 And the webinar is being recorded. So right now it's the four of us and there's no attendees. Okay. I'll start with that statement pursuant to Governor Baker's March 12 2020 order suspending certain provisions of the open meeting law, general law. 30 a section 20 this meeting of the Amherst Board of Health will be conducted via remote participation to the greatest extent possible for information. On remote participation, please see the calendar entry on the town of Amherst website. There you will find the zoom link and the telephone dial-in instructions. No inputs in attendance of members of the public will be permitted, but every effort will be made to ensure that the public can adequately access proceedings in real time via technological means. In the event that we are unable to do so, despite best efforts, we will post on the town's website and audio recording of the meeting and meeting minutes will be posted on Amherst Board of Health website transcript as soon as possible after the meeting. So, we have to take attendance. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Gilbert is absent. And one position is vacant. So our first item on the agenda is to review the minutes of the October 13 2022 meeting. Does anyone have any comments on the minutes? I would say I didn't see, I thought they were fine. Any other thoughts about that? No, is that not then maybe we can have a motion to accept the minutes of the meeting. Can't hear you Tim. Can't hear. There was some yellow highlight in that one. I don't know if that is in the old business B part. Someone is highlighted. I'm not sure if it is intended to any corrections or do you see that? I didn't see that. Thank you, Tim. I'll review that. I believe that was added by Nancy Gilbert. Okay. Those were, yeah, that's what I believe that is. Which section was it? I thought it was, I'm sorry. So it was under old business section B. Okay. There was a highlight key informant interviews. I don't know what the highlight is for. I don't either. Well, it reads good. Yeah, I think it's, I can make a motion to accept the minutes for October 13. And I'll second that. Lauren, can you hear us? Yes. Okay. Do you look to accept the minutes? Yes. Yes. And Tim. Yes. And Maureen, I will also. So the minutes are accepted. This next section is for public comment. On agenda topics only additional public comment at the end of the meeting for all public health topics. Do we have any? Do we have someone and I'm going to allow them to talk. It's, I see a phone number. And if you can state your name, where you live. And I believe it's three minutes to talk, Maureen. Is that right? Yes. All right. So if you can unmute yourself and please state your name. Then your address. Four, one, three. Two, one, eight. Hi there. Can you guys hear me? Yes. Hello. Thank you. So my name is Maria. What's your, what's your last name? Maria, Maria, what's your last name? I'm sorry. Maybe Lauren should mute. I think there's sounds coming. Pardon. My, my last name is Kofiki. Okay. Thank you. No problem. So I wanted to thank you for cleaning up the chemical regulation. And you further where the particularly timely and relevant in terms of addressing the issue of PFAS. And I want you to know that I support. The regulations that you've asked the draft. Indication that they should be avoided whenever possible. I'll comment again later at the, at the other public comment portion. But just to, to let you know that this is a very timely issue because the issue of artificial turf. Is has been raised in with respect to the track and field. At the high school. The project that they're looking at there. And I'm really glad that the board of health is taking a look at this. There was some indication. I think it was. In the town manager was saying that. That the board of health may not be taking this up. But my understanding is that you will be talking about. Artificial turf from a public health perspective. And I really applaud you for doing that. It's a, it's a very important issue. And I'll speak more to that again later. So thank you for doing this. Okay. Thank you. Is that our only comment at this time? Yeah, that's the only comment. Okay. So our next topic. We're a little ahead of schedule, but it's toxic. Chemical regulation with a slight. Draft update from Jennifer. Yeah. So I wanted to again, thank Tim and Lauren. For submitting this draft and the draft that you. Both submitted. Is up on the Amherst. Board of Health webpage. You can get that draft. What I did was I did review it. I thought some of the research was outside. I think you just, you know, I went into databases. You picked really good articles. I see that you looked at some other towns. I think that's really important. There might be some tweaking. But what I did was I sent this draft to Jeremiah. The plants. So now Gerald on my other plant. He's the head of facilities and maintenance is going to look at it. And we'll get it back for December. And we'll get it back. Ahead and give it back to the board members. So I wanted him to look at certain sections. So not the purpose or the definitions, but the regulation and that section three. He may have some ideas about. If you use the word toxic. When choosing consumer products or are we looking at green, silver requirements, green, silver. And he's going to look about, look at creating connecting. Throughout all the buildings, the same products. I've also asked him to look at section four. And section for a, and I know I said last month that, that for a, I'm very interested in to see what his input is. Who will be giving the variance to the plant. Does that come from the health