 Hello, welcome to Toffy TV, there's a lot, there's no football this weekend, so we don't have a chat about what's going on around a football club away from football matters. It's because of football matters though that's made me think we need a chat about what's going on away from football matters. If that makes sense, transfer window closed a week ago, evident didn't add to the squad but have since still didn't add to the squad on deadline day for clarity. But have since sold another player in Damari Gray. But there is still the ongoing issue of investment coming into the football club ever and recently seen the MSP deal change. It didn't disappear, contrary to reports it changed. They were going to come in with £150 million and had two places on the board wherever it's now £100 million loan. That's it, that's not going to happen. And it's led us to the 777 talk and other stuff of it, other investors, Chinese consortium and things like that are going on. And Pedd, let's start with you because I think right now there is a lot of doom and gloom because Everton have obviously started the season with a lot of win at the first international break. But there's also this uncertainty bouncing around of what's going to happen next, the stadium is getting built and everything both. The uncertainty of MSP 777 has making a lot of people and not being able to spend money as well if it's come out has made people nervous. I think obviously John can speak to it more from a more expertise but just being as the normal fan. And this is something we spoke about in the summer where we wanted a little bit of clarity of what was going on. And I think we said this a few times in the summer like what was happening with the MSP deal. The MSP deal don't fully know what's going on because if it is a £100 million loan that loan is yet to hit the club because nothing has hit companies house yet as we speak. I mean it might, they've got time, I think they have three weeks but that's yet to hit companies house so they haven't gone, we better get this straight into the bank lads. So there's no clarity there, we've still got it in some board now again whether that's a bad thing or a good thing. I think for the normal fan you want that to all be sorted out, you want a CEO who can take us forward, a chairman who can take us forward. I think again I'm sure John will tell us the reasons why these things might not matter but I think for the normal fan you just want that clarity. And at the moment everything feels up in the air because we're being told there's a lot of negativity because of what's happening on the pitch. We sold Alex O'Wobby, we sold the money great, I don't think we'll ever see that money again. I think we just have to be honest about that and we have to understand why those reasons are. And actually if that money goes to pay the bills that keep the club, keep the lights on, then so be it. That is the way it is, that's where we are. So I think that's the general gist out there and again it's that communication side of the things. Come out, talk to people when there's something to tell us, I suppose is the right thing. But I think we just need things, we just need that little bit of clarity from the football club. I think if we get that then things can start moving in the right direction and I think we just feel a little bit like we're in limbo at the moment. I think you'd like from the perspective of just looking at it as if John again keeps saying you're looking at it from a business perspective but if you're just looking at it as an editonian and we all do it, we all get dragged along by deadline day and we all get dragged along by strength in the squad. Well every club does the Premier League football clubs have just spent £2.5 billion in this transfer window so that's when it focuses everyone's mind on the transfer windows and you can bring players in. But you write it, that money that we brought in for Alex Rwobi, Tom Cannon, Damari Gray that's been brought in to help the football club exist. Then that's the way it is, that's plenty of clubs do we? We just need that kind of out there so us as a fan base can understand exactly where we are. I mean John, from your perspective, are your worries any greater than the way before this MSP deal changed? Can you understand why the football club would pocket the money to keep it running so to speak as in not spending it out as well and should we be worried about more stuff going on, administrations being mentioned and things like that? Everton's a great thing for worryers because there's never a moment when you can't find something to worry about. Just a clarification point first. When's our next game? Next Sunday. What's the date? Whatever the date is on Sunday. It's the 57th anniversary of me being a match going Everton fan. Okay, well I mean with all due respect John, I like you but I don't like you that much to know when you first went the match and I wasn't born. So there you go. So I'm an Everton fan. Yeah yeah, now and now I did realise when we were saying as Everton I did realise. So I'm an Everton fan but I'm an Everton fan who's had some time in business and stuff and therefore perhaps I do look at things ever slightly different. So when you do the intro we think, the first thing that strikes me is that as fans we might like to think