 I found a lot of people that did it after I did it and they saw me and I was like, that's a blessing. If you're making money from learning from what I'm doing, and it's still a bunch of money to be made, bro, make your money. That's all everybody wants to do. Make money from the stuff they make. They copied my format, which I have no problem with, and they were having success. And I was like, bro, that's so dope. What's up? What's up? I'm Brandon Shawn. And I'm Corey. And we are back. Well, you had another episode of No Labels, Necessary Podcast. You can catch us every Tuesday, every Thursday on YouTube, Apple Music, Spotify, wherever you stream your podcast, chopping it up and representing for the artists, the music, entrepreneurs, those who really live at No Labels type of mindset. You can't put us in a box. We do this, how we do this. And we got a very special guest today, Kebo. Yes, sir. Kebo is a unique fellow because there was a headline the way I found about him. There was a headline from CNBC. Let me just read this out. Making $82,000 a year as a rapper on Fiverr. That headline sound familiar? Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Is there some accuracy to that headline? Absolutely. It's all factual. All factual. Now, I know there's been times you've made more than that off of Fiverr in the year too. Right. We had that talk. Now, a lot of people are going to be wondering how, right? This guy's making $82,000 on Fiverr. And I'm up here dedicated my life to these Spotify streams, these Apple music streams. And at the end of the year, I got my wrap up and I ain't got no more than $3,000. All right. Right. I'm still at zero. We just did an episode talking about how there's 38 million tracks on Spotify to have zero streams. Right. So this is a completely different approach to how to live a career as an artist. And this is what we want to get to. So Kibo, there's a lot of different places I want to get into in terms of your particular career. But just sum it up, let's get straight to it. How are you making $82,000 in a year on Fiverr as a rapper? As a rapper. Yeah. I pretty much take the talents and first off, it's an honor to be on the show. I'm a huge fan. So everybody who's been watching, man, this is so dope. I basically took what I've been doing behind the scenes for a good 20 plus years rapping, not making much money, not being able to pay the bills. And then I said, hey, I will rap for your birthday. I will rap for your intros and your shows. I pretty much will use my skills at your disposal. And it was a hard transition to say I'm going to do that because it feels like I'm selling out, making my own music and trying to get signed. You know, the idea of getting signed is always the vision since back in the day. So to do that just felt so foreign. I didn't have a blueprint as to if this was cool, you know what I'm saying? But once I got paid my first amount of money, I said, it's cool enough for me, man. You know what I'm saying? So money, money changes things. It doesn't mean you got to sacrifice your integrity. But I'm like, I could, I could support my actual music career. Like this is, this is fine, but it was a lot of hurdles to get over. But that that the big transition happened in 2016 to to condense the story. And like I said, it was no blueprint. So I'm just kind of like doing these things and just staying up late the night taking orders like. And it's just it's just been a long road. But I've been kind of I feel like I've been behind the scenes for so long. And when they said they want to share the story with the world, I said, man, for sure, there's a lot of people that don't realize it's so much money out there. So me sharing is not going to take no money out of my pocket. Just think outside the box when it comes to like using the talent that you have and seeing how you can monetize it. So I would be selfish not to share what I've learned because, like I said, I felt like there was no blueprint. So if it ain't none, I'm going to show what I did. You know, yeah, I like that. And I know there's a lot of details to get into in terms of what you go through, the artist doing what you do, right? How you have to adjust your brand. And there's something to be said for any artist trying to build their music career while like working their regular job, whether it's a nine to five, right, eight, seven, whatever that might look like. Right. But this is an even more unique space trying to use music brand while still doing some other type of music. That's not necessarily your music brand. But before we get into that, the details of what you do, can you kind of like just walk through the workflow like, hey, somebody says, I want this type of song, right? Is it a corporation or just a random person? I want you to make this song for my girl and then you rap it. Like, what does that look like? Yeah, it varies pretty much. If you can think of it, I probably had to do it, not had to do it. I've done it. It'd be a lot of corporations where they want a song to celebrate a 10 year anniversary of being successful. You wouldn't even think of that. They want an original song that has their names in it. And so I have to make it. And a lot of times they're older, you know, older people like older music. So I have to find a segue of like what I'm comfortable doing because they may want something that may sound like nineties. And for me, I don't like to just keep going back with the old style all the time. So I'm like, let me do my style. Let me try something. And so I find a common ground. That's really the hardest part, trying to figure out what you're comfortable doing. And then, you know, then then deliver it. And they're like, oh, I actually like that. You know, I thought I wanted something like pop and big, but I like your style. You know, so you got to like find that groove. But companies, companies always want something for personal use. They want something commercial use for maybe a song or a rap. I do songs for people's birthday. But it's the key component is custom. It's always about how can I make that person feel special? You know, people say, oh, I cried when you made the song for this. My girlfriend and this and that. And I always be like, dang, you want me to rap for your girlfriend? Like, is she are you cool with that? He'll say that always felt funny. But I realized that they don't see it as me trying to highlight the girl. It's kind of like, hey, I got this song for you. So it's a disconnect with a disconnection type of thing. And I think that's cool. But it's it's going all across the board. But now we say rap for your girlfriend. Like, is am I sending you a whole bunch of like lyrics or telling about a personality or am I just giving you pictures of her? And no, no, no, I usually don't work with pictures because I don't know what that is. You know, like, you got to tell me like things that she likes a moment. You just give me a bunch of stuff and I try to pick apart what I like to share. Because a lot of things that are finding a special to you, maybe hard for me to articulate in a bar, you know, like. And so I try to just say send me some things. Sometimes they send pictures too. But I'd be like, hey, she looks like a great great person. But I don't really know how to pull from it. Like, I need words. I need things that happen. You know, like a picture only does so much. You mess around and say something and they go, all right. Yeah, like, love your beautiful face. You know, say something like, you know, you think and that might be disrespectful. You know what I'm saying? Like, hey, Brian, say that in the order. Like, don't be saying she. So. So, yeah, you got to like go off of what they they're comfortable. And, you know, and it's it took a while to get that skill to be able to like articulate it. But after a while, I built the formula. But it's always from scratch. You know, some people some people think I have a template. Like, yo, I got a birthday for John. And it's like, I just plug in the word, but it's all from scratch because I've done it so much that I can already, like, as soon as I see what they ordered, my brain starts like going like a million miles an hour and I can pretty much put it together. That's crazy, because like when I first saw like your story, I immediately thought to watch a Jamie Fox show when I was little and he used to get his jingle company. Yeah. And I was like, that's mostly what he's doing. Right. Just in a bunch of jingles, you know, and when you first