 Good afternoon and welcome back to the title in Y25. My name is Mansoba Sige. This particular time is speaking about state of athletics in the country with focus on the land and marathon set for tomorrow. Elid Kipchogge looking forward to defend his title. He says that he is not going for world record title, but probably he will be crossing his fingers hoping to retain the title he won last year at the same place. Of course joining me are robust people from an integral part as far as athletics. Awan man this plane, Awan man sport is Kansan Barna Baskorir, Athletics Kenya branch chairman and a man who has been actively in matters athletics in the country at the house and John Vaslin, a reputable athletics writer. Gentlemen, good to join me. Good afternoon and governor, how have you been? I'm very fine Maxon. I think it's good to be here. Good to be here. It's been a while, but I'm happy to be here. Thanks for coming through. John Vaslin man last year or 2017? Last year, the last time I was here. Have you been out there? Ah, good, good, good. How is athletics? Athletics is good. It's good. The office is good. No wrangles so far you see. So once the bearers or custodians of anything are this farm foundation, then things will flow, things will flow. But challenges are always there. And those challenges we have to highlight them so that they get challenged, encouraged and it's good. And the office accepts those things. Mr. Korir, John Vaslin is speaking from a journalistic perspective, but from an administrative angle. How are things at the other house? Rangling is something of the past now, and it has prevailed. And the game is getting to another level. I think it's right. At the moment it's not that bad we are doing very well. I think everything has been put in the right position, right perspective. And so far you have seen the results of the performance of the athletes. And of course you can only charge a federation by the results of the activities. And I think ours speaks for itself. Speaks for itself, the track record is encouraging, right? But we speak about the landed marathon set for tomorrow. John Vaslin, I know you are a writer and you must have made several articles previewing these championships later for tomorrow. It's a do or die contest. And of course for more record holder Wilson Kipsang in male categories is also looking forward to pull a surprise. And if possible we will probably break a record title something he did a few years ago. So what do you make of the build up so far to the contest? But the build up is good and it's encouraging. And it's one of now the most talked sport in the world. And it has been put according to the ratings now. Actually it's the most apart from the Premier League. It's the most weighted upon sport to be seen tomorrow. And it's promising fireworks. The weather is cool. The environment so far is good. The build up also in London has been encouraging. More interaction and more words. More words between the runners. I still have a stand of elude carrying the day. Elude so far has not run in a race. So he's at his best. More has run a race. So you see when we compare the two and I like the management of elude because it seems like they have the program for the runner. Maybe it's three marathons in a year. Which is so good. That means it's this three three three months or four months four months four months. It's a good because the body has build up. The body is practiced on Malisi and even the energy and the mindset is clear. And you know elude so about mind. When I think he talks he says it's about here. Everything. He doesn't depend on any. After training he'll tell you everything is here. So I expect more to be seen. Fireworks tomorrow it will be there. We cannot rule out Mo Farah. Mo Farah is there and you have seen the British media how they are doing everything possible to put him everywhere. Every minute they are talking about Mo Farah. So there is a lot of positivity on his side. And then the beauty is that it's his home ground. Home ground. And the following he has the following amazing following that is coming into place. Wilson Kipsang. Wilson Kipsang is the only man who has beaten this great enormous runner called Elude Kipchagi. So he'll be also there but when you see the last races or the four races that he has participated or competed against Elude his performance has been wanting and he's noticed. I like his kicks. When I look at the legs how he runs he's more of a next person. I don't know what happens after 20 km. It's the time that he goes into. There are things that I really don't understand him. Mr Gorell I know you've dealt with these athletes even from a tender age to where they are. Most of them you've guided them, you've mentored them professionally and career wise. And going by the build up as John Vaslin puts it the build up is enormous. It's tremendous. It's so huge land and it's massive. British media hyping. They are very young, more farra. As usual of course they are very patriotic and like other press from other countries. What do you make of the redness of Kenyan participants ahead of the event tomorrow? Yes I think I would term this event we use it to call it the Rambo in the jungle. Honesty the preparation has been very good following what Elu Kipchaka has been doing. Kipsang also has been training here in the jungle and I'm sure that also he wants to prove himself despite the fact that the last few races he has not done that well. When it comes to more farra I understand that he was training in Ethiopia and going by the past experience you know both of them are track athletes Elu Kipchaka and more farra are track athletes and they are exceptionally good. Both of them have good speed and they have determination. Both of them as Vaslin has said have the mind to fight. This game is actually the mind game and you have seen the way Elu that has always been philosophical of what he talks about and he believes in what he is doing my take is that it is going to be a tough game although my bet is that Elu will win but then