 da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. Receiving your content. Your audience will see it in a moment. Get ready, hooray. You are now alive. I've got orange as the health for the stream. That's a little bit concerning. Orange, maybe that just means it's. Means that Trump's watching, dude. Oh, damn it. Oh Cuz it's orange I get it. Why the fuck is it still orange go green. Oh, it means that we have armor So our health bar turns orange Hello, everyone. Who could I be looking at the comments section is apparently working. So I don't know what orange means This is zero watching. I think it's I don't know Stream health is technically alive, but why bother cuz no one's right. It's it's up. It's up. It's fine Oh, oh, even in someone in the comments was like, look, it's Fringy 6 5 again So many people call you be called in Fridgey as well. I know I've said my own name Doesn't matter. I Think when people when they just read it and they haven't heard it. Yeah. Yeah, no, I know. I'm just joking. I'm not offended I'm not gonna look at his name is clearly Fring Daddy G Bring Daddy bring Daddy G. Yeah, the daddy is silent If that one doesn't work, there's fremen M This was not 10 minutes it did take a little longer to recalibrate No, we needed to give time for people to walk around. That was the important thing Wolf came back on the previous stream and we didn't give it a week to ruminate. So yeah, he's back We gave him about 40 minutes to ruminate. It's like So people like wait, well the fuck he's back. It's like, yes, he's back Yeah, we did a the last 40 minutes were they were for patrons only Exclusive content if you support Fringy Fring Daddy G as he's known to his patrons With women welcome welcome number 16 We were just celebrating 15 Our e-faps are now at the age of consent. Yep Uh, what? You have to be 16 to be able to watch stuff on youtube. That's uh, it's true. I don't make the rules. I just report them Um But yes, wonderful wonderful day. We we we were always planning to do the eric taxon thing and then joseph decided to uh Correct his viewers and it's resulted in hilarity So we were just like, oh, how do we cover that and eric taxon putting that putting that in the same video It just does not not not meld whatsoever. So that we separated them out um And we decided to bring on uh What name are we running with fring? Why? Fring daddy g Man, you put me on the spot He was he's been here for now. Is this your third e-fap or second third e-fap insane Yes, or as we we call them one fring to rule them all There's a lot of stamina you got there You can do fring dog too Fring dog. Yeah, that's yeah, so many potential options here. Let's just make it an interchangeable thing for the whole Whatever comes to mind Uh, so today watch your diet because you don't want to accidentally get some fring worms I guess we should Give those who haven't seen e-fap episode. I want to say 11 Yeah, yeah, because it was after the toro one. I think so Uh, he Joe's fans and finally released his fabled video were explained Why horror games don't work for him and unfortunately he framed a lot of the things in that video as we covered it, uh Like the the best way I can put it is the difference between objective and subjective He had a lot of statements that people were like, but you just you just said that was true and that's not a true like Just just random shit like you play as a superhero because you respawn people are like, no you don't Because that's not what's happening It's important to understand that the way that he said certain things and the way that he said other things made it confusing Because he would sometimes say in my opinion And then other times he just state things as though they were true And you had a history He's a history with with uh soma is not a horror game Which she still defends to this day is not being a mistake of writing. It's just that's now I think it's I think it's important to start comparisons right away Like if somebody says soma is not a horror game and somebody says the sun is not a star Are they both not equivalents in terms of the way that they're phrased as though they're factual statements Oh in that case. Yes, but he would argue the difference is important that the genre is subjective Therefore him saying it's not this is the thing even if it was what he's just stated is as you've just put it It would be a statement rather than Him saying I never felt it was a horror game, which I probably would have gone over a hell of a lot better with people Well, it's just once you change the words Like if you if you take the same sentence and then just change a few words Somehow because it's about a video game. It's no longer a statement of facts Like if I if I said for example if I said the sun is a star Uh super smash brothers is a fighting game Are they not both statements of truth or objective statements or is one of them an opinion Because it's about a video game and not a star Is that how it works? We would rather sit in reality and say, yeah, you shouldn't have wrote it like that because it's you're saying a thing It's true, but but no he was like no it makes sense if you really just understand how he uses all the different words, but It's it's it's so Everything to do with art Is is subjective everything to do with science would be objective And and his position is basically that if you say anything that's factual, it's no longer an opinion It's just a fact But that's unfortunately for him that doesn't follow the uh Our words work. That's not what they're defined as. It's not people use them. So Uh, you ultimately are sitting in a position where you're like, okay So we take your definition or we take the definition that people have agreed on collectively like or or significantly Let's say which is the whole point of language The thing is if he just came onto one of these to talk about it It would be way easier to figure out what he means Yes or to reach some sort of conclusion, but he he doesn't want to talk to mohler No, he really doesn't like to I remember it's not even the word I use it's the fact that I insulted him It's what he cites it which just putting it out there if you've insulted me. I'm still up for chatting with you It's not a principle I hold because there's so many contexts. I mean Me and wolf never would have met if he had taken my insult away. Joseph Anderson took it This is how we cite it every day like the ragnarok. We will never speak to each other And like, you know, uh, fringy, you're an asshole. There you go. It's done now. No more friendship And I guess I gotta be honest. I don't like green people Oh, well Well, that's an irreconcilable difference You might be like that's context though. It freaks already both. I just like that's the Joseph Anderson never actually sold my video. He didn't uh, he's he's admitted. He hasn't seen anything for me So he's just going off somebody told him I insulted him which is To me, it's just like man, you just looked for any thread to not speak to me, didn't you? That's the best you got if you didn't like take snipes in this video, which is what this video is It's just him sniping He won't mention who it's about but it's clearly in response to the podcast that we did Oh, uh, it's it's not just us. That's the thing. We weren't the only people who had an issue So it's A response to us and other people but Funnily enough, I wanted to mention, uh, do you guys know the youtuber skill up? I know No of him, but like I put a I put a comment on joe's video like trying to go through my main issues with it And uh, he responded to by that guy saying, uh Like I was inconsistent Nonsensical and just rude It's like did he did he ever qualify did he ever qualify that? Did he give an example? No Um, his his description though is balanced thoughtful and mature gaming coverage of cool games So that seems mildly hypocritical. Yeah, that seems inconsistent one might say Well, it's just like, you know, happy willing to talk to him But that's probably not gonna happen either whatever they open it's like that I'm just like just just keep the doors open whatever but um Their mother's basement who's apparently an anime reviewer Hit me up on twitter. Well Didn't directly Someone had to send me it because he was talking about how off base I was Without adding me of course because why you know don't want to get me involved Um, but then you're gonna go find it on twitter me and him had a back and forth the lasted ages During it. He cited his five-year professional career to me. Um That includes being a youtuber by the way. That's like a part of it And he was saying like this is clear evidence that I know what I'm talking about sort of thing and it's just like You're a youtuber too though. Yeah, but he's probably got more years on me So I don't count even though that doesn't necessarily mean he's right anyway, but um He he was staunched against the whole objective opinion thing until he finally conceded that yeah You can have objective opinions, but they're worthless compared to like subjective ones because subjective ones are the important ones Uh Um The is the response would just be how important a subjective or objective fucking opinion is Subject it's like it depends on how much you want to hear it who it's from blah blah blah There's loads of other stuff that comes with it. Um But yeah, the the the this chaos has come from this Um for for joseph especially like there's loads of criticisms coming at him that he just cannot handle criticism Like that this just it comes down to that sort of thing and we'll we'll see about that because there is Interesting though, like that's just interesting to me that a critic Doesn't like being criticized. What critics that can't take criticism done done done um Yeah, what I liked as well is so he was like, you know, no content of art is truly bad or anything are objectively bad One of the top comments was um pulled out 76 is objectively bad Yeah And no, I was looking at the responses and some people said as long as one person enjoys it as long as someone's enjoying it It can't be considered objectively bad Right. So if if somebody's just ate dog shit and then somebody came along and said, you know, that's less nutritional than like a salad Well, they're like, well, I like it. So that's now it's up for interpretation Well, when I first heard about that from moller, my response was okay So if somebody makes a game, but they never sell it or tell anybody about it and it just sits on their hard drive Is it a bad game because nobody enjoyed it? Oh, yeah, that came apart pretty fun. That's one of those bleep bloop logic dyke It's help I should get the mario death sound ready. Oh, yeah, but whenever you play it's absurdly loud Oh Well, it's gotta be ear rape or oh, yeah, if we've learned anything from eric taxon Because ear rape is good. It is a good design decision that you should do Yeah, so, uh, I guess we should open with um What is what is an opinion? anyone See we really need to oh, he's gonna come up in the video. So This is what the fucking video is about dude Like this is what it all comes down to is the definitions of objective subjective opinion statement judgment fact like all the Is a judgment viewpoint or statement that is not conclusive Yeah Uh, yeah, this is what the definition of opinion is according to maryon webster 1a a view judgment or appraisal formed in the mind about a particular subject matter Um 2 beliefs stronger than impression and less strong than positive knowledge Um and 3 a formal expression of judgment or advice by an expert. So that's what the opinion is Yeah, I also have an estimation of the quality of uh, or worth of something or someone Or the beliefs or views of a large number or majority of people about a particular thing Uh But but I like uh an opinions a judgment viewpoint or statement that is not conclusive And this puts it at odds with objective. Oh, yeah, that would uh, this is the problem. Um Fundamentally with a lot of words It would eventually come down to uh, what definition you've chosen and as long as that's clear then the communication can go through But like the most widely accepted Uh definition for opinion as far as I'm aware nice one wolf A view or judgment formed about something not necessarily based on fact or knowledge So the idea is right, but that not necessarily is important though. Not necessarily. It doesn't mean definitely not Um, yes, you could have a you could have a an opinion that like an unjustified opinion And and you'd be like guys, I'm quintin. I know exactly what an opinion is orange man bad Uh, I fucking hate trump I I fucking hate trump guys I did he ever give his reasons for why he didn't like trump. Uh, he said that he's he's like he's race Or he does things that I don't know like just just all the stands Like he's he's the worst for all races. He makes America look worse than it already is blah blah blah Okay, but again middle of a fucking reform review that came in It's a don't human Yeah, so anyway a view or judgment and you're like, oh, so maybe that could give joseph wiggle room but it's like um in the definition of judgment which I found amusing was uh, it's like Just give me one sec. Yeah an opinion or conclusion is a part of the definition of judgment So if an opinion is a judgment that can be based on facts An opinion a judgment can mean an opinion It's like it's it's it's you get to the point where you're starting to discover the problem with the english language, but Uh, all we're advocating for is that you can share a perspective To to use to not use the word opinion right now You can share a perspective that is irrelevant of your emotion Which would be objective and then the exact same thing as an opinion sharing a view or judgment Is that you know does that make sense to everyone here? essentially objective means that it It isn't affected by your opinions subjectively your opinion is wrong the definition of objective, um At least the adjective not the noun because the noun is you know, like a goal or anything like that But the definition of an objective Adjective is of a person Or their judgment not influenced by personal feelings or opinions in considering and representing facts I'm going another definition is on this based only on the facts and not influenced by personal feelings or beliefs So Surely a person is capable of being objective. Yes. What yeah, so you can have an objective opinion Depending on what definition No, but depending on what definition you use if you use the standard of an opinions a judgment viewpoint or statement That's not conclusive just because it's an opinion does not mean it can't be conclusive Yeah, it's just because it's an opinion. Yeah, you can't use that as the only criteria to find out If the proposition you're accepting is subjective Is adjective the definition is based on or influenced by personal feelings tastes or opinions Yeah, so we know what the difference is now I mean, we already did know but those are people who are curious on where we stand on this because There's another thing that joseph didn't really do but we'll get to that The yeah, so not influenced by personal feelings or opinions. So for me to make an opinion I'll just say like I really like Um, I don't know apples There's just there's just something I really like you'd be like last year opinion Whereas an objective statement would be an apple is a fruit. Yeah Apples are good because they're not orange So if you if you said apples taste good to me That's an opinion. That's an opinion objectively. Yes So what we're trying to say is you you keep providing opinions and you'd be like How do you split these into subjective and objective? Like well one one's some approvable some of the self truths that only can be proven by the person itself Uh Based on feelings based on your reactions to things and the as much as you want to be like Everything is based on reactions because everything's based on senses. You'd be like well at that point then Do you surmise that nothing in science is objective? And if you do because there are people who do then that's fine, but then we're talking about worldviews. So Virtual virtual shadow says if everything is subjective I can say it's objective because I say it's my it's my subjective way of using objective Oh god This is what happens when you start Like fiddling around with the way that words work. These words exist for a reason They exist because there is a distinction and they exist. Joseph has since concluded that It's essentially he's like agreeing with us But not he's basically said you can share an opinion That is founded in fact, but it would still be personal or something like that He'd be like you could share an opinion that only has facts and is based on facts But it's not objective because it's an opinion if you are sharing Something subjective it is an opinion if you're sharing something objective It is no longer an opinion what he's trying to say is an opinion is determined by what the statement was While we're saying the opinion is what you start with the content of it determines what kind of an opinion it is Yes, your opinion can be wrong But it can also be right. Mm-hmm. Yeah, that's the other thing by the way We'll get to that defense for the idea that it's because you're it It being your opinion does not mean that you haven't made an argument It doesn't mean that you can't you haven't said something that can be counted Uh, I mean the idea that it's not that it's kind of absurd like of course you can say things that are wrong Well, if I told you I told you I don't find um Like the character ox satisfying for iron man in and I'm I'm one because he Doesn't fucking he like he doesn't cry at any point And I I just feel like he should have and then you can be like well, okay But what character ox do you like and then I list a few and then you go one of them doesn't cry That I'd be like shit. Well, it's all my opinions will leave me a lot It's like no no no no we were having a discussion about your opinion And this is chaos This isn't news to me exactly It's like god damn like it gets Everyone gets so defensive the second their opinion is challenged even though that's the whole thing we're doing here That's what we're doing every day And the thing is you know if you say something like if you make a statement like soma isn't a horror game I haven't played but for the people who did Clearly that kind of robbed them the wrong way Because of the way that you put it across I mean it'd be great if you just you know blame them for misinterpreting what you meant Just listen to his audience. He might have you know fucking discovered something about why they were pissed But uh, that didn't really work out. Also, I just realized I'm giving you guys the invite for the watch together, which We're gonna do in a moment, but first um This is a couple of comments that I found interesting from his video that sum up a lot of the issues better than I guess some of us could because this is coming from people who are like You know, some of these people are in love with his channel. So they're very passionate in Disagreement And uh, this will tie into how he responds to the comments in this video, but uh You guys have the The album if you go to the first one, I'm assuming rags would like to read it out by bob billson Yeah, um, so the video is called subjectivity is implied and this is obviously works as a sort of reaction Just to the title alone Bob billson People are well aware that subjectivity is implied whether rightfully or wrongfully a significant number of people view your videos as arrogant and dismissive of alternate views This very video unfortunately supports that assertion So that'll be yet to be proved But the the idea is subjectivity doesn't it's not a shield. It doesn't work that way Yes, that's true. Um bob sorus says Uh, we have a theme with bob It's true that subjectivity is implied, but you're making the erroneous claim of because it's in a video It must be subjective and that movie is bad. That's clearly subjective. It's not worthy of qualification of in my opinion However, when you say something like that movie has such glaring plot holes that to enjoy it You have to actively ignore the failings of its writing That's clearly overstepping the bounds of reasonable subjectivity Sure, there is still discussion to be had But clearly this individual is making a bold claim that cannot simply be lumped in as another subjective opinion When you make the claim of current horror games require those who enjoy them to ignore its failings You are extending not only your personal opinions, but also Very clearly making a statement about those who do You spend a good portion of the video literally talking about how people who are scared by horror games must be x y or z This is obviously not talking about yourself because you literally start the video with the fact that horror games don't scare you anymore So too long getting read you made a video talking about how other people are scared by horror games because they can or are Ignoring x y z failings That is by no measure a subjective claim that is on the level of that movie was bad and making that comparison is rather baffling Yeah, and and the fact is like that movie was bad for me I'm just like do you mean you didn't like it or do you mean it was badly made because uh Some people can take that place between the two I think yeah, I think that you can because for example I think venom is bad, but I liked it Um, it's not good Yeah, the room is another example So when I say the room is bad, you don't need to assume that I hate the room and I don't like the room But I could have been independent of what you think of the it's it doesn't necessarily have anything to do with What personally thought of it And that's that's that is textbook definition of what objective is Yeah, but we don't want those pesky definitions getting in the way of my defense. Just turn off those pesky dictionaries Objectivist use vote bots to downvote our opinions the objectivists. Yeah, objectivists like this video It's your moral duty Apparently joseph deleted your comment Oh, well, I you never know anymore on youtube because weird things happen on youtube You know one way to find out is to go to your email And in the email there's a section for like youtube notifications. And if you can find someone replying to that You're replying to that comment in the gmail you can click on it and it'll take you to the comment And if it's been deleted, I wouldn't be able to see it. Yeah, so you're on social It'll say new comment on such and such or a new reply on such and such a new reply on this and that And then if you click that link It will bring you to the Um, imagine you go to the movies with a friend Um, well, so if I click a notification that I actually do have uh It does take me to the comment and I can't see it My theory is that it's been reported enough that it's been taken into The spam folder or whatever. Can you link me? Is there a link to it? Yes I don't think he's stupid enough to delete my comments. That would just bring so much flak for him But I could believe that it got reported by people who don't like me and has been forced into a I see yours. However um I do not I see yours, but i'm using your link So let me know if you're looking at incognito test. I don't necessarily see it. That's a thing No, I don't think it doesn't show up anymore for people outside, but I think it's in his spam folder now because it's been reported Yeah Yeah, and it's up to him to release it or not obviously just because he hasn't done it. That doesn't mean he's keeping it They're delivering might have missed it. Yeah One thing that might be strange is that sometimes people are unable to like reply it and get to it which is why um A comment can be there and it gains a lot of upvotes and it gains a lot of replies and then all of a sudden Basically, all of the upvotes stop because nobody new is seeing the comment And the only people who are getting to the comments are people who are adding on to the chain But yeah, don't I just all I'll say is don't automatically assume that the the person's deleting them because youtube's weird um He doesn't Joseph doesn't delete a lot of the criticism So I would assume he's got a catchall rule to not delete any to be honest He's probably like me. I don't actually look at my spam folder anymore because it's too much um But if I was too and it's in social No, well whatever folder it's in if I could like check all and approve I could do that But I do just send yeah Yeah, it's weird because even on youtube if you set it to allow all comments. It'll still mark some of spam Um, but anyway, do you want to read the the last one before we get into the video? It's from Owen Crowley. Um, Owen Crowley says just because it's subjective doesn't mean you aren't making an argument An argument invites people to argue their own points So when you try to rationalize why games aren't scary to you you are trying to persuade them to see your reasoning It's natural that if you present all your points and your listener is unconvinced you're inviting them to present their argument Criticism is a discussion in an exchange just like in literature In the end no one has to yield their subjective view and we are all probably better for having everyone heard I don't envy your position being the one all of this is directed towards Mm-hmm, which is it's the whole thing is really complicated because this is basically the bedrock of discussion Like this is this is as base as you can get, you know Um, and he's just released a video to sort of be like nailed it and it's like you've really not nailed it I mean if anything is worse, he's definitely made it worse I haven't said anything at all Kiwi said her that comment is poor man's mathematosis. Wait, wait. Well, this is like We've got all these lined up so that they'll match what joseph says Like these are responses to actual parts to his video So it's better to read them as they come sort of thing, but the first three are just about the title That's good. All right. So is everyone ready to hear out his argument for subjectivity is implied Okay, how long did it take us to get to the video for 28 minutes? Yeah, that's not too bad That's actually pretty good. Mm-hmm. Yes. Here we go Imagine you go to the movies with a friend Irrigate how do you go to the movies with a friend? Imagine you go to the movies with a friend You see whatever is new and popular and afterwards you start discussing it as you leave the theater You thought the movie was just okay. Meanwhile, your friend turns to you and says that movie was really good How do you respond? Do you a disagree and have a discussion with them about it? The same part of a What do you mean? Oh, wait, have you guys gotten to be already? We're he's I got a big c on my screen. Oh, shit. I'm only on a Took a watch together just not sinking us properly. How dare you uh, maybe go back to the stop ABC play out So stop when you get to the end of C. Muller. Okay. We'll we'll stop when we get to see and then talk about it Do a disagree and have a discussion with them about it Be ask why they liked it and hear them out or see rip off your shirt in a frothing rage Okay, well, we'll stop at throthing rage. So yeah, he said the options are to say you disagreed and talk about it Talk about it. We'll then ask them why they liked it and talk about it And then see to go now just go hand in hand, you know, they feel like they're more or less the same really In a casual context. It's basically the same I love the I don't know where to begin with this we got such a weird way to start the video so um Something that uh glib pointed out he's someone who hangs a lot on the disc or a lot. Um, someone you'll find in joseph and some videos He likes to I hate to use it because it's just like oh fallacy herb is the false dichotomy. He will create options Out of like this such a broad Uh possibility of answers and then you'd be like, so do you do this or this in this case? It's three and there's an obvious wrong answer here I don't know if you guys picked that up the fuck you didn't say in person You know Perspective or you know, do you and discussion is so complicated and nuanced If I watched a movie with any one person on this planet and the first thing they said was that movie was good And then I said, what do you mean? The answer could be just they