 So, hey Welcome to our session. This is women in tech How to get and keep women and your leadership roles? So, thank you all for joining us for the first session today. It's quite early We do have a remote presenter So a general introduce yourself if it's what I am for time, but thank you very much, Jen So today we're just gonna do some quick intros We're gonna talk about how we're defining leadership in this session Well, like from the panelists, we're gonna have just an overview of our experiences as women in leadership roles and challenges as it relates to leadership We're gonna talk about why these experiences so common and this will be a bit interactive. So, go for you to participate and then so after questions, we're gonna summarize with takeaways and then like real World examples we have a lot of resources that we'll be sharing with this presentation With their real-world examples, so we're kind of gloss over those during the session But we also have a Google spreadsheet of other additional resources because there is a ton of material We will share the deck as well Great, so So I'm Lindsay Catlett. I am a Google architect with Google Brands, which is it's a Fortune 100 product company Previously, I worked out for a number of years in various technical roles I've also worked in consulting as an engineer in Intel and then also on political campaigns And I've been a contributor to triple and other open source projects for about 10 years now So my name is Ruth Jusley. I'm the Mortar Community Manager at Acquia Previous to that I founded and grew a full service agency for about seven years and I've been involved in open source for about 18 years. I've been on the leadership team of the Jubiler project for Just over three years And then joining us remotely is Jim Shrimp Hi everyone, I'm Jim Cranick and I'm the Director of Learning Services at Acquia where I've worked for about the past eight years Prior to that, I've been in the project and program management roles and as the Director of Operations And I'm currently a board president for a non-project public health rescue program in San Francisco I'm here remotely from California because family responsibility is kept in film But I really wanted to participate. I'm happy to be able to join this way We've actually pre-recorded her Her comments just in case we get technical problems So what do we mean by women in leadership? So we don't mean just being in a leadership or management role But really leading and encouraging others throughout their career And really setting gender diversity strategies for a team or organization And not only that but just owning the delivery of those strategic gender objectives Like in the long term So given that, how many of you guys consider yourself to be a woman in leadership? It's very interesting to talk about that more So we have an additional question So which of the following describes how you feel your company or organization Supports women in leadership roles throughout their career So we have four different options here So super confident, okay, needs help or I'm not sure So how many of you guys would say super confident? How about okay? It depends a little bit Yeah, exactly Talking about leadership in terms of managing Manager as a function, they know But as a person, you need to group Yes, definitely That's a great point So how many would say it's just okay? Yeah, how about needs help or you're not sure Okay Yeah, so we're all going to share our experiences As it relates to leadership and gender diversity as well as challenges That we've encountered throughout our careers But just a general disclaimer We don't want you to be discouraged by any sort of any of our stories That may seem unfortunate Like in this panel, this session we should really be able to talk openly About our own paths, both good and bad And that also does not imply that that's the only path to leadership But just because we've never experienced something that we or yourselves Or other people in the room have had an honor to talk about That doesn't mean that it is not happening So my experience in tech I got in tech kind of a non-traditional background I started working on political campaigns And very few female role models Both when I was working on campaigns And then also throughout my career This was kind of in the Howard Dean era of Drupal So as I got more involved with Drupal and Open Source And moved to more tech-centric roles or developer roles I was really reluctant to take leadership roles And challenge the status quo Until really being encouraged by mentors in other allies As far as challenges, finding a mentor and support network That was, it took me a while to do that I definitely have had and probably still have Imposter syndrome, probably like many of you Especially as it relates to contributing to public Open source projects or public and other open source projects And if you're not familiar with that term That's when the person really doubts their accomplishments And they have kind of an internalized fear Of exposing themselves as a fraud to others And then also, I've struggled in the past Where I've had to come to terms with How achieving the best leadership positions May actually mean the need of an organization at times Yes, so also my route to IT has been somewhat non-traditional I trained as a physiotherapist And then I ended up building websites in my spare time Working in IT But as a, when I was at school Like science and technology, but it was just one They were kind of