 on the regular scheduled select board meeting for the town of Berlin to order. Today is Monday, June 20th, 2022. With us tonight are Flo Smith on my left, Karl Park on my far left, Dave Sawyer on my right, Joe Staub on my far right, I'm Brad Town. With us also is Vince Conti, our town administrator, and Diane Isabel, our town treasurer. Additions or changes to the agenda? No, sir. A bit of a comment. This one you want me to talk? It is. Good evening, Matthew Romiai. I'm here, I'm actually a town resident, but I'm here for the fire department tonight. Wanted to just provide a little bit of a note about some activities that we've had going on. We've recently published, and I'm sorry, not too long ago. This is lovely. Published our May call volume on our Facebook page. We answered 18 fire calls in the month of May, three of them being the structure fires, one of them in the town of Berlin, one in East Montpelier, and one in Middlesex. It's seven alarm activations, two outside fires, three wrecks, a service call, and we've paid the fire department out twice than medical calls. Those are usually the severe ones, cardiac arrest, major things like that. We logged 52 and a half hours, personal hours on fire calls alone, and 112 training hours for body and the neck. Fast-forward also answered 69 calls, and I'm not able to quite drill down yet with numbers to tell you how many person hours those calls amounted to, but the call times themselves were about 12 and a half hours, just on calls. Some of those calls could have had three or four people in them, which would dramatically increase those calls. We are working our way through an ISO review, which happens every five or 10 years, depending on what's going on. This review was actually completed with, the survey was done a couple of years ago, but COVID, so we're working on getting some of that data fixed up. We're hoping not to go down a grade, quite frankly. We were not the only regional department that was set to drop a grade, but we have a year to turn some of those things around. Our biggest hits come in apparatus and personnel. When we start looking at it, we actually got great scores in our water service, so that was a good reflection on the town. That's very little that's in the fire department. One thing we are steering, and it's like a train coming down the tracks is we're gonna have to look in the new ladder truck very soon. It's quite old when we look around the town and see how it's going to go to the hospital, nursing home, nursing home, model airport, commercial ISO, that becomes much more valuable than the ISO records. I'm sorry if I skipped over this, ISO is who sets your insurance rates. So your fire protection category, I forget what the number is, but if we drop a grade, when you look at a building like Blue Cross or one of the bigger buildings, big bucks when it comes to paying for your insurance. The other thing I would ask is this, is this kind of report beneficial to you on a periodic basis? Do you wanna see us? By the way, the chief sends his regards, he's tied up with a duty student, so I have to follow in the sword form, but if this is beneficial to you, we'll keep coming back and seeing you whenever you want to scale. Probably think it'd be beneficial, I find it beneficial that one of the things I was wondering when you say the ISO scale, would there be any way to approach businesses that would drop or have to pay more insurance to help fund some of the fire department's activities? It is possible. Oftentimes that comes, and I'm about to speak out of my pay grade for a minute, but oftentimes that comes at like the DRV process. You say, oh hey, you're gonna put a 17 story building and you're gonna need some help making the protection work for that. It's not just fire department that looks at that, it's all town services should look, so you sort of look at that that way, but we're our fleet's aging and just coming over here tonight, I was listening to a report that's talking about electric fire trucks. They just actually deployed the first all electric fire truck in LA as a Rosenmauer and they broke it in the middle of the peak, but that will, somewhere along the lines of triple the cost of a piece of fire apparatus. So that will take your half a million dollar engine, which is a very nice engine, you get a very nice fire truck for half a million dollars and turn that into a 1.5. Aerial device right now, a new off the line, which by the way, if you swipe your credit card for it today is three years away, is in the 1.2, 1.3 category. We're looking at some apparatus out there right now, but they will be 10 year trucks. So, you know, we'll look at something, but it's gonna be something to give us through the next 10 years until we get a really good capital replacement plan in place. But the other big thing that's always going to hamper us is manpower. You know, it's hard to find a substantially staffed fire department from the town of 2,900. And being an all volunteer service, we only count, so we count one third of what a full time in the station firefighter count. So when they do their calculations, we have to have three volunteers for every one career person to make the same benefit of the calculations. Well, that's a big sandwich that you want. I'm sorry, yeah, we're off track. Any questions for me? Good information. concerns, worries. I'd like to thank you and the volunteers that volunteer first responders here in town. That's a spectacular job you're doing. The report you gave was very interesting. I think, you know, maybe for the sake of time, so you don't have to take a day to be here, even just a quick email to Vince with the same information you gave us that we could compare against previous months and previous years, that would be very interesting. I hope as we get there, we can start getting some linear comparisons. We can go back and do some of that now. It just, it takes a little time to get it cut loose. I know the fast plot is always a point of conversation. We did get communication this month that on at least two of the calls in the month of May, Berlin Fast Squad was the difference in life and death in the town. That's, that came from our transport agencies. That came from our animal services, giving us that feedback. And, you know, that makes it worth it for them. Any other questions for Ms. Brumway? That's all you got. Don't be sitting back here. Yep. Thank you. Thank you for the report. Thank you. We appreciate it. See here, CV runners, special event permit, Robert Emmings. That doesn't