 Lakeland Currents, your public affairs program for North Central Minnesota produced by Lakeland PBS with host Ray Gildow. Production funding for Lakeland Currents is made possible by Bemidji Regional Airport, serving the region with daily flights to Minneapolis-Saint Paul International Airport. For information available at BemidjiAirport.org. Closed captioning for Lakeland Currents is sponsored by Niswa Tax Service, tax preparation for businesses and individuals online at NiswaTax.com. Hello again everyone and welcome to Lakeland Currents, where tonight we're going to be talking about pressures and coaching. And it's something that affects all of us, whether or not we have kids in school, maybe we used to have kids in school. There's a lot of research that shows that kids who are in athletics do really well after high school. They do well in their life, they do well in decision making. There's just so many positive things about having kids in athletics. But the whole athletic environment and the whole environment of coaching is changing so drastically. It's putting a lot of pressure on the people who go into coaching. In fact, the Minneapolis Star and Tribune did us about a two-section article on the pressures and coaching here just recently. And there were some interesting statistics that they threw out. Ten percent of girls coaches, I believe hockey coaches, no, ten percent of football coaches quit every year or retire every year. Eighteen percent of girls hockey coaches quit every year. And in the 2016-2017 year, 71 coaches resigned their positions from coaching across the state of Minnesota. Those are pretty stark statistics. And so today we're going to be talking about what these pressures are and what is it that coaches are dealing with today that they didn't have to deal with 15, 20 years ago. And my guest to my right is Gary Gruy, who is a longtime friend and who's been a coach for a long time, an athlete, played at the college level, played at high school level. He's done a lot of different things and he'll give it a little bit of his background. And then Stephanie Hansen, who is a star player maybe. I will say that. But she has an interesting, very interesting background. And Stephanie works now in Park Rapids. And she is a volleyball coach coming off a disappointing loss to chance to get into the state tournaments. But welcome to the show. Thank you. Thanks for having us. Gary, maybe we could start with you and you could give us some of your background. Oh, let's see. I grew up in Jerk Creek, Minnesota, small town by Wadena. And went on to college at Brainerd Community College where I played three sports. Mainly went to college at Brainerd, basically, obviously to get an education, but mainly to play sports. Back then, that's three sports. You don't play three sports, even at the high school level, about any more. I went on to coach at Sabika Staples, Park Rapids, Bemidji, and I finished up in Pequot Lakes. 25 years as a head boys basketball coach, we had quite a bit of success at Pequot Lakes. Some dang good kids and some good people I worked with, some assistants. Got out of coaching about my fifth year out of the head boys basketball position. Found out I was spending more time with other people's kids than my own kids. My wife and I have a set of twins, a boy and a girl that are now seven years old, and that eats up a lot of my time. I found out that coaching took up too much time. I was spending too much time away from my own kids. I do miss it. I miss being a head coach. Now I'm currently the junior varsity coach. I spent a couple years coaching seventh and eighth grade after I got out also. And you had pretty good levels of success. You had three teams that were in the state tournament in basketball. Yeah, we were blessed with some good kids and some good set of parents, good administrative help, wonderful assistants. We hardly ever changed assistants. The 11 years I was there between Brett Surge and Brian Lempela. Kyle Spray and John Dale helped out there for a few years. But once somebody told me one time, you surround yourself with good people and they make you look good, and that's pretty much what happened at Pequot Lakes. And when you got out of coaching, like you said, for a couple years you really did miss it, didn't you? Oh yes, definitely. I missed the competitive spirit. I missed the camaraderie with the kids. You really miss that. And the competitive nature of the game. But I found out it was just taking too much of my time. And after I got out I didn't realize how much time it actually took. And I go, my goodness sakes, how did I actually do all this and spend time with my family beforehand? It was very noticeable. And I think it's something important to point out too that no one coaches for the money. No, absolutely not. We'll talk a little bit about what people are paid. But it's not a lot of money when you look at November, December, January, February, March, and basketball. All of these sports takes a lot of time. Stephanie, let's talk a little bit about your background if you would. Yes, I actually grew up in Northern Minnesota in Carlstead, way up in the northeast corner. But yeah, I of course was a three sport athlete as well. Basketball and volleyball and track and very involved actually with a lot of things. Anything I could be involved in I was as a student athlete. But I played college volleyball at NDSU and also had the chance to transfer and play with the same coach in Texas at the University of Texas in Arlington. So and then I chose to coach as well after I had my kids. And so