelines in place before they come. So we can say yes or no, rather than create them once they come there and then they think we're picking on them if we don't like what they do. Well, that's real good. I'm going to call that sustainability standards in God of Lots for historic properties. They're solar panels specifically, ACHP just put out some guidance and I think, because this has been a big deal that is about to hit Colorado, some other states and towns also have stuff. So there's information out there that we could, without reading my tweet at all. Denver is revising their guidelines because they looked at guidelines all around the country when they came up with new guidelines and they presented the process and their new guidelines at the meeting. So it was, you know, it's been, we'll do something a little different probably, but I mean it's already been done. We just have to get into it. Yeah. So, as we move into 24 priorities, what else, what other priorities do we see for the year? Yes, sir? I sent it around to something and so it's a while ago, so I'm not sure I remember everything I wrote. But one of the things I wrote was consultant work and grant writing, home places that would be a non-competitive grant, but $15,000 from the state of historically. That's basically, is that state grant? I think that is the catch-all state grants. That includes that $15,000 non-competitive some grants you got to fight for. Sure, sure. This appears to be what I've read. And that says we, as we move forward with some of the survey work, we would definitely be pursuing some of those grants. That's definitely something on there. Yeah, I did include everything on that list because some of those are kind of in process or things that we have kind of percolating already. We have a presentation that's commissioned maybe a year ago or more about the sugar melt and since then it moved in a different direction and then that was defeated in the polls. So I guess what I'm curious about is what, you know, at what point do you think it would be good to get another update? I think right now there's a lot going kind of behind the scenes. Tony Chacon in our office is our redevelopment manager. So he's really spearheading those efforts. I will talk to him and see what he thinks it would be a good time to give an update on the sugar factory because he really is spearheading those efforts. There are a lot of different moving parts right now. So I think the answer is we're getting there but it's a very long-term project and very far out. But I will coordinate with him to give an update on that this year. The other one I talked about before and I sent you the link on it. The Louisville City of Louisville and produced a booklet on historic preservation and we had talked about doing that part of the problem was you didn't have staff and so that might be something we need to grant for it to get to grant money for but I sent you a link to the link. Yes. Because you couldn't remember the name of it. Yes. Yes. And that's something I think that also goes into the property and community outreach as well. Well, why? Because we would develop a booklet. Yes. We would provoke it. Well, I'm saying community outreach, general community outreach. Something that we put together for for public consumption. We're talking about things. I think you're talking about the preservation plan. Okay. Yeah. Great. It's called Exploring Louisville Historic Museum, Get Involved Historic Preservation. That's the link. Okay. But I see property owner outreach as we reach out to property owners to find out what they're interested in and what concerns them and that helps inform us on our decisions. This is, that's something where we are publishing something which we can then distribute in lots of different ways. I mean, we haven't talked about that but I'd be glad to give you 20 ideas on how we can distribute booklets. Sounds like something that would be good to collaborate with both the same brain historical society but also the Longmont Museum on. So maybe we add that to Longmont Museum coordination. Yeah. I was looking at that and wondering, you know, if it would be of some value to reach out to potentially both those organizations just have one common meaning similar to this, who just get around the table and say, what, you know, how do our goals align? How do we support each other? Just have the museum as a historian too. So it would be nice to meet her and introduce ourselves. To me, does that connect you to Eric? Eric is, now he's the director of the museum now, but he's no longer the historian. Is that something that we put together as an agenda item and presentation for a future meeting, future commission meeting? Well, is it commission meeting? Could it be, like, if this group, I think, if this group meets with another group like the historical society or museum and we don't conduct formal business, you know, can that be something that doesn't necessarily have to be, I'm not saying it's a closed door thing, that doesn't have to be sitting around a dais with a presentation that's more of a work section. Let me talk to, I'll just consult with our legal folks to make sure. Just, especially because the museum also has its own board. So I think if it's