 What's up, everybody? I'm the hook and I'm the blade and I'm the historian. Ah, okay. And together we're You know Welcome to the hook land blade marks a show about all things AC landmarks I'm your host Lawson with me as always is your host Timothy and we are joined this episode by a very special guest the one and only Mr. Arshak from Assassin's Creed landmarks on Twitter YouTube and elsewhere How are you doing today Arsh doing well guys very very glad and like humble to be over here You guys are so amazing in the podcast man, dude. Thank you. We love your your posts and your tweets and stuff Very insightful and informed Content that that really helps expose people. I think to the historical side of of Assassin's Creed. It's it's good shit, man It's good. Yeah. Yeah historical landmarks figures. I'm your boy. I'm your real-life Sean Hastings, you know Now it would have been maybe obvious to get you on for an episode about Landmarks, but we did kind of you know, we've done the whole cities thing and you know what if people want to learn About landmarks they could just go to your Twitter. They don't need us. Yeah, you guys did it with blue That was an amazing podcast man. Oh, thank you Well, we'll pass on your praise unless he hears it listening blue If you're listening blue it was it was really good No, actually actually guys blue is canceled because today is all about our shock. Yeah, boy. Get blue. Love you, blue Arshak To infinity and our shock Dude if that if you weren't ac landmarks that would have to be your 20 a hundred percent our shock Do you like bio shock Arsh? I played it once. It's not my type of tea. It's not your cup of game. Yeah No, my my cup of games requires historical shit, you know Yeah, I feel like it's a fucking like documenting almost yeah, dude You got I mean there's like they're both taking place in different time periods. They get some points for that It's a fantastical history. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. I mean Assassin's Creed also Is but you know, I'm not gonna argue with you about it. Okay. You're allowed to not like Your namesake bio shock It's actually my shock is my favorite game of all time If that was my freaking Twitter handle that would have been great because like bio shock I give biographies on And my name is Arshak You do biographies of of historical characters. Look, we brought it full circle. We brought it around town What an amazing historical characters is the subject. It's actually called a segue. Yeah way. Yes segue. That is what I just They call me lost in segue the segue king All right, so Arshak, what's up homie? What is in your opinion the best Historical character in the franchise blackbeard. I freaking love that guy fuck dude. I thought you can't use that I was gonna that was mine. I was gonna say blackbeard Sorry, sorry Darby. Okay, but is blackbeard your favorite because of the performance or because of the actual historical figure blackbeard blackbeard is my favorite because like he is Both historically and with performance the most intimidating guy ever Okay, and like the amount of information that Darby got on blackbeard and based it on AC4 black black is crazy because like I Took three days researching blackbeard and trying to find his comparisons to like real life history and Man like it just like boggled my mind like I freaking love Darby, man So he's your favorite because you feel like there was a lot of research and effort put into the character a lot of research and effort yeah, like he's a very complex character and To you know bring him to life like he's the best version of black. He's if you tell me black beard I will remember AC4 black beard not fricking Pirates of the Caribbean black beard. I Think I like blackbeard so much because a lot of times in the AC games the historical characters as I'm sure we'll get into more detail about They're kind of boring. It's like. Oh, yes Here's you know fucking Alexander Graham Bell or Socrates or Any they're doing the thing that they do. Hey look Darwin. He's talking about evolution and shit They're doing the things that they like to do and then with black beard I feel like they took advantage of the most interesting parts of the character of the person historically in the sense that There is a popular image of what black beard is and it seems like and I don't actually know this firsthand It's just sort of what I've been told and what I believed and interpreted from the game So maybe you can comment on this harsh. It seems like black beard Rather than necessarily being like the most ruthless or evil or or scary or intimidating badass of the pirate world It was all very theatrical and it was a a reputation that he deliberately cultivated that wasn't necessarily a reflection on who he was as a person and I just love that like I went into this game expecting a certain black beard because of what I've heard about black beard And the way that he's been depicted in other media And the black beard we got was a more interesting and complex character in AC4. So that's that's what I appreciate about him Yeah, it showed both his human side and his Like actor side because historically black beard was known as like Either Edward teach or Edward thatch, but like he wanted to look intimidating. That's why there is there is black beard and it's all a part of his act and Yeah, like that one scene with steed just defines. Yeah, who black beard is That's why it's like pasted into our memories because that's his act that like