have no idea what I mean You would go from there. Yeah, you have to you just you take it as as you go and the idea that you're like I I thought I thought it was that I put it in the comment I was like, isn't it just most clear to be like so did you enjoy it? Or did you think it was well made and if that was your concern if your concern was literally just Tell me more then you would say that right Yeah, but there's nothing wrong with asking somebody well, what do you mean specifically? Yeah, because if there anything really wrong with that If we came out of the cinema of the room and I said man that film was incredibly well made Then you guys would be like no it wasn't but if I said it was incredibly good You're curious of which which two statements. I would probably know what you mean and I'd be like, yeah I will yep. I I agree. That was amazing. That's that's exactly the thing is it's it's really is sort of a false dichotomy because what He what is related to Joseph Anderson was he wrote a script? And then made a video for his job Where he didn't explain things properly And he's trying to compare that to just a casual conversation as you walk out of a theater Yeah, which is like they can be compared And I mean he's not necessarily said anything that's incorrect here I'm just saying the framing is retarded where he's just like this is this happens This happens all this crazy person goes nuts. You're like, what when When does that ever happen? And you'd be like the comment section someone said in the comment section in all caps Joseph you're wrong. You said horror games are fucking not scary. I hate you I'd be like, oh come on Joe like really Joe come on now Joe now come on Yes We'll we'll this this this uh We're gonna try and do the whole you know Make sure we hear his arguments perfectly because Joseph has the one person we're not allowed to criticize as much But I choose c I choose c2. It's the best answer. You have I don't even know what the rest is. You have me a frothing rage Or c rip off your shirt in a frothing rage and ask how dare they represent their opinion as objective fact That they're a monster for trying to speed everyone in and declare the movie as Really good Then you launch into your rehearsed speech about how important it is to remember everyone has a different opinion and I do this and to be I'm sorry, but like has he has he never come across a scenario where someone says something and he's like Well, hey, that's not true And then they go was my opinion This is kind of what we're talking about the fundamentals. It's uh The two sides of the aisle that are fighting right now on one side You have the people saying Be clear because you keep presenting your feelings as arguments of truth and then the other side is like hey Listen better. I'm obviously being subjective when I say this You see there's like a breaking communication whose responsibility is it? Yeah, is it on the listener or the speaker And I would say it's on the speaker. Oh, absolutely. It's on the speaker to be clear If if the viewers have to say what do you mean by that? Well, obviously they could be I could say like an apple is a fruit and then they go what do you mean by that? And I'd be like go look at the words Right, but the thing is is that people aren't being facetious here. They actually genuinely want to understand Yeah, we'd like to clarify that he found soma to be not scary not that he considers it Just not a horror. It's like what? Please tell me Joseph that you so baffling. Yeah, that's why it's on the writer in that scenario I suppose that's what I would say. It's sometimes on the writer. Sometimes on the speaker Yeah, I mean the the listener. Sorry and Yeah, we'll just keep keep plowing through active fact that they're a monster for trying to speak for everyone and declare the movie as Really good Then you launch into your rehearse speech about how important it is to remember everyone has a different opinion and I think you get the point of this exaggerated example The reason you would not do this and to be clear here if is because In the world has ever Just ripped off this shirt I like that you have to apologize for doing it like who would do that? Yeah, like is this ever been done? Is this the thing? Why are you thought? Why is your video talking about that? That's never happened He even admits it's an exaggerated. This is an exaggerated example and if you've done it I was like, oh, oh, you're trying to talk to people in the audience who've done it. Oh No one's ever done that But if you did you should apologize Okay I think you get the point of this exaggerated example The reason you would not do this and to be clear here if you have done this to someone you owe them an apology Is because even though the statement has no formal declaration of an opinion the subjective nature of it is implied Both so what do you think of that? Even if it was why can't you have a discussion about it? The thing is I feel like a fundamental issue with this video is that I think the way you can frame something being your opinion is by saying I think or in my opinion But there are a lot of different ways that you could say something And have it come across as your opinion There are so many ways that you can do that like English is it's quite a diverse language, you know There's a lot of ways that you can convey something as your opinion without saying in my opinion. It's just harder Yes, if I say if I say Fringy is tall That's my opinion Jenna said if I kept the shirt odd would it be okay? I have to ask Joseph about that one I'm not sure if it's the shirt being on or off is the problem or the other parts Hey, I mean they get to look at a woman A whammon, but yeah, uh the subnets subnets What the hell English was that the subjective nature of the statement implies it's it's an opinion is is what he's saying So you wouldn't need to say it's my opinion if it's obviously subjective now Um, he's like he's like almost he's like using he's he's he's right in certain scenarios He's he's completely wrong in the scenario. He's trying to use it for here. So if I said to you guys Uh, I feel cold And you're in the room and you're like it's clearly hot in this room and I go Well, yeah, I'm saying I feel cold Like I don't have to change my statement because it was already subjective with the word feel I don't have to say I feel cold in my opinion But if if if for example, it was 40 degrees which here like if you Translate it to the incorrect measurement of temperature. That's really hot if I said man, it's cold, huh? It's really cold today Do you think that anybody would be like, oh, well, that's just your opinion, you know Well, but even things like even things like hot and cold and short and tall are relative Yes, generally it's under generally we have we share an understanding that someone who's That someone who's seven feet tall for instance is tall, right? And generally we share the sentiment that even though it's not absolute zero like kelvin negative 200 degrees If it's below zero, it's cold Yeah Is because even though the statement has no formal declaration of an opinion the subjective nature of it is implied So the problem that he's obviously applying this to the somer is not a horror game one as well Because he stands by that. He's about to follow it up though Well, I'm I'm I'm asking does it does this apply uh to that? What do you guys think and that almost comes into a conversation about genre because No, because we have objective criteria for what constitutes a genre He doesn't think so. He thinks the Like the thing is the dictionary does so i'm sorry if he can't read well Like how do I go ahead. I was just gonna say do we have to go to Defining genre on the dictionary and then defining adventure on the dictionary horror on the dictionary and like Well, I think you need to be we all know that there's games that'll do a thing Because that's clearly horror. It has that shared understanding. That's how we know Well, that's the thing Goes both ways Now if and if you wanted to look it up, then it would just confirm that Check out this definition of horror a literary or film genre concerned with arousing feelings of horror So it it is a horror game by definition. So it's a horror game And well the interesting thing is you'd be like feelings of horror So let's look at the other definition of horror that fits in so you'd be a literary or film genre concerned with arousing feelings of intense fear shock or disgust And Right, so it's kind of and the fact that it says concerned with arousing those feelings. It doesn't mean it has to it means it's trying It just has to make the attempt Yes, which is and as far as he's concerned is if the genre does not make you feel those things Then it is not that genre to you subjectively which so if I don't laugh at a comedy A comedy Okay He's hanging he's hanging the genre on the effect and not the attempt which is his mistake Right, and let's let's hear this whole statement out now so that we've covered that someone you owe them an apology Is because even though the statement has no formal declaration of an opinion the subjective nature of it is implied Both by the situation that it's taking place in a casual conversation after seeing a movie and by the basics of communication I know the first part was right the first part was right, but that second part is not right the basics of communication So, uh, I'm gonna what should I call this the list of condescending the list of just I want to say massive fagotry, but I think I might be inclined to agree For the list of Let me say the basics of conversation Yeah, the basics of conversation So joseph anison is extremely condescending in several moments of his videos. I don't think I've ever seen a more condescending video than this one Uh, it was impressive. Let's just hear that again to make sure I got it right This and to be clear here if you have done this to someone you owe them an apology Is because even though the statement has no formal declaration of an opinion the subjective nature of it is implied Both by the situation that it's taking place in a casual conversation after seeing a movie And by the basics of communication Yeah, so you're saying that if you don't understand it's subjective then you don't understand the basics of communication Which is not my fault Not my fault. It's the audience. The it's just so you don't you don't want to say that to your audience when they're having trouble with something You've made you say sorry guys. You just don't understand the basics of communication Get on my fucking level. I'm better than you I keep fucking spelling this word wrong. There's two m's in communication, right? Yeah, yes But uh, no, that's your opinion. That's just your opinion Yeah, because subjectively I think communication is only one because I can only hear one m come communication Anyway, let's keep Applied both by the situation that it's taking place in a casual conversation after seeing a movie and by the basics of communication Everyone knows different people like different things and that no one is actually trying to speak for everyone when they make statements like That movie was really good Right. No, that's wrong. Can What depends depends depends if you just walked out of the room then sure, but if you're making a video called I don't know the room is really good really Then then yeah, what's so wrong about that? Okay, so let me present the issue. I say the haunting of uh hill house. They got it right. Well, I say the haunting of hill house Is good finally and then you guys go Oh, so that's subjective and then I go no I'm actually talking about the the fundamentals of filmmaking in relation to the show and then you go. Oh So that statement what I'm trying to say is that statement can be objective Meaning you need the clarification as long as one person on this planet used it objectively Then now you need to know every time you talk to somebody which one are they going with What's wrong with that good because the thing is we were discussing a while ago what Good means and that isn't a silly question. I know it sounds like people say silly, but it's it's actually Semantically, but when you say that yeah, but when you say something is good The definition that I really like for good is its second definition, which is having the qualities required for a particular role So that's why you can point to a scissors and the um A good scissors is sharp a good. Yes. Yeah. A good scissors is sharp Right or if you if you use a scissors and it's not very and it doesn't cut paper Yeah, because it's too dull Then those scissors are bad. So she is the qualities required for a well for instance for a video game since This is mainly about game criticism um There's probably base standards for a game that we would consider good i.e When you press a button 100 of the time the input happens Like surely surely there are certain things we can agree Are fundamental pre-requisites for being a good game That everybody can agree on funny. We're talking about language by the way And I think the correct term is actually a pair of scissors and scissor I've I've actually heard it the other way maybe I might be using an archaic way because I learned it from a charlie brown comic So that might be the case. I've always said and I know I'd just say a pair of scissors if I'm not saying scissors. I normally say where are I need some scissors. Yeah, yeah You know that would work too, but I but now I Oh, and if you didn't get it already folks who are watching If you're not interested in semantics or pedantry This is not going to be an interesting stream because we this whole thing is a discussion of what words mean Like yeah, yeah, it looks like I'm it looks like I'm using an older Yeah, because the way that I learned it was just Okay, so it you so you would have a scissors blade If you're talking about one of them one of the blades on a pair of scissors is a scissors blade Or just a scissor So Yeah, no anyway Yeah point being he says it's obviously subjective And then it's like no the statement can be objective depending on what would this is the thing I hate to say it but rags has already pointed out good doesn't have one definition Yes, and obviously he's using the primary one which is to be desired, which would obviously be subjective It would be the most I believe it would be the most useful in this scenario because If your definition of good is relating it to desired roles Desired roles essentially we have lists of criteria that we can use to judge it by that standard Yeah, and if someone says oh, I meant good by I like it. It's good for me and you go. Oh, yeah Well, that's subjective Right and you can use it that way, but this is what I mean. You want the clarification. What's so wrong with that? Yeah, and if people ask for clarification, that's okay That's like this whole I know that there are people out there who are thinking that we're being super anal about this But we're responding to a video of someone's being as we're not the ones who told our audience that they don't understand the basics It's always okay, and you see this in debates a lot of the time and stuff It's okay to ask for clarification And on my discord all the time and when i'm talking with people I say what do you mean by that? Yeah And it's and it's okay because if I want some quality because it often helps It really helps when you're arguing about something or debating something or you're trying to get to the bottom of something Um, I was having a chat the other day with somebody who said that doom 2016's multiplayer is not an arena shooter And I asked him really what do you mean by that? What makes it? What about it? How does it not meet the criteria essentially? And he said well because you can choose loadouts And so I said well does the ability to choose a loadout mean it is no longer an arena shooter and obviously the carried out as you might expect but asking questions and having people Answer those questions often makes them think about the things that they've said Making somebody qualify things that they believe Helps to further a conversation and a discussion. What is language for if not what he's just laid out? exactly Anyway, and language isn't perfect. No, it's not English language is especially hilarious So it is okay. That's what's one of the reasons it's so kind of fun and you could play around with it Because it's kind of in a lot of ways it can be very loose and it can also be extremely precise So it just depends on who you're talking to What you're talking to them about and if somebody says can you explain something? You can do that do it And if you don't understand what somebody else is saying Ask them to explain it and besides to say someone doesn't understand the basic communication and then to not actually go over it Like we've just done we I mean you could be like you haven't done that and we'd be like, okay, we're trying Like we're trying to give definitions and explain how things are used instead. He's just like no, I'm right. You're wrong Okay, that's great. Thanks So, uh, move it on Let's go to here Everyone knows different people like different things and that no one is actually trying to speak for everyone when they make statements Like that movie was really good. Yeah, well, yeah Right. No, that's wrong Considering that you're watching this on my youtube channel where I regularly present my opinions in videos I'm sure you know where I'm going with this and you may immediately think that it's not fair to compare statements Man, it's a part of his parody video. I think it's April's one. He's like pretending to be terrible at cuphead because that's That's the mean okay opinions in videos I'm sure you know where I'm going with this and you may immediately think that it's not fair to compare statements made An everyday conversation to those made in a scripted video. Well, that's true But uh, that's very true as he's just said is like my videos have always been this way and it's like, yeah But this this way Is clearly something your viewers weren't aware of or at least don't share with you Yeah, that is that is a defense Uh, that doesn't hold up Because I mean that would be ridiculous to say but this is how we've always done it Joseph anison in all credit to him has made several videos that are very long that have lots of evidence in them Lots of statements of fact lots of objective opinions where he says stuff like This isn't working because of this and shows it Or mario has the broadest move set in super mario odyssey. That's uh, that's not your opinion. That's provable It's yes And he does prove it right implied subjectivity there Well, he does by listing off the moves that you can do is that his opinion or is that Like obviously it's not your opinion, but now you've told me that subjectivity is implied So how am I meant to figure out? Which is which in your videos when you write in a certain way and occasionally say in your opinion, but occasionally don't And if you fail if there are enough people who are convinced or Debating or arguing over what you mean by what you say that means you fail to communicate Yeah, well fail to communicate perfectly, which obviously is a tough fucking thing Yes, perfectly. Yeah, and and we don't expect perfection But when it's like an ongoing discussion as to what did he mean Yeah, maybe work on it And it's fine. It's not like it's not we're not passing moral judgment on you You know, this isn't this is doesn't have anything to do with your character. Maybe how you respond to it more so But oh definitely Yeah, you talking about something especially if it's a complicated subject like imagine how many times philosophy professors and stuff have to repeat things and restate things so that they can get the point across And it's a difference That's just the nature of the beast the difference between describing something as boring and monotonous Or or repetitive the all these words could be used in the same sentence depending on the context But they all mean if you tell me something's boring and I didn't find it boring I'm just like well, that's not true But boring is a feeling so I can assume that you just meant subjectively But what if you said oh no, I meant that it's it's the same thing over and over again It wasn't yeah, I could be like well Why didn't you use monotonous because boring is a feeling You you'd be accurate in saying it's repetitive, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's it's boring And then once again, you'd be like wow, you'd be pedantic and it's like that's language. That's how it works That's what this whole video was made for And he's taken it so far now that he's pissed off A huge majority that's there's enough for him to actually have to address instead of the standard stuff Where if say for example, I did present a whole bunch of uh pieces of evidence And then I said this is just boring someone could be like I didn't find it boring, but I can see why you said it was boring And that's that's usually the benefit you get as a creator But if you do the horror video like he did where it's just poorly researched And then he makes like conclusions and you're just sitting there like I can't even follow you on this He told me that respawning in a horror game means you can't be scared of it And that people have to ignore that you're like what? But um, yeah, well we'll kick on On my youtube channel where I regularly present my opinions in videos I'm sure you know where I'm going with this and you may immediately think that it's not fair to compare statements made an Everyday conversation to those made in a scripted video However, I don't think that's true nor do I think you'd really want that if you fully understood what the result would be Okay Yeah, let's see that a little bit. Oh, what a fucking Faggot We can't get 10 seconds in without him just immediately falling on his face I would never fucking talk to my audience. I know right? I would never I was like I would never tell my audience that I like maybe maybe like in a super joking way about something that's an obvious joke Like this is the best thing ever and if you don't agree that such and such is the best character in this anime Then you're wrong and I hate you or and you don't understand fine art or something Like, you know, obviously something that's hyperbolic as a joke, but to say that His audience unironically of like you wouldn't want that if you understood what it meant just like In the chat Sorry, what hello to cynic snacks in the chat Hello pizza man Um, but yeah, that uh, let's Let's hear what his take is on uh on how that would result So let's demonstrate exactly what's happening The video I released before this one is a great example since there are over a hundred comments on it that address Objectivity versus subjectivity instead of discussing anything brought up in the video. It's almost like you failed to communicate Yeah, how do you not get that? Yes, and you know what that's okay. You could say, you know, that's interesting It's interesting that people are focusing on that Let me make a video about subjectivity versus objectivity and we can have a discussion on it Because this is an object of contention for a lot of people You know, I'm just gonna talk down snarky to my audience I wonder if perhaps there's a reason why people are having this conversation joseph I wonder if it's maybe because you're wrong about it No, he actually does end this video saying maybe I'm wrong and I was just like, oh It's like that guy who like replied to you on twitter And he was like, did you think that shinobi might be right and you and wolf are just terrible people So I go man, I didn't consider that they said if you consider you're full of hate I was like, um, what do you want us to say to that? Yes, we are evil Totally hate that things. All right. I this is a little this this is slightly off topic But somebody just sent me a link to a video of a guy who believes that the season of autumn is a conspiracy and it does not exist I'm not fucking with you. I am not fucking with you. This is a real thing in the chat The season of autumn does not exist Depending on how good it is. We'll throw that on eFap, baby Also, one of the commenters says rice is not a thing. It's also a conspiracy rice. Does it really exist? Rice doesn't exist Rice is Dude rice is just corn but like rolled on a table and repackaged Is like they they want us to believe those tiny ass seeds are grown in big fields and harvested by hand Oh, I waste more than a fields worth of rice every day I open a box of this stuff and it goes everywhere rice is actually just starchy stuff made from potato extract or something They pour it in the seed-shaped mold Dude, that's that's like all the that's like all the the conspiracy theory videos I don't I don't know if I told you this uh, fringy, but when I was gone from youtube I I'd like logged out of my account and everything and I would get the weirdest fucking recommendations for videos ever Between like weird sketchy anime shit. There were all these like Conspiracy theory videos one of them The first one I saw was a guy who like looked at this ancient Like settlements and like the Mayan or Aztec region. I don't know which of the two or maybe it was a third I don't remember but basically he looked at this wall Right and you know how brick walls are made. There's just like a bunch of cobblestones Like, you know laid on top of each other and rose. Well, he found like these these little Divots where there were these circular rocks in between them and he was like Look at how complicated this is. Do you know what this means and everyone with a brain said? Well, it's probably because everyone was stupid 500 years ago and made shit. It doesn't make sense 500 years. It's like 2,000 years older whenever but point still stands. Anyway That's what everyone with a brain thought He came to the to the conclusion Sorry that the reason why the walls were built in the most retarded possible fashion is because humans were actually Super advanced back in the day and then something happened And then we went back. Yeah, look at the walls. We're now we're stupid Yeah, he like literally believes he literally believes that the lore of halo 4 is the way that the world works Have you seen logic to respond to certain people with like zelda proves god and Other things like that. It's like people will believe a lot of stuff Well, the point of all this is that autumn is just your opinion Yeah, well if I'll check that video out if it's like goody fat material, we'll totally throw it on Oh, there's some great ones that you should see the the conspiracy theory videos about how giants created the world and mountains We're just like they're maybe yeah, I've been talking about that before Like they sat on melons and just talked to each other So anyway um Yeah, there's the video we were talking about I think For example says there are over a hundred comments on it that address Objectivity versus subjectivity instead of discussing anything brought up in the video But then there were lots of comments that discussed what was brought up in the video Well, what we're gonna do, right? We're gonna run through about Until he's we're gonna we're gonna play this until he stops showing comments And then we're gonna go all the way back to to this because the we got a new set of comments to read from his audience after this section This is we want to do a his audience's response to this video as well So we'll just let this run until he stops showing comments on screen These are comments that are using a perceived error in presentation as a way to entirely I'm sorry, but that's the shittiest sensor attempt I have ever fucking seen He just took like a white Thingy on paint and just put a white spot on the icons after he took out their names Like look at his little white spots on the icons I don't know why why wouldn't he just do the whole icon? Yeah, like people make this All you had to do all you had to do is just like take A white box that covers up both the profile picture and the name You didn't need to cover up the name and then like go in with a little Can I just put it out there guys like you just read one of these comments load up the comments on his video control Left anything from this and then you'll find these comments like this doesn't protect them Yeah, in fact it does less to protect it doesn't do anything