department? Or does it come from another department that might have more expertise? So anyhow, still in draft form. Thank you everyone for your patience with me. I really appreciate all the work you've done. And we'll revisit this in December. Thank you. Can I add. One request, I think. Yes. Beyond the facilities. If it's, if it could be shared with the fire department. Yes. That'll be very helpful because many of the. Forms used in fire control. It's also something, you know, they have to look, you know, they can look for alternatives. Yeah. Thank you, Tim. I know you said that to me before. And I, I heard you and I always appreciate being told this. You know, a second time, I think starting with Jeremiah and then we'll really distribute it out and make sure everyone knows it exists and get other input. But yes, definitely the fire. Fire department. Just to clarify the variance procedure. Yeah, thanks. It can come back to the board. To decide on some of the variance. Based on what type of health effects. And consideration so that that is something it will come back. No, that's good to know. I appreciate that because when I look at this and, you know, everything will unfold, but you know, I look at these consumer products. So what are we using. Down in the clinic, you know, one chemical or this, but when it comes to larger, you know, you know, chemicals of big categories, not just a product. I think that's very good to know. Thank you. Well set. Yes, that's it. For old business then for moving to new business. There's. Tobacco violation. 96 North Pleasant street. Yeah. So I'm going to report that. I spoke to Susan Malone, who's our inspector. We have a business that was had their cigar smoking tobacco retailers license suspended for 30 days. So that's quite significant. It was through the department of revenue and the tax division. So what that means was that one of their products. Or many, or products, but I'll be not explained, did not have a tax stamp. So I actually called the manager and spoke with her and I said, can you just explain to me what happened? Is there anything. From our point of view that we can help you with, you know, so this doesn't happen again. It was really good to speak with her. She said it was one item. And granted, this one item had a several. Boxes, but it was, you know, it was one item of tobacco and it didn't have a state stamp. And she said, believe me, if we had known it, it should have had a stamp. We would have done it and gotten it up. So we wouldn't have had the suspension. They try to be very transparent. And she said that it can be challenging to be a retailer. So we had a good, good conversation. You know, she certainly doesn't want to see this happen again. And I'd like to be able to support people if they have any questions about tobacco products. Their suspension is November 3rd to December 3rd. And December 4th. They'll be good to go again. The state, not the state, but our Pioneer Valley Tobacco Coalition will be doing a reinspection on that. I was just going to check. So that's it. Did they have an inspection from the, from the Pioneer Valley? Yes. Yeah. So that's how it was found. They come into Amherst and do checks throughout all the, the retailers. And that's what they found. To say we've been pretty, we've had very few suspensions. And, and fines here in Amherst. It is something I want to continue to look at. Tobacco handler quiz was something that I was tasked with, I think about a year ago. And some things have changed since then. There's some great online forms that can be done. There is a checklist for retailers when they come to. Renew their. Their license. They have to do that. So it's a good trigger for them to see what they need to do. So, but I am going to revisit that. I think there's some other questions about tobacco. That I'd be interested in looking at. And that's, that's it for this violation. Okay. The next item. Is a WSPC white paper draft. And that's what I'm going to do. I'm going to revisit that. I think there's some other questions about tobacco. That I'd be interested in looking at. And that's, that's it for this violation. Okay. So the next item is a WSPC white paper draft. And at this point, we thank Tim for making some comments about that. We would like to hear from him if he. And explain them a little bit. The rest of us. All right. So I reviewed the document which was submitted from the water supply protection committee on large scale solar installations. In general, it's a well written and documented with a lot of background information. And what they recommend in terms of sound, they're very sound in terms of extending beyond what they are. So the, these types of installations are expected to do, which are controlled under the source water protection. Planning. The, in general, the direct health effects are not direct, but you know, direct or not innumerable, but primarily they are through the water quality, water quality impacts coming from construction. And any type of impacts due to extreme storm events, where there is intense storm events that might be concentration of pollutants, but said that the general recommendations done by WSPC is really appreciated because they have gone beyond what is expected in those types of installations. But one thing is the report also mentions couple of violations or at least some sediment erosion and sediment water quality impacts in two cases. And that's only because most of the time the inspection is done during the installation. And, and then during the lifespan of the project, we don't do much in terms of follow-ups. So that is something I made a recommendation that monitoring