 None from staff. Any requests from board members? Okay, not here in any minute. Let's move on to public to be heard. Public to be heard is a, actually I wanted to explain, I've been identified as a contact or a direct contact, somebody who later tested for COVID. So I'm following the protocol and we're in the mask. I will do my best to enunciate and try to speak clearly. So anyway, moving on to public to be heard. Public to be heard is a time when attendees of the meeting can speak to the board on items, about items that are not on the agenda. If you'd like to speak during public to be heard, you can either raise your hand using the raise your hand feature in Zoom, which you can find by floating your cursor around the bottom of the screen and clicking on reactions and there'll be a raise your hand icon in there or you can raise your hand in the room. If you'd like to speak during public to be heard, please be brief, please be civil. Please address your remarks to me as chair of the select board and thanks for being here. So, and we have one hand in the room. Come on up, introduce yourself. Good evening. I'm Alan Nye, your rep on the Chittenden Solid Waste District Board and we have a couple of capital projects that are underway and I just thought it would be good to come in and update you as to where we are and where I think we're going and what my thoughts are and if they're contrary to yours, I need to get that information from you so I can represent you as the governing body of the town. So the first one is the new materials recycling facility or MRF as we call it. We are moving forward with the vote for the bond in the November election. There's an interesting twist in that we cannot get our question on the ballot that the secretary of state's office is putting out. For some reason other municipal bodies can't work that issue. So we will be working on a couple of others. One is of course to have the ballots available at all of the community's voting places for that day and also for early voting here in the office. So we'll be working that. The staff is looking at trying to find a number of ways to get money other than the bond so that the bond is not as big as initially was being thought to need to be and we're hopefully going to get a positive vote as this does not add anything to the tax payers bill or the town's bill. It will be paid through the dollars that people pay to drop off recycling or it will be paid with the money that we get for the sale of materials. So it's been, I think it's been like 18 years since the waste district has asked for money from the communities the first couple of three years that was the way it went. Then that the number right now is like 20 something million 20 to 23, the vast majority of that is equipment that will be installed. The second item is an administrative office building and our staff prior to COVID was in a modified raised ranch. Ventilation is very poor. One person would get a cold and six or seven people would get a cold in the building. Just, you know, there was just no way to put in a adequate ventilation system in that building to meet the needs of the numbers of people that were working there. So we were looking at trying to build a administrative office close to the compost project close to where the new Murph will be and the drop off center for Williston. But the estimates came in pretty high and the board has stepped back a little bit and taken a look and having staff take a look at some other options, renting, leasing, purchasing an existing building, you know, some other options there. Nothing has been decided. We had quite a meeting a couple of weeks ago on it for information and direction to staff. But that isn't out there right now, not moving forward with it. So, but I'm assuming that you guys are in support of the Murph and the new Murph and the project that will be built with that bond and stuff and so I'll continue to, you know, work in a positive vein down those roads unless I hear differently from you. All right. Thanks, Alan. Yeah. You are aware that the ballots are being mailed for the November election. You may now get a very big turnout actually coming to the polls. Yeah, there's, we may be able to, if the town gets a request to mail the ballot, it may be able to be put into your package. I just cannot believe that the Secretary of State's office, you know, can't, you know, whoever wrote the legislation on mailing ballots didn't include other municipal bodies. Something that we need to get the legislature to look at. But yes, I do realize that, Tom. Oh, so there's a possible, oh, that's weird. Everything's being mailed, so people aren't going to be here. Right, right, general election, everything gets mailed, you're right. So. So is, yeah, go ahead, Tracy. I was going to say, so if some people get a ballot and some don't, I mean, is that, is that an actual binding vote? If not, everybody gets the ballot? Yeah, because they're going to know that they can come in and get the ballot at the town office or go, you know, vote in person, you know, our lawyer says everything is copacetic, you know, with respect to it, if there are people that, you know, did not get a ballot in their package and mailed their package in, we're still okay with the results of the election. Okay, that seems a very odd situation. Yeah, yeah, wow, wow. So with regard to warning the vote on all that, that will all happen through your board. The town doesn't need to warrant any kind of vote. We