to protect them Because you wouldn't find them via their name any way you'd find them via the fucking control laughing the words I mean, yeah, these people make these comments Like publicly on youtube because they believe them. Why would you want them to be anonymous? Why would he just go through the effort to break out his fucking wakum towel? Just scribble a little bit over each one. Like I always thought it was pronounced wake him Wacom I don't Wacom is what I say, but I don't know Wacom I thought it was wake. I don't I don't know Oh, so yeah, autumn isn't real Wait, someone said more of those are generic circles with the letters of the yeah We're saying the the the white blobs Clearly his attempt to cover them And it's weird. It's like, why wouldn't you just cover the whole thing? Yeah, no because you might find out that j Right, that could be j j made a comment on a joseph anderson video and I will hunt down every purple j You could you would faster find him by just control f thing these words like it doesn't it doesn't do shit Let him know that j made this Purple google j was He was clearly using his his wacom tablet and it just that's what it went with okay It makes total sense. But yeah, let's try and get through this bit because like I said, we got some comments Could just imagine like liam neeson showing up at j's doorstep and he's like I saw your comment I don't know if your name is jason or john or jeremiah. I don't know but i'm here for you I don't know who you are. I don't know what you want But i'm going to fucking kill you If you think you can continue to comment on videos you are sadly mistaken. These are comments dude. Look at that one Is that commander shepard's face I think so Why did he color in the note? He started out so good with that first one. It's almost like a shape At the bottom. He's just like a fucking spooky go Why would he even bother it's like it's like he almost didn't want to cover up the rest of it See I knew it was commander shepard Oh These are comments that are using a perceived When that we really feel what he says, aren't we? It's gonna be all right. All right, everyone just close your eyes for a moment Okay Directivity instead of what's the fucking point of censoring the other ones if you don't censor these He's just showing all of these David Bowie sama sensei It's j man. Oh no. Oh wait j man. Yeah, I recognize that name Oh, he's he's less purple than before Oh The j Oh, that's That's okay, man Because i'm assuming the principle is I block their names out so they can't be targeted. It's like This if anyone is going to go in search of someone who commented on a video to harass them There are weird people out there. There are weird people sure You're not gonna you're not gonna block out his name. He's like your top comment is Oh, wow. Yeah, I didn't know he commented on it and Reykjavik Wait, wasn't this the example of comments that didn't get the point Did he's saying he didn't get the point? Well, these are these are totally different comments though because I guess but So I could find out where they live. Look at that one at the bottom. Okay, joseph. Are you with me here? This is easily the worst video you have ever made All right, let's do it. What's no no pausing or comments until he gets to the end of showing the comments We can do this Comments on it that address objectivity versus subjectivity instead of discussing anything brought up in the video These are comments that are using a perceived error in presentation as a way to entirely dismiss any points There's no need to argue anything when you can just say sometimes self-righteously Stop presenting your opinions as objective facts. Oh, he's gonna look at us. I'm thinking self-righteous everyone Stop mixing facts and opinions together. This has been a problem since the first okay So that he said it now and there's so many ways to break this section down But the first one we're gonna run with is uh people actually responding to this so Rags if you go to duttle is the first one Okay Duttle chat if someone in the chat said troll or not a troll You can see that about every video we've covered Okay Well, duttle says This video feels somewhat mean spirited considering many of the comments you're defending against were earnest and made a fair argument That at points you did seem to project your opinion on objective statements And that the general underlying statements in your horror video are less sophisticated than your usual style Admitting some degree of error isn't bad and the overall tone here is really patronizing Not to mention the broad sweeps here border on strawmanning some of the original commenters on the horror video Interesting let's pop to the next one Domanthus said Great, some people took the easy way out with the mopinion argument I can respect calling them out on it Now go and make a video addressing the top five comments that actually point out why you were wrong And don't pretend that any of them were that subjective because they aren't And finally Matthew Matthew says Me and many other commenters were trying to give you criticism on the last video But I see you have just brushed it all aside I think that says a lot about how you handle criticism These past couple of videos have been sloppy and rushed You make good videos when you take your time and do adequate research on the topic You do try to pass off your opinions as facts with manipulative language It's on you to write a good script and tell the audience when you're being objective and when you're being subjective You can't expect your audience to not have a problem with you expressing your feelings as facts You state both in the exact same way This is a very common tactic people use to persuade people Subjectivity is not always implied relative isn't is actually what's harming debate You also come across as very condescending in this video and I would recommend knocking that off And so that's it for them uh the The general consensus is people are not happy with how he's just summed up the response from his audience, which Doesn't fucking surprise me considering he did just brush them all away like Don't you just don't fucking understand language or writing This is why we're gonna have to go through this bit a couple of times because there's so many different Just you're such an asshole is the response to a lot of this But the fucking accent he puts on to portray his audience where he's like you don't understand what It's like Joe you sound like a five-year-old doing an evil bad voice This is all a wonderfully bad argument for what inspires fear in people in general of Jesus I also love that people are Distinctively understanding this based on the comments Although if this is your source of why you feel scared or even horrified by a game all power to you man Wonderfully bad argument for what inspires fear and people well This is the thing a lot of people felt that he just did not understand what makes people scared in games Like he he just it just showed no empathy and it was just like he didn't really try he didn't explore anything So that's one of the bigger problems. Yeah, I think the third comment there is pretty interesting Chaos blade says so many people saying he's not stating a fact He's stating his opinion. Look the title of the video is why horror games don't scare me So it's all just his opinion But in the video you say quote this is where I conclude that most horror games aren't truly scary But are instead horror themed. Yeah, that sure sounds like an opinion He probably would say that's his opinion honestly He'd be like well, it's just my opinion Yeah, whatever he even says this is where I conclude x So this next run through right We'll listen to what he says And then the final run through we'll see what the actual comments say in relation to what he says But just listen to what he says this time anything brought up in the video These are comments that are using a perceived error in presentation as a way to entirely dismiss any points There's no need to argue anything when you can just say sometimes self-righteously Stop presenting your opinions as objective fact Stop thinking Jesus christ, man, you know what I mean? You know what I mean? That's so bitter No self-awareness None You speak for everyone stop that voice that voice Oh Who are you? Who are you trying to sound like? What is that voice? Where where is this question from? We haven't gotten to it yet, but uh He's not showing the comments that he's speaking. Do you know what I mean? He's like We're trying to figure out where we're in the comment. He's at but if we tackle it without comments So if we tackle his argument here, which is let me just listen to it again to make sure I got it And as a way to entirely dismiss any points There's no need to argue anything when you can just say sometimes self-righteously Stop presenting your opinions as objective fact Stop you don't have to argue anything if you just say it's my opinion stop mixing facts Um, also, that's another one. He's just called as fucking people in his audience self-righteous, which is like great Yeah, you're one to talk Uh, and yeah, I'm just trying to catch they're using a perceived error as a way to entirely dismiss his argument, I think would entirely dismiss The basically he's accusing his his commenters now Of choosing the whole subject of his objectives to ignore everything he's saying which As you've already seen in the comments if that's all they were saying the comments wouldn't even be that long would they Like there's a lot more to it than that Facts and opinions together This has been a problem since the first video that I'm all right. So now this time we'll actually look at the fucking comments because When you put them up that fast sometimes you'll miss what they actually say These are comments that there's a there's one comment where the profile picture Like you only see the outline of the circle and everything else is white And it's like you had to get so precise to do that And all you had to do was just put a box over it. Spooky ghost is my favorite My favorite too spooky ghost shepherd is Oh, I want that to be a shirt My name is commander shepherd and this is my favorite ghost on youtube This video is honestly pretty bad So while you start off on the route of subjectivity you quickly detour into objective statements And you'll notice that that's cut off Um because the rest of his argument doesn't continue that way and I Fucking for some I I got the snap of it and I was talking to I think it might have been rags about this Because obviously I had to do some prep here in case I got some things wrong It's the last thing I need to do and talk about fucking semantics But I have not I can't find where I had that snapshot up from now, but the Basically if you go and find this comment that starts with this video is honestly pretty bad Um The rest of the argument moves on to specifics in the video I believe the comment even ends with him making a direct comment about the video and what joseph's talking about right now is um The idea that people were basically just saying you're presenting objective statements as with subjective Argumentation bad and it's like this. They're doing more than that joseph Even in the ones you've cherry-picked they're doing more than that Can't ghost milk wet steel people? People are saying that ghost milk is better than rhino milk, but I don't know I love how the chat is all just ghosts and rhinos Rhinos and milk Ghost milk is better than rhino milk Have you ever tried to milk a ghost Ghost of a rhino, how about that does joseph is quintin I'm sorry joseph your videos are so terrible that we're more interested in what the chat's doing than you We're amused by ghosts and rhinos Rhinos and milk And you know if someone just jumps into this stream and like sees this right now They're gonna see us laughing and they're not gonna understand any of They don't get this 15 15 episodes of lore for them to absorb first Yeah, 15 episodes in like 31 hours worth of lore to figure out Dude dude if we and we've got 15 episodes That's I mean like four hours an episode that's like 60 hours You'll get to a point where there's a new one There'll be a more content than a general game There'll be a point where there's a newborn baby who can't actually absorb all of e-fap because it's just too long Before they're dead Did you know if someone was a baby was born today and listened to all the e-faps They would have to listen for 98 years before Anyway, so so yeah So he's saying that the main main thing people were missing here was they were like Oh, it's just presenting your opinions as a personal experiences objective And it's like some of these comments go further than that So he's got the first one which cuts off a large portion of the bonus part of the argument The second one which says he acts like the purpose of scary media Is to literally put you in a fear for your life Which you know, there's there's so many elements to horror as a genre. They're not all about making you fear for your life. For example Uh, Lovecraftian is is more so about making you fear for your position in the universe as opposed to Your life being in danger. Um Yeah, and then there's the existential ones from horror as well from soma. That's not specifically about making you fear for your life It's more like what is life and how feeding everything is life. What am I what makes me what I am? Are you in my my body and my my memories? What am I? Are more of me it's yeah, so yeah, so there's more there than simply saying But he does say it in the second sentence, but it's like seems like you ignored the first one there Joseph Um, and then you got you're so determined to state your personal experiences fact for everyone You can use the same logic to argue that games will always be more scary than movies and again So it's the first part sure. That's what you said it was Joseph But what about the second sentence? What do you have to say to that in response? You can use the same logic to argue that games will always be more scary than movies It's easy How do you reconcile that in your head when you're saying that movies scare you more than games? Like um, have you guys heard the argument of like, you know No horror movie could ever be scary more than once because you know how everything turns out Yeah, it's like if someone told me that I'd be like, well, yeah You know, I I tend to get invested again when I watch horror movies that really do scare me Um, maybe less scary. Yeah. Yeah, I would imagine that's probably gonna happen for a lot of people Yeah, I like they're really big jump scare and hail house. You know the one I'm talking about more I mean, I probably next time I watch through the series I'll be like expecting it but I mean that doesn't take away from the tension and anxiety that the show makes you feel the whole time Yeah, that's just the three so let's see what what's next they're using a perceived error in present He only really pays lip service to the idea that it's just his opinion He repeatedly insinuates that everyone else has just misinterpreted their own feelings Now that one isn't even what he was saying the whole it's just objective presented a subject if this guy's actually accusing him of Saying that other people have misunderstood the experience and the example of that would be when he's uh talking about how Like like people could be more scared than they realize and I think it's more because of when he said Most horror games aren't really horror games. They're just basically pretending Yeah, and how people have to give more to horror to get immersed in other stuff He's like he's just declared that that's the case Yeah, I feel like when joseph said that when people are afraid of something and they say this scared me and that That's a horror game. It scared me. He's like no No, you you just yeah, you might think that you were scared, but really it was just you know Presentation as a way to oh and uh Then you got except a lot of the points He makes the statements are not prefaced with I believe or in my experience or something along those lines He does sometimes but they're so few and far between this is more of a general review than a personal one Just from the way he worded it which Is that not a fake comment? Well, he's gonna address that one uh later in this video. So in But again, um It's just that it just comes down to semantics at this point Which is as we've said if everybody's having this much of a problem with it Then maybe you need to do something about it instead of telling them. They're listening wrong Um just because it's his opinion doesn't mean he can't make terrible arguments Which he most likely did in this entire video besides the the opinion piece narrative is just a facade Once you actually read between the lines of what he's actually saying throughout the video I have to agree with that comment But yeah, he's selected a couple here that do represent the whole um They didn't have to address his arguments in the video instead. They just addressed the presentation But the problem is He said that that was a way for them to uh entirely dismiss his argument When in reality that they're making an argument against his argument in the what he's arguing objectively cannot be Considered valid evidence because it's subjective he hasn't He doesn't care about that because of his den definition definition of um Well subjectivity and opinions and all that So he's not taking it well If you use phrase like I think and I believe more often or stating his opinion as fact then I bet people would be less harsh that's Possible may you lose the opinion title once you start making definitive statements in a manner to pass your subjective opinion as objective fact Like so must not a horror game Um, and then you go I'm insulting him because he's going the downward thrust direction of stating opinions as facts and trying to use Objectivity to justify his claims. It's all vapid and nonsensical But he tries to pass it off as an opinion as opinion while using fake facts fake facts Like fake news. I'm confused. Why are the lower two comments like indented? Because they're replying to somebody else and he whited the name out Oh, okay Uh to try and bolster his argument that if you can respawn. It's not horror This is the same guy who said mario odyssey is a boring and is boring in three hours or so And now spends 13 minutes trashing an entire genre of gaming Do you not see the point or do I have to spell it out for you? Not only was he wrong about mario odyssey He's a moron for trying to use subjectivity as the crutch of his argument with false objectivity I've always found that interesting that he spent three hours on a game Then he spent 13 hours on a genre a 30 sorry three hours on a game 13 minutes on a genre And now he spent 14 minutes on the fundamentals of discussion Yes, it's a little bit interesting, isn't it so like you might want to reconsider how you sort of Maybe maybe put a bit more research and effort into this particular topic because man This is like a huge one that a lot of people are very concerned with I don't know Most youtubers probably wouldn't feel the need to make a video addressing just this It's really complicated and you know How long has it taken us to get this far to make sure that everyone's following along with More essentially the rules or the rules we follow anyway for language Takes a while to be sure if you throw in a few spooky ghosts and rhinos though it does sort of delay it up a bit Yeah Wait, there's no need to argue anything when you can just say It's just you know, we'll we'll let these three go. I'm just like it's unbelievable how he's not Been shaken by this the amount of people who've been like The middle comment is a good one though daily reminder that having opinion in the title and sprinkled for the video Makes you think you can get away with pedantic shit like soma isn't a horror game He's gonna keep coming back to that for him sometimes self-righteous Stop presenting. Yes. You look like that's the that's the did you see the the profile picture that was like all white except for the outline Oh, yeah, yeah That's did he color that all in I don't know Why'd you put so much effort into that one? Man listen, not every not every censor mark can be a ghost man As objective fact Also, look at look at these comments. They're huge. There's no way. They're just saying that Stop thinking you speak for everyone I'll never get to that People were talking that comment Stop speak a ghost if you're talking to everyone Justly stop presenting your opinions as objective fact Stop thinking you speak for everyone. Stop mixing facts and opinions together This has been a problem. Like if this was always a problem, then why wasn't it um as why is it more significant now than ever? and um How is it that you would assume that it would be just from YouTube or just from you making game analysis? Like wouldn't this be a fundamental of communication anyway? If all if people all of a sudden start bringing up a certain issue with my content, then i'll be like, oh, what happened? What did I do jennison? How long do the geetuck to individually colorate all of those? What's the point? What look at the fucking top one? It's like She's like two different spots on it. That's gotta be a troll There's no way he did that like what's the point because it blocks out his face. Look at it And whatever he's holding too Oh, is that the person holding something? But some of these he blocked the ones out that just had the generic fucking Yeah, like one of the bottom is just like clearly a picture of a bird and he blocked out its head For a second there I was like maybe he's doing it to block out anything that could identify someone's face But then he's done it to just generic photos So I don't know what are you like letters? Yeah, like stop He did it to jay not jay man, but he is a jay How dare you do that to jay? He's a good man Weird Um since the first video that I made on dark souls It is a problem for other content creators and for people who don't make videos But simply want to discuss things online. It's also an issue that is getting weirder as time passes He missed it's an issue that's getting weirder as time passes I wonder I kind of remember that when I first watched this. How does he qualify that getting weirder as time passes for some Subjectivity is the problem. What are the chats actual name is jay? Oh wait, yeah, yeah, since it's name is actually jay, so No, it's not him. It's someone was saying that his name is jay as well though Dark souls isn't a game. I didn't play it So it works, but it's an issue that is getting weirder as time passes for some subjectivity is the problem not objectivity These comments do the exact same thing except this time the fact that I'm presenting Opinions is what's being used to sweep away any needs to argue points being made. Is that a fact that you're presenting opinions? He needs to prove this so it grabbed me for wrong But he's just said that some people are saying that The fact that he's Saying feelings means that there's that they don't they can't argue like working about it that it's invalid or something But it The thing is It could be depending on what you say So if I made a video called why horror doesn't scare me and then I just go Outlast doesn't scare me soma doesn't scare me amnesia doesn't scare me There's no horror movie that scares me. Anyway, thanks guys. Please visit the patreon And see you next time and then they go that was shit all you did was present you fucking You know feelings and then I go wow so you don't like subjectivity. Those are my but those are my opinions Those are my feelings. Exactly. So it depends on what he presented and there's a lot of crazy shit in his horror video Same thing except this time the fact that I'm presenting opinions is what's being used to sweep away any Needs to argue points being made in the video or the article. This is also So you got much like a subnautica review this is too flavored in personal preference to be useful This tells us more about you than being any help with a good idea I think that's fair the idea being that if you're an analysis channel, you'll I don't know about you guys, but like people will be like, oh, thanks. I've actually learned something Yeah, a review when you when you make a review. It's not for you It's for everyone who watches the review I mean it'd be weird to upload it if you were intending it only to work for you, isn't it? like well Yeah, I mean the fact that you're publishing it to the world means you want what a hero And sort of unintentionally perhaps means you're inviting people to respond to it Yeah, I mean ideally you can't learn anything from your own review Uh, if you make a video blog on how you feel about certain things do not criticize anything for fuck's sake Only because you're some marginal person with a bizarre perspective If you are the problem talk about your problem not about how the industry gets it wrong. What a deluded lunatic That is a a bit of a reaction sure, but the the fact is that he does He does imply that the the problems in the genre and it's like Joseph You don't like it doesn't mean it's a problem. It's more complicated than that Also, you're gonna have to censor better because I know that's clearly satan who made that made that comment You're just gonna have to work better. Well, someone said, uh, it's a meme on the internet that you block out the eyes That's all this is this like but he's clearly blocking out different amounts of things on everything Yeah It's extremely inconsistent It's just funny. You can see where he went to paint and just a little squiggle Subjective so why discuss it? This is just your subjective opinion. So that middle one. What the fuck's going on with that one? Uh It must we even try to figure out what it's like a butterfly A butterfly ghost I expect to see butterfly ghost milk emojis in the Chat Discuss it. This is just your subjective opinion. So who cares god Who said that? What is this? What is this voice that is doing? If I can piss you off that every It's just like Oh my subjective view Just stop it. Stop it I just I want to know who out there thinks that the subjective opinions aren't worth discussing people are actually putting I didn't know there was a butterfly emoji. I didn't know they could do it Oh, there's a milk emoji That's it. This is just your subjective opinion. So who cares Personal subjective views aren't worth discussing. Who said that? Let's see if it's on screen. Let's see if it's on screen. Maybe um Uh Well, somebody says I don't feel I feel this doesn't need to be analyzed, especially since it's such a Objective thing that belongs to you. You can't be immersed Yeah, yeah, that's I think that's fair. It contextually it's Based on the video. Yes, uh Well, they said it doesn't need an analysis because it's such a it's a thing that specifically happens to him So why even bother trying to like explain it on an any objective level when you could just sum it up as I don't get immersed because you die in horror games and come back You could have just said that and this has the same value because the rest of it's fucking nonsense Yeah, man, that's not the same thing as personal opinions aren't worth discussing Yeah, that's not what that guy said Despite using reasons that are literally the opposite of each other these comments. It's just it's a bad faith translation of it Also, did you catch that? Listen to the the next bit of a little condescension there by using reasons that are literally the opposite of each other These comments are identical get out of jail free cards for people who disagree with something being presented to So he said that is that's funny That's really funny. These comments directly contradict themselves. Are they being used as a get out of jail free card? It's just like can you wonder why his co-ed sectional like screw you at this point? Jesus Christ. I would never talk to my audience like that um And this is the thing if you responded to specific comments and these things were true You could at least have that but he's painting such a broad brush with these guys Also, I kind of I don't even know I was gonna write this in my the list of mf, but I don't even know how to sum it up it's like these comments on Dicts themselves and What does he say function out of get out of jail free card