and reporting any issues throughout the lifespan, especially when there is any type of a high erosion formation or high intense runoff coming from the site. It is the operators have to report to the both the WSPC, which is the water supply planning, plan protection committee, as well as the Board of Health. And it's very important to know that, you know, and the other one was during the inspection stage and until vegetation establishment. Of course, it's a really important part for any type of inspections to make sure the installation and establishment of vegetation is important. But once the, that period of its establishment stops or at least, you know, its ending inspection is very infrequent. So what I was suggesting is to have long-term monitoring of the sites, especially when to avoid any implications or impacts like the two cases we saw in, in, in the last two sets. And I think that will, that, that is a really important one, especially when the, when the, that particular manager of that particular site observes certain impacts, especially heavy amount of runoff going on or any type of a soil erosion coming off the site and or any type of a impacts they could visibly see, it becomes important that they should notify the, the water supply protection committee as well as the Board of Health. The second one I was making a recommendation that could be added is the runoff best management practices. I called it as BMPs in the, in the recommendations should be a part of any solar by-law which is, which is being developed. So these best management practices can be establishing some sort of a buffer strips or, or some rain gardens or pollinator gardens, all becoming a part of the site installation because those are the ones which will actually can mitigate heavy runoff that can come up. So there is one comment I want to add which is more technical, but it might be a simple misinterpretation I would say. So when a forest is cleared to install, many times we see change in water yield, water yield is some sort of a runoff coming out of the site. But I think the report mentioned something about increasing groundwater recharge. I think they're primarily talking about water yield, I think. So, so that's the only thing is, essentially it won't, by converting from forest to a solar site, you know, it essentially will not increase infiltration. Essentially will runoff will increase. So that's the only comment, very technical comment I want to add to that. So that's, that's my recommendations from the Board of Health. Point of view. Tim, thank you so much. You know, I read this draft of the white paper by the WSPC. I looked it up online at the conservation commission. And I learned so much from it. It's not my expertise. I've never read anything about this, you know, too much in depth, but I learned so much from this paper. It's so well organized that, you know, talked about those two other Massachusetts sites, where the developers were fined. And then just how this really differs from other building construction because of the land involved. And sometimes it mostly is, they try to do it on sloped land for the solar gain. So anyhow, I recommend it to people if they're interested, they can learn a lot. How does the solar installation compare to say a paving, you know, because I some someone somewhere mentioned that it's not the same impermeable areas. And it seems to me that this isn't the same as an impermeable areas, but it's maybe a place where water gets dumped into a row or something in front of the slant of the solar panels, which is really not a very natural way to get rain to flow. So I just wonder how those things compare. That's a good question. I was the one who added in my comments to add runoff BMPs. And one of them is the, since the panels do not infiltrate, they're just essentially washing off and concentrating your flows. It can actually increase the velocity because of the runoff. But one thing is there is a difference between regular impervious cover like rooftops, parking lots, sidewalks, everything compared to those which are actually not connected to the storm water lines. So it's called as a effective impervious cover. So there's some sort of a difference between impervious cover themselves like rooftops, which are connected to a gutter can contribute to the storm water flows. But those which are not connected to the gutter, they're just dropping into a lawn area. They have the chance to infiltrate. They don't have the same amount of impact like influencing the storm water flow. So our solar installations have like a series. It's like a, we could say these are all impervious mosaic, which are actually concentrating, but they're actually dropping into a lawn area or the vegetated area down, allows some sort of infiltration. And so that is where I think the water has to be captured, allowed more infiltration. Instead of, you know, if the water is not allowed to stay there for a little time, which doesn't allow any time for infiltrate, that could be a problem. That means it would be starting to wash off and create soil erosion and everything. So that's the idea behind urban best management practices. Also a part of the solar bylaw. Thank you. You know, also, I don't know if this is the same thing, but like if you go to page eight of the, the, the draft, there's something about what you were talking about. And there's, there's drips. There's the sunny drip edge and then there's the shady drip edge and it just how that impacts the, it being permeable into the shaded area of the grass. But anyhow, I don't know if that's accurate, but it's, there's so much in that paper. Yeah, drip