 Welcome to Radio Davos, the weekly podcast from the World Economic Forum, that looks at the world's biggest problems and how we might solve them. In this special episode, Technology, what are the technological breakthroughs that could help us solve some of those problems? To look into that, I'm joined by my colleague Greta Keenan. Hi Greta, how are you? Hi Robin, thanks for having me. You work at the Centre for the Fourth Industrial Revolution at the World Economic Forum. You're very heavily involved in the report we're going to be talking about today. Tell us about this report. Absolutely. So the top ten emerging technologies report is an annual report of the World Economic Forum that brings together insights from over 90 experts across 20 countries to list the most promising breakthrough technologies of the next three to five years. It has a legacy, strong legacy over the last 10 years and since the first edition in 2011, the report has really called out technologies that were little known at the time but then went on to have a huge societal impact. One such example being genomic vaccines or mRNA vaccines which we put on the list in 2016 that then went on to become years later, a few years later, the technology underpinning the majority of life-saving COVID vaccines around the world. So we're really proud of the history of this report and we were really excited to just a few weeks ago launch the 2023 edition of the report. And just as we have in the past, the report is really to serve professionals across industries and help them anticipate the new technologies that are emerging, understand their potential impact and then really positively shape the outcomes for economies and societies. We were proud to do this in collaboration with Frontiers and excited today to talk to you, Robin, about what those ten technologies are. Yeah, and we've looked at this on Radio Davos in the past. We've done two episodes before on previous editions of this one. People can go back and listen to those and to see if we were right in those forecasts. And I'm delighted to say we've got the same guests on this time as we had on last time. Greta, could you introduce them to us? Absolutely. So behind this report is a fantastic steering group of experts who have the hard job every year of whittling down almost 100 different technology nominations down to the 10 that make it into the report each year. And we're really pleased today to be joined by the two people who've really been championing that effort over the last decades as the co-chairs of our steering group. We have today joining us Mariette de Cristina, Dean and Professor of the Practice of Journalism at Boston University College of Communication and Bernie Mayerson, Chief Innovation Officer Emeritus at IBM. Thank you both for joining us. Thanks for having me. It's great to see you both again. Before we get in, we're going to go through this list one by one, this 10 technologies that you've helped pick out. Could maybe, Bernie, could you tell us what are the criteria you use when you're whittling down just to 10 technologies each year? At the end of the day, it's scale and impact. If you think about it, you're looking at what's going to have a profound impact on society, on technology, on science, on business. It really is going to be the scale of that impact that we look for because at the end of the day, remember the word we use in this is emerging. Emerging literally means the technology has to grow to some significance within the three to five year period. So those are our metrics. And then based upon that, you actually have to do the very difficult job of forecasting the future, which Mariette and I have struggled with for years, where you look at all of these excellent proposals and say which ones are going to win and emerge. And the group we have is fabulous. They've really done an extraordinary job in terms of helping us whittle it down. Great. I'd just like to add quickly to what Bernie said. He got that absolutely right about the scaling. And one way we probe that is we talk a lot about is it truly novel? Is it really building in a significant way? Does it have the power to disrupt? And we call it depth. But what we mean by that is is there more than one company or more than one group exploring it, which will help add to that. Right. There must be a tricky job because you've got technologies which are still relatively small and you're having to think three or five years in the future what it could become. Greta, over to you. So now that we know what the criteria are to get on to this top 10 list, let's get into it. Artificial intelligence is constantly making headlines these days. And of course, two of the technologies on the 2023 list are AI related. Bernie, perhaps you can tell us about what those technologies are. Well, if you take a look at what's going on in the world, generative AI, you know, chat GPT is just something that's hitting it out of the park in terms of people's interest in it. It's truly extraordinary. The ability of it to basically help you go through and actually say, this is an answer that as a human being might have taken me months to generate or I might not even have the skills. Generative AI and chat GPT, it basically can come back and give you this answer you might have sought for months or years or maybe never gotten. That's the good news, but we tend to be very balanced here in terms of looking at what we call lights and shadows. Generative AI basically trains upon the existing data that's out there in the world and says, from that data, I can then parse together this answer that you're looking for, whether it's a description of a Shakespearean epic or is something as straightforward as what would a painting look like of somebody who is basically ice skating in a competition. I mean, literally it has that broad set of capabilities. The caveat and the quote, shadow people worry about is how far can it emerge? In other words, how far can it go in terms of actually displacing human effort? And that has been a contentious area which we're not ignoring, but there are such positive things it can do at this time that it deserves to be on the list. If you think about it, for instance, in