how long were you at Texas one year then? Two. Two years at Texas? And then I actually lived in Texas for about seven, eight years. And we decided to move back to Minnesota just for our kids and get kind of the way I grew up in the small town and just a safe environment for my kids to go up in and so been here ever since. And I coached my daughter through her career in volleyball and she went on to play college volleyball as well. And did very well. Yeah, she did very well. She won two national championships at the University of Concordia in St. Paul. So very well. She was on the seventh team that won the straight title, seventh straight title national at national. So just really fun to be a part of all that. Never thought I'd probably coach again but had two nieces that in Park Rapids and started with them on their offseason and then the coach resigned and then I took over and this is my 15th year so I'm four years going now and coaching volleyball in Park Rapids. Volleyball has gotten to be really a big thing in Minnesota. I think a lot of that credit goes to not only the teams like Concordia but University of Minnesota has had a phenomenal program for a number of years and I know it's not unusual to see that place packed now when they have their volleyball games. So it wasn't that long ago that not that many people went to the University of Minnesota volleyball games. So it's good to see that women are getting the recognition and girls are getting the opportunities to play in those sports that probably wasn't that big. I don't think we had volleyball when I was a kid growing up. Right. Well girls didn't have anything but being a cheerleader at that time. Yeah it has grown immensely and I don't know the exact statistic but volleyball in Minnesota is they're one of the top in the country as far as participation. So now besides being a coach you also teach. Yes. And what is it that you teach? Currently I do have my master's in education and have an elementary degree but I'm currently a teacher for Deaf Hearty Hearing for a co-op in Bemidji for BRIC. Okay so you travel to other school districts and work with kids in other school districts. Yes it's a low incidence so not a lot of this you know there's maybe one or two in each school so technically they're not going to hire a full-time teacher so yes I'm kind of the itinerant that goes around. And Gary what grade are you teaching now? I teach the grade language arts and I've taught for what not 35 years I'm 56 years old so I can retire. You didn't have to tell those you were. You look much younger. I married well that's my key success. Well so you both have very rich backgrounds in coaching and you've been around a long time period you've been around since the 80s and the 90s when the coaching was very much different than it is today. And the article that the Star Tribune did focused primarily on the metro area. Correct. And I think you guys want to talk about maybe the rural area to start with and maybe we could talk a little bit about the pressures of the clubs in the AAUs in the metro area but maybe we could get to that if we have time later. What's happening from your perspective that's creating the pressure on coaches where so many of them are just saying it's not worth it? Well I think a big problem that we have in the coaching ranks is that you don't see the the longevity of coaches anymore and if you're a young coach say if I was like 23-24 I'm not going to probably make it to 30 as a head coach. And sometimes part of it is that coaches get in as into a head position too young of an age but of course there's an opening there and there's nobody else that wants to take them. I think a lot of the stuff has been our summer programs and to keep up with the Joneses so to speak. If you're going to be successful you have to put time into the summer and you know I think that one of the biggest changes when the high school league started to allow coaches to work with their athletes in June and July. And basically I remember the last 10-15 years or whatever when that program when that initiative came in. Basically the only month that I ever got off from basketball pretty much was August and part of September. Otherwise you know when you're preparing for the season then there's a season of basketball then there's April and May getting ready for the summer then June and July okay you're spending time not with just your varsity if you want to run a good program you as a head coach you're also delving down into the fourth fifth even the elementary lower than that. That takes time and I think that really weighs on young coaches with as far as their commitment to their families and obviously you're not going to get paid for this and you don't get paid much even if you do get paid some. And usually that's through Community Ed or something different. Yes yeah it's I don't think I hardly ever talk hardly anyone to be so much money for the gas or something like that this summer because it's costly enough for the kids the way it is. We try to keep it low cost I hardly ever charged very much for our camps but still when you think about your camp then you take gas money for tournaments these kids have to eat sometimes there were overnight things things start to add up and then it's the investment of time we live in a lakes area kids when do they have time to go fishing or to do whatever else it is that they want to do as a kid or with their families and that not only for the kids and their parents but also for that coach and I think fewer and fewer coaches want to spend that much investment. Stephanie