man I would have loved to meet him in real life, but he would probably kill me Man it's just just like I'm intimidating just just talking about him because I love I love the character so much Speaking to kind of what you were saying last about like the theatrical elements of black beard and kind of how like he was able to just take A ship without even firing cannons because they just feared him so much. Yeah, it's kind of yeah interesting But as well as because where black flag I think does some of these historical elements well as it's kind of Generally believe that black beard and perhaps you can confirm deny this arsh, but um black beard with light his actual beard on fire Before going into a battle or something, but in the game It's just these like ropes that are on fire that are attached to his hat But you could imagine that from a distance it would look as if his beard is on fire, right? I think that's like a really kind of interesting like smoke and mirrors type thing that black beard could have been utilizing, you know Yeah, yeah, definitely. I also rank black beard so highly just because Even outside of his status as a historical character in the AC context he is also a good character in the context of the game's narrative and The the sort of friendship between him and Edward is really well conveyed and his death in the story is Probably one of the more effective and emotional, you know death scenes in an assassin's creed game period Like pretty much it's that one and the hanging of Ezio's Brothers and father that that like actually got an emotional response of like hey, fuck you game. I'm sad about this You weren't sad about Soma Who Soma that was Okay, that was such a Freaking cheesy death. I'm like, okay, if you're gonna kill a character don't freaking copy a fucking death Yeah, also the fact that like I'm sure that they just thought they were like referencing or pang on Yeah, but like doesn't Hanwall dies too, right? Yeah, but very very very unceremoniously Like he dies in the background. It's kind of weird to be like a great two characters died at the same Nish time and like feel bad about it now Hmm. Yeah, but again because of the game is a hundred hours long You forgot who those people were by the time, but you definitely did you definitely did have interactions with Hanwall the way Recently then you would have Soma because Soma was like the first arc that is true or one of the first arcs I mean like I love Valhalla man, but I don't know that that moment just just got me Kind of like no, it's meant to be epic, but it's not. Yeah anti-climactic Anyway, besides shitting on Valhalla, let me ask you Tim since since we're over here on team Blackbeard Yeah, who would you say is your favorite historical character in Assassin's Creed? So my answer is gonna be a little more underwhelming could just kind of be like a recency thing But I gotta go with Napoleon. Oh, yeah, that is a bad answer because why on Napoleon is not in the game very much I feel like he's very well acted His opening scene is very good. I feel like he's represented pretty well But it's not like he's super in-depth and like a main part of the story like Blackbeard is So I'm not saying that Napoleon is like a better representation of a historical figure than Blackbeard is But no, it's just your opinion. I do like Napoleon what we get of him Yeah, I think I could like Napoleon better if it weren't for dead Kings, right? I agree with you. He also pops up in some co-admissions, but it's not like he It's not like he's it's like it's like a fucking rendered cutscene anyway. Go ahead Right. Yeah, no exactly like if I thought of Napoleon is like, oh, you know He's this politician or you know military figure He's doing what he's doing in France at the time and he just has this sort of brief Intersection with Arnaud and they their interest kind of line up for this just this sort of one sequence really I Could appreciate that as like a slightly more novel use of a historical character in the Assassin's Creed canon, right? But yeah, once dead Kings enters the picture and he's supposed to be a more substantial character But he's kind of just doing some villain shit. It seems like and he's a little more cartoonish. He's a little less interesting I mean Arnaud suffers the same fate of like getting progressively less interesting as the story goes on Yeah, it's fitting makes sense for unity, but damn I just yeah, I can't I can't love Napoleon that much I'm definitely not like you do a lot. I'm not I'm not including dead Kings into like my Napoleon enjoyment Okay, and it's not it's not like I have like a Napoleon poster on my wall or anything I just think of all the you know who does is it Greg. Sorry no Who my my twin sister's husband is a straight-up Napoleon fanatic nice, okay, like he just fucking loves Napoleon I'm surprised that never came up in conversation Yeah, I well, you know, it's funny cuz I was when I was doing my replay of unity for the podcast most recently I was like playing who's like, oh, what are you playing? I was like This is Assassin's Creed. This one has Napoleon in it and I expected him to be like what there's Napoleon in the game That's so cool. And so he's kind of like yeah, and I was like, don't you fucking love Napoleon, bro But he does he really does he just doesn't like Assassin's Creed Napoleon's also an interesting example because it's kind of like Leonardo da Vinci where they utilized him and And and similar to Leonardo before they've reached