health care, think about forgetting about just it can help a dentist, for instance, identifying it from an image. There's an issue in your mouth. That's a fairly obvious one. But what about areas where you go deep into the hinterlands of a country where you don't even have medical services? And you actually have, however, a connection to an AI that has actually been trained in medicine. It has actually read, literally, the entire body of medical evidence. And if given some very basic information on symptoms, for instance, can actually come back and say, probably dealing with this, that's access. And basically leveling the playing field globally in terms of accessing health care and getting treatment, therefore, it's an extraordinary evolution. And it is, in fact, taking place today. There are places in India, in fact, which did not have medical services, which are getting them through this means. And it is clearly something that is going to be emergent over the next three to five years in terms of bringing up the standard of medical care globally, even where the educational system is not yet caught up creating the ability for the local institutions to provide such care. So these are just two obviously disparate things. But when you look at them, and perhaps Mario could comment, if you look at AI and chat GPT, the challenge that you're faced with, of course, is it also, when misused, can generate answers to questions where you're attempting to train a student. And the student just gets out on the web and basically pops up an answer that looks absolutely great and has nothing to do with their own ability. I mean, I know that's a setup, Mario, but it is a challenge you face in particular. Thank goodness that as people develop new AI technologies, they usually develop ways to detect whether they've been used. And that's one of the things we do in education. But one thing I would like to add to what Bernie's been saying that really struck me as I was looking over the list is that the power of data science, AI and computing is really throughout the entire list. We singled out a couple where the AI advances were particularly noteworthy, but that power of using computation and data to take a systems approach really runs through the entire list. Yeah, and it is, by the way, there is a very interesting emergent field interesting in defeating AI. It always goes like that. In fact, there is a very clever bit of work going on which might make the list next year, you never know, which is how do you detect AI's use in places it is not meant to be used. And as one example, human beings have many, many different ways of saying the same thing in words and they randomly select words that would give you the same outcome. Turns out you can actually set it up so that a system such as AI to identify itself always chooses among, let's say, 10 different word options it always chooses one. And therefore, if you look at a response where it is actually used all words that you know are actually AI affiliated even though they could be randomly used and you compare it to what should occur. If all the words that AI would basically now to identify itself appear in an answer that you're given, you know it was produced by AI as opposed to a student handing it in. It actually is very, very clever. There is, it's inevitable that there is a plus and a minus. The good news is the world is beginning to deal with it proactively. So poor Marriott will not have to sweat whether somebody has actually used their brain or their fingers. Yeah, generative AI, it might be people listening to this are saying, what do you mean emerging? It's emerged because in the last six months everyone, it would seem, but everyone it seems is using it. However, those applications in healthcare or in medicine were still really in the foothills I think of what this technology can bring us. Do you want to go Gretchen on to the next one? Sure, absolutely. So we just heard about generative AI and AI facilitated healthcare which made the top ten list. There are of course other technologies on the list that are related to health and healthcare. Perhaps Marriott, you want to start us off with something called Spatialomix. What is that and why is it on the list this year? So thinking about healthcare and about what we can see and know I think we've all seen a picture of a cell, right? That looks pretty or maybe you've seen pictures of brains where there's an area of the brain that's active but the problem with those previous pictures is that they're quite static and your brain, your body, all your metabolism is moving constantly with thousands and thousands, I mean so many thousands, in fact there are more than 37 trillion cells in our bodies right now all actively working away and to get a sense of what they're doing in between the one snapshot or in a case of brain imaging, things that are done at a fraction of a second here we are going to soon be able to turn to Spatialomix and this is using advanced imaging technologies and the specificity and resolution of DNA sequencing combined and as I mentioned just a minute ago a lot of computing power behind it and what can we see? What we can see processes actually unfolding and the ability to see those processes in folding whether they're part of your metabolism or how your brain is working or how other areas are working gives you two things. First, critically a better understanding of actually what's going on there are many things like if I have a headache that headache could be oh I don't know it could be that I just got a concussion it could be I have a tumor it could be something else sometimes things present in the same way and only if you can really see the mechanisms underneath them can you understand what's going on and then second and critically once you understand in detail you can then develop therapeutics to approach challenges like if I had a cancer tumor this technology could be used to exactly see what was unraveling in my cells and come up with approaches to tailor cancer treatments to that tumor or tumors in your body so it's a kind of an amazing technology in the next several years we financial folks forecast that it will more than possible in its