 Good should be recording now. Okay, thank you. So first call to order welcome to the Amherst Historical Commission public hearing. I'm sorry, public meeting on Wednesday, September 22 2021 at 630pm. My name is Jane Walden as chair of the Amherst Historical Commission. I'm calling this meeting to order at 633pm pursuant to chapter 20 of the acts of 2021 this meeting is being conducted by remote means members of the public who wish to access the meeting may do so in the following manner. Open the town's homepage on internet browser. Navigate to the town calendar at the bottom of that page. Click on the historical commission meeting link. Zoom and telephone connections and the meeting agenda can be found there. No in person attendance of members of the public is permitted, but every effort will be made to ensure that public can adequately access the proceedings in real time via technological means just described. And this meeting is being recorded, and then it's are being taken as usual by someone who will volunteer to take some notes. Thank you. Thank you. Wait, I didn't say me I said don't look at me. Oh, it can be me. I'm not sure what you're writing right now paper down her car so she can't do it this way. Well, well, does anybody can you guys hear me now. Yeah, okay. All right, I was here before I'm, yeah, I'm going to turn my video off and so I can figure out where to put this. I'll try to take notes, rough notes as we go along and then you do that too. Okay, so now let's take attendance by roll call board members as you hear your name called unmute yourself answer affirmatively, and then please place yourselves back on mute when done. Patricia off present. Catherine Davis is not present Robin Fordham. Present. Becky Lockwood. Present. Janet Marquard here. I'm going to start up. Yeah. And I'm here to Jane Walden. So just a few housekeeping comments. You know if they're technical difficulties we might need to pause temporarily I don't think that's ever happened but just in case. We'll pause and then continue the meeting when things return to the normal. And if you have any technical issues during meeting please let Ben knows through the chat. Certainly if you have access to that. For orderly discussion please use the raise hand function to ask a question or make a comment. If you see your raised hand and call upon you to speak. Sometimes if screen shares on it's a little harder to figure out but I'll keep my participant list open so I can see it that way. Ben, of course will help me keep track of commission members who wish to be recognized. And if neither of those things works, then just just talk. And then after speaking please remember to to remute yourself. For members of the public who are might be in attendance there is an opportunity for public comment on the agenda toward the end of the meeting. And, especially when there are demolition requests there's usually a public comment period during those times as well. For members of the public wish to make a comment during a public comment period. You must join the meeting via the zoom teleconferencing link for video or teleconferencing so that's the dial in or video conferencing. And as explained earlier these links can be found on town homepage calendar listing. So for members of public please indicate you wish to make a comment using the raise hand function raise hand button. When that is solicited and when called on please identify yourself with your name and address. And, and then you're welcome to speak for up to three minutes at the discretion of the commission chair. The announcements are the. That's the general housekeeping. So moving on to the agenda. Announcements is number one, and Bendy you have announcements and or do other members of the commission have announcements they would like to make. So then our first order of business is to nominate and vote on a representative to the design review board. So this was. I'm sorry. You might need to wait because I think Catherine was nominee. Yeah, that's right we said we would. I'm sorry she's not here. Okay, well, we'll wait on that. All right, so then we get right into community preservation act project presentations. So there are. There are attendees who are representing different projects and I'm just going to say that Jean is here to discuss the honky house. Are we, we want to stick to the order that I wrote here. Yes, yeah, let's let's try to do that. Yeah. So this more honky house and Jean Lucas. Hello, thank you for having me. I was just saying hello and welcome, and just going to invite you to describe your project. Let us know if you have any questions and we'll do our best to, to give you our best advice. Okay, well, I'm here to talk about what we call the conky Stevens house, which is at 664 Main Street in part of the East Amherst historic district. The house has become very rundown and need major repairs. It is part of a mixed use condominium complex. The 62 units in the complex are residential units that are behind the historic site. And so far we have been trying to support the building using their monthly condominium HOA fees. And also, I'd like the commission to know that there was a period of time that this particular HOA was under really bad management. And so we have been climbing up out of a hole and essentially been dealing with safety concerns and taking care of emergencies. We do have a positive cash flow and we have managed to rebuild our capital reserve and are wanting to do take good care of the building but it there are so many major projects with it that it is really beyond the scope of the HOA to handle it. So, can you give me guidance would you like me to be talking hard numbers or do you want me to give you an overview of what repairs are needed. I think begin with perhaps give us the overview. And I think some of our advice will probably be to suggest that you focus on elements of the project that are preservation, historic preservation. Well, we, we were proposing to preserve the original mansard slate roof. There are five chimneys on top, which need to be completed at the time of the roof repair. And also, there are some small projects down around the foundation. The main house needs to be repointed. The most obvious issue with the house is the beautiful once beautiful original wrap around porch, and with its ornate balusters and railings and the original ornate dormers there are 13 of them, which need to be repaired. The original granite steps, which have been sitting there for 180 years have become tilted and need to be reset. And there is a the original iron fence which we had to take down because of damage from tree limbs falling tree limb falling on it. And we have that down in the basement ready to go when when that time comes. Okay. Let's see. Then, can you tell us maybe this is a good point to which to let us know some of the estimates and what you know the process you've gone through to acquire estimates for these different pieces of the project and what kind of numbers have come back. Okay, well, KPM has been wonderful they have managed properties in the area and are pointed us towards the Liber, I don't know how to say their names because I've only read it, but the Liberties builders who are specialized in rehab rehabbing historic buildings. And I can let's see. I mean I can, I don't know how specific to get I don't want to take up all your time with specific numbers but I have provided you guys with a several page written draft in which I enumerated all the specifics. But we've also gone to a the only person in the area who specializes in slate roofs to get our our roof evaluated. That's my hand slate roofing company and they're out of Springfield. And we have gone to Paul lens masonry for our masonry work for seasons has offered a good estimate for resetting the granite steps in front. We've gone to there's some things we're not asking for your help with but we've also gone to a time to painting and have several breakdown estimates from them. I should have asked it. Ben did you did you send that draft to all commission members. I did not. Okay. So I think Jean that I'd be glad to give you some feedback on the the draft and I'm sure other commission members would also so then maybe we can circulate that afterwards. I think so I love for other commission members to speak especially our current and upcoming Community Preservation Act committee representatives. I think it's terrific that you've got hard numbers hard estimates I think that makes a big difference to the CPA committee. All of the items that you just described as you gave us the overview. Those are, I mean to me they all sound like obvious historic preservation measures. But Robin or heady do you have some suggestions or heady your hand is up. I have a question about the structural integrity of the building as per slate roof. Have you got any information about how much the new slate roof would weigh and whether the current framing would support that. Well the current structure the building is supporting the slate roof now. It's not like we didn't. It's never not had its slate roof on what but the with the crumbling chimneys and the old flashing the water is for example curling around the edges of it and fixing the wood with water at the site of the dormers so that needs to be repaired. And there are crumbling, you know slate that is typical of a slate roof that the HOA has been repairing all along. But at, at no point has the entire roof been gone over by a roofer and if you like I can read to you what they are suggesting needs to be done. It's quite a long list. It's a back. It's got about 28. You could share it in a document afterwards. You know, sure. I have seen the book in the evening. I'm not going to be able to remember everything. Right. And I'd rather be able to kind of weigh, you know what you're going to be you know thinking about doing. In a board meeting, probably a year or two ago, I remember asking Kendrick property management to go up in with the with the roofers who were evaluating the roof at that time to make sure there was nothing underneath no mold no mold. And that report came back that there was there was no problem. So, if you like, I can ask them to reevaluate that a second time. What do other people think. Robin has Robin has her hand up. So I'm the former