 That first topic that I mentioned this morning, and that is systems thinking and systems leadership And we're so fortunate to have in just a few minutes on that screen Peter Senke joining us from Boston, so keep an eye on that screen and I've been with Peter fortunate enough to be working with Peter I've been over the last few years and I once heard him say that he is on an odyssey to find places in the world Where the future we desire is starting to show up and he sees British Columbia is one of those places So if all goes well Please welcome Peter Hello Maria. How are you doing? I'm fine. We just had a chat about it being cold there, but I guess everybody here knows that it's cold there Well, it was It's actually much very cold So Peter you're I know you're looking into the face of the tasha right now who's in the back of the room She's our technician, but in fact what you're looking at is we're looking out to a room of just under 500 educators and Community partners who are all here because they care about the the well-being and the mental well-being emotional social well-being the children of you and You are going to set the stage for us around How systems thinking systems thinking leadership Can build up that's being done in the British Columbia and elsewhere But maybe you could begin by just telling us what you mean by systems Thinking leadership systems thinking and what it's got to do with me on this room So It's possible to your mic What I'm doing is I'm hearing my voice The delay to your mic. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah Won't hear that. Yo, that's so The wood systems He is always a problematic word As he doesn't condone much at all What's typically nowadays means computer system or you know, not my phone's a stupid system But what we're really thinking? Well, we're really thinking deeply about most anything I listen we're practicing system thinking because we're starting to move the surface events To the deeper sources of problems and when we do that we start That's much more Which is really all the term system is pointing to which is pointing to the fact that the reality is we deal with our Master more interconnected than we realize we think we can do something over here in a classroom But of course the kids are just in that classroom all the time There are a lot of places and we think we cannot intervene in the classroom over here But not in the largest school climate and by the way kids by and large don't live in schools There's the school classroom the school climate and culture, but then there's the larger community So this is really a web of interconnectedness. So that's all the systems. They is trying to remind us of My one of my fantasies is that if all this work really goes well enough 10 20 30 years We're just about the systems part of all thinking because I think exactly what we really think We go below the surface events So that's been the corner of our work for a very very long time and when you start to see the world that's sort this kind of Interconnected dynamic and verge of world. You realize that there's no simple answers It's not about having a plan But it's not about fixing problems or some rigid pre-determined formula for what's needed So that's why learning systems Go together, you know, you only have to have a chance to murder this tricycle Let's see what works and let's kind of learn as we go So that's how a whole learning organization systems thinking just became a natural marriage many many years ago And then a funny thing happened This would probably come years after this was initially published was a long time ago. I started getting notes from educators and it's that strings things like student school the other organization and Hard to argue with that But of course the culture of most schools is really not teachers are often seen themselves as experts the post sage of the stage kind of metaphor They see their job is kind of convincing what they know they've invested a lot of time Big part of their life in becoming experts But it's not just that in Organizations are extraordinary Organizations in the organized structure You know in rigid walls silos or chimneys really metaphor in life And you know a lot of those boundaries So I'll never forget many years ago. I heard a teacher say when I close that door. I'm God in my universe So there's often an image in a lot of professions teaching is probably one of kind of individual as professional as opposed to team and as opposed to larger network So that's the other thing that goes in a club with all this if we start seeing the organization as a system as Much more of a community than just isolated profession and that's all sounds It's not easy and it does tend to contradict the prevailing cultures in here in most schools Which again particularly in the industrial age we keep organized around technical expertise Delivered by professionals and then we test themselves when we're all done pretty much like a big assembly line so assembly lines and Use the word we did at least in the introduction What do you consider a leader who's a leader or certain a lot of leaders in this room, but in systems thinking what's a leader? Well, we always try to make the distinction between Formal responsibility or you might say you're wrong authority when you're in a position of authority the superintendent school principal Whatever the next position of authority and in global use most of us for to those people Notice work the finger kind of automatically points So those are leaders up there the rest of us were just here whatever doing whatever hours or whatever That is really not too much for each of us, and I'm sure this is a very real Many of you usually Barments They're very It's just not enough to have good leadership Leadership really has to come from every word and I don't think Interesting Aladdin And it means to step across So I always think Other people's definitely across the pressure in any company system They're gonna be alive or no real change occur It is the deep change in values and practices and mental models They have to rise with in place. There is an important role for executive But it's not the only So we often As people who are good at Austrian collaboration, you know to bring about And they used to be They are the or the most What are the the qualities do you think of people you've seen who are you know really awesome systems thinking leaders? What what kinds of things do they do? How do they think what's different? Well Earlier this kind of Or you might say Just repeat that The first test ability Where that kind of I don't have I may have a Where we need to go. So the second thing I was saying is that It's this kind of capacity To create a space or environment where people start to come together We often call it skill of reflective conversation In a very funny very simple way the core process where by all organizations operate and all change processes unfold Is the processes of conversation how we talk to each other? Do we really listen to each other? Are we so busy trying to kind of get our point across that we really There's one I remember years ago one student said oh you're listening. That's what I'm waiting to talk And that's of course true for