don't need to. We'll be doing that. Right, but then the question of whether we can somehow assist with getting the ballots out, I don't know how that, if there's anything that can be done. They are going to be talking to all the clerks of our administrative folks. Wow, because are they being mailed from? I'm thinking, they're coming from the Secretary of State's office, it's my understanding. I don't know why if they had their ballot there, it couldn't be included with whatever they're mailed from. It's not on the ballot, it would just be a separate ballot. It's automated. They've been many conversations with Mr. Contos and our lawyer and our executive director. I'm so sorry to hear that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, wow, wow, okay, okay. All right, and if you have, if you hear that we're going in the wrong direction, please give me a call and tell me to make, so. Okay, all right, thanks, Alan. Thank you very much for all you do. All right, yeah, thank you. Okay, anybody else for public to be heard? See any hands in the room? Anybody online? I don't see any hands, so let's move on to the first business item, business M5A, consider appointment of volunteers to the Economic Development Commission. We've had a number of discussions about this and I believe Don, you have the motion there? No, you don't, I thought we did. Yeah, I did, but wait just a minute. All right, then maybe I will go ahead and make the motion. I move that the select board appoint Ray Garofano to the Economic Development Commission with term expiring June 30, 2023. And appoint Rebecca Robinson to the seat expiring June 30, 2025. Thank you, Don. Any further discussion? All those in favor, please say aye. Aye. Aye. Opposed? Okay, motion passes 5-0. Let's move on to business item 5B, discussion about budget goals for fiscal year 2024. You Greg? This is me, staff is starting to put together budgets for fiscal year 2024. We always try to check on the select board about this time of year to get your thoughts. If you have any particular goals that you want us to focus on as we put the budgets together, we're working on bringing the manager's budget to you by October, so we can have the budget day in early November. So yeah, just wanted to have an opportunity tonight to hear from all of you about what's on your mind and what you would like us to focus on. All right, great. Thanks, Greg. Any, remember comments? Anything you want? Hey, Ethan, you're good at that. Smile, Ethan. You gotta start. Go ahead. I don't always start. I got a couple things. I know we've all had this conversation and we've all been thinking about it a lot. One of the biggest things to me is, and when I say this, I don't mean cut services, but find, you know, polls and things like, you know, public works and positions that aren't filled and then really assess the need for the positions and, you know, look at things like mowing and other things and if it's worth having our staff do it and they can be doing other things. And, you know, my main goal was obviously to not have a large budget increase, not a tax increase, but a budget increase for the next year from the budget that we're at and what we plan on being when we reduce. So, there's a few things that I have to say about it. Thanks, Ethan. What else? I know we talked about this a little bit last year as part of budgeting, capital planning, but really making sure, I know Tom has done it, Tom Yando has done a great job with our facilities, but really making sure that we are appropriately planning for maintenance upgrades, things of that sort so little problems don't become big problems as time goes on. Why not just the excess spending because some of the stuff I see in the warrant is questionable to limit the tax increase to as low as we can make it. We know we're gonna have one, but make it as least painful as possible and to really, oh, I word this, not add staff that we don't need. Kendall, you got anything you wanna bring up? Well, I've been sharing a number of ideas with the town manager directly. I do think there are some areas of the budget that you could potentially see some big savings in by bidding out some services that haven't been bid out for quite a while. My personal goal is I don't think that the town should be doing any private work on private lines if you're a public entity and we should only do public work. There are plenty of businesses and things out there to do private work and the town should not be in that business. So that'll be what I'll be looking for in the budget. Thank you. Thanks, Kendall. I mean, my list has about 12 things on it. Well, share it with us. I guess things that I'd like to see is some understanding or a discussion about whether to ask for an increase in our capital tax. We currently or we have our current, our most recent past practice has been about half of our capital comes from our operating budget and half comes from the capital tax. I think it would be more transparent if we got more of it from the capital tax. That would be essentially shifting money from one place to another, but it would I think be more transparent. And there's also a full disclosure, right? We've probably got, we definitely have a reassessment coming up. And interesting fact that the last time the capital tax was touched was the same year that the last reassessment was done. But the reassessment will increase that capital tax. We got to keep that in mind. I think that needs to be part of the discussion. I'd