areas can be there, but I think the practices should be not just having those vegetated maintained, vegetation maintained below the panels, whether it's shaded or non-shaded. But when it's starting to collect downstream, there'll be large volume of water. And that's where I think that should be retention basins or detention basins or even small rain gardens. If we can, we do that in any type of development. If any type of a new developers come in, I think that's one of the part of the plan. They have to actually handle the storm water. And that is, that's what has to be replicated in, in these types of large installations. Gotcha. I saw photographs of what happened, what went wrong in Williamsburg. I think that's what I saw. It's so dramatic. Any other comments about that report? Okay. So we'll move along to the director's update. So to give the COVID update, I'm going to sound pretty similar to what I've been talking about the past few months. The Amherst Health Department continues to collect data every day, Monday through Friday and posting it. We were going to go to weekly, but we collect it daily anyway. And we have a few residents that have been asking that we continue if we can with the daily raw counts. I think they're making some good graphs, but we know that our numbers aren't, aren't capturing the real burden of, of COVID because of PCR testing down and people not reporting antigen tests and asymptomatic and not reporting. We do continue to look at the incidence rate. I've always been a fan of the 14-day incidence rate that looks at the number of new cases per 100,000. And we are low. We're 6.7. And even two weeks ago, we're 10.4. If you look at our numbers against our wastewater, and I always want to say thank you for the Department of Public Works who collects that three times a week, sends it off to Jamaica Plain and Biobot analyzes it. We get the reports. Sometimes it's delayed, but we get them and we post them online. We post them outside our door. And it's really wonderful to look at the trend. And it truly is low. It's the effluent of three different areas of Amherst. So it's all combined north, central and south, but it combines all the universities and colleges. So it looks at Amherst as a whole. When I think about giving guidance, I think we should start talking about how we give guidance for COVID and also RSV and flu. So RSV is respiratory syncytial virus. Seeing these real, what they're calling unprecedented spikes. The Boston Globe is reporting mass generals ICU, for example, is above 150% above capacity for RSV. I hope all of your children are nice and healthy. And I think it is going around the schools. We also want to look at flu. So influenza, the Department of Public Health starts recording that on week 40. So that was October. If you go to Massachusetts, DPH influenza weekly reports, you can see that they now have an interactive flu dashboard. So they've really done some, some upgrading to that. You can see where we are. We don't have it in front of me. But the first two weeks, we started higher than we were in the last five years. So flu influenza like illnesses, ILCs are up. So I don't, you know, just everyone has to think of all these things. So COVID precautions, and now the flu and RSV. So I think what I've been saying is just going to hold true what we read in the New York Times, what we read in our research papers about protecting the vulnerable. I think that needs to be a key thing and thinking about breaking the chain of transmission. I love those two sayings now. So things that we can consider is having a plan, finding out ahead of time about events and precautions, figure out who's going to be the highest risk person at the event and bring the guidance up to that level. For example, Thanksgiving's coming up. Other holidays are coming up. Can you really have everyone at a tight table or can you spread people out? Can you have really good ventilation? And also importantly, we have a lot of antigen tests we want to give out to you. They're here. You can call us, but have everyone do sequential testing, test two days out and test the day of, if you're negative, pretty much you can assume that you're not transmitting the disease. The other thing is have a backup plan. Make sure that, you know, if you feel like you're going into a situation that is more risk, use a different mask, maybe you even exit and come back another time. The other thing is have a good provider. If you don't have a healthcare provider, if you don't have health insurance, please call the health department here. We can help you get set up with that. Not us, but we can refer you to people. I know when I call my provider, it's hard to get them, but I've gotten really good at the portal. And if you use the portal, they get back to you within hours. So that sort of transitions into a new research paper that's been out since the fifth. I don't know if it's a pre-printer or not, but it's one of the first studies that say Pax Lovett may be helping reduce the risk of long-term COVID. So I think that's something for us all to think about is Pax Lovett. Take it if you qualify. It reduces, minimizes your severity of illness, but it can help him along COVID. Some of the things that I hear in the COVID clinics that we are giving is that they are still, people are getting vaccinated. We're at 90% for fully vaccinated here in Amherst. I'm so happy about that. But some people are still thinking that getting the vaccine prevents you from catching the disease. So just a reminder that the vaccine reduces severity. It keeps you from more, you know, reducing mortality risk from death, but it doesn't