CPA rep. Heady is the new CPA rep. I think heady and Jane have a lot more experience with actual architectural projects than I do. So that's great. We have like a very rounded crew of people who can weigh in. I would say from the CPA perspective, what a great project to be bringing forward. It's a huge public visibility things that first can do you have a bottom line dollar figure that you're looking to submit with your proposal just so I can get a sense of things. A bottom line for for from you or for how much you do we're requesting and CPA. Yes, I do. So we've added up all the proposals. We also reviewed what we could contribute and so the total amount that we are applying for is 200,078. I mean, I'm sorry, 278,410 dollars. Okay, and that does the amount that you're applying for and there's an additional amount that your homeowners association is going to supply for the repairs is that correct. Yes, we will be pulling $20,000 out of our capital reserve and we will levy $51,000 on as a special assessment on all of the unit owners. So we hope to contribute $71,000. Okay, and so given that that's a pretty large figure is this project capable of being phased in terms that's one of the things that the CPA will be looking for that I would encourage them to be looking for if I was still on the committee that if you could break your ask out into two or three year phase project that would be maybe more maybe more palatable but obviously they also look for anything that has an aspect of urgency to it so that's, you know, I don't know favorably is the right word but that's that's weighed in consideration of of the of the proposals. I have broken it down into two, two parts. There is some considerable urgency for both parts, but in terms of phasing it, it phases very readily into two pieces. And that is that, of course, the first thing we need to do is secure the building and make it waterproof. So we go for the roof first, and the estimate on the roof, and in order to do the roof, we have to repair the chimney so they can flash to the newly repaired chimneys. And also, the, the, as to the quote that came in from the Mason is dependent upon being able to use the staging of the roofers. So we're cutting costs there. So we would wrap together for the first phase of the request would be for 100 that the total amount would be 119,760 dollars. Okay. And what would the second phase need to happen within the next 12 months or could it conceivably be a second year proposal for CPA. It could conceivably be a second year proposal but there is, I would like to present to you very quickly what the urgencies are. Yeah, actually, go ahead. Yep. Does that make sense. Yeah, I think that I mean you can certainly you could certainly apply for the entire amount and then. I think it was if it says hesitation and committee, it could be suggested that it be is but definitely having a sense of which things are time sensitive is, is extremely helpful. Okay, so the second part, the second phase would be the wraparound porch and dormers, by the way, because that is all one of that's one contractor doing both. And neither can be done until the roof is secure. So that was the second phase. The urgency of the second part is that the, the worst of that we took care of the wraparound porch was in danger of rotting off the building. The NATO a rescued it by rebuilding the understructure the deck and some of the balusters, however, the ornate railing and balusters are now rotting and falling off the building. And while the posts are still holding up the roof, the soffit and facial boards are rotten, and therefore the rot could be penetrating the underlying roof structure. And once that's affected, then the, the rescue of the porch will be many, many thousands of dollars more. That is extremely thorough and I have to congratulate you on the furnace of that presentation because that really makes it very clear why it's all very urgent so that I think is really helpful. I'm just going to ask Ben. And Jane, is this house on the National Register at this point. It is it's. And I was going to actually mention that that there, there are the National Register submissions and a listing on the state database of historic assets that would make terrific attachments to your proposal. Yeah, I was just going to say two things one is just being mindful of time we have a few CPA applications and an agenda later so just wanting to be mindful of that and then secondly, just just for everyone's knowledge and for the applicant especially I think the, the wraparound porch I don't think the railings need building code at the moment. Because they're too low so just that's probably something you'll encounter is needing to raise the height of the of the railing, and I think it's a discussion to be had about. I think we're going to lose some of the historic integrity and that's something that happens when it was building code by issues. So maybe we can figure out the exact treatment at a later date for how, how the railing is treated. And I see Jan's hand up and then, and then I see Jean and then I think we probably ought to kind of summarize and move to the next application. So Jan, would you like to comment. You're muted. I just wanted to quickly asked Jean. I don't know how much experience you have with site roofs and Mahan is very well considered in the area, but there is a monopoly. So, you know, there are different kinds of slate different thicknesses that last different lengths of time and they also do have use late that they've taken from other buildings that can be worked into a job so you might just find out you know exactly what you're planning on using how heavy they are and whether they can replace some of the ones that are bad on your roof with some good used ones from elsewhere to save money. Thank you. I will take that into consideration. And then I wanted to add one quick point. I have seen, as I was looking at restored buildings with this kind of beautiful low rail. I've seen them put pipe drill a pipe through at a higher point on the posts so that you can maintain the same or Nate historically accurate railing, but you can also address safety issues without detracting from the appearance. That's a great idea. Yeah, yeah. It sounds to me like this group members of the Commission are excited by your proposal and want to want to help you develop the proposal further in whatever way is useful and timely for you. And so I did have a chance to look at the draft. Just a few minutes before this meeting and, and I'll get back to you Jean with some, some thoughts about it. Okay, well I think you'll be able to share it. Yeah, we'll also be able to share it with other commission members. Great. Well thank you so much for hearing us out. Okay, thank you Jean. The next guest is the strong house and is there, let's see, I believe George not in this year. Oh, and Catherine Davis is here. Hi Catherine. Hi. Thank you sorry for being late. No worries will. We'll come back to an item of business that we temporarily skipped over. So let's see. Good evening George. You want to tell us a bit about what's up at the strong house. Funny you should ask yes. Since last time, when I talked to you about a plaster fall that we had on the second floor, we got an estimate for repairing that particular piece. Mr Scott whole thought that he could do the job for under $800. That plaster and there's some other that has come loose it's not attached to the ceiling anymore, but that's okay he has ways to reattach it. So he felt that that would solve the problem. So for that piece. We're withdrawing our application we haven't actually made an application but the idea that we had to apply for CPA funds we don't think you know $800 is enough to aren't applying for CPA. But the plaster situation did alert us that first off we have other other ceilings plaster on. And we are looking at getting a comprehensive evaluation of the strong house you know what is the situation with the plaster on the ceilings. We're going to need some work. And also we would like to get a structural analysis evaluation of the strong house in light of the proposed Jones library demolition and construction. Neither of those is going to go through this year. Yes, there it is. There's the strong house and Jones library. So for funds for either of those this year will need to find people who can do this kind of analysis and then get estimates from them. But suggestions that you folks had about who we might work with or any special way we might go about doing this would be very much appreciated. Let's see. It makes a lot of sense to do a structural analysis of the building with everything that's going to be happening nearby. So, I have a very odd experience of going through plaster ceiling failure. And you don't want to do that. So, yeah, I think having a structural analysis is a really good idea for a building that could does have some fragility to it. We've had problems in the past. It was before my time, but the last phase of the Jones construction. I understand. Damage the drywall foundations of our house. So they've been reinforced. There's some modern concrete work down there. But now the Jones is talking about doing more work. We'd like to be proactive on. I'm wondering if our CPA representatives can advise on whether that kind of consultation is is eligible for CPA funding. Whatever to Ben, maybe. Yeah, so I think there's still a little bit of uncertainty about structural analyses and engineering, kind of like the soft cost that happened before a an application to actually do the repairs we I think we have funded those in the past. The town, I guess, you know, I guess the accounting department is, you know, questioning that the eligibility based off an opinion provided by the CPA coalition from the state. And so we're working with our town attorney to figure out what if those items are eligible. And they could also use types of soft costs and engineering assessments and studies could also be eligible under CPA administration funds, which yeah, up to 5% per year so it's a decent amount of money. Yeah, and that was what I was thinking that the, there's, there's language that suggests that this kind of work could be done if it helps the town, I think it's like if it helps the town. If you manage its historic resources