look like they joined, but this is the same that they run every year, Brad, that the application is in there. I have their certificate of insurance as well. It's a five mile race around the pond. They're estimating maybe around 75 people for the event at the high end. It's from 5 p.m. to 7 30 p.m. In the middle of August. They're going to have volunteers for parking and around the pond to monitor traffic as well. And they'll have a registration table out here. Okay. No problems in previous years. No, there's no issue with this. I make a motion to approve the special event amusement permit application as presented by this country and as outlined in the paperwork presented to us. And it's specifically on August 18th and they'll have a start and finish after the field road. Second in that motion. Is there any leeway there for a review of the police and the fire? They can fill that out and we should take in maybe it's conditional on how to react to a button. I would like to include that conditional as presented by Brad regarding the police and fire as well. Thank you, Brad. Second, Brad. Any further discussion on this? All those in favor? Motion carries. Charter change review and discussion to receive events. Yep. In your packet, you'll find a copy of the charter. And in that charter, you'll see the changes highlighted in red that have been proposed. If they're in red with no strike through, there are the additions. And if there's a strike through, they're being removed from that location. So it's pretty straightforward. I think there's three in general. One has to do with the local options tax. And that's on page two paragraph D in red. Do you want me to read those changes or I think so because you got people in the audience here. Okay, so it says upon resolution of the select board or upon receipt of a petition signed by 5% of the registered voters of the town at an annual or special meeting worn for that purpose, the voters of the town may vote by a majority of those present voting to assess any or all of the following. A 1% sales tax, a 1% rooms tax, and a 1% meals and alcohol beverage tax. Page three paragraph D2, a tax imposed under the authority of this section shall be collected and administered by the Department of Taxes in accordance with 24 VSA section 138. Then D3, revenues received through the imposition of a tax imposed under this section shall be designated for capital projects within the town. That's the first change. And then in sub-chapter four, under town officers, under elected officers, item two, there's a strike-through for the town clerk for a three-year term as a deletion. And then in section four dash four, appointed officers on page five, there's the addition of the town clerk there as an appointed officer. Then on page seven, under section seven dash three, penalty for delinquent installments, we're adding and personal property inventory taxation. And then paragraph C that's defined as, when the total assessed value of personal property or inventory taxation is equal to or less than $1,650, the town treasurer may, after approval of the select board, waive the personal property inventory taxation. Did you wanna say anything to that, Diane? What it is, is that these bills are under $5 and under. I have 46 tax bills that are under $5, and the majority are under a dollar. And it takes me a long time to collect that money because people just ignore it. And so all I'm saying is, you know, you're looking at a total of all 46 and $250 total, not even that much, $250. But I spend a lot more time on that in stamps and try to collect them. And so all I'm saying is, if we can go with that, then it's $215, however, we are spending more than that for me to collect them. So that's what I'm saying. That's the only way that we can waive anything that's under that money. And the way I understand it is, is that you can waive up to $1,650. But no, no, the taxable amount, because you have to divide that by a hundred. Oh, okay. And so then we divide that by our tax rate, it's like $5, but the whole year or less. And I have tons of them that are under a dollar on the 46. But we have to have it in the charter or I should fill out so that everybody that gets personal. Just as a note for the board as well, if we proceed with the charter change, the administrative code will have to be updated to reflect those changes as well in regards to the charter position. It's just an administrative action for the administrative code that would need to be done. Discussion of this? Now I have a quick comment on page Roman numeral two some section D by the majority of those present and voting. It may be understood, but does that language have to be changed for mail in or absentee voting? Those, can we just get rid of present? Who's voting? Where's that present from the town? Well, it says present and voting, so voting would include your mailings too. Well, I take it as it's a floor vote. That's, it's really a concern. So what type of vote will it be and where will it be held and who can participate in the vote? So that particular phrase is in question. I think it's because it isn't a budgetary item that has to be on the floor vote. Yeah, and again, it's referring to a special meeting, but to get the ultimate clarification, I will consult with our town attorney and BLCT on the language to make sure it's appropriate. Any other comments on that? Can I ask a question? Sure. Thank you. I'm Margaret Manley, Justice of the Peace. I'm Margaret Manley, Justice of the Peace. So are you voting today to change the town clerk position to an appointed position versus an elected position? Or does that go to like town meeting and the people vote? Well, it has to be voted on by the town. Okay. So that changed you guys don't have the power to meet. No, all we're gonna do is we're trying to think of what we're gonna put in front of the voters. Right, right. Okay. The local options tax course that we're hoping to use that to fund the capital budget on the local options tax. I believe the research says it's about half a million dollars additional revenue. We'll come to some of that. There's a presentation there as well. Local options tax as well. Talks about some of that. I don't know if Tim's gonna be here, but we have a truck that's trying to retire early and a few other things, the payloader's getting, we've had that for a long time. When you take an ad all those up, it's a big chunk of money. This is just a way to get people from outside of town to help pay for this because they're enjoying our roads and