if we sell a player, 10 million quid, it goes in the tin for spying players. We save some wages, it goes in the tin for wages for players that we buy when actually it goes back into the business to be spent and where the business thinks it should be spent. So there is no doubt that we got 10 million quid from some Arab firm, a club and it lands in the bank account that the first bill that needs to be paid that might go to pay it. That doesn't mean to say that automatically because you're paying using transfer income to keep the lights on as you might say that you can't then buy players in January because it's all part of the whole. And anyone who's old enough will have the jokes about Ken Wright and Co but back in the day the money's ring-fenced, no such thing really. If the bailiff's knocking on your door but that's your Christmas money, you give him it, so to speak. So there is that. The MSP thing is an interesting one because lots of people will have opinions about whether or not he should sell or not and if he should sell you'll immediately get into the very emotional or most subjective. Well, there's no one who wants to buy the amount he wants to sell at, therefore he should sell for less. Well that's one side of a coin isn't it? The other side of a coin is why should he sell for less just because someone won't pay what it's worth as he would see it. But you can have different valuations. I mean we've just had the CMOS in who've come to have a look at the studio and the subscribers and stuff which they can do to the people watching can't they? And if you take a simple view that says 135,000 shares that exist and shares typically a train at the moment for about 3.5 grand each then if you try and buy all of them it'll cost you £475 million. So that's how much the club's worth then. If you use that simple way. Or you could say MSP were allegedly going to give us about £150 million some of it might have gone on players and they get 25% share in the business. Oh no, it's not worth 600 now and the mere fact that an MSP were prepared to pay between £150 million to get 25% stake in this football club might say to the guy who's got 94% stake in the football club my share are worth more than that. So that's when you get into very much opinion and all those sorts of things. But your question about the MSP thing that we're standing with don't all know the detail about how right to media exercise their contractual right to stop something happening which is clearly about the shareholding bit. And with me you and I've talked on this sofa about this loads of times and we said didn't we the far had should be squeezing the parties to either get more money for the percentage or less percentage for the same money. It would appear he got more money for the percentage which is good like 50% more. But not enough to allow our right to media to think that it was right. And we've subsequently spoken about one of the reasons they interfered if you will was they thought that MSP were getting too big a stakeholder for the amount of money that they were handing over. That suggests therefore not with standard they've got their own interest at heart about how much of the 200 million of facility has been used or not. They want to maintain the risk profile that they signed up to but it also suggests that they think they should have been paying even more to get 25%. So you end up with all these things but this is what Peds alluded to. The loan bit which was described as to secure funding to complete the stadium. Again if you read between the lines that is what 100 million is short on finishing the stadium and MSP we're going to fund that by loaning us the money. But it all fell apart as an equity thing but allegedly it's not falling apart as a loan so that money will land won't it. And when it does land we'll likely not see it on companies house and those sorts of things which is good because we'll know. They tend to put on companies house the minimum they can get away with so it might still leave questions but on something like this we shouldn't. And if we're warriors we're going where is it? Why haven't we got it now? Hurry up. If you're the club maybe that means Farhad Mishiri but the club who are borrowing money to secure the funding to complete the stadium when do you need the money? When you need to spend it and if it's going to bear interest get it as late as you can so the interest starts as late as you can. And so just before let's say it's Langorawg I guess just before you have to give Langorawg 100 million pounds get it off MSP. And if you then again all this is just it's not guesswork but it's trying to join the dots on things that have been said in the past. And in July 22 when Farhad Mishiri met on Zoom with the shareholders association executive committee he said the stadium was funded to the end of next year. That's the end of this year. So we may conclude that some time before the end of this year they need that 100 million for some time thereafter to hand over to Langorawg to allegedly complete the stadium. So maybe they don't think it's a big rush. Well okay that's fine. And the big rush might have been because it was 50 mil quid in it that might have gone on players and you need to have done it before the window closed. As soon as the windows closed you've got a bit more time