 What if you're laid off during the pandemic and there is a family waiting for you to get your career back on track? And especially if you have over 20 years experience, there are not that many job opportunities out there. Today, we're going to show you how Andrade is making a comeback during the pandemic and he got a job offer as exactly director in the tech company. This is Dr. Nancy Lee, a director of products from DrNancyD.com. I help people transition from worker B to a product manager and business leader. To learn about the most effective way of landing a product manager job, you should subscribe to this channel and turn on the red bell button so that you'll be notified every time I post a new video every Wednesday. Make sure you smash the blue like button so that I have more motivation to make more free trainings like this. Today, we had the pleasure to interview Andrade. Actually, Andrade got like an exactly director offer during the pandemic. She has a lot top secret to share with all of you guys. Hi, Andrade, how's it going? Thank you, Nancy. Thank you for having me here today. Awesome. Can you introduce yourself very quickly? Sure. My name is Eduardo Coca. I'm a senior director of product marketing now at Constant Contact. I have extensive product management, product marketing experience, you know, developing a common vision, launching products and scale such products with cross-functional teams during the last, you know, 10 to 12 years. And some of those products have achieved over $100 million in revenue. Awesome. Yeah, Andrade, today we more focus on how exactly you got like amazing offer during the pandemic. As we all know, now the pandemic is shifting how people hire the top talent and especially getting the exactly direct offer during the pandemic. In my opinion, it's super challenging, also very outstanding. Congratulations. So can you share with us how you started this job hunting journey and where you were before we are right now? Yeah, thank you. I think the challenges at the beginning were the, you know, lack of opportunities to meet people and a one-to-one basis or an events, to network, to talk about job opportunities to be able to present yourself. So luckily, I already came from a big round of doing NIFI communication and collaboration meetings products. So know how to, you know, network, you're a true get your message across, you know, very concise manner that you can communicate to people, network of people, interview with people and follow through everything remote. I think those are the major challenges, but very important in order to, you know, network interview during the pandemic. Now you fast forward, right? I was onboarded. I met everybody, my team and my leaders on the company remotely and already not only growing the business, but also hiring some people in the company as a director level. So she was very excited for a very slow period of time transition from somebody that was looking for my next challenge for somebody that is trying to hire somebody else to come in the company. That's awesome. So let me understand the time a little bit. You started job hunting in March or April, right? That was at the deepest time of the pandemic. Correct. Yes. It was the deepest time. There are some job opportunities that I was starting to have interviews that are very excited. I was moving very fast. Everything stopped. Everything was slowed down and really stopped and was going to talk a little bit about the secrets, right? I was having the right mindset about this because everything stopped. And then eventually not by only outbound opportunities that the companies that are starting, people are networking, but also you start to attract. Lots of opportunities start to show up again in my way. And you were able to manage interview like three or four. It landed the one that I had the most interest that I thought was a long-term fit. That's awesome. Yeah. We do need to dive into all the top secrets details right now. Okay. So can you share with us the top secret you had? You mentioned earlier when you got started, there are not many job openings and you don't know how to go networking because pandemic suddenly hit us. All of us. So what's the top secret for you to land a job as the effect directors? Yeah. You know, in a very simple way, right? The first one is mindset, which I can expand a little bit about it. The second one is coaching. The third one is having the right strategy. And fourth is massive action, right? Do and how to do it. I think you're very good about giving a lot of hints in the details of how to do interview or program management, the words you need to use, the double questions you should be preparing for. But really, as a strong mindset, it starts there. And if you want to expand a little more, what do you mean by strong mindset in job hunting? Well, so in my case, let's see, like you know, and I think you too was a job hunting during a very challenging time. Right? Yeah. So I think that having the right mindset and is knowing that when you're going to the storm, right, is, you know, that eventually that will, there is going to be an end of it, right? It's like a season of the year. If you're going to the winter, eventually, you know, the spring and summer, you'll come in. So putting those things in perspective, very important, especially in high in the mindset, use, you know, a little bit of a couple of things that are important, four or five things that are very important, gratitude, right? I think having a mindset of visualization, what the new job means to you, what the new position means to you and have the feeling that you already have achieved it, visualizing it, right? And if you cannot visualize it yet, use visualization to something that already happened to you that you're very grateful to have and enter to wind those feelings, because in your heart, your mind, you know, you should not be different. If you think about