for what exactly? Comments are identical get out of jail free cards for people who disagree with something being presented to them Or get out of discussion free cards Get out of discussion free cards Because that's what everybody wants, right Yeah, the people who come to your comment section and write out these paragraphs About how they feel they want discussion get out of jail free cards That's what they want Why waste time thinking of counterarguments when you can just do this instead? It's easy Wow Joseph what are you doing man agree with something being presented to them or get out of discussion free cards Why waste time thinking of counterarguments when you can just do this instead? It's easy It just works Most of you are probably thinking this is a bizarre reaction Unfortunately, it's becoming more and more common and I feel like no, that's a that's a funny thing He thinks that we would think is the audience that he's highlighting bizarre reactions from the audience while we're like Yes, you are having a bizarre reaction, joseph. Yeah, that's a thing. You're the one who's having the bizarre reaction But no no self-awareness like but Someone said that attitude got trump elected lol Our reaction unfortunately, it's becoming more and more common and I feel like I have to address it If anything just so I don't have to keep saying the same things time and time again when I speak to people about my videos if anything joseph you've made it even more complicated and Confusing for your audience in future now people will be even more confused about what you they'll go forward Be like so with subjectivity implied at this point in your new review and you'll have to be like Yes It's not implied if they have to ask It would have been better if he just redid his horror video With all of this in mind, then it would be for him to try and Keep digging that hole. I guess First off, man Or he could just not make videos on horror since he clearly doesn't know what he's talking about Ideally yes, I mean if you have like no emotional connection to the the content maybe Just leave it alone because it's not for you and you're not gonna have Yeah, I'm not gonna review rom-coms because they're not my thing That doesn't mean they're objectively terrible More complicated doesn't mean you can shit out an entire genre That's the other thing there was so many pieces of evidence that were like but he hasn't he hasn't played this then Or he hasn't played that and you're like, oh, yeah when you make statements about genre You better be fucking accurate because there's a lot in a genre Things time and time again when I speak to people about my videos First off, it's vital to make it clear that objective opinion pieces do not exist This is an oxymoronic demand. Wow. So our channels don't exist mauler. Well, we're not real I'm pretty sure he has made an objective opinion. Maybe not an objective opinion piece Because does that imply the entire video would be objective? So None of us are real. This video isn't real. This stream isn't real We aren't real. What what is the world are we is the simulation theory? Correct Well, this come I mean, I was just gonna say this comes down to the beginning of our video We were talking about definitions. He thinks yeah, if you're objective are you real Mr. Buller, I don't feel is a ghost milk real objective just doesn't mean The objective just essentially means that it isn't hinged on it on on opinions. That doesn't mean it can't be part of one Mr. Wolf, I don't feel so good We were oxymoronic at this point that objective opinion pieces do not exist This is an oxymoronic demand. You are asking for the conversational equivalent of hot frozen ice cream You're just not gonna get it It's that simple guys. That's the explanation. You can deep fry ice cream. That's true Would that be hot cold ice cream? I don't know. I've never had deep fried ice cream If your desire is a video of only objective facts Then you are asking for a dry list of mechanics and low level terminology that has Oh You are asking for low level, what did you say low level? terminology Terminology, Jesus Christ. So that what so when I listen to a video about science and it's presented in an in a fun and entertaining way Oh, because it's no longer objective. Yeah. Oh my god, Jesus The lindy beige video that tells me about why this is this and why that is that Oh, it can't be entertaining. It's all dry by the way Um, there's there's youtubers. What would be ahoy? It was what I'd reference it by comment who is very objective with his analysis and he's got a voice like this And it's awesome to listen to um He's not dry at all The irony joseph of you being like if you do this you'll end up is let me let me do better If you do this you'll end up reading it dry That's just you man That's because you're dry. I can I present objective facts and I think I do it in an entertaining and interesting way Well, I think I think I think all four of us can do that. I think joseph Well, no, he couldn't he can't even make subjective arguments without sounding completely dull remember all the times he tried to make jokes Oh, that's the thing his voice is kind of like oh, I don't want to listen to you very long Well, I mean this is definitely a subjective complaint from me But uh, I tried to watch his game game of thrones god of war video And uh, I got so bored just because of his delivery and it's not even that it's got bad content I was just like come on come on sound like I can listen to matthew matosis for hours And I have I gotta do a lot of people for hours. I can listen to you guys for probably hours I just I need some hours and hours. I need some lifeblood in there sound like you actually give a shit Yeah, joseph your videos don't sound like you give a fuck If you think that if you if if he thinks that if you if if you're trying to give objective information That it necessarily will be dry and you lose and use low level terminology Like damn Why did he say that? Why did he say low level? What planet do you live on where objective facts are only given in dry low level terminology? Oh School You are asking for a dry list of mechanics and low level terminology that has been carefully vetted for any hints of opinion or subjective leanings Wrong talk about how a game Wrong Jesus, I think it should be self evident How it's ridiculous to say that I mean, how many youtubers have you guys watched that have a mix of objective facts and opinions in them? That's what we do Like exactly my videos aren't 100% I'd say that's what most youtubers do That's how it works We we go with we present information as research and then we often will offer conclusion That's based on how we felt about it or or natural conclusion I show you a bunch of hitboxes that are broken at ds2. I conclude some of the hitboxes at ds2 are broken That's just What was the fucking emotion in that exactly? Someone says matt's irish accent makes listening to him a spiritual and sexual experience I mean, I'm not Oh, unfortunately, I don't think you would but I mean, that would be awesome He has actually got a slightly different take to objective on on even to us He said in a q&a It does exist But you can only go as far as very very tertiary elements like you can't even describe environments You can only describe like Straight-up clinical facts about a thing like character names and stuff And the thing is I just like let me talk to you about it because I want to see how you react when I say something like A character is inconsistent because they chose to do x or they value x and then they do y and it's like Is that objective or is that based on how I feel? And I just want to see how he reacts because a lot of people and this is absolutely no criticism of methamatosis But a lot of people would be like I haven't really thought about it that way You know and that's fine because again the words we're using not everybody uses For some reason some people have different fucking definitions that they make 14 minute videos ranting against their audience about so It would be interesting, but I don't think matt does that. I don't think he sort of Comes on to conversations and stuff, but again, it would be cool Um, this is interesting. Iggy the koopa says joseph is a robot That's why he actually hates soma because it hits him on a personal level He marginalized his people um Yeah, I guess we'll push on We'll go back a little bit There is a video of only objective facts And you are asking for a dry list of mechanics and low-level terminology that has been carefully vetted for any Failure in your part or subjective leanings We can talk about how a game may have a sprint function a jump button and a death system But we can't make any statements about how well they work and only the bear Yes, you can Of course we can so if the game is broken How can we I just came it's bizarre. It really is The game has a jump spot, but it doesn't work 50 percent of the time. That's bad. Oh, wait. No, that's No, you can't you can't talk about that fringy. Remember he's it's all subjective Even though we could sit him down and say here's the here's the definition of good Right and here is the definition. Here's a video game and what it does This is why when you press a jump button and it only works 50 percent of the time That is not good Here read this. Yes. This is objective. It's not good Oh my god, I I give up the room is just as good No, I don't know alien You know, uh Right to hell Just as good as the first mass effect game, you know, green is brown black is blue Uh, I To be fair to be fair colors are subjective in um Water is wet in his comment the section in my comment. My example was Hitbox, what is a hitbox designed to do? It's like it's designed to match the model and create damage or whatever to the player if they were to strike the The model on the thing so the the closer you are to the model Uh, the the better the hitbox is more accurate. So if your hitbox is lazily done It there this is contextual as well It depends on say for example, if you have like um a trail behind the sword or something And if you hit the trail you get damaged too, then the hitbox would have to change But let's assume We're dealing with a straight up sword and it swings and it's got a big rectangle as the box But the the developers were lazy and they just didn't shave it down and they kept it to Two two times the size of the sword because it was like a fuck it whatever And so you have several examples of you being hit when the sword isn't even near you and you're just like this is great Because now my perception of what counts as dodged versus not I can't even rely on the fact that it's a model I have to now uh compensate For the badly leveled hitbox And then you get to Dark Souls two levels where you can get hit from behind somebody when they attack in front of them Because the hitboxes are so fucked in that game and You know bad what I mean by bad is inconsistent or bad to a standard the standard of making hitboxes Which is to match the models the whole fucking point people use them So When you have hitboxes, they're outside of the models and they're creating gameplay in which the player is punished for no reason of their own That is bad And that is bad functionality Or should I just say inconsistent functionality if people would prefer that and you should be like you can't talk about How well these things work it's like I just did And what part of that had my emotions in it if you want to highlight it's like Another part where you said you didn't like it or something No This is like a you can get really clinical with uh with games or filmmaking development and uh even with books Even with writing You can do it to joseph's video or my videos or rags. It's the wolf's or friends No guys, we we got to just give it all up the phantom menace is just as good as the Shawshank redemption joseph's right We've been wrong this whole time Subjectivity is the way the truth and the light god Something I don't know. He sounds so depressed revelation 114 I'll fucking I mean, I just don't know how you can be this stupid. I genuinely It breaks my brain Have a sprint function a jump button and a death system But we can't make any statements about how well they work And only the barest of comparisons to other games that have similar things without flirting with the dreaded o word opinion Um, my my ask my question would be why why do you think that? Yeah Like why is it that that's how it works You have one game that when you die it sends you back to a checkpoint and the checkpoints are every half an hour And other game does it every 20 minutes You can talk about the effects of those you lose less progress But what's happening in each game that would change how important those last pieces of time are These are all things I haven't used an emotion yet. Are you following joseph? You could do this is this is the thing if you follow this to its natural conclusion All games could be equally as good or bad as each other That's absurd And then you come to acts like that. What is the point of teaching these things? What's the point of even talking about it if it doesn't matter and Fundamentally everything is the same or not the same or it's whatever you want it to be Like there are certain classes where if you presented the idea like I said my foundational art class I know that if you'd said this to the teacher That my stickman drawing is better than that person's extremely well shaded an acut drawing He would just be like it's not shut the fuck up like get on with actually getting better And they'd be like, how dare you it's subjective It's hard that it'd be like how much you like it is subjective, but how good it is It's not subjective how accurate you'd be like what's the standard and you immediately go the fucking comparison to the actual person If you're doing a self-portrait, that's the obvious standard Yeah, what takes talent time effort skill all these things get thrown out the fucking window when you say everything's subjective Fuck it stick figures forever stick figures on a sistine chapel You guys know that van Gogh is no better than the diary of a wimpy kid books Stick figures on the sistine chapel It's all the same He's like a really badly drawn smile. It's like a wibbly wobbly Like you know that woman who tried to restore that jesus picture and she fucked it up She she didn't make it worse It's all the same Step aside Da Vinci deviant arts in town Act even those words I just used sprint jump and death could be called into question if true objectivity is the goal Okay, all right So now he's saying because words could have a different definition I assume that it's no longer technically objective Because you could be referring to two things at once is that the argument there or is he talking about something else? I think he's trying to say that If just the idea of a sprint function in a game is subjective And death in a video game isn't literal death. So it's subjective. It doesn't actually refer to a mechanic That's inside of the game that can be measured repeated If you want to get to that point then just have to let your audience know that by death I mean the point in which your character is sent back to a checkpoint Yeah, but but that's like you have that's like going back to brain in a vat levels. Well, yeah Improve it. So fuck it. Like do you have no what exactly are you expecting your audience to interpret death in a video game as Like do you think people in the comments section are actually going to go you don't actually die in a video game Joseph that's a bit of an extreme example It's like nobody's gonna do that Well, you can never say that there's always somebody Maybe somebody in the chat now is that the other you go death is subjective Used sprint jump and death could be called into question if true objectivity is the goal These videos and articles would be like extensions of video game manuals except even those can have more character Conversely, if your desire is a video of subjective opinions that speak for an acceptable minimum amount of people that Already hold that opinion, then you don't know how discussions are meant to function We've been talking to each other wrong guys. We can't possibly be friends of the state We don't know how discussion works What world does joseph live in It's like it's like somebody built a A disfunctioning automaton robot synth and it's trying to lecture us on what it is to be human You guys don't get it The robots in near autotoma have more personality than joseph does Joseph why? Yeah, death is objectively a preferable alternative to coming Death is objectively a preferable alternative to watching a joseph anderson video Everyone on this This is this is he was just setting us up for the real horror video Amount of people that already hold that opinion, then you don't know how discussions are meant to function No opinion is truly worthless videos like mine are Okay, wait wait wait my opinion is that the earth is a pancake All just the chocolate chips on that giant pancake is so much to take away from that statement truly worthless What does truly mean? What are you? Oh, what is it? What is this weird salad joseph? No opinion is truly worthless Well, it's my opinion that oxygen is an animal. It's trapped inside a clown Maybe he should take his own advice with all the comments because those aren't truly worthless I just don't I don't know why do you even feel the need to make this statement that no opinion is truly worthless And then what does it mean? What what is so yeah? What does that mean? That's one of those things where if he was here I'd be like, what do you mean by that? Is like what someone just said is isn't the worth of an opinion subjective? I I suppose it's like it's like it's like this thing is true by its own definition. It's a pointless sentence It's like it's like saying the color red is the color that it is My response would be joseph say what you've just said again without using any of the words You just used find a different way of sharing whatever the hell your idea is Because I don't know what the fuck that just meant No opinion is truly worthless like sure But why say that? What's the point of even saying that function? No opinion is truly worthless videos like mine are not meant to be a source of confirmation bias Most content creator, but they certainly operate that way depending on what you're doing My people finding out that I had done This channel called more that did a video ripping into the last Jedi and an angry British man voice If they hate the film, they will like shit, man. I'll watch that It's like why because they hated the film the confirmation bias. It's like they're not supposed to act that way What does it doesn't change the fact that they'll absolutely be used that way? I don't know But why are we talking about this now? Like Sometimes I just want to watch a video talking about how shit fallout 76 is because I find it entertaining Mm-hmm Worthless videos like mine are not meant to be a source of confirmation bias Most content creators do not put up their videos all giddy thinking. Oh golly. Gee. I can't wait to see how many people agree with me While that it's kind of funny to hear. I'm trying to emulate emotion Oh golly gee Oh golly gee You like to think if like his family was like Kidnapped he just be like, oh, no Oh, however, do I get them back? It's like it'll cost a thousand for your sister and he's like How much is that in american? I mean canadian subjectively How much is a thousand dollars in your mind? subjectively Eventually the kidnappers just give up and they're like I take your fucking family back He's like I've captured your family. He's like, yeah, it's just your opinion What is it to capture family? What is it to have? how bio To hold to have to secure contain first we need to define We need to define what capture means Sleep loop Be thinking. Oh golly. Gee. I can't wait to see how many people agree with me While that can be a good thing depending on the topic there. Why is he talking about this like? Yeah, people don't use my video off on its own. This is kind of going off on its own little thing So he said my video isn't meant to be used as confirmation bias, but it can The video is not released like many in a way that's like I can't wait for people to agree. It's like Yeah, I agree with both of these statements Technically speaking. Where are we going with this? Primary purpose is to encourage discussion whether you agree or disagree It should give you something to think about. I agree with that statement I do not agree with the idea that that's what your fucking horror video was doing Because if it was you wouldn't have made this one This is exact The discussion was born from that video because it sucked. Yeah, you've got a discussion from it, mate It's just not the one you wanted And now you've had to tell people how to have the discussion properly Yeah, it's so fucking. Oh, it's Oh, it's like a skit. I can't believe it. We're five minutes out of 14 Right five minutes out of 14 and we've got one two three four five six seven eight nine elements of condescension That's bad. See how many more we can fit in The most troubling implication of statements like personal subjective views aren't worth discussing is the idea that if opinions aren't Who said that? No one said that Nobody said that and even if they did why are you acknowledging them because they would have been somebody with like one upvote Yeah, like that's a retarded thing to say. Why are you even uh like Jesus man, like it's um, yeah, why are you wasting your time? Do you need our approval? Like we'll give it to you. You can talk about subjective Opinions. That's fine. If this was my video and I found a comment that said that or if that occurred in my head That somebody would say that and like no people don't actually think that that's not gonna waste my time talking about that That's not something people think Objective views aren't worth discussing is the idea that opinions aren't meant to change This is also seen when opinions are used as a shield or presumed to be used as one People have also That's you That's what you sound like not you, but it is you to change This is also seen when the chat says we found it the one straw man to rule them all I mean this this video is just it comes across metaphorically as a giant shield to me It's just like you'll put this one this video up whenever anybody says anything critical of him anymore This is a shield or presumed to be used as one people have also accused me of doing this You keep saying this is all your opinion as if that makes you immune to criticism This could not be further from the truth People change their opinions all the time. That's what discussion is one person thinks the movie is good Another person around the screen. Yeah, I think he just he sensed something from the game. I guess Oh, okay. Oh Have you guys seen the the video someone sent it to me? I think it's this game that he's um Is some kind of plot plot hole expected plot hole in in the narrative again I I don't have enough context to be able to give this definitive, but this is a funny quote So he said he's he's gonna stop playing the game If some mooder turns out to be at 10 p.m. Or something like that. I'm again very vague someone in chats we're gonna know this better than me and The game turns out it's it's 10 and so he gets pissed and the altar falls the game And his chat don't respond well because they're like it does make sense if you think blah blah blah blah blah It's back and forth for a while And there's this this quote from him where he's like you could tell he's pissed and he says, um, I'm not being stubborn I'm right Oh Joseph Wait, so someone died at a certain time in the game. He rage quit because of that. It's apparently a plot hole I I again, I don't know enough about it Sprinklers at 10 I guess and uh, I'll I'll give him all the benefit of of the doubt Uh On the video I saw there was a comment that said he did retract that statement Like seconds after making it so it was obviously made it in an angry state It's just funny because it makes you think like is is that a brief insight into his head? I'm not being stubborn. I'm right Um Like the art of this game. What is this game? Uh for sona It's It's dry Dang dang dang a romper dang a romper through vision three v3 Dang a romper vision. I don't know But yeah, uh, let's keep it going People change their opinions all the time. That's what discussion is one person thinks the movie is good Another person thinks the movie is bad They argue over the points and hopefully reach some compromise or a better understanding of each other's viewpoints Someone might even be convinced and change their mind as impossible as that may seem I would you use this footage if you have to blur it out Oh, I mean, it's he's been playing it recently. I don't know. There could be any reason. Yeah, but like shit, man Tell the audience he's reusing footage from his old video So like just like really like Is that someone might even change their mind as impossible as that may seem it's like The utter condescension just just dribbling out I changed people's minds. So I Did you know do you guys know that you can change your mind? You know, oh, yeah, I do Interesting, I do it. I don't know. I do it sometimes even Eyes or a better understanding of each other's viewpoints Someone might even be convinced and change their mind as impossible as that may seem when you've been talking on the internet for so long It's debatable if there is such a thing as a bad opinion But there are definitely some that are uninformed or underdeveloped It's debatable whether there's some such a thing as a bad opinion Okay, you want you want to know what an abat what a bad opinion is joseph subjectively implied Yeah, yeah, that's exactly what you mind reader mauler part time God, I wish I I wish I was that smart I mean, I you know, I'm not stubborn. I'm right I mean just like we were talking about the definition of good You know, can it can an opinion be not good? well, if you're at the point of that opinion is to Correlate with reality then yeah You can have a bad opinion if your opinion is something that is not objectively true then that is a bad opinion I'm going to buy this game just to spite joseph. I mean, I think he likes it overall actually so Oh, fuck this game then We hate it. We're gonna view it badly Talking on the internet for so long It's debatable if there is such a thing as a bad opinion But there are definitely some that are uninformed or underdeveloped an article that you underdeveloped Kind of like the ones from your horror video, which is what everybody kept talking saying to you joseph Yes underdeveloped you can I could probably substitute that with an opinion for unjust If you can't justify your opinions, I'd say it's underdeveloped Yeah, and that might stem from the position that might explain that the position people hold where they like Don't share it at that point Like if if all you're interested is in arguments for why the room is bad and I just tell you I didn't like it over and over again You'd be like, yeah, can you develop that because I can't work with that It's like when people call into the atheist experience show they host asks not what you believe necessarily, but why do you believe it? Yeah, because the opinion that you have or the belief that you have is based on a solid foundation if you can Justify it if you're if you have good reasons to believe the things that you do Which is far more interesting or well That's subjective Agree with doesn't just function as a way for your mind to be changed about a topic It can also act as a spark that strengthens your original opinion by challenging it so strongly That you finally work out why you feel the way you do about something and none of this counters anything Cometers have accused you of this is just Something that we all agree with because you just say it stated obvious shit right now It's like yeah, he's like minds can change opinions can be uninformed. You're like, yep. Yep. Yep. This is all fine now address the points, please I had some comments on the odyssey video that said just that even though that video is fairly negative They went into detail about how me explaining what I didn't like about the game Made them realize why they like it and they got value out of the video and now that can definitely