growth and impact and I think we've been watching this one in the committee for years and waiting to see when we can say alright within three to five years we're going to see a real impact here and that is spatial omics spatial omics that's a term most of us won't have heard before you've been discussing it for years in the committee where does the word what is an omic where does this word come from different areas of study and biology where we're understanding the processes of something like metabolomics genomics you use that word not too long ago so get used to the word omics it's often applied to the study of different areas and spatial here understanding the spaces and how they move along in the body Great, on to the next So we've heard about spatial omics another one of the medical themed technologies on this year's list is designer phages again probably something no one's ever heard of so Bernie do you want to talk us through that one Sure It's interesting basically phage is a delivery vehicle of information in this particular case you actually are taking a virus and one of the things virus do to replicate themselves is they deliver information into your DNA that essentially causes to replicate themselves when it's an infectious agent however designer phages are very different approach what you do then is imagine you have a tub of a given bacteria and you want to manufacture something and as an example literally maybe manufacture insulin believe it or not you can actually inject into the actual mix a phage which has been designed so that it's DNA it injects it into or the fraction of its DNA that is injected into the bacteria it attacks turns that bacteria into a factory and that's a fascinating thing it's a very clean sort of thing where if you design the phage correctly it will actually insert DNA information into the bacteria that are present to turn them into factories for highly desirable things in vast quantity whether it be a drug whether it be insulin whether it be any other chemical that you actually need in a biologic process it's a remarkable thing and in terms of manufacturing if you think about it it's very natural you know it's not like you're going out and getting some magic ingredients and going and mixing them up and hoping for the best outcome this literally is exactly tailored and it's kind of if you think of it it's an offshoot of something we pointed out where you actually do gene editing it's gene editing but it's done with a remarkable simplicity literally using a designer phage a virus that has been tailored to do the editing for you at scale and it's interesting again that remember the word scale comes up so it is something that is really revolutionary in terms of oddly as it may sound manufacturing literally it's a biological manufacturing system that is making use of a virus to do your work for you and that's damn impressive and will become important because if you want to talk about low cost drugs and the cost of drugs one way of really driving that down is being able to do a very natural process that involves creating the drug through some sort of fairly straightforward biologic process that then scales enormously I have a word phage before I believe you're correct me if I'm wrong isn't there some relation to the fight against anti-bicrobial resistance anti-microbial tell me drug resistance yes the antibiotics that are in current use today the challenge you have with them of course is what happens is let's say they kill off 99.99% of the bacteria you have to really worry about that .001% that survived and how they manage that and it may be they have some disruptive genetic information that prevents it from being attacked by this antibiotic that you've applied and unfortunately over the course of many years as you kill off bacteria that are susceptible to your drug the only ones left are the ones that are resistant to it so you better find other ways of attacking them one of which is again using these virus that are capable of genetic alteration such that they can actually make the necessary alterations biologic agent you're using for attacking these microbes that render them once again essentially susceptible to attack or attack them directly literally by inserting some fatal genetic disorder into the microbe itself using the phage as an actual weapon so it is you've made a very good point that this addresses yet another one of the challenges we're facing due to oddly enough the success of modern medicine so phages selectively target specific bacterium and this enables you to not knock out everything let's say you're taking antibiotics not knock out everything the good and the bad bacteria but selectively focus on one so if you can use CRISPR-Cas9 or other genome editing technologies to modify that phage to target the exact bacterium that you want then you're going to have a much more precise outcome so I think some of those examples within medicine and drug design but also in preventing antimicrobial resistance are really showing the impact of this technology thanks Blenny. What's the next one? Shall I go to it Greta? Perfect. It says here on my list the next one we're still on health but on mental health and turning to you Mariette how can the metaverse help our mental health? So although we've all heard of meta and maybe we haven't really engaged with it so much yet one thing that's scaling and again we're using that word scaling and computing can do for us is help address a chronic but really underappreciated problem of all of humanity and that is mental health I remember some years ago while I was still a science journalist steadily I read about a mental health study that was done in the US every decade and the thing that really struck me was about half the people in the US at some point in their lives would suffer some form of mental illness and that 20% or more would suffer clinically depression at some point in their lives these are huge numbers but everybody gets similarly a cold now and again everybody gets other kinds of illnesses so why don't we fully appreciate and grapple with what the US Surgeon General is called the health issue of our time and the metaverse for health stands poised to help us with