a board-to-board thing, it probably needs to be an open meeting, but maybe it's something along the lines of a study session type thing. So I'm not trying to say make it something that the public doesn't have access to, but I'm saying it's not a formal, you know, presentation at a historic presentation. Yeah, and I think, you know, maybe we use it, I was thinking we use a commission meeting for kind of a study session, a work session. Here we do that in the museum of the room or something, just so everybody's in the room. Again, just think about optics of how this works. Yeah, I mean, study sessions are typically open meetings and they're just in the study session room, so I don't see why we could. So that helps, you know, time-wise in terms of everybody's resource and time commitment, especially if there's a meeting, if there's a commission scheduled hearing date with no, you know, no foreseeable agenda I am. Yeah. Right, maybe that's a good point. That's kind of what I was thinking. Yeah, that's what I was thinking, is using the meeting time since we all have a lot of calendars ready. So from a staff standpoint, I can coordinate with both organizations. It'll probably be at least a month or so just based on other priorities that we're around right now. But that's something yet, and it makes sense that we are at the top, so slightly. And we have, I'm going to start Preservation Month. One of the ideas we talked about in previous meetings is getting Steve in front of those long-time call. Right now, we're going to do a long, long later. It's a soft-ball interview, I mean, especially this long, long later. Just going to get a chance to talk about what the commission is using as part of the Start Preservation Month. What I'm talking about, you know, getting getting a face out there is another way of getting the community. Yeah, I think it's important. Let me get, I'll need to get it through our comms group, our communications office. I think they're from there. Yeah, I just, I knew you were meeting with the media team, and I just thought I wanted to remind you about that. Then that same group, we look at the calendar and events page, and we also talked about, I also said, you know, I know if we talked about this, we did talk about this community outreach sessions, where, like the city council does, they have two members of the city council, so it's not a meeting. So you'd have two members, and I know Rick would volunteer, or an east side, you know, for an east side meeting, and we do a west side meeting, we do just the idea, even if we only do four-year, it would be more than, be more interaction, and we're getting feedback, and we open our meetings as a public, and one person shows up. Okay, so that's not working, but it's not like nobody cares about what we do. Nobody knows what we're doing. And that's, this is our opportunity to get out there. You know, I kind of just say, I think getting out there first and raising awareness is important, because if you arrange a meeting like this, without raising awareness, we get maybe one person coming to our meetings will get nobody out there to come sit with us and chat about historic issues. We have to raise awareness first before we have the meeting, I think. So that's maybe a long-term goal. My sense is that I would start to make, I would start to work as we develop something like this survey plan, right? We get this survey plan, and now we have a piece of information that somebody might be, now we're raising awareness. We're going to have a little chat about it. Come and talk about your neighborhood, and say, hey, we, oh, have you thought about this cool building, whatever, you've got something. When it gets back to the historic preservation plan, that's the kind of outreach we have to do as part of the historic preservation plan, moving forward as well. Right. So I think the historic preservation plan, you mean the booklet or something else? The formal historic preservation plan that would be incorporated into our comprehensive plan and digital online. Then what's the word, is that something on our agenda? That's a long-term goal. I'm not talking about the agenda yet. Long-term goal means we're not going to talk about it for a while. It's just in terms of the order of operation, we need to do the survey plan first, identify what gaps are, and really kind of doing the surveys, really dovetails into, and then we do the surveys, and once we have the surveys, we would do that historic preservation plan, because maybe what we're surveying, we find, oh my gosh, we need to do something here, or maybe we don't need to do something here, but it's all additive. What I'd like to see is some kind of, when we get finished with all this, and you've started to absorb everything that you've got today, some kind of a timeline, so that for me at least, we have something we're doing now, something we're doing next month, and then everything after that is in cloud. I have no idea, you probably know because you've got some idea, but I don't know what is happening in this year, or what's a year from now, or what's two years from now, or what's five years from now? So I would say realistically in terms of timelines, the survey plan should be wrapped up, I'll say summer, a