 We're recording. There we are was Joe. All right, mate. Give me a number. We've got one three six ten or eleven Number one. Oh top of the shop. Oh, it's oh Oh, it's got an exciting name. It's a no-brainer Jeff. No brainer So that could mean one of two things. It's obviously a very easy simple decision or it's got absolutely not not my socks off Hard it says dry cloudy and sparkling hard cider Cloudy and sparkling. Hey, how can how can it be? How can it be? Let's give it a go on the Copswold cider company strong Doesn't why well taste and smell that strong nice noise. Can you hear it? Yeah? Look look look look look look look look look the fizz and here the fizz here the sparkle 4.8% We like them refreshing them. What's nice is yeah different kind of taste a bit more A bit more apples in that one the normal Yeah, but in a nice way this is great. It's very fizzy. I wouldn't say yes, but it's a bit cloudy, isn't it? It's nice there. It's got a bit of a floral floral taste to it as well Apples and flowers. What about you what you got? Well, I've got an interesting looking thing Look at this. I've gone for the packaging. Oh, you've been sucked in by this cartoon strip packaging. Yeah, it's a Amundsen brewery I've heard an everyday hero. It's a new world IPA. I'm not quite sure what new world IPA means Looking at the ingredients and from Amundsen I associate with Norway. So yeah, yeah, it's Norwegian Norwegian beer and It's very colorful So there's a full can Looks a pock apocalyptic almost. Hmm. We're very apt labels and things have very apt That was a taste Smooth light. Yeah, smooth very Almost lagery in a way. The hops are quite subtle. Yeah Yeah, pleasant. It's got a slight a slight tang to it. No, not particularly fruity or anything quite Simple 4.7% Yeah, yeah, that's all right. Very good Cheers cheers chap another one another remote event Yeah, what are we? What are we now week? What a seven week week many of many? I think I've lost track. Yeah You're a good day Yeah, fairly fairly productive day. I think today been trying to we did a bit of work on our advanced class today Didn't we we've trying to nail that into more of an online Using Miro, but a mirror work today. Didn't we? Mm-hmm. So that was good. I say us mostly you Is your better than me you would do you had watching well when you were watching? but no, I did I did it tried to Engineer a couple of other course offerings. I'm thinking about offering at the moment. So a couple of emails to the old scrum alliance about those ideas Again, I've gone back into kind of ideas mode either But almost when I was back to when I was writing my book that kind of can't sleep I know a lot of people sleep has probably been affected by Anxiety and a lot of the stuff that's going on But that's generally when a lot of my ideas come to me is that kind of slumber time Just boy, I'm trying to get to sleep and a few sleepless nights in Last week or so when I've just literally had to come downstairs grab some post-its and write stuff down. So Trying to put some of those things into motion I've always got a pack of post-its by the bed you keep them by the bed you Yeah, I should I should have done that without to venture downstairs in the dark. I'm doing away. That's it. Yeah Oh just really we should we should say a toast We should Toast to our newest patron and who is that Andreas Andreas Hitler Andreas? Yes, great guy from Germany Good scrum master He's joined us at the social distance in As well. Yes, he did and he he had some fun with his webcam. Didn't he he was trying all sorts of different Masks on with his webcam filters. I think they call them. Don't they? Yeah, that's like snapchat filters, but for the zoom My favorite one was his he don't he began to look like Donald Trump. It's kind of a Donald Trump kind of Face morph wasn't it? Then he was into Joe Exotic wasn't he from Tiger King? Yeah, that's some good stuff on there We made it certainly made us all chuckle when we were watching that Cheers Andreas. Nice to yeah. Thank you very much for this for the drink Okay, so yeah, sorry undirected you talking about different course offerings and things We had Somebody else tweeted us recently. Okay, okay, I think to their friends He said She'd be interested in learning more about remote sprint meetings Okay, probably not the only one. No, it's true. It's probably People having to quickly adapt aren't they to To remote formats of various scrum meetings And you've been doing quite a bit of that recently. Well, I've I've done I've been focusing more on the retrospective element of it Who's been your favorite isn't it? Well, it's um, I offered my as you know, I offered my services to any team really that wanted a neutral We always talked about the advantages of having a neutral facilitator So I took this I thought kind of thought well Maybe people might want to some help because I can virtually travel anywhere virtually now Who wouldn't want you Well exactly I and I can turn up on anyone's zoom call and facilitate for them so So I've been doing a bit of that and that was quite fun and a lot of again I've been using Miro for that as well So but a lot of the tools that I've been in retro's format and I've done some little on the short little online retro as well remote retro's and Probably harder because you've got to get people talking more and it's when you've got Zoom we've got a Teams or whatever you're using you'll find well, I've certainly found It's