 Let me be clear with you before you watch this interview with the Chief Operating Officer and Head of Product for BMC Bikes globally. This topic, interview, whatever you want to call it, was not their idea. In fact, if anything they were a little reluctant, but I push for it because I read your comments and I know that the price of mainstream bikes is a very hot topic right now and I wanted to hear it directly from the horse's mouth. Now interestingly, I reached out to the Australian distributor for BMC Bikes. Advanced traders just recently asking for the recommended retail price for as far back as we could go on the BMC Team Machine SLRO1. Now, keep in mind, there is an SLR model, which is about just over a third of the price of the SLRO1, but because I own the SLRO1 and I've done a lot of content on the channel on that bike in recent times, that's what I decided to ask for. And as you can see here is the last seven years on the Team Machine SLRO1, frame set in Australian dollars. The integrated handlebar, which costs over a thousand dollars stand alone, is the main contributor to the rise in price. But all in all, considering the recent global increases in material costs, shipping, logistics, energy, which I left out of this discussion because that applies to everyone, those prices were or increases were less than I envisaged. I don't know about you, you can let me know below, which makes me ponder, maybe we should be shifting our attention to the likes of CAMPAC, Shimano and SRAM. And if anyone out there is listening from those companies, can we just please bring back mechanical rim brake? There was simply nothing wrong with it. That's a fair question. I mean, we're all different. All brains are different and all frames are different. And it also means that all suppliers are different. All materials had different processes, nuances of how to do things. And this is what actually makes then BMC or the other global brands, as we are part of, unique in our industry and different to everybody else. We all bring in, on the material aspect, there's different types of carbon. There's a Japanese made carbon, Mitsubishi Toro, which everybody has heard of, then there's also Chinese carbon. Then there's also the resin, which binds everything together, you know, the glue, there's off the shelf resin, then there's, you can develop your own formulas. And that gives a different characteristics to the bike, the ride feel of the bike. And the balance between the fiber and the resin also has an impact on the ride of the bike as well. So you go into quite deep detail about what are all the differences that go into it. You also get some brands, factories will also put a lot of fiberglass actually into the frame. So they're reducing the cost by putting in more fiberglass and reducing the carbon content. Do they have to outline that to the consumer? No. Okay. I just wanted to point out that, you know, when we speak about the carbon frame, it's exactly like a puzzle. Okay. And if you have a puzzle with, let's say, 50 pieces, you see the picture. Okay. If you have a puzzle with 250 pieces, you have, you can be much more, go much more in nuances. Okay. And a bike is exactly the same, a carbon bike is exactly the same. So I would say that the ratio is maybe not from one to five, like I made the example with the puzzle, but the ratio is maybe from one to three, where you can have, you know, an entry level bike made out of 150 carbon pieces and the high end bike out of 500. And this is directly linked to the hour spent of the employee. And it's actually also making sure, I mean, you know, for some of our frames, we have three, four, 500 pieces of carbon. How can you make sure that actually all those 400 pieces have actually gone into the frame? Something hasn't been left, you know, on the floor accidentally. So yeah, I mean, that's some of the secrets we can't give. You know, but we do have measures in with our supplies to ensure this that every single piece of carbon fiber is accounted for that's going into that frame. And then as Conrad said, also making sure that it's actually in the right position, in the right orientation to then give the right performance attributes that we want out of that frame. I think you had the opportunity to visit the impact lab this morning. And so that that's great. And we do have a serious amount of the cost that is not the frame itself, but that is how to come to that frame where we can do our own models. We can prove to some factories that we work that are selected. I mean, high end factories that are selected that these technology can work because we can come with a prototype and say, Hey, look, it does work. I think one of the examples I can mention is the MTT technology, you know, with what we launched as a cross country hardtail, we're under the name of the team elite a couple of many years ago. Then this is a technology that we have kept on different other platforms. But when we first came to the factory with something like that, there was a big question mark of how do we how is that going to work? How do we work with the flexibility? And these are prototypes that were really actually made here in Gretchen. The integrated cockpit system, you know, I think just about every brand has followed us in that journey. And this all comes, you know, at a cost coming back on that point, you talked about it's all coming out of the same factory. No, no, there are tens of hundreds of carbon manufacturing factories. And everybody has their own area of expertise. Yeah, you've got some factories are experienced in lightweight road. You've got others in full suspension. You've got others