services. I appreciate it. Yes. So on the change for appointing a town clerk? Yes. So then when it's time for a clerk to be appointed, is it, does the town recruit? And not just like I come in and say, I want to be a town clerk, like we do now, it's gonna change and the town will recruit. Yeah, one of the advantages of having an appointment is they no longer need to be a town resident. And that gives you a bigger pool people choose from. Any other questions on this? Yeah. Yeah, go ahead. I'm wondering if you could each please state for the record why you would like to see it go to appointed from elected and to the point that you just made as far as it makes a bigger pool because it can go outside of the town. I'd like to point out that it's been several months that you've been looking for an assistant town treasurer and you do have that advantage and it doesn't seem to have helped. I believe there is a interview tomorrow. Right, but it's been several months and there isn't one yet, unfortunately. So just having a bigger pool does not mean you necessarily get all kinds of people. But I would love to hear from each of you as far as what you believe the advantage is. With the, as far as not getting applications for the assistant treasure position, we have had several. It's kind of a unique employment thing right now. It's hard to, I can't describe it. I mean, Tim was telling me today that towns all around the middle sex had one man on their road crew now and they cannot find other people to work. And it's just Barry City, Montpilter City, Berry Town, Roxbury, everybody's looking for help. It's widespread. And it's just not coming in. Let's see here. Well, like I said, if it wasn't for this time of history, I think that you would find there'd be a lot of people interested in the town clerk's position or I just think we need to get the apps, get people that have the absolute best abilities for the town. Not necessarily just being Berlin residents. And I didn't realize that until just recently when I was reading some communications and talking with folks. And I almost didn't think that that was true. But the more that I've given it consideration and talked with people, I think that could be backing on what you just said, Brad. It opens up the ability for more people to apply in a bigger pool. Not necessarily to say that we wouldn't hire someone from Berlin, just we had that option to look at everyone who's interested. So I would say that's my answer to your question. Garo? Well, I guess I could be convinced about elected or appointed being positive. They both have positives and negatives. We certainly in this nation have seen that sometimes we get a choice of candidates that we don't like either one of those candidates and we're surprised that that's all we get. Election is a popularity contest with no filter for qualifications. Whereas an appointed person would have to go through a personal process. They'd have to probably be filtered through a hiring committee. Their qualifications would be scrutinized and we'd be certain that the person that was put in place as the town clerk was qualified and the best person that applied for the job. Joe? I could go either way to see it in a positive both ways. I think it's nice to know the person in the office as being a local person you can relate to and have that communication and deal in a business dealings with. But going back to having more of a pool of candidates, I could see that as being a positive as well. I would have to pretty much the same answer that's been said I think that being appointed if there was an oversight hiring person committee or whatever for that position, we'd have pool of individuals that are best qualified other than being again a popularity contest or something that somebody put their name on the election got elected simply because maybe who they were or who knows them and maybe not be the best fit for it. I myself would need more to want to have a selective, a committee that selected individual best fits within that to do their job. Any other question? Well I'd also like to share something. I've just spoken something that I said and I will be rectifying that to the best of my ability but I'm not sure if you're aware I wasn't aware that even if you were appointing a town clerk it still would be the town clerk who would appoint the assistant clerk. That is from the Vermont League of Cities and Towns, some questions and answers that they had just a by the way that's how it works internally. Any other comments? Yeah, go. So I believe it was page three when we talked about the revenues being used shall be designated for the capital for capital projects for the town. I think at one point we were talking about the emergency services being that the PD has a very large budget as well as the town clerk who wrote the, so if it was capital projects and also then incorporates the police department as well but is there anything in the police department that it wouldn't cover? That it wouldn't cover? That it wouldn't cover, you know, like salaries. Salaries, yeah. But usually capital improvement is a physical infrastructure. Well, up to these vehicles that we could be considered capital and the radios and the equipment that they need and that is very extensive. And they need to have obviously the latest in technology. Yes. Is the local options tax something that's going to be voted on question one, question two? It's my understanding is it not that if we do a 1% local options tax at the state of Vermont, it keeps half of it and we get half. There's two ways of doing that, okay? Can I just say we're going to come to that? Okay. Local options tax is specifically on the agenda to talk about numbers and how it works. Okay. All right. So, okay. Anything else on this? Okay. Have a motion on the charter change review and decision. Proceed. I'd make the motion to proceed with the charter changes that was presented tonight with the added information that Vince will obtain and just a few grammatical things that I can share with men so they're nothing major some periods and just overall grammatical. And also maybe something to indicate about what we talked about about having to be in the board where we can get that necessary. Yeah, I'll certainly get clarity on that garbage. Excellent. Second. Both motion. Could I ask another question? As far as when you're planning on putting this out to vote is it going to be several votes as far as like the local option tax would not be under the same thing as the others so they each get their own vote? I