he will have to really get extra care to make sure that he beats more farra. As for Kipsang the disadvantage he has is that he is not a track athlete so if he manages to hang on with these guys until the last one kilometer definitely he is going to lose because of the kick of Elu and more farra but then if he has the energy and he is in the shape that he was a few years back then of course he has to go away at 38 kilometers so that he can leave these guys but eventually you know London is a really tough course and it is going to be really really a tough one but we don't have to forget that we have also Ethiopians who are going to be there and they are also extremely good so this competition this time round it is a toss up it is not really beyond what we are going to win but my bet is on Elu because of the fact that he has a very tough mind that if he is there in the last one kilometer the chances are he will win There has been this assumption that mind games and psychological tricks are only in football but athletics has also witnessed such scenarios going by the headline midweek of athletics this verbal warfare between Mofar and Hailegabresa last year when he was hosted and was training in Ethiopia do you think that is also mind game vastly? Ya, it is it is psychological torture you are being tortured psychologically and once there is an effect or you are affected here then automatically you have a war, a mind war so the British media has really been trying to cover up that thing they have played it so cool they have engaged people they have been talking to more the coach for more who is the husband to Paula Radcliffe the current world women record holder and he has come out to explain the situation how it was and he said more defended because there is a trainer they were training in Ethiopia so this guy was coming to beat the trainer so more had to defend his fellow athlete so he went and then he gave him a blow and there is a lady who was coming up with this training gyms and so forth and so forth so it is a torture they are trying to torture this man but statistical when you look more has really grown as a person and in athletics in athletics it is all about what career is taking about when you come from the track and you have a proven record written record you have grown your touches grown you have somebody people are talking about every day that confidence that you have it is all about here so for me it is on paper actually when you see more the best time for me is two of five forty nine he is the second last the last person is Daniel Wanjiru he has two zero five forty nine so he is the last person on paper second last if you go on paper statistical with the time most time is last year 2018 running Chicago Marathon when you won so it is time if you compare because we have four Ethiopians we have Tola Tamirat Gabriel who all are within the two zero four bracket so it is a tough game we cannot rule out these people the Ethiopians these people they are called parasites in athletics because when you lift the leg they place the leg where you have lifted it so they are just playing psychological torture you remember last time the rest the person who was debuting the Ethiopian who debuted with Eldwood he really tortured Eldwood even there was a war as they were going on with the rest because Eldwood was telling him keep your leg but the man is not keeping his leg he is just behind Eldwood so torture is there again and there are four good athletes Ethiopian that are there so this race is going to be won in Marathon they say the marathon starts at 38 km that's where the marathon starts forget about this journey forget about the journey from 1 km 5, 10, 15, 20 and forget about that journey 4 km away from the end yes that's where the marathon starts and I am so sorry if Kipsang will not have gone by that time I am sorry because the two people Mo and Eldwood they will beat him by a kick do you think the target umo world record holder Wilson Kipsang has said is realistic one and considering that you know Mr Eldwood Kipchoke who is the reigning champion for London Marathon so hinted that he is not going for world record title do you think those particular targets are achievable umo yes you know now Eldwood has tried twice he tried to break the two hours he almost did that he went for the world record he did that he made it so this is a man who is capable of anything when they go now because probably you don't even have it means that you really have to run not only with your legs but with your mind to make sure that you calculate it's about calculating the energy you have to know what kind of energy remains for you so that you can run in the last 4 km after that you know the 4 km that remains is the one that determines the breaks or makes you and and of course with Eldwood and Mo Farah and the Ethiopians it is going to be very tough so what they will do now is to figure out how they will run the last 4 km or the last 2 km and that one will determine the person who is going to win Kipsang really needs to be careful now he is going to handle it if they don't have these megas or these megas is not following them then the chances of beating the two will be very difficult nevertheless I am looking forward to this when I want to see how everyone is looking forward to eat it will be blistering tomorrow at the London Marathon women representation as far as Kenyan is concerned Vivian Cheryot up for the title defense do you think so? Vivian as always with my favorite she is also a lady who has the mind to compete and she is also very intelligent and mainly people always think that you can only run with your legs but it is mainly the mind determines whether you will win or not despite the shape you are in Vivian has that capacity and the toughness of mind to resist any pace and she knows when to run I remember her first debut in New York she was too much and she used the pace of others and then she paid the price later but then the next marathon she was too much intelligent and she left everybody to go and she