necessarily prevent you from catching the vaccine. So that's going to be part of the transmissibility of the, the different variants we have, but also it's more behavior. So, so think about what you can do to prevent that. Right till the right time where your mask, like a regular procedure mask when you think you might need it, a KN95 for more dense situations, more crowded, poor ventilated rooms. Ventilations, like I said, are key. Now to say with the RSV and flu, wash your hands, continue to wash your hands, use time and friction, don't touch your face. I think people have gotten pretty good about not touching their face. And stay home when you're sick and then get boosted this fall. So right now we're doing bivalent booster clinics every Thursday, 12 to two. But I have sort of news that I'm very excited about that we're going to be having a large COVID vaccine clinic December 5th. That's a Monday from two to six here in the Amherst banks community center. And the state is coming in to help us. And we're going to be offering vaccines from six months old and older. So everybody we're going to have the Pfizer first and second doses bivalent. We're going to have Moderna and we're going to have J&J. And because the state is sponsoring this, a $75 gift card for everybody that gets vaccinated. So I know I'm so happy about this. So I asked them what the gift card was for. They said at one point it was for grocery store, but they're not quite sure what people will, the company will show up with. But it's not retroactive. Unfortunately, it's just for people that are getting vaccinated at this clinic. Right now, if you wanted to sign up for this clinic, you can go to the Amherst health department. And up on the webpage, Lillian has put a big COVID clinic thumbnail. If you click on it, you can sign up right now. But then this coming Monday, we're going to start with a lot of social media and just go to apartment complexes, the schools and just let everybody know about this. How many appointments will there be for this day? Do you think? 600. They have to keep it under 600. So when we get number. Yeah. Yeah. So I'm so happy about this. It's the time just to, to come in, get your bivalent booster two months after your last shot. Even it was a regular booster. And get that immunity going before the holidays. So you still need two weeks for that to start. Okay. Can you explain what the bivalent is that a combination? Yeah. Yeah. Thanks, Lauren. You know, there's so many different names and terminology. So this is the new booster. So thank you for clarifying that. It covers the Omicron B a 0.5 and B a 0.4. So, and some of the ancestral strains. So the original strain. So when you get this shot, it has broader protection. The antigen more, you know, diverse antigens and more greater antibodies, the breadth of that. So it has the Omicron strain. Thank you. That's the COVID update. And I would just put in a plug that don't forget your flu shots. Those are important too. Those we don't have. I don't think at the health department or no, I don't know. Yeah. Thank you. Your pharmacies and other. I guess those are the main sources of your primary care doctors offices are the place to go because it's a good match for this particular flu outbreak. And this flu outbreak started earlier and it's, it's going faster. You know, they're just more, more cases at this point in the year than it's quite unusual. So this is definitely the time if you haven't gotten your back flu vaccine to get out there and get it. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you so much. You know, I have to say, I think it's a good thing that we're doing this. Yeah. I think we're doing this. Emerson health department. We get flu vaccine from the state. And the vaccine because we're a local board of health. We're able to give it to uninsured people only. So we've been doing some flu vaccines. Clinics. We're at Craig stores. Tuesday night. Olivia Lara. The new public health nurse. But I think we're. Oh. Yeah. I think next year we're going to get back into the flu. Business, but that, that means we'll have to purchase flu. And then we may have to charge and we can do that. And it's not a charge to the person be the insurance company, but that way maybe we can have a revolving fund. But I just think now is the time to start thinking about how we can, maybe the health department can up our game with that. Thank you. Okay. Thank you. And then I can go into the health department updates. Is that okay? I have a part two. Of directors update. Sure. Okay. Thanks. We are continuing our childhood immunization clinics. We're very happy about that. We've been doing a few families that have been coming in. I'm giving them polio. Do you have any medical information regarding the health department? Yeah. We have a lot of information about that. Yeah. Tdap or Dtap. Um, we have the childhood immunizations. Um, and I've always say this that it's one part vaccine and nine nine parts education or support. Um, so our health department right now, I can look down on the new Sunday health center. So we'll give a shot. Then we give them a packet and we say, you know, Deanna Solers down there. And then the other last thing I have is for folks to know that there is a new amended housing code coming out. It's going to go into effect April, 2023. Our health inspectors restaurant and building are going to training. I'm actually going to do some of the training myself. So I think that's a big, big deal. I don't know when the last time they were updated, but I'll let you know as we get closer if there's anything that impacts us. It's 105 CMR 410. One thing I know that