like peak fame Leonardo da Vinci was not a household name while Ezio was hanging out with him and Napoleon had not reached the Amount of notoriety that he would have come to have when Arno meets him And I think that makes these characters easier to characterize Because like let's say if you did Genghis Khan, right you would have to utilize him during his reign Or rather if you did Genghis Khan during his reign You would you would kind of be obligated to showcase that part of the character Whereas if you do the if you do them before they're Completely relevant and like what put them on the map as as an historical figure that we know about for years You can make them into a person more I feel like and then you can have the Obligation later on of making Leonardo the person that makes these War machines and that makes a tank and stuff. You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah, I agree with Tim because like Napoleon is this figure in the French Revolution that's Gaining advantage like dude, right the guy was a freaking failure up until the French Revolution That's when he started like, you know gaining favors and doing his political games and stuff to Gain attraction. I'm actually like researching Napoleon right now. He's like one of the next threads At the time that you see him he is like an equal to Arno, right? Not in Dead Kings, but in the palace when you see him He he is an equal to Arno and he's like trying to find answers to and I Appreciate that like when we find him in the middle of making a name for himself But yeah, like he's a very Complex kind of character. He's more bourgeoisie He's just trying to gain his spot in history when you see him But in Dead Kings that is put like a little too much But his connection to Egypt is so freaking amazing because as we know It's because of Napoleon that we know shit about like AC origins like about Egypt Yeah, that's a good point. Yeah, the other thing This is just sort of stream of consciousness. I appreciate that Napoleon is one of the few historical characters I can think of off the top of my head right now who we popularly tend to know what he looked like like We've all seen paintings and portraits of Napoleon. And so when you see him in the game, you're like damn That seems like what Napoleon probably could have looked like yeah And I don't know what Leonardo da Vinci look like. I don't know what Blackbeard look like. Yeah, that's a good point Yeah, because the the most popular Leonardo da Vinci paintings. I believe are when he's old and bearded And so when we see young Leonardo It's in that I think also helps us separate from like the icon that we know to this character in this game Because you look so different. Yeah, and it's also a cultural thing because like I'm sure if I googled I could find Pictures or portraits of like, you know, some of syndicates historical characters It's just that I feel like Napoleon has that cultural impact where yeah, we've all seen the paintings We've always just know what Napoleon for sure like, you know, but it's funny You say that though because while like I agree with you and I'm sure most people when they still felt the need to in the In the unity like story trailer when Napoleon pops up to dub in Arno saying Napoleon Because people wouldn't know otherwise Yeah, I think they have to do that anyway, you know, like maybe even if everyone knew what Napoleon looked like They'd probably still have to call him out by name just to get the point across. Yeah, perhaps They're not all about subtlety in these trailers There was this one trailer of of AC unity where Napoleon confronts Arno is like he he puts a gun at him and then he's like And I'm like damn. This is so cool Oh It's a great it's a great scene. Oh, yeah, it is a great scene and to be honest with you That's what got me to buy AC unity really that Plus the fact that it was co-op, but like okay with historical figures You don't get a lot of historical figures in unity. You get Mirabeau Robespierre Robespierre and like, you know the monarchy basically I'm only learning right now that Mirabeau was a real person. Oh, yeah Oh, yeah, it was a real person dude. Yeah, that's cool Yeah, Mirabeau was like a low-key like historical figure though hence why assassin Marquis de Sade is a sort of figure too Oh Marquis de Sade is a good one I think I did a threat about him a while back ago He was an important figure in the French Revolution, but like I don't know how AC Got him in there, but he's like very quirky and stuff. So I don't know why But I definitely knew about Marquis de Sade before Unity came out not for anything to do with the French Revolution But purely as the origin point for the concept of sadism. Oh, they didn't know that. Yeah Yeah, like the idea like the word sadism being sadistic actually comes from Marquis de Sade I believe yeah 100% 100% Yeah, because he literally just liked to get off on torturing people. He probably had sex with underage people He basically originated like BDSM in a way. He's a really influential person Yeah, I think a word as popular as sadism is pretty, I know Erotically influential He's he's the sexual grandfather of many a leather daddy I mean you see him right in the middle of a cafe dressed dressing like this like dude Can we talk about how deep that fucking V is? Oh my god Yeah, it's the deepest V I've ever seen that shit has passed his belly button. Exactly. That is fashion icon status right there I wish I was brave enough to wear a V that deep. It's