 In preparation for 2023 presidential elections, the National Judicial Council has issued a new policy on political and election-related cases to courts. And the People's Democratic Party abandoned zoning and throws open the presidential ticket. This is Plus Politics. I'm Mary Annacol. The National Judicial Council has issued a new policy direction on the handling of political and election-related cases as such suits begin to flood Nigerian courts ahead of the 2023 general elections. The new policy issued by the NJC's meeting gives strict rules to politicians on where they should file their political and election-related cases. Announced by the NJC's Information Director, Sojuye, the new policy also contains rules on how heads of courts and judges must handle suits that have been ruled upon by a coordinate jurisdiction. The statement said the NJC issued the new policy to prevent another wave of conflicting decisions from courts of coordinate jurisdiction. The new policy, according to the NJC, takes immediate effect. What's running us to discuss this is GDO Logo. He's a legal practitioner. Thank you so much, Mr. Logo, for joining us. Great. Let's start by looking at all the things that have happened in the judiciary, of course, with the elections over the years that has led the NJC to this position. I mean, just recently we had two conflicting court orders that made the CJN, of course, come out to say this cannot happen again. But then the question is, even though this has been put out by the NJC, how realistic, how walkable is it, and will Nigerians, including the politicians, abide by it? You know, with the experiences we have had, we expect that this time around, the judicial council will proceed to ensure that these laws are enforced. Because we cannot outrightly say that before now we don't have rules and regulations that the judges are expected to follow. And the National Judicial Council remains an executive body established by the federal government, you know, in line with the provisions of Section 153, NJC is amended to protect the judiciary of Nigeria from the whims and caprices of the executive primary and, of course, by extension to ensure that the judiciary functions in a way that justice is delivered to the people. And like you brilliantly mentioned earlier, we've had instances where you have cross-expatial orders being given by courts of coordinate jurisdiction. And that is what the National Judicial Council is trying to put in stock to them. Now, a very recent example is the fact on the new electoral act 2022 as amended, particularly Section 84, Section 12, that stipulates that political appointees must resign from their offices at least 30 days before the primary. And somebody now went to court all the way in happy as they, and a judge trying to position this new provision with the provisions of the constitution declared it null and void and that it should be expunged from the new amendment. And of course, that may be the position of the law, but when you clearly try to identify that who is a political appointee and who is a civil servant, the constitution is also clear. But interestingly, the appellate court has ruled that that provision contravenes the fundamental human rights as we have in our constitution. But this countenance, the decision of the court in happy as they by virtue of jurisdiction and the fact that the person that went to court does not have a local standard. And we call that what interest do you have to have gone to pursue? You see a situation where we paint the picture of what we call forum shopping, going to a court where you are likely to get people. And the National Judicial Council is rising up now to say we were not allowed to continue. If the judiciary is entrusted with the mandate of justice, then justice should not just only be done or clearly seem to have been done. In the words of Martin Luther King, Jr., he said injustice anyway is a threat to justice everywhere and that we are caught in an inescapable network of mutualists tied in a civil government of destiny. So and whatever affects directly affects all indirectly. So if we allow the justice system to be derailed, definitely the impact will be felt by society in the health sector, in the economy, everywhere. Because World Section 15, Subsection 5 of the Nigerian Constitution 19 as amended says is that the state shall abolish horror practices and abuse of justice must be able to stand tall in health society. Talking about justice standing tall, I mean just like I said in December last year the NJC had to sanction about three high court judges after issuing conflicting court decisions on political cases with the same subjects matter. Now the councils have also warned various heads of courts to put a stop to such embarrassing conducts of their judges in the various jurisdictions. But my question is, this is the season where we're going to have these suits and countersuits. What are the measures? Because you see, I feel like we in this country have several laws that may have covered almost everything but we always find a way or look for loopholes and half the time, you know, the double standards. How do we, what are the measures are there that may be put in place to ensure like you said the enforcement or strict adherence to