 Welcome to the Jenkins documentation office hours. This is the US edition here on December 15th. Today, right now, we have myself, Mark White and Bruno Verrachtin joining us. Thank you for joining us. On the agenda today, we have some action items. We are looking to focus on a couple different topics going into the new year and some blog posts that just came out. We have a lot of ideas and discussion topics for the December newsletter. This is going to be a recap of Jenkins over the last year. So we want to make sure that we highlight as much and as many great things that we were that were accomplished this year as we can. Several different topics and we have some a lot of ideas already for what we can include. So we want to have a bigger discussion with the community at large and see what other people are thinking of or what they might want to see. It goes from everything from platform modernization itself all the way to the advocacy outreach sponsors. Every facet of Jenkins is something that we want to highlight in this case. Then last few items we have on the list here, we do have another LTS coming up that's going to be released in January on the 11th. There's going to be a break due to the holidays at the end of the month. So a little bit of delay there, but just yesterday the RC release candidate has been shared. It's ready to test. It's good to go. We have the back porting ticket ready and all set and taken care of as well. So a lot of progress has been made there. The change log and upgrade guide pull request has also been submitted. So we're just trying to get ahead of everything and make sure that that's ready to go come time to release. There's been some talk about the Pipeline Docker plugin and where it stands in terms of its place within Jenkins and what that means for Jenkins and its extended community of users. There will be lots to discuss on that at a later point in time, but that is something that we're working on. Then finally, just the couple blog posts or another pull request that we've had come up recently, they're really interesting and like to have discussion around since they do address a couple of things that impact Jenkins as a whole. So anything that I might have missed or anything else that anyone wants to add to the agenda today? Nothing for me. Thanks. Neither for me. Thank you. Cool. All right. Thank you very much. So first things first on the action items. Right now we are working on a project to go through any of the tickets that have been created in JIRA in the website category. These are issues that were submitted regarding the Jenkins site documentation, other parts of it like that. However, they are for the most part older and potentially have been actioned on since even though the initial ticket might not have been updated. So right now what we're doing is we've out Friday, so we've created a GitHub ticket for that to go through and review. Mark and I have been going through the list of remaining issues, finding out what can be closed, what doesn't need to be there, what still might be relevant and what we can do to move that migrated into the GitHub so that we can track everything properly, get the progress going and make that information just steadily available and where it should be. That'll also help us focus everything into one place as opposed to being split between JIRA and GitHub. So benefits all around. There's been an item to archive the doc mailing list and switch over to community.jankins.io for the doc sig mailing list. That is something that we'll be taking on probably in January, just due to we're approaching the end of the year, end of the month. The holidays are going to include time off for a lot of folks around here, but that's something that we'll work together on as I'm taking over for Mark for documentation officer for Jenkins. We'll be working together to get to that point and once we have that going, we'll be able to provide some more information. Of course, Mark wanted to add that there was only 70 issues remain on the website project, so we've been able to close out a lot. I think I at least looked through 100 or something and I know Mark had looked through more, so we've done a lot of work on that already, even though it's only been a couple of weeks, which is great. And then we had a few blog posts that were published recently. One, the first one here is regarding the Google Summer of Code Mentorship, and this was written by Jean-Marc Messon, and just goes over the idea of being a mentor for Google Summer of Code and other projects and programs that we work with. She go to Africa, Riji, stuff like October Fest. Being a mentor is really, really important and helps push these along. You get to feel like you're contributing, helping people. You get to flex your knowledge if you are a mentor, and it's not a full-time commitment. It's a smaller commitment that we're looking for, not talking full-day dedication or anything like that. You can see here, we've got about five to eight hours per week, and that's doable for a lot of folks. But for mentorship, it's a really crucial part of all the projects that we work in, and we want to make sure that we can share that with people, potential mentors, existing users that