 Welcome to Pure Dog Tuck. I am your host, Laura Reeves, and you guys, some of our early listeners will remember that once upon a time, Alyssa and Alexander and I used to get together at least once a week for a tip of the week. So Alyssa and I saw each other at the garden and said, hey girl, let's do that again because it was really fun. But now we're going to make it a full podcast. So look forward to many conversations with Allison. Going forward, we're going to be talking about all kinds of stuff, lots and lots of grooming stuff because I love what Allison brings to that and all kinds of handling stuff and everything we can think of. So welcome back, Allison. I am thrilled. So I am so happy to be back, Laura. Like I said, seeing you at the garden and we were both like, hey, how come we don't talk more? And we're like, yeah, we just kind of both got really busy and it fell off. But I'm so glad to be back. I think it's perfect. It's a great conversation that we have every single time. And I think that's kind of what matters. And it's great information for our listeners. So I love that. Today, I have a fabulous topic for us to talk about. As many of you remember, I grew up with clumber spaniels and long white coats is something that has been the bane of my existence for many years. So we thought we would do a deep, deep dive on just white coats and how we keep them up, how we condition them, how we clean them, how we fix the staining, how we prevent the staining and all of the pieces in between. So let's go, Allison, let's start with prevention. Prevention is 90% of the cure, right? Yeah, I don't know. This is very true. Yeah, so I think that's a good place to start with prevention. Because one of the things I'll say about white dogs is, even if you haven't prevented it, and you need your dog to be whiter, you need to follow some of the prevention protocols in order to keep them white. In my experience, often once you start whitening a coat, even with something you might think is gentle, our dogs do tend to restain a little bit quicker. So let's talk about that just for half a second. Sorry to interrupt, but I think it's important that people understand why, right? Because our whitening products strip the hair shaft, yeah? And it makes it more porous. This is my understanding, correct me if I'm wrong, and then staining stuff, whatever the stuff is, whether it's urine or spit or dirt or grass or whatever, gets into that open hair shaft, yes? Correct. So basically, there are kind of three of the more popular ways to keep our dogs white once they're stained, right? So they are using a bluing shampoo, something that has some bluing in it. When I started, we used to just use bluing, right? And so that does work, but what that is doing, it's really just changing the spectrum. You probably see that TikTok new toothpaste viral toothpaste that's out there. That's exactly what these kind of shampoos do. They take something yellow, they put a purple filter over it, and then our eye sees that as white. And so problem A with that is you do that too often, and then you're actually, then your eye starts to see the purple or gray or something in between there. I made a Smurf clumber once. Yes. Yes, I've had many lavender lipidists in my day. And then the other popular one is an enzyme cleaner, right? So those are super popular, and but what those actually do is the enzyme is actually eating the stain, therefore eating some of the keratin that's in the hair. And then that makes the hair actually quite weak after a while, and that it can not only go dingy, turn a different color, it can actually snap off, right? So that's kind of scary. Same with bleach, right? Bleach is doing the same thing. So all of these things like they, this is why prevention is so important, because as much as we like to whiten our dogs, you kind of want to do it as delicately or as less often as possible, right? The more often you're doing it, kind of the more damage you're doing, right? So yeah, so prevent, so for me, it starts with prevention. So prevention is sometimes a little bit easier than you might think, right? Is your dog running around on the lawn? Are they getting grass stained, right? Are they just getting dirty? Are you hiking a lot? Your crate, we all love these aluminum crates, but sometimes, you know, if they're not freshly painted or you haven't kept up what's inside the crate, that can wear off onto your dog's coat, blankets, bedding, there can be dye transfer from that. And it might, you might not even notice it day to day, but after a week or so, that buildup is on our dog's coat. Water buckets are another big one. You know, if our dogs are always damp, especially some of, you know, especially white dogs with beards that are drinking out of these buckets, they're always damp and that just creates this color. Then of course, there is different foods, different ways our dogs metabolize food and or water. It could be the quality even of your water. You know, I know a lot of people that have toy breeds that just buy distilled water, and that's the only thing their dogs are allowed to drink. And, you know, that is more, you know, that's easier to do for some of these smaller breeds than if you have St. Bernard's that you're trying to keep, you know, weight in the bottle. Yeah, exactly. So thinking of prevention, like how is my dog getting stained? You know, is it eye staining? How can I can I clear that up myself by going to my veterinarian and seeing what the underlying issue is chewing