 na wa awajib nga waomu na waata. Kwa kwa muniniael doqewa. Mwajib na maaimisha ya kwa. Taoja sai na nanii wajiba kwa kuwa mwajib na mwajiba. buti niwa zao. Kwa yawa... Kwa ki wa na kwa... na kwa kwa yawia niwa unha. So na kwa na, kwa kwa wajib na... kwa kwa mwaja waghya kwa nansина kwa nyae pa. kwa kwa kelub estdakawe and had about 6 work subgroups for the job seekers. So some job seekers could call me and asked me that, J, we need someone to do a CVS. So I used to refer them to another lady who used to do the CVS. But back in my mind, I was not happy with the work she was doing. So because formally I had done HR as a course and had never practiced. So this was the only opportunity I had to practice. So I decided that why not venture into this, why not do the CVs. So I did a poster, my first poster in December 2018 and I shared in the groups. So in the first week I had no knowledge. Something funny is that I had no knowledge on how to use a computer or laptop. I had never done that at school. So when I had this opportunity I used to do it with my phone. Then I could transfer the data to a laptop, go to the cyber and have someone at the cyber guide me on how to maybe match the lines and format the content of the CV. So through that in the first month and second month I was just learning on how to do it, on how to use the laptop. So that's how JCVs came about. And also something to notice that after I lost my job I really wanted something to do with HR. I applied for internships, I got rejected. One of my current mentors employed me for two weeks. She fired me. So it's all thanks to everyone who rejected me that it brought up JCVs. I would like to find out your mental state or space when you decided to just move on. Considering your story there is a level of rejection that would happen. And most people, young people especially, we go to numerous interviews after interviews just trying to bag a job opportunity but it doesn't come our way and then depression kicks in. So what was your mental state? What happened for you to make that sheet and decide I am going to create a job for me? Now after I lost my job the first thing I did was I contacted my former HR. I told her that I would like just to volunteer for free. Then after I told her that I gave her that information I would pick my calls again. So the second there was an advert for an intern. They needed fresh graduates. But by then I had 11 years working experience. So I went for the interview, I got invited for the interview. I told them I would volunteer, I was willing to volunteer. And you have 11 years working experience. So the company also rejected me. They told me that how will you survive. I told them I am okay even though I had no any source of income. I had no any way of getting to work. And it was within Wilson Airport. So I would spend around 400 per day to and fro from work. So after that rejection I felt the pity that the job seekers feel when they are looking for jobs. So I was in a position now to influence something. I was in a position now to do something for the job seekers. I had the responsibility because most of the job seekers would call me. The people I don't know. And I would link them to jobs with HR managers that I didn't know also. So I got that trust from the HR people and also trust from the job seekers. So I saw that if I could get into a full time employment I would not serve them well. So I wanted to give back to the community. So the rejection led me to having enough time to do what I wanted to do. Now giving back to the community. So that's how I started this company and also that's how I really wanted now. I had now the opportunity now to do it full time. Okay. Fantastic. What I've picked from what you've said is that especially when you mentioned that you had a decade experience in your line of job that you're offering to actually volunteer and people were saying no. Let's look at the aspect of desperation and from what you've learnt. I don't know if you can label it as such. From the context of anyone can be qualified particular position. But would you feel like desperation can also be a state of rejection on arrival? For me the point I was in that was desperation. To be honest that was desperation because now I was working in a totally different line and had worked for 11 years now by then and having done HR at school had never practiced. So now the only way I could now get into the market was through HR and getting to the market through HR it's so competitive. There are so many HR out here, so many HR personnel without jobs out here. So the only way I could do that is was to gain experience first then get into the market and by gaining experience I needed just to volunteer first. Volunteer now for like 3 months then get into the market. So desperation was the reason I was doing this. I had no otherwise because I think what we do most nowadays that most people have done different courses but they are in totally different fields. When you finish when you are in a totally different field for 3 years your career goes you move out of your career totally and getting back to your career will be so difficult. That is what is happening nowadays. I have seen people who have done finance they are doing customer service. I have seen people who have done HR they are doing sales. When you do 3 years that means that your salary might be higher. You might even be earning 60,000, you might even be earning 100,000. So when you want to go