did you play basketball too? I did. And so you played basketball volleyball what was your third sport? Track. So when you had your summers as a student where was the other pole what was the biggest pole for you was it volleyball or was it basketball or what was it as a student? It's interesting you asked that because I think that's so different now because of the opportunities that are out there in the summer especially with volleyball because our off season is in you know well it actually starts winter right away when the season's done but I really don't remember ever really taking an interest in volleyball being my top sport until I was a junior in high school I loved all the sports and I did everything but nowadays I just think girls especially volleyball athletes are picking volleyball ahead at an early age and then quitting their other sports and yep and because the opportunity is a year round and I'm not I don't want to take away from that opportunity because it's it's needed to again to keep up with the Joneses you know but um but I do feel like they're they're not getting the value of of all the sports and they're seeing different coaches too yes you know and I I've always thought too is that some of these basketball players that they just play basketball that's all they would see is me and then my style of coaching yes and I always thought it was very beneficial for them to have a football coach a cross-country coach or someone else a baseball someone else to compare to where they get different experiences in life everybody brings something different to the table and those kids will benefit from that I mean practices I love it when they say oh I coach so-and-so said this and you know certain things stick in their minds and it makes a difference for sure and it's so beneficial coming from someone else and not just you all the time and you do start to recognize talent pretty young don't you in the sports that you're seeing so when you see a talented girl are they starting to feel some pressure about being good enough to go on to college at the high school level for sure yeah I think you know though it depends you know those pressures can come from a coach for sure yeah um I'm I tend to try to be a more balanced uh coach and I try to give the you know the athlete a bigger picture and and give them a chance to kind of see what is going to be best for them but they might be getting the pressure at home with with parents going you know or peers or peers yeah or their best friend or social medias where a lot of those interactions say Billy over here he's playing on this AAU team and he asks Sam over here on my team to play with them yeah and then one thing kind of leads to another definitely so that social media has changed the environment for coaches yeah in what ways how is that affecting coaches you want to go with that one well I younger on this yeah I okay so the instagram and I mean there's so many things now that they can show the videos and they can get information out there and and they can I know our park rep it's uh you know team had a instagram page and and so did the tennis team and I was able to be tech tech enough to kind of you know go into those different pages and it was almost like this battle of popularity and you know and it's just a constant pressure I think for I don't know these adolescents to be popular and to be cool and they can go get drills they can go get information on camps they can get information on tournaments some in-state some out-of-state what's Johnny they they get together with people from other towns and all sudden then they're all sudden they're being taken out of your community yes or away from your local coaches sometimes I'm not saying that's a bad thing and but you know what I'm saying there's more pressure than because everybody else is kind of doing it and that they find out that through that that social media and they know everybody they know every every kid knows every other kid it's insane that was one of the things that the star tribune reported about was some of these elite camps were telling the kids come to our camp we do a better job somewhere than your high school called track which has created a whole different stress less the level especially I think in the metro area I'm sure you see some of that at your level too yeah there are camps that you send your kids to and one of the concerns in the years a few years ago I know was that AAU kinds of events sometimes kids were getting bad habits yes yes and no I think there's a place for AAU and I think that there's a lot of good AAU coaches unless maybe you explain what AAU is for people who don't know it's a higher level of basketball volleyball I'm assuming also correct outside the regular high school season it usually takes place in April May it sometimes it goes in the fall league there's fall league basketball it's where kids will go to gain one better skill set to play more basketball number two through about through these programs and to get exposure for college college coaching and you have a tryout tryouts and so you're put on a level a skill level of team that you know are they regulated by the Minnesota State High School no not a bit so they're completely free yeah kind of operate as they like correct and there's a lot of good coaches out there and there's a lot of good programs I'm not here to bash AAU by any stretch of imagination I always had good good rapport with a lot of the AA coaches some are better than others and they run a better program some I think but AA parents have to and players have to