harder sometimes to Get everyone's voice in the room like that you would be perhaps more easily if you're doing it face to face We're in the same meeting room So literally just level of those names a good level of when everybody's remote. Yeah true But it's not perhaps it's not as natural. I wouldn't say is it's natural. No No, but when it comes to something that's a Word that I hear you use quite a lot status. Yeah People in the room when you've got people who are remote and some people in the room I think naturally the status of the people in the room without talking about it is generally higher Yes, and so it's a little bit too easy if you're facilitating to be swayed I was I was very guilty of this and I can remember cause that we were on together probably a certainly a BT or similar instances when I Would forget literally forget about the person who was hanging on the end of a phone It's probably harder if you can see them visually if you've got cameras on or if you've got webcams But before that we used to before that we use I used to actually get the team the people who were in the room To draw pictures of the people who are on the phone. Yeah and stick them on the chair Yeah, so they could see who wasn't there Yeah, and you know then if someone is being quiet you can your eyes are scanning around the room And you realize somebody hasn't spoken Yeah, so yeah, absolutely and trying to as much as you can you got to respect people's privacy, but I'm staying visual Seeing people's faces Playing around giving people so another interesting thing I tried in retrospectives as well is that again making use of the features is the rename tool so You can obviously on zoom you can rename yourself to anything you want to be on a on your zoom window So just try and introduce that element of safety Trying to introduce Your name as an emotion you're you're you're feeling right now, so I might rename instead of just being Paul Goddard. I might be What might I be beginning with P patient Paul or I might be Provocative Paul, I don't know something like that So something that might be summarizing my emotion or my kind of state right now And just just playing around with that that zoom feature as well just to give a bit of a game to get people's mood in the room That was quite nice thing to do But yeah, you can you can use these feature these zoom features or these Collaborative tool features to your advantage and make it a lot more colorful and mirror that I've been using as well as Jamboard is a very colorful way to To see your date see the data Well, I've seen them Advantages More advantages of everyone being remote. Hmm, but quite often if you're in the room Then you've got one person who's driving, you know, yeah the Jira Driver, yeah And it's such a painful thing. You're something at a planning for example And you're going through the stories and someone's at the machine or someone's logged in to the yeah Machine, but here everybody's logged in and they can all be annotating on the same thing Or they can be going into different breakout rooms if you're in planning sessions, for example, and you know Doing a bit of backlog refinement in a in a small breakout room And then automatically redistributing people into different pairs or different triads. Yeah, I Think that that's an advantage of everybody being on the same Page yeah with the same tools providing of course everybody has the same Technology the same access and something we talked about in a recent episode. Does everybody have the same? You know internet access for example Machines some people are having to use their their data allowance on their phones and so on But that's something I learned the UK is the responsibility of the employer Yeah, your employees to work from home the employer is obliged to provide Necessary equipment Yeah, so any other anything else about remote meetings? So think let's think about what we're planning. We've got Stand-ups you can make stand-ups a bit more interesting as well So the one that we've always done just playing games on stand-ups like You can play tag quite easily on stand-ups to try and Obviously you if you've been in a stand-up situation where you've stood in a circle You'd probably just wait until the next person the talks person circle talks before you start But you can play that a bit more virtually By playing some kind of random tag over the zoom calls And things like that trying to change it up a bit. I saw some other I think it was actually on the mirror website They they came up with like 10 different games or icebreaker type games that you can play and one of them that the one that stuck in my mind was The quickest person to lie on their desk Lie on their desk. Yeah, so you So you have to literally try and rearrange. I don't think I could do it here without causing a massive catastrophe, but Trying trying able to see if you're able to lie on your desk as quickly as possible That rewards the person with the clear desk policy, right? Yes. Maybe that's it Maybe that's the the the the benefit there Yeah, I don't tend to clear my desk every day. It gets to the point with it Right seriously now I need to have a big clip and to be honest it only takes me about five minutes to do it Even when it said it's worse. Yeah, why I don't do it every day. I don't know. Yeah I'm looking at it now and thinking. Yeah, I think tomorrow might be the day Hey there Yeah, look at the day where you can put off till tomorrow