haven't you? It makes sense. Don't you need the money to pay back someone though? Oh Andy Bellingham. Well again who knows. But he's never toning he's handed it over maybe he's prepared to wait for it who knows. And that's where you can. Make it ever toning than me. Yeah well if you've got a 50 milion line around. Do you watch Andy would you like to invest? Yeah yeah yeah. I think the thing is with that. Because obviously it was 150 milion for equity allegedly again it's all but just what was all. And now it's gone to 100 million with a loan. That's right. Should we be concerned. I mean Peder you can say and there's a fan that the next people trying to buy in them will be stopped by writing media. Or have you not really thought that far and what are you hoping to see then from everything. Because right now like you rightly said before we have still got. And this has just kind of been pushed away at the moment but we have still got an interim board. Got an interim chairman and interim CEO. Interim finance. Let me just say first of all I'm absolutely terrified that we're talking business and John's just drunk a can of Red Bull. That's terrifying. Yeah we don't know what he's going to be like. What are you all about? That's worrying. Just hope he won't tell Douglas. We shouldn't like we shouldn't have to worry about anything. But it's so ingrained in the culture of football now. And I do blame football manager for this by the way. Football manager came in. No one had a bloody clue. That's the next year. No hang on. Champions. Yeah. Money. It was more playing. Football manager has made you have to look at everything. No no. The next year. Now listen. Yeah I mean. I mean sure your next question will probably move on to like 777. Yeah. But it's yeah it is that there is a worry like if these people were allowed to stop. And there are two sides of the story and of course these people have got within. I don't like saying within debt to them. We have an arrangement with them. Yeah. And it makes both. Festility. It works both ways. It's like an overdraft isn't it. You don't necessarily have an overdraft and say. I'm in debt. You just have an overdraft. Whichever way you look. Say still once you start using it. No I know. And we might be using all of it. We've been. Oh no. We've had this for years and years and years haven't we. And I don't know. I don't know what to think. A lot of clubs have it by the way. Of course I'm not it. I can't see it. It didn't go well. For all we know. This facility is a better facility than any bank could give or. I know we used to bank with a Chinese firm and I believe they don't. Do it anymore. They don't do it anymore in this country because they dealt with people like us. But it's the left thing. So we are who we are now. But they've said this deal isn't good because there's more. Like John said there's not getting too much power for the money. It creates the risk to them. Yeah it goes against them and all that kind of thing. Then what does the next person do then? Is the next person coming along and go we'd like to do something to them and they go. No sorry. How much power do these people have? But again I don't look at them and go you're the bad people. I look at them at football club and go. How did they get out? How are they allowed to block you know. But we've seen this in the past. I think it's about getting the right people isn't it? MSP was supposed to be coming in. Two people on the board. Possibly open the doors to other loans coming in. We've had JP Morgan was mentioning you know really. It was being mentioned for years. Exactly you know. When you hear those names as a layman you go. I know I've heard of them. They see more like you know. So it is that thing of like. Everything is just shrouded in a little bit of mystery at the moment. And when you hear those words administration. And administration is a big scary word. But at the end of the day you can't pay your bills. And someone calls in one of your bills. That's what it is. Usually it's a taxpayer. You can't pay somebody. And everyone are getting to a point where. We've got a stadium to pay for. And we've got a club that pays its bills just about every month. What comes in goes out. So it's that thing isn't it? If your boy the breaks or your car breaks down or anything like that. And suddenly you go where am I going to get that money from. You end up getting in a situation like this. And we see that the transfer marker is that isn't it. That's the extra thing. Then you've got to start thinking about all these extra things. And that's where it gets a little bit scary. And that's where again I think we just need that clarification from the club. I think you know someone just to come out. Show them dice to the dish week on the football inside the things. People might agree. Might disagree. But at least he's communicating with the fans. And telling us exactly. This is where we now need first of all. As Kevin fell well. State of the Union. How to transfer when it all was. And then the problem is though. If you do the next one, which is the next step up. And John will have his opinions on this. Who does that? Chief exec. Would he do it? Would you still let him do it now? Let me ask you this for your answer. I think it will be advantageous for the football club. For the fans. Sincerely