wise public works director once told me to speak in seasons. So. Not mentioning the year of the season. Just the seasons of the year, so I would say summer 24 would be, we can expect the survey plan to be finished. At that point, we'll need to digest it, and again, incorporate it into our work plans from a staff standpoint. Following the survey plan would be to surveys, I won't have a good timeframe for that until we understand really what the survey plan says. So when we get the survey plan, we'll be able to better develop the survey when we're going to do the survey. I would expect that to be 12 to 18 months probably, so that would put us towards the end of 25. Figuring out when we're going to do the preservation plan that ties into larger discussions about an update to Envision Longmont, which are kind of parking lot right now, but part of our challenge from the department is we're in this interim leadership period, and so it can be challenging to, from a staff standpoint at least, having the department priorities get in this interim period. I can just say for an example, when I was a consultant years ago, we were hired to do a comprehensive plan update for a county. The planning director resigned shortly after we signed the contract and did the plan under interim director. New director comes in and says, I think I want to go into a different direction. So we had to pivot. So until we, while we're in this interim period, I'm hesitant to give time on this. That's kind of where I am. Speaking of the survey plan, we might, we all of us might be better served if instead of this quote, summer unquote, it was a specific date in the fall, which gives you a little more flexibility. I'll know more when I, after Josh and I digest everything, and we'll have a better idea of exact. So print a date, a specific date in the fall along the target. I have a question. Summer's too soon. How does that... Summer could be September 21st. Fall could be December, December. This is match a survey grant, a grant cycle. Should we be applying for grants now to start the surveys? Do we have to, is it a rolling grant or is there a certain dates? In fact, we want to get moving on this stuff if we could do that. There are both kinds of grants. Okay. Big grants are typically time-sensitive, of course, to your... So do we have a deadline we have to be looking at? So once we have this, come the end of summer, fall, boom, we have the money, we can get started with it in fall, winter, spring, or when do we have to get that grant out? And is that deadline? I'm just wondering. I think there's the first deadline is in January, is that the time? There's a CLG grant, which I think would be a really good one for us in January. There's the big, the bigger SHF grants would be October 1st would be the next. But those are like huge. We need to... Yeah, the SHF grant is what was used for the restoration of this building. What? We need to kind of digest what neighborhoods we're going to start organizing. I'm just wondering, can we work, you know, with both hands at the same time so we can keep going. We don't say, all right, now we know what we're going to do. We say, now let's start applying for grants. All right, now we have to wait. I think we need to have the strategic plan completed before we start applying for grants, hopefully. It'll make the grants stronger. It sounds like we're... I mean, if we get a survey plan by the end of the summer, we have time to massage to hope that a January grant cycle for a plan is completed. With an action... I mean, part of the survey plan, what I heard is we're going to get an action matrix. And so it's like, okay, one of those action out of matrix boxes is going to be applied for grants in January 25. And we can emphasize that. I have no problems with that. Or even your idea of having something in the summer, something like that. My concern is with a lot of great big open days out there, it's hard for me or I think to really understand how we're progressing along what lines. Well, and I think the most realistic idea is at each commission meeting. I'll have an update and a status report on where we are, which I think is the most realistic. We can think of date, but it's basically meaningless. It doesn't matter. It's the same thing. You can say it's going to be done by September 1st, or you can say it's going to be done in the summer. And it'll get done when it gets done. I mean, it's just the reality of how all of this works. So I think what our job is to keep, not to focus so much on the exact witness, but the pressure of this is still important, right? Every time you're right. Because you don't feel it. I don't know. I didn't have to be, but just to be sure, it's like just keep learning about it. Just keep talking about it. Just keep getting an update. You know, one of the things we sometimes, some of the things we do need money, and we, the only way we can get that from is on the city budget. And that's code follows a certain timeline. So right now, they're there in the semifinal stages of getting a budget ready to go to the city council. So there's anything we want to do in 2025 that's going to need money. We have to be asking for it today, or tomorrow, or next week, or next sometime in the