happen I could highlight an inconsistency and then h-bomber guy can say the inconsistency is why it's consistent as he did for dark souls 2 which was utterly insane or the It's uh, it's in it's complete in its incompleteness. That's what he said So yeah, you can highlight an issue that looks better than fallout 76 That's racist But uh, yeah the Yes, this these are things that can happen joe, so this is not addressing the argument though Is this super mario odyssey? No, this is skyrim modded. No, it's super mario odyssey shut up It's an unlockable level. That's my opinion. Yeah That way it's about a game. So there's nothing objective to say about it Yeah, no, I was criticizing the game for most of the runtime In my view, that's only half of the issue here, though I think that all right, so that face has an age dwell by the way That hair it looks like his brain Uh prepare so he's setting up here that he's gonna be putting qualifiers on each statement And so and the point will be that if he was to uh sign post every opinion or in this case subjective opinion Uh, then it would be a clunky script because it would ruin it. It would ruin the flow So this is what he's doing right now. So the runtime he's being meta in my view That's only half of the issue here, though I think that most people watching this video will recognize that this is elementary stuff However, in my view discussing this is necessary because I think that there are a growing number of people who in my experience Are demanding that every sentence in every video include a I think that or in my opinion in order to avoid presenting opinions as objective facts And I don't know about you guys, but my response to that is just you need to improve your writing at that point Yeah, you don't have to use those words. There's a lot of ways that you could say it There's a lot of personally If you just put personally and then write what you're gonna say Maybe might I think it's up the debate Whether one could say it could be said that it could be interpreted that one might believe It's not unreasonable to think that's a that's not to measure by the way this does not protect you though So if I said in my personal view every single Well, every single game has no controls you'd be like That's not true. And then I go, but it's my opinion and I did signpost it and you're like, I know Like that doesn't change shit The way I see it it takes me on average about one second to say those opinion tag statements In my opinion, this would lead to unnecessary clutter when writing and recording scripts for videos That's why you read draft and you have this whole section that was condescending this entire section I can't put a quote down because it's all said in a condescending tone He's like he's talking down to the audience. He's explaining to them That what they want is stupid and now he's explaining to them how in the most Basic terms you what you want as he points to his audience What you want is for me to say all these things These things take time to say and they don't add anything to the argument as he continues to point closer and closer to their face you You Don't want this. Do you understand now? They're like, that's not what I said Yeah, we're not saying that you have to preface everything with in my opinion I mean, aren't you a are you a shit writer? If you're a shit writer, then yeah, maybe you do I mean We're saying it is like this this one's all on you my dude If I was to do like a full-on, you know assessment of Joseph Anderson and look at his writing structure in Each of his reviews I may be able to make a statement on that but from what I remember he has some structure just the this is just sad to be like there's nothing I can do but Put in my opinion at the beginning of every fucking sentence. It's like Jesus For something as long as fallout for one year later I think that the extra time onto every paragraph would result in well over 10 minutes of padding in my view This is a worthwhile demonstration of the problem. Just consider continues to explain this when nobody's asking for this anyway You think that it would take 10 minutes of filler to add some qualifiers to your shit. Fuck off What what a horrible writer you must think you are Nobody's asking for that. Nobody to show me the person who said you needed my opinion at the beginning of every single fucking sentence Problems that would result in appeasing this demand and again just to qualify There is going to be the one guy but that one guy is the I found him in the youtube comment section. I found him There he is. I found his poor for something quicker I think that you could look at the time added to just Right, so now if he presented this to me and was like this is the only choice I had to be subjective I'd be like What stops you from putting in my view? In my view that's only half the issue here though. I think the most people watching this video will recognize That most of this is elementary stuff. That's fine. However um Discussing do you need that in my view? However discussing this is necessary because I think There's a growing number of people who are demanding you didn't see put in my experience was unnecessary redundant Yeah, it's redundant take it out who are demanding that every Sentence in every video include you just say a qualifier. You didn't need those examples and it should be and not a um Yeah, that's true in order to avoid presenting opinions as objective facts And it's the issue is more complicated than that, but fine the way I see it It takes me on average about one second to say those opening tag statements And no, so that's objective You wouldn't need to say in my opinion this would lead to a necessary clutter It does because these are repetitive words that are doubling up in some cases So they would be repetitive and unnecessary. So that's an objective statement. Yeah, that follows the definition of unnecessary It's funny that he doesn't understand this shit man, and it's what ruins his scripts It's ruining this script anyway when writing recording scripts for videos for something as long as fallout for one year later I think the extra time onto every paragraph would result in well over 10 minutes of padding. No, that's just a truth Yeah, that's just a truth Uh, that's not a subjective opinion in my view. This is with wild demonstration of the problems that would result in appeasing this demand He should have put a comma there at the end of in my view We don't even need it because again that would be true This would represent a good demonstration a strong demonstration of these problems We've identified the problems are repetition and clutter What would represent those well by putting in my opinion at the beginning of every sentence Which he has done and it's presented the you know, like this isn't your opinion You know, he you know, you could probably take out unnecessary before clutter because unnecessary clutter is unnecessary. Yeah So this is not done a good job in convincing. He's not even proven his point efficiently If the point of this is to say that look at how brief it can't be and we're telling you No, you fucked up a few places. We can make this even more brief. It's redundant. You have extra words here Uh improper use of and if we wanted to we could argue that he's actually being a little bit disingenuous here presenting it as much worse than even For the people who are asking for in my opinion at the beginning of every sentence He's just presented it as worse than it actually would be Yeah, I mean if you added one second to every sentence surely that wouldn't add up to 10 minutes If it did that would be 60 times 10 6 So it would be 600 minutes the video in the first place, right? That would be how you do it if it was one If it's 10 minute, he said it was six hours and he would add 10 minutes, right 10. Yeah 10 minutes. Yeah, there would have to be essentially 600 if it takes Even if though it doesn't matter because the fact would be that uh, if he had enough If if you hear in my opinion once per two minutes even that should be spread out enough that it wouldn't be distracting If it's a fucking long ass video, but again, that's another topic of Being a good writer is you can change it. You don't have to say in my opinion Change it up with loads of different ways Make it much more interesting or well Varied would be see see what I mean. Well, I was highlighting those words earlier If I say it's much more interesting that's subjective, but if I say it's much more varied that's objective Language folks. I'm just just how it works But this paragraph I'm speaking right now from all of the I think that statements that I went out of my way to include That's a whopping 10 seconds for it. You didn't need them Yeah, you didn't need a lot of them. No However, in my view, that's also not right Yeah, plus like even the one after fallout one year later I think that wouldn't be needed because it would add time Objectively it would add time Jojo jo 20 paragraphs in this script and this is one of my shortest videos And remember it's not just time. That's the issue It restricts sentence structure creates a ton of monotonous repetition from the same statements again and again Yeah, depending on the writer Yeah, if you're a bad writer, I could see why you think that he's telling his audience now Faith in yourself. See, this is where he's fucking up as well on his own fucking opinion. Like you got He's telling us it will result in monotonous. That's just an objective statement It will result in a monotonous structure and it's like but it won't So you're wrong and you'd be like, well, it's my opinion that it will and it's like fucking hell jojo This is what we mean about a shield you just escape it every single time Everybody is able to criticize you in any way shape or goddamn form And hampers how creative and varied the script writer can be I will stand by the statement that writers get an opportunity to be creative when they're hampered by rules So if you if you like put the position That's when you if you're free to do anything creativity is obviously available But to to do something with restrictions. It's like the premise of humans having to solve problems You have to use creativity. So yeah, just he's not right on this This is this is his subjective opinion and it's bad Okay So why can't a subjective blanket be assumed to rest over everything with some sprinkled in my opinion statements throughout the script as reminders Which most script writers already do including myself to remind us are they not qualifiers? What's about to come afterwards? So I feel like if you do it specifically that's a qualifier for what comes next not a reminder that everything you're saying is your opinion this is a great example of um The difference between what people are seeing and hearing versus what he thinks he's putting forth So everybody hears him present objective arguments and then say in my opinion Blah blah blah subjective subjective as a result of those objective things for example You collect 10 moons in the exact same way in mario and then he says in my opinion. This is boring as fuck That's fine. If you've shown the 10 you've shown how they they're monotonous or they're the exact same And they they take let's just say for the sake of argument They all take an hour of mario standing still and they generate on the spot and that's how you get them so you and I don't know it has to be Active like you have to be moving the camera, but you can only say still um So you go all these pieces of information you go I find this boring and I would imagine many people would um But obviously the actual actions are very much monotonous. There's no way you can get out of that because it's Fucking definition That's how these ways work So that's what people thought was happening while he's saying what was happening the whole time was it's all subjective And he was just throwing in random in my opinions to remind people who's subjective Yeah, I mean if you really like if the script you were shown if if the the page that he gave us the paragraphs he gave us three sentences Cut it down cut it down so much filler just cut it down. That's three sentences worth of info But yeah, you really have to do is Like all you have to do is just say in my opinion then give your spiel And you don't have to say it 15 times if you've already said it at the very beginning The following section is my opinion And uh, yeah, so what I'm trying to highlight is that this is the disconnection between him and his fan base apparently Where he thought this whole time That they were just waiting for more qualifiers for the in my opinion thing and uh Yeah, I just he's he's he's fucked it up But I was gonna say the question the the next comment is with uh having to look out rags. So um dusty links You want if you want to read it dusty? links As in the cat the kid So wait Where is the part where people actually tried to discuss your reasoning of what makes the game scary? And then when someone lists their reason why they think outlast or soma is scary you respond with a flat responsive because that's not scary Don't tell me you're trying to make a discussion out of these videos when you yourself don't even discuss it with your viewers You flat out shut down and dismiss the conversation your viewers are trying to have with you You are being dismissive and don't look at things from another's point of view You don't even need to agree just acknowledge how you could see something like that being scary But nope instead. You just shut them down Almost half of this video was consisting of you talking about how it is not practical by starting each opinion with well in my opinion We already know that's not practical Many of your fans were really questioning your reasoning with what makes a game scary and to be honest They had every right to question your reasoning But you had no right to shut them down when they did I don't want you to say that you're critic that can't take a critique, but it might be true Anyways, I really do hope you realize why a lot of fans were questioning your logic about scary games because I would have to agree with him That your logic is severely flawed So there are these things are being listened to and responded to and I just I think he's underestimated his audience's position quite significantly or at least a portion of his audience um And yeah, I think that it's no better highlighted than this moment where he's like Guys, you just want me to say in my opinion more. It's like no, that's not it not even a little bit Script writers already do including myself to avoid this issue Well, there are two sides to this problem the way I see it The first is that some people are being genuine when they react with outrage that someone is trying to pawn off an opinion as an objective fact That there really are people like the one in the opening example get angry when someone says that a movie was really good That's can you put that on the list whether there's actually people in his audience who are ripping off this shit I don't even know how to put that it's just like yeah, there are there are totally implies audience cannot stay dressed Yeah, I'm gonna put that If anyone reads this as is like an actual summary heater real quick Yeah, if anyone reads this like as a summary They'll just be like did he really say his audience can't stay dressed like yes In in a roundabout way Um But yeah, I was gonna say maybe I'm gonna read all the super chats at the end because Void of this video is making All right. Yes. So let's let's kick on matter of quantity and compromise How many reminders of opinion do you need in a script? Is it half of all opinion statements? 75 percent or is it really all of them? Why do you think why do you think that it has to be a flat percentage? It's condescending is really do you need me to say it for every sentence? It's like yes, Joseph. That was the only problem they had with you No, the problem was that he only did it for 15 percent when the optimal number is 56 percent I didn't bring you do a task. It was 56.7. I think so it's technically 57 if you That's objective I look at this as being the same as citations that are used in textbooks Not everything is referenced and backed up with direct evidence even in history books There's a compromise you make with the author. Did you really just say textbooks while showing a book from skyrim on the screen? Look at the one he's showing now, dude Jump flea disarray precious joy frightening graveyard variants fun puppy. He didn't need to show it actual fun puppy Well, yeah, it's just kind of strange the imagery he decided to put on screen that doesn't really Support the thing he's saying. I mean, have you listened to the argument though? This Yeah, ignore the video just take this one this argument here this one's contentious for a lot of people This is being the same as citations that are used in textbooks Not everything is referenced and backed up with direct evidence even in history books There's a compromise you make with the author that some information If it was a history book typically it has evidence What are you talking about? That's ridiculous. No, we just made that shit up So all those pictures of the holocaust are just no Well, we just wanted to give we just wanted to give the Jews a reason what I will say is uh Rags, I know it's a long one, but it's just it's just perfect for this section. So the next comment is from Theo the Oat tree, I guess the the Oat tree the Oat tree. I'm not sure what you're supposed to go with that The Oat tree, this is a response to the history book thing history is implied Dude deal that that's great Dude the parallel you're drawing to academic work specifically regarding history is that's my area of expertise It just doesn't exist when using facts as a historian I'm expected to be able to source my information And if I cannot reliably source that information then the fact is unreliable and you and unusable Some facts do not require a specific citation in academic articles because they are so commonly known to be true The battle of hastings was fought in 1066 near Hastings, for example Nothing more than a quick google search is required to find a deluge of cross references that confirm this fact is true And as the intended audience of the essay becomes more specific from historian to medieval historian to a medieval europe historian To medieval france specialist the understanding of what common knowledge is changes Common knowledge to an audience of specialists in medieval france is very different matter to the common knowledge of your average educated reader watcher Hence the need to cite thoroughly is dependent on exactly who your audience is The average reader will trust a professor Of history when they make an unsighted claim because that professor speaks with authority and the work more than likely Has gone through a lengthy process of peer review in order to vet out inaccuracies The historian cites information so their work is reliable And contextually does not need to do so if the information is common enough to their target audience that it needs no verification How is this process in any way similar to signifying that you are giving an opinion not stating a fact It is vitally important that a critic make sure their audience understands when they are describing the mechanics And how they correspond to the developer's intentions versus how they are as a consumer responded to the subject The differences between analysis of art and debate over history is that games Implicitly have intentions behind them But more importantly we have clear understandings of the mechanisms at work and how they could be changed or improved to Further the intentions of the developer When you say death ruins horror games That's a blanket statement about a genre and hence applies to every single horror game ever made Have you played every single horror game ever made? I doubt it And making statements about entire genres is a very difficult endeavor with very low returns Your language indicates that death is an issue that plagues the entire genre But what if a horror game where death isn't even a possibility? We brought this up by the way Or a horror game that can only be attempted once eliminating the possibility of respawns You see what's happening here? You've made a statement and i'm attacking it Because your previous video presents a very strange idea that is argued for in a way that isn't convincing Not to mention the presentation giving the very explicit impression that your criticisms are faults of the games Not a personal reason for not caring for them If your video is intending to share a personal feeling Why were references and mechanics brought in criticisms made in solutions proposed? If there's a solution There's a problem and there's a problem. We're talking in objective terms And you just want to share your sentiments. You can't be caught saying death ruins horror games as that's a straight up objective claim A vulnerable under informed one But an objective one Objective doesn't mean true. It means measurable Your statement has qualifiers these qualifiers can be true or false Your claims validity depends on the validity of his qualifiers So when you make claims that seem from our audience's perspective to talk about an entire genre of medium You fail to make the line between description of reality and a personal assessment clear I really hope you can see why your audience is having trouble here The language you use makes it incredibly unclear whether you're assessing mechanics or giving a personal feeling Horror games fail to scare me is not the same as horror games fail to scare And you use the latter with the unreasonable expectation that your audience will hear the former That's an excellent comment. That's just a mic drop right there. This is like well Such a that's really good. That's a really thorough response I love you Theo Well, that's yeah, that's excellent And yeah, you know We were as much as we could rip apart the history sectionals like I think he's done it in that opening so better than we could Uh, the only contention is that by I guess I would have is that technically history isn't a technically the stuff that we say Hi, it doesn't matter. It's getting too pedantic. Let's just move on. What is it? Is it going to be like there are some things that some agree on it's about history and Facts and what we can show you prove and things like that. Yeah, it's very complicated. I think and that's part of the problem With joseph just being like history books don't always need to cite stuff. It's like what the If they don't cite stuff Then how is that how is the history that we all know the accepted story? Which is essentially what history is what we all accept to be the story of what happened based on the issue is everything in between It doesn't relate because when they don't cite something it's because it's already been cited before That's not the same as you not telling people that something is your opinion when it is Yeah, the history books even in history books There will be sections that say while Many scholars disagree or we don't have conclusive evidence or we just don't know yet Here are the ideas that have been proposed It's just a crap comparison. Yes And if if you were to try and make it more relevant you need way more time than this If you're gonna go over how like 20 how historians cite information and how it's verified like come on Just in textbooks not everything is referenced and backed up with direct evidence even in history books There's a compromise you make with the author that some information is considered commonly understood and agreed upon And that most of the references will be contentious points or newly discovered information that needs to be sourced It is unnecessary for everything to be cited just like most opinions in an article don't need to be labeled as such That's not the same. That's not the same. It's not the same It is an understandable expectation to want to label on all of them, but it simply isn't reasonable The second side of this problem are people who know full well that there can't be a label on every opinion But still point it out to weaken an argument that they disagree with This could be caused by an emotional reaction that makes them grasp at any counter that's within their reach Or it could be a calculated response because they are so invested in arguing against whatever position the article is taken One that they find so abhorrent So he's saying yeah, that's he's arguing that they're doing it in bad faith at this point Like he's saying you possibly know that the disagreeing in bad faith and they're using a grasp at straws to do it like either they have an emotional investment in the opposite uh argument to the article or they're uh Like that was the the malicious intention was to recognize that they're essentially losing the argument So they pick anything to work with which does happen by the way for example, um If if I do an hour analysis and then they go your black panther video makes no fucking sense You said that it begins in 1992 when it begins in 1997. I'd be like that That's like that's not even relevant to any of my arguments. So you know is in the chat Really? Oh, yeah Where yeah, he said thank you everyone in chat who is saying nice things heart I noticed a couple people tag him I mean You know what when we when we get to the end of the video we can have theo jump in if uh if they want to Theo we love you Wolf's definitely in love You are the now the official fifth e-fapper Your now you're part of e-fap lore. You did it. Hooray Um, yeah, that's a crazy coincidence Well, I Yeah Everyone's like hey theo. Wow Hey, everyone's like wow what everyone likes me for some reason. I just Been a discord for two days more to pay attention. Oh Send me a friend request and then I'll be able to get you into this easily Uh once obviously we've got a couple things to get through but then we can definitely have you on I've repositioned the article has taken one that they find so abhorrent For these people the only answer that I can see is for everyone else to remain vigilant and not allow these responses to gain legitimacy It's killing discussion and So like if you were to give him a little less benefit of the doubt you could actually construe that what joe just said is People are picking up on the fact that I am saying subjective arguments and portraying them as objective In order to destroy my my arguments and it's like That doesn't even make sense if they're talking about the framing versus your argument And then just just like everyone you need to ignore or go after these people you have to stop them Civil war in the comment section Oh, yeah, there's definitely a fucking civil war. It is covered every comment that we've covered We'll have responses of people being like you fucking understand what joe was saying And not allow these responses to gain legitimacy. There's only one response that matters and it's theo's response That's some that's some truth right there killing discussion and makes things worse for everyone Ironically especially for those who also disagree with the article and want to properly argue against it The reason I know this is happening is because I have received comments that have accused me of adding opinion labels as a Sneaky way of presenting my views as facts like some trojan horse that can force you to change your mind But is also telling you at the same time No, how is that a trojan horse If no one can say that it's forcing you to change your mind and how would it be a trojan horse if it's labeled He's like it's a trojan horse that I I tell you about It's like so it's not that it's not a trojan The whole point of the trojan horses Don't know Like listen to that again. That's such a confusing statement that he makes happening is because I also you can't force anyone to change their mind belief's not a choice Yeah, he's missing. It's just missing the point. Stop missing the point received comments that have accused me of adding Chosen right labels as a sneaky way of presenting my views as facts like some Trojan horse that can force you to change your mind But is also telling you at the same time that it's trying to In these cases, so it's not a trojan horse that that even if I don't even know what point he's really trying to bake with that bit like that's just confusing