it is going to affect is they're revising the heating season. It used to be September 15 through May 31 and this is something that used to come up in the Clark House. So now it's going to be. It used to be September to June, excuse me. And now it's going to be September 15 through May. But it also is this aligns more with like I think the weather patterns, but also the Board of Health can also make some amendments. There's some other things that are going on with the housing code, but I'll keep you updated as that happens. And that's, that's what I have. Thank you. Thank you. So now do we go to public comment. So, are there additional, is there additional public comment. I see no hands up. Oh, there's a hand. Okay. So I see Maria Kapiki, if I'm saying it correct. If you can say your name again and thank you. Unmute yourself. Yeah. Again, so just a quick introduction. I'm a retired OBGYN and, and also more recently I worked as a case investigator and an outbreak specialist with COVID and so I really appreciate you guys staying on top of things. Thank you for that. I wanted to speak tonight about my concerns about artificial turf. There is a proposal to use artificial turf at the high school track and field the field part. And this was voted on earlier this year. And PFAS has been in artificial turf is a known thing now. It hasn't gotten a lot of press and maybe locally but but it regionally it has in fact Boston has recently made the papers and talking about not allowing any artificial turf in any field that they're going to be installing because of PFAS. And when this was voted on initially by the school committee, there literally was not any discussion PFAS was not mentioned at all. I'm not referring any of the school committee meetings nor the CPAC meeting. One funding was obtained, but it was recently brought to the attention of the school committee and brought to the attention of town council who was asked to summarize some funding and several town counselors asked that the Board of Health dig into this and, and make recommendations. So my concern is about PFAS this is avoidable and natural turf field the grass field can be used and would have all the problems that would prevent that would help with all of the problems of the current field and poor drainage and it either way would need to be maintained. Artificial turf you probably or you may be aware of some other concerns aside from PFAS depending on what kind of material is used it can have organic carbons in there and lead and and and the PFAS is in the blades and the backing and even though some firms that talk about using it and including the one that the school committee has used Western and Samson may say that there's no PFAS in the product there is and and that got to be an issue in Portsmouth, New Hampshire. There's a lot of evidence on this. Other concerns are the heat injuries and the orthopedic and skin injuries that you see an artificial turf that you do not see in a natural grass field so we have an alternative so when feasible to avoid PFAS this is one of those times when it is feasible and to get still get those benefits to to the people who are going to be using the field and by the way I'm also a big sports enthusiast both myself and for for my kids so I am absolutely in full full fledged support for improving the field, but not with artificial turf. So I hope that you will take this up. The town council is got this on their agenda for the 21st but it that can be delayed again and I really do think that the public health and environmental issues need to be addressed for personal safety, but also for water bodies and environmental concerns so all important public health concerns. Thank you very much I hope I didn't go over three minutes. You're good. Thank you. Other commenters. That was the one person. Okay. So now we move to topics not anticipated by the chair 48 hours prior to the meeting and one of those. The next issue is actually this concern about the artificial turf and whether it and asking that the Board of Health actually weigh in on on that question because of concerns about PFAS. This is a complex issue. It's a difficult time to be making decisions about it and from what I can read there is there are concerns that have been reported in different communities. But there's not a great deal of of wide broad scale research on that from my reading again I am not a two week expert on these artificial turf fields I've been looking at the some of the literature and the reports from the. EPA CDC study that's in process. But most of those studies actually didn't focus on PFAS it is more about the issue of the, not the blades of grass the fake blades of grass or what have the PFAS and the and the. Whatever holds them together, but there's a crumb rubber that expels in and and helps the blades of grass to stand up and to soften the field from rubber is basically ground up. And so there's been off a long term concerns about about the contact without that either from the air or skin contact or ingestion, and it hasn't really been clear what's going on with that and there's a big study that that was started, like around 2017. They kind of defined some of those chemicals but haven't that didn't proceed with the, with the exposure because of the pandemic kind of slowed down a lot of things with with that study. Again, it hasn't really hasn't. There's nothing on that scale, even in process about PFAS so it's a difficult time to be making a long term decision. Anyway, we just heard about this. Again, I think yesterday is it coming requested for the board. Our chair woman is in Ecuador, and we would like a chance to take this