just followed America and eventually she beat them so this should be her third major marathon and she has done well in the others she is someone to look up to and I will not be surprised if she wins still a line up for Kenya in women category America itani Vivian Cheryot in my own assessment we are sure for podium finish Kenya podium finish and I will tell you why for me I know Vivian runs her own personal race that's what she learned through the very first race because she ran someone's pace that she did not prepared for or to do or train for but when you see especially the last marathon she ran on her own and she eventually came victorious but according to me Keitani land her lesson and she knows the people that she is going to run with and the pace that she will go with I still think she has something in mind that she wants to achieve she will be the fourth she has won three times so this one is going to be the fourth also and I am putting my prize money on her and I know she is going to perform because she has done it before she is the current holder with 217 so I know she will do it something but there are two people here that we should not forget Vivian and Keitani we call Cherono and there is somebody called Gladys Cherono and then there is Bridget there is Gladys and Bridget when you look at these two women their personal best actually is 218 and when you look at 2018 when it was going to end look at the performance of this girl called Bridget Kosgay then you realize that something is going to happen and the people that we need to really focus on right now because for me my fear is she might beat the two because these two their mindset is Vivian and Keitani they are going to fight each other but they have forgotten these two they are the favourites even statistically they are being favoured but I am telling you somebody to watch in that women marathon is called Bridget watch her she might carry the day I think about other headlines as far as athletics is concerned locally the junior team that represented the country that did beauty for Kenya at the 1820 African youth championship in Ivor coast of course I have staged a seating over and played allowances you spoke and even the athletes upon their arrival spoke let's listen in before we proceed in 15 hundred meters so we cooperated with my fellow colleague I was strong then him he dug up so he will be able to pick a sabu mojambili na tulioza in late gold medal na piyaka late silver kumusana jupafumansi and then I will define anybody it is actually emotional when you see what they require as girls and this just was told so when it comes to that now we cannot be so rigid to the extent but it can be done legally through the ministry they don't have to pay a k they let them come and pay the athletes directly here they are here each athlete can sign on their own behalf and collect the money but if we say now they have to be paid through the account which accounts now because they don't have accounts the parents don't have accounts and the ministry say we cannot pay to someone else other than the parents so what we do are they going to be paid or are they not going to be paid we have to be realistic in what we do and we have to really understand the artists themselves and Edward Zakai of course speaking upon the arrival from Ivor Coast where they participating in under 18 and under 20 African youth championship of course good performance spectacular show from the Kenyan lands and of course Burna Baskoril also spoke with the regards to the unpaid allowances where is the conflicts between the government and athletics Kenya in terms of payment of athletes dues as far as athletics Kenya is concerned you know we are the body who is responsible for development and nurturing of the talent we have seen as Kenyans the results that we have already achieved we know all of us know that we don't get any support from the government to nurture the talent we have all the programs that athletics Kenya rolls out for the preparation of competitions for the whole year and we do it with the support of the sponsors and other well wishers we don't get the benefit from the government the only time that we ask the money from the government is when the team has already been selected and it is a team Kenya it is no team AK it is a team Kenya and that is the responsibility of the Kenyan government to ensure that when they are selling the team for African championship for world championship for Olympics then they should be ready to pay that little amount which are from prices of the tickets and allowances and that is the problem that has been persisting for a long time you have seen also in other federations that they have issues when it comes to the tickets they don't plan very well so that our teams or our athletes or our players they end up in their boots they still live on the floor of their boots because of the poor planning we don't have any conflict with the government but the problem I can foresee as I've always done is that some government officials don't even understand anything about sports they don't understand specifically when athletics how it functions and when we were in Aifori ghost with the team the new CS Amina Mohamed came and I found out she is a lady who actually can help change the structure and the attitude of the sports ministry in my opinion I have seen for many years that have been working with AK yes people have been talking about federations not doing their elections federations not eating the money but then when you really understand the whole thing the problem is the ministry of sports they don't understand what is going on the problem of unpaid allowance to the athletes to the sportsmen has been a rampant drug for the last few years and even going forward in case it's not addressed it will remain to be a crisis that is supposed to be addressed even during world and 18 championship pre-olympics the same scenarios witnessed do you think it's high time the government of Kenya the ministry of sports can reminerate the participants prior