that just as we are all right now sitting in different places around the world and engaging with each other you can harness these technologies but in a more kind of amped up version to help with health mental health diagnoses and treatment and that's what the metaverse stands to do we already have seen some signals of this coming technologies for example gaming companies have for some years now started to offer some mental health benefits for instance deep my deep wealth therapeutics has created video games that help address problems of depression and anxiety and there are others and there will be more coming along to grow what's going to bring it all together is our new metaverse for health platforms and eventually I hope when it's hard to find a clinic a mental health professional to help support you in your care we'll be able to find that more reliably and more you know more readily than we would have had in the past I was actually doing an interview this morning this morning with the head of a or someone senior in a metaverse company it'll be on another episode of Radio Davos and she uses the metaverse she does mindfulness every morning and she does it sitting on top of an iceberg in the North Pole so that's the environment she surrounds herself with presumably it's less cold than that but there's this calming place for her to do her her mindfulness I guess you know that's an everyday application that could be used to help mental health Bernie there is a fascinating example also that I've seen in Australia where they actually have a company that does human like avatars and what they found was in mental health treatment they found that people on the autism spectrum in a broad range of it in fact actively worked well with this avatar better than avatar than the real human they felt they could tell that it was clearly an avatar and I think with intent the avatar was made to be clearly evident as non-human non-less very human like and they found that those who called in for help worked very well over zoom and other technologies with the avatars as opposed to humans and it is a very powerful example that we should not assume that well you need the human touch there's a certain disconnect in some ends of the spectrum in autism where there's a level of comfort found using the metaverse as opposed to real people and so there's a really incredibly broad range of applications we have yet to explore so thanks for walking us through some of the medical related technologies on this year's list but obviously for any technology to have those real world applications in medicine they often require similar advances in engineering Bernie tell us a bit about flexible neural electronics what are they and what advances have we seen on the engineering side of things to earn this technology a spot in this year's list it really is an enormous technical challenge in some of the things that we'll discuss in a moment you're really talking about just enormous materials challenges think about this you're actually putting something into the human body that has to maintain its location that has to interact with neighboring cells without damage and has to extract some sort of data from it and transmit it to the outside world without further damaging the location it's at that is an enormous challenge in medicine particularly with implants and really the reason it earned this is we're finally seeing the ability to take electronics and first of all render them flexible that's not trivial if you've ever taken a silicon wafer and tried flexing that you must enjoy getting little chips of silicon I don't mean good chips I mean the broken pieces you know ain't a lot of flex there the remarkable thing now is there are new classes of electronics that are actually flexible physically flexible you can bend them without damage more importantly they now have biologic coatings over them that enable you to implant them in incredibly sensitive areas like the brain and extract direct signals in the holy grail of this work you want to take somebody who because of for instance a stroke or a spinal cord injury you want to be able to take the necessary information from the brain and bypass the damage back to a region where you can then drive motor function for instance that was otherwise lost in order to do that you have to have incredibly precise connectivity to where that information is coming from which is the human brain previous sensors were either A external to the brain but because of local motion literally of the brain you constantly had to retune them and or inflexible electronic elements placed on the great brain which had a tendency to slip around and also were not remotely as friendly to the surrounding tissue because they're not flexible so the fact that these implants are now being used and are proving to be both biologically compatible and good at extracting data is the very beginning of a revolution that hopefully will resolve many of the challenges we've currently had with enabling those with an impediment due to some sort of brain injury and or physical injury and loss of connectivity through various parts of the body it would really help resolve those things in a remarkable way it's really the holy grail and so the it's not necessarily the scale that it actually is in some widespread use at the moment but the impact would be almost unimaginable to people who are essentially quadriplegic in the longer term so it's something that has a really good future and it is now finally at least becoming a reality in terms of execution that's flexible neural electronics so we've talked about implants or sensors in the brain but another one on the list is sensors in a plant I was watching a world economic forum social video on this just yesterday and I had no idea this was possible Mariette tell us about wearable plant sensors thank you yeah it's amazing technology I mean if one of the things that really strikes me when I was again looking over the report the UN has said that by 2050 we'll need to increase food production by 70% to feed the world's population at the same time as everybody on you know who's listening to this nose or watching this nose we're struggling with various issues