what the council has put out? Because it's okay, it's all fine and dandy to put this out, but what is the assurance that we will not see the same things play out that we've seen year in year out for the election cycles? Lovely question, you know, and I think I have partly answered that by saying that these rules need to be enforced by whoever is ruling them out. And brilliantly, the judicial council is addressing the issue of the judicial and one of the highlights of these new rules is that any suit that the outcome, the outcome will likely have an effect or compelled persons of actions beyond the territorial jurisdiction of any state must be filed at the High Court of the Federal Territory, Abuja. So that was a stop to, for the example I just gave, where somebody will rush down to IBR state. And where there is a clear, within the exclusive judicial of the Federal High Court, the new policies says they shall be filed or received at Abuja and assigned by the Chief Judge of the court. And it further states that all such suits within the course of action that arises in the state and the relief sought or declarations, you know, within the state, within the state territory with no consequence outside the state, they shall be filed or received or had only in that state. So you don't say that you are not satisfied with the decision of the High Court in legacy, for instance, and you start rushing to Oshun state. You see, so they are trying to make rules and policies that will ensure that justice is actually transparent. Because I mean, like all those cross-expertise decisions that both embarrassments recently, you know, that led to the sanctioning of some of the judges. We need to prevent all this. You see, we have laid much emphasis on expatriate order. But in the ways of justice rules people, one of the judges in the Supreme Court of Nigeria, he is of the opinion that expatriate order must remain a part and possible by justice system due to his utility, because there are certain conditions that must be met before the grant of the expatriate order. In such situation, there is a likely irreparable or serious miscarriage of justice that will result if that order is refused. And what is expatriate order? An order sought and obtained without putting the other party on notice. You recall that recently, the governor of Central Bank rushed to court, asking the court to grant an injunction against Aine, and then the attorney general of the federation in respect of his intention to declare and obtain nomination for the presidency of Nigeria. And the honorable justice said, no, this is not serious enough. Put the other parties on notice, let them come and show course or allow me to grant the order. So justice is declared to be the umpire in the society. You see, the legislative arm will make the laws, the executive arm will execute the law, and the judiciary will interpret. And when the judiciary begins to lose the confidence of the people, it's a very dangerous development. It was Blaise Pascal who said that justice and power must be brought together so that whatever is just may be powerful and whatever is powerful may be just. If not, we'll be creating confusion in our society. That is why we must commend the noble intervention of National Judicial Council in ensuring that we follow the path of honor to find justice in the temples of justice. I want to take you back to some things that the president had mentioned in his first tenor about election tribunals. And of course, I remember lots of people argued about the manpower. You know, they talked about personnel, judges to seat on these tribunals. So I'm trying to understand if this is some form of, let's say a bridge between the election tribunal and the average court system. Again, if this is going to be just in a boujah and subject to states depending on where the cases are, how fast can these processes be? Again, let's not forget that the majority of the problems that we've had. In fact, the reason why our election calendar is the way it is right now is because of the suits and the counter suits and the cases of, you know, rising from elections. And so we now have Akiti and Oshun and we have the likes of Anambra in November of 2021. So what is the assurance again that this would bridge all of those gaps that have already been created within the electoral system? Do we see fast tracking of these judgments or is it just going to even slow it down further being that the courts in a boujah might be saddled with more and more cases than it's ever been able to handle? You know, it takes a function of efficiency and effectiveness. And we need to look at the macro environment. Do we have the requisite infrastructure and the superstructure to support effectiveness? And when I talk about infrastructure, you talk about the processes. Yes, fantastic. When you get to the Supreme Court in a boujah, you know, you'd be glad that you have such specifics in the country. But the story is not the same in many courts. There are courts you get to sometimes there's no electricity. And the judges or magistrates would have to struggle, you know, to sit on these cases. And you talk about the workload. I can let you know that even in the Supreme Court of Nigeria the courts may be dealing with cases of 2008. So