in their feet? Is it a food allergy? There's all these, there's the thing is, is that our dogs aren't white for so many different reasons that finding that and then figuring out how much of that can I control, right? And then we have other things, urine, right? Some of our dogs like to pee on themselves, right, whether they're boys or girls. What about girls that come in season or English that are bitches that pee on their pants, standard poodle bitches that pee on their palms? Right, like, you know, so there's like all these different ways that our dogs are staining in different parts of their coat, and what can we do for those things to help up? So my number one tip is always, and I'm really excited to hear your thoughts on this, conditioning, conditioning, conditioning, conditioning, keep them clean, bath them regularly, and condition the coat, seal the hair so that nothing can get into it. Yeah, absolutely positively, right? So I am, everything gets bathed once a week, like that's how it is. But if that is staining from urine, it is staining from drinking out of a bucket, then yeah, you need to maybe be spot cleaning those areas during the week, right, to really keep it up. Oftentimes it takes way less time than we think, but conditioning, sealing that cuticle back up. Because as we said, a lot of these shampoos, how they work is they blow, think of a hair cuticle like scales on a fish, right? And we want those scales to be super tight and waterproof. Most shampoos that we use work by blowing those, the hair shaft open to suck the dirt out of the hair. Very few products seal it, right? So we want products that seal it so it doesn't restain as quickly. And to me, that's just part of the game. Wash, condition, prevent. And dry, because the damp part, right, is causing all the problems also. So wet beards, I think about spinoni, obviously, white wire hairs, West Island white terriers, you know, anything with a beard that they get spit or they drink a lot or whatever it is, that's the moisture is what's causing the bacteria that's causing the staining. Absolutely. The other thing about that is most of the products that are designed to seal the hair shaft will only seal it with heat, right? So if you're not drying them to your point, those products aren't going to work. When it does come to those bearded breeds, so anything wire coated, you know, we'll often see that little crease in the bottom lip. And I'm just going to pull those hairs out, right? Because they seem to just suck in the moisture, the moisture gets stuck in that, and then it like kind of spreads it to the rest of the beard. Anything that is soft or coated, so like a Vichon, a Maltese, a Havanese, anything like that, I like to trim the upper and lower lip line, like just very, very carefully with like small, like snub nose scissors. And that way that hair doesn't get sucked into the mouth and stained. And it's that hair that acts on both the wire and the softener coated, it acts as a wick, right? So that wicks the water into the rest of the beard and causes more and more staining, right? Absolutely. And like you said, and then that's the bacteria, and then the bacteria just keeps breeding more and more. Lovely red staining that we call making a mess. And so I personally, and speak to me, you have lots more product knowledge than I do. That's your absolute strength. I just tend to rely on what I know. But when I'm washing and I'm spot washing, right? So a lot of my dogs are wire coated dogs, they're not getting a jacket bath every week or daily. But my bearded dogs, that beard gets washed when I'm showing it, I'm campaigning at whatever that beard is washed daily, washed, conditioned, dried every single day. What's your favorite product for that? So I'll use a couple of different things. If I'm on the road, I'm traveling, and I still want to keep that beard really clean, I'll actually use baby wipes, right? So baby wipes are kind of my go to, I'm on the road, and I want to keep that beard clean. So especially after they've eaten, which is a big one for me, and, or, you know, if I can, if they're out for a big walk and then drink before they go in their crate, and I continue on my journey, I'm going to use a baby wipe because a lot of them do have a gentle cleaner in it, and that cleaner will help kind of automatically dry that beard. So I'm going to really scrub it with probably three baby wipes, if it's a Spanoni, maybe one, if it's a West, and follow towel and towel it dry, right? So that's my on the road thing. At home, I'm going to use, typically I don't like to use something with blowing in it every day, right? So I might use a self rinsing shampoo, like OC magic foam or something like that, that's clear, because I don't want to be adding color to it. They also speed the drying process, right? A lot of those rinseless shampoos do help speed the drying process, and let's face it, when you're drying that beard once or twice a day, you know, saving five minutes helps you out. INV actually makes a fantastic beard spray that, so when we also talk about staining and white dogs, I would like to also think about staining on our blue dogs, right? So coming my mom had Sky Terriers, I showed some of them, and they would get that brown staining that you could see, even though they were blue, but I found that using that INV beard spray, so same thing, I'd wipe it with a baby wipe and kind of air dry brush it and spray the beard spray in it, and again, it helped clear the bacteria, kill the bacteria that