the same. Oh Arno Darling Yeah, it bothers me how all those characters in unity have like perfectly white and teeth It's like that wouldn't be the case. Yeah, it's even worse in syndicate because we know the British. They're really a verse to dental hygiene and Like that like fucking Victorian London everyone has model white teeth. What's going on with that? They had toothpaste, okay? Where are the people who cry about historical accuracy because there are female gang members in syndicate? Why aren't they talking about the teeth speaking of teeth? Isn't it really funny how? There are certain sort of figures where they just they're pretty respectful with and like Napoleon some people might think he's a terrible Dude, but you know, he's not played evil and worry where he shows up But then you have people like Rodrigo Borgia who are just the worst people in history Both in the game and in like I guess in real life It's funny how it's like there's certain people where it's acceptable to Like represent them as he's like mustache twirling dudes Like there was that Netflix show about the Borges, which I'm sure what didn't paint them in a in a positive light or anything But uh, yeah, oh, I love that show. I haven't seen it. Is it good Borges Alan rookie himself. Yeah, it is really Yeah, yeah, that was like one of my favorite TV shows like I was hooked on it It's also partly because I took a Renaissance glass back then so it was great It is it is interesting when you can see when they choose for Assassin's Creed a really, you know Well-known historical figure and you can kind of compare them to different, you know iterations because it'll be fun Like if my family watches like the Borges, which they did at some point or like Medici I think they watched black sails shit like that My sister and I will kind of compare and contrast like she'll talk about oh, yeah You know Chezz Ray and Lucretia and shit like that and I'll be like, oh, yeah They were horny for each other in Assassin's Creed brotherhood. It's like I think it's cool that they these different media franchises all take Different approaches to the same characters But there are things that they are that they have in common that they're united by the same historical basis and you get to Have that. Yeah, sure. Yeah. Yeah, I mean when Chezz Ray and Lucretia were like, you know romantically involved in stuff That's like rumors because the Borges were bad. So people got like rumors about them I don't think it would be like factual to to Say so but it is commonly understood that way interesting. Yeah, which is which is why in Brotherhood when you see that yeah, it was rumors and stuff But in real life Lucretia was actually was a really really awesome figure I thought you're about to say in real life, but that's it was really really ugly. No, no What do you mean by awesome in this case? She she grew up in the power hungry family when all she wanted was like normal life AC wiki and I when we collaborated we covered all the women of Assassin's Creed Yeah, and we included Lucretia in there, too when I say she was an awesome figure like I what I remember from What I read is that at the end of her life She married into a family and like lived happily ever after outside of Rome not dealing with her family's bullshit So she kind of fled the the family so to speak. Yeah in brotherhood She's portrayed as this like villain type of sorts, but she's only a villain because her brother is a huge douchebag So which Chesray was a huge douchebag Yeah, do you like Chesray as a character in Brotherhood because he's he's kind of one of those historical Characters that I feel like I don't I don't like him very much I don't think he's a well-written character, but does he feel like accurate to history and stuff I haven't researched about him. I just know that that he was a difficult brother to deal with I'm sure he gave her a lot of difficulties if you know what I mean But I will neither confirm or deny that but But he's viewed as this annoying Antagonist and he just kept yelling and yelling and yelling. It's like, oh, no man can murder me. I'm like fuck you. Here you go Drop the ledge like Thing man Chesra is the most annoying assassin's creed figure that I know of Next to Socrates because Socrates just questioned me a lot. I'm like just let me live my life. Hold me Just fuck off Socrates. I get I mean it's I felt like he was written kind of funny Like I I saw what they were going for with Socrates and I appreciated it of just like that one dude Who's like he's kind of a well-actually type person. He's kind of like a Always annoying you with philosophical questions and I I enjoy that He he gets to be exactly as good as any character historical character in Odyssey is allowed to be in the in the sense that Any character in Odyssey is only there to like motivate a quest So they don't get to actually be part of the story very much so they kind of all have to be pretty thinly drawn because they're just gonna make you go do something and That's true for alchemy oddies and and or alcibiades. I guess is how that's pronounced You know, yeah, well pretty much all of them the only person I remember in a Sanskrit Odyssey is Socrates because like While he was annoying to listen to because you know, that's how you know Philosophical Conversations are sometimes he was like a fun person to be around and he was also like this figure where I was taking a Greek class a Greek history class back then and Reading Plato's the Republic and