 none of my friends, nobody. Alright so so everyone that I know now is just from four years ago. So it takes a lot of effort. There's no encouragement from anybody. The closest comment I got from a family member was, isn't that a job we outsource to India? I don't know if you've heard it before. I go know and I quite enjoy doing it. I mean what's wrong with outsourcing it to India but anyway. So second job, so I say okay job I consultancy is really good because you get a bunch of projects, a variety of different things. You get to see kind of how non-tech people come in interface with you which is atrocious just because they don't know they don't understand the tech right. So forgivable but still atrocious. And five projects later I said that you know I think I think I kind of got how this was going and I'm ready for my next experience. So I said hey I came into this as a business person so let's see how a startup works. So my next step was into a startup and again it was fairly easy argument to say that that's where I came from. Here's what I want to learn and here's where I want to deliver value next. So a startup was my next pit stop. That was a really short pit stop because anyone that works in startups say let ten people ish or less. High stress right and if you don't click with the team like really really high stress. So I was out pretty quickly and I said okay so so what other experience might be valuable to me and how do I get there. So the experience I decided was valuable to me was and then at the startup what we found was a lot of things hacked together because for agencies even if you are trying to deliver good code people have a budget of time and money so they don't allow for very much else. They're like what is this testing thing you're doing. They don't do it. So I thought that kind of the practices and kind of the company management side of things was really valuable for me and so I said that okay for a bigger company how do I get noticed because I still want to I still prefer the route of talking to somebody there first and finding out kind of what the environment what the culture is like there because like you said you really want to try and stay there right. You don't want to just up and jump. You want to absorb as much as you can. You want to make changes. You want to like at least not at least not for a lot of the bigger companies. So the way I kind of got noticed was I decided at point in time to take part in hackathons because that's where a lot of big companies would go. They would send representatives. They want you to use their APIs and so I thought that was a really good way to get noticed. I won't cover so much on what I did in the hackathons but if you're doing a project for blind people do it blindfolded. I assure you that gets you points right. So that was that was how I got into Skyscanner where I currently work and at Skyscanner I think that it's been a really enjoyable experience and you can see that based on asking a kind of a few questions like how long have people been there right. What is the culture like when somebody leaves and just are people generally happy because honestly I think you get to a point where I think salary matters slightly less than your sanity and a lot less than your sanity after you have enough to eat and like pay for your expenses right. You just want to be able to go home and like go for a run without going oh my god my application is going to crash again and again and again and I'm going to get called like like I think you definitely want to value that a lot more as time passes. The thing I think I would like to cover for this group of people is where next. Where next right. You might start out as a programmer and then you go well some people want to be a tech lead. Well tech leads have very varying roles depending on where you are. In some places this is a person that just writes code and just happens to have the most years of experience. In other places this person writes no code and tells people what to do. In other places this person is an architect so it's just it's kind of a title that may not mean very much and people who work in startups know that titles may not mean very much at all because you might be doing one job here and one job there tomorrow. Things I've explored are more to do with where my long-term goals are. So my long-term goals still lie in having my own company. So what's missing from me having my own company. I don't know how to hire software engineers. So that's something that I'm putting my time into into doing. That's the main thing. So that's the thing that I put focus into as guided by my mentor who's been thoroughly helpful to me. So I guess maybe I just wrap it up by saying like like remember where you started and and try your best really to enjoy what you do because it's it's it's kind of a waste of time otherwise and you learn a lot more by enjoying it. Anyone have questions for Sherwin? Well with that thank you. Thank you Sherwin. Alright