In these cases directly pointing out that I'm voicing an opinion still isn't enough to stop people from dismissing arguments with this excuse Why is that a bad thing if I said in my opinion soma has no enemies in it They'd be like you're trying to pass your opinion off as if it actually has some validity, but it doesn't you've based it on fucking nothing You'd be like I mean you can't get a mod that removes the enemies, but I'm assuming We're judging the dot mod right now And I mean we one would assume That if it's your opinion it has some validity to it because if it didn't then why would it be your opinion? It's just so much eyebrow-raising stuff in this video Isn't enough to stop people from dismissing arguments with this excuse Does all this mean that there's no place for objectivity in videos like mine? Certainly not and I think it's worth discussing how evidence can strengthen arguments as well as satisfy what I consider to be the Responsibility of a content creator that has attracted an audience big or small The basic structure that almost all arguments in my videos follow is a subjective judgment on how something works Supported by objective evidence from the game sometimes the opinion. Sorry. I want to stop there. Um so I've just I've been thinking about this uh sort of example, I guess of um I an instance where you would say something that kind of doesn't fit into the mod that he's presenting here So imagine if you you said uh that runner has the best time in the world And the reason why he has the best time in the world is because nobody in the world has run faster than this time here Therefore, he has the best time That's an objective statement backed up by facts so If somebody were to say this is the best game ever made and here's these reasons why Is that somebody's opinion because best has a very specific definition? Uh, could you What if what if I argued is best in in that it made the most money? Well, you could if you qualified it that way Yeah, the qualifications important I do yeah That's a fine thing. That's a fine thing to do. There's nothing wrong with that. In fact, I think it's better I just find it interesting that you can take a sentence like this is the best Something and then make it a video game or a movie all of a sudden it no longer means the same thing Kind of ridiculous I think You just need to be Careful with the words that you use. That's that's really all there is to it And comes first and then the examples show up to reinforce it Sometimes it's the opposite and I'll say what I think at the end And that's a process that even I and on wolf and ray whoever will use say for example I just I present all of my arguments to you about the last Jedi and then I say I fucking hate this film By the way, like seriously hate this film And you could be like you didn't even need to have that but it would be my subjective Opinion on the film after I presented all of the reasons for why I felt that And that's fine that doesn't he's implying that that's what he's done this whole time and that People shouldn't be annoyed at him because that's what he's continued to do It's like joseph if that were the case and why has everybody gone nuts on your fucking horror video that was retarded in terms of research Why do you think that is? You just you just like oh, it's just a weird coincidence. That's when everybody got mad at me And then what how do you explain the response to this video too like they Are these not reasonable questions they don't understand they don't they don't get they don't understand how discussions work Yeah, let's let's how about a run through uh It's implied by the basis of communication if you understood what it means you wouldn't want it Uh, they talk about x instead of anything that's in my actual video. They're self-righteous They're using a perceived error as to a way to dismiss his argument These comments contradict themselves and they function as they get a discussion A discussion free card. I think it was oh, yeah get out of a discussion free card Um, and they don't have to waste time of thinking counter arguments when they can just do that They're asking for low level terminology. They don't Can't be settled these things they don't know how discussions are meant to function Someone might even change their mind as impossible as that may seem implies the audience can't stay dressed Do you need to say it for 100% of the opinion statements essentially arguing a bad face like joseph What are you doing mate? I want to be absolutely clear here because I already for He's been so clear man. So clear say what I think at the end I want to be absolutely clear here because I already foresee the comments below saying that i'm a giant hypocrite And do try to pass off my opinions as objective after all objective evidence Does not mean an argument is infallible It only means that the examples are from the game itself and are tangible proof that the things I am talking about Actually happened. We agree with the statement Moving on They could still be bad arguments the examples may not match as well as I think they do or my conclusions May be far from what you think of the game when studying the same examples. I'm using What if it's a conclusive argument though? Yeah, I was gonna say that can happen That scenario where you present a piece of evidence that is objective and you can draw multiple subjective conclusions from it such as tom yuazo is acting in Thingy is unbelievable and then someone goes. Yeah, I know I hate I can't get into the film at all And someone else goes I adore it. It's what makes the film so good or so entertaining I should say So, yeah, that's a that's a thing that can happen and it doesn't it doesn't push this argument one way or the other The whole subjectivity is implied thing right, but I mean like um, I think what I mean is he's saying, you know You can use evidence to make a point, but it's still a bad point But what happens if you use the evidence and you make a conclusive point Yeah, what if what if the evidence and then you say something that's correct? The sun is big. It's really hot. It's plasma. It's a star That's correct. So then what what happens now? Is it objective or is it still a subjective implied opinion? Well, he said the second that you're uh saying something factual is no longer an opinion. It's a fact. That's what his position is It's still an opinion. It's just also a fact Yeah, well, he doesn't agree with that. That's the biggest problem he has That's the thing is like you can say it's not just your opinion It's your opinion and your opinion lines up with what the facts are Yeah Then he would say you're not presenting an opinion you're presenting a fact But I said in my opinion. So it's my opinion, right? No, I said it I don't know. I don't know how you defend that one That's what I mean. That's why I'm talking to him. It's also my opinion that the sun is a star It's my opinion. It's my opinion. That's a goose egg You can't prove me wrong. I can't argue. I can't argue with that Like I said, we are all the chocolate chips on the cosmic pancake and you cannot prove me wrong Metaphorically that is objective Most people I see what you did there Subjectively it's objective examples. I'm using I think that this is what most people mean when they say they want more objectivity in articles and reviews They know why didn't you just say this is what people mean? You just said I think that why did you put that there? Why don't you just say this is what if subjectivity is implied you could just said this is what most people mean when they say that because Objectivity and subjectivity are a clear defined difference. He knows the difference He just likes to fucking write his scripts quickly if they want to deal with repercussions that sometimes he makes mistakes That's this fucking video. I'm not even kidding. It's like deal with it. You make I've made many mistakes in my scripts If I go back to old videos, I'll be like, oh, I shouldn't have said that like that Well, oh, yeah, I could have said that better. I'm doing it with my redrafts. I look at a redraft I'm like, what the hell was I and you have a moment when you're writing sometimes you just go Then you look back and you go, hmm Boy, boy, that's I need to correct this. That's fine It's I don't just go. Well, it's all subjective show. Yeah, nobody expects perfection But to to be so stubborn because you're right That would be the case, wouldn't it Joe You're right that once you start saying once you start putting in your video things like I think it's my opinion da da da Now we're like, well, I mean if it's implied Why are you saying it here and not over there? And if we want to be super meta You know if we want if we want to be super meta is this is he correct here Is he correct or does he just think that he's correct in the subject subject subjectively or correct objectively? Well, I mean like if if the takeaway from this video is what is it? Is he right or is he only right in his opinion now with this argument that he's made Does he think with absolute certainty that subjectivity is implied and that's correct Are you asking If I'm just I'm extrapolating his his argument in this video to The video itself is subjectivity implied or is it just in his opinion that it is? Because he said that he said a lot of things like oh the basics of language, you know This is how it works. So which is it? I don't know opinion or is this it's important. This is what I mean I can't Doesn't make sense More objectivity in articles and reviews they know full well that opinions cannot be objective But they want something supported by evidence or failing that an attempt to represent more perspectives than just the writers When it comes to a formal appraisal of something I consider content creators like myself to be obligated to provide the sort of evidence in most cases My opinion is not worth more than anyone else's But it's undeniable that it has much more influence Uh, wait, do I begin um Well, I would say that it's worth a lot less than everyone else's how to fucking undercut your channel 101 I mean To be like Fucking shit Oh, man. That's not right. That's like how can I mean for example if a climate a climate scientist His opinion matters more than mine on the subject of climate because he knows more than So yeah, it it is worth more. I mean And we're with the subjective again, which is it depends on what what your qualifier is It's like now you have to take the position to your audience that like what are they? What do you what is your audience paying for and if your opinion isn't worth more than anyone else's What are they paying you for? Niable that it has much more influence My videos on Fallout 4 get so many views that just today more people will listen to me speak my opinions on that series Then most people will be listened to about anything in their entire lives That's going on the fucking way Yeah I just just just dude when you redrafted and read that out you should have noticed how fucking How much you was sucking your own wing wang right there? I I don't think I have ever seen Or heard a more pretentious thing in my entire life That ego is the size of mount everest My doom So joseph There is a right way in a wrong way to accept the fact that you have a large audience This is not the right way Jesus christ like Man, this is not the right way you can guarantee the that will be in my april fool's video And you know if any of us said that in our videos unironically We would get this shit ripped out of us It's How did you say it with his dick in his mouth like I don't Because he's got a little dick Come on joe That is so unbelief. I can't even believe he said that Us today more people will listen to me speak my opinions on that series I almost want to apologize to eric taxon, but i'm not gonna do that This this this script of this video is the writing equivalent of eric taxon's face Well, hey Joseph anderson does have like a striking resemblance to worm tail from harry potter follow. Yeah, so he His own face kind of substitutes for it. I Forgot so many views that just today more people will listen to me speak my opinions on that series Then most people will be listened to about anything in their entire lives Presenting he's got a fallout for video. I guess in just today. He thinks that in one day more people It doesn't even matter if it's true. Joe. It doesn't matter if it's true It's like I like I said there's a right way and a wrong way to let your audience know that You understand that you have a large audience and you can accept that with the level Maybe you say like I feel like with this audience and you guys supporting me And you guys empowering me with this, you know with Being an audience of mine that I should speak truthfully and then I should mislead you And you know stuff like that and and I shouldn't waste it and then I should You know tata tata tata accept responsibility whatever you want to say, you know do your thing But like damn son like you only have that because we're here Yeah, like just humble keep it keep it even slightly humble, please You can just say like just because I've I've got uh a large number of subscribers just on a daily basis Um more people are gonna hear the things that I say then perhaps people who watch me Which is that's just a statement as opposed to saying in their entire lives They're not gonna get it listened to as much as you did in one day It's not the right thing to say And like he's so out of touch that he just he was like yeah, that makes sense for me to say and that's fine It's like Yeah, it comes along and says joseph anderson If I that little that little pipsqueak. Nobody no one listens to that faggot Oh, you can't say that he can't talk to if you say that Don't say that right. I look I have been your soul. No, I'm because I when I said that I was speaking as a hypothetical of somebody Yeah, he was quoting he wasn't I was I was quoting as hypothetical It's like once you once you measure yourself And and you're worth in that way somebody else might come along and say, oh, yeah Well, your views aren't anything compared to mine. I should have done that when he complained I should have said it wasn't an insult. I was making a subjective view on uh Subjective I should have just said subjective It's subjective that it's an insult A list of unsupported opinions would not just be less interesting It could also be harmful to how people view things since they may take my words on faith Without any evidence to properly judge whether they agree with me or not This can wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait, they they'll take my what I say at faith If even if they don't have any evidence that you're saying that's a potential I guess Well for as it's redundant. Oh, yeah, it would be like if us for released videos saying that uh Fallout 76 is amazing and we don't even have evidence. We just say it's amazing There's some people out there would go well if they say it's amazing Oh, okay. Yeah, I trust rags when he talks about things So it must be amazing because generally rags is good opinions on and and so and so Joseph unwittingly Identifies the issue with his horror video It's interesting It could also be harmful to how people view things it is harmful to the horror genre that you told everybody that It's not scary because it's broken that you're a superhero in it You're fucking rad since they may take my words on faith Without any evidence to properly judge whether they agree with me or not This can lead to groups of people repeating information about something that they don't fully Understand because they trusted an unsupported source. What you mean like uh horror games John because you told them that it doesn't yeah, they shouldn't have done that because it was subjective and they just didn't realize Should I get home? I'm looking for a good horror game. Should I get soma? Well, soma's not a horror game I'll go with mario. That might be a horror It's the doom is scammy. So it's a horror game. No, that's uh that who was that for that was like pat that was Was that clepec? He wrote that article about doom Oh, god, was that Grayson or who wrote that? Who? It's hard to keep track of all the tisms Someone someone wrote an article about your filing system. I can finally visit doom because I could stomach the violence and so There's some soy boy uh fucking uh game journalist Jesus it's like nathan grayson joseph anderson isn't really a critic. He's not scary Somebody in the comments said The people repeating information about something that they don't fully understand because they trusted an unsupported source And maybe that's what some mistakenly believe is happening when there aren't enough in my opinion This was some people mistakenly believe what is happening That clip just perfectly encapsulate encapsulates fall out in a nutshell that Running around and punching something until you die No, that doesn't have anything to do with Substance joseph video Tags throughout an article just punching at a movable force. Don't think that's the case. Oh wait, let me uh Throughout an article, but I don't now it's the beginning of mess effect too We just came here from fallout 76 where I died after punching a robot. I hope you're following it makes sense Shut up And maybe that's what some mistakenly believe is happening when there aren't enough in my opinion tags throughout an article But I don't think that's the case We're all intuitive enough to know when something is an opinion even if it isn't being formally presented as such If I yeah, because subjectivity is implied and that's why you had to make this video You've proven yourself wrong on that one. It's kind of an oxymoron, isn't it? It's implied, but you had to tell people that Yeah, that's the funniest name for a video I say soma fails as a horror game Then it's easy to understand that I don't think that everyone who enjoyed it as a horror game was somehow wrong So I see it saying saying that soma fails as a horror game is not the same as soma is not a horror game Apparently The idea is that like he's gonna talk about what it means and then you end up saying why didn't you just say what you meant You know the idea that he's like soma is not a horror game. What does that mean joseph? It means it didn't scare me Why didn't you say that joseph? well Then you just fucking lost because it's okay to say should have I should have been more clear I should have clarified what I mean to say is x She's gotten off his high horse. He still seems really defensive over when all he could have said I can't believe he's still pushing that it was the correct thing to say It's like joseph. Do you know how language works? Like that was It fueled me to complete my series on soma because I was like you're fucking lying to people Yeah, people are pointing out the stuff that's happening in the background Rarely has anything to do with what he's saying, you know, and it's always swapping around as something else is like I hate it bugs me I said then you are lost Joseph's not a kid. He's not you know, he's not that badass. He didn't get burned turned into Darth Vader At least Anakin was attractive The horror game was somehow wrong and didn't understand their own feelings It's simply an opinion without the tag Just says we're all also intuitive enough to recognize when something is being dismissed as an excuse Yes, we're all intuitive enough to recognize it and that's why you keep telling us. We're not getting it Like throughout this whole video you can't how do you make this ending to this video? This is like completely at odds with everything you've just said In without the tag just says we're all also intuitive enough to recognize when something is being dismissed as an excuse To not directly answer the points being brought up Or maybe not maybe i'm wrong and this growing number of people complaining about this issue Really do need to have an indication that it's an opinion in every sentence. Do you catch that guys? Yeah, that's uh, that's another one to put in the list. Beautiful sums up his whole Maybe my audience really is that stupid That's oh that probably bothers me the most out of all of them because he's almost human Right there. He's nearly there. He says maybe i'm wrong. Maybe they're right Maybe they are really stupid and it's like No Your april fool's video is going to be like the greatest thing references to everything It's over anakin i have the mpi everyone is What was that sorry? It's over anakin. I have the implied ground This issue really do need to have an indication that it's an opinion in every sentence It makes me recall that saying if everyone is special then nobody is Can't you do the same for opinion statements if every sentence needs one? No, some opinions are better than others don't but not every sentence needs it sometimes you It's like if i say this game If i say this game doesn't work the input like it doesn't respond to play or input you fall through the ground That's bad I don't need to say in my opinion. It's bad You underestimate my subjectivity Don't try it And then he hits publish on subjectivity is implied you was a chosen one in my opinion Ian says in the chat joseph just engineered a situation that no matter what only he can be the correct one Oh, that that pretty much sums this up. Yeah, he's yeah, that that yeah, i'm pretty much is hilariously. I've run it consider It's called subjectivity That is joseph response theory Frame your response in a way that no matter what could possibly happen you could not be wrong That's that's great I think that the occasional reminder throughout an article is enough in my opinion anyway Thank you for Let's make sure we caught that ending properly because that's the end of the video Can't you do the same for opinion statements if every sentence needs one? Can't we all agree that most of them don't I think that the occasional reminder That doesn't even make sense if every sentence needs them but can't we agree most of them don't like No That's how it needs enough in my opinion anyway Thank you for watching at least he thanked us for watching after the fucking cavalcade of cob dissension God, I hope I never Jesus christ, I hope I never behave like this to my audience It is just there's nothing else, right? Oh wait, let's let's make sure there's nothing else like credit wise all of you people All of if your name is on this list, you just paid to be insulted. Good job It's not even exaggeration God I do that for free carl and yo han and zoe. Good job guys. You paid this guy to insult you Yeah, josh w Right. He's a shit. So there's three comments to go through that remain rags and then uh, we can bring we can bring feel on Why oh, there's why would he blur out the youtube comments, but he didn't blur out his patrons I don't even you didn't even blur out all the youtube comments. Yeah. No, he only blurred out a few So let's check out these comments. I guess we're on chris adam's is yeah Ah the long awaited joseph pedantically and condescendingly explains why his videos cannot be criticized or responded to In any harsh way because it's all just my opinion bro video I expected something like this to be around the corner as soon as you publish your video on horror games Honestly, I'm not surprised. You felt you had to make this I've been a subscriber of yours for a few years now and I've seen a lot of the flak You taking your comments for the way you word your videos I can genuinely empathize with this Scripting ain't easy people will continue to find issues in your writing even after a million re-drafts and that's frustrating You'll never please everyone and I get that What I don't get is that you don't seem to understand why you receive the criticism that you do As time has gone by I have taken issue with your videos more and more because more and more you veered away from your Fallout 4 and Uncharted videos so great So as a service to you assuming you read this I'm going to lay out my complaints about your channel as brutally as possible Here's your problem You still label all your videos as critiques This is great for seo and promoting your channel But it implies to your audience that you'll be analyzing and comparing objective values with and between games As long as you're actually doing that it's fine It's not the part of the video that people like me take an issue with but when you say things like soma fails as a horror game Dark souls has no story This fight is not fun or challenging or hollow knight's pacing is bad without qualifying these statements at all It comes across as entirely combative Not just for people who enjoyed those games, but for people who appreciate a certain quality of writing from the analysts they listen to I'm certain that you know this Anyone who had a different experience than you could challenge you improve your wrong You're clearly aware that opinions work this way since you mentioned early in the video that these challenges have been Posited to you since your very first video But instead of altering your language since then Maybe asking yourself what you could have done differently to avoid vitriolic retorts like this one You've consistently doubled down to the point where you are now blaming your audience for taking issue with the things that they say Beyond that. Sorry with the things that you say Beyond that you're straw manning legitimate criticisms of the way you word and structure your videos watching a movie and saying I Didn't like that to open a discussion is entirely different different to an hour long video called Dark Souls 3 critique But even making that ridiculous fallacious comparison is missing the point of the arguments against your content You want to freely mix and match your objective statements with your subjective ones? You want to call your video a critique and discuss objective merits of design elements But you also want to put your opinions in the middle of these sections It's fine if you want to do that, but I'm sure you understand that it's bad writing So then you want to avoid taking responsibility for the language you use Put more simply you want to create content without anyone who watches it holding you to any account To that end we now have a 14 minute video of you Smugly talking down to your audience about how we don't understand language and heavily implying that anyone who disagrees with you Just isn't smart enough to watch or engage with your content Then you have the nerve to preach about holding discussion to a better standard I have too much minus may watch the quality of your writing deteriorate over the years But worse than that I've watched your integrity as a game critic deteriorate as well This video more than anything is proof that you're comfortable resting on your laurels And when challenged you will say things like my video on fallout 4 exerts more influence in one day than anything you create in your life Hearing statements like that from a content creator is hearing a death knell for the creativity and passion for which you once subscribed to them But more than that It shows how deeply couched they are in their own ego At this point accepting a challenge on your content is admitting to yourself that maybe your work isn't as good as you think it is And despite what you say, you don't want discussion You can no longer take criticism You don't want people airing conflicted opinions on your videos But you absolutely cannot admit that to yourself or to your audience Listening to you talk from about 4 30 onwards was hilarious to me because you typically won't engage with dissenting commenters And will instead rely on your adoring fans to lambast us into silence on your behalf You are perfectly willing to sit tight in your echo chamber instead of responding to the people who don't agree with you And don't get me wrong I don't blame you Dealing with the scope of negativity typically found in comments sections of just one youtube video is extremely taxing But then having you turn around and profess that discussions must include opinions from all angles Knowing from a fact that you don't practice this principle. It demonstrates in no one's certain terms what a hypocrite you are In short, this video was terrible. And I hope on some level you realize It's heartening to see that most of the people commenting here are calling you on your bullshit Despite the disproportionate like dislike ratio You