Luckily for the benefit of the people that have maybe watching this on patreon can see the The the camera view of jeff and I talking but what they can't see is that the kind of the The cone of of of the area that you can't see behind my screen or to the side of my monitor, which is literally Just a carnage this stuff everywhere, but everything behind me looks very tidy. That's the main thing on zoom calls But um, yeah, exactly. So I was wondering this might not go anywhere I might not this might die on its ass Go on then But it's a half thought when you were talking about remote meetings And I know we've talked already about zoom fatigue and it's a thing and people understandably just so Tired and drained and fed up of being on video call. Yeah every day Um, and it's well documented that it's much more draining than being in physical meetings. Yeah Okay whether Maybe maybe you need to flip it somehow. I don't again. I like say it might get no go nowhere But usually you'd see the retrospective as as one of the few opportunities where you'd get to get together Yeah Planning sessions the ceremonies where you'd actually get together Now i'm wondering whether those should be an opportunity to Get away You know break the monotony Actually, the retrospective was a breath of fresh air in a sprint quite often. Mm-hmm Now what the breath of what the breath of fresh air might be to not be on a zoom call So is there a way of of getting away from the team? And being useful retrospective wise No idea what that means So almost what do you mean in terms of a personal reflection put time on your own without any distraction as but doing that at the same time as all the other team members could be Could be Maybe maybe you know a dedicated solo almost meditation Reflection type thing with no other distractions zoom off computer off Download for half an hour and then come back and See what see what your colleagues have thought what you've thought. Hmm, but yeah, certainly within Changing your environment and and Slowing your brain down. I think absolutely when you're trying to do And again, it's that kind of time when I come up all the with all my ideas is when I'm just My brain is probably at its slowest and that's it's trying to engage those kind of and I you know if you're doing a retrospective on zoom On Thursday, you know or a Tuesday afternoon And you've just done a full day's work You're probably not in a great and you've done it all on zoom if you've been on zoom calls all day If you maybe maybe you come out of a sprint review on on zoom and you had half an hour for a quick cheese sandwich at lunchtime Maybe your brain isn't you know, isn't in the right right kind of frame of mind to sit looking at five six seven others other Zoom windows, you maybe maybe there's a point but even Just from a personal development point of view That's that's a healthy thing to do anyway trying to distance yourself from too much tech Um We're at the right time is probably useful for you But even even just turning your cameras off that that would probably help trying to do as a retrospective or a stand-up or a planning session Use the audio feature, but don't Don't use the video and you know Part of me is the battling without thinking when you it's great to be able to see someone I do agree with that, but your brain is working that much harder to try and maintain Five six seven on the windows of of eye contact with other people So just using the audio functionality What may even get people to listen that a little bit harder Yeah Yeah, I mean your other senses increase when you're deprived of one But um, so on that thought you could there's nothing to stop you for instance using a tool like jam board or Miro But um, if you make it a self-explanatory process Literally write the instructions of a game retrospective game, whatever it might be online And people can do that at their own speed in their own time And that's you know, put some music on in the background or something like that Using an online jukebox or something like that, but you can literally then just fill in these post-its online And try and draw parallels without being able to talk to each other without having to share that conversation Might work never tried it like that, but there's nothing to say it might not work Yeah, it's interesting to see because there must be so many people out there trying different things right now Um, so many people getting frustrated with with the monotony and that was Like I said, that that was one of the things that we look forward to because retrospectives broke the monotony Um, it changed things up. We gave you a chance to stop and re-energize as well as learn Other people must be uncovering lots of different things right now. It'd be good to be good to hear what others are finding um You just made me you just reminded me of our game of werewolves the other day Oh, yeah playing a game online You'd have to explain if people weren't aware of what we did what we what we set up and how we went about it Oh, brief brief overview. I'm trying to be brief. So, um Many many years ago. We were we were introduced to a game called werewolves, which since we started playing it he found out was Originated as another game called mafia and it probably has other aberrants another sort of lineage, but um, you know, we we came to know is the werewolves of miller hollow And uh, it's a sort of game of hidden identity really where of a party game, um