was in there, that's causing that kind of red staining. You know, at home, I'm going to just use shampoo. Right, just a pretty easy shampoo, and then what's your go-to conditioner? Well, I like something that seals the cuticle and speeds up my drying time, so I use typically 95% of the time I use Chris Christensen after you bathe, it seals the cuticle, it cuts down your drying time by like 30%, and I dilute it 8 to 1, it doesn't say that on the bottle, but I dilute it 8 to 1, and I find that I get really good results from that. Okay, great. I know this may make everybody's head spin off their body, but having had enough spinonies that I had to salvage a beard, right, like go get that beard back, I have found that I can use the hydrogen peroxide, like we use the higher, not the wound kind, but the haircare kind, put that in a spray bottle, spray after bath before condition, and that will help dry it and then put your conditioner, and that, for me, has been very successful in trying to maintain that kind of thing. We are at the Kentucky Anna cluster of dog shows, and I'm talking to Dr. Karen Potter. She is a German wire hair pointer breeder, a Trupanian breeder, and she's also a veterinarian, and Karen's going to talk about what Trupanian means to her as a breeder, and also what it means for her as a veterinarian. When I became a Trupanian breeder, and I sent my letters out, I knew that they were going with 30 days of coverage, had one of my owners have an emergency with them. That's comforting to me as a breeder to know that they can get help. As a veterinarian, there are many cases where we have to make decisions on how to treat things based on financial restraints. And when the financial restraints come into play, we can't always do absolutely everything for that pet. So if my puppies are covered, at least for those first 30 days, I know that if they get sick, they can get the best possible care. Interesting. I once had a Samoyed come to me, and he was about three years old in full specials coat and was completely urine stained, like his entire rear end, halfway up his front legs. And he had just lived in a big kennel on cement and had sat down, and you know, Sammy's have a more porous coat. And I got him in like November. I was specialing in the next year. He ended up winning like 30 best in shows. What I did is I used milk, a very old like English recipe. So I used milk of magnesia, the 3% hydrogen peroxide. So the first need kind, not the air kind, and basically enough cornstarch to bind the two together like a loose toothpaste. And I would literally smother him in it every and I did it. And I if I use that formula, we'll say now, I still do it the same way. Last X, right, they've been from last X and I smother them in it. And then I just put them to bed. If they're living in your house, they should sleep in a crate last that night, because it's messy, right? And I let it dry. And it's like the milk of magnesia and like helps draw the staining out naturally. Now this isn't something that's going to take a urine stain dog to white overnight, like this took like three weeks. But it also didn't damage the coat, right? And I just kept reapplying and reapplying and reapplying. And, you know, some of those things do really work, right? And that I have seen that used a lot, the clumbers, the eye stains, the bib stains particularly, but the eye stains and clumbers that can be real problematic. That particular recipe works great. Yeah, it does work. The, I like the just straight peroxide and then condition, condition, condition, like super heavy conditioner in the beard, because if it gets a little bit in their mouth, it's not going to hurt them, right? Right. We use peroxide to make them throw up. Right. So I've got to work around here where I'm really concerned about them ingesting it. And I don't really want to leave anything, the, the milk of magnesia recipe on their beard, because then they're going to eat it. Yeah, exactly. So, so that was, that was my trade off. Talk to us about, because there's some really great solutions. And I know you are going to have a good insight on this for different things that we can give them internally. And, and I think this is such an important part of the prevention, right? We start with the diet and, and the, and the supplements that we need to give them to keep the hair white to start with. Right. So, you know, a lot of our dogs have food allergies. And a lot of those allergies show up as reddish coat between the toes. Typically, it starts around the ears. It can be around the mouth. It can be, you know, a drooling dog that has more red wherever that drool is, is hitting the hair, right? The mouth, the beard, the bib, etc. So, Tums, right? So a lot of people will use something like Tums because they feel that it levels out the, the enzymes in the body, right? So that the drool isn't the stomach, fluids, etc. aren't as acidic. And I know a lot of people that have had a lot of success with that. I don't know personally, whenever I've tried it, that I've had a lot of success with that. I'm what I have had success with is buttermilk powder. So a lot of nasty people that I talked to, especially in the UK, they just buy like bulk buttermilk powder, like you would do to make up your own milk from like baking supply store. And they just put about a teaspoon on their food morning and night or every time that they feed them. They've had a lot of, I personally had a lot of success using that. There are people that will use a low dose