maybe have not thought about this sort of thing before, and new users that are getting into Jenkins and contributing a lot. Recently, especially, we've got new release leads, and there's a lot of people joining up, and with October Fest now coming gone, we've had a ton of new contributors that may be interested. So definitely share this out as much as you possibly can. Make sure that if anything comes up, let people know that this sort of information exists, and that it's something that we'll always be here to help with, whether it's questions, additional mentorship, or otherwise. The next blog post that I want to mention here is Damian DePortal has recently created a blog post and alert, essentially, for this coming Sunday, December 18th. Jenkins will have an interruption and will have some downtime for Jenkins contributors and actually running things in Jenkins. Users of Jenkins won't be affected in the same way, but JFrog, who we want to thank as a continuing sponsor of Jenkins, wants to perform some maintenance just to make sure that everything's working properly for Artifactory. This will look like six hours of downtime between, I think it's 11 a.m. Israel? Yeah, so that's 9 a.m. UTC till 15, so what's that? Till 3 p.m. UTC is the time range, Sunday morning. And also the Jenkins infrastructure status page will also be updated with that downtime window. So click that link, Kevin, so we've got it in the, there we go. Notice that it says, hey, here's the status, and as that outage resolves, this page will be updated to show what the resolution time was. Perfect, great. Is there any other place that this might be relevant to? I know we have the community thread also talking about it, and we were talking earlier about making sure that the tweets and other notices are set up. Is there any other communication or avenue that we need to be aware of on that, Mark? The advocacy SIG meeting earlier today recommended two additional places, the Jenkins CI GitHub organization and the Jenkins Infra GitHub organization. And I submitted pull requests to those two. So if they're merged, then those pages will be updated as well. And if they're merged tomorrow, that's already Friday before it, before the Sunday of the outage, so that's quite good. Definitely. Thank you so much, Mark. Really appreciate that. And following that, we did publish our November newsletter just a couple weeks ago or on December 5th. So just again, our monthly newsletter highlighting November for Jenkins, a lot of the governance updates. We had our elections, security updates, infrastructure updates. Again, standard of what our newsletter is now meant for. And again, this is a little bit less than what the year-end recap will be. It's going to be a massive post comparatively, but a lot of wonderful updates, a lot of great information. And once again, just a wonderful way to highlight our community, our users, and anyone that is part of the Jenkins project. So now Bruno, I guess I do have a question for you. Really? Usually you've been the one who's kindly converted the Google Doc into an ASCII Doc format. Oh, yes. But this next one is going to be sort of mega monster. Are you still OK doing that? Yeah, of course. I will do my best. And of course, each time, I think it's just about perfect. And then the review begins and so many people point a finger at all the mistakes I make, but that's perfectly fine with me. It's community effort and I feel like everyone is putting it together. So it's it's not everyone Bruno, not just you, but yeah. And and as an aside on that too, for the December newsletter, since there's going to be so much and since we want to make sure that a lot of these, if not all of these topics are at least mentioned, highlighted to some degree, I'm going to be looking through it very carefully myself and reviewing it along with Mark to make sure that everything is good to go on that one. So ideally, you won't have to worry about as much of that in this case, since I'll be helping you out and working on it as well. And for me, it's a lot of making sure like it's it's what I want to do is make sure that these topics are put on there. So if, you know, if Damien provides a platform update or, you know, I'm providing the documentation update, there's a lot of different things that could be in different places, topics that might, you know, be coinciding with other topics or other ideas. But at the end of the day, we just want to make sure that things sorted properly and connected and make sense. And, you know, more importantly, highlights what we've been able to do in Jenkins over the last year. So and again, again, like this is a big one. There's a lot of information that's going to be there. So this is pretty much one of my main focuses for the next week or so. And, you know, and obviously we might not have it published before the end of the month because it's a monthly yearly recap. So that might come in January, that'll come in January. But between now and the publishing date, I'm here for anything that you need. And then the last blog post that we want to look at here is something that Basil Crow has just put together for us, which is really nice. But this is about the Jenkins plug-in development and that