where certain members of the community in the game are have a double A secret identity of as werewolves who try and pick off the villagers at night While the villagers are trying to rid the community of that pest Um, and so yeah, we decided we set up normally it's a game that you'd play Uh in person sitting in a circle Um, we've played at conferences. We've even played it in in training courses before because it's got quite a lot of interesting messages potentially learning points Uh, but we thought for a bit of fun. We'd play it at our social distance in that we have on fridays And we invited people to come along and and play and we had people from America and Uh Germany and yeah, yeah Scandinavia someone from scandinavia, wasn't there? Yeah Finland all sorts. So um, it was uh, it was good fun It was quite Yeah, and because I've played it before on since lockdown and I was amazed at how um It does bond it it creates I'm not going to say it's ghost if I was to say friendships, but it's it creates Come certainly creates conversation and um A lot of fun a lot of um Teasing maybe that kind of you know playful teasing Through and these are complete strangers that had never met before on that on that day Hey, there's there's there's a lot in that and I I've played it before On a csm course I'm not sure if you were there, but I certainly I for a couple of months I iterated on on a version of it in in this csm Mainly to finish day one I think it was to finish my kind of day one of that first day Because it usually was getting on to talk about the scrum master role and so I I generally tried to include a scrum master in a deliberate role of someone trying to facilitate the team agreements Yeah So if you don't know the game at the end of each day effectively The the community has to decide on which of their community to get rid of to lynch in metaphorical sense On suspicion of being a werewolf on suspicion based on their conversations They've had who they're suspicious of and trying to convince and and trying to get a team a village decision a community decision on which Which of their team members is a is a double agent or a werewolf and it's hard to Without taking over without telling people without You know listening to what everyone says and then just making your own decision I tried to create this the scrum master role amongst these villages as someone who's got to listen Carefully and try and create proposals and and and give options and then allow the village to decide So I changed the game slightly To a base. I don't think I allowed the scrum master a vote as such, but they had to try and Encourage that that team to make a decision. Yeah And the scrum master was definitely not a werewolf. Yeah, the scrum master was kind of I ruled them out that they are of any suspicion. They tried to make them as neutral as possible So, um, but yeah, we certainly had some interesting Behaviors emerge in our game last last week And your experience Who wins more the villagers of the werewolves of the recent time with werewolves? Yeah, that's always my experience too I think it's easier to it's easier to be sneaky in a new group Than it is to be ruthless in a new group Saying that about the new group thing. I remember playing a bt. I think I think at this time you weren't It was probably a meeting that you weren't at jeff. There was there was there were many of those that you didn't I tended to avoid meetings I was Me and Nigel and Nigel will remember this but um, we ran a session And after it was a team building day out and it was the the morning after a lot of the team had had hangovers that they were nursing So we while I was working you guys were getting drunk Um, and me and Nigel had agreement with the the team leader to shorn to run a version or a game of werewolves for our team And we ran it and you'd think that this this team a lot of those relationships like um Like shorn and alan and people that you'll know jeff were quite close. It's fair to say they knew they've known each other for a long time And they were up. They weren't a new team, but these werewolves still managed to win and one of the uh, so shorn particularly didn't pick up on one of his best friends at work Had a hidden identity that he didn't recognize and he was quite upset by it. He was remembering being quite shocked at his inability to Detect when he wasn't telling the truth a man that he'd known for you know, 15 20 odd years so I think It's dangerously maybe even in more mature teams that can be people can still quite can hide their True feelings or their true identities quite easily Yeah, I suppose if you're quite fragile, it could be a well thinking to see me about that. Well, exactly. Yeah So it could be team forming it could it could destroy teams I suppose that that kind of game if they because it is a game of of deception largely So um, a lot of the I originally played this in lockdown with a group of the applied improvisation network as group of improvisers who use improv for teaching and for educating all sorts of things and um, the guy who was running it um He was trying to he was thinking about using it As an offering for his clients as and he described it as something that would help him teach kind of Influencing and negotiating And I know that we've touched a lot on this before in a lot of our classes about We do talk about a scrum master being a politician and being an influencer in organizations But we also talk about this