the competition so that it's something of the past I think it will be in my own opinion it will be good if they can do that because when you look at the team team that athletics Kenya and I'm not here to vouch for them the team that they when they set up the team where a team is going under the name of athletics Kenya you will never hear of these issues they are paid prior even before leaving there was a certain time that it was not paid but they were paid I think in the middle of the night money money money has issues everyone has his own every house has his own problem and challenges but if you are to ask me to the ladies the government needs to pull up its socks because from 2017 you can imagine in Maxwell when you are covering the youth and the 18 youth till now these guys have not been paid their money something must be wrong and then they have to meet all the contractors the government the machinery of the government there is something that is fishy because when you look at there is another federation I don't know if it's boxing federation that you hear even their budget they have been already paid everything but when you look at the other federation there is an issue of getting that money and when you go to intrigues of how that payment was there is a sister works at the federation to this chairman so what you are trying to say there is no same level playing ground in terms of treatment of this federation yes yes yes I think there is something fishy that we are not being told but I think with Amina being at the helm let's hope because you know Amina will always be a mother and Amina has children who have grown up they have passed 20 years so I think he needs now to come in as a mum to these young people because this is torture they are doing to them if Zakara has not been paid since 2017 Manangoi has not been paid since 2017 will you will you he might even change citizenship because of such because money is coming these people are calling good money sign up contracts they are good outside there so why should you stay here where you are not even being you know muna itwa they were called but you know I was embarrassed that the vice president called them he took them to his residence and he promised that these people will be paid in one in two weeks time those were his own ones two weeks time we will have cleared this today they have not been paid we do politics in athletics athletics is not of politics athletics where somebody is sweating let me tell you one thing I'll give you a scenario of a marathona you go to that person or let me give you this scenario if a marathona gets lost let me tell you at around 40 km or you stop that person from running at 40 km immediately he will stop his body he is completely finished he cannot pick up anything he is done completely done when you go to that person you remove because for us people who cover athletics we interact we know how they suffer what they go through when you go to remove that shoe just go here to cross country championship after finishing go help that runner to remove that shoe you will find how painful it is when a marathona removes his running shoe all those nails are not there it's red blood this is something I'm telling you that I have experienced personally and he has been a runner he knows that so that's why you want people who have run he seems to be in agreement he seems to be in agreement because for me I'm not here to complain for career I have had issues with career and I usually tell him and air them but the thing is we need such characters in office because one he has been a runner he knows where it pitches most two he is a runner that has gone to school so to run such an entity it will be beneficial to the community to the country and even individuals that are running too so if you can get hold of money of a runner's money somebody who wants you are not doing any favor you are destroying his life because with running let me tell you when you get an injury or something your leg happens to something your case is gone so we need to encourage Yaman as you wind up do you think these are the situations that can contribute to change of nationalities because I know athletics is a team that has dominated headlines as far as Kenya is concerned and Kenya athletes have done spectacularly well overseas and they have attracted interest from other countries who want them to change citizenship delays in terms of unpaid allowance salaries and dues can contribute to running away from Kenya this is something very sensitive when they stage the sit in two days ago I went there to talk to them after meeting the CS I asked her what can I tell them and of course she gave me what she wanted me to explain to the athletes but when I went there you cannot even imagine or believe that the same artists like Zakaio Manangoi they were talking exactly what you are saying that they have no even business run for this country because of what happened they talked about that they say if they get a chance they don't want to run for Kenya but you know that aside I think the attitude of the Ministry of Sports must change and I realised also for the first time that we have not spoken enough to fight for the rights of athletes I realised that actually we have been fighting going round and round over issues maybe election issues and leaving out the most important issue and that is the needs of athletes he explained very clearly I was an athlete myself I ran the marathon and luckily when I my first marathon I did it at 35 kilometres I was running with the guys from Ethiopia and Tanzania when I looked down on my foot it was all blood so I kept on looking at it saying will I really finish it was complete blood the shoe was blood luckily my son was in the car with the mother because they were watching and they kept on encouraging me I went on to win that marathon but then they had to come and remove the shoe for me because it was total blood and I could not walk you can imagine what he says and if you go back now to the athletes what they go through in some of them