saying, oh yeah, you could do this But there was just no practical support I wanted to be an engineer and I ended up in a design office And I just came to, you know, like And all my male friends were in engineering workshops And stuff like that So from my perspective, I got into this Mainly through open source, actually Through getting involved with the junior project And it wasn't until someone actually So I was starting to build websites I was building a business while working full time And to get the clients, I went and spoke at some conferences And it wasn't until another woman in leadership Diane came up to me and she said Like, I've heard you're talking I know you want to use Group locally I think you'd be really great on our community leadership team And I really want to nominate you And my first response was like, I'm not a leader How can I be a leader? And she really took me under her wing And gave me a lot of support and mentoring To kind of come into that role So like, I didn't actually believe in my own ability And I still struggle with that Each step up the rung I go is like I can't do that role, how can I do that role? So, yeah, and also I live with a long term disability So for me, as I take more responsibility It cannot be at the It cannot be the case that That means I have to work more hours Or put my health at risk Because I just won't be able to work optimally So understanding my needs And having confidence to be vulnerable Like at the job interview stage And say, I need these certain conditions to function That has been a huge challenge for me And supportive networks I think we all find that supportive networks To help you get to that point And have someone to sign off If you're struggling That's what's really important for me And then moving to Okay, Jenny Well, I've worked out of the technology By virtue of a non-profit background And I was sort of the most technical person At the non-profit So I set up other people's email addresses And helping them use their computers And things like that And that was in my early career Moving to managing web application projects For non-profit organizations Because I understood them And then I also understood tech And then trying to have this open-source And it's your goal And eventually it'll work out for you As I was coming up in my career I definitely had my fair share of challenges And like many of you I experienced the Poxer syndrome And really feeling out of place In the tech arena From my non-profit background I felt out of place for that reason And being a woman in tech With very few of them I was a new mom for a period of time there And navigating from my work and my career And looking for flexibility And since about 2004 I've also been an entirely remote worker Where I work for three different companies Where I work from home So working from home Can have a lot of challenges With by itself With being visible You know, showing up on people's radar With things they're looking to do And it is definitely hard To speak up and get attention sometimes In meetings when you're women But it can be even harder When you're a remote worker And cut tall against the wall So that's been part of my earlier career And then What I ended up meeting in the end Was really mentorship And it's just me allowed to figure it out But I did potentially figure it out So how many people in the room Have experienced similar challenges For the ones who Probably everyone Yeah Yeah So Why does this happen? I think everyone in the room Has been impacted by it It was one of the things that We talked about I'm sure you have additional challenges to add So we've tried to boil The experiences of all women In the world down to seven bullet points I'm just kidding So we took a stab at doing that So What we think this really comes down to Is a number of things It's lack of role models So lack of women In existing leadership positions And not just women, but also allies Who are supportive of gender diversity And empowering women There can be a lack of flexible And supportive conditions That are healing Or required by many women I skipped ahead A lot of organizations or teams Or managers can Really not be great At giving feedback It can be really insufficient At a lot of organizations And also training as well Like many managers and leaders They really don't get training That's either required Or encouraged by their organization Or teams On gender diversity And the importance And then there can really be A lack of awareness At many companies Of the benefits of gender diversity And this can be I mean There's so much research that discusses The benefits of gender diversity And these teams tend to be more productive They tend to be more animated and collaborative And at the end of the day That can be much better For businesses in general I also skipped ahead So there can also be Just a lack of visibility At many organizations And among colleagues In the existing experiences And like many people are not even aware That there could be an issue With gender diversity On their team or organization And then I've At least throughout my career I've also seen that There could be a reluctance At some organizations To really acknowledge Or accept existing problems And then take the necessary Like actionable steps to address them Because in many cases that can mean That They have to acknowledge the problem And there can be some hesitance At many organizations to do that Yeah So you mentioned Your introduction About open source communities What