fine line between Influencing and manipulation when people feel that they've been deceived by you Because you've got an agenda that that isn't that they don't want you know, they don't agree with or they think you're trying to push your own message So I think it's a very using that game in that sense about influencing Maybe is a bit of a delicate line to tread Yeah Yeah, maybe it maybe it's a good way of illuminating the line Of where not to cross Because you need to Try and bring people around to making a decision If you're if you're a true villager A pure villager. Yeah, then you need to bring people along Um get some kind of consensus And to be able to spot when somebody's manipulating you Hmm And that can be quite useful as well organization Yeah, I was just thinking today actually um The last the last thing we did together was the birmingham meet-up group Was it? Yeah, we were talking there about um The the politics because somebody asked a question. Yes about a scrum master being a politician. Yeah. Yeah, and Yeah, there's they are and this this sense of If you can influence positively That's got to be a useful thing, but at the very the very least Know when people are manipulating you. Yeah, you can understand how people think How decisions are made How people influence each other Consciously and unconsciously because we're we're influencing people unconsciously all the time Hmm And we consciously but not realizing it And I'll talk about influencing people while you're asleep but um That uh, although saying that my wife said she had a dream that I cheated on her and she hated me after It was just a dream, but She was angry with me with the next day. Somehow I've managed to influence her in during sleep, but Yeah, so the way was was the game a couple of people have asked us if we're going to do any game we might do we might do um, yeah, it was down quite well. Yeah, it was um It probably took a little bit of time to set up. You've got to You're going to be quite I think what I'd do again if I was going to do it again I'd send out the rules or the at least An overview of the rules in advance and then people can read up on it and Hmm Make sure they're they're fair with the rules and houses zoom works and it doesn't work particularly well with mobile phones apparently so Or certainly breakout rooms didn't so we have limited functionality, isn't it? Yeah Well talking of that you just stumbled on something else. That's you were just going to bring us back to our remote meeting. So I I'm um I was due to run a retrospective for a client Last week. Yes last week Uh, I got delayed. There was there was a clash with with a board meeting um, so it's in now next week, but um There was a lot of people so first of all I wanted to make sure that it wasn't overcrowded so asked them to self-select To make sure there was enough coverage of opinions that it was still a site. Yes a workable size group and um I asked them to to give me some input get gather some data in advance So I created a really short Timed it made sure it would take no more than five minutes Questionnaire. Yeah, uh, sort of google form type survey monkey type thing. Yeah Where they could give me some qualitative and quantitative data and then I Gathered that data together and presented it back to them consolidated And asked them to to have a look at that data in advance before the session Yeah, so a lot of this stuff can be done outside of the zoom call Uh, so that allows us to reduce the amount of time we need to actually be online together and allows us to focus On stuff, but also allows you to digest information Not just on the fly some people Just don't they prefer to Sit with things and just think about things for a little bit when in a really short space of time in a retrospective Sometimes you don't have that and so the people who are much better at thinking on their feet Are at an advantage Yeah So, yeah, they'll by the time we get to the retrospective they'll have had A week and a half to to to think about the data that's in front of them for the subject being the topic of the retrospective Um, and yeah, it'd be interesting to see how that plays out who picks that topic Uh, so the group themselves They picked the topic Uh, and I spoke to a couple of people just to get a little bit of context See because I'm I'm out of I'm not in their day to day. So I don't really know the details But enough to to get a feel for what what was going on so I could Work with them and craft a goal a specific goal for the retrospective Around that thing not just we're gonna have a retrospective on this topic But like an objective to meet so the end of it. We know we've met that objective Um and check that with them. So that that's um, I think it's set up Well, there is a chance and I said this to them that so actually you might not even need the retrospective now There's there's there's perfectly it would be perfectly fine by me if you use this data as a group Decided what you wanted to do and didn't need the actual session That would be fine by me So there's I think making use of All the options you have available perhaps that's maybe that's the message of what I'm trying to get across Because I I ran one of these um online retros for a team last week And um, I originally set out the time box when I was trying to arrange it and agree it up front two hours. I thought well He wanted to so the guy was organizing it all asked me to come in and help I