next couple of weeks. Am I right? I mean, I will be honest. So this budget is typically adopted roughly off of October. So they are in the works. I have. Yeah, I've met with the city manager on Sunday for some other things. And they're in the final stages right now. You're talking about when the city council goes, boom. But boy, that is, if you say, okay, they're going to approve it in October. So September, we want to suggest this. We're still working towards it. So I need to have those discussions with my director. I don't know where we are in the process. Sometimes we have kind of general dollars for projects, special project dollars. Is that something that we can allocate for some of these things? I think having that strategic plan first is going to help guide us. And, you know, grant funding is something we're pursuing as well. So I guess my question is, is there anything that you can advise us instead of just generic monies that we might need in 2025? I mean, probably some supplemental survey funds. But that's, and realistically, part of that is going to come up with, you know, some various discussions that we're having as far as the landmark status was going to take to get, you know, to get the barn restored, to get, you know, to make sure the tower stays in good condition. So there's a lot of interdepartmental coordination that is in the early stages right now, and I'll have more information. It's perfect. Rick mentioned the, I was about to talk to him. No one saw me. Suzanne had a quick comment. Just a quick, then sort of off-topic video, but it may be people with historic preservation, and we're going to talk with communications. What about asking people to throw in their stories? Well, and they may not. We talked about the same great historical society, one of the things Rick went to one of the meetings, and I think our long-range goal was, like Steve said, I think that was a great idea. Maybe short-term, I think it said two people for the next meeting, to just chat them up, talk to them, tell them that we talked about certain things. It's not a meeting because we wanted two people there, and they can just start establishing conversation with them. Do you know how often they have meetings? I don't know. I went to their annual meeting. At least quarter of the meeting, mostly. I can look it up before the meeting, so I'll work in and answer that question. They put a little cattle prod in them. They apply for grants all the time. They have a significant staff. They have a huge volunteer base. I didn't realize how big they are. So if we could somehow coordinate with them and do some of the work for us, wouldn't that be nice? It would be nice if they occasionally attended our meetings. I think that's part of inviting them. That's part of what the two people would do, is invite them to come to one of our meetings and stuff. I think what you have, maybe the idea of the context is that historically, this body has been more of just a procedural body. It's been we review the COA. If somebody wants this, they go through the process and they show up at HPC, and that's it. So for a really long time, that's all HPC did was just stamp a COA. Somebody from the historical sites is not going to show up just to listen to one person's desire to get a COA. So as we begin to broaden what we're trying to accomplish as a commission, it then becomes maybe on us a little bit too, let other similar like-minded organizations know that we're doing that and try to bring their resources in. But this is a new thing. In my head, I was thinking, some of these groups are going to be doing these things already. For instance, the same brain historical society sponsors in May, interesting, historic preservation, a strongly festival, from the 18th to the 19th, at the Gallic Barrens. That's kind of what we do, but the point is they're active doing things in there. They also print, they distribute pamphlets, list of member homes on the inside and outside. They have, yeah, I think three walking toward pamphlets. They're just eight and a half by 11 sheets. You ought to get that information. Josh, he probably has most of the information, but maybe not. I don't know if they do this or if I wrote this down. Some kind of a drawing contest in city schools on historical homes or events. Drawings will be posted in the library and on my library. People would vote for the winner of the best city school district. Now, that may not be able to get that in time for this time, but that could be organized maybe for next year's because it has the same frame as the school district. Have to approve it. I think that goes, that would tie into that coordination with the historical society and the Long Haunt Museum. That seems much more of something that they would undertake than we would undertake. We would need to take a look at our bylaws and basically our charter effectively, but it seems that that's a collaboration type thing, not just something on us. Right. To me, it feels like if we're just helping make people aware of it or if we're supporting their efforts somehow, just as commissioners, because that's interesting to us, I don't think it's appropriate. The planning side, the survey and the preservation plan, those sort of things. I think