around climate and how different growing conditions are changing we also a little earlier today talked about systems in the body and how in the past we might have been able to take a picture or a series of pictures but being able to look steadily provides us with revelations on what's actually going on at the ground and in the same way we could do this in a human body of course we could do this for plants and these wearable plant sensors the idea is you get a non-invasive or maybe it pokes a little into one of the leaves sensor that can monitor resistance in the plant and by doing so can tell folks who are watching it does it have adequate nutrition how is its water supply is it getting enough sun and the difference here is going from being able to take very low quality satellite pictures of a field down to exactly what's happening one plant to the next and this will enable us to help feed the world when you say resistance you actually mean electrical resistance amazing that I had no idea that there was any kind of electrical signals passing through a plant but in fact that is what this is measuring actually all of our cells our cells, the plant cells, anything alive uses teeny tiny electrical signals to communicate to transmit information we are I suppose different in some ways in many ways from electronics but we do contain our own little voltages going on in our bodies and the plants do too and by measuring those electrical light electrical changes in the plant the sensors will be able to give a lot of precision to what's going on in the field and they enable us to get the maximum we can out of every acre on the world what do you think are going to be the biggest challenges in terms of reaching scale for this kind of technology Marriott I mean it seems amazing that we could have that level of precision for each individual plant within a field or many many fields in agriculture but how are we going to get there well obviously any new technology has a bit of work that it needs to get to really be efficient I mean the sensors themselves have a cost to them it's a cost that's now not yet applied to agriculture and to bring that cost down scaling will need to happen and that's always a bit of a chicken and an egg you know event these sensors have to be applied in some way I mean we do have to put plants you know the seeds and plants in the ground so that they will need to get we'll need to find some efficient way to connect them and then of course we're going to need to manage all the computing associated with hundreds of thousands of plants and there is progress in an area it has a bizarre name called smart dust but remember that the miniaturization now possible with chips literally means you could build a chip that you would look at it and you would say good lord that's a speck of dust that it would be an entire sensor with communication capability where in theory at least you could literally drone over a field and just sprinkle them and enough of them land on the targeted plants to get the data so technology is moving in a direction that ultimately it will become pervasive it's a question of really how fast it's not if so you've told us a bit about flexible neural electronics and wearable plant sensors naturally for any technology or electronic to be flexible it's going to have to be powered by something that is equally flexible which brings us on to one of the technologies on this year's list Bernie do you want to tell us a bit about flexible batteries yeah you've hit the point you've hit the issue right on the head which is if you think about what you want to do for instance where you want to make medical care essentially a medical knowledge pervasive one of the best things you could do as an example is you take a shirt like mine and you embed sensors in it but you have to transmit the data from sensors or store that data so it can be transmitted later not to mention you have to take the data and to do that you need power people have really come a long way in basically now making flexible lithium ion or other types of batteries which are remarkably remarkably resilient shall we say against things that you know ugly things like you throw your shirt in the washing machine and you don't kill the battery this is not a little deal that you know a little problem materials it's really a point that this world is really coming to the level where we need material scientists to really dig in hard because these batteries the capability of essentially extracting power in a way that you can make these kinds of sensing systems pervasive is crucial I mean think about this there are many many many companies out there now that are building sensors that are wearable sensors that detect blood glucose levels for those who are diabetics imagine how unbelievable a breakthrough would be if you had a type 1 diabetic this is a child who's born as a diabetic where instead of having to either prick their fingers or inject them daily you actually have the ability to literally just put on pants or put on a shirt or put on an undershirt and it literally could both sense the glucose level in the blood and transmit that in real time to regulate the glucose level at a fairly constant point because the problem in a diabetic is when you have these big spikes in values of glucose level that's what does damage to the body to do that you need power and so that is why we believe there's both a tremendous demand for these kinds of batteries and there's been enormous progress lately in actually achieving this and it's not just a battery you also have flexible electronics that literally use the motion of your body to generate power I mean there's a lot of approaches people are taking here but because this is tremendous need that actually is part of what drives emergence a demand for something and the demand is there so the technology and the material scientists who are working on it are working with pretty good success right now in literally generating stuff where you could build it into a piece of clothing and throw it in the laundry and it would still work so it would go away and again the three to five year horizons seems reasonable one of the things I think about when I hear about new