they sell their land they sell their chicken everything to buy the shoes we don't have enough funds to assist them the young ones to grow we don't have any money to give them the government has only give us any money to symbol them so when they have come all the way to make the team for the republic of this country of Kenya so that they can represent Kenya and so that you can be proud about them then why is it so difficult to pay them the spinners allowance if you see them want the money these boys and girls who have been given is only $500 having stayed for that long others were saying they have to go to school on Monday and this is what they are depending they are parents they don't have anything they are guardians they don't have anything when they even came here to get the passports because they were paying for them we had to get the money to go back home when you go to the ministry because that's where I've been sitting and looking for following these things you talk to these guys they have no clue and they don't have that empathy they don't have that feeling that these people should be taken care of they think it is just when they see an athlete that is kipchoga now winning London Marathon they think every athlete is like that 80 years work for it and you know they don't know the history of kipchoga from 2002 now up to now so not everybody earns money the way other major marathons are earning what I want to say is that I have a feeling that the new CS like he says as a mother she's going to make a change but my proposal which I'm going to pursue is that if the ministry is going to continue doing what they are doing then they have no business in dealing with the federations the allowances and the money that has to be used to develop sports in this country should go to the fund and the fund can control when we give up projects in our budgets six months then we can work out until the time now they have to pay then they have approved and the fund pays us let the ministry deal with policy and other issues but when it comes to allowance they should actually stop it completely and we go to the fund we get money directly and we face our programs at least Kenya, football all those so that we don't continue claiming the federation that they are earning money they have most of them they have briefcase offices but then when you ask the government what have you given to say yes we gave you this and you didn't open an office we gave you this and you didn't develop this so you are taking now about maybe netball or wherever they don't have enough capacity to develop because they don't have the seed money now who is going to sponsor them because the sponsors they also want to make money they want to grow also they are not going to sponsor somebody who is not and they want value for their money and they want value for their money how can you say you are supporting them then they are misusing the money when they don't have that kind of money so the problem I can tell you is not even with the federation our major problem is the sports ministry that needs to be completely the structure so that we can develop otherwise we will never develop you can take it from me fair enough finally John Vaseline your last submissions on the doping menace as we speak right now man was also supposed to claim Kenya at Tomorrow's Land and Marathon as you know failed at testing positive for consumption of banned substance that is Abraham Kutum Big blow for Kenya oh it's a big one it's a special how big I told you do you know that's a platform and these are the gimmicks of wazungu they know how to play around that's a psychological torture on Kenyan runners who are going to participate tomorrow because everyone there the runners so the TVs will be talking about doping a doping issues these fans failed doping and doping funny enough something that I've just learned this morning is that this man knew even before he traveled to London he had gotten the finding had been sent to him about the athlete blood and they took him there and even took the flight to London what a shame you know you could have declined to take the flight to London because the results had been sent to him already and later had been sent to him from AIU who are responsible on that so this one is just shaming the country and now they are going to ride on that but again the issue is this now the custodians of this runners is AK and is here I think I don't know what AK is going to do so that these people I think they should propose a bill or second a bill that once you dope it's criminalized so that in fact I know he landed yesterday because he was he was immediately taken to the flight this morning or this morning in fact such characters need when you land you're in chains straight away to police because it's a criminal offense you are shaming the whole country because tomorrow Sunday tomorrow at 11 people will be watching the whole world is going to be watching Kenyan and you'll hear those commentators mark you me you'll hear them saying yesterday one half marathon they called holder was sent home for doping purposes it's shame to hear such a thing I think athletics Kenya they need to put their house in order they need again to go back to the drawing board and see what can we do because if it's education let me tell you recently we had a conference a very huge one and conducted it okay instead of awarding athletics they took all the money and facilitated they paid flights because I heard a sneak preview of the program and how it was happening they paid flights for others from Eldori because they didn't want to come even now okay head to Pombeleza people we will pay you the flight just come up here for one day then you can go back to your training you see they gave allowances to these people they put them at the best places they can everyone from that person who is not known to the person who is not known so at least there is a role that a K is playing so it's upon these athletes now to see and get something out of such investment that these people put but again