that's an appropriate role for the survey. We're the technical side. Right. To undertake. And then supporting groups that are doing some of that other stuff, I think makes sense, but not taking it over. That doesn't feel like what we're here to do. Which also means that any outreach we do should remain focused on our initiatives. I agree very well. I guess where we've been talking about historic preservation, as I mentioned, and that we are not just going to be a state engagement. The only things that we're talking about doing are things where we're reaching out to the community and the idea to have interface, find out what they know about historic preservation. What are the neighborhoods? What is NGLA? No, that's not stamping anymore. That's interaction with the community. And how far we go and we're going forward stepping out of the toes of other people trying to do it better. I appreciate that. I don't, sure. I mean, I think at least my vision of the HBC is that it's an interactive group that talks to people about preservation and how the community feels about preservation and educates them on preservation. You know, that's very different from what Steve was saying. I know. We need to have a mission statement. Maybe we should think about defining what our role is, especially maybe we should wait until we talk to the same frame of historical society and museums so we don't duplicate efforts. We compliment them and we focus our energies where it's most needed, but maybe we should develop a mission statement. That might not be a bad idea. Again, I think if we're taking our role from the lens of a more technical body that is looking at preservation planning in the city, preservation planning within the city, that's what we do. We're looking at what are landmarks and what are, and what we're trying to expand, right? What are these neighborhoods, but it's all under the lens of the more of a planning perspective, right? It's not just, I mean, not that it's not cool to have, you know, a fun exercise out there in school or about, you know, draw your sort of house, but that's not what we're here to do. We're here to guide the city's planning effort relative to the sort of operation. I agree with Steve and I'm going to step further and say that we have a proactive obligation preservation for us needs to mean finding those things that are not yet designated for preservation, making sure they are preserved, making sure that the preservation requirements, statutes, regulations, protocols, etc., are continued and reinforced, etc. So we, the term preservation for us is a proactive term. We have things to do and it's not just preserving that which is historically already preserved. So we power bylaws and we have our charter from the city about what our responsibilities are. But we are CLG and we're a historic CLG because we were first certified by the government in Colorado. I believe our review is coming up soon. We're doing our, we're in the midst of our quandary already. So Lindsey will be attending, I believe, the April 8th. Maybe with their, would it be appropriate and we'll really have time for Lindsey to maybe give us all a little about what a CLG is and what it does and what the program exists just to get us all up to sleep, I can ask. Yeah, I think that would be, yeah though, I mean if she's going to be in our equal meeting, and yeah, I have one agenda item for the equal meeting thus far. So we have a city property, the long walk, the Firehouse Arts Center. So it is, there's restoration work that's programmed and there's an RFP on the street right now. So the project manager is going to come and talk about what they're doing a lot. It's going to be what their restoration work. So Ozzie will be, Ozzie and his team will be able to discuss what they're planning, what they're doing with that particular property as well. And I'd like an update that you already said you're going to be giving us now. What comes out of this meeting, what you know as far as stuff like by April, well everything, but you know more than you know now. Sure. What's happening from this meeting? I'll definitely be able to give a recap and kind of progress report. We'll also have three weeks from that day until the beginning of the long, long history of the historic preservation month. So anything that has to be in play has to at least be started and maybe continued at that point. Absolutely. So I don't, I don't expect to hear that our meetings can cancel. No, I have a agenda item. I do have agenda items. I've got agenda items. We have things for discussion as well. So yeah, we will not be canceling the April meeting. Any other thoughts? I mean, would that be useful or is that just maybe a lot? I think it might be useful for me. It's a commission, it's a other members of the commission think it would be useful. Because as we talked about, yeah, we're trying to do, I think it's, whether it's a true mission statement or not, it's again, one of these things like, oh, everybody needs to be reminded about what's important, you know, what criteria. Why are we here? Here's what we're doing as part of the review. Right. Just saying, tell me, give me from the state perspective of the review process. So any other items on the priority list