technological advances you often think oh that's wonderful but where's the downside and the last two on the list here we're going to talk about are also related to energy but we're looking at aviation sustainable aviation weren't aeroplanes a marvelous invention aren't they still make it sustainable and the other one is and it comes back to maybe the first thing we were talking about at the top of this list sustainable computing generative AI we've learned uses a huge amount of power and a huge amount of compute so Maria maybe you can get green for us and tell us about sustainable aviation fuel and about sustainable computing Thanks Robin and you're right I mean obviously some of these wonders of the modern age like being able to get on an airplane I'm doing that myself in a couple of hours they come with consequences that we need to grapple with again at a systems level and again in a kind of combined way with the benefits of computing talking about sustainable aviation fuel aviation it's a significant piece it's not the biggest piece of carbon use but it's quite a significant one at about two or three percent of all carbon dioxide or more annually from aviation but to make that work to get aviation carbon neutral we're going to have to make tremendous changes in that fuel and the problem is where it's relatively straightforward to get your cars to be electric because we can have charging stations you don't need to have huge amounts on board there are a lot of mechanical and electrical problems to be solved aviation currently requires an extremely energy dense fuel and a small because you can only carry so much on that airplane and get it off the ground so the challenges there are quite a lot sustainable aviation fuel reminds me a little of when you see those biologic fuels at the gas pump sometimes where a portion of the fuel the normal aviation fuel is replaced by fuel that is either produced from biologic ingredients and there are there are about 10 or so different versions of sustainable aviation fuel but different biological compounds or by using non biologic meaning taking carbon dioxide and treating the fuels in a different way to make them more less energy impactful on the environment less biologically impactful on the environment today I think it's about 1 or 2% of all airplanes used sustainable aviation fuel but we're going to have to increase that up to about 15% for airlines to become on the carbon neutral path by say 2040ish 2050 and the good news is that there's a lot of energy because as Bernie just pointed out there's a lot of demand and a lot of challenge here so there's a lot of energy in trying to produce additional types of sustainable aviation fuel used in different circumstances and to get those more available to the airlines that need them that I haven't been counting Greta but I think that should have brought us to 10 but we wanted to cover sustainable computing I knew I just felt there was more in case you had a question about that but yeah I wanted to touch on sustainable computing you know data centers as you rightly point out use a tremendous amount of energy something like 1% of all the energy produced in the world already today which 1% of anything is a lot and when you have to take a systems approach you've got to look at all of the different pieces just to touch on this briefly because I know we're coming to the end of our program you can manage heat management issues to try to bring energy costs down with liquid cooling systems AI again coming back to the beginning is being used to analyze and optimize the power systems for sustainable net zero energy centers for sustainable computing and technology infrastructure supporting this as also being developed being more modular and demand based so that is actually only responding as needed rather than burning the same amount of energy at all times so going back almost to the beginning we do need to take care of reducing our energy uses to make computing more sustainable as well yeah that's actually delightful also side effect of things like AI and generative AI training because these things do not require latency and they're not latency is not the issue in other words it's one thing when you type a search and do something like Google and it spits out an answer in milliseconds that's the latency the delay you're willing to tolerate but when you've got something like training chat GPT which literally can run for 10 20 hours even days then what you can do is you can basically transport that computation to a region where energy is essentially carbon neutral or better example you know you have people for instance in Iceland who are using geothermal power to do working cryptocurrency same sort of thing latency isn't that crucial you have people who now move their data centers to where there's proximity to hydro power and again it may be far away from where they're physically located but because latency is not a crucial thing you're actually able to dramatically reduce the carbon footprint because the source of your energy is in fact hydro or very clean so it's really interesting people have finally been into what I'll call parse the problem where latency is crucial yes you know you have local computing sources but where it's not for crying out loud we'll put it someplace where you know you don't have to burn down a forest in order to get the thing to work and that is actually a very positive trend and it's exactly what you've been talking about Marriott which is you know these are just nods you can turn to dial down the energy demand for this technology 10 thank you very much what amazes me you know this is the third time I've done this with you on Radio Davos is they're 10 totally different technologies every year it just shows you and you're seeing dozens and dozens more that don't end up in this report so it's a very impressive report congratulations to you people can it's called top 10 emerging technologies of 2023 you can read the full report at weforum.org thanks to Greta for co-hosting but thanks very much to Bernie and Marriott who are co-chairs of the steering group for walking us through the top 10 of 2023 thanks to both of you thank you guys thanks for having us