back to your career you will have to start from zero. So no one will want to come from 100 to 30,000 or 100 to 20,000. And is it possible? For instance if I did law and they found myself into probably sales and marketing and I feel like in my journey right now I want to go back to practicing law. So how do you go about that? You have to be humble enough to start from the lowest point. So now that is what we call passion. For me it was passion now. I had now to live money for passion. So even when I was starting JCVs to be honest I didn't know if I would survive in Nairobi. And per month I could roughly get less than 10,000. And my salary the other side was around over 20,000. So the difference I could not even manage paying bills. So at this point when you are in a different field like for me I was there for 10 years. Coming back to HR I had to start with internship. So that was the only way out. Either start with internship or go into self employment. So I opted for the second because I was rejected in the first. We speak about now you have decided to get into self employment. Who are your first clients and what made you feel like actually this can be a business after all? I had several people calling me. My first, when I did my first group I was working with them. My employer was Naivas. I used to work with Naivas. So I created the first group. I remember it was in April 2016. Just out of nowhere I didn't know the role of this group. I just created my first group. So I used to post jobs there. So the first group was filled and there were more people wanting to come on board. So I decided that we can do a telegram group. But telegram people were relaxed and they told me we don't like telegram just do a second was up group. So I did the second was up group. So by the time I was starting the business I had six was up groups. Which you can only be in one group. So six was up groups those are around 3000 people. And that's just your clients? Ya. So I could post jobs. I was also in HR groups. So I could see a HR post a job. He or she is looking for someone in this field for an accountant. I called the HR. I tell them that I have someone who is fit for this job. So I post in the groups my was up groups. Then I am looking for an accountant with these and these qualifications. So someone will reach out. So I link him to the HR. So people could get jobs through that. So some now could call me and tell me that J. I really need someone to work on my CV. So I used to send them to another lady. The lady could just she had one template. So all CVs had a similar template. So I felt that she was not doing a good job. You know when the CVs have a similar template and they are in the same group. They will automatically apply for the same position. If it's an accountant and an account's assistant position. They will apply for an account's assistant position. So the account's assistant position. The recruiter will see that the content is similar. So he might not consider them. So that is what pushed me now to start doing CVs. So when I did a post and posted in the groups I had the first week I got three clients. By then I was charging five hundred. I got three clients. The second week it grew. So after the second week I went for another. By then I used to go for every HR forum that was announced. Whether it had an entry fee or not I could go for the forum. So I really wanted, I was now passionate. I really wanted to get into HR. Now you had, it was all hands in now into the business. So about CVs. Is it better to position yourself as a generalist? You don't do a specialization on your CV or do you go generic? What would be your advice when it comes to resumé creation? No. One thing about resumé and CV is that they are the same thing. It just resumé is used in French and then CV. And resumé might be shorter than the CV. So one thing about the CV is that depending on your career. If you are an accountant, if you are a journalist, if you are a reporter. If that is your field, that is what you want to venture into. Have your CV customized to fit that role. If you are an accountant you are working as a sales personnel. Or if you are an accountant you are working as a customer service personnel. And you want to go back into accounting. Have it customized. You can fit the two roles. Have it customized to the job description. But still you can have your CV fit two or three more roles. Okay. How? Now that's where JCVs comes in. Okay. So let's say you are doing accounts and you are working in administrative department. Okay. So in most companies, what from my experience is that most companies, that means personnel will handle some of the accounting roles. Things to do with managing the petty cash. Things to do with handling the debtors. Things to do with maybe handling the assets. So those are some of the roles that you will find in accounting JD. Account assistant JD. So if you have those roles in your CV because you can handle them. So if you have those roles in your CV because account assistant is basically the lowest rank in accounts. Because accounts like most companies don't have accounts like they do. They start with account assistant. So it's the lowest rank you can start with. So have those basics because they handle basic functions. The basic functions. If you don't have basic functions, you can handle them. Or someone with the internship experience will handle them. So have them in your CV and have the admin roles in your CV. So