for next year? I know what you're gonna say. I'm not gonna say anything. What am I gonna say? Um, historic east side conservation overlay. Well, that's a topic that is important, but I don't, is that something we're having? It's not an HPC item. It's definitely a print and zoning item. We're working on it. We need to give, I've got a date, we're working on getting a date in front of council. They are requested back at the December 12th meeting. Basically, an overview of the process because they don't know the process and it's less about where we are, but what are we doing? And how do we do it? And what is the ask? Because, you know, we have the pre-application meeting. Part of that was the memo that there was a report that I did for that meeting. It basically says, here's a checklist. Here's my items that we need from the community because it's supposed to be a community during the process. Right. So I will be giving an update to the council on that probably near the end of April. So I will keep you posted on that. So I'll keep you posted on that because it's a, they don't, they need to understand exactly what it is and what the process is because they don't know that. So there's two ways that I am trying to make conservation overlaid work. And one is, I brought it to the commission that we should change the rules so that the planning director, if we ever get another one, can waive the fee. But I don't know where that's gone. And then there was the east side specific request because the zoning was changed with concerns raised at the time with Joni Marsh, I guess at the time. She said, we'll deal with that later. We'll fix, we'll get your restrictions back after we get this whole vision 2020 thing done. So that was kind of a unique thing for the east side. And so that was part of the request that they made was, well, since the city said they were going to fix this and since the city took away our preservation restrictions, can you waive the fee for us once? So there's two ways to approach it. And I don't know. Well, either way, at this point, it's going to require city council approval because either, you know, they can do the special, they can do the case by case waiver, which I don't have any reason to believe they wouldn't do. Or they can, and or they can direct us to a method code. So that's kind of the question. I think this is such a unique situation that it may be most appropriately done on a well off basis. It's a discussion we need to have because I hear Glenn wasn't presenting the recommendation that the commission made for the change in the city code. He wasn't presenting it. He was going to review it or something. I think what the words were he used, but I got the sense that this isn't going anywhere. And don't recall it. I know council discussed it and asked about it. Okay. And so it was essentially when I got from that discussion, so I was at that meeting as well, is that they need to understand the process before they can approve the waiver. Right. So that's what it comes into. They need to understand the process. So it's a chicken or egg type situation. So they need to understand the process and what the ask is, and we'll go from there. Because if we are going to become a more activist commission and try to do more than just what we are required to do, I don't think conservation overlay for all historic districts would make sense. There's really no restrictions on redevelopment of national historic districts. You can carry on anything you want. If we had a conservation overlay for all of them, it would help preserve them in a palatable manner. I would think for the residents of all of them. What it comes down to ultimately is regardless of what you call it, it is rezoning someone's property. So we need to have, there needs to be a certain amount of public buy-in and political will to rezone someone's property. So we have to go through that process. There's a process we have to go through and it ultimately turns out that majority of property owners aren't favor of it, then it doesn't go anywhere. But that's really where, that's a big reason it needs to be community initiated. Because if this is something that you as a community want, then you need to drum up support in your community and demonstrate that support. And that's for, we go for any neighborhood that wants to do the conservation overlay. You're basically, because it is a legislative action and you are effectively rezoning people's property. That's what it comes down to. Yes, sir. So not to step on your district, but I think we think. I just want to clarify what the basis for my comments have been. Section 2.56.04 of powers and duties of the commission. And go down to DEF and G, advise and assist the public on matters related to the city's historic preservation program. Develop and assist in public education programs, including but not limited to walking tours, brochures, market programs for historic properties, lectures and conferences. And then G, assist in obtaining financial assistance for projects and programs related to historic preservation. So that's not stamping, just that first part, we see the deans, that's stamping. But F and G is what we're talking about, which is public education programs, interaction, making