the football club. But if he come out. If it really is the case of luck. We're always going to try to improve every transfer market. Because we're a football club. And we're trying to, as you've often said. We're trying to grow the income and shrink the expenditure. Because that's where we get. That's how we're going to get more money. But right now. Things are tight. We're building a new ground. Plenty of other Premier League clubs have done it. Where once the ground is being built. I mean Arsenal. Arsenal came out very early when they were moving. And we didn't spend the money for a few years. Because we're going to have it. Simple as that. So we're going to try and improve the team. Because they didn't do a vision of that. Just to let. I know you might say well why would you. But what I'm saying. From the fans. Could we do with things. Say look. Things are a little bit tighter. So we. I mean Sean Dight has had to do it. He's had to go. We haven't got loads of money. I think it's pretty obvious. Otherwise we would have been buying players. Do you think there is a world in which Colin Sean could. Paint us the picture of what's going on. Or do you think he's simply right now. Doesn't know. Because the owner's making the decisions. What is it. Or what it likely to be. That's a multi-layered question. Isn't it right. You're best on your breadboard. The thing is. The manager should never be. Facing the media to talk about things. That outside sporting decisions. Right. And he should have a stock response. Which says. Listen guys. We've done the best we can. With the funds available to us. If you want to know about the funds. Go speak to Fred. Whoever Fred is. You know. Chief executive. Problem is there's no one here at the moment. Well we have a chief executive. You have a chief executive. Yeah but you're chief. We've been given software isn't there. No. So you haven't got the spokesperson. Who can calm things down. Yeah. By perhaps using a lot of words. To say not very much. Yeah. But has to be someone who can be believed. Everton fans I don't think. Want to know chapter and verse. They don't want to know all the nuances. They don't want. Some will. You know. If it's your thing to look at numbers. And 14 decimal places. I don't. I just want a message. But the average fan wants the big message. Which is this is. State of the Union. Whatever you call it. This is where we're at. Yeah. Okay. And yet the chief executive come out and do it. Sunderland. Sunderland. Around by the 20 odd year old kid. 25 year old kid. Yeah. And he's done his. We've just seen the lead United. CEO do it on a podcast. Their biggest podcast. I'm not. Sunderland guys. I'm just saying. We've just seen him come out and do it. Sunderland guys. Sunderland owner come out and told them why they can't spend all. And what they have to do. The fans have come flubbing back and got behind it. The stadium's full. Right. Absolutely. The needed. So yes. That you know. If you. If you wanted to go there. I. Increase transparency. You know. Engage with your most important stakeholder. As again the independent regulation type thing is reaffirmed. That the whole industry accepts that the fans are the most important stakeholder. And this is not the one that ever football was talking to. Right. Now. They need to. They know they need to. We know the professionals in. You know in the media and the PR know that they know what needs to be done. Alls we need as fans is for whoever's make pulling the strings. Whether it's the largest shareholder or the chair or whoever it is. Let's say it's one of them to who's stopping them from doing the right thing. Stop stopping them. Yeah. Right. Let them do it. Right. Now you do run the risk that if you answer a question that begets five more questions and so on. And we know that bills approach to life over the years is always being which I would caricature as. If you don't say anything you can't say the wrong thing. Those days are long gone. So you say the wrong thing. Of course. Those days are long gone because 24 seven instant media independent media like us lot. The mainstream guys are strong to keep up with the independent stuff because it goes straight away social media ripples. You know just viral the whole nine yards. But good news in the old days travels slower than bad news. These days it travels just as fast. There is no speed limit on good news. It can come out and be viral just as fast as bad news can you know. And therefore they must know and we used it earlier in the year and did the back end last year and then it became very acute earlier in the year. It wasn't if it was when the board went. It's not if it's when they engage properly with the fans. And yes Kevin could be upfront and it can be a canned interview. Be better if it was a bit like more lively than that but it can be. And he just talks about the key messages of what they are seeking to do in the window. Perhaps give some propaganda around. We are stronger out of this window than we were out of previous whatever whatever whatever. We know the results aren't what we expect but you know we've got what we've got. We're going to do the best we can and come January if we have to strengthen and we have the funds we will. People have missed out a bit in the middle. We have to strengthen we will. And the same from the