fact that we now require Java 11 as the minimum requirement for Jenkins. So this is to address concerns, issues, questions, any kind of general apprehension about it. Basil has done a really lovely job and put this together with charts, links, really good examples and logic and reasoning behind a lot of these changes and what's going on. This was just published a few minutes last hour, so very new to the blog. But it's very, very important in addressing some questions and concerns that folks have had over the last recently. Yeah. So could you go back to that graph, Kevin? Yeah, of course. That one, that one, that little thing on the right is a point of dramatic pride. Notice that the red line Java 11 is greater than the green line Java 8. So we have data that says that Jenkins users are in fact switching to Java 11. Now, if you look at the slope of the curve there, it's quite similar to the slope of the Java 8 adoption curve. So so it gives us good hope that we're going to see Java 11 adoption continue. Now, I'm even more excited by that Java 17 curve because that's a much steeper slope than previous next gen JDK adoption curves, right? When during the JDK 11 period, you see the early parts of the Java 11 thing, the slope of that curve is almost dismaying. It's so shallow, whereas that nice steep jump in Java 17 gives us good hope that, hey, in 12 months or whenever we we're ready to make even more progress on Java 17, great. So special thanks to Basel to so many others who did so much work to make this happen. Yeah, I was there in 2018, 2019 when the switch to Java 11 started. But I have the feeling that everybody in the core development team and in the infra team is pushing for the adoption of JDK 17. So I think it's a first in the history of Jenkins, maybe. Yeah, that's a good thing. We're almost not late. Right, which is dramatically better than past behaviors. Yeah, of course. And thanks, Kevin. Yeah, of course. Thank you, Mark, for all the additional contacts that really helps. And this is really great to see. And especially with I know the Java 17 adaption and so far it's been really, really reassuring and really giving us the results we're looking for, fixing a lot of things and making it easier. So that that last little curve, like you said, that steep gradient is really nice and safe. Great. So so now that we've gotten through the action items, just we can go over the some newsletter topics, ideas. Mark and I put this together recently, and it's been coming since Docs Office Hours as well last week. So this is just something that's going to be an ongoing project for the time being as we move towards creating it. But just looking through this, we have a lot of different topics. Platform modernization, user experience improvements, development, acceleration, website improvements, localization, simplification, our Jenkins Governance Board elections and officer elections, the origin advocacy that's been performed over the last year, security updates. We've had lots of those infrastructure changes and updates and sponsor contributions. These are very vast and cover a lot of ground. Is there anything that we could add to this list in terms of a general topic or air to highlight? Or if you notice anything that is already categorized here or listed, is there something you'd like to see for it specifically? Is there something that maybe looks related to something you had in mind and isn't there? We can add it. Yeah, I'm just curious to see what everyone else might think. And we have a lot of we also have a lot of content for almost all of these things. We've had blog posts about Java 11, Java 17. The system was a big change over earlier in this year. We have a blog post for and then the more general topic stuff like back and dependency in front and dependency updates, making sure that we're staying in the forefront of that. Yeah, no, I guess to make the to make the translation easier for Bruno. Bruno, is there any guidance you want to give in terms of how we lay out that Google Doc? So, for instance, I'm tempted, Kevin, if you jump up to the sort of the topmost on the required Java 11 support Java 17 and system demigration, I'm prone to embed links to more details into each of those saying, look here, is it OK if they're embedded as hyperlinks or does that make your experience doing the ASCII doc awful? No, that's fine. That's OK. Um, lists and embedded links is fine with me. OK, all right. So, so you that doesn't because I assume there will be a lot of that. If I'm writing this, I'm going to be bragging and pointing, right? Bragging and pointing, bragging and pointing. That's fine. OK, cool. Right. And thank you very much, Bruno. And since I'm typically working in ASCII Doc myself, I might just end up writing some versions that have the links and everything set up for you if I can. I'll do what I can to help you out, though, on that front. OK, thank you. But just to be OK. Yeah, either way. And yeah, and I think, and Mark, no, this is something I just thought of as far as all these items go when we when we point them out on the newsletter, should we look to keep it brief and keep it to a few sentences for each item since there's going to be a lot or in the case like obviously