I was also Playing a sassus great Odyssey at the same time. So it became kind of like a shared experience for me, which I Appreciate it. Yeah, I totally get that and I feel like there are a lot of similarities between the historical characters in the syndicate and in Odyssey Both of the you know, Quebec games because I feel like there are like various different camps that historical characters can be in One I call the Darby camp. So between, you know revelations with like Suleiman is a great example and AC4 and even to some extent Valhalla those historical characters are Characters first and foremost, you know Ivar is playing a role in the story that he's got a personality That's based on presumably some some research But it's not like he's just there to be one-dimensional and do whatever it is that Ivar is famous for doing I really don't know because I've never looked into it So we'll call that the Darby camp and that's where you get your blackbeards and that's that's kind of the best place to be then you have what I would consider the shitty camp which is where you have games like AC3 and and Unity where the characters are there, but they're not they're not even really characters or particularly historically Distinct or anything. Let me let me rephrase that. It's not like George Washington in AC3 is a very distinct character You know what I mean? Like he's hard to describe all of those historical characters in AC3 like we just like we said They're kind of wax figures. They're really boring. They they are pretty much interchangeable with each other They are not great and then I think there's the Quebec ones where those characters are distinct They are notably different from each other, but they're also just meant to be doing Exactly, whatever is the one thing that person was famous for if it's Alexander Graham Bell He's inventing things if it's if it's Darwin. He's doing science if it's Marx He's liberating people, you know if it's Socrates his philosophizing They just find the one thing that person's famous for doing and they use that as a as a way to generate quests for you to do So those are I feel like the three approaches that AC has taken I do agree with you that there is a Darby camp the way Darby writes the historical characters is Like if they're actually right there with you Yeah, like even Prince Solomon when he was like just a kid You get to see his wisdom playing out and yeah, and you get to see how he's gonna become a great leader But you don't see the great. Yeah leader himself and I and I appreciate that revelations was like a great AC game But like I also feel like when you said AC 3 and what else did you say AC 3 and I think Unity largely falls into that camp for the few historical characters it does have like I don't think Napoleon Is particularly distinct as a character or or has much to do. You know what I mean? Yeah, like games like AC 3 and unity and stuff with George Washington when I researched what like Washington did to the to the to the Indian tribe and When I saw like, you know that Haytham Connor and and Washington's scene where he wrote a letter To purge like the Indian camp That was actually, you know factually real Wow, you get to see like these historical events happening But like as characters, I didn't feel you know as drawn to George Washington as I was to like black flag characters or even like even like Valhalla characters because Valhalla characters Notably Alfred. Yeah, you get to see Alfred not not at his peak but like, you know going up the ladder and You get to see his like, you know calm figure that was portrayed in The Last Kingdom as well Yeah, and from what I researched about Alfred yet He would be that that type of character like that ending scene with yeah Avor and Alfred I'm like, oh, what an amazing scene, but like no battle of Eddington and I was disappointed with with not seeing like the battle of Eddington because that Will get in the DLC. Don't worry. Oh, yeah for sure It's gonna be in Ireland. I think Tim was in England. I don't know how it's gonna freaking mash up together I don't explain it to us Darby. Oh Yeah, it's just like they're all at different camps, but at the end of the day When I when I researched historical characters I am like very surprised to see like, you know these little bits of Accuracies that are in the games because I don't know. It just gives me like a like chills, you know, like oh man Yeah It's important for me to clarify That when I divide into those like three sort of camps basically those three kinds of ways that they handle things It's less about historical accuracy. I think from from what I can tell every Assassin's Creed Historical character has been at least pretty much well researched Yeah, there's something I think is worth pointing out when it comes to like historical figures in in these games and most Most recently too. I think AC one is a good isn't as interesting as able for two reasons one AC one has a good amount of historical figures You I just don't think you notice it for one reason because they're not as famous and Obviously, everyone knows who Leonardo da Vinci is a lot of people are gonna know who Borja is so I think that's one part of why AC one is a little more subtle with their historical figures But also there's something to keep in mind with how I see one handles it because all of the historical figures in that game Are also your targets Whereas an AC to and pretty much every game beyond that you have historical figures who are