role do you think Open source communities can play In kind of challenging that Or even addressing The diversity issues in companies So in my experience Getting more active than open source That really It took me a while to do that But it exposed me And introduced me to so many people That I otherwise wouldn't have met And not just the people themselves But their experiences And also in many cases Like I could hear about The culture of their companies And like I think At least for me I worked at An organization for a number of years And I think I had started to normalize Certain behaviors Because I didn't even know That like There was a problem Because I wasn't hearing about other organizations And about how conditions were there So and not just like Hearing about the experiences I also learned about other leadership Opportunities and other roles That other companies as well And like I think that Like that I mean that's how I ended up in my position now I found out through talking to people In the Drupal community There wasn't something that I actively sought out But like I think That also speaks to the power of just Networking and you know It's one of the things I love about Drupal Is there is such a community center You know And I guess many open source communities But yeah so like I Definitely wouldn't be Where I am today without open source And I think my experience as well Is that That there were some amazing So our first world conference in June though We had 24% women attendings Without there being a huge diversity That's just what happened We weren't happy with that But having other women Who were willing to kind of bring People in as contributors That for me personally I find that really helpful I don't really have any issues Working with guys But it was just a different approach And for me it was like reaching out the hand So like you know You're reaching out to people to help you But also you can reach down to people Like newer than you and bring them along With me And that really is exemplified I think you know open source No so you mentioned You know working with a disability So in what ways from your perspective Can a company Provide support for those living Not just living with a disability But also Ensuring that you can Be productive and happy I mean I think There's two sides to the coin I think You need to be Self-aware enough to know what your needs are To work at full capacity To be a happy, healthy human being And that takes a little bit of self-awareness And compassion for yourself And I think typically My experience is that women tend to be Quite strongly conditioned by our culture That everyone else's needs are more important than ours And as you come up into leadership roles My experience is that It is much more demanding Physically, emotionally, mentally Just like in every way And if your basic needs are not being met How are you ever going to thrive In the leadership role Without going home So I think from an individual Perspective it's like knowing what your needs are So for me it's I need Flexible working, I need to have a half day And maybe a week ride in a crash If I need to recover and continue But also Being willing to be vulnerable At some point in that process Whether it's right at the start Or whether it's when you're getting off of the job And saying absolutely I love this job But these are my requirements And really standing firm with that And companies I think need to Find ways to allow people To have that conversation Early Or if something changes in their life If they have children, if they have a caring responsibility At home And they don't feel like that's going to jeopardise their career On that leadership But actually it's a positive thing Like I want to be working at full capacity I want to be able to bring my whole self to this role But to do that I need some flexibility To make sure that I need some flexibility And for me that's been key And I actually lost jobs I literally retracted the offer And I said I can't do nine to five Two hours community to go And I'm like really? Like huge enterprises Really in this day and age You're lost, like you've lost me As an asset to your business That's fine But I have felt that I really Had to put my hands first So Jen you talked about How important mentorship was In gaining leadership roles So what are your recommendations For finding and Being a mentor That is a good question So for me It could take a while to figure out What I needed with mentorship So I had my imposter syndrome Telling me you don't belong here anyway So in a lot of ways I was just happy to play any role That I had Living the dream in San Francisco And all that But eventually my knowledge Caught up with me And I got a really strong desire For the role and the work that I was doing To design the work that I was doing Have more to say I was frustrated for a while About the fact that I was not team promoted But I didn't recognize at the time That that was more my fault than anyone else's Because I just did not really understanding How to be in the driver's seat of my career At that point I was lucky enough to be a company To have an apprenticeship program So I was able to take advantage of those And I run for the company kind of management And this was a really great opportunity And I learned a lot from that But I still didn't quite click Until I chose my own mentor And that ended up being a male Mentor at Alameda He still was there And still has his own mentor role But he's somebody who really got me And