something you want to achieve, the same way you think you already achieved it, you can create that feeling of, right, a gratitude right away. So starting a gratitude, then feed your mind with, you know, the right materials for problem management. I think you need to focus, right, in case you're going to problem management or problem marketing, you're just feeding my mind and everything about those two topics. Right, I think that you were, what, even before we got job offered, you constantly learning about product management, product marketing, so you're on top of the games, right? Correct, like podcast is your classes, other materials about it, what's latest in the mind or having your keys, what have done, what you, you know, was well, you know, what to, I think, what are the successes you had, translating those stories, what you have, could have done better, right? All that information is important. It's more than functional knowledge, it needs to be fresh in mind, right? I think that the third one between a both gratitude and mindset, right, was the body, right? So you need to exercise or, you know, move or walk or meditation or anything that keep your mind, your body also moving during this period of time, especially because you're so much at home, it is very important, right? Keep you active in some way, this was very important for me. Yeah, I remember when we started our coaching course, we're both walking around the box. I take classes where I take podcasts as much as I can and walking in the morning in a park or end of the day because just keep your mindset in a different way and it's therapeutic, right? It's almost like a meditation that you're doing, you help people relax and focus what's important. The other one, you know, in terms of preparation, I think the fourth one is role model. So finding people that really have done it, right? Like you, right? They came, you know, with a deep expertise and a technical background, moving to problem management, found a different job positions, grew in the position, but also hiring. So finding people that really have done it, so coaching with people that can be role models for you, that just not do coaching for a living but have done it with other people. I think that's very important, right? And the last one is once you decide how those tools for you, right, act. You really need to try it. You need to work hard. That doesn't come, you know, it's having the right strategy, but you need to work towards your goals. Exactly. Yeah, I think all those four steps are very critical, especially actually the beginning. I'm glad that you touched upon about the mindset. I also have a money ratio as well. I do meditation, which I share those meditation links in our Slack channel and imagine what would the future look like. Then you move close to it. And on top of that, of course, learning all the strategies and mindset and also the knowledge about problem management. So it's ready to take the go. I'm glad we, we touched upon something and most people do not talk about which is mindset. Yes, it is so important going to those, those phases, right? Because just the preparation, putting things in perspective and, you know, the challenge you have, but those are the things that keep you going, despite the challenges that you put your things in perspective. That's very. Exactly. Can you touch more about your networking secret? You mentioned at the beginning, there are not that many opportunities. And then suddenly, so many inbound leads or outbound leads. What's your networking strategy? Yeah, so are you, and even I think I remember we discussed that I was using more the sniper approach rather than machine gun approach, right? So, so it was a kind of, once you know, I knew the kind of functions and the type of companies that I want to work with there, right? I use my networking approach target those companies, but not only people that work on those companies, friends, right, colleagues, former bosses, right, and people that like you, right, the mentors that could give me a reference or refer or somebody that I can talk to those companies. Those are very important during this time. So I say that every job is an incredible opportunity, not for the contributions you can do for the customers and for the, for the company itself, but knowing people, right? So reaching out to your brother network, you say, look, I'm looking for a different position because of that. That's who I am. That's what I can do. Do you know something in the specific area, the specific company that I can talk to for a virtual coffee, right, or a 10 minutes conversation? It was amazing how many times people open the doors and I have conversation people that when they're driving on in the day, five minutes conversation, which they could be a referee. I know I was your position here. I know somebody's hiding, somebody a position that's, you know, open up where I know who is hiding for the specific position and can refer your resume at least open a door or something a little more personal and be ahead just to be meeting your resume to application. I'll not say that is the only way, but I feel that it was a much more, I'm going to say a personal way, which was more fun than to be meeting a resume and application to a line system, right? Yeah, exactly. And we should, our main methodology in the parliament into the bookend, when we go networking in general, I tell all my students do not even apply for jobs without referral. And I do agree. If you do the massive way of applying for thousands jobs or just hitting many people with the same messaging, it's not personable to like who for them to refer you a job. It's just, it's very low. So I do agree with you. I do think that having a meaningful conversation for five minutes, 10 minutes, and then have someone else open doors for you. That's a multifaceted plan of job. Congratulations, Andrado. Now you're also our own role models. Yeah, thank