would think, because I mean. The way it's designed. The way it's designed is I understand it and recommend if we please the cities and towns in the verbiage that's in the charter change each item would have its own line to vote on. So there'd be one for the local option stacks that'd be one for the town clerk change and there'd be one for the taxation change as well for each to vote on. That's the way I would presume that. Any other comments on this? Hearing none. Those in favor signify by saying aye. Aye. Those opposed? Motion carries so Vince you've got some work to do. Yes. Thank you very much. Personnel policy update. Okay again in your package you have a similar I didn't give you the whole personnel policy just the page that had the change on it page six under section 201. And again this came about from a discussion with the leads and cities and towns for the board's recommendation to start a review with them with regards to our personnel policy. So they gave me the recommendation I'll read off what that change is and the entire policy in this draft including this has been sent to them for a complete review from the leads and cities and towns and I should have a response from them sometime in the next two weeks. So once I have that I will bring the whole policy back to the board for review of their comments as well. So this one reads basically it's nepotism and again this statement is directly with what the leads and cities and towns has recommended the town of Berlin in recognition of the potential for a conflict of interest to occur in the workplace prohibits the hiring of transferring of relatives when doing so will result in a close relative supervising or evaluating another close relative or close relative supervising or evaluating the immediate supervision of another close relative. And then it goes on to say a close relative includes a spouse, civil union partner, romantic cohabitant, parent, step parent, grandchild, child, step child, grandchild, sibling, aunt or uncle, niece or nephew, parent-in-law and sibling-in-law. That's the extent of the change that they recommended. The Vermont Leagues of Cities and Towns. Does your emotion on this? I'd make a motion to go further with this personnel changes and personal policies. All the way up. Any further discussion? Cover something like when Bethany was doing minutes for the board for several years, would that not be a possibility anymore? Well, be honest, she was a contractor. She was not a hire. She was an employee. She put in a thing on an RFP, was low bid, and that's how she got her job or whatever you wanna call it here at the town during minutes. I was just wondering how far it goes as far as it's a small town. Well, the other thing here is, is that the nepotism cause is pretty specific in saying that supervisory ability is over the relative. That is, there's nothing would keep a relative working here in the office from having a relative working out in the road trip. And the other thing is, of course, is that the ability to supervise someone goes away when most of your work, or supervision should go through either the immediate supervisor or Vince. And of note, the clerk's office is not covered by the personnel policy. That's true. And the way it's set up today, I believe, if it was to go to a higher position or a point position by the town, I think that position would be covered under the statute. Under the statute? Under this policy. Well, I'm not sure, because it does say that it would still be a clerk who would appoint. You are correct, but I think that the clerk would have to abide by the policies of the town at that point. It's just my opinion. Let our lawyer earn some money. He is reviewing it. The leagues and cities and towns have also provided, along with that document, because they're seeing this more and more throughout the state that they're recommending. There's a form there that they actually are now, some towns are starting to use that for elected positions that still remain like the clerk, they're having him sign that form as part of a condition of employment to accept also and include them in the town benefits that they will abide by the personnel policy if they wanna receive town benefits. And that's, again, I have that form that's directly from BLCT as well. It's something that they are implementing across the state with the towns that they, better members. Is there gonna be any pushback with the town insurance through VLCC if these policies aren't followed? I don't know the answer to that yet. I haven't had any feedback from them with regards to that. The question is out there though. What type of impact will it have through them? We don't have anything back from passive or VLCT on that yet. Any other question on the immediate supervision? So, I'm a poison. Right. And I call it, I am falling. So who do you answer to directly? I answer to Vince directly. Vince directly. So let's say you did an assistant treasurer and Vince's daughter. I don't know if you have a daughter. Couple of them. Apply for it. And you would supervise her because you would be the immediate? Yes. And okay. As long as I don't have any direct supervision or evaluation of that person, if she's doing it, that would be fine. Because that person have to come to me and then if there's any issues, I would go to Vince. It's kind of like, let me just make the, like Tom, for instance. If there's an issue, Tom doesn't come directly to me. He's supposed to go to Vince. Vince comes to me. All I'm saying is just the same type of thing. You know, I'm not related to Tom. But it doesn't matter. There's a certain way. A certain process, right? Follow that process. But I am appointed. I do have the insurance from the town and I do follow up, follow up on the paperwork. I was pretty sure I just wanted to touch face about immediate supervision. Yeah. Thank you. Anything else on this? Your motion? So if there was a motion. Oh yeah. Second? Discussion. Yep. Sorry. All those in favor? Aye. Aye. Those opposed? Motion carries. Local option tax reduced, Vince. Yes. Now we can talk numbers. Aye. So the latest numbers that I were able to pull are from the state with regards to the local option tax. So it's 70% of 1%. Then we get. So for 20, let me get the right number here, $2021, that would equate to about $558,000 for us after the state takes their cut. Do they have any more pre-COVID numbers? Pre-COVID numbers. I could go back and there actually are some in the report that I, well, no, they're not any. They do have some numbers that we could go