seriously and perhaps discuss this at our next meeting. So, that's our hope that we can postpone. And some of those decisions until just a little bit later this year. Yes, I have a few thoughts. It's difficult trying to keep track of all the things that are going on in the town. From my big recollection. The town council, I believe voted on going forward with the turf. And I'm not remembering if it was, which cost less was it the natural field or bringing in the turf but I know the cost was the issue. And then also recently a counselor that sent a, a article about the concern of injuries of the high risk of injuries. So, I, again, for me as a board member for for the Board of Health. I first, you know, want to understand what the council is doing, and I don't quite know what the Board of Health, yay or nay, how they would influence or impact the decision of the council because of my recollection I feel like they've already got the need on the turf and now there's still more information coming in. So I'm not sure if they're going to vote again. But those are some things that I just. I'm not clear on that either. I asked Jennifer and she hadn't had a direct request from the town council for the Board of Health to consider this question. But it has come up from community members that the Board of Health considered this question. If I can just say I have spoken to Paul Bachman about it, but you're, you're correct. Yeah, but Paul and I have been talking, okay, keeping up to date. And I think, you know, I remember reading about the field and there were three options and one of them did have a natural grass field, and then the more expensive one had the turf field. There were concerns about PFAS and leaching into water and maybe some direct exposure to people, but more probably leaching out and the other thing is these turf fields if I looked it up don't last that long they last eight to 10 years and then they have to be, you know, maybe a little longer than that, but then they have to be up, we place so then what do you, you know, so there's this can't be recycled, you know, so it has to be disposed of in some way. So there's a lot of concerns at every kind of different steps along the way about about these turf fields that are getting more attention now in the last couple of years. I think Maria had said that Boston has as put a ban on any future artificial turf fields. I don't I don't I mean I, you know, I think we're here to talk about the health effects and what's safer and the council figures out and the school figure out the what's more expensive but I. I don't know that that information. I think there's upkeep that's significant for both types of feel that I mean my first impression was these turf fields you just put them there and forget it but they also require upkeep annual you know, so it's not exactly. You know, you said it and forget it kind of kind of system. So, again, this came up to us just just yesterday and I think we need more time to think about it and get more information. Thanks, Lauren. I have a suggestion. Because I feel that we run into a lot of times like trying to visualize these complex issue. You know, it does matter when you have the right information and where are you getting the, you know, your information from and are you able to go out and actually see, you know, in real life like what is what is happening. To collect information as well so would it be possible to have a member, you know, contact, you know, either. I don't know how it works but is there like a contact counselor that, you know, has already gotten some information or research this that can like help inform us as to how we would, you know, lead a discussion or, you know, try to, you know, put information in there is like how, how, how are we connecting to the, the researchers that have already researched this and that the town leaders that have already, you know, put forward their, their interests or, you know, how they feel. Yeah, I think, Lauren, I think you have some good ideas. A lot of research has been done already so it's like what information do, where do we get it, how do we gather in sort of, you know, take a look at it all so, you know, I think there's things that we can do, you know, I still have access to UMass and the good databases, you know, PubMed and all which is the nursing, allied health and, and Cochrane they do the meta analysis so that's one area and then looking at what have other towns done and the expert information they've brought in. Do we get experts on both sides what's the industry saying so I think it's a process of figuring out how to gather all that and not recreate the wheel. And I would just say, you know, when this, when we get to the point of researching it, exactly what are we researching. So what is the field that's been proposed and I don't know. So there's different types of organic infills, for example, I don't, you know, what, how do they compare there's coconut silk there's walnut there's quark. That may not in itself be enough but I think it'd be be important for us to know exactly what the thought was that they were planning on installing. I think in terms of research. There's no ambiguity in that. And in the sense in the past decades we have so much studies on artificial travel friend. There are really good review papers on that you know which which covers groundwater infiltration and volatile organic compounds that essentially those when they when they emit you know these volatile compounds you know these are rubber compounds you know and so in terms of research it's there but thing is, you know, I'm hoping the town council as well as the you know