here stood me in And what I wanted to contribute And how I could contribute more so than I did I think he believed in me and what I did bad More than I did for a long time Which showed me more of how the path To advancement was in my hand And not so much in the control of everyone But the way I had kind of taught it And taught me how to operate the career ladder Better and understand What it was people were looking for And the people that they advanced And I was doing all those things I was just very bad at bragging about it Which ended up being the thing I really needed to learn Which is stop with the humility And the downplaying of the Convolutions I was making That happened more like Nendil You know, the frag You know, talking about the ring The great accomplishment It's actually interesting Because I think Jen and I Discovered that same mentor Around the same time And he's still my mentor Even having left off me But it just I think we both kind of Started with a lot of the same things And he really elevated us Individually For our individual strengths But he also like Really helped us work together In the best way Which was really a really great experience He find a great male ally It's with them They tend to help other The people behind a lot of different things And to be identified And they really support women in their innovation And I think that peer support as well Of having other women Who are at roughly the same level Of career With roughly similar kind of ambitions Or you know That you're sort of struggling with the same things That can be so valuable Not only from just having A comrade in arms But also, like he was saying Having examples of maybe Other businesses where they're getting Something that's really helping them And you can kind of then ask for that In your role In relationships with other people You may not even know That that is something that will be helpful to you And mentors at least Yes, we wanted to Open up the floor For any questions Either to us or to each other I mean Are there any comments that Anyone would like to make? Can you come up to the mic if you want Because then other people I think it's pretty small I have a question It's not a question But I think one point that we missed In your point As a society I come from India I didn't have, forget about Leadership roles I didn't have them in that area of school So that kind of thing I think we have the same We should really talk about that Yeah, that's an excellent point And so that just That's a cultural societal issue And that's something that I myself have not necessarily had The experience I think in my family Experience So my mother worked When I was in school But from her backwards Every other woman in our family So for me for example I was the first walking woman In both society families So that was Yeah, and sometimes I find I bear a lot of responsibility On my shoulders And my sister also Who is quite high up in HR So much expectation is being put on us As women and as career women To be it all and do it all And actually sometimes that Is really like a big stick To be myself with I'm not good enough Which plays into the imposter syndrome as well So sometimes it's also like Do I really need at this stage in my career To be pushing myself to the next stage Or do I just actually need to Get settled here? What is it that's driving me? Is it anxiety that I'm not going to give enough? Or is it genuinely like I feel ready To move forward? Are there some questions? Sometimes I struggle with Identifying with a woman I am a woman of course But I'm also With a brown hair And if I propose a session And it's also a proposal to the session I want them to choose me Because I'm broken about the fact that I'm A female but If we also Choose the female in this case Because she's a female and we want to increase the diversity We are maintaining the gap a little bit Yeah So how would you recommend Riching this gap? I mean it's for me Personally at the end of the day If someone is choosing for a panel Or hired Who doesn't have a great skill set It's to me it's almost Then they have to be a woman And it was Like I said diversity hire To me that's actually setting I think Women in the middle of it back Yeah, it's setting you up to fail And that's your really shit heart Getting up very quickly Right I think Ruthie kind of did the other day That you've been selected For a panel For just being a woman and you actually said no Yeah, well I said no And I explained why I said no Because I'm not I'm not willing to be on the panel Because I'm a woman I'm willing to be on the panel Because I'm a technically competent person Who can give really interesting reason What have you And it is also nice the fact that There's a lot of diversity But leading with We need more women on the panel Yeah, no But it's an opportunity Some people would just find that way To treat women as easy to deal with But for me I approach it as an opportunity To educate And that person genuinely genuinely Did not realise how That can be received by women I didn't even think it was an issue Because you know I'm really passionate But I also Found a comment in 2012 When I said about the world conference Only having 24% women Where I actually said exactly what you said I don't think we want to have women Keynoting at the world conference If they're not competent as a keynote speaker Because that is really detrimental In so many ways We need to be nurturing people So that they are then competent And then yes absolutely But