all of us to some degree until we build a capacity to really give attention To really give attention to the other and as we start to do that We start to create a different kind of social space or environment or setting where people feel really listened to We all know what that's like when I really been listened to I know and conversely when I know people aren't listening I'm quite aware of that as well So this capacity to kind of really create a space or a setting or a field We often call it a more generative social field that really is Christ I'm listening in reflection and And lastly, you know, we're all said then you have to have vision. So where are we going? What do I really care about? It's almost Tontological it's almost a definition that everybody would agree that leaders are people who care deeply and there's something They're trying to create. They're not just trying to react to a bunch of problems We've used this distinction for a long time to help people begin to understand. It's very very easy Particularly when you're in a position of authority to find your life consumed by reacting to the crisis in a moment So this reactive firefighting or reactive problem-solving is it's not bad I mean look at we have to act you're in a position of authority and something needs attention You give it attention. The problem is often that's all we're doing We're reacting reacting reacting acting. So this last Characterized systems leaders. Let's just say a different kind of balance Reacting to the problems as they arise and really moving towards where we want to go Reacting and the creating not one or the other You know one of the things that we that everyone here is interested in and from last year's conference asked for was more information about how to expand and grow and really shift the culture around this this idea of Mental health and well-being being being most important. So how is it that systems thinking is more likely to? Have that happen. I'm trying to figure out what's different about it that some kind of culture shift might happen as opposed to just a change of Rules or change of policies Well, I think the the short answer to question is that it's about transforming the quality of the relationships that are operating I mean systems work the way they work because of how we work We often forget that and again, this is where the word system is problematic people think oh well system change That's a policy change or that's something to get the only the people at the top can do There's so many policy changes that are in name only nothing really changes Systems work the way they work because of how we work how we think how we are with one another So really deep systemic change is always changing or shifting the quality of relationships They're operating and that's not an abstraction. That's an every meeting every conversation That's why I was emphasizing a few minutes ago this quality of listening Now all that again sounds pretty philosophical Maybe a little idealistic until you have tools and methods. We have actual ways of going about it. I'm an engineer Training I think one of the inheritance is you have on your engineers you really believe in tools and I think you know the way you've got this program planned is great because After we you and I finish Maria You're gonna have some folks who've been busy doing this for last year and from one of the local school districts Maple Ridge if I recall and And I think their journey is very illustrative, you know, they came to a workshop a year ago I think it was and they also had other support structures there people who could help them But they just went off and started practicing with some of the tools There's an old saying if you want to change how someone thinks give up You cannot change how a person thinks Give them a tool the use of over time will lead them to start thinking differently. It's a very important learning So we we are big believers in tools and practices and they've got to be simple enough to be usable By most anybody who's interested which by the way in this case as the nice additional benefit They were every the adults are using to develop to support their own journey of systems thinking the exact same tools Can be used across the K-12 spectrum and our What's an example of a systems tool that you use or you've used with people that you found maybe especially in education Led to some aha moments and maybe some culture shift Well, I think you're going to practice just a little bit with something called the systems thinking iceberg It's very simple took about 25 years to develop That's always the way, you know to get something really simple and really workable takes a long long time But it kind of gets at the heart of the epistemology where the ways of seeing That define the systems perspective and it basically comes down to learning how to distinguish the events on the surface You know the crisis the moment the fire that just broke out literally or figuratively The all those problems that I was referring to before that people in leadership positions often find themselves compelled to have to react to to the deeper longer-term patterns that are unfolding behind those events and Tells still deeper what we call the systemic structures the underlying habits of thought and action and artifacts that are really shaping How the system operates that generates the patterns and in turn eventually produces those events I think you're going to practice that tool in just a little bit. You'll get a much better feeling by doing it And and what's the point of that is the idea that you somehow see as you mentioned at the top of the iceberg We all know there are problems. There are things that happen over and over again With that and other tools is the idea that you somehow see those problems differently You see your system differently. You see yourself differently. What's the point? The point in the simplest sense is real change I mean how many times have you noticed yourself reacting to a problem and then A week later you've got the same kind of problem It may be not literally the same in every single detail But it's more or less the same and then you've got another problem and another problem We often refer to this as the problem-solving treadmill that leaders again people in positions of authority often feel they're stuck on The real difference is just reacting to the same old same old same old same old versus creating a set of conditions Which don't produce those problems You know they're getting to the deeper sources of problems I mean, it's not a it's not a radical idea at some level. This is why I said, you know I was joking before sooner or later. Maybe we'll just call this thinking real insight Get you to a deeper level where there's real leverage This is really the operational or practical definition of real insight It brings you to a way of seeing things that actually can produce a longer term change You're not just kind of reacting to the moment You're not just putting band-aids on you have a system that's actually going to generate a different set of conditions And no band-aids aren't bad. You know, I my hand stuck in a door last week Guess what the band-aids were very useful, but this system has