have finally achieved peak smug You have finally achieved peak smug like erin hansen h bomber guy thunderfoot and so many others before you The way I see it the way things are going this channel has nowhere to go but down I truly hope i'm wrong as i've enjoyed so much of your content in the past I genuinely want to see a return to the quality of writing and analysis that drew me to your channel in the first place I guess a man can dream Does Theo have a cult of people that just write novel sized comments? I get a lot of novels in uh in a lot of uh my videos. I'm sure you guys probably do as well Especially when it comes to like media people are really passionate about um, oh, yeah It's just that these ones are so based entirely on like a history that they share with the channel almost A lot of people are saying they want to hear joseph's response to this comment So i'm gonna try and uh get it up for For us Apparently so I just got to find it again on his video. So this is chris adams Got a load of bunch of comments. Give me a sec chris. Now there we go So, uh Oh dear So joseph says probably three times as long as this one Oh Jesus Uh I don't know if I can like can I link the comment to people or something because I don't know if we can read all of this out We'll put it in the um Can you put in the discord and let me see what exactly I don't know how do I how do I link it to you? All you need to do is load up a joseph's video And then load comments and then search for chris adams Moller's trying to get it up Yeah, you're right though. Like the comments are um Increasingly you're seeing the more, you know Critical comments because initially it was just a piece of chris adams. Here we go. Ah, yes, I've got it Joseph's not doing too good in the comment section on that either Like jiminy christmas. Do we want to actually read this whole thing out or because Uh, we can encourage everybody to go and check out his response if you'd like, uh, obviously I don't the problem is it's too it's too large even for efap right now considering where we are because we want to get Thea on as well Wolf had a special There's two comments to get through a sec. So go back to the um the ones we were actually showing so yeah if you guys want to see For that real quick. There were some quality prequel memes in the chat. Oh, yeah My favorite one so far Don't lecture me mauler. I've seen through the lies of efap. I do not see subjectivity as you do I have brought implied subjectivity arrogance facts and insults to my new fan base Um, all right new plaid we're gonna do the rest of the comments we have plaid We'll bring Thea on Uh to talk see how that goes if if we want to then read out his comment and respond to it That could be the last thing we do just because How many how much time I thought there was something else that we wanted to look at Well, we got two comments left for rags to read out on the on the thing. These are two are short anyway So they they're just they're just more of a punch line basically. Um, so the first one was sarich or sarich sarich I mean I can read them out if you want. I don't mind sarich I'll finish it up Sarich says I started disliking joe more and more as I watched his content He starts to grind you out when he's being incompetent at something and blames it on everything but himself Other than that, I've never taken him seriously. I thought he was more but sadly He's just another game si youtuber who had a good streak took a turn for the worst and let it go to his head Good luck in future projects joe the last one QE says poor man's mathematosis And that that's it and you know what we're trying to highlight with these comments is that the The response from his fans has been just one of Passionate disappointment. I suppose you could say there's loads of approval by the way Uh, there's plenty of comments that are like yeah joe you're right and all these guys are assholes that sort of thing or I did say I was looking for like Passionate agreement like a like a a big comment about how How much people get this wrong or something like that, but um I'm sure they exist again. You can always look for them and stuff But uh, yeah, that's just sort of an interesting selection of comments considering the video which Going through it as the condo said should actually be my biggest issue with this Not even the fact that he's trying to talk about a subject just the whole like how he fucking did it But yes, um Wolf did you want to was it something you wanted to do? Oh, yes was So I I read this incredible book recently. It's possibly the greatest thing ever written by another human being And I felt like you all needed to hear this inspiring passage that I found early Early on in the book if you would like to hear it I'm sure the chat would be Well, they'll lose their minds over it Okay, all right, so this is uh, this is an excerpt from uh, the world-renowned single reviewed book interstellar marines This is just Yes This is a this is a book by joseph anderson so, um Just make sure you you pay careful attention to how it's written And maybe some things will become a little clear The nightmares started on the first night Reese was a baby in his crib. It was in the middle of a field in the middle of the night What There was a breeze blowing that was rustling through some trees He couldn't see them. He couldn't see anything except the stars in the sky They kept flashing like tiny fists expanding releasing fingers of light What look with each flash the crib shook He tried to roll over But he couldn't He closed his eyes when he opened them again His parents were there Neither of their faces were visible. They both looked like someone had grabbed their heads and twisted His father peered down into the crib How did he know that how did he know that they were his parents if his their faces weren't visible Who's subjective rags? Jesus. Hold on. Hold on. We we we haven't read all of it yet We can't take him out of context. Maybe he explains it. Yeah, his mother's hair hung from her face like a melted mass Her head is not hung from your face Maybe it was like mind keep in mind her head is twisted backwards. So he Okay, okay They circled the crib and the flashes in the sky and the vibrations from the ground came with each step They took mutilated giants stomping around the baby Oh the parent. Okay. Okay I'm following I think yeah, I gotcha The blinking stars continued to grow brighter The dark sky was filling with light But his parents kept growing larger like they were fighting to keep the crib in shadows The ground shook again and this time it didn't stop Reese's parents put their hands on the rim of the crib They leaned down to him. His mother's hair covered his tiny body She she whispered something and then began to scream The light was burning them from the sky chunks of her face were peeling away and falling through her hair They landed around him and continued to burn Well So the uh, baby having a night so right at the beginning of this of the paragraph He said that it was nighttime and then said it was nighttime again if I remember correctly Yeah, it starts off with the nightmares started on the first night And then it goes into he was in the middle of a field in the middle of a night. Well, that's That's I'd have recommendations for editing on that one. I have read that's all it's not I'm not saying I could write better I'm saying I'd rather have recommendation. That's it. Um well What do you guys think? I mean, well if you've reviewed books before what's what's your take? um, well It it's It's interesting However, I do want to draw some attention to the fact that interstellar marines is only the first part in a series of absolutely incredible novels by Joseph Anderson these novels include the wizard and the dragon You can are they are they capitalized? Um, no Well, the wizard and dragon parts the words are like 50 times the size of the other words in the title. Oh He's also got such works as interstellar soldiers The monster slayer series one the monster slayer series two The bounty hunter series one two and three The lost starship The haunting of moon base 13 Oh, well that you know that could be that sounds moment 13 as well And uh, just just so all of you know um The cover art looks like Well for a lack of better terms it looks like it's made in gary's mod Uh, I've added I've added fio to the chat now. Hello there. Hi there. Oh, it's got a voice now I was I was concerned you might end up with like one of the crappy bikes or something that ends up happening Is it a reasonable quality? No, it sounds good to me Wonderful. I was afraid it might be like like a screaming 10 year old british kid I'm afraid you've hit the british part, but oh my history banger Oh, yeah Yeah, you got me history philosophy How uh, how are you? How's your day? Um night, but yeah doing great But no, well, it's the morning. I yeah, it might be for me because this is what I've been doing all fucking day Yeah, me wolford rides don't have a life. You know, it's just how it goes preaching to the choir here Oh, um, I'm assuming you're you a fan of joseph and one of us three or maybe all of us three, I don't know um Found moeller first, uh, which one of us do you hate the least? Oh, that's a good question Probably fringy. He's green. Yeah, I was about to say fringy. Sorry. What? What? Uh, but yeah, uh, I've found joseph and his videos in passing before not Payed a huge amount of attention to them, but He always had this Way of speaking, I guess way of speaking. Yeah, it's condescension. Let's just be blunt about it. It's the condescension and it's abjectly horrible to listen to especially when he's just Wrong, I don't know what you mean the comments we've collected are just so friendly and happy It's implied by the basics of communication. Don't you like it when people tell you that? Not really especially since one of my modules on this year on the philosophy side is language I'm studying language and joseph anderson is telling me how communication works Well, what did you have you did you see this whole stream? Or were you in sort of the later part of it? Um, I caught all of this stream. I missed the Oh, well, because I was busy. What do you what do you think of our take on language? Considering we're all none of us have studied it. I don't think or at least official capacity I did it in year 12. That was my My subject that I did the best in at school was english I was gonna say I did english language in gcse and a level but I don't know if that's really comparable to like Taking it to actually studying at university. Yeah for the most part taken as Uh in sort of like as a working usage of language rather than trying to delve down the philosophical rabbit hole and find out what things really mean or whatever Your way of using language seems perfectly reasonable. It allows discussion to take place In fact, I'd say it's almost Identical sometimes to the way joseph is using it, but he just uses different words and assumes that they mean different things For example, I'm pretty sure if you put The idea of an objective opinion and a subjective opinion to him in the form of a rational and an irrational opinion He would agree with you Which doesn't like the is semantics, isn't it? That's what it comes down. Yeah Doesn't like he's bogged down in the semantics. He hates the word objective The definition of opinion would support more. So would it be us or him? Easily you guys like well That's interesting. Obviously, we're not saying that you trump everything, but it's just interesting to hear your opinion Obviously, it's it's in the english dictionary It doesn't have to be based on facts or knowledge But it does not say that it is not based on Facts or knowledge that reminds me of the thing I said That is a lot like what you said um So, uh, what was the was it the history comments that made you want to write your comment on his video or uh, yeah Don't bring my don't bring my beloved into this it happens an awful lot in um In critical analysis in everything of this particular field People will try and drag history in as if history has some kind of comparison I don't such a weird. Yeah, like I guess it's because there's a perception that history is always sort of set in stone Maybe like maybe that's just what it is because yeah, that happens in the past It's probably because the term here Historiography as opposed to history is not as well known Historiography being the study of how history is studied and the concept of historical debate. So people I don't think he's covering that in his uh, his 14 minute video People still debate how like whether certain events could have been avoided So on and so forth who bears responsibility for certain events in history and such like these are debates that happen um, what's what's your reaction to his comment that uh His fallout his fallout full video Gets to more people than some people get to in their entire lives well It was relatable for a while, but now i'm here. So significantly less so because That's just that's just harsh. You can't put down people's ambitions of Like telling people things that they care about telling people about things and like generally criticizing and analyzing the things that they are passionate about like that It's just rude cruel uncalled for Almost vicious The thing is it's like it seems like he didn't even in to be I'm not sure better or worse. Yeah, like he didn't know what he was saying almost Like you he looked at it as innocuous. It was just like, it's just the thing that's true. And it's like, dude, you It's it's dangerously close to i'm fucking better than you In so many of his sentences, it's just the syntax you can clearly see there's So there's so many problems like in that sentence There's so many ways he could have phrased that that it does not come across as an attack on people who do not have the same platform as he has He doesn't even need the second part. He can say there are many people viewing my videos Uh, I would even not I wouldn't put it that way myself either. I would be like my videos can exude influence Uh, that's it. That's all you need actually for his his point That's all that's necessary to make the point he was making. He didn't the last bit. It's just a jab Yeah, it's just like I I have more influence than most people do in their entire lives in one day And less than matematosis Well, he's got more subs than matematosis, but he doesn't have the respect of matematosis Not at all. Matematosis is one of the best Sort of he's my he's my favorite. He's great. Yeah, he's my favorite. Excellent I don't know who he is. Wolf's a bad picture. He needs to watch how it starts Matematosis iosha infinite. Yeah, that one was really great. That one was fantastic I will have to check it out. Everyone's been fawning over him and I'm like, I don't know Everybody's been e fapping over His devil may cry commentary is great as well. Even if uh a bit on the long side, but I don't imagine that's a problem for anyone here Um, I'm just trying to get it Sorry, what did you say? I didn't actually catch I was doing something No, I just said his devil may cry, uh commentary was good as well, but Clocking in at six hours if I'm not mistaken. Was it six? I think a lot of the people from this Yeah, it's totally the right crowd for this one. Uh, we've got his reply up to to uh, Chris Adams I was gonna say if if you've got it rags we can tackle this now with uh, with theo if you'd like Yeah, I've gone and found the comment as well Oh, it's I mean I could read it if you want to read it rags. It's up to it's up to you Um, you're oh, I had it. I closed the thingy People think this video was good. I'm like this is fucking shit This is we're looking up which one jones's uh the response to chris adams So if you find chris adams, yeah, so, um, joseph comes back and says um To me less thumbs up as a thing. Uh, so as a service to you, uh, I say so he quotes Here's your problem. You still label all your videos as critiques Uh, this is great for seo and promoting your channel. Do I should I just read the responses parts or do I need to read the I guess we need the context in case. I don't know. It's up to you um Let me see so He's quoting here's your problem. You still label all your videos as critiques This is great for seo and promoting your channel, but it implies to your audience Analyzing and comparing objective values with and between games as long as you're actually doing that. It's fine That's not the part of the videos people like me take issue with But when you say things like summa fails as a horror game dark souls has no story This fight is not fun or challenging or hollow nights pacing is bad without qualifying these statements at all It comes across as extremely combative Not just for people who enjoyed those games But for people who appreciate a certain quality of writing from the analysts they listen to Joseph responds These statements were qualified in the videos. You are incorrect Aside from the dark souls has no story one, but I don't believe I've ever explicitly said that in a video Only in the comments or other discussions outside of the critiques So if you because if he if he implied it in a video and then confirmed it in a comment This is the thing. He doesn't actually need to argue against the person's argument considering He's already said well implied subjectivity so meh, but dark souls has a story It does it does have a story Like so that's just incorrect entirely. There is a plot. Let's see what the Yeah, I mean some people say that like, you know, you're the undead and you're going from one boss to another and you get to the end It's not really a story. It's like there's still even if you think it's thread beer. There's a story There is a story. Yeah, there's clearly a sequence of events that take place that yeah, exactly And there's a conclusion to the story as well a conclusion to the narrative That's just your opinion It has an obtuse story. It has a story that you have to Know why but it's it exists There you go Joseph says Soma fails as a horror game was discussed at length with examples to support why I think so in the video I'm pretty sure I talk about why I think this for 10 minutes And his references were pitiful and a lot of them was subjective It's like I was as good by this and finally even if they he had everything right you wouldn't be able to make the statement You made You can't make the statement Soma fails as a horror game in any way other it's just wrong like I don't know what what criteria you have In which that is valid. It's like it doesn't make sense But you know That statement works is if Soma didn't scare him and that cannot qualify as Soma failing as a horror game You realize all you should have said is Soma didn't scare me and you're like, oh, why didn't you say that? Because you have to be because you have to be stupid Said he said he's has to be impactful. That's an impactful say do you remember how he delivers it? He does each word at a time he goes Soma is not a horror game. It isn't scary. He likes pauses his video to do it He's just impactful. Also someone said why are you not um Getting all your references and responding in a video instead of shit posting you're better than this I want to address the person. I'm working on videos on something else. This is something I can do Uh with instead of not doing it at all And I think we've done a really good job to be honest We've been going for hours. We took I I did all the references in advance. We've all seen the video in advance We we've done our best to actually argue for joseph hannison a lot of sections We broke down the I think it's due to with the fact that he defines words differently But he's also extremely pretentious. He doesn't deal well with criticism and he's smug as fuck And I think most importantly Everybody here would be keen to actually talk to him about this Oh, and I am salty about soma I don't mind that. Yeah, because what joseph hannison said was fucking retarded And it and it did the thing that movie uh film bob was talking about in the previous e-fab the one about uh Shinobi where he said that cinema sins will actually cost Sales by telling people movies are bad when they're not Joseph costs frictional game sales by telling people that soba's not a horror game Which is not true. So it's just this is the kind of read this like I think I I I'm salty. Yeah, I'm salty I didn't scare me. It's not a horror game Anyway, that's the standard He states that he discussed at length with examples to support why he thinks soma fails as a horror game But then he backpedals to state that subjectivity is implied and that he is talking subjectively from his opinion the moment his qualifiers are attacked Yeah, that's what's happening here. He doesn't respond to he doesn't defend the qualifiers. He just abandons them and runs away And even then It's going from from his perspective. It's not a horror game if it doesn't scare me Which again, which is factually incorrect. That's it's not an action because it's I've got to be honest. I would abandon that qualifier if it was my position to defend It just Yeah, that's what most people that's what I why can't you just say that? Why can you just be like, yeah, what it means is I uh, I didn't find the game scary Even a little bit and then someone says why didn't you just say that and you'd go next time? I will because obviously this is not translating my ideas correctly And I've got a different take on on what these words mean, but most people don't just share that take so So um Quote this fight is not fun or challenging joseph says you're going to have to be more specific about um I think this is that guy's comment on his comment. I think I don't know joseph. This is joseph saying this It's just really poorly written. Okay So that's why it confused me Because i'm reading this and it doesn't form a cohesive thought so I have to stop and my brain has to catch up You're going to have to be specific about when you think I said this without giving a reason why But I am confident that I have always backed a statement like that up with evidence The only video I may have not done that was in the dark souls 2 level design embosses I think that's my worst video so I'd agree there. I criticized this one for that I used a quote from it as a bad piece of writing so He agrees yay Quote hollow knight's pacing is bad Joseph says I went into arguably too much detail justifying this claim So I cannot begin to understand how you can say that I don't qualify these sorts of criticisms Like this one isn't even remotely close It's so out of the realm of accuracy that I question if he even wants the video Unfortunately, I have to watch the video to know Too long on something what happens if you're qualifies or you're Kind of irrelevant or pointless or what if they contradict how he like this video here Like he contradicts himself in this video here He can shoot his own point to pieces because he goes on for too long eventually He contradicts himself and which one of the two things are we supposed to take its value? Which so next up seems smarter Uh I'm so so quote. I'm certain that you know this anyone who had a different experience than you could challenge you improve you Wrong, you're clearly aware that opinions work this way since you mentioned early in the video that these challenges have been Positive to you since your very first video But instead of altering your language since then Maybe asking yourself what you could do differently to avoid vitriolic retorts like this one You've consistently doubled down to the point where you are now blaming your audience for taking issue with the things you say Joseph says I have not doubled down The opposite is true. I have made a concerted effort to say in my opinion I think that More often than I think I should because of comments about objectivity In my most opinion-based video, I even gave it a title that communicated without any ambiguity whatsoever that I was presenting My own perspective How can you look at the previous video and think that I've learned that I've leaned harder into the issue? I don't know. We've already tackled how the title does not automatically It's just so ridiculous He shouldn't he agree with me if I say the title of my video is this is all my opinion And then I start stating facts throughout the entire thing So then he with his definitions he would be like well that video title is inaccurate Like what what I'm getting at here is he's like I even named it that and it's like it doesn't matter what the title is If that's not the content of the video Also, someone they did highlight you skipped the by the way part uh rags of what you said about the Hollow Knight one Just under the Hollow Knight bit Oh, there's a line there. He says by the way, I'm not saying my reasoning for any of these is airtight and 100% correct But you're not saying that you're claiming that I didn't qualify any of these statements, which is not true So going I can't we can't know for sure unless we watch those videos um quote beyond that Let me see Quote beyond that you're strawmaning legitimate criticisms of the way you word and structure your video Watching a movie and saying I didn't like that to open a discussion is entirely different to an hour long video called quote Dark Souls 3 critique But even that even but even making that ridiculous for the laziest comparison is missing the point of the arguments against your content You want to freely mix and match your objective statements with your subjective ones? You want to call your videos a critique and discuss objective merits of design elements? But you also want to put your opinions in the middle of these sections It's fine if you want to do that, but I'm sure you understand that it's bad writing Joseph says This goes against what I say in the video above this comment section So what's happening here? Did you not pay attention or do you not believe me? There are no qualitative objective statements in my videos There never have been there never will be there is no mixing and matching there is any statement Yeah, any statement about merits is subjective Any statement about merits is subjective So he says he says yeah, let me just let me just check the definition of merit The quality of being particularly good or worthy and what is worthy it'd be like it depends on what standard you're looking for Well, we've already we already know the definition of good and good can be qualified in an objective, yeah This is not 100 subjective. It depends on what you're fucking saying joseph Yeah, he says any statement about merits is subjective no exceptions The only objective statements are directly from in-game evidence and have no judgment about quality The they are examples to support subjective points. What does people think quality means? only subjective like The standard the the degree to which you achieve a standard equals quality and the standard can be how it made you feel The standard can be how efficient is this hammer? In terms of its, you know balance its weight its blah blah blah. There's all these different You know talk to my epic turtle. You are incorrect Uh, we're uh turtle says worthy and good require a value-based framework which can only be subjective No, I don't agree Well, it depends if he's arguing from that whole everything is subjective thing, which if he is yeah, that's fine, but that's a worldview difference You know, like yes, it is objective the scissors example can be judged through objective objective standards Having the qualities required for a particular role Once you name what that role is You have objective standards by which to judge them The thing i'm curious about is if you in a vacuum like ignoring the context of his previous videos Ask to joseph anderson if he believes the statement I mean first off, it's called a statement If you asked him if he thinks the statement soma fails as a horror game Is a definitive judgment about a subject or a personal feeling on the matter. What would he say? Everyone would say Yeah, but now I feel like he'd say the lato. Oh, you would yeah to defend himself But that's but that's why i'm saying without the context of his videos. Oh, then the format. Yeah right Yeah, he's wrong. He'll he'll pick whichever one he needs to escape out the back door Yeah, so Quote put more simply you want to create content without anyone who watches it holding