antibiotic, right? Island powder, tetracycline, doxycycline, and putting their dogs on it for 30 days on, two days, two weeks off, 30 days on kind of thing. So that's something that you'd need to talk to your veterinarian about and how they feel about it. But people do have that work. I did have somebody recently reach out to me about white dog food. So dog food that especially formulated to help our dogs stay white. And I know I saw it on Amazon, but I know you can get it in the UK. And it's called nature's protection superior care white dog formula. So nature's protection is the brown name, then superior care for white dogs is like their formula, kind of like preenup, preenland, right? So yeah, I mean, I haven't used that, but like I read a lot about it. And I've talked to a couple people that have used it, particularly with Bichon's and they they've had great success with it. And they kind of showed dogs that pre that food, then post that food and their hair, not only isn't stained, but actually does look whiter, like the new growth that's coming in. That's kind of cool. So I'd like to get more kind of into that and understand how that really works. But I think, you know, really watching for allergies and understanding that our dogs can be allergic to food, watching out for foods that do have a lot of dye in them, like they do say that that is one of the things. And not only watching out what they're eating, but what are we giving them for treats, right? And, you know, as I've stopped showing other people's dogs and I only have my own dogs now, I've noticed that I'm like, pretty generous with the treats. And maybe I'm not always paying attention. I'll pay attention to what they're eating, like their food. But then, you know, I'm thinking, huh, they're actually eating quite a bit of treats that maybe I'm not paying attention to. So I think that there's lots of things, you know, watching your water, what is the pH in your water? Do you have hard water? Is distilled water an option for you? I mean, I just know so many Maltese people that really some Maltese people, every every Maltese person I've ever talked to, you never ever, they don't get to drink anything but that. And I actually had a really interesting conversation with Tara Martin about Maltese and she said that genetically, like there's there's good white hair and that good white hair, which I thought was super interesting. I know that in clumbers, I had one special that could not eat any food that had beet pulp in it. I mean, I literally changed his food from one with beet pulp to one without and within a, I don't know, four to six weeks staining gone. Huge difference. So there's that one. The only other one that I've used and had intermediate success with and I think it has to go to the pH balance in your water. I know some Akita people that have white Akitas that will use apple cider vinegar, the kind that has like the mother, you know, the stuff in it and put that in their drinking water. So again, I think it's back to the pH balance and I had one white Akita that I use that with and it was, I mean, she didn't have any eye stains. So I'm going to go with it was good. Yeah. And actually, I meant to mention apple cider vinegar earlier because when we showed a lot of English setters, bitches that were quite heavily coated and it was the urine staining, right? It wasn't so much. They didn't really have tear staining or a lot of drool staining, but the boys, you know, had big white kind of furnishings that would they pee on their loin hair and their front legs. The girls would sometimes get their pants in it. And I've, I swear by apple cider vinegar for reducing the acidity of the urine. So it doesn't smell as much, which is kind of a bonus. It doesn't stain the coat as yellow. It just doesn't get as yellow. So obviously there's something there with the enzyme of that. And I've had great success using that, right? And also they weren't tear stained, but I never really thought of that before. But, you know, it really helped. Right. So that was that was that was the only other one that I've that I personally have used that I thought had some success. The one that did actually completely blow me away was the was the beet pulp one. And I had to, you know, it's like go in this dog food store and read every label and try to find something that, you know, doesn't have beet pulp. But it worked. So, okay, different kinds of white hair, I think, and different ways we treat from the wire coat to the poodle coat to the old English sheepdog coat, right, the bearded cowley coat. There's there's so many different kinds of hair types within our white, the sammies, right, the a white Siberian, a white Akita. So let's talk a little bit about different ways we would treat those different coat types. Definitely conditioner is going to be your best friend across the board, right, for any of those white coat types. I will say that the harder the coat is, the more I would stay away from bleach, right. So typically if you take like a West Highland light terrier and you want to bleach some of that biscuit out, most likely you're just going to turn up bright orange, right. So not the desired effect where if you use a softer coat, a poodle coat, a Maltese coat, you can get away with using more of a bleach type product. If you were at that point where you needed to use bleach, and it's going, in my experience, be more successful for you, right. In all cases, you must use conditioner all the time. I will say whenever you are using