the ability to heal itself Therefore the band-aid is a bit temporary Imagine that your organization culture and climate has that capacity to heal itself But that the band-aid serves the function of mandate. It doesn't become a lifelong occupation You're right. We're going to be hearing from me. Porridge pit meadows next I think it is going to be helpful because there's some really practical applications of those tools Because I think in a system we systems do tend to want to go back to The center or back to the way they are is that the way systems work? Well, yeah in biology you thought homeostasis, right a living system can maintain balances That's what one of the conditions for living It's always able to kind of take something that moves to the side and bring you back to where you are Social systems are no different. They're very homeostatic We often call it, you know, the status quo the power of the status quo And you know, the truth is probably 80 90 percent of that status quo is fine It's not problematic. There's another Typically 10 or 20 percent. It's very problematic I suppose you would hope or one would hope that you just apply these tools and Miraculously take happens, but I know that in my family, we've been doing family systems for years And try to understand our family and it does take years and just when you think you've got the system fixed the system changes So just say something about that maybe patients is it or what is it perseverance? What is it? Well, I think what you're really pointing to is fundamental limitations of the whole problem-solving paradigm We often live in. I actually don't think it's some fundamental level. This is really about solving problems Life is going to always generate new problems. I mean, there's no answer to how to raise our kids, right? There's no answer to how to be a Good son or daughter of an aging parent. This is life This is not about fixing things that are broken The problem is oftentimes the problems are the deepest problems. We really feel impotent We feel there's nothing we can do about them So it's not about fixing the problems in the sense that they're over and done It's are we really engaging in the things that matter most? So you're absolutely right. You don't fix a broken system You allow yourself to get engaged in a way that it starts to improve But of course it like anything in life it'll improve for a while and then new problems come The question is do we have a sense of efficacy that we actually can do something that improves matters Again, it's not about fixing them once and for all that's much more machine kind of image machine is broken We got to fix it But the truth is these are problems that we live through the question is are we alive? Are we really engaged? Are we doing the things that really matter and do people have a sense of of? deep confidence That we really can move the things go up and down, but there's a trend you might say that's leadership Leadership is not a phony No fake facade of I've got all the answers we see that a lot in the world today And I think many of us feel down in our gut. It's almost the antithesis of leadership. I've got the answers listen to me do this That's a type of leadership that comes out of lack of confidence the real confidence says, you know I don't have all the answers, but we need to move in this direction We know that and let's get going and let's build some confidence that we can sustain that process of improvement I think one of the wonderful things about the work you're doing in You know all kinds of organizations is that it's not just about that individual leader doing this work It's always about a team and so it's not just one person who says we can get through this the team Not only becomes closer, but seems to me they become more adept at seeing the problem saying oh, yes And this too as opposed to we're in trouble here. So I'm supposed to blame That's absolutely I actually think if you look over the broad long sweep of things in the in the business world We're of course we have most of our practical experience up until the last 10 years or so I wanted the big shifts that's occurred in the world of business over the last two or three decades Has been almost everybody works in teams didn't used to be that way most people work for a boss now There's still bosses. It doesn't mean hierarchy has disappeared because hierarchy can play a real function The problem is when all you had was the hierarchical structures I don't forget years ago a guy at Ford said I've always known who my customer is as my boss If I please my boss or anything else is okay So I think this evolution to more team structures and hierarchy and a different kind of balance has been a really big shift I think we're still in the pretty early stages of that shift in education Again, historically it was an extremely individualized profession But I think more and more and I'm sure this is true of most of you in your schools in your school districts are really trying to Foster a real sense of no it really is collaboration Together we have to work to shift the climate to school. It's not enough to have one or two brilliant teachers And then the kids have to suffer through all the rest. That's just not going to cut it It's totally inadequate. So we have to learn how to work together So we all become more brilliant teachers and to collectively we're really shaping a more coherent and generative social Climate and culture. So this shift from individual professional Isolated professionals I would say to connect to collaborating professionals is a very deep shift and it does usually take a Generation or two. I think the education lot of the best school districts now are well along the path They've definitely starting but it requires different skills. That's kind of what we're talking about this systems leadership These are the skills of building more effective teams and networks of collaboration Short videos that will be shown throughout the next two days just to see what your perspective is on the other Topics that we talked about that I talked about this morning So thank you in advance But I wonder if you have any words of advice for everyone who's here today about how we can all show up for this two days as systems thinking learners as system thinkers Would you say to us about how to try to do that do whatever Maria tells you to do Now I think it's a brilliant I mean re and I walked through this program on a few occasions and I think it's really well designed because You're gonna move kind of from this general introduction to the indigenous perspective which is by its nature Kind of you don't need to talk about systems thinking to native peoples I mean that the whole universe is about interconnectedness To the world the world the role of students and the role of data and measurement and in each cycle I think you'll encounter a little different angle on the systems perspective and in each cycle You'll hear some from practitioners like the Maple Ridge people coming up and then you'll do a practice So I just think follow the program. It's really really well planned I was so excited when Maria first walked me through it a month or so ago I think it's it should be worked really really well