that's a gross oversimplification of the language but there's that possibility I don't know, Ben if you think that suggestion is wise to just what I would suggest but you can comment on this is just to submit an application. And then, as we figure out how things can be funded, there's something to consider as opposed to not having something on the table at all. Um, Heady is your hand new newly up. Oh, okay. George there I have another thought for you there's further would be further down the road. If, if, if the structural analysis results in a recommendations for repairs. And one another source of funds in addition to CPA. I mean I think probably whatever work needs to be done would be probably eligible for CPA funding, but another source of funds is the Massachusetts preservation projects fund. They, they explicitly exclude the kinds of soft cost Ben was just talking about they specifically explicitly exclude architects and engineering fees, they want to pay for actual, you know the actual bricks and mortar work. But that's a that's a state. Again that's a state grant that is run through the Massachusetts Historical Commission. So that would be that's either an alternate source of funding to CPA or an additional source of funding in addition to CPA. If you're thinking possibly, we should go ahead and fill out an application for CPA consideration. Just so there will be something on the table to discuss. Yeah, that's that that's right is that's your suggestion Robin, right, your recommendation. That is my recommendation. And then concurs with that yep. So yeah, I think we'll have some clarification by the time CPA doesn't need to vote until December. So I would hope we would have clarification by then. George you were saying. So were you thinking that that would be for this year or are you saying that that would be for a future year. I figured that it would probably be for a future year we had thought that we would not apply for CPA CPA funding for this year. Because we don't have anything close to a dollar amount on anything you know what, whether it's the structural analysis evaluation, or whether it's any work implied by that. Yeah, I'm going to start at the starting. Okay. Yeah, then yeah, so yeah it makes sense to get those have a have a better idea of what the proposal would be for the structural analysis. And I guess there's one other thing that you've probably picked up in the CPA materials and that is the funding. So if the application is due in October. And it is ultimately approved by town council, the funding is not available until the following is the following June. Yeah, something. So there's a there's a little calendar thing just to be aware of as you think about timeline. I think it's July one right then that was clear. So members of the commission do you have thoughts you'd like to share with George about the strong house. People know of firms that can do this kind of structural evaluation. I mean you don't have to give it to me right now but we can trade emails if you know, going forward who can we work with us. I know a couple that. Yeah, but I could share with you. Okay. Catherine or you not in your head to. Yeah, okay. Yeah, yeah. So we'll have some thoughts for you. Very good. Okay. All right, well thank you. I'm glad that the plaster repair is gets to go ahead and so. So nice on the pocket book. He was not seeing a big problem. So, you know he's the plaster guy. If he says it can be it's a little fix then maybe it's just a little fix. Good. Good news. Yes. Jane, can I just throw in one quick thing. I was multitasking on my iPad here and there is a website called historic funding.com, which you might want to look at for additional sources of funding. It's historic funding.com. Yeah, it's new. Well with a name like that. Yeah. All right, well thank you George and good luck and we'll be in touch. Oh I see there's a hand up. There's not a hand up. I think it looked like and Tweety was here and there was. Okay, well thank you for your time. And we'll be in touch by email. After the meeting's over. Okay, very good. Thank you, George. Thank you. Thank you George. All right. The Amherst women's club. I have some ideas about CPA proposal and we have representatives of the women's club here, I believe. I will bring them into the meeting here. Just to orient everyone that Amherst women's club is on triangle street. It's this building here across from the. Google maps is a beautiful fall day. A glimpse of what's to come. Here we are. So welcome. Dorothy and. Yes, we're both here and I'm going to start I'm Dorothy McCaffrey. I'm a member of the women's club. This house is no, we own the Alice Maud Hills house. It is a house that is on the national register. And we're also in the Emily Dickinson historical district. The house was built by Leonard Hills in 1864. His architect was William Pratt, who I believe has was the architect for some of the other buildings in Amherst. It's in the Italian Renaissance style. He came by the house in 1922 when his daughter Alice Maud Hills died. She had been a member of the woman's club and she left the house to the woman's club. And so ever since then, we have maintained the house and paid for its repairs and so forth. In the last few years we've completely re done the first floor, which is the public area of the house. With age appropriate age appropriate that's not the correct word but era appropriate wall papers and so forth. The house has three small apartments upstairs that we rent. This is used for our meetings and our fundraisers. And we, the reason we raise funds is because in our charter, we are committed to giving scholarships to the high school every year and also we give a certain amount of money to various community services that apply to us for grants. In the last year because we couldn't have any fundraising, so we did not do either of those things, but normally we do each year. Let's see the house is commonly known as the Alice Maud Hills House after the woman who left it to us. It's not an endowment, but because of the extensive repairs we've had to make on the house in the last not say seven or eight years. It is dwindling and dwindling and we are really really nervous that we might have to sell the house in the foreseeable future which for us will be a terrible thing and I think for the town it would be a terrible thing too because who knows what somebody who buys it would do with it. The main issue with the house currently is that it needs a paint job and all the attendant things that go with an outside paint job and all the attendant things that go with the paint job, you know repairing the porches, the roof on, excuse me the roof on the couple of people is the correct pronunciation. Let's see porches. One corner of the house has repairs it needs. There's a wall on the north corner that needs repairing and we have gotten a detailed estimate from Ron Keith construction who has done worked on worked on this house for the better part of 20 years and it's either as the general contractor or actually doing the work himself. And I think this job here he would do himself. Let's see. I think that the house is important to Amherst histories and in ways. If you think about the women's movement because the women's club itself started in the, I don't know the exact date but it was in the 1880s or 90s, and it really was a place that women could go to to have social educational and civic knowledge and to the goings on of the town and that was, I mean anybody who knows anything about history, the history of that period in the United States knows that that was a big movement for women and it was important to the women of the town. So as I said, we, we are applying this year because we feel that it's a big job. And if we would have to pay for this ourselves and dumb would almost disappear. And because we, you know we have tax bills we have very large insurance bills for this out so you know all that stuff I don't have to enumerate what we have to pay for out of the income that we get from the rents which is small and we also rent the house out. Again, this didn't happen last year, but to small weddings. LIR meets here. Sometimes, sometimes it's people will have collisions after few rolls of wedding showers, anything that is like 50 or fewer people and then we have our meetings here, twice a month. Thank you Dorothy. What, what's the size of the request. You're looking well. Did you add up all the figures. My colleague Liliana has the has the numbers. Okay. I mean I tell her the body. I'll just give a little specifics, not many of them but according to that what we got from our contractor repair and paint cupola starting from the top of the building is 5400 roughly. Then repair of the roof house has four different roofs and the second floor roof will require about 20,000 20,200 dollars and then the big job, including repair of all kind of decorative work on the house is going to cost 100,000 625 dollars. There are a few more items. There's something related to the north wall and repair of that wall about 6,400 and North and porch that is also to 1000 hundred. All together when we add up everything. This is about 166 K for this extensive painting of the house and repairing on necessary tanks club already committed $30,000 to the reparations that are necessary and the first in the line to be addressed. We are hoping that we shall be able to access to this funds of CPA and get some help in this. Okay, thank you that's the, I know how expensive the repair and painting of that style and size of house with care that needs to be exercised with. With repairs, first of all. Yeah, yeah, I can show you picture if you. No, my picture. I don't know. Ben, can you put me on. I have it in my hand. The most probably that is not so. If you can. It's too small, I think. Yeah, up above the main entrance we have area that really requires repair. The balustrades are falling apart and they need to be remade that would be there yes we are pointing that that that is the front. Yes, exactly the balcony above the main entrance. There, there we have a problem that is visible. If you stand in front of the house. Very much so, Robin, are you wanting to speak. See your hand. Yeah, I would turn on my video but I'm in the dark so you wouldn't be able to see me anyway. So, I think