also like to see a true five-year capital plan. Our charter requires a five-year capital plan review every year. And I think a lot of our out years are very empty. In many departments, and I think it'd be good to be able to, I think it would help us to understand what our capital needs are. We have a more filled out capital plan. There's been a lot of discussion about whether and about the fact that this building we're in is in the city. I think we need to start planning for a municipal center. There've been discussions in some of the discussions we've had about how to spend ARPA money and what our town finances, the two sessions that we had, there were suggestions that we make a land purchase with the anticipation of building a municipal center at some point down the road when we're able to. The pool also needs some, Ali keeps reminding us it's the same age as she is. And so it is, I hope Ali has many, many years ahead of her, but I'm not sure the pool does. I think I've asked for a couple of years in a row is access to the river. Be nice to have a boat launch in Essex. We've talked about this before is the indie book rate structure. Is it appropriate? Should that be looked at? See another thing is we have a scenic overlay corridor. I'd like to see if there's things that we can plan for to make sure that we're focusing on that. Housing is an issue for a lot of people. I don't know what we can do. There's been talking about establishing a housing trust or housing fund or whatever. This may not be the first of the right year to do that, but if there's anything that can go on there. Communications and outreach, continue what we're doing or expand that. I think that's always an important thing. Senior center, we need to resolve what our plan is gonna be or what our path forward is gonna be with that by the end of next calendar year, given the agreement we have with the city. A lot of discussion about climate change. Are there things that we can do there? I know this year are, what we've done is we're planning to purchase either hybrid or electric police vehicles. If there's other things that we can do. Equity is a big thing. Either continue what we're doing or expand that. Like to have, I think it's helpful to have it as a front-up item in our planning. And then trails, we've had comments over the significant amount of time about connectivity, wayfair marking or, my wife and I did the outer loop at Indian Brook on Sunday. I had the map, but I wasn't really sure where I was kind of thing. And I know that would make some people uncomfortable, we were okay with it, but it was, I don't know, those kind of things. I think if we can do it, there's been a lot of comment about those kind of things. And that's my list. Thank you both. I did send you a written copy of that. Is this where I could add two things? Yeah, go ahead. I would like to add that I think our delinquencies are too high and that we should focus on getting those down, especially when you're looking at increasing taxes. And I would also mention that I've read quite a bit that, and I'm not sure if this is accurate, that there are some sidewalks that do not get plowed and don't get taken care of. Other than there are public sidewalks, I think that the town should focus on making sure that all of our sidewalks are usable. Thank you. All right, any other board member comments before we open up to the public? I've also thought about the Indian Brook passes and just for comparison, I went and I looked up the rates for daily passes, the motor vehicle rate, which allows all access to all passengers in the vehicle. So if you have a van with eight people, it's just $5 in comparison. If you go to Sandbar State Park, it's $4 per person. There's no limit. So I don't think that it's keeping up with the actual cost. And I would like to see that at a structure that's more self-funding rather than pulling from tax dollars and being funded by tax dollars. Thanks for anything else, Ethan? I haven't been up there, but I just heard things from before and after the normal season or when it first starts to cover. But is there like a port-of-body or anything up there yet? And a cab accessible port-of-body? The one you mentioned, Sandbar just popped into my head that, you know, there's bathrooms at Sandbar. There are port-of-bodies up there. Okay, awesome. I just wanted to double check that because I was gonna throw that on the list. I haven't been there. All right, any other? Any other board member comments? Hey, I see Patty Davis's hand up. Patty, do you have a comment? Yeah, I just wanna say kudos to Kendall and to Tracy for mentioning the sidewalks and maybe charging more for, I think, money is to be had with our recreation and the fact that a couple of facts. One, the population's getting older and so many people use trails, get lost and use all our steep areas to bike and walk and I get lost at Saxon. So I understand how you feel, Andy, but not only do the sidewalks need to be plowed because our population's getting older, it's dangerous, but they need to be like on Allen Martin Parkway, that sidewalk or paved path hasn't been changed in 30 years. And I like what Tracy had to say about maintenance and we are going to have to pay people more to retain them, to have people to plow and to have people maintain our sidewalks and our buildings if we plan on growing. So yes, housing is a crisis, but we shouldn't be growing if we're not paying people to maintain what we have. And then one other