athletics Kenya you need to come up with a bill you take it the relevant authority so that we criminalize this act because they were doses A.I.U the whole house all the example Burmett is called Burmett they in charge he was in Kenya on the same issues of doping so we need to now just change the act that we criminalize so that these people can put in jail so that was why we will be able to kai from management level is it a character as a nation to the country is it injured the reputation of Kenya considering it's well known country for athletics as an individual sporting discipline and now that IWF has suspended Abraham Kiptum provisionally and now you wouldn't be able to participate in Tomorrow's Land and Marathon what are the relevance they called us doing apart from workshop and training A.K. in partnership with even ADAC to continue sensitize the athletes on the need of you know not involving themselves in doping you know this thing is also very very interesting because you know the issue of biological passport for Abraham Kiptum came about a month ago and the information was given to him and also the manager that they said was resource for biological passport and they were still investigating it two days ago as a lands Kenya because we saw that he was in London we wrote to AIU to find out whether this gentleman can actually run in London because he was already has already been at firstly mentioned and why he was in London he will be shocked that we received the information yesterday that confirmation that AIU is saying he can actually run in London when we have the documentation to prove that they say that he can run in London 24 hours later they said no he has actually been professional suspended so it goes back to what Fislin is saying that this whole thing is it smells of an intention to to put the country in part light because when it comes to London you know that competition is watch worldwide and everybody is there they will now be talking about up around the tomb but not about Kipchok and the others or whatever they are commenting they say yes one of them has already been sent home they have been sent home they have been sent home they have been sent home and then you know that this boy also had broken the world record in 21k and the record has been there for a long time so it is a very sad day for us but as he says we need to change how we are going to handle the issue of doping in the country we have to be more severe in the punishment when we had annual general meeting with all the stakeholders in the country he came and we passed a resolution that any athlete that has been sanctioned has been as they said posted sanction and coming out after the sanction is not going to be allowed to compete for the country anymore it is done we will not even if they do even like the guy who was winning somewhere yesterday he is not going to represent this country again anyone who has sanctioned will never wear the kajan chassis that is one of the rules now but we need to go to parliament and make sure that there is a law so that these people when they test positive then we have evidence and we will change them that is the only way we can do but you see the other resolution that was done the rules and regulations that was given was that we had already adopted a law that says that if you are found guilty then you will go in for 3 years or pay 3 million but then it is the IWF that actually say that you cannot change there athletes but you have to follow the process of IWF same thing with Ethiopia when they they are going to change these people again then IWF say no you can't do that so we are in a catch 22 and we don't know what to do but then because of the fear of ban because of government involvement but you see now we have to do other things extraordinary things to prove that we are doing something against this and we have to together our own laws so that we can we don't have to worry about the IWF but we say okay you will go in if you are working for the gate if you are working for the police or any government you will have to be fired you lose everything and you lose even the money you have received from this because at the end of the day we are destroying this athletics which has been special for this country we cannot continue like that and something has to give in so that we can change this and we must change I think I forgot something before we just finished just a few seconds just a few seconds I think AK has the power because the manager was given the letter advanced later again a skip tomb a case should hold accountable the manager he should be suspended or taken to jail two last year I heard Fununu you know we do research as writers that Rosa which has been advancedly mentioned in this doping issue doping issues they were to be suspended this year they were not supposed to be there but this year they are operating I think the athletics need to suspend such people they need to get hold of this manager so that he is liable for what is happening because now it's not about the manager of the athletes it's about the country tomorrow I agree with him just give us two days and you will see the action you will crack the week you will see it for yourself fantastic conversation it's been on the state of athletics we focus on Marathon set for tomorrow and Kenya Marathon has both male and female categories of course they are the defending champions and you keep joking for male category for female category looking forward to retain their titles of course we will be keenly watching the proceedings of that particular event tomorrow to see how it pans out and keep in form role is a pleasure having you on board for me as far as athletics is concerned Barna Bas Corril Athletics Kenya branch chairman and John Vaslin athletics writer joining us to put things in perspective as far as matters athletics is concerned role is a pleasure having you governor thank you for coming through fantastic cheers man thanks a lot touchline is the show and this is Y25 don't go we stay tuned match is coming up next