Chief Exec. The Chief Exec coming out and not talking about the stadium but talking about the rest of it would be great. And that can be fully scripted. So it's when they do it not if. I think for my Kevin Falwell just on a small point is if Kevin Falwell did an interview and explained we sold Alex of Warwick because he's in the last year of his concert. And as a football club we don't allow people to go to get to the end of their concert anymore. People immediately would go tick we're on it. I've already shown people talking about what John Dyche said with Samarie Gray. No one's bigger than the club, the bats wherever it's shown you're going. And people like that's the message. Brilliant. Keep it then. Kevin Falwell do it. Samarie Gray. Another one who had a year left of a contract. We want to get money. Alex of Warwick. We don't do that no more. He could even blame others and go in or he could even refame. The player did not want to sign in the contract. In the past. We do not let people drag it out for free. What he can say is he can make the change, the distinct line. In the past players have walked out for nothing and we've lost out. We don't do that anymore. We've drawn a line in the sand and that's why we act. And I think everyone would go. Brilliant. We're seeing a new evidence. Great. A lot of people during this transfer window, us as well, had said there seems to be a change in the plan a little bit of the recruitment which is identify what you need. Get a young player like Timothy. Experience one good like better. Brilliant. That's what we want to see. We're a different profile. Money has probably dictated evidence. Couldn't get a few of the ones he wanted in. There's still a few. They missed that with cheap as well by the way. But there you go. But you've got to get to where you want to go. You've got to get on the ladder first. I think evidence has shown evidence of that. Moving on. Sorry, but if you're being transparent to some degree, but you're doing it to a defined message, which has been, if you're Kevin, you've been helped by professional media guys, PR guys, stuff of what to say and how to say it. Then you also have to do some of the things which I think was where Dijs was well. When Damari Gray said what he said, Dijs almost had to respond. And he did, but then he subsequently said other stuff which was even better. The Kevin one would be, well, I heard all that. That's great. So why aren't you a player then? Right? Because you're going to get that question. So go into the zone of uncomfortable debate. And even that's an easy one to answer. Do you know what? We've got a finite amount of resources, a finite amount of money. We went for the players we wanted with the money that we had, believing that to be enough. And it didn't happen. Prices were going up every day. We had the limit what we were waiting for. Prices were going up. And when the player we wanted crossed the line between our value judgment, it was too late to go for other targets. And I know, and you could even say, I know there's people saying there's loads of guys on the loan market and all that, but it's not just about, you know, transfer fees. It's about wages. It's about what it does to the other guys in the dressing room. All those other things. We made a judgment call to go with what we've got. Back us, yeah. Back us, please. Right, right. Moving out. All right. I think it's all legally. So you've sort of mentioned it in past me four when you were talking about it. Seven, seven, seven. There's names being bouncing around since, I think, even since January. I first met MSP where it might have even been before that. We saw a lot of stuff, a lot of noise, quotes you on that, a lot of noise around about them. But we did see a very, very physical demonstration against them by standard liais last week that they're involved in. There's a lot of people who are uncomfortable with this organisation. And there is other people apparently interested in having. I mean, what's your feelings on that? Without going into detail on what they've been accused of or what's been written about them. And there has been some really good pieces written about them by top jainers, by the way, like Philip Ecclairs, really hot on this kind of stuff. And I know he's really hot on the advertising deals, sponsorship deals that have been getting done through, like white label companies that are in the Isle of Man and all this. I think you just look at the reaction of fans of clubs that are involved with. That's the biggest one for us. Forget about all the other stuff. It's not here or there. It's the effect they've had on other football clubs, standard liais is the latest one. Like I said to you today, they remind me of like in alien films when the aliens come to your planet, take all your resources and then piss off. That's what they seem to be. They seem to be going to places, buying in and then taking their resources to go and buy another club. And because they are this multi club thing, every club that's not the top club seems to be suffering. Now, even if everyone at the top club, I don't want to be part of that. I don't want to be part of a system where if another club comes along, we suddenly are pushed further that way in the pyramid suddenly. I don't want to be part of that full stop because that system