understand there's more time commitment for certain programs as opposed to others and I think they as parents athletes you have to kind of find your niche yes in the AAU program sometimes unfortunately sometimes kids have an expectation when they do play AAU that that's automatically going to make them a better high school player and go to guarantee them a spot on the varsity team or x amount of minutes playing time that's where things kind of come in and I would guess that parents also have some expectations from that they do sure they do it's it's also it's cost time and time away from family so they're investing they're investing all this money we want more playing time or they think they should and in some cases you know the majority of the people that I worked with that wasn't a problem but I think it's getting I think it's more of a problem towards the metro area because it's a little more cost we've had pretty good rapport with the people up here that I've worked with through the AAU programs definitely yeah and I guess what I was going to say is there's different levels but they're all opportunities and you kind of have to look at the child or the kid and say what what what is this kid looking to do what are their goals and what kind of AAU situation would be would be good for them is it the high level best skilled team in the state or is it just local tournaments or is it you know in in a college where they want to go you know and that can start as young and believe it or not second grade really yeah I was just talking to a parent I'm not going to get into names but whatever their their son was invited to play in a specialized hockey situation I was going to say I bet it was hockey down in the cities and the parent you know is probably going to say no because hey it's it's too much time away from home away from school now grand there's parents that might want to choose to do that but I think that's where parents have to come in and say enough's enough or this is right or we need to do more I mean there has to be and there has to be communication with the high school coach and the parents and the player to figure out where that would be best for them as coaches how did you handle parent complaints or how do you handle parent complaints do you prefer face-to-face meetings because I know that one of the things that's starting to happen excuse me through social media is there are more parents communicating with their coaches through email maybe saying things that they maybe wouldn't say face-to-face have you how do you handle that to be honest in in Piqua Lakes I had very little parental issues not that there weren't parents torqued at me I get that and but that's the nature of the beast absolutely that comes with part of the job I mean you're going to get some of that but I had the majority and I mean the majority of the parents I worked with in Piqua Lakes were very very very cooperative not that they always liked what I did or whatever but the players and the parents were very supportive of what we tried to run as a program I think what really helped me is that I had stability in my coaching staff I had the same ninth grade coach I had two different three different varsity assistants but I and one was only there for a short year but I had on both ends some good quality people my seventh grade coach was there the whole time majority eighth grade coach was there I changed very few coaches the thing is that what happened is there was an expectation as people moved up the ranks and so on that there was this is what needs to be done this is what needs to be done this is what's expected and a lot of my lower level coaches took out took care of some of those problems before they got to me to be honest most of my issues you know would come up with our youth basketball with youth basketball program at the beginning of the programs when they didn't know the expectations that were designed into the program or what were the expectations as the as their son moved forward I think that's huge you know I would say the same thing well the expectation piece yes throughout the whole program right it just clarifies a lot of things right off the bat and when you know the kids come up especially you know at the varsity level they already know the expectations and there's no questions right there was there was one boss of basketball in our town we had different entities we had the pack program we had the community had program the high school program and then the summer program and you know I advised the youth programs and I ran the high school and the summer programs you know but there has to be one set of expectations from the head coach on down which means you have to have administrative support in order to have those expectations and I had that also I'm not asking about personal salaries here but in general what kind of salaries are our head coaches made and let's just say in basketball and volleyball if you look kind of across central minnesota what what ranges do you hear of or and I know it's negotiated by a teacher contracts for everybody but what are you looking at for salaries now for people in your field do you get forty eight hundred no I think I was like as low as 32 at one time the problem and I think I was at Bemidji I probably got close to a little over five I had to start over again yeah parking park rapids started at the low yeah because yeah yeah the salary doesn't I'd never coach for the summer no but I think it's important for people to understand that people I get what you're going to coaching to because it's paying well