thing, Andy, I really liked what you had to say about the access for canoeing, for kayaking. If you go like from my house down Sandhill Road, take a left onto River Road, then take a right onto what is it, North Williston Road and you just go over the bridge, just go over the bridge. There's a little tiny hut of a restaurant. It's like people are sitting outside. It looks like a little trailer type thing I don't know what they serve, but there's this little tiny road just before that hangout where you can buy french fries right there on the left. And right at the end of that road, my neighbor across the street, Scott Turnbull, takes his canoe and goes right down that road. I don't know, there might only be one or two parking spaces, but you can go right there and slide your little banana right in the water. Yeah, that's- Do you know what I'm talking about? Yeah, that's the Fontaine access, yep. Is that something that's public? It is public, it is. So maybe there's money that we can spruce up a little, maybe make a little wider area to park. It's in Williston, it's in Williston, though. Oh, it is. Oh, I thought it was just over the bridge, still in Essex, no? No, that's Williston. That's Williston. Oh, bummer. Did you cross the bridge there as Williston? Okay, I was just trying to help. Yep, yep, thanks. Yeah, there used to be, there is also a, there's two other accesses and maybe, maybe that's a different discussion. Shouldn't go there. One of them is where the Woodside used to be, but the parking is about a quarter mile from the river, so it's a big lug to take two kayaks down there. And the other one is the one that Green Mountain Power is supposed to maintain at the end of the Global Foundry, at the access to Global Foundries. And it's not very well, it's very difficult to navigate. Well, something we should look into, recreation is our biggest way to make money, three billion the state made in 2019 with recreation. And a significant portion of our southern border is waterfront and we don't use it. Yeah, we don't, yeah. Right, thank you, thank you, Patty. Any other public comments? Seen any hands in the room? Seen any hands up and online? So Greg, do you have what you need? I do, thank you very much. All right, thank you. And let's move on to the next business item, which is 5C, consider adoption of updates to Town of Essex personnel guidelines. And this is here. I am. Thanks, Travis. Yeah, so we've got some small proposed changes to the personnel guidelines. The predominant one, the reason that we're putting this out here today is that we felt we needed to define the per diem employee classification now that we are utilizing per diem employees in the fire department. So we did develop a employee definition for per diem staff that was run by the town labor attorney, Sue Gilphillon as well. In addition, the other significant of sorts change in here was adding a vehicle use policy that actually came up with a lot of the fire personnel work I've been doing with Charlie Cole that we're not really properly vetting individuals who are operating municipal vehicles in a bare minimum. We should be upon hire, at least confirming that they have a clean and valid driver's license. Understanding it's not necessarily practical to do driver's license checks on any sort of a regular basis, but we should at least be checking upon hire and then putting the onus on employees to notify us of changes to their license status. So that would be police, fire, or anyone really operating. We already do it for our CDL drivers, but anyone operating even one of the town cars at 81 Main Street just to help minimize liability there. The rest of it was primarily some general cleanup. We tried to change unified manager to town manager throughout. And there were a couple other clarifications. I think in the health and wellness section we clarified that that benefits for full-time employees. That's always been the practice and what we've budgeted for, but it wasn't necessarily spelled out there. So I believe the rest was pretty much just general cleanup. So that's all I've got. Happy to answer any questions as well though. All right, thanks Travis. Any questions from board members? Comments, Tracy. In section 6C, which deals with sexual harassment and discrimination, I was curious about the language involving... Now let's see here. I think it first appears under examples of sexual harassment, derogatory or provoking remarks about or relating to an employee's sex or sexual orientation. I was curious whether that should be changed to gender identity or sexual orientation. That would probably be a good addition to the policy, yeah? And there are a few places where that shows up. Okay, Greg, would the best option be to make some of those changes and put this back at a future meeting or how would be the best way to handle that? If you're comfortable with it and the board's comfortable, I'm happy to take a motion to approve the amendments plus whatever's discussed tonight. And the board's amendments, yeah. I'm okay with that. My question's got answered, so I'm gonna let it go. All right, any other questions or comments? Board members, anything, Ethan? No, I'm a very good reader, so it doesn't drop out at me. Kendall, any comments, questions? Oh, it's good. I wish I worked for the town of Messicks. Okay, any comments from the public? I don't see any hands in the room. I don't see any hands up online. Oh, there's a hand. Oh, Lorraine, go ahead. Very quick question. Just