got into it, how did you see it? All right. Were you thinking of it as a, hey, I'm doing this in this industry, right? I know there's a lot of songwriters who write songs for commercials and things like that, or was it kind of like, well, this person wants me to do this. And you were almost kind of just, I don't know, not even as an official profession or anything. How did how did that go at first? Yeah, I'm going to be completely honest. When I first started, I really was trying to make sense of it because I felt like this could be seen as corny. I hate to say that, but I didn't have an understanding of I'm making money from a skill that I do. But in the rap world around 2016, 2017, it wasn't, there was no space for that. But then I had to do my research and I was like, Luther Vandras was a jingle singer. Phyllis Hyman was a jingle singer and writer. There was so many push or tee you all talked about. So I'm like, there's no shame in saying I'm using my skill to make money. I just I couldn't connect it because I was like, I don't have anybody to talk to. Like, is this does this make sense? You know what I'm saying? Because if I put out music and then they don't they don't go together. But I understand his business. I had to really learn it, but I didn't see it as like, cool. That's why I never promoted it. You know, I was like, I'm going to just do this. And I never really posted about, hey, hiring me on it. I never did it, never did it. And I feel like I was supposed to business wise, but I never did it. And I just got super lucky and fortunate that Fiverr had an algorithm that helped push it because I was just like, and I'm not about to go on my Instagram with my real music and be like, did you like that? Hiring me today? And I'll make you it just doesn't go with me because I'm like, I really be into my craft. So it just felt like I'm putting commercialism into it instead of it being more nuanced instead of you hitting me up. Be like, man, you killed that verse. Let me hire you. And I'll be like, oh, OK, I got this gig, you know, but I just couldn't find that rhythm. But I was fortunate Fiverr had the algorithms together. So I didn't have to go outside of my comfort zone. How long does it take you to create a track? It literally can take me less than 30 minutes because, for one, I already have a bunch of my own original beats that I've made. And then I hire my brother. So everything is like not I don't have to use anybody else's unless the client gives me a beat and or if it's a personal used beat, like if it's something personal, you can get any beat. And I pretty much doesn't take me long. It doesn't really take me long because I already had a beat because I like to work like that. Because otherwise I'm going to be sitting there working on the 808 for like days and be like, can you change it? And that just be too long, man. Like I'm telling you what you what y'all think y'all want with the beat. You don't you don't care. It's just got to get you a feeling as soon as you hear it. And I'm like, I already know the beats I like and what I work with or you give me so they can take me 30 minutes or less. And it sounds like I'm just throwing something together, but it really just be off emotion. When I read what you tell me, I'm like, I just get into like, OK, this is how I feel when you send me that. And I'm going to just give it to you how I interpret it. And then it's up to you whether you want me to change it or not. But 30 minutes to create a song, how much? Oh, for 30 for 30 seconds right now, I have it set at $65. You know what I'm saying? And but again, 30 minutes to make a full song. Technically, I can do it, but I usually don't. I usually spend an hour because I like to kind of I like to kind of let the hook kind of let the melody come to me. So I like to like kind of just I don't know. Step outside of something because I really want the hook to be memorable. So that's why I don't rush the full song. But 30 second song, 65, 16 bars. I have it at 130, just equal. And then right now I have a full song at 250 because it was lower. But I upgrade, I changed it up recently. I still think you need to run them numbers up a little bit. Just a little bit. Yeah, you're right. You move it in the right direction. Yeah, you're right. You're right. I'm changing it because I feel like it's it's time and the workload has increased. So I got to be respectful of my time in the craft. So yeah, I mean, you you brought up something that is interesting. Me and I just had never heard about or thought about. Like you talked about not really pushing the services to your audience and really banking off of the fiber algorithm. And, you know, kind of hearing you say I'm like, man, it makes sense. Fiverr has the algorithm. Everything has the algorithm. But thanks about like that space. Like what did you learn kind of like working through that process? Like what were some things that you had to do that you didn't think you had to do to kind of help you out in the world? For sure, show your face. That's that's the key component. You can have a gig and you can just put your picture on there with a bunch of words. But you have the visual component, the making a video saying, yo, hire me or original video, just anything that shows a person. And now more than ever, it's important to show a live person. I get more people wanting to zoom chat with me about the idea because they just don't want to feel like they're talking to a robot. You know what I'm saying? Especially they don't want to feel like they're getting scammed, you know, because it's kind of scary that it's like, yes, I will make a hot beat for you, send this much money. And then they be like, is this a real person? So I'm compassionate for that. But showing your face, I had to learn about that customer service had to be on point with that. You got to be non. You can't be emotionally invested in the work you do because they may ask you to revise it. And you be like, man, I killed that beat. You don't need no revision. That's that's that's a complete but you can't be like that. You got to be like, all right, what is it that you're wanting to change? You got to be very detached from the work. And that was hard because I'm just like, bro, there's no revision needed. I killed that beat like you don't need a revision, but I had to just silence the ego and be like, OK, what what realistically are you asking me to change? So but I had to learn business. I had to learn about my image. I thought it was always about bars and verses, but I can't be looking crazy in a video because it just it won't sell the song. You know, and that was another component that a lot of rappers on Fiverr didn't offer videos. I said, I'll do it. You know what I'm saying? I just tried to see everything that I could actually do. And then I did it. And then they said, oh, you need to add a video, add pictures, add this. I just did everything because that's really the thing. When you think about any kind of success, have you tried everything? And then usually it's going to be like, well, no, I haven't tried. You ain't did it all. You got to do it all. And I guarantee you after doing it all, you're going to see some kind of success in any arena. Yeah. Are you are you only working in Fiverr or are you working in any of the other like gig economy sites? Just solely Fiverr and then also when people hire me outside of Fiverr, like they hit me up on Instagram, they email, they hit me up and I work with them. And that's that's crazy. And that's sometimes it's not even related to they don't even know I'm on fire. They just find me on Instagram just posting my freestyles, which is really dope. I find that really cool. So they see you posting freestyles, your regular music, and they still got some stuff. Yeah, which is crazy. I'm like, dang, I'm just like very fortunate that it just I'm not promoting Fiverr and you just find me and you're like, yo, can you know, I'm like, that's dope. They don't ever even know that the two coexist, which I find really dope. That's interesting. You said something earlier, you make your own beats. Yeah. So do you also have a gig where you make custom beats for people? Nah, I didn't want to do that because I felt like it would over exert me because I actually had a gig when I first came on Fiverr and then I shut it down. I was mixing for people like they would send me their song and I mixed it and I can technically mix. But I realized how much I hated mixing because I would judge all these songs. I'm