there where we have the blog post, we can link to it and share that and let that do a lot of the talking for us. But in the cases where that's not where that isn't possible. Yeah, so for me, I think brevity will be be useful here. I would assume even more important is that we want some intermixed images scattered throughout this thing so that people have the visual relief of breaking a breaking a large block of text with with pictures of something. So it may be a Java for the UX improvements. Those should be UI screenshots for. I was thinking for the Pipeline Steps documentation improvements, screenshots of the page for for some of the others. It may the vision presentation. I think, for instance, if CloudBees is willing to allow public access to the DevOps world recording, we should embed the link to that video or even better get their permission to put it on YouTube in the Jenkins account. So then it then it gets registered right in the page as a nice clickable clickable link. So those kind of things for me are are they they improve the chances that people will read it. The other piece, I guess, with something this long is we probably better start with a table of contents so that people can read the summary of, hey, here's this, this, this, this and now maybe another question. Do we have too many themes? So count could you help me with a quick count of the themes? Kevin, it looks like there's at least 12 or 15. Ten. Ten. OK, well, so and the guidelines, I think three, three to seven is typical list length that people tolerate. So maybe we ought to look to, I don't know, maybe we need to think more about should we combine some of these or or or remove them. OK, yeah. And I think stuff like elections can probably go into like outreach and advocacy, maybe. Or yeah. And some newsletter do a TLDR part, you know, with the main topics. And then they go in greater details. I think of the pine 64 newsletter that I read earlier this day. So maybe we could have. Less subjects in the first part, and then maybe do something bigger later on in the documentation. Just a suggestion, I'm not sure that would be a good idea, but so how does the TLDR concept in the pine newsletter work? So they do a one sentence series, a series of one sentence items? Or how does it work? No, it's a kind of summary. It's not let me find it for you. I think it would be more something like in twenty twenty two, Jenkins was able to do X, Y and Z and a big thanks to everyone that helped. Maybe like one or two other ideas that you want to share in that. And then everything would be just kind of formatted after the fact. At least I don't know how it works with pine news. Well, and I just know I've seen some TLDRs like that. So it's just a list and the rest of it is sentences, real sentences. But already you are working with lists. So yeah. Yeah. OK, so the so the TLDR for them is top level bullet, one level indentation, one level below that, no more. So it's a table of content. So it's it's basically what we've done is our outline is their TLDR. Oh, you're right. So I like that. Yeah, that makes life a lot easier if that's OK. Well, and then if we if we make those things clickable and have them jump to that section of the document. Now now it's not just the themes, but it's the themes plus the details of each theme. Right. So nice. OK. Yeah, I like that a lot personally. I think that would be a really good format. And especially where now you can just kind of list everything out as you're going through it. And it's OK that it's as long as it is because you've already got this here. You can jump to where you need to be if we set it up like that. Yeah. No, that's a that's a good I like it a lot personally. And yeah, it looks like it's really and it's super adaptable and putting the images and everything else won't throw anything off. Yeah, with how much we're looking to put on there might be worth. Check trying to know, yeah, for sure. Cool. That's great enough. Thank you very much for know. Love it. So cool. OK. Yeah, I know Mark and I have gone over this list a handful of times and we're looking for any other additional input ideas, stuff like that. Bruno, as far as the stuff that you've been working on, I know that you're leading some of the platform SIG meetings and stuff like that. Is there anything that you'd want to make sure is listed here or? Yeah, I'd love to. But I think I would have to discuss maybe with Damian about that. But I have a few subjects about Docker images for the agents and also alternative platforms like arm 32 arm 64. I think those kind of progress we made this year could or should appear in that section. But I have to discuss that with Damian because what I see is as important is maybe not seen as with from other people as important. It's just because of the kind of things I like, which is not the case for everybody. So we'll see. But yes, I have a few subjects to add if you don't mind. OK, perfect. Yeah. No, of course, that do whatever you need to do. Talk to Damian, you know, obviously figure out what you what you want to. But I mean, if we're going to do a TLDR, something like that, where we are listing out smaller ideas, I like we can include more. If that's the case, I don't want to