thinking about what Travis said about personnel and vetting, having worked for a number of different companies. In terms of vetting, is there any cost-saving for liability in terms of how we vet or train or any of that? And has that ever been explored in terms of saving on insurance? That's a good question. I would need to run that by VLCT, the Vermont League of Cities and Towns, but I can certainly run that question by them and get back to you. All right, thanks, Travis. Thanks, Lorraine. Any other comments or questions? Okay, bring it back to the board. What's your pleasure? Make the motion that we adopt the updated version of the town of Messicks personal guidelines with Tracy's recommendations. Second. Thank you, Don. Is that a second? Second, yep. Thank you, Ethan. Any further discussion? So just a question, we are adopting. Does this mean we need to approve it later, or is this final, the final? This is intended to be the final one, considering it's not a new policy. Yeah, it's not a new policy, okay. All right. Okay, any other discussion? Any hands? Okay, all those in favor, please say aye. Aye. Aye. Opposed? Okay, motion passes 5-0. Thank you, Travis. Thank you. Okay, moving on to the next agenda item, 5-D, which is discussion and potential action on nominating a delegate for the Vermont League of Cities and Towns 2022 legislative policy and annual meeting. This meeting runs concurrently with the town fair, which this year is gonna be held in Killington. I have been the delegate a number of times in the past. Happy to do it again, but also would like to offer it to, if there's anybody else who is shopping at the bit to do it. Yeah, that's good. I make the motion that we appoint Andy Watts as our delegate to the Vermont League of Cities and Towns to the LCT 2022. Second. Thank you, Don. Thank you, Ethan. Any further discussion? Opposed? Yeah. Aye. Aye. Aye. Opposed? Okay, motion passes 5-0. I'm glad you retired. I will contact Tammy and let her know to sign me up. Also, if anybody else wants to attend the meeting, she can just let Tammy know and make arrangements for you. Yeah, I was looking at this meeting in the only head in Burlington with the regional planning. But you have to be vaccinated and double-boosted in order to attend both of them. Just a heads up for anybody who wants to try and attend. All right. All right. Great. Okay, let's moving on to the next agenda item, which will be a executive session we come back to later. There's no discussion we need to have at this point around that. Then the next one is real estate lease options, similar situation there, and then discussion about contracts. So moving on to consent agenda. Make the motion we accept the consent agenda. Thank you, Don. Second. Thank you, Ethan, for the second. Any further discussion? Those in favor, please say aye. Aye. Aye. Opposed? I didn't hear you, candle. Aye. Okay. All right. Okay. Motion passes 5-0. All right. Moving on to reading file. Any... Go ahead, Don. Are we going to have a chance to discuss something in the reading file? First, building policy, use policy. Yes. So it's in there. It's right. It's in there to give us a heads up that it's coming. It wasn't intended to be discussed tonight. But it is coming. So we will have input into it. It will come to a meeting in the future. And having the fact that you have it available, the first draft is a rough draft at this point. If you have anything you'd like to comment on, you can do it outside of this meeting because we didn't want to have a discussion here. And then when it comes back around, we'll have a full open discussion with the public and so forth. No problem. And I know that we've gotten a number of comments about it already that we'll certainly play into where we go. Okay. Thank you. Ethan. I have a board member comment. And it's kind of a question. But I was just wondering when and what we are going to do about changing and finding an ordinance for the town. If that's an idea. If it's coming back or if that's something that just. So the public nuisance ordinance that we talked about before. Yeah. Yeah. My understanding is that the police staff, the police department are working on a language. I just wasn't sure what was. And we'll come back when they're when they're ready. I suppose we could ask for an outlook. Yeah, I mean, I want to be a bad idea if we've made some recommendations before we had a whole other meeting about it. If you have, if you have comments you want to make, you can go ahead and make those to pass them to Greg. And he can share them with the staff that are working on it. Okay. And then we can have an open, we'll have a discussion about it again. And, you know, our process is we have to have a public hearing. And then, yeah, so it takes a couple of meetings actually. I forgot to say thank you to the Essex Police Department and to Greg for Essex Night Out. Oh, it was really the police. Yeah. Wonderful. Turn it. It was a good turnout. Good. Good event. Thank you. So I had followed up with Marguerite about the ARPA survey. I was assuming that the scoring was golf rules, meaning the lower the score, the higher it ranked. She did indicate that she's going to update the X and Y axis and update in the next few days. So those who, like me, they've been a little confused based on the larger bars actually being lower scores that an update is coming. Okay. So I guess for clarification, does it mean that they're in the wrong bigger bar? Other ranked higher than anything