people aware of the getting their feedback on it, using that feedback in our decision making process. So I think we're well within our mission. I always love writing mission statements. We don't need to write more. It's in our mission. That's all right. It's already there. Yes. And that's what we're just starting to do. We're starting to do what we're authorized to do, is what I'm saying. But there's very little of what your district cited, with which I agree entirely, that isn't going to need to be funded. Funded? Well, there's several things that I've said that we've talked about. They don't need funding. Some stuff needs funding. And that, whether we need to, but I think to come back to what Jennifer said, we probably, if we're going to ask the city for funding, she may have a way of doing that within her system. But if we're going to get the kind of money we're talking about, we're really talking about 2026 and responding, having the funding request being a function of what the work is that we're doing right now and we talked about doing that. But getting, for instance, getting a brochure printed on historic preservation in the community. That's a grant that we need that we talked about getting that for two years now. And we just need the money for it. Maybe there's a way to ask. Oh, we also need the technical assistance to do the graphic design and get the content together. That's money, right? But also ultimately, it's coordination with the communications office, because that's something that we would need to work through that for. So they need to put that in their budget for us? I'm not certain. If they can't put it in their budget for us, then we have to put it in our budget, instead of one of the other. Or we can pass the pot. Let me talk to them and see what we can find out. Because there is, I mean, when it comes to putting together that type of doc, that type of information for public consumption, we do have our city protocols that we have to go through. And because I'm the keeper of the time, we do have this space until five, which is when we need to be out here. It's like a nice little cushion in our time for last year. So if we want to, any other item, probably, what, 10 more minutes or so? Any other items? One thing I will say, which does relate to our priorities is we are now in that mid-year work permit process. We have one open regular seat and two open alternate seats on the commission. So if you know anyone who might be interested, urge them to apply as a CLG. We always have a particular need for subject matter experts for people who are qualifying professionals. So those design professionals, historians, things of that nature, there's a whole list of, it's a pretty broad list. So that's something we definitely need to know. The commission's, as it's on, is recruiting new board members. So moving forward, and the deadline for this cycle is April 19th. So if you know anyone, they got a little more in the month to get everything in. So we see what else I have on my agenda. All right, so recap the next steps. Recap. In your list of accomplishments, you did include the demo for these, didn't you? You know what, I forgot to do it. I know. Oh, that little thing. Good point, good point. Yeah, thank you. Like a piece of paper. That's kind of an important one. Yeah. It's not great about that. It's important to pop it in my head. Yeah, that's actually a pretty good accomplishment. So yeah, 2023 was a great thing. We did a lot more time. We did some stuff. We did some stuff. Yeah, we got some stuff. When you consider that that demo on this was something that I was talking about, like the first meeting that I ever did in HVC. Okay, it was more really seemingly forever. And perhaps maybe that's one of the things we look at for more of the historic preservation of items is kind of here's what we accomplished. There may be, you know, that may also be something that's worth a little, you know, outreach. The thing about trying to have any outreach is you have some to talk about. Here's what we actually do as opposed to so. We're here. That could be in the form of proclamation, city issue and proclamation, which we have to write them. They wouldn't know what to write. Whereas following, that could be talked about the city council when it's two meetings. Okay. Something to think about. And then that something that proclamation could be that lever to get Steven to talk to the Yeah, it seems like the proclamations are usually a little more general. They're just sort of like it's preservation month. We're going to celebrate preservation month. That's all fine. You still leverage that into something, you know, it's just talking point that opens the door, right? But I don't know that that document ends up being so physical, right? It's like a broad brush. We're recognizing this, right? But but again, it's adorable. Sure. Well, where do we see this list of accomplishments going next? Where does that go? Just into the library? What we accomplished this year? And what do we think that was? I mean, I think we It's not something we usually report out. But it's something that as we're, you know, I can, I can, you know, talk to, to join me and see how they'd like to treat it. Is that my way of saying