overload it, obviously, and make it too, too big. But yeah, depending on how we get to that list, maybe maybe it's worth putting that in there. Maybe that's in the development acceleration. Maybe that's something else that we can highlight. I mean, that's a totally different subject that we don't even have here that we can talk about, you know, we find that. Yeah. But so so the the Docker ones that you were discussing, Bruno, I think are a good fit under the platform topic up above. They're they're clearly clearly platform modernization and platform platform enhancements, right? Docker images, new platform support and. Oh, actually, let's I get regularly reminded instead of the word Docker, let's use the word container. Yeah. Because Docker is a vendor of a container solution, but the things are containers. That's awesome. Thank you very much, Bruno. Yeah, that sounds great. I like, yeah, and I like the different perspectives and thought processes, because even if want to like mark or I don't think it's important, it might be very important to the people that are not, you know, able to say as much or aren't taking a minute to share that with us. So I think that's always very, very valuable to discuss and figure out and then, you know, at the very least find out, discuss, decide whether or not it is. So, yeah, thank you very much. You're welcome. We had we had some website improvements, like and that was thanks to a lot of the work in the summer of code projects. We had the secret after contribution contributions constantly, which were really great in helping us with revamping some of the screenshots and a lot of the inclusive naming stuff. They were also able to provide new examples and all sorts of testing, which was great. So a lot of that stuff's going to be there. And we have the blog post for that, so we can always link to that directly. As far as some of the website stuff goes, Mark, would would stuff like the web components fall under this too? I know Gavin was working a lot on not deployed yet. And I'm not sure we're going to get them deployed by by end of year. So OK, so they could be. But but actually, I was thinking we might successfully eliminate a well, no, not really sorry. No, I take it back. I was going to say we could can combine website improvements under Google Summer of Code, but that only works for one of the three items that are there. So that's a bad choice, right? And then we have the plug in health scoring, which is a totally different kind of idea from that, I guess. So right there, there were three other summer of code projects. So so putting website improvements there, we might find ways to scatter those improvements elsewhere so we can eliminate the website improvements theme, but let's keep thinking. OK, because yeah, that sounds good. Because I feel like these could also fit into like user experience improvements or something along those lines, because that does affect how people are using the Jenkins site itself. But yeah. And then Alex Brandes did a lot of work just kind of getting the crowd in peace going. I spent a lot of time at Docs Office hours earlier this year going through it, talking about it, just showing what is possible with it, which is really great. So I want to make sure that that is highlighted really a lot, obviously. And yeah. We can table that for right now. This document is always available. And so is Gitter, Matrix, any other chat channels that you want to throw an idea in please like message me or notice me, whatever it is, by all means so that we can add that in. And then we are a time couple of minutes. So just to kind of finish things up, again, we have the LTS 2.375.2 coming that will actually be released in January. But we have a lot of the pre-work done right now. So the change login upgrade guide, the release candidate, backporting, all of those things have been either submitted or merged already. So any reviews, any ideas on that much appreciated. And then there's been discussion about the pipeline docker plug-in. What that means for Jenkins, what that means for the documentation. It's a lot far more far reaching than initially thought. So there's going to be a lot of discussion that won't be something that gets resolved until January at the very earliest. But it is something that we are very, very mindful of and working on because this can affect a lot of people in different ways. And then finally, just a quick note that there was a pull request that Mark had made suggesting that board member rules can be modified a little bit right now. But there is five board members, one being Conasi Gay and then the rest are elected. If the if there are it's more than 50 percent of representation by a company. It's not allowed. So just discussing ways to work around that. Talk about ways to engage people and get them on the government as well. But something we can talk about later, no worries there. Anything else anyone wanted to discuss? Check in mention, if not, I think we're OK, we'll end things here. And the recording will be available in about 24 to 48 hours. And thank you so very much, as always, for joining us here. We will have a section next week. So we'll check in again before going on going on at my for a little bit, so.