gave him the option. I said well, you can either one or two things you can either run. This is kind of a Um, you know, what did you call it an extraordinary Retrospective which is kind of would interrupt your normal process and we'll just do it as a as an ad hoc one off here Or you could just schedule it for when I come in at the end of your sprint as normal But give people a bit of notice that you're going to have a Neutral facilitator And then we got onto the subject of topics if you like and I said well, you've got a choice is you can either Go back to the team and ask them to come up with some topics They want to talk about or you can just see what emerges And they he chose that kind of the latter there just to see what emerged and some fairly interesting Stuff did emerge when you just went into it with a kind of uh You know, I had some games I was going to always going to play But the conversations lent themselves to where he thought they would go if you know what I mean And he kind of was pleased that that's where they did go. So Um, yeah, it was it was I mean, I was really surprised that my point was is how fast Two hours went and I don't know if it's because it was online and I don't know if it is because Um, the tool that I was using the Miro board or whatever it was, but It just felt it didn't feel long enough even even though, you know The advice the guidance is for a two of weeks sprint two hours should be But I felt that there was more There was more that you could have got out of it and You obviously with remote stuff and again back to the original question. You've got to be careful with People's energy levels and you've got to manage that much more effectively and you've got to be perhaps A lot more aware of that on an online meeting, but I felt that maybe it took him even a bit longer to get Deep enough in a retro online than it would have done if you were face to face Just when you because when you did scratch away the surface There were some more underlying team behaviors that needed to be Exposed I felt Is that something could be picked up next time? Or would the moment have gone? No, I think it was I think it opened a An option for that team that it was okay to to deal with those kind of things on in retro Express perhaps they hadn't dealt with them too much before So if anything, it just maybe Would start that conversation a little bit easier next time Okay, so yeah There's obviously this is why for more isn't there? You want to get as much and but sometimes That's enough And I've got to be mindful of if it's is it just me being nosy So as as a as a fissillator is this isn't my problem. This isn't my Team this isn't wanting the best for them as well. Yeah. Yeah to get as much Make as much progress as they possibly can But again, it's about but looping back to that influencing Is it am I influencing people with with my line of questioning with my Through my own curiosity as a as a fissillator. Yes Though I was mindful of that in a couple of cases. I I retracted my question and and step back so But yeah, if they want you for their retrospectives, what's the best way to Well, Jeff, well you can look at my website That's our fly And that's our fly.co.uk. Yeah, and people are actually going to type that in now you watch But um, I should buy that URL shouldn't I buy that domain? Yeah Um, no, so if you look on that's nice, you'll already have Yeah, maybe um Now all the it's very simple You just literally look on the diary on my website at gelify.co.uk If you are interested you can have a look at any potential dates that might work for you or And we can book a time for me to run retrospectives But yeah, it's it's actually been you know a lot of these This lockdown stuff has got me thinking a lot of different ways and I've already got a list of other ideas That I'm going to try out and some are going to work some aren't a lot of them. These are experiments, but It's a good time to experiment, isn't it so Definitely. Yeah, so it's good fun. I'm enjoying it I wonder what other games there are that we used to play that we could trial online I know people have made a good online conversion of the ballpoint game and the penny game. Yeah Things like the pizza can burn pizza game and things like that. They're all online already I think what there are now, but uh Yeah, um sprint reviews on zoom Not that only those has yet but um I'd like to think they were they were a lot easier um than the others because there's A larger audience, but most of the audience are on view only right so whereas we would used to we we'd often say um You know, there's a rule that only certain people can speak in a sprint review Which is all well and goods are saying it but when you're in a room and there's a senior manager there Yeah, very hard to say But here you can actually if you're in control of the meeting you can have their microphone muted That's true And uh, you can make certain people co-host so they can do their bit now and again and you can have the chat Facilitated so you can you can Team up with a with a with a tool like slider or something and have the questions come in and have them up voted and things by the people who are interested and so on Um, so I think yeah, there's there's definite benefits and a lot of people um Well, this is kind of a almost like a marmite Point in a way in that it divides people But I've I've known a lot of people who who record their sprint reviews Hmm Even before