some kind of bleaching product, once you have decided to either go with bleach or an enzyme cleaner, you, from then on, should bathe your dog in something white, right. You can't bleach a dog and then bathe it in a bluing shampoo. You can't use a cleaner then, right, because you are going to turn them bright purple, bright blue, did I mention smurf the clumber, yes. Smurf the clumber. There's lots of different things you can do. There are some, you know, now that we're getting better and better toners in the hair world. So this is something where you need to go to a beauty supply store and talk to somebody that is experienced. But there is a better, like you can't dye hair white is the problem, right. So if once you bleach the hair, the hair is going to have a yellow cast, right, because, you know, we've pulled so much protein out of the hair that that's what's left. And so then to put something back in, you need to use like a very light, like it looks white to you, but it's basically violet. And that is what's going to put that white pigment back into the hair. I don't really like bleaching the hair to that point, even though on the odd poodle, I've had to do that, that was very, very creepy. But like I said, you can't do it on a Westie, something harder coated, even, you know, our bearded collies, Folding the Sheepdogs, I'm more going to use like a milk of Magnesia type recipe, rather than a bleaching type recipe, right. So the harder the coat, the harder it is white typically. And so the one thing we haven't really talked about is short white coats, dalmatians, or smooth fox carriers, or, you know, in that, any of those kind of guys. So again, here's where I think food and water is so important, because, you know, I've always said short coated dogs need twice as much grooming as long coated dogs, because you don't have any other you can't hide it, there is no way to hide it, it is there for the world to see. So that's the same if they're not going to be bright white. So actually, my favorite tried and true whitener that I use for my smooth coated dogs, I will even use it on, like I do use it on poodles and other things as well. But for short haired dogs that has never let me down, I've been using it for 25 years, I think it's one of the most undersold products at dog shows. And it's crown royal whitener. Yes. So crown royal whitener comes in a tub, it's a white powder. Now do not get it confused with crown royal grooming powder or crown royal chalk, which is also confusingly sold in the same tub. The other thing is that it needs to be used with 20 volume cream developer, so 20 volume peroxide like that you mentioned earlier. And they don't sell the two together, right? You have to go to like selling what we call those secret under the counter things that you just have to know. So that's why we have our podcast today. So that we can know are under the counter ways to do things. It's the in and out burger menu, right? This is what we're doing right now. This is our secret burger menu. So for whatever reason crown royal decided not to sell the two things together, which is like mind blown for me. And so like even if you can find the whitener at the dog show, it's still two days till you can use it because you have to find a beauty supply store that's open for best in show and get there and buy it, right? So again, I like to do it last thing at night. After last X, I'm going to mix up the crown royal whitener and the 20 volume, I like to use cream developer, you can use clear developer, but I just find cream has the conditioner in it already, right? Okay, right. I make mix it into for a short haired dog, like just about toothpaste consistency and I smear it on there and put them in a crate overnight, right? And maybe they will look it and maybe they would vomit if they did. I have again, used it for 25 years. I've never had a dog get sick from it. It makes them absolutely positively white sparkly, sparkly white. I use it no more than once a month. The next morning, how I like to do it is they go out. So like, you know, this is a plan, right? It's not like, you don't do this willy nilly. Last X, they come in, you do it the next morning you have plan, that's the first dog getting a bath, right? So they go out for their morning exercise, they come in, I like to rinse it off and immediately apply conditioner. Yeah, right? So I immediately can apply the conditioner, I leave it on for three minutes, then I just shampoo and condition as normal, even on their short haired dogs, I put conditioner on them, right? And it does make them absolutely sparkly white. And like I said, I've used it on poodles, I've used it on American cockers, I've used it on bearded colleagues, old English sheep dogs, I've used it on beards, I've used it, you know, on everything. It's not expensive, which is fantastic. I will say it can be hard to find crown royal, you may have to online shop it. Out here on the west coast, it's hard for me to find crown royal products anymore, unfortunately. I will agree. Their wire coat shampoo is the best wire coat shampoo I've ever used bar none. And the other thing is even places that do carry crown royal don't often carry the whitener because they think it's another chalk, right? And it's not a big seller. But I think it's because it's on the secret burger menu, right? I mean, I think that that's why. And I think if they sold it with like, this is how you use it, like it doesn't even yet like put the peroxide with it, right? In the interest of full