both ally Targets other characters who you bump into and so AC one is kind of this unique example in that You don't have historical figures who are at Masia with you or anything You're only killing them and then your target right and so that that it's funny You bring that up because I was just thinking to myself Where which which are the three camps in which I would place even AC two and that's challenging because on one hand we love, you know Leonardo da Vinci and Actually, I think a lot of those Like the Patsy and the Medici they are all pretty well realized characters Like I would say maybe it's closer to the Darby camp. I agree. Definitely. Yes. There is I think Leonardo da Vinci I'm gonna say this. I know it's gonna be controversial. I Don't think he's a great character. Yeah, I agree. He's just kind of the tech guy, you know He's like Q or whatever. He's he's a guy who gives you tech and upgrades And you have this friendship with him that I feel like is is powerful because of how it's established as Like Leonardo da Vinci essentially gets to be one of the only characters in the story accepting say Ezio's sister who knew Ezio before shit hit the fan. That's Interesting like Leonardo when when Ezio goes to him for the first time after shit hits the fan and he's an assassin now Leonardo has this like knowing like, you know relationship of I I knew this kid when he was still a Kid and now he's become a man because Life has forced up on it. So like there's there's depth there There is it's more than just like hey It's Leonardo da Vinci doing the thing that Leonardo is famous for but that is still most of it like on the surface they have Da Vinci and he does drawings and tech and The things that we all know about Leonardo, you know what I mean? So he's kind of a quip back camp character But he's a he's like a friend to Ezio, but I would say based on based on the friendship element and All of the other historical characters in ac2. I say we can count ac2 in the Darby camp No, you know on the level definitely a style of inclusion. Yeah, you know, I know Darby didn't write ac2 Yeah, it's also interesting because given how how with ac1 all of them are like people you're ultimately going to kill It means that the only interactions you have with them are pretty much in their last words And so they don't have they don't have a lot of option to become a character So I don't really think of them as characters exactly sure. Yeah, and but I I feel like that's intentional Yeah, yeah, I can't hold that against them. I know it's part of the yeah Yeah, yeah, and I'm not saying you're like downgrading it for that reason I just think like it is an interesting approach compared to ac2 where it's like here is your companion Leonardo da Vinci, you know what I mean? Yeah, it's true I don't know if ac1 fits into either any of the three camps But that may be by virtue of it not really technically having Historical characters in the way that we're talking about. Yeah, like it doesn't qualify almost the only historical figure I remember in Assassin's Creed one are Al Mualim and Richard the Lionheart I think as the games went along it became more and more Advantages to them to make some of these historical figures your your friends and allies and not so much like Not all the time people that you're killing or whatever. Yeah, and that also kind of brings in like I wish that they were more Historical figures that like were actual assassins kind of like Machiavelli Yeah, yeah, I feel like a lot of historical figures just kind of are in the middle and while that's fine It would it would be neat if some of them were actually assassins and you can you can utilize that in some way That's why I was surprised that Mirabeau was real because I felt like right if he was real It was a it was a baller move to just say yeah, he was in charge of the assassins Yeah, no, I think you're completely right about that I would love to see more of that in like ac2 and I think I think also ac brotherhood remember those Shawn videos that that came up. Yeah, mm-hmm like Explaining who they are as a person and then yeah seeing they're very useful. Yeah, and then seeing their bad side Man that that got me to like, you know, actually want to kill them because they're freaking bad Yeah, I've never wanted to kill anyone more than I wanted to kill uberto alberte. Oh fuck man Uberto man piece of shit. Yeah One of those days. It's a good idea. I'm gonna like Make videos that are like that because those videos were so cool, man. It's like uberto alberte I don't think I watched any of those videos. Where did where were these they're they're in the database And if you click on the figure like you have to go to the conspiracy tree I think and if you click on one of them and Sean will have it like a pre-made video about them I'm pretty sure it's in the conspiracy tree, but maybe not but it's somewhere the database I never ever knew that because I always kind of ignored the database That's another thing about the database though is a kind of because there's not one in AC one and What not? I feel like you can miss some of the people who were actually in real life Yeah, but when it comes to the database and all the other games you could read their little excerpt And it's like this person was a lemon stand operator Then they became a Templar. Yeah, and they became an evil Templar who poisoned the entire town with their lemons Yeah, it's kind of like those hitman kind of intro videos that explains who the