you. I appreciate that. I'm very grateful for everything I learned there. It's a humble process, right? And really depends where you are. If you're looking for a better position, if you're looking for a completely new job because you lost your job, right? To where you went to transition from university. That's so important to know what the strategies suit you better, right? So in my area, I knew already I came from problem management. I have a lot of problem marks in the big world. I just want to refresh the skills and be in touch with people that, you know, are on top of their game to learn something new and take me to the next level, which I reached out to you Nancy and I really got those skills. Thank you. Right. But some people that are looking for their first job, it's a different challenge, right? They're looking for to learn the methodology of problem managing the means how to translate their personal experience in leading any kind of project and contributing, doing research with customers and translated that leadership skills and what could be a problem managing job, right? So those are important to know which strategy makes sense for you, depending where you are in your journey. Everybody is going to be in a different level and they need to feel that they can match the right strategies to what they're trying to achieve. Yeah, exactly. As you said, for the younger folks, I recommend them to make a product portfolio to demonstrate something done before, how it's relevant to management. And I lately made a video about product portfolio. I'm going to put the video up here so people can check them. Andrade, I think you're also I want to do a video. By the way, you're probably for even after a job, take a job. I keep watching your video or probably put your phone. I love it, right? And when I say put your phone, it's not only the products you did, you are your portfolio, right? Yeah. You're 30 seconds, you're a minute, one minute and 30 seconds. Your story is for functional leadership behavior. Those are very important. Be empathetic about the people you're meeting with and be respectful for their time, something meaningful that they feel I would like to work with that person, that if you're excited after the interview, they want more about you, right? And for sure, the products are important, the products you touch, what you've been doing, but I think all this is your portfolio, yourself, what you bring in and also your contributions, right? Yeah, exactly. Everybody needs to know how to see yourself as a product. Actually, you are presenting yourself, selling yourself the whole time. Right. This one last question I want to ask you. I think very few people can answer the question very well. Regarding, there's a difference between getting a job at exactly directly level. I have lots of people reach out to me. They want to get directly VP level jobs. And you are a few representatives who are actually successful data during the pandemic. Can you tell us, when you interview for like high level jobs, exactly directors or VP have jobs, what are the differences and how can they prepare better on top of the typical strategy? Yeah, I feel beyond the right to the portfolio and products that have achieved, it's your executive presence, meaning how you communicate, summarize. They want to know that if they, whoever's interviewing, if you came from in front of their bosses or the CEO of the company, and know that you know how to communicate with the audience. So, knowing how to change your communication style, depending on the audience. So that's what I'm saying about the executive presence. Right. Be concise, be relevant to the point and be gone. Right. Move to the next step. I think that's a very important communication style. The second one that's very important is not only have the ability to have led or have done it, is ability to have motivated people to get work done. Right. Because that's a part of the leadership is do yourself, but also know how to motivate people to have done. Because you know when we're going to be a more listener level that you'll be working either managing or leading groups and you need to know how to communicate with that. The third one that's very important for executive style is be a peacemaker. Right. Or knowing how to, in terms of, you know, difficult situations and challenges, don't be shy to have difficult conversations, but think about creating win-win situations where people will unite people inside of the company to achieve something. Find a common ground that's above and beyond yourself is selfless to your customers, what you guys trying to achieve and have those examples that you are somebody that contributes as a teammate, team player and a collaborator in the group. That's above and beyond your unique yourself. Right. Being selfless about the leadership skills. Right. I think those three characteristics are very important in terms of looking at executive role. Awesome. Thank you, Andrade. I learned so much from you today about how to get ahead and keep on cleaning up the career ladder. That's awesome. Thank you. Yeah. Great. And I think there is another great information we can share with all the audience is that we have a secret society for all the product managers and existing product managers to learn people from like Andrade who had years of experience. I'm going to put those, which I grew by LinkedIn group icon up here so people can join those product management communities for our network today. Awesome. Great. Andrade. Yeah. This is thank you very much for your time. Do you have any last many words to our audience? Yes. I'm going to say learn to persevere, endurance, but remember this is a marathon with a couple of sprints is not just a sprint. So take care of yourself beyond, you know, taking care of your job, your career. Awesome. Thank you very much, Andrade. I'm going to see you next time. See you guys. Bye. Thank you.