back. And those numbers seem to be pretty constant. Years ago, Jeremy Hansen was investigating this, and he came up with, it came up again, about a half a million dollars to the tax. So on that, I can give you some figures. In 2019, in fiscal year 2019, it would have been $510,911 for the town of Berlin. In fiscal year 18, it would have been $491,772. Fiscal year 17, it would have been $485,252. I can go back to 16 if you want it, but those are the numbers that it would have been if we had elected it. It's easier to put that money into the capital budget because the money is not guaranteed the same every year, just to be clear, that is just for the 1% sales tax. It doesn't include meals and rooms or any of the others. It's just on the sales portion of it. Yes, sir. So with the wording, the capital expenditure, so we're talking about machinery, are we, you know, perhaps let's say we wanna build a new town garage, we wanna buy a new fire truck, all that kind of stuff would be included because man, it sounds like they need a fire truck and we need a new town garage and this would be a huge help to the town, but thank you. Yep, just want some more information on that local options tax, I mean, it's... Do you know, can you tell us what the money is for rooms and meals would be? I can't tell you today's numbers, but I can tell you in 1918 and 17 years. The fiscal year 19 from the meals and rooms and alcohol, it would have been 138,868. Fiscal year 18 would have been 66,238 and from fiscal year 17, it would have been $59,782. And the benefits both vary in my favor, having a local option tax, don't they? They do now. They do now. And many towns in the country have to go over one as well. Yeah, I can tell you the list that have the 1% sales and options tax around the state right now are Brandon, Brattleboro, Burlington, Colchester, Dover, Killington, Manchester, Middlebury, Rutland Town, St. Albans City, St. Albans Town, South Burlington, Stratton, Williston, Wilmington, Winn Hall, and Winooski. Yes, sir. I believe the Montpelier option tax is only on the rooms and meals. Just coming to that, you're right. So for just the meals and rooms as well is Brandon again, Brattleboro, City of Berry, Colchester, Dover, Hartford, Killington, Manchester, Middlebury, Montpelier, Rutland Town, St. Albans City in town, South Burlington, Stahl, Stratton, Williston, Wilmington, Winn Hall, Winooski, and Woodstock. And again, I have a presentation that I'd be happy to share with anybody if they so desire to talk a little bit more about it. I'll give some numbers. It sounded like a Johnny Cash song first of all. I've been to Wilmington. Yeah. So obviously everybody has had this conversation that has added this tax. So there must be some negative impacts. My question would be how do local business owners that are going to be directly impacted by a field? We've got empty spaces in the mall, the old Staples building. So we have potential retail space that's not being utilized now. Will this contribute to them staying empty? I guess is my question. Is there any record of negative impact in Barry or Montpelier after they have added this tax? I guess those are the questions that I'm sure somebody who's really looked into this deeper than I might have the answers to. I don't know who to direct them to even. I won't throw it under your lap. I can reach out and I can talk with each of the town managers in both Montpelier and Barry and see what they have to say. And before and how the business has responded and so on. I know this is one of the issues that was being discussed before I was elected. And I tried to reach out to a couple of businesses that I did business with. And they didn't really, those particular individuals didn't really have a feeling either way. But I don't know if there would be a way to get that input from local business owners and all the retailers and the region. I can reach out to a few of them as well. If you like some of the local businesses. I also think the Regional Planning Commission has some information on that as well. They've done some research and I can see what they have. Well, just as an observation on that though, Willison has the sales tax and they have a new fire station. Nice morning, Mr. State. What's that? In my class, I'm solely as a taxpayer and resident of the town of Berlin. I'm not representing the fire department in any way. Yeah, Willison's fire station is really nice. They also just hired nine new firefighters. Comma, however, at least my personal observation, the thing that runs businesses out of Montpelier is property taxes. And the things that burden businesses less in Berlin is property taxes. I don't think that the sales tax, those are pass on taxes. And when you look at the interstate, the last time that you pass a gas station, you can see from the exit is exit four. And the first gas station you can see from the exit going north of here is 11, I think. Maybe Water Bear. But this is what's utilizing city services for those that aren't paying property taxes like the rest of us. The only thing I'd like to add kind of follows up on the question that you had asked earlier as well. Out of that 30% that the state keeps, we still get some of that money back because that funds the state's pilot program, which is payment and lieu of taxes. For the state buildings that they have in various towns, that money is pooled from all the towns that have that local options tax to pay a portion of what their taxes would be if they weren't a state organization. So we even get some of that 30% back based on the formula that they used to calculate that pilot payment for each town. And the financing, as I understand, that happens all through the state. It wouldn't fall on Dianne's. Correct. The accounting and that is. Although I believe there is an option that the town could do it themselves and have all of that. But generally. That's because Jeremy looked into that. Great to have that. That's why he's doing that. Did that change, though? Did the statutes change on that? Yeah, I couldn't find that in the statutes anymore. I think that may have changed because I think, again, the state wants that pool to pay a pilot tax with. So it's got to get there cut. But we get some of that back as well. Any other discussion on the local options tax? Yes, sir. I got one last quick point. And that is if I were talking to a business owner or somebody out there and saying, look, we want to charge your customers 1% more, here are the benefits. We're going to replace a 17-year-old firetruck. We're