person is before you assassinate them Like oh man, it was so cool. I will I will look into that next time I play that game Which will be never and I hope it's a long time from now because I don't want to do it again because that's not it very recently, but Anyway, you know what I was gonna ask this earlier I wanted to know what everyone's least favorite historical character is Charles Lee I can't say that about Charles Lee personally like I I actually think he's kind of a fun villain Charles Lee, I haven't researched into him, but but where is he? Like like where is Charles? What do you mean? I mean, where is oh, okay? Good Where is Charles Lee? Who is Charles Lee? Yeah, where is Charles Lee in history, man? Like you definitely got to make a clip out of that He's somewhere in the American Revolution But he's not like he's not like an important kind of figure to like focus on Hey, is Christopher Guest a real life historical person? Oh, yeah, dude. Yeah, yeah, then him. Yeah, it's me Christopher Guest I'm so excited to be doing Templar things Rogue had like so little characters. They even had Benjamin Franklin in there. Yeah, which was awesome Yeah, I mean yeah, Rogue did not have a whole hell of a lot of real people in it, which is interesting It's sort of an outlier in that sense. I don't know if I have like the least favorite Assassin's Creed character. I'm trying to think of one because I know Blue said it was Cleopatra because of you know, some of the same things you were talking about I'm I'm trying to think of what my least favorite historical I mean, well if Christopher Guest is Israel then and he is that's easily the answer I think he's the worst one. I'm trying to think if there's any other honorable mentions though for really shitty ones Can we do honorable mentions for really good ones too? Yeah, let's do it What do you got and why is it Steve Bonnet? Well, of course it's Steve Bonnet Oh, wait, hold on before we do that before we do that I Wanted to mention this I I think I've said this on an episode before but I had no idea that Steve Bonnet was even a Real person until that Taika watiti project. Yeah, I Was like hey Tim Taika Is making a TV show about Steve Bonnet and I I feel like for in your head for at least like 10 seconds You thought that Taika was gonna make the most asinine Assassin's Creed spinoff possible Yeah, because because like I just and then I was like well why he was it he was such a great character I had no idea he was a real person. I meant like 22 22-page thread about him before Taika watiti announced that Yeah, but I don't follow you on Twitter. Oh, yeah, you do Yeah, I do you caught me you caught me Imagine if you're not following a guy you're freaking who's a guest that's gonna happen when we get Leo K on he refuses to follow us Man Leo is freaking amazing man His his stealth videos are the level of stealth I aspire to get We also have to give credit words to Jaysers Hobbs zero one is some good stuff videos to you. Oh, yeah. Yeah, Jay sirs is a good stealth boy and Travizo is a good stealth boy to good stealth people I guess I shouldn't say Jaysers Hobbs zero one eight because it's just Jaysers now It is just Jaysers now. He dropped the the it's cleaner dropped the habs. It's cleaner Drop the habs. It's cleaner It's cleaner. All right, so our shock. What are what are some honorable mentions some some favorite highlights? historical characters for you first one is Caterina's Forza She is actually like it goes blackbeard then Caterina's Forza for me Interesting because man, she was portrayed so well in in in Assassin's Creed 2 as like a woman that can hold her own Yeah, she's strong. She's she's a good leader. Yeah, brotherhood. She just fucks at you and that's it Oh Yeah, brotherhood, she's kind of reduced to a sexy bathtub scene and that's about a damsel in distress But the fuck you be soft, but but that was real though. That was real. She was she was like taken to you know What else is real? You know what else is real? misogyny Especially you be soft, but especially yeah You know what else is real Caterina how to turn him down to end up with Sofia later, you know, so that's good God, I love Sofia. It's a Sofia real. No, Sofia is Oh Sofia's a fictional character brilliantly made by by dark Why I just wanted to know I don't I don't know if anyone's real. I've learned about Mirabeau Christopher Gist You can tell me Arno was real and I believe you right now Dude when Arno was first revealed and his name was Dorian. I'm like, oh my god Are we gonna play in a French Armenian assassin? But no, it was just Dorian He was an Armenian because our men used tend to have the I a n in the end our nodorian is It's like literally one of the coolest names ever. It was a pretty cool name. Yeah Hello, my name is on a door. Yeah, I'd say an honorable mention for myself would be Lorenzo Medici You know, and there's a fun connection because he fell into the river Arno as little boy Yes, I just wanted to add something to the to the listeners to Caterina the fortress she's imprisoned in in AC Brotherhood a few years back She was holding that fortress by herself To secure her husband's name who who died later on and she had to secure for Lee Which is where she meets at CEO. Damn. That's pretty cool. That is that is some Historical accuracy for for you guys Any any other honorable mentions? Oh, you didn't say yours. Oh Let me think I have one more after you go. I mean, I think I did say Steve Bonnet but If you said Steve Bonnet, I'm