and it didn't have as much. Yeah. But if you look at the, like one was the most important, 10 was 10 weight. But it turned. Yeah. It was off. It was back. Yeah. It was upside down. Yeah. It has to do with like survey, the survey output of the data. It was, yeah. Just of course ended up being the opposite of how we scored it and made it very confusing. And I'm sorry. I did not catch that on that PDF. So we'll fix those and repost it so that it's way more clear for everyone. I'm not so weird. Thanks, Marguerite. So, so Marguerite, then can you clarify that the category that was other that as the, as the chart appears now, it looks to be the most important. Right. So it's the opposite. Or is it? No, exactly. It's, and if you, right, if you really want to see the hot, there is another image there on the ARPA page, excuse me, where you can at least see the top because I ended up pulling one out, you know, we did it ourselves just so we could give more data. And that was just for our public info sessions. So you can see what the actual top four are. And you'll note other is not on there because it does. It's not important just as you said. So, yeah. Okay. All right. Thank you for that clarification. Thanks for asking the question. I wanted to comment on the explorer Essex thing. I think that's a looks like it's an amazing thing. Very, very happy to see that. I'm getting pulled together. It'd be an awesome event. And it's on my birthday. So it'll be good. Isn't it three days long? Well, yeah, my birthday is three days long. The other thing I wanted to point out is that the upcoming meeting schedule does include a budget day on November 4th, which is that first Friday of November. Kendall, I saw you nod your head, but I haven't yet heard that you're okay with that date. It's hard to say that's like forever from here, but I should be good. Okay. Okay. All right. All right. It goes on all day. That's a Thursday. It's a Friday. That was a Thursday Friday and that was too many dates. In person or is it hybrid? It'll be hybrid. We'll be here. Everyone can be here. Great. But we, I think it's just in general, are doing the hybrid as an option these days. I heard Andy was buying donuts and coffee, so I'm coming in. There will be something. Maybe I will make something. That's a good idea. I'll make some homemade muffins. These cheese breads that I made. There we go. In my neighborhood, I can't go to a party unless I bring them. There you go. All right. Anything else I wanted to comment on here? Okay. Then I guess we're moving on to executives. I got one more comment that I was thinking of, but I just wanted to point out about the Essex Night Out. Super awesome event for the community. But I was really disappointed to see that there was no Essex municipality there besides the police department. I was there. Marguerite was there. Tanya was there. Public Works was there. There was no public works there. There were trucks there. Most public work was there. In the fire department, but it was the only one that didn't show up then. Playing fire trucks. I don't have a full list, but it's a town event. I just didn't understand why there, and all the pictures I saw, I didn't see a lot of town involvement versus the events. My apologies for not seeing the municipal trucks because I didn't see any pictures online. A national event. Put them by the town. All right. Hi, Zia. Hi, Zia. I move that the select board enter into executive session to discuss the appointment for employment or evaluation of a public officer or employee in accordance with one BSA section 313A3 to include town manager and deputy manager. I also move. How should we do that? Anyone do that one first and I'll go the other one. I'll do that one first. Okay, thank you. Thank you, Don. Thank you, Tracy. Any further discussion? Those in favor, please say aye. Aye. Aye. Okay, thank you. I move that the select board enter into executive session to discuss the negotiating or securing of real estate purchase or lease options in accordance with one BSA section 313A2 and to include the town manager, deputy manager, and director of parks and recreation. Thank you, Don. Do I have a second? Second. Thank you, Tracy. Any further discussion? Those in favor, please say aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Opposed? Okay, motion passes 5-0. I move that the select board make the specific finding that general public knowledge of contracts would place the town at a substantial disadvantage. Motion one. Do you want me to do a vote? No, thank you. Tracy, you seconded that? Yep. All right. Thank you. Any further discussion? Those in favor, please say aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion passes 5-0. I move that the select board enter into executive session to discuss contracts pursuant of one BSA 313A1A to include the town manager. Okay. Thank you, Don. Thank you, Tracy. Any further discussion? So I guess the question I always ask when we get to the final thing is, are we going to come back? Thank you, Will, tonight. Okay. Okay. There's a chance of it. There's a chance that we'll come back. Okay. So we won't hold you, Scott. So we won't have the television access. We'll not continue, but we will. We will go into a breakout session with Kendall to have the executive discussion, this executive session discussion, and then we'll come back to the room to adjourn and potentially make the motions. Right. Thank you, everyone, for attending. And if you'd like to hang out, we'll be back.