like, I could have went hard on that verse. That this beat ain't all that. And then I'm just like, why am I doing this? This is not what I need to be doing. I need to be detached from the work and I couldn't do it because I'm like, I wasn't, I would be judging the music instead of just mixing it. But I'm like, I need to make, I need to make music. You know what I'm saying? So and then we're doing beats. I feel like if you ask for revision, I'm like, man, I ain't trying to pull up. So anything I can do quickly and efficiently, that's what I want to do on Fiverr. I don't want to do something that over exerts me and has me stressed out after I log out the computer. I just want to be able to just because I can revise a verse over and over and it doesn't bother me because it doesn't take much effort to write it because I've been doing this for 20, 20 years. But making a beat out, I still do it, but I just don't want to offer that skill when I would get frustrated. It would be, you know what I'm saying? Yeah, that's like a creative exercise for you. Like, yeah, where people can take forever to write something, come up with something for you. Right. It's like clockwork, which is dope because also you talk about creating your own beats that probably allows you to charge what you can charge to because you don't have to buy a beat from somebody else or anything like that. In fact, that's dope. Well, now you mentioned video. It reminded me about something that we talked about. Yes. Well, let's get into the brand conversation. For sure. Because you told me that you did a video early on and you learned your lesson. Yes. Can you tell me, you know. Yes. A little bit more about that. Absolutely. I know we're laughing chorus, like, what's up? Basically, in the beginning of Fiverr, I was more like the movie Yes, man. You know, I had to say yes to everything. Jim Carrey had to say yes. I was pretty much like, if I could rap about it, I'm going to do it. Even if I'm like, I'm going to do it because I need to get my gig popping. And I'm so grateful to be making money. Like, I'm making money. Like, I can keep making these. And I had a gig that was political and it was at the height of like 2016, whatever. And it was Trump, Hillary, but it was a third party. And I'm not trying to make this conversation political, but I have to stress I was like, I didn't care about what people's political views. I didn't care. And I didn't care about religious views. I was like, let me get this order. And they were trying to make me rap about a third party, but it kind of looked like it was bashing one of the parties. But I didn't even put the two to two together. I'm like, hey, let me get this money, man. And I did it. And I, they said, can you do a video? I was like, bet. Grabbing, grab, grab, political. Don't care. Don't care. Come to find out that video goes viral. And I'm like, and my dad sees it and he hits me up. He's like, bro, what is happening? You, you voting for this dude? I said, bro, no, I just, I lose like a million views and people in the comments, like, who was this clown? How much they paid this clown? I said, no, that's not what I was trying to do. I wish I get a check, but I was, I was, I was jigging in the video. I was just jigging, just going in, trying to get my little check. And it was a low moment because I'm like, man, this is a sellout. Like, I know that, you know, what I am was talking about to sell out. This is a sellout. Like I was doing it for the money. I'm jigging for the money. Like, and I was like, never again, because politics can get misinterpreted and people can see what they want to see. And I was just like, I'll never do anything for me. I'll never do any political cause I just, I see that it just, it's volatile. It's already like toxic as it is. Why I'm going to throw my head in there and say something. But I didn't even believe what I was rapping about. That's why I call it a sellout moment. So I was like, but I had to do that because I had to learn. I wouldn't have known, you know, people would tell you, but I had to go through and I was like, okay, I learned my lesson. I'll never do that again. And I'm grateful for the opportunity. I'll laugh at it. Like I'll never be ashamed of mistakes I made on the internet because I got to learn it. And I got to, I get to tell people, hey, don't do this unless you're sure. So it's funny to me though. It's funny. I mean, I think part of it probably too is because it was steps at a time like you rapping, you know, my voice, it just is what it is. Nobody's really going to know. And you said, you didn't really know too much about the political party that it was anyway. So you just wrapped on lyrics, just my voice. And then the video guy asked for it separately. And at that point, you already did the work. You just thinking about this, oh, a little bit more money, whatever. Well, you kind of got like walked into it. You know, they might even, they look, they might even have been thinking that way from a jump. So they probably did. Yeah, they probably did. And then when they didn't even know that they had a cloud like that. I didn't. I didn't bother doing my research, you know, which is why when I started to get real hard on people when they ordered videos and say, can you do it on green screen? I say, nope. I don't know if you're going to have monkeys doing all kind of crazy stuff behind me. So I said, no green screen work. I don't know what you're going to put behind me as a joke. Because in 2017, a lot of people hired hired stuff and be making funny memes. I'm sitting there rapping about, I don't know, something crazy. And you got it on greens. I said, no, that's what I learned from that. I was like, I don't know how my likeness can be used and manipulated. And I look like, like a fool. You know what I'm saying? Let me take a quick second to make a special announcement. Kibo has made the decision to actually do a small course on how to make money like he's made on Fiverr. Step by step from setup hacking the algorithm on Fiverr so you can get paid more and how to handle the entire process. You can check it out at www.brandmannetwork.com slash Fiverr. You have to type in www.brandmannetwork.com slash Fiverr. That's F-I-V-E to ours. And I have to say this is extremely special because we don't know if it's going to be available for long. Truly, he's just doing this test. You'll hear in the interview that he didn't have a course decided after we first talked to him, hey, I'll give you our audience something a little special. It's going to be a huge deal than what he normally would charge for. So if he does decide to keep doing it, the price will definitely go up. So check it out now at www.brandmannetwork.com slash Fiverr after you finish the interview, of course. Now, that furthest the brand conversation because you don't go by Kibo on the Fiverr side of things. No. Right. So can you talk about separating your artist brand from who you want to be in terms of the artist to the world? Right. Your artist brand in terms of like your work, you know, just to get the business done when you're doing something like that. Because I think there's a lot of artists who have opportunities like that where they can do work, but it's still not something they want to mix with the artists that they want the world to know them for. Right. That's always hard. But what I what I had my original name when I started Fiverr was Super Hype Mike. I always didn't like that name, but it was Super Hype was a mixtape that I had about 2011. My manager was like, hey, just be Super Hype Mike. I was like, I ain't got nothing better. So I rocked with that. And when I started Fiverr, I was telling people that was my name. So then they started releasing the stuff I was on all everything. I'm rapping about everything. And they just put in featuring Super Hype Mike. And I was like, man, that is not what I want to be putting out there to the world. I wouldn't even want to be on that song like that. I was a work for hire type thing. So then I was like, man, I can't be telling. It's already too late. So I was like, I need a real artist name because I do want to put out real music, even if this is what's working now. Like this is not the end all be all. Like I do want to have my own work put out. So then I came up with the name Kibo and then I made it clear. Like if you want to feature me, like you got to ask because some stuff I'm cool with being on. But it's not that I'm not don't want to be on a project with my name on