to me is shouldn't be how football works. I'm not against the multi club thing, but I think the way they're doing it is wrong. And as I said, look at the fans of those other football clubs. Look at how they feel. How long would it take for us to start feeling like that? You're jumping from the frying pan into the fire. It's not always about a deal just because we're going to sell it, sell, sell, sell. You've got to sometimes stop, have a look and think is this the right deal and they don't seem to be the right people at all to be involved in a club like us. And I think if this gains any traction, I think as a football club and as a fan base, we need to be on this straight away. And I know a lot of people haven't been part of process and stuff, but I think people need to be vocal about this because this is something that, if they get their hands on us, well, it wouldn't be good. We are in a great position. We're not in a great position. We're at stage on. And we have to be clear as well that 777 stuff isn't... I've not seen it mentioned as a takeover. It's a minority stake, whatever that means. But, John, what I would say, and I agree with everything Pedd just said there, I think the biggest... What you do is when there's noise about something, you go to the people who are directly affected first because there can be other noise around it. People can have prejudice as either in every way, but if you go on to fans of a club, which is what we are, we are saying these owners have come in, and we've got ways, and this has got ways, and it hasn't been better, and they made promises to put money into the team, and it hasn't happened, and whatever. I think you need to take that seriously. But my question to you, John, is not so much with 777, because they are there, but we've seen. We were both at a business conference this week where somebody was telling us that there's so many American owners who are desperate to buy wealthy, or to buy premier league clubs. We saw Manchester United seem to have been up for sale for months, and this sale is one step away. You're just waiting for Fabra Manos here we going, or that, and it's not happened. But there must be wealthy, wealthy Middle Eastern consortiums, other wealthy American consortiums, Q80s, Chinese, a lot of people with money who've got an ambition to get in and make a difference at a football club. Why do you think they're not knocking on evidence door seemingly, seemingly, although we have obviously been linked with a Chinese consortium? We don't know whether they are or they're not. That's what I said seemingly. When Murray was talking about it. Surely we're a big club. If you look at clearly not the guy who was talking yesterday, particularly the finance guy, who was talking about how often his phone rings. He was basically saying curiously, because he's involved in football clubs. He said curiously, we don't really deal with the Middle East, or Far East, did he? He said, so most of our stuff is North American. The phone's never off the hook. So there's loads of North American interest. And you think, well, if you've got really wealthy entities, and they want, as they would say in their language, to own a sports franchise, then they look at the NBA, or they look at, you know, whatever. And clearly NFL. And then you look at Manchester United, which might be the most valued soccer property in the world. There's 15 NFL franchises worth more than them. So if you're only a teeny ween, it's a bitty guy who's worth tens of billions of dollars, instead of hundreds of billions of dollars, and you can't quite afford an NFL franchise, you can afford any football club in the world. Potentially, right? So yes, there must be. So you'll always get the banging against thing, which is, yeah, they're all interested at this valuation, but they're not interested if it's more. And that's always the game you will play about how much does the buyer prepare to spend, and it's not just going to be how much they pay for shares. Actually, I don't want to buy a club that's going to be very average. They'll all have this starting position that's the best for one. Therefore, the amount of investment Everton needs, for example, probably, even if you get all emotional about how much of a share you sell for, set that aside for now, then at least the same again, and probably a lot more, to get it where you want it to be, making it great again, which includes the stadium, capital investments in the playing squad and all those sorts of things. But yes, there must be countless and make it great again. That's what I mean, because I'm going to come back here on it. That's why I was just interrupting just to say we were told yesterday that the Manchester United valuation is still lower than the 16th ranked NFL team. I think you said Washington Redskins or whatever. That's what I said, it's 15 worth more. Exactly, and for Everton, let's just say, you know, seeing valuations, some people have put valuations out there, it might take a billion or 1.2 billion to have Everton at zero, own their own ground, all the debt comes. Everything's great, ready to go. That loads on players. If you're... I would suggest a bit more on players. I would say for 1.5 billion, you could have Everton Football Club in the Premier League, big input into the playing squad over the next