we don't report at all? And Delta, I mean, we're going to report to whom are we responsible, right? It would be part of our annual reporting to the state or our CLG for sure. That's definitely something to be reported to. So we don't, yeah, it's not something we put under our rock at dawn. But it's probably doesn't need to go back to council because everyone's approved in the first place, you know, it seems like a cyclical report. But to CLG, we're actually doing something to do our job. It's a summary report to ourselves. Do we have, do we have, really it's for us more than anyone else? We are here at all. It's true, I agree with that. It's part of the planning and development services overall budget. We do have a small, we do have a small allocation. I don't have to double check on what that is. What's the allocation for? My understanding was it was just sort of a miscellaneous spot. We've used it occasionally. We've used it for when, you know, we have a landmark for getting those brass plaques for the historic landmark. Those are definitely not cheap. Well, they paid Carl a lot of it. We paid Carl a lot of it. So something about our survey dollars for certain, you know, our historic surveys that we do from our standpoint. You're not paying job. Josh, that's coming out of our general consulting. We had some general professional services dollars for that. They're not for us. That's just playing important. Yeah, general. So maybe it's in support, in a memorandum of support for the item in the budget. We just tell them what we've accomplished during the year. You know, one major, two major, some of them that can help draft it, you know, forthcoming. But I just think something should get into writing. Yeah. And that can, because if somebody looks at that item and say, well, say they're cutting, say, well, do we really need this 5,000 or 10,000 or whatever it is? And there's no support for it other than, well, you say, well, we could do it. Say, well, no, let's look for this document, which is what we accomplished for hardly any month. If they would have to pay rent or anything like that for space. No. Okay. Do we have any physicality? Are there any documents that are uniquely ours? At this point, no. You know, we have a section on the website that we're working on. I mean, the city's website is doing an overall update. How old are we? As far as CLG, we are, I'll be honest, I don't know, because there, I mean, there were a lot of other people before me. I have stacks and stacks of binders and our files on our historic landmarks. Yeah, it would be called 1977. That's interesting enough, like no preservation plan. And that's what we're looking at doing. Your date is 1971. Yes. That's when the program was formally began a while ago. All right. Well, so our April meeting, we will have a Firehouse Arts Center. I think we've got Lindsey who will be there as well from the state to talk about our CLG review process and also just what we do is what our responsibility as a CLG is or purpose. I'll have an update as far as progress on the work that Josh is doing and Josh and his team are doing for the survey plan. And then looking at having by our main meeting, having a deliverable progress will be basically a midpoint deliverable as far as based on the work that we did today. So we've got definitely some things moving forward. Otherwise, I don't have anything else on the agenda. We've made some good progress on the survey plan work. So I'm kicking it off, Steve, because you're the chair and you're the one who's chair. I'm sort of gleefully not having to make a shepherd this entire time. Sorry if I offended anyone by taking half of the afternoon off. Yeah, perfect. So I, and then we'll obviously have the record of minutes of this meeting to review. And so I think, you know, if there's, we could look at setting up, talking about maybe just goals for other, you know, for this next steps west rather than just let language, I don't think we'll have time today, but in that April meeting, we can sort of, yeah, pinpoint a few of those and say, Hey, what can we talk about? Maybe put this, you know, put an item on a future agenda, for example. Okay, well, thank you very much, Jennifer, for putting this together. Thank you so much from her to bring it all from her to set up a new refreshments. This is still your history, I was thinking of. This isn't my hometown. I haven't painted this a picture of this in my office. This is Rex, it's UX dinosaur, then there's two more dinosaurs. He's a mini golf mascot, and these mini storage was the mini golf close down and his crap is their balls, but everyone wanted to keep Rex and he incorporated Rex into it. And they incorporated Rex into their detention area and he is projected by my school. Yep, there's a whole architectural trance, I think it was Venturi, probably right, it's like on ducks, right, just random weird buildings. My hometown had two milk bottles on either end of the town. They were ice cream stuff, walk up stands. So yeah, the store preservation isn't just you know, it's weird stuff. Well, thank you so much everyone for sharing your Saturdays with us and can I accept a motion to adjourn? So moved. Second. Second, all those in favor? Aye. And that was Jacobi. Yes.