there are various challenges that we can upscale. But what are we making ability to support the system? And again talking about the manpower, can we claim that we have justices and judges and magistrates, you know, who serve in the temple of justice that can fully concentrate on that career that we know need to combine other businesses with what they do. Keeping the economic situation in the country. So these are some of the several issues that affect us. These are general issues, not just in the judiciary. And that is why sometimes you find out that even members of the National Assembly that should be in the National Assembly making laws for the country are busy running after contracts and, you know, running after importation of goods and services to make ends meet. In quotes despite all the huge allowances they collect. So we need to build a system that allows people to focus on what they have been mandated to carry out. You see, and in this age of IT, it should not be a serious burden to dispense justice. I can let you know we have a lot of challenges, a lot of challenges. New judges are brought on board to support the system and you constitute this tribunal when necessary. But given the fact that for many years we had a lot of backlogs, then you must be concerned that we need to clean up the space to give room for efficiency and effectiveness. Because I must say that some judges are really working against it. Hi, I've been in a court at the time and I really commend the magistrate who was in Oba in Lagos here for working under such a very harsh condition. But just because she was diligent, another magistrate would have adjourned all the cases and asked you to come back at another time. Because they have that discretion. So those are the issues we have in the country. We need to upscale our environment, our working environment and the mindset, the attitude to work to ensure that we deliver. And that also brings the time frame into it, knowing that whoever comes to court is in court because justice is the desire. Because I was going to ask also because you're saying an upgrade in infrastructure and an upgrade in the working environment. And I'm looking at the time frame. The primary is for the political parties, it's just around the corner. And before we know it, elections will be here. Is there even time, enough time for that upscale to happen? Again, this question is solely for you at your own discretion. Do you see the government in a position to do that upscaling to make sure that it happens? And when I'm talking about the government, I'm talking about those who have been elected or appointed by Mr. President to oversee the judiciary. Do we see them pushing for those upgrades or the upscaling that you're talking about? And these changes that must be done to fast track and reduce the workload. Can it be done within the time that we have before the elections in itself begins? You know, brilliant question. And I can let you know that in Nigeria, all things are possible. Let me bring the experience we had in the aviation sector recently. When the aviators even expressed intention to down to. We saw how quickly the National Assembly decided to gather to intervene and top personalities hope to them. And that was suspended because the higher mighty are afraid to travel by road because of the set of insecurity. So, but that could not be done in the case of us. So it's a matter of priorities. You see, okay, let me bring another case. The Section 4 of the Nigerian Constitution 1999 as amended says that the National Assembly shall make laws for the peace order and good governance of Nigeria. And you expect diligence in that. But sometimes it drags on and on and on and on and on. But right now we have the amendment of the electoral act to accommodate statutory delegates. And we can also see the speed at which that law is being amended. So it's a matter of whether they are, whether, how well it affects them. I can let you know after all, we've had, you've seen how about 4 trillion Naira mobilized to attend to society and things like that. So the interest on the higher money and the interest of the general populace. But you see the explanation that you gave, or the example that you gave about the aviation sector. That's more urgent and expedient for the politician. But then for some people it might just be great if certain things drag out in court and delay the process. So it's a win-win for certain politicians. But I really don't know what would make it urgent for the average politician other than maybe them also saying, oh well, we're shutting down and downing tools. And I'm not sure that we will see that coming from the judiciary any time soon, will we? I'm just, I use that illustration to tell you that if it is important, there will be a way to attend to it. Like they say, if there is a will, there is a way. And let me say this, as a lawyer, I know the enormous discretion that judges have in their courts. You know, I must at this point commend Justice Khaim of the National Industrial Court. You know, we were in that court on a particular day. We started sitting, I think, around 9 a.m. And this justice did not rise until about 6 p.m. And he would tell you, I'm not just here to listen to your cases. I am judged by the number