few years. Not crazy money book, but if you're doing things right as in good recruitment and things, you could have a team on the Mersey. Royal Blue Mersey John Surrey. City Centre, playing in the Premier League, in with Liverpool, they were huge as well, so you've got that buffer enough, that makes noise all over the place, and you could own that for a fraction of Manchester United. Manchester United biggest club in the world, I get it, but what I mean is, for them, it would still be a fraction of what they're trying to buy an NFL franchise, but they can't. I think there are some people who've got that kind of ability to do it. Of course there is. When do you do your wishlist thing just then and end up with a number of 1.5 billion, and if we'd just be generous to say that's one third of what it would cost you to buy the shares of United? Never mind the billion plus 2 billion you're going to have to spend on old traffic. Exactly right, and what they want and what the market cap is, because you go back to Everton's market cap, 10 times. But yes, there are, there must be. Selling Everton can't be difficult. Selling it for what you might want, and perversely, it might not be the money, that's the issue for Machir, maybe he's got the ailment that other people have had in the past as they want to keep control as well. So maybe there's an element of that, but Machir has spoken publicly about wants people who can bring expertise. So if you then follow the logic, are you likely to get that expertise from the Middle East? I don't think so. Are you likely to get that expertise from Asia, for East and so on? In financial terms maybe, but not in sporting terms. So if you wanted somebody, again to use the term that I'm cheating because it's the clues in what I say is most, who's got experience in getting hold of a sports franchise and quote, making it great again, North America's the place to go isn't it? But not 777C. Well they haven't done it in the States have they? Really? No. But anyway, yes you would think so. So if you have that sunny day disposition in your mind, that says it is sweaty and sunny and so on, and I'm not going to get het up about when, because it's not if, it's when, then you can calm down a little bit. Unfortunately, if you get lots of noise that says well, when is important because we could be in an administration before then and you've got people making stories about what the commission may or may not do to us and how does that impact with the regulator which won't exist for God knows how long anyway because it isn't even going through the Commons at the earliest on November and all those sorts of things, then we're in a classic place of will fear what might happen to our football club. There's a huge amount of uncertainty board members interim, what does that mean, is Colin really the chief executive just keeping a seat, whatever, whatever, whatever and then doubt about what the outcomes might be and that's classic business food fear, uncertainty and doubt and it can make you really, really passive and don't do anything blinded by the lights and stuff so the important thing is for the football club is to carry on as normal now clearly when the window, transfer window is not open, the sporting side has to carry on as normal there's nothing you can do guys until next January sure the recruitment guys can carry on searching and doing all the things they do but you can't actually execute anything so the sporting side have got September, October, November, December four months and there's another wind international breaker so they've just got to get on with their day job but the business side has to keep doing this day job as well and that's I think where there's a lot of uncertainty for people about well if MSP were going to come in and have the top jobs then when teams and Colin said yes they thought it was for weeks maybe and now it's certainly months and are they actually going to be able to do stuff and that's where because you started all this about worry that's where I would worry that the club just stays not doing anything while it waits for tomorrow to come and tomorrow never comes and we speak again speaking to people yesterday at the conference you know if you go in the Royal Abilities apparently it's like a morgan the sense of obviously morale is low people aren't happy happy tomorrow never comes and that's where the uncertainty comes in and we all know if that sort of full malaise got into a playing team you get relegated because you just get on a slippy slope and you can't get out of it don't you so that can happen in businesses as well Paid just to finish then you have to try to pick this one because John's right if that then starts sliding right the way through I know this and I know the manager is very experienced in the play it shouldn't affect the job you're doing on the pitch because you're a professional and all that but what do you think you have to do to pick the fun because we are the most we're the ones who create that feel around the club certainly every time we're in the stadium and that's a big thing but what do you think is needed over some kind of certainty and that's really difficult isn't it because like John was saying there you're waiting on other things you're waiting on maybe outside influences but I think there has to be