in ebike. Everybody has their own unique characteristics. You know, the point of difference. And we all use different factories, you know, whether it's us or the other brands, you know, even some of the other, you know, Chinese brands that you were talking about, we're all using different factories. And every factory, as I said, is different. So we are doing business in China, Vietnam, Taiwan, and also in Europe. And yeah, so we're doing our masterpiece. So road machine masterpiece and team machine SLR masterpiece is all manufactured here in Europe. That's a very different facility as around 10. Yeah. Yeah. And that's a mix between carbon and also alloy. I mean, we also offer alloy products. Actually, we have a team in Asia. We have a team of just over 20 employees based in Asia. And it's not just quality. They're working with Conrad and Shtifu, who you met earlier, you know, on the project coordination on R&D product development, actually with our factories. So people on the ground helping develop the product into manufacturing, obviously supply chain. And they're BMC employees. They're BMC employees. Yep. Yep. So actually, that's how I started at BMC was actually set up that business in Asia for BMC. And then of course, you know, quality assurance or QA. So we actually have people physically going into the factories to audit our factories to make sure they're doing what they tell or what we've agreed upon that of how what they will manufacture. When it comes to carbon, every frame that we produce, we record all the serial numbers. And with that frame comes a report. You know, we're measuring the critical measurements like the physical measurements, headset, etc. You know, there's also performance attributes, you know, weight stiffness compliance. And they're also, you know, on the weight side, we put a tolerance against everything. So we're also then looking at, okay, with intolerance. If we also see some production moving more towards one end of the tolerance spectrum, they might actually go back and question it. Okay, why is these frames consistent a little bit on the light side or a little bit on the on the heavy side, or maybe it's the stiffness attributes. So we've also got one person literally just going through all these reports and checking to make sure that we're manufacturing within the degree tolerances. The other thing I was thinking of was like, there's also the other costs that are not directly related to the physical frame that you that you don't not everybody thinks about. You know, I think that's the other thing too. So, you know, for us, I mean, you saw the investment in the impact lab during the development is very important. I mean to have innovative people, you know, to get the right talent coming to us who have got these crazy ideas about MTT and ICS and auto drop. But the other aspect is the investments that we make to the sport as well. And this is not just, yeah, okay, we've got Ben O'Connor, you know, at the Tour de France, we won Kona on the weekend. This is all great as a marketing tool. But the feedback we get from these out high performing athletes is also critical to our development as well. And I mean, and Cadel's a very unique character, like he's the sort of person that you can have two different frames built up exactly the same wheels, tire pressure, the whole lot. Before he's even gotten to the end of the block, he can tell the difference of the ride characteristics between the two frames. And, you know, I think this is what's really unique to BMC and is that this secret sauce, you know, anybody can make a chicken tikka masala. But everybody can follow the same recipe and it's going to be a little bit different. It's all those little nuances that make it up to be that better than the other person. Relationships. Yeah. I mean, this is to be honest with you, like, it's finding the right partners. You've got to find the right like minded partners, you know, that you both have the same vision of what you want to achieve in terms of the product. And also understanding what the market needs are as well. It's like when you start dating, you know, you go through this little bit of a honeymoon period where everything's all sweet, you know, it's all roses. Then you start to get into, okay, now we want to, you know, maybe get married and have children as you make frames, you know. And this is when... Or the new iteration. Or the new iteration. Exactly. And this is when you get to understand how your suppliers actually really operate. You know, and I'd also say, once you have your first challenge, or you have your first fight with your girlfriend or wife, that's tests everything. Yes. You know, puts everything to the test a little bit. And it's how you then work through that is very, very important as to then what the long-term relationship is going to be. Because you understand, like, you know, Team Machine SLR01, you know, has a life cycle on the market of three to four years. But for our relationship with the supplier, you add on another two to three years on top of that for development. So you're basically married for five to seven years on each platform. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. So what do you look for in a relationship in that part of the world? Secret sauce? That is the secret sauce. That is the secret sauce. It's a great quote that I love from Picasso, which I use a lot in the office. And, you know, you need to learn the rules like a pro and break them like an artist. And that's what I think makes the difference not only in terms of the supplies that we work with, but also internally for us as a business and how we operate.