this. Like it may not be aligned with what I'm trying to do. You know what I'm saying? Like, and that's OK, you know, because the deal is I'm going to work for hire. So if you want to put out the song without acknowledging me, I'm OK with that. You can make an alias. I'm OK with that. But you got to understand like I got stuff that I want to say and it may not be aligned with what I'm rapping about for you. And I'm so people got to understand that. That's just business. But I had to learn that because I didn't want to be ungrateful to people. But I mean my name, you know, saying like my name, I got to I got to protect that. I still I want to do this forever. So, you know, I can't be on everything and it just won't make sense. You won't even check out my real music. You know, you heard me, I want to rap and buy all kind of stuff. You say you want to do this forever. Are you talking about the Fiverr thing or your music career? Be an artist. Be an artist. That and that encompasses making art, producing, writing. I want to make art forever. So I can't be in a box with just being a Fiverr rapper. It won't make sense because this game changes so much that you got to be open and malleable to switching it up and not be afraid to change. You know what I'm saying? Like I want to I want to make art forever. And I'm always going to find a way to make money from the art because I'm I'm a weirdo. I'm a weirdo. I'm cool with change. I'm cool with seeing stuff switch up. And I just want to I'm always going to be open to see what's going on. You know what I'm saying? So I don't know if that answered the question. Let's say I went to some philosophical thing. It definitely did. But I mean, speaking of philosophical, man, you. Basically sold out, as you said. And then you found another moment where you had to split paths in terms of your artist brand and your professional brand. But internally, right? Like, what were you going through as an artist? Because, you know, you use the term sell out. But I know as casually as you said that, you don't you don't take your art lightly, right? Right. Yeah. How you want to present yourself. So how much of a struggle was it truly to to do something like this, to make money based on what you grew up seeing was cool to make money? It was a struggle to make sense of it. But after a while, I was realizing I'm able to take care of my life just from rapping. And I started to sound crazy. I started looking at my apartment in the walls. I'm like, dang rap paid for this rent this month. I'm just looking in the wall like rap, rap, rap. And I told my dad, you know, like rap paid for the house, you know? And I'm just thinking this thing that I thought was just like a hobby as a kid, I'm like rap is paying for this. And so I'm I started to look at things different. I'm so grateful, man. Like I'm so grateful to be bit by the bug of hip hop and rap and for the circumstances that happened the way they did. So what what first was like, you know, kind of like confusion and feeling like a sellout was my like, nah, bro, like I'm I'm super grateful. Like because not everybody gets a chance. I even Googled it. The percentage of people that make a living off of music is very small. So I was like, I'm a small percentage. And so I'm like, if I can share any kind of insight I've learned from this period, I'm all I'm for it. But it took a while to make sense of it. You know what I'm saying? Even though money was being able to come in, I just I was like, bro, but what if I get signed one day? You know what I'm saying? What if Jay-Z sees me and he's like, dude, you can't be rapping about all that stuff. We got to drop. You know, it's in my head. You got to stop that, B. You know, I was just thinking that could possibly happen. You're saying so I don't know. Yeah, how has it changed? How has it changed the way you kind of look for money opportunities around yourself as an artist? I'm assuming like this is kind of opened your mind a lot to the way you can make make money in music. So are you are you currently looking at other like non-traditional music industry ways to make money? Yeah, so I have a few since the article. A lot of I've been reached out by a lot of people and it's a lot of things developing like, you know, without going too deep to detail apps and different, you know, because I've been on video games. They had me on a game which tripped me out. And I was on a show, a soundtrack for a show called Dogs of Berlin on Netflix. They found me from Fiverr and they said, we're going to be on Netflix and people tell me stuff all the time. And this song going to be big. And I said, that's cool, you know, thanks for the order. And it was and I was like, what the hell is this crazy? I'm on Netflix. My mind made it. But, you know, it's it was just cool. But I'm just thinking like, man, your music can be everywhere. And sync licensing was one of those things that I was privy to that I just did not understand until somebody hit me up on Fiverr and worked it out. And I was like, bro, there's so much money. And when I watched TV shows, they got these little songs in between. And I was just like, there's so many opportunities to to use the songs you make, whether old or new and put them out there. And it's over my mind of a lot, you know, even in the cartoon and animation realm or just making content. It's just anything you could think of where you can get eyes on your stuff. And it's the list goes on and on. But I'm still learning in real time about where to put music. And it's it's it's exciting to see how I could take it. Yeah, that's dope, man. Because, I mean, you know, we use the term Fiverr Rapper because of how, you know, the headline presented itself. But really, you know, artist, songwriter, you're just doing what songwriters do, right? You know, writing jingles, writing these custom songs, writing things that could be used by other people. All it is is being a songwriter, right? It's it's the skill set, like you said. And with that being said, I want to touch on that skill set that it takes because you talked about some people want older types of music, different styles of music. What does that look like, right? Having to be able to create in a specific voice for these type of people and different styles? Because I know you said you had to stay. I think you even mentioned having to like catch up and listen to new music to write in different styles, right? Well, you were the old person. So what does that process go like? How do you continue to stay relevant in songwriting in that way? Well, because I'm 38 anytime. I try to I used to not tell my age, not because I'm ashamed, but it just it appeared as if when I told people, they're like, Oh, you my older brother's age, so you into that old school. And I said, bro, no, I grew up with it, but I like keeping up. Like, I got to know what I spice on. I got to listen to the album. I got to listen to it. It's not because I'm just trying to stay in the mix. But I I hear them like, OK, I like that. But the switch happened when I joined Fiverr and then somebody said, yo, bro, I want something like all my friends are dead, bro. And I said, is this a song you're talking about? I didn't understand what you were talking about. And so he sent me the link. And it was the first time I heard a little Uzi Vert. And he's like, push me to the edge. And I was like, OK, that goes kind of hard. I wouldn't even listen to this. But Fiverr and all these young kids had me in the loop. It was crazy. It was crazy. And then I started to actually get back in the mix of like new music because when you're older, you got a nine to five year work, you go home, you watch TV, play video games. Where do you listen to new music unless you go to the club? Who puts you on? That's that's a very real thing. You know, we want to make new music for, you know, people 25 and up. But like, where are you really jamming out and being open to it? And I wasn't even having the time to listen to it. But once Fiverr hit me, I was downloading today's hot hits. I was in, you know, TikTok wasn't out. So I'm just like, I had to stay in the loop. But then I was like, you can stay in the loop and not have to like do what they're doing. You just got to be on the pulse of it. So you know, the rhythm that they on, like when little baby is a triple time beat and you know how that goes, you don't have to do it. You just have to know internally what we all on at this period because you can miss periods. You can miss periods. I was talking