yeah you have to Put someone into a ball And let them grow And they're not quite ready Or like throwing them in the fire Let them burn Yeah, yeah So that's really important That we sometimes do that Maybe that's because Maybe that's how we find Maybe we are competent Because we should not be too guilty About getting opportunities like this Just to say that Because That's not the end of all Yeah and that's a good point too Because In my Previous experience I just turned out to be very responsive My career And that was discouraging But Seeking out other opportunities I think that gave me Just a lot more confidence And kind of validate that I Was technically competent And maybe one company Was giving me that promotion For whatever reason But I had this other organization over here That was And so That to me It helped me a lot I think the big posture syndrome But it's like a fine line Between the two So what And everyone's experience Has helped to make leadership Rolls like more attractive Also maybe So Maybe how can an organization Make a role More appealing to Perhaps this more specific Needs of a woman So like an example Of being able to work Remotely Or have a personal work day Or even play child care Or take care of child care responsibilities Things like that I was just going to And I chaired the board of Association And I heard your question As you mentioned Leadership roles As I certainly heard it as we think about For the group of nominations For other board members In that dimension That's obviously a sense too And I know that when we sit down To talk about You know, nominations and reviews One of the things that we do Is We've long had A role of generality on the board And that's something That we've had for quite a while And what we've At least what we've found Is that it's not immediate Once we get to that parity But as long as it becomes The norm Then it becomes Much easier to Identify people Of much more different backgrounds And sort of the diversity Of the board and the experience That's going from there It's a critical mass That helped us Celebrate And I also wanted to Speak to I'm also a professor And And I just wanted to Echo your comments Around There's actually research out there That looks at Sort of A number of Of the mentors And what you're saying is exactly right Sometimes you find You know, mentors Who are really aware And are willing to promote And pick up that kind of Brandification And they obviously get Intensive people And But certainly Are there sort of enough And the resources basically You know, but it seems to be wrong Thank you Yeah, thank you Yeah, so I know we've talked about a lot of Topics They're just Kind of just summarized, I think Our takeaways from this session Like, I think one of them is Definitely to invite feedback Of an experience sharing I mean So there We have some examples of Not so great feedback So this is the word cloud of Actual words that have been Used as feedback For myself In various points in my career So like this, these type of words At least the problem that I have with them is that It's calling out a behavior Without a clear example Of what the preferred Like behavior should be And so typical job Responsibilities, these could also just be More related to Someone's personality, I mean some of these Words I also think are very sexist And that's My opinion, but just like Like When some of these phrases have been used As feedback for myself, like Very rarely did they actually Come with actionable insight As well as to how to improve And like that I think is much more productive And valuable feedback Has anyone else really To these type of words And I don't think Strong world is ever a problem But yeah So also So it can also be pretty valuable In many cases to open up Opportunities for anonymous feedback I know there was one case, or one Story, so Nike actually did this They opened up Or they sent out An anonymous survey For their more ranking file Employees to provide feedback About their executive and other leadership And that actually revealed Some pretty serious misconduct That many were Completely unaware of Resulted into pretty high profile Dismissals Any other feedback on Yeah, I mean I think So I think we can get sucked into This all-day work, but I think it's really important When you have people in leadership roles In open source projects that you actually treat that As if it was a workplace as well And so like you actually Have the opportunity for there to be reviews For people who are in leadership Whether it's with someone else in the team I think peer review or someone else further up the chain And that also gives them the opportunity To say actually I'm finding this really difficult To make people can support me But I've, yeah So I've also had Certainly in my earlier career Some of those were to use Rightfully so, because I was Really quite unaware Of the way my communication comes to others But like you, so some people have given me That kind of feedback and they've been really constructive They've been like you have to stop Saying that because you're probably Possibly arrogant And communicate it more like this So that you achieve the same Outcome, but people aren't quite as pissed off And that was really helpful But it was like You're doing something that's not good But here's a way that you can really try and practice Because when you're coming up into leadership You're kind of practicing And it's going to be clunky And you're going to be bumping up And doing things wrong and often