when you are applying for a job, customize your CV to fit that position. Because I've seen there are roles that are inter-merged and there are roles that are merged. There are roles that are merged like accounts and admin in one role. So companies are doing that to save on costs. So you find that they are looking for an account and admin assistant. Or a finance and admin assistant. They are merging those roles into one. So when they are merging those roles, it means that you'll be doing the admin work and the accounting work. So most of the work that you are doing will be admin work but now a little of accounting work. So your CV should match the two roles. So when you have the two positions in your CV, it's advantageous because your scope in applying for jobs will be bigger. Okay. So Jay, we have most of us out here. We have a perception about HR in any organization. Energy is in different lanes. We are all humans and human behavior dictates that there is a possibility that I can discriminate you in regards to where you come from, probably your background in the culture that you come from. So let's look at what exactly should I put on my resume and what should I actually leave out. You talked about HR. I think HR are the most important people in any organization. Very true. And I think no organization can thrive without us. And another thing is that on few occasions do we discriminate. What I will learn people to understand is that most companies do not have HRs. And for smaller companies the same is you will find that the director or the managing director or the CEO is the one doing the interviews. So they are companies that where the HR are just act as clerks. So they are given the decision on what someone decides for them on what to do. So what you need to have in your CV is basically your name, telephone number, the email address, then work experience. Basically Paleju is our details. There are details that you are taught in school, things to do with marital status. Is marital status important? No, not important. Age not important because there are positions that will discriminate you based on the age and there are positions that will discriminate you based on marital status. It will not be a decision of the HR. It might be due to the working conditions of that position or the working hours. And religion? Someone should not be discriminated based on religion unless the workplaces are charged where they will need someone who is a Christian. Or if the workplaces if you are working for a mosque definitely they will need a Muslim. But most companies will not discriminate you based on the religion also. So things to do with sex, marital status, age which will should not be in your CV. You have to unless asked for. But I've seen for when I'm doing CVs for Middle East countries or basically abroad we add the nationality then the age because they are so keen on the age because for them you might sign a long term contract maybe for 3 or 4 years. So they are so keen on the age. We will have your age and nationality then a picture of yourself. Oh, I was about to ask that. So a picture is allowed? A picture is allowed outside the country. Or maybe if you are a journalist we can have a journalist and people in the hospitality industry. But for an accountant why should we have your picture? Sure that this is our idea. No, for an accountant we don't need your picture. For HR we don't need your picture, we just need your skills now. Alright, so what's the worst may mistake ever that one can actually put down? The biggest mistake people do is that they don't understand their resume. Someone is in an interview you tell them to take you through the resume they cannot do that. They even forget the period they worked in certain companies. So that is a very simple way of getting yourself eliminated from the other candidates. It's an easy way to help us eliminate yourself. Okay, so I think we have tackled most of these parts when it comes to resume writing and what is allowed and not. Unless something else you can add on. For resume still what I would like to advise because most of the job seekers now are youths. And recently graduated or maybe graduated from 2018 on once. They have a problem with when they are doing their references they have a problem, a big problem. The problem is that most will write their lecturers as their references. Someone maybe they never interacted with. So the lecturer even doesn't know about them. He or she has interacted with so many students. And maybe there has been no direct interaction. If you are a class rep the lecturer will easily not know you. But if you are a silent follower in the class and maybe you miss classes the lecturer can't identify you. So how can we cap that challenge? So basically how you can cap that challenge when you are a fresh graduate from school. You can have your class rep represent you or a school leader or student leader. Because most student leaders will know all students. So you can have someone at least if you don't have any experience if you have the attachment experience. If you have the attachment experience make sure that attachment experience when during your attachment you have your supervisor as your referee. But if you don't have any experience have your school leader. You can have even maybe if you have your high school teacher. Someone who can remember you well and someone who can watch for you. We don't want this then is where they call this person