we were talking about an aspect of what 130 to 160,000 is that right. Yes. Okay. So my first thought again with similar to the previous applicant is having a stage since it's such a big amount of money having a stage set of repairs what are the most urgent, what are the least urgent because CPA has funding every year. The next thing I would think is trying to for these larger asks is trying to find, especially if we don't have an issue of urgency is trying to find other matching sources, or I wouldn't say alternative I'd say additional sources so that you can lower the amount of the cost to the CPA and that might be something that I, or, well that I would offer to try to research to see if there are any appropriate funds. And that that also helps to see the application to for an applicant to come either with funds in hand or to demonstrate seeking of alternative funds or to demonstrate that there are no alternative funds that can be sought. So I think the most important thing would be to first determine which pieces of work are critical in terms of the next year, and then stage things out from there and then also at the same time take an approach of seeking other resources for funding to combine with the package. Now, are you. Now when we submit this. We've only got a couple of weeks before this has to be submitted. How do you suggest that we break that down because as I recall on the application. I don't know if there's a place where you can say what you're asking us to say are you asking us to find out if there is what's the most urgent and only apply for that this year is that what you're saying. I wouldn't necessarily say that I would, but I would, I would definitely be able to outline and so you'll have the application process and then you'll also have a presentation opportunity. So it's not necessary to have every detail nailed down necessarily for the application, although you could even just put a line in there that you're trying to determine which repairs are most critical in terms of a timeline and then at your presentation which would be later in the application process you can have more of a clear sense of that and you present and the committee members will have an opportunity to ask you questions so that would be a good thing to be prepared for. Is there any limit in the amount of money that we can acquire in our proposal. I don't think there's a limit then right. No, but these are, but it's a large ask it's a large request, and I do know that the painting of the cupola, the repair of the cupola and the repair of that balustrade. I think are probably very important, but I because I'm not the person who talks to the contract I'm not absolutely certain of that. I have this bit but I'm not. We shall definitely make the list of the most most urgent works in this but the most probably we shall put all what we have from contractor as specification of works required and the quotation that he gave so. Yeah, and you might you are also suggesting that we save other funds and somehow verify that we apply to them to or what exactly you expect from us to put in the proposal regarding that. I think given the timeline that it's just a short time away that you are a simple statement that you are seeking additional sources of funding and trying to determine which repair. I would say that we already committed this 30 K for repair of the house as absolutely yes, yeah, yeah, there's yeah you put that into your budget and again, anything that's not clear that ends up being not clear on the proposal you'll have the opportunity to Okay. Committee. Yeah. Thank you. I'd like to contribute one little thing about these strategy. I understand that CPA needs to know what is most urgent, but I think if it. I think it's probably better to package it as here's one component of work. Here's another component of work and and not say this. This is what we want to do this year and and part two is what we want to do next year because that I mean for two reasons one is that's an invitation to give you less money. And second, the urgency of certain work. If there's something that's say there's some kind of carpentry thing that's very urgent. And there's some other carpentry thing that's less urgent. Well, there's a cost to to dividing them. And I think, I think CPA needs to understand that. That's true. That we need to find if efficient ways to maximize the use of the CPA funds. Well, the contract that did the contractor gave us his bid in sections. So if we just, if we just submit his bid, the way he made it out, maybe that will fulfill that requirement. That may well, that may well be. I, and I think maybe that's why he did it that way. Anything that requires staging, you know, if they need to put up scaffolding. Oh, yes, yes. I think of the house first for scraping it to everything is given in this wash entire house built containment areas for pain scraping another debris scrape and sand and as a spot prime, et cetera, applied to posts of paint, all materials, et cetera, 100,000. Okay, my, I think the CPA committee, especially needs to understand that that the cost of staging is very high. It's a waste of money to put up staging, take it down, and then get back at another stage to put it up again. That's a, that's a, that's a big expense. And yeah, so I, if you're, if you're piecing things together, I would suggest avoiding breaking up the staging at all costs. I mean, not at all cost is the issue there. Thank you. I was actually just going to add to something that Jane was saying and I was thinking about while listening to, you know, my fellow members speak is that I understand that this is the bit of the contractor has given you, but with the process of the staging and if you have to break this up and components. I imagine that you will probably need closer to $200,000. I mean, the potential exists that you could so if you're thinking about like, seeking other sources of funding like maybe it's worth considering that you might need to be raising more money than I think it was like the 160 that you had mentioned, that the potential is there that you may need more money than that, because I'd hate to see you go into this process and then find out that you actually need an extra $30,000. As a thought bubble to put out there. Yeah, so it's good to have the budget a little bit. Thank you. Good heavens. We had in February when we were talking, the painting of the house was quoted as $80,000. You are now in September, end of September, and the quote is now 100,000. But we can, but Liana that didn't include these other jobs. No, but this is just painting and that is showing that the materials went up and we don't know really. No, they did go up. They did go up during this period of time and they might go up until next June or first of July. 2222. Yeah. So that's all unknown. All of this is so volatile. And I think, especially in this climate, I think it's probable that working with someone working with a contractor you know well and who's worked with you before is advantageous to the pricing you're getting. Okay. Yeah, because contractors will, you know, if they're busy, and they don't really think the job is high priority, they'll just bump up the cost so, so that the client won't, won't bug them anymore. Gee, I hate for that. I didn't hear you what. Oh, I just, I'm, I'm sorry that seemed to be my last. Okay. Negative comments. Sorry about that. Yeah. Well, really. Yeah. Okay, other other comments from commission members. Jane, again, I'm multitasking. I'm looking at the preservation mass does have a $10,000 matching grant fund for exterior painting and repair. Anyway, just trying to think of maybe I can pull together a list of potential resources to look for in addition. Yeah. Yeah. We would appreciate if you send us that we are also looking. Yeah, I mean, I did some footwork in that department, but when we found out about this, we decided to focus on. Sure. Preparing this. And so you had said before the Massachusetts preservation project fund you had said to the other people who you were speaking to. Not sure I did look at something in the state that might have been what I looked at, but I can look at that again. Yeah. Probably, you might need to check eligibility. I think it's open to municipalities. And it may be. It may be. Excuse me, our nonprofit. Okay. We are we are that under that 501 C. Yeah, that's our tax. Super. Okay, that's great. There was one other. One other source. It may be a bit more of a. Long shot, but the Massachusetts cultural facilities fund. That's a, that's a possibility. It's not, it's not a difficult application. But the case to be made there has to be a very strong one about. The, the contribution of the organization to culture of the community. Okay. Does that message. Oh, go ahead. Oh, no, Jen, I was just going to say be happy to work to put a list together for. The potential applicant of possible sources so we can direct them to the places on the internet. And one easy email. Fantastic. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. You have a. No, it's just. Interesting to me. I was just looking up when the women's club was founded, which is 1893. And the women actually met on the campus of. What was their new mass at the. Agricultural college, which. It really ties that organization into other extremely important organizations in the history of our town. Not just at the building, which is really important or the location, which is important or the actual people who've. You know, embody the history of the organization. It's, it's also that, that other link with. The people who are really kind of rooted in the community. So. You know, I'm, I'm curious to learn more about this project and, and to support it in any way I can and I'll work with Ben and Robin to. To get more information and more resources, you know, swinging your way. Thank you very, very much. And we have a more information about history of the. We have a book that our member wrote, and this is history of. Club, including the story about house. Yeah. That's a great thing to have. Yeah. Thank you very much. Thank you. We look forward to seeing you again. With a. With your proposal. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And then. So last under CPA projects is an update on the Mill River interpretive trail. And. A potential application for that. So. He is here. Hello. Hi, maybe. Yes, we can hear you. Great. Shall I remind people of the project chain, or what would be helpful? I think. Well, we have a couple of new members who may not know much about the project. So if it could. Yeah. If you could just give a brief. Yeah. Great. So the Mill River in North Amherst. It was actually the industrial center of Amherst. And at the time of the revolution in 1775, there were six. Mills operating on the Mill River. There are. A number of sites still with sort of. Remains of cellar holes. And if you know the Mill River recreation park. The whole northern. Side of that. You'll see that. There's a hill. This was a canal. And if you go. To the right down toward. Right near where the trail starts the Julius Lester trail. You can see the dam that diverted part of the river into the canal. That went up and across. Where the road is now to the grist mill, which is the. Red building. Right next to the river on Montague road. In addition, there's a pushman clam club. So it's. Important historic. Part of the town. And all of this. What we're interested in is creating a history trail. Interpretive trail. All of the areas of interest are on town land. The conservation land. The conservation commission has expressed enthusiasm for the project. And we. Applied for CP. Funding last year. And there was, it was kind of a complicated. Frankly, I think everyone felt unsatisfactory process because there were different opinions about whether we qualified or not. And whether we were. The project was too big. And we had a kind of bigger project than we're proposing now, which was envisioning a kind of. Interactive trail with. Signs with. QR codes that people could learn a lot about Amherst history and. What we're. And it was, it was too much. And. We're now proposing something much more modest. Which is a $20,000, $100, $20,000, $100. Initial. Architectural. Archaeological research on four of the sites. That we think have the best. The most interesting remains where we know enough about, we can see what was there. And we have been encouraged to apply again. Although there's some questions still about whether we qualify. And I want to express. Gratitude really to several of you, but Robin. Has been helpful in trying to figure this out. She's actually in the process of seeking funding. From another fund. The CPA money could match. He came on the tour. This summer. We took a lot of pictures. Robin actually has a bunch of pictures. I don't know if she wants to show them now. Is that, is that too short enough? Or is that enough? No, that's. That's, I think that's good. That is probably really interesting. Part of town that most people don't know about. And these, these sites are right in front of you, but they're endangered because. It's a popular swimming area. And students are tempted to move the rocks. We have pages of photographs of. Trinkets and historic things that people have found there. People go. And try to find, you know, Civil War bullets and old British coins and things. And we want to get those into. The strong house. Or a museum is rather than have them being. Taken by. By individuals. So it was a really. Cool project that we've got to find some way to get to $20,000. We're good. We're working with a UMass archaeologist, Eric. Johnson and a colleague of his who have given us a very detailed. Plan for the research. They'll do on four of the sites to start it with. Okay. That sounds great. Yeah. What, what we understand from Sarah Marshall, who's the chair who's been trying to be helpful. And again, it's, there's been some lack of clarity about what. What qualifies. It doesn't. Sarah Marshall said it would be really helpful. It's the historic commission. Determined that this is a historic resource. Not necessarily endorsing funding, but just. Is this historically. A resource for Amherst that. You care about. I mean, it's a pretty modest. Request. Is that your understanding. Robin. And Jane. That that's what Sarah requested. I'm happy to speak. That is actually a. I believe of the CPA for anything that's not on the state register and the national register. And I don't think that that's going to be any problem with this. Commission Meg. So, but yeah, she's correct to get that assertion from the commission. And that I think should be maybe something that comes out of this meeting. The other thing that I wanted to say is that. This has just been such a great project and I. I know Ben. And I'm shoveling a lot of information to Ben and he's trying to get. Like we said in the other in relationship to the other application, we're trying to figure out what the rules are. Not just for your project, but for all projects going forward. And perpetuity. And that I would give. I would give a slight revision to what you said, which is that this is not that, that my suggestion had been to break this up into its planning and implementation phases. And so what we're trying to do is support your group's application for planning funding, which might be funded under a slowness. Different heading over the CPA. That's what we're trying to clarify. And then the ultimate result of that, if that planning funding was granted and you could go, guys could go forward. This lost my connection. Oh, sorry. The, the, the ultimate result of a. Of that planning process. Would be the creation of an. Some recommendations from the commission. I think that would be a good idea. I think that would be a good idea. I think that would be a good idea. I think that would be a good idea. I think that that process. Would be the creation of an. Some recommendations for internal implementation of the trail, which could then come forward to CPA. Again. In a second funding round to. Help bring the trail into. Existence. So all support. I think we're all in support of all of it. We just need to figure out the appropriate way with the law. So I hope that helps clarify for. For everybody who's listening. Thank you. I don't know if you want to see the photos that Robin took of the. Oh, that was what I was going to ask. Ben, I think I shared them when my Google drive with you. Maybe that's not. Necessary. Just to underscore what Robin said while he's looking. I think that's a good idea. I think that's a good idea. And this is the preliminary. Research part of the project. To. That would. And included in his recommendation and Eric's proposal. I mean. Is that they would make specific recommendations about next steps. What, what we should do. So this is a much more modest. Kind of. Early research approach to this project. And there's a whole lot. And I think that's a good idea. I think it sounds like it, you know, we, we have, we see this as an important. Community building project. Down the road, but you don't need to hear all about that. But if you want to ever. We'd be happy to share kind of why is a neighborhood association. So interested in history. It's because we. Want to be proud of our part of town and to have everybody sort of understand. How cool it is. Thank you. Ben, did you have something you wanted to add? Yeah. One thing I wanted to add was. Obviously there's this. We're seeking. Clarification about the. Eligibility of this project and where it fits into CPA. But I think. One thing I've been talking with Nate about is like. You know, I've been talking about it. Independent of the, the, the. The opinion we get from town attorney, I think. One way to frame the application, especially for the, for the planning part of it, for the archeological part of it is that. You know, the historical commission, you know, I understand we'll. And I think that that's an important criteria, but then too. You can think of the, the archeological part of it as. In order to protect the. Or in order to preserve the historic resources that are there. And that are not well understood. We need to hire an archeologist. To uncover. And identify those resources so they can be. Preserved and protected and that no harm. Comes to them. And I think if you frame it like that, as opposed to. Hey, we just want to understand what's going on here. Then. It might. It probably has a better shot at. Being eligible under a historic preservation. And you probably already knew that. I think that was kind of the way it was worded on the original application, but just to reinforce that would be good. Make sure no more harm comes to the. Presentative reserve was there. Okay. I think. Thank you for offering photos, but I think given the time. We probably should. Go to another agenda item. But. Thank you for kind of, you know, keeping at this and. Figuring the angles. Yeah. She's in California. It's great that she's joining. Yeah. I'm actually like camera works. You could have seen me, but. I had a comment. Thank you very much, Jane, for what you said. And everyone. I feel the enthusiasm people feel for the project. We just have to find a way to make this. Fit in this whole. And at a previous meeting, I had a comment. I wanted to make about something extremely unrelated. And then I, it was the meeting went on and on. I wasn't able to. Yeah. Yeah. It will be the last. It will be the last thing, but. I may come back or else I'll just send Ben and no, but it's really, really good news. About them. The. Matusko demolition. I'll just basically tell you the town stepped in. You all don't know the background. I'll write it up. It's really good with the town did. All right. Great. So we were worried about the brown fields from the oil spill. And we have to worry. Okay. Thank you all. It's really great news. I was really proud of my town. That's good. That's great. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Carry on everybody. Thanks for the good work. Okay. Thanks Meg. Thank you. Thank you. Bye bye. Bye. Let's see. Can we. We just go back to agenda item number two. Very quickly. We have to find someone to serve on the design board. And. Thanks very much, but you have to be officially nominated. Do I. Do I hear any nominations for a representative to the design review board? Do I get to, or do I have to stand back since I'm already there? I can. I nominate Catherine. Good idea. Second. Thank you. Okay. Sounds great. Well, that's. Oh, it's not over. Catherine. Oh no. We have, we have to take a roll call. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. We haven't asked her if she's accepting her nomination. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. You know, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, was what tonight was. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. I, I, I. Wholeheartedly accept. Thank you. Hey, hey, how wonderful. So. Because that was a motion and second. Let's just quickly say. Yay. First from Pat. Yay. I mean, I didn't mean that to be like a leading. Come in. You can vote too. Hey. Robin. Yay. Becky. Yay. Janet. Yes, sorry. Heady. Yes, absolutely. Thank you. And I say. Yippie and thank you. Yes. So sorry for being tardy. I, as I said, I got caught in a work tornado. So. There was a meeting a couple of days ago and there's kind of, might be a short follow up. For one of the items. So depending on how it. Comes down, if it's just a follow up to what we already discussed, I'll go ahead and do that. But if it's more new stuff then. And I told Maureen, I told the group, this was a possibility. I'll let her know. I'll send her a mailing list and everything. And I have all the materials. In fact, I have booklets, which they shouldn't reprint and everything. I'll, I'll try and send those to myself. So the town doesn't waste another. You know, bunch of paper and printing. In fact, using my email on the. The meeting thing, just send me an email of your address. If you would. Thank you. Great. Super. Thank you. And let me thank Jan for. Is it five years? Six. Six years of being the historical commissions representative to the design review board. So that is. Possibly. Well, thank you for your long and energetic service. I need to cut back now. Okay. Well, thank you. Okay. So update on the bylaw for. Our newly reworded update on bylaw for the preservation of historically significant structures. Is this a. Ben item. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I just wanted to check in with everyone about it. I just wanted to make sure that the commission put in a lot of work to. Rewrite the demolition delay bylaw. I think there were some concerns from staff about. Just making sure that it. Was. A legal, legally. Everything was with sound. And so I'm happy to. I'm happy to say that the commission was. And I think that's just the same thing. Where we had a zoom meeting went through it line by line really closely. And. He had a few comments here and there just to clarify some things. But really no, no substantive issues. I guess the only thing was the, the appeals section, which I think most of you wanted to do away with anyway. He was saying it's not really appropriate to have a separate general bylaw. So that was a big hurdle. I had some concerns about kind of the two step process and how we were defining demolition. He said not, you know, not to worry. It's in line with a lot of other communities. Especially those in eastern mass. So. That's good news. And I'm just putting the finishing touches on it with his comments. And. I don't know how much, how much any of you have followed kind of the zoning. Work that the planning board and the town council are taking on now, but. There's been a lot of zoning. Bylaw changes that we've been developing. You know, mostly due to down related to downtown and housing. Those sorts of issues, but it's kind of like, I've been waiting for like them to get through that. Lock of zoning proposals. And the art. Bylaw has just been kind of like waiting in the queue ready to go hit prime time. And I think it's, it's really close. And then in the next. You know, I think. The planning. Yeah. It could be in the next few weeks that the, that the planning board takes it up. As a. And I think that the first step is just kind of get some initial thoughts and feedback and then. Have presented to town council and then start a public hearing. So. I'm, I'm confident it'll, it'll happen in the, in the next few weeks. And. Jane and I to present a planning board with that. Presentation I put together, or are you thinking not now? Yeah, no, I definitely, definitely. That makes sense. It's still up for it. Depends on when it is. Yeah, yeah, exactly. I told what I told Chris. Restrapped the planning director who is, you know, kind of the liaison to the planning board is. You know, I would, I would. Way rather. Present at a meeting where the, you know, We actually, the planning board is not completely overwhelmed with a million other things. As they have been the past. You know, two, three, four months. And to get them, you know, when they're fresh and. Rather than, you know, and this has happened twice to me now where I'm on the agenda. And I sit through the whole meeting and then. They decided to. End early because it's so late and everyone's brain dead. So I told her like, let's just get through this busy time. And if it needs to wait a few weeks and that's fine. But. Sounds good. Yeah. Thanks everyone for your patience. I know it was a. One of those things. Better to have the right strategy for it. Then to rush it. Now this has been underway for just one of those things. It's been in the works for a while. So if, if we're now. Needing to wait a few weeks longer after having come this far. That's true. Yeah. That's all right. That's okay. We started November of 2015. So if we get it done by November, we're going to have to wait a few weeks. It's just. Rocketing past. I mean, Thanks for all. A much faster process than the writer's law. That was 2009. So gosh. And both ended with a good product. So that's, that's what came out of it. It's just. Rocketing past. Yeah. And both ended with a good product. So that's, that's what counts. Sorry. I just wanted to thank Ben for taking it on. I think it was really. It was great that it became. Home and that area of sort of more expertise and we get to weigh in, but not have to be quite. Not have to recreate law without a law background. Yeah. We've been working through it with a lot of changes of staff and members. Yeah. You helped us tie it. In a nice little package. Yep. Thank you, Ben. Thank you. And then speaking of. The long running writer's walk. Next agenda item is setting a date for a launch event. Yeah. So I still, I still thought, um, I know we kind of went the late September day that we had in mind. Can't. Coming down. Not quite, but we were thinking. Only 20 seconds. That's true. But I think I was a little nervous just because the, the town canceled the block party, which is like a big, big event. And I think with COVID numbers higher. I just, I didn't want to push it, push it to have an event, even though it's outside, but, um, I thought maybe mid, mid to late October, things might be a little bit better and the weather will still be somewhat manageable to have something outside. Um, so what I, what I really had in mind, and I'd like to hear others thoughts was just, uh, Just kind of gather together outside. Um, one of the signs probably on the common in front of, I'm thinking the bolt in front of the bolt, what in makes sense. Um, and just to say a few words. Uh, maybe we can get the town manager to, uh, uh, give his blessing for the, for the project and, uh, whoever else, maybe, um, uh, and Tweety or someone from the bid might want to speak and, and then, uh, Uh, kind of just, I think, you know, go, go see a few of the signs, maybe go down spring street or the, uh, Dickinson museum. Uh, there's one in front of, uh, crazy crazy noodles on main street. Um, if we want, we could go into like the Lincoln sunset neighborhood. Um, but I think, uh, just kind of get our steps in and go, go see a few of the signs. What if, what if we gave everyone a map after the ceremonial. Yeah. To have a parade might not work. Yeah. But to give everybody a map and to say, choose what direction you want to go in with your group, your family, et cetera. Because I, I in, especially with COVID, I can envision us making a group walk. Yeah. You know, I think that might not be, be so welcome, but I think if we gave everyone a map and, and whoever is speaking to say the Emily Dickinson house is this way, the Lincoln street is this way. Um, you know, and here's a map and you choose where you want to start. That might, that might be, um, COVID friendly. Um, Dan, what do you think? This is your baby. Oh, that's fine. I mean, the cards have a map on them and a list of the houses would be addresses. So those will, they'll have those automatically. And. Yeah. I mean, I think there will be a whole lot of people there. Um, it's more probably a media event. So the newspaper pops a picture and puts it up after they've already found the, um, the pest release that Ben's working on. And that just brings more exposure. I think it works fine a year. It's my favorite weather. I think it'll be fine. So, I think it will be fine and press release will include the brochure with the map. And so that, that will be part of it. But I, I, I think allowing people to kind of focus on what interests them and make that their start. Might be. And once we have a date, we can have Amherst books do a display in the window of the authors. Right. I don't know if you want to talk to them, Ben. About that. They had said they would, right? Yeah. I planted the seed in like. Probably July or something. And they were. Exciting. Yeah. Yeah. So. I mean, maybe we could just walk over there because there's that the one. A sign right in front of their building. Um, and then they might have something in the window that will support this. I don't know if you want to talk to them, Ben. About that. They had said they would, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um, so what kind of. Uh, What kind of organization need steps need to be done? Should we include this date in the press release? And, um, And then, uh, let's see. Send the press release to some kind of. List. Yeah. Um, I usually have the, um, the town like communication manager. Handles that social hosted to the town's website and then has like a list of contacts. She'll send it out to. So. I'm sorry, Jen. I was just thinking if, if we're wanting the town manager and maybe the chair of the town council. To be present. Um, I think we need to be some, some conversation behind the scenes in, in settling on the date. Yeah. That's, that's a good point. And then, um, and then kind of formal. Um, official invitation. Yes. And