to my dad about New Jack Swing and he's like, well, what, what era was that? I said, bro, that was 88 to 91. What was it? He's like, I was raising y'all. I said, oh, that's true. Yes, that's true. Yeah. So like big moments like, dang, I remember when Pac died. He's like, oh, what year was that? I said, bro, I was raising you. So you can be so busy on your life that you miss it. It's understandable. But if you want to stay current, you have to take time. If you playing video games, if you chilling, put new music on, even if you don't want to hear it, just put it on. I bet you're going to find at least one track in the new. You have you have to do it if you want to stay in the post. There's a lot of slang and all that I learned from TikTok. And I'm like, my brothers, my younger brothers used to put me on when they went to college. I said, what y'all bumping? What y'all bumping? What y'all saying? And they say, OK, but now I can be on point with TikTok. You got to. You got to. Otherwise, you will be always fantasizing about the past. And, you know, we've already didn't heard it. You got to keep up, keep up. And that's hard. And for rapping on older stuff, that's not hard at all. I already know, you know what I'm saying? It's not a dis to older music, but I didn't have heard it. Meantime. And that's OK. But newer music is like, I'm going to tell you this one thing. It was 2017. This kid ordered from me and he's like, yo, I want you to kill this beat. So I wrote the coldest verse and he said, too many punchlines, too rapid rap. And I said, OK, so I took some words. I said, and then the third time I freestyle it. Just when just nonsense. I mean, I was as a joke. He's like, perfect. And I was like, OK, I don't know what I'm I don't know what hip hop is right now. So I had to go back and listen to what we was on. And it was kind of more like, you know, SoundCloud rap. And I had to not hate it. I had to listen to it. And I was like, oh, XX and Tashiyan goes hard. And so that's what I'm saying. You find because there's always dope new music. You can't be like all music sucks because you ain't heard all music. There's new music that's dope dropping every day. You know, there are all the millions of songs that upload. Listen, until you listen to all of them, you can't say all music sucks because there's a lot they ain't been listening to. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, yeah. Now, with that being said, your industry, so much of the music industry, but your side of the music industry is something that people are predicting to be up in it pretty quickly because of AI. Yeah. What's your perspective on AI and how it's going to impact things? When instead of hiring you, I could just go ask Chad GPT to make me a quick song and come up with something. Yeah, I love this conversation because it's so interesting. It's a big question mark. You know what I'm saying? So if I come over here and be like, ain't nobody going to take my job, bro, then fast forward, I'll be a recap. Five years later, be like, his job's gone. You have another viral video. So I can't be like steadfast on an opinion of like, I'm straight. But I do feel that creatives will always survive because any time something is super homogenized, there's an undercurrent of a new thing that's going to be anti whatever we were just listening to. So if a chat GPT and then you can have it make a beat that's trapped, sound like this, sound like that, the younger generation will be like, yeah, but I don't want none of that. I want something that's bluegrass. I want something that's not even recordable. You have to hear it live. Like it's going to be something anti, you know, but yeah, it's going to have its own thing where people can make their original songs. And that's going to be for a consumer. That's fine. You know, I am a creative as well as a consumer. So yeah, but I'll just figure out where else are we going with it? You know what I'm saying? Because that's why you've got to have multiple skills if you make music. You know what I'm saying? Like, and I'm just open to see where it goes. But it's just really hard to predict. Like, I actually been trying to talk to my friends, read stuff. And I don't feel that a creative will ever be out of work. But I'm not just like I said, I'm not just a songwriter. I'm an artist. So I'm always going to find a new way to express myself and monetize it. So it's, but it's really hard to predict. I really don't know that you. Well, I know you said you actually had some people send you some AI written song at this 30. I've had at least 30. And it's always the same. Yo, love your work. I got some chat GBT lyrics. Check them out. Most of them say you can use it as an inspiration, but a lot of them say rapid verbatim and they all know disrespect. They all sound like super 1982. Now, listen up here because I'm here to say it's all very basic. I'm just like, man, I don't, you know, but I'm happy for the order. But I'm just like, let me do my thing with this. But I'm going to tell you why they like a lot of companies like that. It hits the key words that they want. They're not really thinking about make it go hard. It's like, it says how many figures we hit. It says this word. People like this word. It hits the logistic side of the art instead of like, does it sound good to listen to? So that's why they like it. And that's why they'll continue doing it because companies like hitting the marks on a lot of things, you know, and that creative space is probably like not, you know, and it's cool, you know, but I'm not, I'm not afraid at this point, you know, because let me play with it. But yeah, they like, they like to look at the words even before they order sometimes. They're like, let me check out the lyrics before you record it. And I always tell them, no, I don't want to do that because if I send you lyrics, you can like nitpick that I spelled that word wrong and you don't even hear it. Like, I literally can say four words and it goes hard because you heard it. So I always turn it down because- I remember that, like just being younger, by playing around at school, like writing raps or like, just ending you have homies writing raps. And anything, you can make anything sound trash if you read it. Not. It's gonna be so hard. Like whatever, Jacory wrote it. I could like read it and I want to roast them. And I could be like, man, oh my pot, what? Like, you just make it sound bad. So it doesn't, it's really- Bro, you just- Try for somebody to take your lyrics without you performing it. You just opened up a memory I forgot. It's like, man, what you writing? Going hard. Hey, give me that, bro. Give me that. No, no, no, no, no. That was so embarrassing, bro. You right. But I would rap it to go hard. Man, I forgot about that. People used to do that. That's so funny. Yeah, man. Yeah, so, I mean, but that sucks because then there's that homogenization as you alluded to of the music and just lack of care for the music itself when a lot of these companies work. It's like, yeah, I'm here and I'm truly appropriating it or marketing and using it because I know it's gonna allow me to touch a certain base. That's what I care about. I heard this is the cool thing and this is how you connect with the kids. So let me go find one of these rappers, right? Or it can be another type of artist too. It's not just rap, but like let me go find one of these music people, have them write a song. And, but I still care, not about the music, I care about the business objective. And let me be clear, I understand that both need to exist, but when you get to the point of, yeah, I'm looking at my SEO essentially, is he gonna knock on these words so he can speak to the algorithm and the transcription can be circle. And it's all of that. Man, I feel like those moments probably take the life out of the work in those ways. Yeah, it does and it's hard, but I'm trying to figure out this whole AI thing as it goes. And I'll figure out what's appropriate. It's so new that I don't even have a, like an answer as to what the best outcome is. But yeah, you can't suck the life out of music because juvenile, that's you with that big body bins, huh? That's you with it. If you saw that on paper, it'd be like, bruh, no, no, no, this doesn't go. But if you hear it, it's like, you were paper cheese. Like, this is my joint right here, you know what I'm saying? So it's just too hard to like make things from a logical standpoint. You gotta let the artist be the artist. And then there's