and they are like. Who is that? We've seen also incidents whereby they call a ref and they give a negative feedback about a candidate. Do you feel like we should also be calling our reference? They want to know who we claim to be a reference. Yes sure. Even have your friend called them. Tell them Jay applied for position in our organization and you are one of the references. Do you have anything you can talk about him? Then they are you listening so that you know your reference might be the reason you're not getting anything. I've seen people tell me that. I've seen people tell me that I've been going for interviews but I don't get this opportunity. So I always tell them your CV is not a problem. If you're going for interviews definitely your CV is not a problem. So your problem might be the interview skills that you don't have. Either the interview skills or your references. Okay. Speaking of interview skills. When asked questions I know interviewers ask different questions and we are always having butterflies when we get into this particular room just for the interview. When we ask a question should we respond with giving a storyline or examples of what you have done? Or should we give diplomatic answers which are just general and just keep quiet just to be safe. May be an example of a question. Let's see. So for this particular position that you are playing what are you bringing to the table? Bring to the table. So one thing your seekers will understand is that an interview is just any other conversation. The only thing that can happen is that they can deny the job. That's the worst that can happen. But they can't take anything away from you. I've seen job seekers who feel stressed. They call me after an interview and they are like it was not a must that you get this thing. What I believe is that it's always a learning experience. An interview is always a learning experience. You can't go for five interviews and still fail the six interview. So this interview when you go for interviews they repeat the same questions. May be a different style but they repeat the same questions. So when you asked about what you bring on the table. It means that you should have done enough research about the company. Correct. It goes back to you researching the company. So let's say a company like maybe equity. Equity bank. Equity bank has been having issues maybe. Or you've been reading about their profit and loss. The profit they've made within a certain year. Talk about maybe you're working for a different bank. And now you're coming to equity bank. You can also talk about your achievements in the other bank. That you can do. You can bring on board in this other organization. You can say like when I was working for JCVs. I implemented a new system that reduced the time frame. For working on CVs. A system to help automatically working on CVs. So that it doesn't take normal three days. But now it takes one day. So when you're coming on board. You are able to bring that knowledge and skills with you. So you bring these skills. Tell them the skill you are bringing on board. And how it will help the organization. In that particular position. I have a question that this one actually makes people go round and round. It is about yourself. It can sound like a really simple question. But yet most people find it difficult to answer. So in a summary format. What should we highlight on this particular question? Tell us about yourself. When asked about tell us about yourself. It's a very simple question. And that question is. I always tell job seekers this is the best time to sell yourself. And it's the best time also to. When you respond to this question. Well you'll have under some of the questions that will be asked ahead. After this question. So when you're talking about tell us about yourself. If you are an experienced person. The first thing that makes an employer invited for an interview is the experience. So talk about your name. Go to experience. Then talk about your personal attributes. Name, experience, academic, sorry. Should I brag about my achievements as well? Personal attributes. Achievements will talk about it. Because that question will come. On why should we hire you. When asked about why you should hire you. You can now talk about your achievements. While I was at this organization. I managed this and this. But so tell us about yourself. Sat with their name. Experient, academics, then attributes. So most people will not understand where to get the attributes from. In any advert. There are places where we have the requirements part. The requirements part is where you'll see the leadership skills. Analytical skills, customer service skills, interpersonal skills. Or a team player. So those are the attributes you should talk about in an interview. When asked about tell us about yourself. And experience you can. If you've been working as an accountant. And maybe your last position is an accountant. Or your current position is an accountant. You also act as an being. Major so much on the accounting experience. When you're talking about the experience. Tell us about yourself. My name is Walemba Jay. I'm currently working as a CV writer at DayCVs. And I've been doing CV writing for the last 4 years. And in my daily job as a CV writer. I ensure that. Now you can mention some of the responsibilities that you tackle. That are similar to that position you are applying for. Okay. And they ask you how much do you want us to pay for