gonna add one more pirate in there and Bonnie and Bonnie is great You know what? No, here's my answer my favorite or my honorable mention because my favorite is Blackbeard I I think Mary Reed is a great character. Yeah, and Bonnie and Mary Reed man forever I I freaking love those women. It's crazy because a Satan's Creed has has so many strong women in There in their games and they're yet to have like one Female character that has the story. I'm like, come on assassin's Creed You have you have the examples right there. Just give us a great single female protagonist hundred percent. Yeah, Tim Did you have another honorable mention? Yeah, I'm just gonna Francesco Vigelio is technically he is he's a Somewhat famous Italian painter and it's kind of interesting because He's an assassin like before he ever even like painted anything and it's interesting because he kind of limit He kind of is just like lamenting about how it one day He'll settle down and start painting but for now he has to keep doing assassin stuff and I think that's a that's kind of a classic way to do a historical figure in AC because You get them while they're young and can run around and kill people and then they paint when they're older The other thing I thought was fun is Even though conspiracies overall is pretty dreck. I like that Tesla is implied to have like faked his death And so he's like seen as an older man in conspiracies. Yeah, and I thought that was a creative thing to do I like seeing yeah Yeah, more stuff like that would be cool. Yeah for sure Because really leaning into the alternate history part of Assassin's Creed and allowing yourself to write a Story for a character that maybe doesn't line up with fact Exactly, or yeah, or like if yeah, like exactly like if because with the pieces of it and things like that like For instance, you know the assassins and Templars are pretty much hidden from history. So hey, you know Pythagoras is another example of that. Oh, yeah. Yeah, it was a real person who he's like a mortal in the game It was like 150 years old in Odyssey through the use of a staff cool What I found like really amazing About Odyssey is its connection to a Assassin's Creed brotherhood in the Da Vinci disappearance they actually talk about Pythagoras is like Sketches of like Isu artifacts and stuff and I'm like, holy shit. Yeah, and in AC Odyssey They they show him to be like, you know this Staff bearer and yeah, like like I love that connection Between it and it it finally made sense in my brain why Pythagoras would be over there Yeah, that makes that's pretty cool. I forgot about that part of the Da Vinci disappearance Which is a great DLC. I guess overall what we what what have we learned? Well, I think we've solidified my three camps of historical characters theory with Darby tear being the best Quebec tear being acceptable and then shitty tier being shitty and It seems like even when they're not the best characters. They are still doing their due diligence with historical research I think there is some credit due to Ubisoft and the developers of these games that When we do have complaints and criticisms and characters we like better than other characters It's almost entirely on a basis of the story and the character writing not on a basis of like How historically accurate they were or how, you know, they try to implement that which I I really really appreciate of them because you know, it takes yeah, it takes a lot to have a story and then be historical accurate to like, you know history itself and In every a AC game, you know, that's what makes my job So fun to like yeah research because you know during my research like I'm I'm researching those those figures and Landmarks and stuff and I'm highlighting freaking websites My favorite part comes when I am drawing the similarities and the differences between AC and the real life history Well, it has been awesome to have you on and talk more about these historical characters So thank you so much for joining us our shock dude. Dude. It's a real real pleasure thing Like thank you guys for having me like this was so so much fun Where can people find you if they want to hear more and read more about your research people can find me YouTube as AC landmarks AC space landmarks and then on Twitter Mostly on Twitter right now Like later on YouTube once I'm more settled on Twitter. It's AC underscore Landmarks. Yeah, that's where people can find me and if you want to follow my personal profile. It's Arshok official ARSH OCK official. Yeah, definitely check his stuff out. It is really high quality and highly Well-informed content if you want to find us you can find us on Twitter at hookblade. Give us give us a cute little follow over there you can Find us on Facebook at the hookblade podcast if you're not listening to this on YouTube Please pop over to our YouTube channel and subscribe to us there We are you know the hookblade podcast those are just some of the ways you can support us besides Liking commenting leaving a review on your podcast platform of choice Thank you so much for listening and it's it's been a pleasure. It's been a fun episode. It's been a pleasure. I Have been the hook and I've been the blade and I've been the database. Thank you for listening. Hey, you switched it Change it You got to be a lot of those you were the historian at the beginning. Well the database historian, you don't get two in one episode the database historian For your next one. All right, and we will see you next time