certain ways of a voice that connect with people that you just a business can't even catch. They'd be like, bruh, why are they liking that voice so much? They wouldn't know, you know what I'm saying? So, yeah. And that's why humans will always survive. That's why TikTok viral sounds, they'll always be so random. Boom, by stick side eye. Like, that's just, that's a sound that's on it. Like, bruh, how's that viral? It's random because humans like random stuff that novelty is the word I'm looking for. So, if everything is super artificial and there's no novelty, we'll seek out the novelty more. So that's why I'm kind of like optimistic about it. By man, I think, as I mentioned before, you need to get you one of these AI apps, right? You need to build them out in charge because you understand the feedback loop, you know what I'm saying? You understand when someone sends these AI lyrics, like what the trouble is, like there's a gap, but then you also understand the other side, like try to fulfill on what that is. And I know there's a lot of people in this space trying to make it happen. And like, I don't know, man, I feel like you're perfectly positioned from somebody who's done this, making a lot of money from ground zero on a fiber-like platform. And now you have the brand credibility, like that CNBC thing, it's huge, all right? We saw how it impacted us from a PR standpoint when we got featured in like the billboards and the music business worldwide, which are like draping things like that, or our side, right, or something. There's a different level of people, right? It's not one of those things that's going to grow your fan base or make you go viral, but the people who are watching it, it's a different type of person, right? Yeah, it's the truth. I know you're getting reached out too. I mean, one from y'all. And I was like, just while watching y'all thing, I had a thought, it'd be so weird if I was on their show one time. And then I was like, what? I was like, manifestation, bro. But it's true, it's true. It's a different respect level that they see when they see that you're on that. But I'm 100% with you on that. You gotta catch it in advance. And I'm on that, bro. I'm on that. Now, I remember you talked about how gigs sway in economies. All right, how the economy is this year, might change thing. What does that look like? Because I think it's interesting to consider that side of music and how people are thinking about music in that way from one year versus a year. So I don't know, during the pandemic versus 2022, what have been the ebbs and flows you've seen in your particular space based on how the economy works? Yeah, that's a great question. I got to learn a lot about what people were looking out for and I got to learn about things. During the pandemic, it was a surge of podcasts and YouTubes where they wanted intros, original intros. It was just like crazy. It was like, it was popping. And I was so grateful to be where I was because they hit me up. Then I see there's slowdowns in the economy of people wanting to get stuff like that. I'd say the end of last year was slower in a lot of aspects for that type of work. Then I had a birthday gig, which has been slow for a while. Maybe that novelty of having that is just, either I'm not the one that they need or it's just not something that they're looking for at this time. A lot of it is to do, a lot of what I have right now is businesses. They want original songs. And then there was a period where Twitch was so big that I didn't even know what Twitch was. It was like, can you do something for my Twitch? And I said, you got a Twitch, bro? What, were you twitching? I didn't get that. So I had to look it up. And I was like, oh, this is like streaming. And then people were gaming and they wanted something that didn't get copyright strike. So they wanted original. And I was like, okay, okay, I get it. And I didn't know nothing about it. But like I said, I get to see where people are spending their resources to do their thing all the time. And I get to see like, if this gig is dead, I'm like, I gotta take this down and just add a new thing. I have to learn and maneuver. Nothing is set in stone. You know, one thing that may make me the money might be dead in several months. And I gotta adjust and move around. And then my videos, my videos, now people are doing more videos. So I gotta reshoot some, make it look more appealing. I think the one that I have on there now, I reshotted around the time it was kind of slow for me. I was like, whenever it gets slow on there, you gotta clean up, clean it up, make it clean. And so yeah, I have to learn what's going on with the economy as well as updating my stuff. That's really, this is dope, bro, because you literally are seeing the economy and having to post more than a lot of people when it comes to demand of content. And this is why you've seen companies like United Masters, when they did a distribution and they did deal with the NBA. It's all based on this idea that we're in this content economy where every brand is essentially becoming its own media brand, right? Not just all I'm doing advertising and using multimedia to advertise my company. No, I'm becoming my own boutique media house at least. And then if I'm a big company, I probably need to be damn near traditional marketing agency within my own company. The primary way we're doing that, content, right? So that created a need for more content than ever. And much of the content is experienced through music, in addition to music, right? Whether it's the background, et cetera. So the demand for music has increased exceedingly, but most artists are still looking at this finite place, right? They're actually a place that's getting smaller in times of you have the same amount of attention. Yeah, we've grown as a population a bit, right? But for the most part, a slower growing amount of attention because we're still limited in terms of hours and amount of attention specifically for music and now it's more competitive within that same space. But then you got all this other space growing because I created a meaning, because I created a podcast, because I got a Twitch, all these other things and people are completely missing that opportunity. So for you to be like, oh man, I saw Twitch pop all of a sudden and all of a sudden I see like podcasts in 2022. I meant in 2020 when you said they pop, right? We know a lot of people were at home, a lot of people work with podcasts and you see that as like a front line to write impact. It's interesting because it tells me that there's a lot of opportunity in just being able to trace those different economies and music and fulfill it. I don't know like what that looks like, like how you capitalize, I mean, you capitalize already in a sense because I know you say you'll like change the gig, right? I might not have Twitch. Oh, people hit me up for Twitch. Now all of a sudden I have like a Twitch song gig, right? Yeah, yeah. It actually just makes me wonder why one, Al, a lot of music executives and major companies are looking at the economy and how they use music as a part of it. And then also for you directly, have you started to go further than just, hey, people are starting to demand this and now I created, is there something that you're using to figure out like how I can catch the wave or view these waves as they come and go? Yeah, there's a few moments that I saw happening and I was like, oh, this is gonna be big. And there was one that I missed and I was mad about, but I'm gonna tell you, Gracie's Corner, if you're familiar with that, it's like a cartoon series where they do rap. It's kind of like Migos type beats and they do kid songs. I got orders for kid songs that had a rap beat a long time ago. And people were like, man, if they did something more up to date, it would go hard. And I was like, yeah, I know. And I was like, I was about to do it, but I was like, I got my workload too much. But then Gracie's Corner came out and all these people wanted the same exact thing. They wanted like updated beats, kid songs. And I was like, I saw that one coming. And I still get orders now. I was like, I saw that one coming. And then this guy in 2016 said, I want you to make the song about this coin. And it was a Bitcoin. I was like, I don't know what no Bitcoin is. I made the song and I'm just like, he said, it's going to take over. I said, okay, pal. And it was like, I looked it up. It was like less than $1,000 to have one. And I was like, I ain't