of cases I conclude. So if, for instance, you come with a frivolous excuse to waste time of the court, it is the one that will throw out your excuses and give you a specific time frame. You have to come back to me next week, so-so-so day to come and prove your case. Recall that recently during the prosecution of Nandikhanu, the law enforcement agents came to court and said they could not bring Nandikhanu to court for logistic reasons. I mean, the judge could have said, what is the logistic? Is it vehicle? Then go to my pool of vehicles, get to Hilo's bands, get my odd list, and go and bring him here. So those who are in the temple of justice, they have enormous power to deliver on justice. And that is why sometimes some people suspect that, okay, maybe they have been manipulated. Let me tell you, naturally, with the crop of politicians we have in Nigeria, some of them just want to waste time and throw spanners. But when they realize that the courts will not allow any privilege, for example, you come to court with a frivolous matter. The judges have the latitude to slam you with heavy damages, that they slam you with serious and monetary sanctions, and then next time you don't think about it. But in a situation where we are even beginning to make laws now that if a candidate presents fraudulent documents in terms of credentials, it's only another candidate that is contesting that can sue on you. So if you buy some disturbing extensions, we are even trying to water down the dictates of justice. But by and large, if we want seriousness in the judiciary, we can create that seriousness. I've been in court when the judges within law are stepping down this case and we attend to you by 2 p.m. So go and get in touch with your other colleague and this case must go on. I have two more arguments for you. Don't waste the time of the court. So these are issues. Well, for some judges who are overwhelmed with different kinds of cases and some lawyers also will naturally come to waste time bringing different kinds of application. But what some judges do is to harmonize everything. I said, no, this application is not necessary in this instant case. Through this or I foreclose your matter. So it's a collective responsibility to ensure that we upscale the respect that is allotted to the judiciary. So it's not just a one-way traffic. But I'm saying that these are all possibilities. It's not possible if you decide to make way for it and make effectiveness the order of the judiciary. How can the judiciary even because I mean I think the true the litmus test in as to if the judiciary has changed its ways or will be serving or will be as we always say here in Nigeria the hope of the common person is in this elections and the season. How can the judiciary regain the trust of the average Nigerian the public because we're all looking many have lost hope in the judiciary. Many have pointed fingers. Many have said that they've sold themselves short, whether it be the bench or you know the average lawyer. We've had those concerns over time. Do we see that the judiciary trying to right those wrongs in 2023 even as they attend to issues that pertain to the elections in closing. The essence of justice is to help us have a sanitized society. And I have said it you see in the judiciary environment we have the bench and the bar. The bench talks about the judges and the magistrates and the bar the lawyers and the bench can regulate the bar. I don't comment with my time. I just say that go this way or I throw your matter out and go elsewhere. And one of the new rules now which is fantastic is that if there is a decision in a court of ordinary jurisdiction for example you got a decision in legal high court you cannot go to or you're on the same facts. You can only go and appeal. Some people will go and start a fresh and that is if the judge in Oyo says no I've read about this case I've heard about it in the news. Why are you before my call? I don't have time for you go to the court of appeal and the court of appeal is ready to attend to it quickly. We move forward and let me say this. Francis Bacon said Francis Bacon said if we do not maintain justice, justice will not maintain us. So we need to create that confidence by yes we can get justice from the judiciary and the lawyers also can call themselves to order and say no let's help the judiciary to really gain the confidence of the people. And when you have these checks and balances and you have a very strong and effective National Judiciary Council trying to regulate and they also have a penalty mandate and they can penalize and call lawyers to order. Then we find everyone trying to stand tall and performing their assignments in the temple of justice. Well I want to say thank you. Judio Logo is a legal practitioner. Thank you so much for being part of the conversation. We appreciate it. Thank you. God bless Nigeria. All right. We look forward to what comes out of the courts and the judiciary in the coming elections. But thank you all for staying with us. We'll take a short break now. When we come back we will be discussing the main opposition party abandoning zoning for the 2023 elections and of course President Goodlock former President Goodlock Jonathan abandoning the People's Democratic Party for the ABC.