going to replace a 52-year-old. Not just like, hey, can you pay us more money? But show them the benefits. Thank you. There are two chairs right here, if you want one, you can have it. That's work. Any other discussion on this? Entertain a motion? Go forward with the local option tax as reviewed with the decision to proceed. Did the other discussion? Hearing none, those in favor? Aye. Aye. Aye. Motion carries. Highway crew retention incentive discussion, is Tim here? He's not here, so. But basically, quick summary, we had a highway crew person elect to leave that's been here for eight plus years. No, probably about six. Six years. And the bottom line was you got a few dollars more than they did in town. They offered it to him, and he took it. Every town around us, again, it's everywhere. The crunch, the higher highway crew people. People in general, as we all know. Middlesex, for example, I think it was a four-man crew. They're down to one. They're looking for three. Callis is looking for one. Norfield is still looking for one. Berry City, I think, is looking for two. Berry Town is looking for two. So everybody around us are looking for people. And it was similar not long ago with the police force as well. They're just picking off people and swapping around and all for the dollar. We've done some surveys and some costs with the leagues of cities and towns using their data from their statewide surveys on pay as well. With the fiscal year budget that we put in place, we're very close. We're still in a couple of positions. One of them, in particular, on the highway crew that is still well below the state average for that role. So we thought we would propose to the town some sort of retention incentive to offset the disparity in the next fiscal budget year and then propose a new budget, obviously, next year to get everybody up to the average level that kind of matches the state and hopefully hang on to some of our employees and not have them taken from another town and hopping around from town to town for pay. So some of those numbers, again, there's a document in your folder that has the numbers and the recommended amounts to do just that. So for example, our road foreman, in 2022, was making 2448. 2023 after his increase, so this fiscal year coming up, he'll be making 2645. So the average road foreman across the state right now, based on $2021, because that's the last survey that came out. Now, I just gave you his 2023. His $2021, the average is 3116 for a road superintendent. So ours falls a little bit short, obviously, even with his 2023 wages. So we're recommending using the ARPA funds, which this is a usable, allowable use for those, a $5,000 retention incentive for him for fiscal year 23 to bring him up closer to that average. Keep him interested and be an employee with us. And it's similar, the dollars are less, but it's similar for the other two men on the crew. Their retention incentive to get them there for fiscal year 23 is about $2,000. So we're talking a total of around $9,000. We're talking a total of exactly $9,000 for the three crew members for retention incentive this year, fiscal year 23. If we hire someone else, there's no point in the retention part that I take it. Correct, correct. So we look at and agree on a appropriate starting wage that would fit within the scale. And then again, we're going to be talking about the 2024 budget very soon and look at making what it's going to cost to make those adjustments to bring them up without having to have a incentive retention bonus. Where will we add on those ARPA funds 23 now? Yep, it's on my desk hold on. I can tell you it's approximately. We have allocated and spent about $63,000 and our expense. We have estimated that have not been approved yet around $50,000. So it's around $110,000 approved or in the potential approval process for projects and expenditures right now. That doesn't include, does not include what we just talked about yet. Well, I guess my question is where we're, and I can see your map. And where did the dollar failure come from? Was that you guys? Yep, yep, yep. From, well, not me, the leading cities and towns from their survey across the state of actual numbers. And the 2022 and 2023 rates came from our actual budget numbers. Well, looking at these numbers, just knowing the industry and knowing what these guys do and running the equipment and stuff, those numbers are low. I mean, just knowing the industry. Yeah, I mean, we're getting challenged now right by the private sector. You know, FedEx, for example, they're looking to hire people with a CDL license of $30 an hour to drive the FedEx drop. Those guys don't have to plow in the winter. They don't have to get up in the middle of the night and go cut trees out of the road. So it's a challenge. And again, it's not just us that's struggling with it. It's around the state. It seems like every time, you know, we just keep spending, spending, spending. I mean, I am definitely in favor and make a motion to do these retention incentive bonuses to a road crew at the amounts that Mitz has down here. Here, a second. A friendly amendment. Those bonuses, could they be spread out over fiscal year 2023 and only paid if they say? That is the intent, right? It would be, you know, a certain portion, every quarter. Well, every check, you know, every two weeks. It would grow down over two weeks. So these monies would be... It will not be a one-time lump sum payment at the start of the year, for sure. I would like to... It would not be good practice. I would like to amend the motion, but to take the motion to the retention incentives to be broke and distributed as Diane has explained. Any further discussion? Hearing none, those in favor? Aye. Motion carries. Town clerk, assistant clerk of discussion and decision? I think... I don't want to put you on the spot, Mr. Sawyer, but I think the point of that tonight was to have a brief discussion on current events and the situation there. I also believe we'll be having an executive session at the end of the meeting to discuss it in further detail. As everybody knows, I made a call when it became aware that our appointment wanted to hire her daughter to fill in for the assistant and town clerk position. In doing so, I reached out to residents asking for some input. I personally don't feel that's the best decision that's going to serve the town of Berlin, and I would like to review some things with the board in the second session. Anything else on this? How many applicants were there for the assistant and town clerk