some kind of certainty and maybe that starts at the stadium because there's almost a little undercurrent at the moment where people say we shouldn't start at the stadium and it's dragging us down so I can get a little bit of certainty on that maybe that will happen with time won't it because in a couple of months time the inside of the stadium and what I mean is the playing side of the stadium will be ready to go the roof will be done the stands will all be done and the jobs will start moving on to the inside and from that point people might go well it looks ready so maybe that kind of that little bit of and they'll talk about moving your seat and all that and once we start getting again but certainty is another thing certainty on when we're moving into the stadium that's another thing that was really badly handled I think by the football club doing the albain we'll give it to you the people no no no mate you're up the big boys here you know the numbers don't come with us and say well it might if we move on halfway through the season it might go against this deal no it won't mate you'll make more money I don't know anything about business but I know that I know a bit that stadium will make more money then goodness and if you move in halfway through a season so give us that kind of so people know or if it's the other way if you've decided to move in at the end of the season I'll be against it but what can I do about it that's life I'm not going to sit there and start you know what daily having a goal give us some certainty and I think certainty then cos at the moment it's like that problem remove that problem I think saying with the stadium I know it's a lot easier said than done then going stadiums also we've got all the money but if there's a point you can say we're moving in this date cos I think that I think a lot of fans not maybe I don't know how many but I think a lot of people are putting off leaving goodness and they want to kick down the road they don't like the idea of moving so the idea of it being another six to eight months is fine by them let's get that certainty let's get that we know when we're moving and you know if we say we're moving in on not this day exactly it becomes a little bit more real even though there's a wonderful stadium if you drive out of town and you see this it's a real stadium it's there it's not until you get closer that you can see that it's getting built give people that certainty we are moving in it is going to be December 2024 that's when we're going and you know what if you can say it's paid for because that would be a big step so what happens if you got told certainty we're moving in in August 2025 you'd have to get on with it wouldn't you not what you would John wouldn't you what do you think the club the pads just said what he thinks I think he's right because when we do the foot bit the fear is a product of the other things which is uncertainty and doubt anything you can give certainty to will reduce doubt and therefore reduce fear as well but you can't just do one isolated thing it has to be all of the above and from a stadium point of view I personally think they could make a statement tomorrow if they wanted to saying as soon as this stadium is physically completed and it's passed all the tests we were moving whenever that is that's certainty we can't tell you when it is because there's a winter to come we don't know what's going to happen but we're not doing this what I think is really wrong and therefore I fear this football club for reasons they perhaps won't be able to articulate will say if it's not ready for August 2024 we'll move in in August 2025 and it'll sit empty and that is a complete and utter joke that a stadium will be finished no it's not a stadium will be finished and for reasons which will be incredibly difficult to articulate and will almost certainly be completely divisive amongst the fan base because there'll be at least one person saying it's the wrong thing to do maybe there'll be a few others and the last thing they want to do is produce a divisive result and if you don't know when it's going to be ready because you've got winters, you've got unforeseen all that sort of stuff that's fine as soon as it's finished and it's completed it's trial runs the next Premier League game unless the Premier League or someone stop us we're in that still could be August 2025 we don't know but it doesn't matter it's certainty and then everyone can go right we can start campaigning to stay in Goodison because we don't want to leave the old lady and the other lot can't start campaigning to campaign against them because we all know when it's going to be and let the chief exec do what a chief exec should be doing right now rather than absolutely Let's leave it there let us know what you think in the comments section below what are you looking for to just pick us up a little bit at the moment because there is a lot of uncertainty the team has shown a little sign of a pickup with the last two games unbeaten in two so hopefully that will continue what else is needed now to just give everybody that lift a brighter days and calm waters because I think that's really what we're asking for calm waters right the way across the football club let us know what you think in the comments section below thanks for watching cheers guys