disclosure, I think that Chris Christensen is going to be taking over some of the distribution of crown royal. And then I am very hopeful that I will be able to market this properly. This with some cream developer, but you know, that's next year. Right. Just FYI, maybe that could help more people get it off the secret burger menu. And get it on the main stage menu, right? And I just find it's easy to use. It's easier to use than bleach. It works every time. It's cheap, too, right? The only other one that I have had some success with is I think it's a Chris product, isn't it? The whitening gel? I think that's number one. All systems. Oh, yeah, all systems. Yeah, you're right. It is all systems. And I was trying to see the picture in my head. Yeah. And I like like heat in clumbers, right? Like I'm not going to use it in a bib sort of thing, but in the short hair, clumber feet are notorious. They lay their heads on their feet and spit on them. It's just a thing. And for that, you know, if I got a dog in that was gungy and I had to get it ready to go right now, that you put that whitening gel on, hat dry it in, and then wash and condition magic. That is one I have had good success with. I've had really good success with that as well. And where I've used it, not only have I used it on feet, I've also used it showing a lot of like white poodles or Bichons where people have used your medication, and it's left a bit of staining. I've just like put the gel on again, hot dried it in, and by the time you bath it out, it's crystal white. It is truly amazing what I've seen it do. I used to buy it by the carton. And it is. It's another one that's a little bit harder to find too, right? So it's like, why are you doing these good things hard for us to find? But anyway. They make our lives difficult. Okay. Any other last words for our white coated dog owners? Um, so for me, it's when you're using these products, use them as little as possible. Right? So you don't want to, it's often it's not a case of more is better, right? So if you're using, if you're using a bluing shampoo, and it's working for you, use it sparingly because otherwise your dog is going to turn gray, or blue, or purple, or smurf, right? If you're using an enzyme at cleaner, remember that the enzyme is actually eating the hair as well as the stain. There's no two ways about it. It is. And you need to use it with the hottest water you and your dog can take, but make sure your dog is well, not just you, and use it as sparingly as possible, or you're going to get a lot of coat damage, right? If you're bleaching or using a whitener or white lightning or white, whatever it might be, use it as sparingly as possible, which is why the prevention part of this is also so important. That's why finding the internal part. Is it your water? Is it the food? Do they need to not eat beet pulp? Right? Whatever that is, find that out because you don't want to be making a problem. The other thing that I see is people either over diluting or under diluting product, right? So if you over dilute a product, if they tell you to use it eight to one, and you're mixing it 12 to one, it's not going to do the job that it's made to do. If it's telling you to dilute it and you're not, maybe you are going to stain that hair, right? Also, leave it on. Don't put it on for two minutes. If it says to leave it on for five minutes, and just actually one thing that I will say about using especially a bluing type product is pre-clean. Oh my God, yes. So here's the thing is that our dogs have environmental debris on their coat, right? They have fabric softener from laying on their dog bed. They have styling products we've put into them from the dog show. Maybe they have just natural coat oils, right? Natural oils in their hair. They have everything. And so a lot of times some of these products can't do the job that we want them to do because they're trying to fight through the environmental debris or natural oil or whatever styling product that's on their coat. So pre-wash with typically a good clarifying shampoo. But remember that a clarifying shampoo can be a little harsh as well. Then use your whitening product. Then use your conditioner. And please to help yourself out, say the shampoo is supposed to be left on for five minutes and you did it for three. And the whitening shampoo is supposed to be left on for five minutes and you did it for three. If the conditioner says five minutes, please do it for six. That's the one. Exactly. Like if you are tight for time, the extra time goes to the conditioner every single time when you're whitening, not only to seal in what the goodness that you've done, but to seal out the next round of. To me, that's it, right? It's to keep it from because once you strip that, you've got to protect it. And I think of the conditioner as like a raincoat, right? Like it's the little wrapper that goes around every single hair to keep more gook from getting on there. Exactly. Exactly. Totally. No gook on our white hair. I think that's an official term. Okay. I think it is official. All right. Well, Allison, it is phenomenal to have you back. I've missed you madly. Well, thank you so much. I really do appreciate being back on Pure Dog Talk. I've missed our Pure Dog Talk, so hopefully we can do this again. And we will have some lengths. You'll drop me a couple of links, some Leading Edge Dog Show Academy links that we can drop in the show notes. And you guys be looking forward to more of these, all right? All right. Thanks, everyone.