position? I don't believe it was advertised. I believe it's supposed to be advertised, isn't it? That there's vacant too? Yep. Again, the statute is the select board doesn't have to take any action until the resignation or the position becomes vacant, which is going to be the 30th of this month. Then they have 10 days to advertise the positions at that point in time in line with the statute. Well, I hope I was correct. Just for clarity, as is the town clerk, as total control over who the assistant town clerk is. That's correct. My statute does correct. Any other on this? I would love to hear what any concerns are amongst the board members. I personally met with you today and I told you what my opinion was and how I felt about that position being shared by your daughter. Be it that you can, if you were, well, right now you have been appointed, but if it was to remain an appointment that I felt it would not be in a professional manner, and I just don't, I personally do not feel that it's the right, it would serve the residents in the best manner. And that's not knowing your daughter's qualifications. I think that to do the due diligence I think that there should be multiple people interviewed. I know it's a short period to do that in. And again, I shared my thoughts with you today on that. You and those. Right, it was only your thoughts. I would really like to hear from each and every of the board members that they have because I thought that was the point was to have a public discussion about this. So I'm all ears. One of my big concerns nothing I'm saying it would happen but having a having a relative in the town clerk's office when you are a cash-generating office where are the checks and balances. Diane, tell us what happens if we take him with us with our audit. Oh, I think I know our auditors do look they they always ask me are there any relatives working within the team? And they do ask me that over here. Of course there's none. But they do frown on it but I can't say exactly why. As the editor as the treasurer they want to know like the road form in the police department of course it's always been known but I know that's what they do. Well, I would still look to all of you before that gets interrupted. I just wanted to make a question in the back. We can go around first unless this question pertains. No, you should go around and have the board answer. Excellent. So mine very clearly I think it's unprofessional to make the request. I think highly of you in your skill set. I didn't make a request just so you know. So my understanding is that you sought to hire your daughter as your assistant when you went into the position of being in the town square. That's my understanding so that's why I worried it that way. If I was in the same shoes or trying to determine who's going to be my assistant if I was moving forward I just consider it unprofessional and that's the best way I can answer you because I know you in this particular instance I would lean toward I know Korean so I don't think there's going to be an issue but I definitely think that nepotism is a dangerous road to go down which is why I supported the change in the charter and I was going to use the same term as our chair checks and balances in small town government we need as many eyes with as few eyes as are available in a small office to be scrutinizing it so the voters and the townspeople can feel confident and secure and what's going on here. Joe? Taking you and your daughter out of the equation I just think the position itself I don't think family members should work in that capacity together because of the checks and it's nothing personal Dave? I shared I shared them and like I said it's just my opinion and I feel that it just needs to be some checks and balances and it's not that anything would ever happen I just want to make sure that the town residents are comfortable with the choices that we have made as a select board and or who are in that position the appointments they made Okay You got a question? Hi, no My name is Sandra Ferber, I live on airport road I'm a resident of Berlin since 2015 Before I was a resident in Berlin I was a resident of Worcester I was the elected treasurer and clerk for eight years and once and after that I was the appointed treasurer for the town of Callis for four years I'm retired I just want to remind the board that this is a statutory right that the clerk has to appoint the assistant and it's not a right it's a requirement number one many town offices have had family members in the office I can point to the town of Callis where two sisters one was a treasurer and one was the town clerk the Fitch sisters Judith, Robert and Donna Fitch worked together for many years and before that the town clerk and her sister worked in the office for many years there was no wrongdoing and I think I just do want to say because I think I know as a clerk and as a treasurer I have been well served by the town office it has always been professional Corinne has been professional Rosemary has been professional I feel very confident that my records are maintained and that my taxes are paid and puts where they have to be and I think I would urge the board to have confidence in this appointment and to have confidence in the assistant that Corinne appoints in the end the buck stops with Corinne if there is a problem with the office she stands for that problem so I'm really here in support of Corinne and to tell you that as a townsperson I read your post I actually don't have a problem with it and I think Corinne actually is very brave to have one of her kids work with her because that you know I think she has a lot of faith in her daughter who is to do the right thing and to serve this town and I am here to at least let you hear from a townsperson who has experience in municipal government it's very important that people have confidence I believe it's very important that people have confidence in the folks at the office and they really are the face of your town most people will know their town clerk and the assistant and the treasurer they don't necessarily know the select board we don't come I think by tax bill is wrong or whatever they go to these people and I feel all of my interactions here in this town have been very positive that's my husband over there Buzz Berber and I you know I'm doing the song and dance for us tonight but I ask you to consider having some confidence in this situation it feels it doesn't feel very welcoming and if the people don't like it they will vote their feelings and I think