this particular role? No. When it comes to salary, salary negazation. Also do research about the company. There are so many things that will determine. You know what I'm saying? Remember there is a meme that has been going around. Like how much do you want us to pay. And then there is a gun put on your head. How much do you want us to pay. And then you're like how much budget does this role have. So there are so many factors that will determine the salary you will ask for. There are people who are working in very toxic environments. So they just want to live. That's factor number one. There's someone who is earning 100,000. And he's in a very comfortable environment. So going to another company. You'll have to consider that the environment and the salary is earning. So he'll ask for a much higher pay. He might ask for 100 or 150 or 200. Then the other factor is that. How do you know like you have not changed yourself? Because when you get into the company now you're working with other people. Then you find out that the people you're working with is the aspect of bonus. The aspect of you could have even gotten a higher pay than what you actually suggest. No. Companies have structures. And if you ask for 50,000 and the company structure is the same. If you ask for 50,000 and the company structure is 150, they'll still pay you based on that. Unless it's an SME. Because companies with structures they'll always pay you as per their salary structure. So about salary. Do enough research about the position in the industry. Let's say if it's in the bank industry. When you go online there's a site called GlassDough. GlassDough you asked for. You Google like a bank teller. Salar is in Kenya. It'll give you options over a range. So you can work based on that. Accountant salary is in Kenya. You can work on that. But I've seen industries. There are industries that are poorly paying positions like accountants because to be honest as a recruiter and a CV writer, we have so many accountants and HR professionals. So many, the market is flooded. So the salary is so poor. So it boils down to on a personal level do your research about the company and just find out more about... Do your research about the company. Basically the industry. Let's say the manufacturing industry. How much is the company paying in the manufacturing industry. But I've also talked about the company culture. The company culture is something that is... There are people who get into companies and they realize that they missed big time. The culture does not... They cannot thrive in that culture. You used to work from 8 to 5. You get into a company that's working from 8 to 8 in the evening. So it becomes tricky for you. So this person cannot survive here. Or there are people who will look at... There are job seekers who will look at... They are seeking for jobs and they are like... I don't want a job where I can work over the weekend. I don't want a job where I can work on Saturdays. You know Saturday is a working day. As per the labor law, Saturday is a working day. But most job seekers will tell you that I don't want a job where I don't want to work. Alright, as you wind up, take us to the right attitude when seeking for a job and also how to just market oneself in regards to different industries that one is into. So, for example, yesterday I was in another forum and... I'm in another forum and I saw a job seeker talk about... I'm not a HR, I've done this and this course. So give me a job. So that is not the right attitude to approach any job, any employer. So when you are marketing yourself, consider yourself, consider your career. The first thing is to consider your career. Am I currently working? If I'm working, yes. Am I in my career? Am I passionate about what I'm doing? Like you've done accounting, you are in a sales industry currently. If you are in a sales industry, that means that before you get into accounts it will take you some time. So, if you get an opportunity maybe to volunteer as an accountant in an organization, why not take it up? I know it's hard, you've been earning money, but it's hard to volunteer just to volunteer without pay. But that is the best thing you can do for yourself. The best thing you can do for yourself, have the three months, volunteer for the three months, then after the three months you can, the company you are volunteering in might give you a permanent job. And it also builds a profile? Yes, it also builds a profile. So Jay, why can't people find you on problem on your website or social media accounts or how they can reach out to you just to keep this conversation going if there are any other further questions? Yes, I have an office at my glowhouse just opposite my investor towers. Then I'm on LinkedIn, Walemba J, I'm on Facebook Walemba J, I'm on Instagram at JCVs or Walemba. Then my website is www.JCVs.co.ke or you can drop us an email info at JCVs.co.ke. Alright, thank you very much Jay for your time to be there. So taking us through a couple of handles and mistakes that we should actually avoid when we are speaking for a job. Alright, thank you very much. So that is Walemba Jay who is the CEO and founder of JCVs. We are looking at job hunting mistakes that you and I can actually avoid. At Y2P4 channel is ready to find us across all our social media handles. My name is Michelle Ashira and you can follow me across all my social at Michelle Ashira. We'll be right back with some match back here in mind in the morning.