maybe, um, uh, 8 by 8, you know, by 11 flyer in some of the windows. Around town that it's happening. But, you know, sort of part of the press release is a shortened version. Maybe just to put it in the bookstore and some of the restaurants and. Well, maybe at the boltwood front desk for visitors or, you know, And there's a Facebook page from the bid or a combination of the bid and chamber of commerce where they've been posting. Event information. So if we have a poster, they might be very willing to have posted on their Facebook page. Yeah. In a time, time sequence close to the event. Um, if you, if you don't mind my, um, Sort of changing the headline to say something like, um, Emily Dickinson's home now part of writer's walk. Um, I think we could send it out to the, the Dickinson list. So just the ones that go out would say that. Just. Just, yeah, just the one that the Emily Dickinson museum sends out. So that it, so that it looks like it's speaking to, to our list. Right. That makes a lot of sense. Especially since we added it in where it hadn't been before. This is good. It wasn't on the original walk, you know. Yeah, it's an important part of it. So good work. They didn't do any of, they didn't do things that were already known. Yeah. So I added that and something I forgot what the other one I added was, but there were two that weren't in there. Huh. How about that? No, I, I didn't know that. Was it Robert Frost, Jen? I can't remember it might have been. I can't remember. I don't know. I don't know. Or it was some house that was well known or something, but anyway, yeah. Well, fittingly, then. The sign at the Dickinson house was the last to go up. So is there a day of the week that this might be more. Attended or attention pay. Yeah, or I wonder if it. Oh no, I guess that's not a good idea. I was going to say. Somehow time it. Like after the farmers market, but now I realize. The farmers market is on the common. So there's a little bit of. Right. Parking's an issue more so because their space is taken away. Won't it be ending soon though? I guess. Going all the way to. Just before. This year. Yeah. Yeah, it might be tough to get. Town manager and staff on a, on a, on a weekend. On a weekend. Friday, Friday after work. Yeah. Like a Thursday or Friday, like five PM or something. Yeah. So I think that's a good point. We're four for 30. Well, it's still light. That's a good point. Cause it's getting, I mean. The days are getting shorter. But, but in October mid-October, it'll still be lighted four o'clock. Yeah, I'm not sure on a Thursday I can be back from Boston in time. So we'd have to be Friday. But if you want me to do. If, if we say. I'll just have. If you want you, you have to be. Oh, okay. Absolutely. And you, we probably want you to speak a few words about it. You want me to dress up as Robert Frost or something? Sure. I can do that. Okay. I mean, maybe I can give the, maybe I can give the town manager and town council folks, like an option of the 15th or the 22nd or, or the Fridays and late October. I'm not here at the 15th. I'm keeping care of my grandson in New York. Sorry. The 22nd. Start with that. That works for them. Otherwise. 29th. What about. Well, the, the preceding. Friday is a little bit too soon. That might be the start of Columbus day. I don't have a calendar in front of me, but it might start at Columbus. We can. Indigenous people weekend. Yes. Okay. All right. Should we throw in another day in the week? When are you in town, Jen? Monday, Wednesday, Friday, I'm here. So, Wednesday. Like this, like, like us now. Like us. You know, well, Jane, you too. Yeah. I usually have something. I often have something late afternoon on Wednesday that I can change. So I can, I can change it. Yeah. And I can change it. I can change it. But I think it's just wrong right into our meeting. If we're having a meeting, if not, we can go out for a drink. A little frivolity. Yeah. I'm pretty unbreakable. Champagne anyways. Yeah. So maybe we should focus on Wednesdays. If the Fridays are looking not so welcoming. That gives us more. the Wednesday before Indigenous Peoples Weekend, the next Wednesday and the next Wednesday. Those are three weeks in a row that are still probably decent weather. Well, the sixth is too early, so the 13th, 20th, or the 27th. If we did it on the 20th, it's my birthday. We can have birthday cake afterwards. Why not? We'll toast to. We'll raise a glass. We can put a candle on every single writer's walk sign. Does that make sense to everybody? To do those Wednesdays? And that gives you conversation points, Ben, to figure out which works best? Yeah, that sounds good. So is the 22nd, is the Friday 22nd not an option? No, it's still an option. We're just giving you more possibilities. Okay, yeah, that sounds good. All right. The last thing before the closing items is the Amherst Preservation Plan and possible update. It's overdue. Ben, you sent us some workshop information and one of the workshops was Preservation Plan Workshop. Yeah, so I think I signed up for it. Yeah, I have to get to it today because I got taken away before I could get back to it, but that might be something if everyone can schedule it as a preamble to are having to start working on updating it. Yeah, I think it's scheduled for October 20th at 10 a.m. There's a webinar about developing a Preservation Plan. That's a good starting place. That may be just reviewing the Preservation Plan. I'm thinking there is a, I think there's some kind of document from a while ago that sort of checks off things that have been done. It's probably buried deep someplace, but I'll look for it. Okay. Yeah, so just so everyone knows, we have the money for it. We have $25,000 from CPA I think from 2019, 2018 or so that we've been sitting on. And I think not only is there, not only is there, it's important to update the plan, but I think the CPA committee is starting to get more stringent on spending money within a certain time period and not just banking the funds. So it's important to do it for that reason as well. But I just think going into it, we should know kind of like what, obviously the first one was from 2005. So the work for it probably happened in 2003 and 2004, building up to it. So it's fairly outdated at this point, but it might be good to just kind of see what worked, what didn't work with the first plan. Obviously, the bulk of the plan is, or not the bulk of it, but a fairly large section is just the history of Amherst, which we wouldn't need a consultant to rewrite per se unless there's parts we want to edit. So I think they could add details here and there, but really focusing on the implementation steps. And I think getting someone with the knowledge of Massachusetts and the different grant opportunities that are out there and how does mass historic work with local historic commissions and just understanding that framework would be good. And not to say that the Martha Lyons, the first original author didn't. I just think having that background would be helpful. But I think I'll work with you all to put together the RFP and the scope of work so we can all kind of craft that together. And I think one thing I've been thinking about as well is with the Civil War tablets, I feel like there's been a lot of momentum towards thinking about African American history in Amherst and not to mention the reparations efforts that are underway with Town Council and the work we hope to get underway with in the West Cemetery. So it might be interesting to kind of have that lens going into the preservation plan as well, thinking about what groups are not well represented in the original preservation plan and what we might look to do to kind of address that or bring that to light. So that was just one thing I was thinking about is what is something that kind of a new way to think about it as well. Yeah, actually, that's one of the arguments I made. And in fact, when I was getting resistance from the CPA to for funding it, so that's great target. It's something that's been an issue for me since the beginning on this commission is that we tend to want to preserve the fancy houses that were built by the rich and that all the workers dwellings and row houses and, you know, the areas of town like the Korok and the African American area are not as attractive to preserve, but I still think they should be. And I think that some of the farmhouses that came out of the Sears catalog and those kind of things, still we need to have representative examples of all those. So this has always been a concern and it would be great to actually state it, you know, for the record in the preservation plan. Yeah, I agree, Jan. It's all who the town is and we have to recognize that. It's a very forward thinking kind of current, I think, and the preservation movement is really moving in that direction. So it's a perfect time for it. I mean, if you look at the things that we looked at tonight, we've got two big houses that were mill owners and that sort of thing and it would be good if some of the workers' houses were also being, you know, most of them didn't survive. I mean, you know, they were poor construction or they've been taken down since, but if there is anything that comes up, we need to sort of prioritize it, I think. Well, I think that house that got moved, Barry Roberts is an example of that. That was a typical farmhouse or modest house and, you know, our encouragement and Barry Roberts willingness to work with Amherst College and Amherst College is willingness to preserve it. It all came together and I passed by that site a couple times a week and the support basement is in now and I would be curious to see how they actually settle in there. It seems like such a remarkable progress, but the short story is we were very concerned about preserving that building and I think that we will continue to be. This might, this is premature to make this comment, I think, but this is where registered districts or local historic districting could be useful, because, you know, the big houses we talked about tonight, they're both, they both have that kind of designation and they get to kind of use that as leverage for CPA funding and so that's a tool. Yeah, there is actually a really interesting group of houses that Habitat for Humanity built down on