you need to trust in that I would like to speak in support of Bryn and Midda who I know known for 18 years and she's smart as a whip she's the most organized person I have a small business I started by myself and people were like we need more of your services could you please expand your business and not unless my husband wants to do it with me because I need someone I know has the same work ethic someone I know will show up won't call off it's just the first sunny day and they want to go so I work with my husband we have a very successful business in Berlin and I as a justice of the peace for the last about 10 years Midda works every election she cares about the town I'm not saying that anyone would be qualified I'm saying if Karin can do it Midda's the right person they can work together I think that I would be thrilled as a town member to have Midda at assisting Karin I heard the word checks and balances and as many eyes as possible many times in this discussion and I know we're not specifically talking right now about the voting for the town clerk position exactly those words should be used for voting for the town clerk as opposed to an appointment from 10 sets of eyes for the town clerk and if the people of the town don't like the decisions that Karin make they'll vote her out in the other discussion Karin's the best so is Midda I'm not sure about the decision part of this one to just go into the executive session or not okay any other discussion on this one hearing none approval of meetings of meetings for April 4 and April 18 April May 2 May 16 from April 4 I'll start with them there's one section on page 2 at the bottom under the GMP right away permit moody subdivision review for approval the second paragraph where it starts with emotion there's some information there that needs to be parsed out and corrected so I can't make a motion on that one yet until that's fixed and brought back about the 18th on the 18th I just took a quick reference there's just another one here for manual questions on the 18th I'd like to make a motion to approve them by giving Vince the hard copy and just asking for those changes to be made mostly periods and just the inclusion of one additional word so I'd like to make the motion to approve those as presented with just a few grammatical changes you'll give me those I'll give you that hard copy I'll start with that motion with the changes any discussion there's the April 18th April 18th all those in favor motion carries May 2nd same thing with the May 2nd just minor grammatical issues and I'll share the hard copy with Vince but I make the motion to approve the Monday, May 2nd, 2022 minutes as presented with small grammatical errors for changes to be made be for the discussion all those in favor motion carries and May the 16th on the May 16th I make the motion to approve them with one addition being at the end of what time the board adjourned the meeting because there's just a blank line there also just minor grammatical issues throughout which I'll share with Vince to be made I'll start with that one any further discussion any none, those in favor motion carries approval of licenses permits, vouchers and applications I make the motion to approve 22-26 for payroll from June 5th to June 18th 2022 to be paid on June 22nd of this year in the amount of $51,725.51 also the payable warrant 22G24 with checks 22066 to 22096 in the amount of $57,400.51 here a second a second any further discussion all those in favor motion carries the round table form nothing thank you Garo I would just like to say one of the issues that I see and that I really was hoping to fix is a cooperation between the town clerk and the town treasurer and they get along very well by everybody's witness I really felt like one assistant helping both offices would make so much sense and I understand now that one's appointed, one's elected and they're separate in that respect but I still have a great desire to try to make those and I also one thing that's also been very clear is for decades there's been a schism between the select board and town clerk's office and there are probably good reasons but I really hope that we could overcome that and I hope whatever happens today does it throw a new monkey wrench in that relationship in that comment Joe I'm going to say a couple of months back actually it was a different board and I think there was some sort of idea of bringing different committees for board members for different departments and to report out much like today when the fire department showed up to give a brief overview I think it's important that the police department, fire department wrote through all those different services and boards to have a chance to come just to give a brief overview of what they're doing and answer any questions that we may have or at least in their report we could come up with some intelligent questions for them I'd like to see those you'd like those to come back I'd like those to come back quarterly whatever that might be and rotate them through so you're not having them all come in we can do that put it in an agenda item I'm giving it a few minutes on the agenda once a quarter, one by one we'll go through them all and then start over again anything else Joe? Dave Brad, before you guys go into executive I would really like you guys to keep in mind what you said repeatedly tonight and that is everybody is having a low hiring everybody and in fact, you have decided to up the wages for the highway department which that was brought up during budget time and nobody really wanted to do that even though at that point there was a chance of somebody leaving and I guess they decided not to leave the person that did leave so the stuff that has been talked about as far as whether or not it's a livable wage and who all is available in the bottom line being two people are needed in that office there are three elections coming up and they don't start in August they start with the ballots going out first day can be June 30th if the ballots are all here and things can go out we already have the request for between 350 and 400 ballots to send out the postcards went out from the state and so people are starting to call to see am I on that list already to get the absentee ballot one person cannot do that and I really don't have an interest in being that one person and executive session for personnel fair motion I make the motion to exit the regular self-coordination tonight Monday June 20th and into executive session to discuss personnel and contract in a second