really publicly So, you know, that's my experience I don't know if Jen, if you have any thoughts Can you hear Can you have the question? We'll echo it I think my actual question Do you have any feedback on how to give Better feedback? But just ways Ways to give Very valuable feedback as a mentor Or a leader The only thing I would ask I heard you guys say When and if you do become a leader Remember the little people Remember how you felt Coming up and we'll kind of see back Do you have any ideas in here? I think when I have shared See back with people that were very actionable They are really appreciative Of having put in specifics to work on There's a lot of pigment In trying for promotion There's sort of like a lot of I feel like I'm written rule Or insider information So to the extent that you can help People navigate that So I think Definitely one of the takeaways Is to Find a mentor Who's not only you look up to But it's definitely been A proven example of What you think is successful leadership Don't be afraid to approach them Or talk to them They're just people They might be an amazing leader But they're just a person And then We especially spoke To this earlier Knowing what you need to be successful And then really not being afraid To ask for it, whether it's in The interview process or in Your current position I think In my experience I've just Like I have had a tendency To just kind of deal with things And be like oh well that's how it is And they can't get And I think like Presenteism is so rife in leadership Like people end up working Crazy crazy hours just because they're So ineffective because they're so Exhausted and sometimes it's just Like you just need to reset And say now I'm working nine to five Because all the people that are looking at you as a role model Whether you know it or not And if you're modelling that behaviour They're thinking like there's no way I could do that Or they're thinking okay that's how I have to behave And it's like taking initiative So another thing That I think is pretty Pretty clear throughout the session Is just to be an ally To women in the workplace I think I'm an absolutely competitive person anyway But I think Like To me now it's not that It's like me against everyone else It's more just find your team Yeah And support them when they need support Yeah So something else That I think is pretty important Is to just if you are In a leadership decision making role Like create opportunities For women to You know participate in panels Or go to conferences To like go from training Or create opportunities for yourself To do training And I've had cases where I've asked To go to Like a women in tech event And it's been like well why would you want to go to that You're doing like health informatics Why do you want to go to something about It's because I want to be with other women In tech in a safe environment Or maybe I want to When I first started speaking at conferences I went and spoke at women conferences Because that's where I felt comfortable That was my safe space And then I agreed to be able to speak at a conference You know like this So it's also like realizing When someone's asking for something like this It may well be that that's what they need To take the next step And just be supportive of that And so the Drupal Community or the Drupal Association rather They have created many opportunities So there's The Drupal There's an inclusion fund That Provides funding to women Underrepresented groups To attend things Like Drupal Khan And it also provides some mentorship opportunities And help them face the first time speaking There's a woman in Drupal mentioned today I think it might be Sold out or I think it might be fully reserved already But I would encourage Those women to attend To get sign up But yeah And like I think you mentioned earlier So a lot of conferences that do require You know at least one woman On a panel and it's not to say that You should select someone Because they're not technically competent Like just because they're a woman And they don't have the technical skills But I mean I think it is definitely Progress in making Very panels and other covers And any conference I go to I kind of have a little beneficial Aim to try and inspire at least one other person One other woman to speak at the next Version of that conference I think that's really important as well Giving people that kind of confidence That they can do it and being Like drop me an email if you want to practice your talk Or something like that Yeah and I mean It speaks to our next takeaway Find that group of like minded people Not just women but you know People Career support groups can be very helpful as well Jeez Oh that was great Great Any other questions or comments I know this was a ton of content to cover And a lot of Not necessarily these issues Yeah so we do have We'll show this deck We do have a larger amount of resources That we've compiled It's bit.ly WFT resources This is just a Google Sheet It actually might be a good idea If you make that editable And people can add to that And you know You know artificial jupyocon I guess artificial jupyocon We're the entire resources Yeah so we can do that But yeah we definitely encourage you to check out those resources I know we skipped over a bunch of The real world examples But again we'll share this deck And this was recorded as well But yeah thank you all for attending You can go back to that now Yeah you guys Okay Okay We'll get back to the house and see you guys Bye Jen