spending no $1,000 on it. And it ended up, you know, Bitcoin being what it was. But I kind of saw that when it was at least attainable. And I was like, when I started to hear news about it, I was like, damn, bro, but I can't predict this. I can't predict where to put all my coins at. But yeah, I got, I get this. And there's still things that are happening now. I actually, what I do is I take notes and I'm trying to like expand other things to take advantage of the things that I know behind the scenes and I've learned because I almost can like see the ebbs and flows and almost predict certain things are going to take because enough people are interested in it. And I don't see it either talked about or like in the mix. So I do, I do get privy to that. And also I build, I build relationships with people when they hire me a bunch and we stay in contact. And it's like, if you ever need anything and we just stay in contact and I get to have relationships for business reasons, like you build a, build contact list. So that's, I'm grateful for that. You know what I'm saying? So that's a big thing for me. But I don't feel like at all I've capitalized on taking advantage of all the stuff I've known. And that CNBC interview just kind of sealed it for me. Like, no, I got a lot of things I need to put together and take advantage of. It's just, it'd be so much when you do everything. You know, I have no team. I film, I take the tripod out. I film it, I produce it. There's like so many hats. So to be business savvy in mind it is, it's kind of hard for me because I'm thinking of rhymes but I also got to think of like the, what's my ROA if I buy that? It's a lot. You know what I'm saying? It's a lot. And it sounds like there's an opportunity to like invest in you as like an indicator of where markets are going. Nah, for real. Let me buy this stock. Like podcasts are about to blow up. Nah, for real. You get trapped all of a sudden. Like the coins and things like that. You know, it reminds me of a talk I heard about music being the culmination of where culture is and where it's going. And I think a lot of times we think about the typical music, right? Like the pop music, right? I don't mean just pop like pop genre but pop like what's popular. And then that like being an indicator because we know all of a sudden people are going to dress this way, things like that. But beyond that, this request nature of working with you, that's like a direct indicator because I'm specifically saying the thing and it goes beyond the typical cultural categories of what am I drinking? How am I dressing? Things like that, right? Like Bitcoin, although it did impact culture at large because of the nature of like how social media moves these days. Like generally that's just a finance market. Right. So it's like you found out a move of where finance markets are going, right? Based off of that. All right. And you know that podcasts are about to go or they're starting to go another level, right? Yeah. So is there a podcast company I could jump in? It's just really interesting that there's these different indicators and it makes me understand more and more of why music is this thing. It's this raw material that people are constantly mining and monetizing in so many different ways because there's so much gold, so many diamonds in the art itself. Yeah, we're still struggling how to monetize it directly for the artists just for the making. It's like going to Africa when we talk about going to Africa to diamonds and then other people coming in and taking from it versus the people who lived in that space, right? That's artists. Oh, that's so real. Everybody's finding these different types of value that it's difficult for you to see. And I don't know, man. Like it's just really crazy to hear like how you got to ride these waves of the marketplace and like you would see them and then you get educated about them because of those requests and then they become what they become. Right. Yeah. And it's still happening to this day and I get to see, okay, that's where we're going. Okay. And I gotta be open to it or something I don't be like, I don't know but even music I'm seeing what things change but I think with TikTok, with social media a lot of people get to see how music's changing. But yeah, with all kinds of things anything that touches music where they want it I get to see a little piece of what's to come and what's happening. It's exciting. And now I'm more like, you know I start reading it more to what I'm rapping about that I like to know. Yeah. Yeah. Hey man, you said you don't have a team, man. We gotta get you a team, man. You gotta figure out a system around what you have going on. Yeah, man. That's the goal. Yeah. I need that so bad, bro. So I can like focus on other things. I feel like there's bigger, bigger things that I could do in addition. But yeah, man. I just want everybody to realize the perfect knowledge I got for every artist that's trying to do this. Not just five or just monetize what you're doing. I had to wait. There was a performance thing we had in Houston. You had to get up at seven in the morning to go to this line of people to bust in the door and sign up. And I try like so many times but I had to bow guard my way just to not be on the list. And I realized like, we all trying to go through this one door, these two doors. I'm like, once I found five, I was like this is a whole, anybody over here is kind of dusty. I'm gonna check this out. And that's kind of how I feel. I don't have to like bust through this door of like where it's so congested. And I realized like wherever you're at where it's not congested is where you can shine. So it's okay to do something that's not been done or weird or like, this is dope. It's just gonna feel uncomfortable because you got nothing to compare it to. And that's kind of how I feel when I was doing five hours. I don't know anybody else who's doing it, but yeah. I found a lot of people that did it after I did it and they saw me and I was like, that's a blessing. If you making money from learning from what I'm doing and it's still a bunch of money to be made, bro, make your money. That's all everybody wants to do. Make money from the stuff they make. That's just people to make money. They copied you? Like you do that? Yeah, yeah. They found me, I guess they saw me on Fiverr and then they copied my format which I have no problem with. And they were having success. And I was like, bro, that's so dope. That's a blessing. That's a blessing. Have you ever thought about making an extension of the brand being teaching other artists how to do what you're doing? Has it ever crossed your mind? It has, but like y'all said, I wouldn't need an assistant. So I'm not so overexerted. But if I had an assistant that dealt with all the ins and outs, emails, this and that, then I could just be like, yeah, I would love to. I mean, teaching is kind of like, send my veins, you know what I'm saying? I like passing on information. I'll do that with no problem, but I think that's all gonna have to happen ASAP. All right, just a quick reminder, Kibo has dropped a course on how he's made over $80,000 a year on Fiverr, actually done more money than that in some years. He's never created a course for any other audience before. He's just been making money doing the thing on Fiverr. He's literally the number one artist making money from this on Fiverr. So if you wanna learn how he's done it or just wanna make a little extra money on the side using your artistic skills, check it out at www.brandmannetwork.com slash Fiverr. Again, do not forget it's www.brandmannetwork.com slash Fiverr. This is truly a deal, especially for our audience. I literally asked him to create it for our audience, but he needs to be compensated for his time. So get it while the getting's good before he takes the price up. Don't say I ain't warned you. Because I feel like enough people have seen that interview and the response was crazy. I wasn't expecting it to be like that. I was very scared, but enough people said they rock with it. So man, it's time. Let's share this information. No, bro. Yeah, nah. We can't help you with that. We definitely know the course game is, I mean, the communication that you have is so valuable. So just a couple more things for us to get out of here. One thing is you said he will be inspired by you and then starting to wrap yourself, themselves, Fiverr. I think he said somebody was like, you went to high school with him or something