no it's uh when you look at the hours I used to say when you volunteered you made about the same amount of money as I had coach because you all put in about the same amount of hours and you know it doesn't come out I mean I I did it because I love that yeah I mean and I think the metro area is paying higher oh yes definitely does here and brander pays brander here and brander pays much higher they're a bigger school sure you know uh you I would assume you both belong to the coaching associations does your coaching associations provide any support for the challenges that young coaches are dealing with now well you know what they provide is they provide people to talk to you know when you're around long enough you have you develop friendship and if there's an issue I wouldn't hesitate to call Dave Gallovich and Crosby I would educate Dave Cressup and Purim I know some other coaches that here's the problem we have that I'm dealing with as far as whatever it may be and I'll network and especially going to coaches clinics in the summer you see people and you have an adult beverage after the game or not after the game but in the summer after things are over and then you talk about it the certain problems you might have and you work towards solving them in your own way definitely coaches clinics they're really fun to go to clinics are huge and networking you know they always say yeah I guess I've always said volleyball is a small world yes exactly it really does help to so that network of and I'm thinking about this for maybe people who are looking at the program who might want to get into coaching networking with experienced people would be a real big deal I strongly believe that goes back to what you said if you're a young coach and you want to you want to have a career in it you know be an assistant with with with the coach that is very experienced and kind of learn and grow yes and you know I'm looking at at becoming you know the end of my career too here soon but you know I've there's been expressed it's you know interest in in some coaches coming under me and I just think that's great I think that would benefit them a ton because there's so much more to coaching find just find a mentor find someone to help you to bounce ideas whether they're actually either currently coaching or even if they're not coaching but then actually then listen to them that doesn't mean you have to do it you know exactly the way because you still have to be your own person and I think you need to find and the schools have to help with this the schools need to hire more coaches I mean there's teachers and coaches if you're a good teacher you're probably going to be a good coach if you're a good coach you're probably going to be a good teacher the schools need to hire more coaches so there's more people to get into the coaching that are in the school I think that would be good you have a mentorship you find some people to bounce ideas off and then surround yourself with with good people you really have to do that up and down the program that makes it makes the head coaches assistant even in the summer which takes a lot of time if you have assistance to help you in the summer and I was really lucky that I had especially in Pequot Lakes it makes a ton of difference as far as hey I can get put them over there they'll take care of it I know they'll do a good job right so in your two particular areas at Pequot and Park Rapids are you having good numbers are you getting lots of kids out for volleyball lots of kids out for basketball are those numbers looking good it's interesting to bring that up because no it has been that has been really tough even though you've had a really successful season seasons really yeah we you know when I always you know you think oh what am I doing wrong you know they're not coming out for volleyball but it is basically all the sports in Park Rapids right now they're having a hard time getting kids come and I know some of the metro football teams have almost not enough kids to have scrimmages yeah maybe because of the concussion issue but that wouldn't be your issues in volleyball the people at the boys side it seems to be doing a pretty good part of participation I think overall our girls do too I think we've had a lot of success in both the girls and the boys sides of you know variety of sports and I think you know people are it's a sports town and people talk sports and the way the kids go out and we have good youth programs too it is amazing because when you have successful sports teams like it's all around the state and it has a positive impact in the community very much the positive impact with the kids yes and I see kids 30 years ago that played at Staples and they still talk about the heyday it's just a great experience so I hope when young people watch you guys today we've been very positive oh yes talking about how to get in not not how to get into coaching but the positive things about coaching I think it's really important information you give about building a network of experienced people yep and I am out of time but thank you both for appearing on the show and if they want to get in touch with you they I guess they could do that through your school district yeah Gary through Pequot Lakes yep Stephanie website yeah part of volleyball dot com so great well thank you for being on the show and sharing some really good information thanks thanks for coming and thanks for having us right you bet you've been watching Lakeland Currents what we're talking about what you're talking about I'm Ray Gildow so long until next time