Southeast Street, just off Southeast Street and I'm very curious about them and their preservation. I don't think they're that old yet. They're about 1970, I knocked on the door and actually used my I'm an architectural historian line, which I don't usually use anymore and, you know, talk to one of the owners there. They're an important group of middle class, lower middle class housing in our midst and, you know, I suspect that they're, as Jane's saying, if we're building out our knowledge of neighborhoods and residential areas, we'll find more. And that those houses were interesting because and actually I actually think they're post 1985 or 90. I watched them being built one after the other. But it was land that belonged to Amherst College and Amherst College students were part of the Habitat group that built them. And I believe a local architect designed them. And so if we take all that into consideration, we need to keep an eye on them, make sure they're preserved. Yeah, they're a moment in time of a movement Habitat for Humanity building houses with sweat equity of the future owners is a movement that that is part of modern modern history. So let's see we've next steps with this. The webinar sounds great. So practical steps, I think, if we haven't, if we individually haven't, like, scanned the preservation plan recently that that might be a good thing to do. And then the RFP, should we look at a draft at our next meeting or the meeting after that? Ben, did you have a sense of what how you wanted to how you wanted to execute on this? Yeah, so let's see. I could maybe maybe next meeting we could like brainstorm ideas for the scope of work. But I, you know, there's like a mass mass like planners listserv, there's a mass historic preservation listserv, there's another one that's mass planners listserv and the I think Northampton is updating their preservation plan to right now because they're they're the planning director over there just posted on mass planners to solicit examples of scopes of work and RFPs. And I reached out to the Northampton planning director and he sent me everything he received. So I had let's see from Beverly from Arlington from a few other places kind of a Sudbury scopes of work so I can kind of begin to pull some language from there. And yeah, it'll be interesting because, you know, we're updating a plan. So some of the work's been done. But the I think it's still should definitely be applicable to what we're doing. Okay, thank you. That's, that's pretty great to have that delivered right here. Yeah, planners and asset users are very forthcoming share a lot of information, which is nice. Yeah, that's nice. Okay, well, that'll that'll be great. So let's see I'm looking at our participant list and we have now zero attendees. So we we can forego the public comment period. I'm sorry I haven't just a quick I am going back to Meg's um proposal is just she had an inquiry about when the historical commission will confirm the historic significance of the Mill River site area. Would that be at our next meeting when we're actually reviewing the proposals? Oh, and would that be in the form of a letter from you with the commission's agreement? You know, I haven't I'm not I don't know if there is a is any, you know, process to this or whether we just vote on it and then and then write a two sentence letter. I think it's the latter. But then I think it's in that it might be in the GR guidance. I remember reading it somewhere. It's not very specific. Okay, all right. So I think maybe to make it to make it a kind of a serious effort, if we maybe have one page about these four sites and maybe a photograph of each one is is that something that so Meg said you had some photographs Robin does that does that have photographs of the yeah yeah I can get something from Eric and the four and four photographs and for that to you. It could you know it could be sort of basically what Meg said tonight. Okay I can see if I can yeah okay yeah well I'll pull out what I can and I'll forward it to you this week. Okay that's great and then I think if we I don't know that just it feels better to me personally to have you know something to that all of us have seen. So I get I think that would mean next meeting. Okay so we can discuss it and then take a vote. Okay so I will perhaps send to you and next meeting we'll discuss and take a vote. Then Robin or and or Teddy I guess I was wondering could you clarify when the historical commission needs to like provide recommendations to the CPA committee. I'm looking at the calendar that I think they sent out and a little bit unclear I mean there's this kind of during the month of October there's this period of like questions and responses to applicants. But then it's you know it's not till December that they're actually or November that they're discussing and voting so. I think it's when we start discussing that that that happens that yeah because we go through so the moment the discussion opens we go through each of the proposals and then I would say for the historical commission proposals the commission you know is recommended you know whatever this amount of funding for this projector so that's yeah it doesn't need to it doesn't need to happen till what never late November. Yeah I mean unless I think they would probably want the historical commission recommendation before they begin discussing and voting right so. No I mean I'm trying to think I think last time we just we took the vote within the meeting and I took it with me. Yeah and it wasn't really awkward up until we get into the discussion of it so as a committee we first sit down and we go everybody has done their question and answer and then we review proposal by proposal and that was when I would weigh in to say the historical commission formally recommends this for this dollar amount for this reason. Okay so this schedule would mean that we would need to make our recommendations by October 28th so that would. No because those are presentations that's that's the people with the proposals coming before I mean we could certainly when does the when does the proposal application close. October yeah okay yeah so I mean there's no reason not to do it in the October meeting. Yeah okay yeah I think we have until discussion begins November 18th so we've got the October meeting and if we had our meeting early enough in November we'd have that time too. Becky. Oh just a quick question about the proposals themselves where can they be found so that we can review them. Yeah so they've not actually been submitted yet at this point they'll be submitted on October 1st and then they're posted to the town's website. They'll be okay. Yeah good question. Ben will you distribute them before we we'll distribute them before we review them I don't I didn't recall them being on the website before I mean I always receive them as being a member of CPI so. Yeah either way whether or they're on the website or they have to be emailed to me separately yeah I can distribute them. Okay he'll alert us. They should be wouldn't it be like in a folder or a portfolio kind of like our our meeting materials are. Yeah yeah yeah yeah we've always gotten them like that before. Okay yeah okay so the next the last agenda item gained significance because of the CPA proposal next meeting date. Yes. And let's see so this is the this is the third Wednesday. I think that's what we were trying to do. Uh huh. So yeah what if if the third. Yeah I have it on my calendar. Good. Oh everything's happening on my birthday. I just think you have us to celebrate with Jan. Probably more than I would normally have. I encourage you to take the full birthday fortnight that's what I do I take a two-week period where I say it's either before my birthday almost my birthday just after my birthday or it was just my birthday. I usually do the entire month of October. There you go. I believe in birthday months. Yeah. If you get really creative with the agenda. If we do the writer's walk that day though it would be a pain to go there and then try to get home and then have a meeting that's too much in one night so it is maybe we could schedule to the following week if that ends up being the favorite. Yeah just as long as it's I can't do the week I cannot do the 13th. Okay well the 27th maybe. Okay. Has an alternate yeah okay that makes sense. We're looking at November right? October I'm sorry October okay yeah. And then let's see oh goodness I can't pull up my calendar but should we we I guess these are we don't have a raft of proposals we can get through them in one meeting don't you think? Yeah we've heard a lot about them too already. Yeah yeah I mean because usually we hear the presentations and then rank them. Yeah so we've already heard some of the presentation. Can we do all can we do the presentations and the ranking all in one meeting? Yeah probably. I think we should limit the presentations this time because we've already heard from most those people and rather than having them go on and on just tell them they have five minutes to update what they said or something like that. Yeah well and I think yeah a time limit is kind of standard that's what we do at CPA too you really have to fit it into that time period and then it keeps things succinct. Yeah and we will we will have read the proposals so we I think part of the point is for us to be able to ask for clarifications. Yeah in some years when we had a lot of them we just only asked questions and they didn't say anything unless they were answering our question. Yeah that's right and I just noticed that the third Wednesday in November is the 17th and discussions start on the 18th so we've got we've got that little bit of wiggle room if we need it. That's good okay. All right. Can I move we adjourn? This meeting has only lasted two hours. This is perfect you've done such a good job. I have to get up before dawn and turn away if I'm not ready. Are you sure? I mean we can touch on that degree. What Jane you want to start celebrating my birthday now? Is that the point? Yeah that's the real point. Okay all right well thank you for the the motion and the second and this is not a debatable motion and yes. Well thank you thank you Ben thank you Jane thank you everybody. Thanks everybody. Have a good day and see you. Thanks. Bye. Bye.