like that? Yeah. So I had a friend named Darren and I looked on the Fiverr one time. It was like two, three years after I've been on there and I was like, man, look at my boy Darren. So I messaged and I said, is this Darren? And he said, yeah, bro, what's up, Mike? And he's like, I was like, what's up, bro? And he's like, oh, I've been on. So you full time on here? He said, yeah, I'm in Alaska. I was like, that's what's up? And I was like, you full time? He said, yeah, I'm on here full time. I saw you doing it after a year and I took it on. And then I was like, I almost teared up. Cause I was like, this whole time I've been trying to figure this out, confuse somebody made a living off of doing it. And I was just like, that's what it's all about, bro. That's what it's all about. And then it's my boy. And then he never even hit me up for questions. He never said, walk me through the process. He never said, give me the game. He just saw it, did it, executed. And those are, man, I was just like, that's amazing. So, and there was another person that hit me up. So they saw the interview and they did the same thing. I just can't tell you how powerful that is for me to see somebody make a living off of something they saw me doing. I don't even know what I'm doing, bro. I was freestyling all this, man. I don't know what I'm doing. So it's just, it's powerful. But all the while I trusted my gut that I just wanted to make music forever. And I was lucky and blessed that it worked. Yeah, man, that was crazy. Shout out to Darren. That was crazy. Shout out to Darren. You still taking space for more artists to hop on and take it back? Absolutely, absolutely. Take it on because no matter how much I work and work and go hard, there's certain attributes about what I do that somebody may not like, like my voice or the fact I don't use any profanity in my songs. That's just a personal choice. There's certain things that just, I'm just not a fit and somebody got a deeper voice, whatever, or you might like them better. There's space for so many people, but you just gotta work hard, be consistent and go hard and don't think it's gonna be easy. Nothing that's worth it comes easy. It just takes a long time. If you got this, there's plenty of space. There's plenty of space. I saw, I turned down money. So I know there's plenty of space. You turned down money, we'll talk about that. Yeah, there's a bunch of projects that people came to me with. And I have to say no, I say no a lot cause I feel like it doesn't align with how I feel that I want to exist forever. You know what I'm saying? Like anything I make for somebody will exist forever and it can come back and haunt me if I didn't really feel okay with it. You know what I'm saying? Like certain adults type projects, you know what I'm saying? They hit me up, how much you want? I ain't about money. I doubled it, I can't really, not that I got an issue with the industry but I just didn't want my brand to connect with it. There's been a bunch of stuff I had to turn down and that's okay. And so I'm just like, there's a bunch of money. I'm turning it down. So there's this money for y'all, like just go on there. You know what I'm saying? Okay, no, that's dope. I mean, it's interesting that you have brand even on that side. That brand's not your brand that you want to have but you still have a brand that you maintain and rules that you have for yourself on that side too. Yeah, ever since that political thing, I was like, yeah, I got to have some kind of like do's and don'ts of what this character willing won't say. So yeah, I had to learn that. Cause I still, even if Fiverr Rapper and me did two different things, we looked the same. Ain't no confusion of who it is, you know what I'm saying? Like mama, that's not me. You got a mustache, you know what I'm saying? So, yeah. Yeah, I mean, one thing I want to mention is should you say a voice, right? And have people like one voice versus another. Yeah. Do you just like rap and a specific voice all the time? You ever play around with your voice or something like that? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I feel like it's because I've rapped for so long. I like trying and learning. I got so many songs I've recorded that I've had so many years to experiment, you know, whether they're singing a little bit, rapping fast, rapping slow. So I kind of already know what I'm comfortable doing and what I probably am not the best fit for. You know what I'm saying? Those things I turned down as super violent. I'm just like, it's not my thing. It's going to come off real fake, you know what I'm saying? So that's kind of what I'm saying. Like my voice as far as like texturally and then also kind of like what I represent and what I can pull out of my system. Because that's pretty much what I mean. Yeah, but I feel like it's pretty flexible in what I can do. It's just something I just won't do. It's not that I can't. Something I just ain't going to do. Yeah, that's crazy because I'm going back to the AI and stuff, right? You know, the voices are now being used and I could bring credibility to something just using somebody else's voice. Right. Yeah, exactly. All right, or I'm reading this ad and I'm doing it in Snoop Dogg's voice. So it just sounds like it's important and things like that. So it seems like voice is going to become more and more important even beyond the lyrics in some matter. Oh yeah. Will you be able to rent somebody's voice? You know what I'm saying? We better rent his voice. Will you be able to like, or is it more important for artists to make sure you've got a signature sound so that you will stand out? Like it may be a good time for making music because it's like people will be not so homogeneous. It'll be sticking out. That's what I've been pondering that, man. I'm just like, yeah, you can rent my voice for this much, for this many words. You know what I'm saying? Like that'd be crazy. That'd be crazy. Pretty crazy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Pretty crazy. Stringing royalties on your voice sometimes. I'd definitely do that. Yeah, you want to use my voice to read that night time book to your kids? Right. You want to read it to whatever that is, you know what I'm saying? Yeah, it costs this much per words. I like that. Per words. Yeah. We might be already creating a model right here. Not for real, yeah. Not for real. Dang, that's, I was thinking about that. It could be a possibility, but you never know. But maybe I shouldn't say too much if it's an idea. Yeah, it makes sense. It makes me think about how Alexa has a different voices that she can put them into the machine. Like it's like, eventually those two worlds are going to have to meet each other. That's such a good point. Yeah, true that. Yeah. But you don't want it into evil doers hands. Somebody calling my girl, I was, hey, babe, I'm leaving you. I said, why? I'm just not feeling it. And I said, I ain't say that. Yes, you did. That's what I'm scared of. You don't want them to do this. They're dirty mac and bread. Yeah. Dirty man. Setting you up so they can slide in. Yeah. That's tough. That's what I'm scared of. But yeah, that's funny. Hey, every way, hey. Well, all right, man, we appreciate you for being on, man, having you on, like I said, you represent the no labels, you know, philosophy, because you're doing something different and you're not letting away other people receiving, stopping you from doing that different thing. All right. So, you know, appreciate you, you know, sharing your story and admiring you from going that path, because we know how hard it is to go a different path that everybody else isn't following the wave yet, right? Right, yeah. But, you know, kudos to you, bro. And again, appreciate you having you on. I don't know if you want people to follow you or on IG or you want people to hire you on Fiverr. So let them know, like, where'd it go? Show, man, both, you know what I'm saying? Fiverr has the option to have your username on it. So I'll put Kibo on there for now. So, but on Instagram, it's holla at me, K-E-Y-B-E-A-U-X. And YouTube, just everywhere. Just type that in and I'll pull up and hit me up on Fiverr, man. And y'all, man, it's just been crazy. It's been so, I've been so grateful to be on this show, man, it's crazy. It's crazy. I really appreciate you having you for real, for real, man. And yo, everybody, yet again, there's another episode of No Labels Necessary. Hi, Cass. I'm Brandon and Sean. And I'm Cory. And we out. Peace.