lockdown they if they were in person they would still record them Uh for posterity, but also for you know, kind of their journey if you like and and and where they come from And this is a lot easier to do But one of the other benefits they get from recording it is that not everybody would be able to make it in person And you wouldn't want everybody there in person. It would be too big it would be too crowded And so you could make that recording available Perhaps an edge To other people who are interested, but you know, I haven't really got that much involvement And you've got that built into the tools now. Yeah. Yeah One thing with regards to tools is only very optimistic here No, it's just to finish on a downer then um no the um So in a in a call in a retro that I worked on Last week for the first time I used teams. Have you used teams yet? I've been invited into teams. Yes, but I've from what they this team told me about teams Is it's a lot harder to use breakout rooms? Yeah So they are there I think but it's a lot of much more manual process in which to set them up and that's the probably the the feature I use most in and even in In planning sessions, these are going to be useful in retro. Certainly these are going to be useful, but breakout rooms in zoom. I think are probably the The most frequently used and we we used the breakout rooms in the werewolves game as well, which you wouldn't normally do How did you so you because jeff you were a villager? jeff was part of the game You were at one point you were voted as the town mayor and you weren't very happy about that At the time so if you haven't played the game in our version last week the town mayor is elected by the the community So it's an extra extra kind of identity someone in the community is given So the so the mayor could be a villager or could be a werewolf And jeff for some reason the village seemed to think that jeff would be a good mayor But he didn't want to take the title didn't you? well No, because I I I don't really rate my ability at um picking out But so from playing the game before and this is to a degree where my prior knowledge actually proved costly um because Our experience sometimes, you know, you you come to expect what you've always expected and so in the past When I played this generally speaking the werewolves have clocked on pretty quickly That being if you're a werewolf and the mayor that's a big advantage. Yes, because the mayor gets the deciding vote if there's a tie and so my my warning for the rest of the game players So after about 10 seconds, I said I would be wary of somebody who's very very keen to be the mayor People were putting themselves forward and almost before pit paul had said does anybody want to be mayor? We had two people that said yeah, yeah, yeah me me me me And to me that just started flashing alarm bells But as it turned out neither of those two people Were werewolves weren't they okay? Um, and so they immediately raised suspicion. Yeah, and because I'd said I'd you know, um Because I'd said beware of people who uh, who want to be there Uh, that sort of I think gave people some trust Yeah, yeah So yeah, I wasn't a werewolf. I lost But again, that's down to status, isn't it you effectively then lowered your status by admitting You didn't know or you were trying to you certainly won't take in a high status position around that and that's That probably what helped you out in that case By possibly yeah, yeah, but it's interesting game of status as well werewolves anyway. Yeah, we digress Yeah, so um, yeah, we'll um, we'll talk we've been talking for Well, so we back at the social distance in just the normal social distance in this Friday Yeah, I think we'll just go back to just um, maybe Regular drinks just to give ourselves a week off, huh? No quizzes Where's your turn to do a quiz this time? I did the last one Um, but what we might look at and we'll we'll kind of sew this little seed on this Pubcast now If you are listening And perhaps give us some feedback on this or give us your thoughts on this on social media, but Jeff and I have running the idea of maybe an informal open space So in our regular friday evening slot Um, we would run basically just facilitate for you Jeff and I would Run a very informal open space with breakout rooms in zoom So it's quite easy to do all we need really is an idea of if anyone's interested to attend And maybe to suggest some content or some questions That they'd like as the subject to those those open space sessions So we're we're just running that idea through um Through our minds at the moment We'll put something more formal out there if we do give it the green light But um, keep your eye open for that and if you've got any suggestions We'll start to form kind of an online marketplace That you'll be able to submit any topics that you'd like to discuss in that open space Yeah, again, maybe that's something that we can take advantage of Time And have the marketplace ready by the time we get that was what I was planning. Yeah Isn't pure open space But again, it could be a more efficient use of time Yeah, so just have that constantly running in the background and it can be built in in advance of the session itself to make the most of it But it'll be very informal. They'll they'll be uh beers involved. I imagine so Drink of your choice. Yeah All right, sir. We're done. Yes, so, um It's good until next time Cheers stay safe stay alert Yeah, that's the message