the town manager and in the school committee itself can direct some sort of a advice from us. And because I think this if you're installing on on schools. What are we exposing our children to you know, and I think these rubber compounds in terms of over the lifetime. They can have some sort of a slow cumulative effect, you know in terms of concentrations of it might be very low PFAS or it might be low in terms of rubber compound during installation but over the lifespan I think it could have some sort of a impacting water supplies anything. So, I think it'll be even though the budget has been approved and whatever it is it will be of interest I think the school committee probably should look into the environmental impacts. I think if they decide on that and the town council decided and and seek our advice I think that's when I think we could brainstorm on this one and discuss and during the as a board. So I guess for now, you know, I guess the plan might be for Jennifer and then maybe Nancy to kind of explore what's known and maybe find a way to get some expert opinion or about about this. And we come at this again in our next meeting. But I think it is an important issue because it is a long term, like Tim was saying their long term effects and I, my understanding is it, you know you can't. It's really easy to go backwards from a turf field because once you have that, you know to try to go back and grow a grass field, I think it's really from what I read is really not, not an easy thing to do. So, it seems like a commitment to something that that might not be the best for the long run, but I don't really know the answer to that. I think it's important to, you know, even though things people want things to progress quickly it's time to, it's the moment to really look at what we're doing. And I also support the athletic fields and upgrading them and I think it's really important that we have fields that work. From my kids in sports I know that has field has been a problem for a long time my kids are pretty old by this time. So in terms of environmental impacts, I think we only focused on infiltrating groundwater impacts and everything. But I'm sure they talked about other probably turf gas artificial turf gas has other benefits in terms of less mowing that means less amount of emissions. And, you know, and those types of you know, other alternatives in terms of water use, you know, less water consumption that means you don't know. So it is has to be discussed in the light of what is more long term in terms of sustainability, which can achieve what we wanted in terms of sports facilities but also overall how we could balance all those economic and societal needs so I know they're like Tim, you know I found a lot of studies about this whole issue of of exposure and there's the it seems like it's not very much but they really haven't been able to, they're pretty small studies about the actual real exposure issue to for health health outcomes. And it's a really hard thing to study because all these fields are a little different and exploring it's hard to quantify exposure. And so the European environmental protection agency did did make some tighter regulations on what can be in the crumb rubber that's in that infill. They said they're kind of waiting for these big studies that are supposed to be happening in the United States to kind of fine tune some of those things are getting more information so that it feels like there's some information but it's not very conclusive and right now it seems like that isn't a big problem. But there is this question about, do we really know that it isn't a big problem. And, and PFAS is in from the concerns about the grassy parts that hasn't really been part of these major studies, I don't think. So, you know, be something and I guess that's used in the manufacture of those little skinny green pieces of plastic and otherwise they don't extrude from the extruder. So it's, it's really kind of built into the process. It seems, you know, so I'd be love to be educated more about these, these issues. My only question though is, have they already decided on the turf. And are, are they walking back and are they trying to gather more information because I'm still like, not sure where the town is on this decision or the town council is. And so I would just like to, when we have the conversation, just kind of know where they are in their decision making. And I kind of lost track but I think that would be important as to what, what is being asked of us, have they already decided on turf. Have they got. Well, that'll be part of what we need to find out. So I can do that for next month. You know, when I spoke to Paul, then I had reached out to Nancy Gilbert and we knew it couldn't go on to today's agenda, but it was figuring out when it would be next. So, so if I hear you, you saying that you would like it on December 8 agenda. Well, we can check in with you. I'm sorry. Oh, I'm sorry. Okay, yes, we'll wait. I think we can. Yeah, I think we can see where we can do some footwork legwork on this and checking with Nancy and see what the, what the plan will be. I don't thank you make a decision in. I'm sorry that you're very. Yes, you're very clear Maureen I'm sorry I said that well we'll check. Yeah. Yeah. All right. And I'm not aware of anything else that's come up. So do we want to have a motion to adjourn the meeting. I can make a motion to adjourn. And I can second that. Okay, I know you. And we need to vote. Yeah. Tim. Hi. Maureen. Yes. So our meeting is adjourned. Thank you, everybody. Thank you, everyone. Good night. Good night. Yes, you did Maureen. I made it through.