you to any account to that end We now have a 14 minute video of you smugly talking down to your audience about how we don't understand language In heavily implying that anyone who disagrees with you just isn't smart enough to watch or engage with your content Then you have to nerve to preach about holding a discussion to a better standard Joseph says If you want to link to a point where you think i'm talking down to my audience and explain why to me Then feel encouraged to do so because I don't believe I did that I believe mohler has a list Holy fuck joseph you are just on another warhead. There's there's a few there's a few examples And that's one video. Yeah, which how long is that video 14 minutes? mean geez yeah interesting Uh, wow. All right It didn't do nothing. Yeah, like we're not saying anything right now. It's just like we're we're in disbelief. Like do you actually need us to Like he actually doesn't think that he said any of those In this video here. This is the problem. I think he doesn't even realize he's talking down to his audience Damn, man. I said like that's like we were saying when we were watching it I would never say some of those things about my audience that he did. Yeah, it's really bizarre To be honest, it's just I'm surprised He has explicitly stated he believes his audience doesn't understand how conversations work if they're criticizing his previous video And how is that not what are you talking about? I didn't smugly tell my audience like, oh, you know, I More people are gonna see my video than they'll Like come on joe Are you are you really going to try and sit here and jerk us around and tell us that you didn't say that I'm just wondering again if you sent him the timestamp. Would he How would he respond to that or would he respond? That's just subjective What's interesting is that if I If I looked at my if I looked at my comment section and said these people don't understand me Then that's my fault When he's when he looks at his audience and says they don't understand me. He says that's their fault I mean I'd say the context for you looking at your audience and there's like one guy in 10 million that disagrees It might not be your fault But in the case of having outliers notwithstanding But if you get several essay-long content with Comments that are stacking up on your video that are in massive disagreement and disappointment with you. There's some things up some things up That well, yeah, that's right. And might not necessarily Like that you're wrong, but there is definitely Something that's happening Yeah, there's something at least And why not then engage with those people? Well, I think he thinks that he is engaging with them. That's a thing. He probably thinks that this was a good response Yes, he is This is the direct opposite of engagement. He's made an entire video justifying not engaging with his audience Anyway, it it moves on Quote I have much to my dismay watched the quality of your writing deteriorate over the years But worse than that I've watched your integrity as a game critic deteriorate as well Joseph responds Examples you criticize me above for not qualifying statements and then drop this with nothing to back it up whatsoever It's a youtube comment. So that's cool. You don't have to but you said you're trying to provide constructive feedback And these sorts of statements are worthless He's not necessarily wrong Wait a second. I thought No opinions were worthless Oh, it pays to have memory, doesn't it? Oh That's kind of fucked up You sort of it's funny because we said when he said it that there is such a thing as a worthless Opinion surely A lot of the time we've been holding him to his own standard not necessarily Yeah, that's yeah, that's all this is really like That's rough. But um, this person has provided I can't I mean they provided examples But the thing is like the somer example that goes back to 2015 So, you know, they would need to be more specific if they wanted to make some kind of Extended criticism I guess but it's just funny that he did go back on his his own statement there. It's interesting Um all the consistency that we do expect from joseph anerson, of course um He goes on so he quotes this video more than anything is proof that you're comfortable resting on your laurels And when challenged you will say things like my video on fallout 4 exerts more influence in one day than anything you create in your life Hearing statements like that from a content creator is hearing a death knell for the creativity and passion for which you once subscribed to them But more than that it shows how deeply couch they are on their own ego So joseph replies That statement has the opposite meaning of what you're taking It's demonstrating it's demonstrating that I have a responsibility to support the statements I make in my videos because they have that much influence humble product It's supporting what you said above about qualifying statements in the videos Except that I'm arguing that I'm consistently doing that I consistently do so I also say right before that my opinion is not worth more than anyone else's How is this about ego because you said that more people listen to you in a day than many people listen to their entire lives I don't know. What's the disconnect there joseph? You wrote that He just doesn't see it Why let me let me give you an example joseph You're in the you're in the gym and you have a friend you go with every day, but you only do Like cardio You're just trying to lose some weight and this friend is doing full-on muscle work And every day he comes in and he says hmm. I'm stronger than you and then he carry on working and you're just like okay Okay, and it's like why did you say it and he goes oh well I just wanted to make you aware that uh, that's the kind of routine we're doing I'm doing like strength and pick up a muscle work while you're doing running and stuff It's like why you could just said that you didn't need to say that you're Then you go there's a bit ego that he goes how is it about my ego? It's true It's just There's a better way to get these ideas across the song You don't even need to make the point. He's making with reference to his influence. No, I didn't I have a responsibility to support the statements I make if you have 10 subscribers you can make that statement I Have a responsibility to support the statements I make Yeah, you don't even need to Yeah, regardless of how many people listen to you Yeah Let me I want to clarify by the way for people Because I know that people will feel like it's an unfair comparison What I'm highlighting is that there's ways to get information across to people and how you will choose to do it It'll often have a telling statement about what your your actual goals are all how big your ego is and Yes, there is a huge problem with with with ego within people of not realizing it and not checking it themselves And you often need friends to check it for you or people who know you Um, this is gonna be something that any youtuber deals with because you you are putting your Your words out there as if they should be listened to that's why you make the videos You're like people should listen to this. It's not just for me. That's why I'm putting it out there So to translate certain messages to people You can choose many ways of doing it And just the way that he did that is very telling that's that's that's what the the point is Like we said when we covered it, it doesn't even matter if it's true. That's not the point Um, he's adopting he's adopting the objective formal critique style of Game analysis, but he's unwilling to accept the baggage that comes along with that In the form of having to defend your opinion after it has been stated Mm-hmm The fact that's actually when it's your job Yeah, that's because when when you tell someone something they are not obligated to believe you They are free to question the premises on which you make your conclusions And when they do that joseph anderson runs away A little bit. It's so bizarre I genuinely don't understand it Yeah, yeah, we've got just a bit left. Yeah, I was at the end So he quotes at this point accepting a challenge on your content is admitting to yourself that maybe your work isn't as you think it Despite what you say, you don't want discussion. You can no longer take criticism You don't want people airing conflicting opinions on your videos But you absolutely cannot admit that to yourself or to your audience listening listening to you talk from about 430 onwards was hilarious to me because you typically won't engage with descending commenters And will instead rely on your adoring fans to lambast us into silence on your behalf You are perfectly willing to sit tight in your echo chamber instead of responding to the people who don't agree with you And don't can be wrong I don't blame you dealing with a scope of negativity typically found in the comment section of just one youtube video is extremely taxing But then having to turn around and profess that discussions must include opinions from all angles while knowing for a fact that You don't practice this principle demonstrates in no uncertain terms what a hypocrite you are Joseph says This part is why I decided to respond because this is total bullshit. Have you gone through all the Have you gone through all the comments on all my videos? Read all of my twitter replies and sat in on every stream and discord discussion Because if you haven't you have no idea what you're talking about I discuss my points with my audience all the time How can you even begin to think that you can speak so confidently about this when you clearly have no idea What you're talking about did you even look to see how many comments? I replied to you on the last video Reach back how condescending you're being when you are literally talking out of your ass. Ah, that's not what literally means joseph literally Brighter joseph you should know what words mean you do not need to make up shit to criticize me I'm sure there's enough you can find and make an argument on um Yeah, I just you know, it's amusing that he's got the whole uh You being condescending it's like Yeah, um It would take moments maybe minutes to go to his previous video find someone providing Counter arguments or just disagreeing with his stance and then You know find an example of him being dismissive towards that person Yeah, and I think what the person's highlighting isn't that he doesn't respond and ignores everyone It's the like his form of I guess responding is like evasion or He's not how do I put this like when you when you to take criticism to take criticism isn't just about responding to it Like reading and responding um So yeah, but but the guy joseph's right if you don't look at every single conversation He's ever had I suppose you can't say that he will never take criticism or cannot take criticism Um, but those are obvious. I would I would assume those are hyperbolic statements. We don't know The hyperbola is implied Yeah Yeah, well joseph and didn't pick that up so his entire comment was fairly hyperbolic So from the overall tone of it, it's easy to infer that he's being hyperbolic again Yeah, like if joseph thinks this guy is saying that he's seen every single conversation taken place between joseph and any one of his fans Maybe you're looking a little too far into it because I wouldn't have assumed that myself All right, so Uh, he is to wrap it up quote in short this video was terrible And I hope on some level you realize that it's heartening to me to see that most of the people commenting here are calling you on your Bullshit despite the disproportionate like dislike ratio And joseph answers most of the commenters agree with the video I know this because I have read almost all of them. Something tells me you haven't Appeals of popularity fallacy that that's great. Um Well, yeah, so he said it's haunting me to see that Well, he's in fairness He said most of the people commenting here calling you on your bullshit and he's saying Most of the commenters agree with the video that is an actual fair counter If it was in response to the video is terrible that most people liked it that you'd be right But uh, yeah That's that's that we could keep going because there's a thread that uh continues. I don't I mean, we will literally be here forever I was gonna say I think I think it's good to to halt it there that is Joseph Anderson having a lot of difficulty with with his fan base currently in and I'd say the main point seems to be the idea of Objectivity versus subjectivity and the delivery of those ideas that seems to be it We know that joseph does not take criticism. Well, I mean Mauler wasn't it you that like found he argued with someone who left a review on one of his books Calling him a troll. I think so, but Again, I'd have to get the quotes to be able to make anything definitive, but I remember being amused That's very subjective Uh, but yeah that video I mean, well, let's let's just do what we usually do. Uh, let's go from the left Wolf what's your take on his video subjectivity is implied It made me want to kill myself well That's a fair take it's confused it's He doesn't I don't think even he knows what he's on about anymore I reckon if he was to remake the video, it would be completely different again because it's just he's he's so unfocused on the actual idea I'm not fully convinced to even knows what the problem people had with him was Yeah um rex I think that's I think that was pretty much what I was going to say I don't think he quite understands the issue that people have Which is easy when your tactic is to kind of make up stuff that they're saying instead and then Talk down to them in a really condescending way and say that Essentially, they that they don't understand and that's their fault and not my fault Even the one i'm the one doing the talking and the communicating uh fringy bad I like to have the conclusion I'm just like what my opinion just watched this entire reefer podcast, but it's just like yeah the the two log didn't watch is uh straw manned his audience What I would love to have a chat with him. I would be very happy to actually talk to him about it That's what I say It would be nice and well Anybody got to take on what damage it could deal to his channel because I I think he'll sail past this if he just stops talking about it If he doesn't double down again, he's fine If he doubles down again I think he's good I think if he chooses to move on with analysis, I I Bet you he's gonna have jabs in his videos from now on So when he's save for example, he's just doing a mario game and he's like, uh, mario's jump takes three moons to be able to do here That's objective by the way You know stuff like that and you'll be like, hi joseph. All right I can see it Yeah, if he doubles down again, he's gonna go the way of downward thrust and pretty much immediately Yeah, I'd say relevancy You probably want to stop Like for his own interest Because if he does stop then people just let it go But if a third video comes out that sucks Then people are gonna start being like, okay, man. Like just it's time to stop I want to call you know how when you look in the comments of a downward video, you see a bunch of people Like there's just memes of all this shit. Yeah continuously does The same thing's gonna happen with joseph. Even the people who agree with joseph on this are gonna start to get embarrassed for him They'll be like to just drop it just drop it Like the they there's loads of comments like that on his is one right now They're like, you didn't need to make this video. This is like, you know isn't it um But yeah, uh people are asking it's like, yeah, of course joseph's welcome to come on to efap to discuss his ideas I think it would be great, but it's never gonna happen because I insulted him and besides at this point If someone was to give him the insult counter from the efaps we've covered about Like joseph, they've insulted you between them like 30 times in in my defense. I haven't actually Yeah, but you're on We've all insulted him by proxy because we are associated with mohler, right, okay They'll say, you know mohler insulted him and fringy just stood there. He just stood there He stood by and watched us be so mean You're just a bystander fringy You know that that video of those like two high schoolers one guy's like Yeah, I saw a girl about to be raped and the other one was like, so what you do nothing and then he was like, no wait then time pauses And he's like, hey guys, don't do what my friend does and do nothing doing nothing's part of the problem Then he walks away and his friend is still stuck in time So before we leave I've I've not read any super chats for this entire stream So I'm gonna have to get through them So if any of you guys want to do anything be it go You could even leave if you really want to because we'll probably be wrapping up after this But I'm gonna go through all of these and one fell swoop I planned on sleeping for six hours, but I guess I'll watch wolves coming out as a centrist past me the blue rhino milk beautiful Stream two electric boogaloo. Yes, you can tell this is right at the beginning e-fap with the women Oh, shit. We had a female guest yet We're not to this. Oh, I didn't ask them all their identities. That's true. Fringy could be a girl It's true I could be anytime I want two streams in a row. You absolute mad lads thoughts on achievements of fairy race on tiktok I have no idea that the fairies are on tiktok I have no idea what's tiktok. It's like I don't know what it is. It's like a new vision of um Fire, what's the one where you do stuff on your phone like quick videos vine? It's like that but different Yeah, all right Come on. Well, I just take joseph on a date under the moonlight and have a girl to Girl talk this passive aggressive video to stream is not fun. I mean I'd be up for that He's just never gonna he doesn't want to come on. So All I can do is I mean because this has been one of the most relevant videos to cover on e-fap in terms of how me Wolfen and rags and was he by extension anybody else who agrees with us uh breaks down media Or at least presents arguments. So like If joseph doesn't want to come on then we're gonna use it to sort of bounce off ideas anyway Uh, it should be About 10 minutes 30 minutes later. We were a little late. I'll agree. Is it too much e-fapping makes you go blind? Yes, yes, so be careful folks. So we limit it to only two a day Rags, where are you new videos? It's been so long. They're in the works. They're in the works Now things are back in works You'll be pleased with what you see probably probably Uh, opinions are courses and opinions are course and rough and they get everywhere. That's uh undeniable Uh, Hideo Kojima just announced spooky game four Is that okay, excuse me? I'm not sure how to take that one joseph anison second e-fap wolf's back hell Yeah, I know right? It's a the party today Uh, what a lovely evening especially listening to e-fap playing monster hunter wield on pc and drinking a soothing mug of nutritious rhino milk That's just It's beautiful. Um Yeah, thanks, uh, neil druckman just announced massive fagotry two. It's the same guy I I don't get the memes. Uh, joseph anison writes shitty check out line tier novels How's that for a subjective opinion joey? That was before you'd read anything wolf? Yeah, that was a couple hours before Is that wolf's voice holy shit? Welcome back and hello to you mauler and everyone else Hello No, this is the voice of kwinton I mean Quentin impression you have to be like I fucking hate trump Unless you got to start with trump Damn it mauler. I wanted to make a video about this now the e-fap is going to do a better more thorough job than I subjectivity is never implied um We never really talked about that. What is it for something to be implied? It's like It comes with it setting probably that maybe the setting like the social setting just walked out of a Revenge sure like wouldn't you Can something be definitively implied or would it be no, I don't think so. I mean gets a case by case Because like if I tell you You know, I threw up my apple you could be like what's implied that he ate the apple, but it could have been shoved down my throat You know You know what I mean like it's complicated strange example. I know throw up my apple It's implied that gravity is still in effect Oh I haven't floated off somewhere yet. Oh, that's that's very subjective Yeah, it's just contextual. I'd say uh The trinity is back together. It's good to have you back wolf. Just wasn't the same without you. Welcome back He's even a heart on it Oh I missed the first hour of this e-fap sadly and even as someone who usually likes joseph's videos The stream is wonderful. Keep at it fellas Yeah, I mean disclaimer time don't attack joseph. He's a nice nice man He's much more How do I put this non-offensively? Compared to the other people we've covered. I do feel joseph is far more effective at his purpose being that he does more research He tends to try and do a better job. It's just that sometimes He makes shitty videos like the horror one and the subjective one and it seems to be a result of him being Just high off his own ego to the point where you can't even tell That telling people they don't understand basic communication is not condescending like Ridiculous, but yeah, he's still not awful or anything and you know Be nice to him. If anything go on his video and say there's a there's a wonderful e-fapping afoot, you know, like the That might really confuse him Uh, if only you know the power of opinions, I get that one Did you hear the tragedy of Darth opinion the condescending? It's not a story most youtubers would tell you revenge of the goshed milk and the women Okay, if so if a comedy scares me is it now a horror According to joseph Uh, because genre is subjective that actually might be something he agrees with but I can't say Apparently genre is results based rather than intent based. Yes, which is not some in a I don't think any of us five agree with at all I don't think I'd subscribe to that Which is better ghost ice cream or rhino ice that's supposed to be milk. Definitely that looks like ice cream though So ghost milk or rhino milk guys. Let's get the definitive answer here There actually was a bunch of people posting, uh Ghost ice cream and rhino ice cream wouldn't ghost milk be in corporeal Yeah, but if rhino milk is bad enough then you would prefer the ghost one because it is in corporeal And it's it's not as hard to drink. I imagine the ghost one would be colder So I'd probably go with that one. That's good enough. I think I think ghost milk might be the preference actually Yeah, it seems about right America is not a country. It's never been there. You need to put in my opinion at the end of that Surge Geez wolf is back. Did efab get his name from every frame of painting also watch scott decison derrickson on Sean carol's podcast Ghost milk is wet. Um, it did come from a combination of every frame of painting The fact that we do pause constantly and the abbreviation just being perfect That's why we ended up going with it. Well, in fairness, it was the top voted as well because the other one was uh video response theory, which Was close considering what happened. We're just right But I think that name would have waned after a certain amount of time Because the meme would be more and more confusing as time goes on because people like what why do you call it there? But efab, you know, that just works on its own Um, Joseph Anderson 2020 make opinions great again. Of course Joseph can't handle the truth Joseph's apparently an author so could that tell so So be that could tell you if he's bad or not Well, I think we are What is this stream about could I get a quick rundown? Well, I guess if you're still here that was 220 that was like an hour and a half ago, um It was essentially an analysis Anderson was doing a dumb thing and we talked about it. Yeah His newest video we've done an analysis if you will or uh, I guess you could call it a Reaction of a bunch of guys just chillin Speaking of jojo I think you guys would like the anime jojo bazaar's adventure bazaar adventure the animation is a bit crazy The writing is tight also hunter x hunter We get I don't know if I'd describe the writing is tight As somebody's watched it There's nothing objective about art though, so Oh my bad. Sorry. Yeah Oh Yeah, but yeah, we get we get a lot of anime recommendations if we just see them all We can then satisfy everybody, right? Yeah, I made a I watched a bunch of anime over my break because people kept like Telling me you got to watch berserk. You got to watch this you got to watch that So half my break was absorbed with anime and house hell Oh, yes I feel like to some degree a lot of what joseph does is try to show how much of a big brave boy He is by not being scared of horror games Uh, if you remember we did read it out on the the e-fap, but he did say that Uh, his assumption When he first got criticism of his video was that everyone's embarrassed that they got scared where he didn't which was just Again, how is that not good? You know what that's going on the list actually You've got to be willing to meet the game halfway And like at least let it at least let it try and do its thing instead of going. Oh, I'm a big boy I'm not gonna get well instead of saying it's literally impossible for you to be scary because of respawn So I'm never gonna do this as a horror game It's like Come on, man Uh glad I was told what to believe by jesus anderson. Yeah, it's beautiful. It's beautiful process. Uh, Is this bretkeed's new book situation? That's a deep meme, uh I've been writing fantasy novels, but I think I'll hang up my hat now. I just can't compare to the majesty that is subjective Of course, uh, hey wolf. Can you do a reading of my jordan jordan peterson erotic fan fiction? Okay, I'll I'll work on my kermit the frog voice and I'll get back to you Uh, wow the e-fap started before work and it's still going. Oh, yeah I mean we've we started the first water. I don't even want to think about that Hey wolf, is water wet or does it simply come into contact with other physical objects and make them wet? Oh dear, okay. Well, um, this is like the atraps gay question Well, uh, you know I guess eric was right. I am a centrist. I'm gonna say that water is moist Because the water is both wet and dry. I have definition to look at moist Slightly wet, but yes, we we are through that's that's everything. Um, it's not as much as I expected I guess this is also the second stream. Yeah, I mean fucking hell We've done a lot today. So for anybody who's actually like watching both of these, um, you can go to sleep now You can give back to your lives And yeah, as for like the next e-fap unless this is like emergency stuff where a video comes out That we're just desperate to reply to like we'll probably take a little bit of a break considering that was three e-faps in the course of six days Five days. So You know, it's such a thing as too many e-fappings right guys. That's a thing Yeah, guys dangerous after a while. Yeah, I mean gotta gotta respect the refractory period, man But do you do you guys I don't know if there's anything you any of you want to say? No, I I just need to I need to eat we got we got content on the way Yes, Wolf will obviously be on e-faps from now on I think is that right? Yeah, yeah neat and obviously, uh, thanks for being a guest on as usual fringy, um, if you want Yeah, obviously, I almost forgot if you want to promote your uh your channel if you're working on stuff But I got nothing to say at the minute So it's so useful what I can do that. It's like check out this channel. I'd be like, I'm not doing anything on it Well, check out the Follow me on twitter man for the for the lull There you go Hard to ghost rhino milk. Thank you emergency guest. Theo for your comment and your contribution contributions to the stream It's appreciated. Thank you very much for having me You were like it was like seeing just a right in the chat only this was more pleasant Me and wolf are like the we caught with the cookie the head of the cookie jar with just right. We were like, oh, hey Um, but yeah, uh, that's it then thank you all for watching and for the generous donations We will see you next time for whatever we've got planned who knows. Um, goodbye. Goodbye You