 Hello everybody. Welcome back to another episode of Anabaptist Perspectives. We're here in New York City with Joel Yoder. This is I think the third episode we're doing with you now about helping to understand the best way of taking care of people who are serving cross-culturally. We did two episodes on burnout and this one's kind of broadened that out a little more, but specifically when you have individuals going to serve in a cross-cultural setting, what are ways that churches and people who stay back home can take good care of them and make sure they're staying well engaged with that individual? That's kind of broad, but I think you know what I'm getting out there. I think for starters, I think it's important for the sending church and those staying at home to recognize that the one they're sending out is an extension of their ministry and I think it's important also for the one who has been sent out to value their home church and the supporters. We're working on the same team and I really believe that in God's viewpoint, the one who stays at home and faithfully prays for and supports the worker who's going out is just as valuable, is just as much in ministry as a person who's on the front lines himself. So I think if they recognize that, that plays a huge part. If the home church especially recognizes that the one they've sent out is an extension of them, is part of their ministry, that goes a huge way or a long way in having them then take ownership and saying, we're going to pray for these people and let them know that we pray for them. So you can message them and say, hey, how can we pray for you today? What are you faced with right now? And then follow up later on and say, hey, we prayed for you two weeks ago. I didn't hear any updates. What's happening? Do you have anything? Not to put pressure on them, but rather just to show an interest and to let them know that they're not forgotten. I think that helps a lot so you can stay connected with them, you can communicate with them. Another thing that was meaningful to us when we were serving overseas is when we'd send out an email newsletter and people would respond, even if it's just like, hey, I enjoyed the update, like a little line like that, that was how it was meaningful to us because we knew that they were reading it. They were behind us. Sometimes we'd send out newsletters and we wouldn't get any response back and that's okay, but we were like, is anyone reading them? Like why should we even send them? We have enough other things to do and we're not even going to bother sending them, but having people stay connected, communicate with them. Another thing that I think is important that the home church, the sending church does not expect the pastors to do all that communication or the connection. Our pastors are very busy. Okay, so it's more of an organic approach almost is what you're saying. It's not like this institutionalized thing necessarily. Our pastors are very busy and to expect them to be the ones that stay in touch with all of the members that are sent out. I think the pastors should stay in connection with what's happening, but don't expect all of that work to fall on the pastors. I think maybe the church could set up a support committee. I think it's Neil Perolo has a book serving as senders and it's a really good book on how the home church can set up like a sending committee that is responsible to stay connected with the ones who are serving overseas. And then this will pay benefits to the church because when the worker returns, if there has been good communication, they will feel much more connected to their home church, to the sending church, and we'll be able to adjust to life back into that church. I think it'll go a long ways in helping with that process. So basically if someone wants to go serve, it's not like they just hop on a plane. You're advocating for something that's very intentional and like connecting well, going through various steps to make sure we're taking the best care of these people that we can before they just, we just dump them in some far-off country. It's really easy to do it that way where people just kind of go and like, oh yeah, so-and-so left, you know, and that's... And some of that is the fault of the worker that is gone, that that leaves too. I think it's very important that before a church member leaves and goes into ministry, that they get the blessing of their church. If you want the support of your church, like the connection, the emotional support, the relational support, if you want that support, then you need to have their blessing to be going in the first place. And there's too many people, perhaps with the mentality that we have today is much more of this lone ranger kind of approach. It's like, well, hey, I'm gonna do this and I'm gonna head off. I have Phil calling to go to Zimbabwe. And so, hey, there's an organization that'll send me and they pack up and go, and then the pastor finds out and like, you did what? Or like, where is so-and-so? Yeah, like they went to Zimbabwe. Like there's not gonna have, they are not gonna have a church's support if that's their approach. And I don't think that's the case in most of the workers that are, that I am familiar with. But I'm saying that is a danger that can creep in if we're not careful, especially on more short term trips. Yeah, I mean, it really happens. I've seen too many cases. And that's why I love what you guys are doing up here, where you're saying, oh, whoa, before you go, like, take a couple of weeks, take some time to step back, prepare, get a little more solidified and just taking that time to step back and think it through, I think it's gonna be huge before someone just gets on a plane and goes. And they're like, oh, wait, you know, maybe it would be a good idea to have my church standing behind me. We're talking about people who, you know, wanting to go and not just going, but actually communicating well with their churches. So let's say they've done that step. So how can churches respond and say, yes, we're going to support you? Practically speaking, now what? You can check with your worker that you sent out, check with them first. But I think it's really meaningful if people from the home church visit them on the foreign field, especially if they're home ministry, their leadership team can visit them. And as I just said earlier, our pastors are busy. They are often self-supported. And for them to think of taking off a week of work and time to go visit workers overseas, especially if there's multiple workers gone out from that particular church or sent out from that particular church, that can seem overwhelming. So I think one of the things the church can do is financially help their pastors be able to visit the workers on the field. I think that the home church should have someone visit, someone from their church should visit the workers at least every year. And again, I said, check with your worker first. You don't want to overwhelm them. You don't want to be a burden for the home church when they send someone to visit the worker that's gone out. They should go with the idea that I'm going to serve this worker. We're not just going so we can get a cheap Caribbean vacation. We can stay at the missionary's house and they're going to take us to the beach and they're going to take a sightseeing. Like no, go take an interest in their ministry. Expect to go to church with them. Expect to go to their regular ministry activities. See what their normal life is like. Don't expect just to do touristy things and think that you're really blessing them. We had visitors when we lived overseas. We had visitors that would leave and I'm so glad they're gone. We were happy to see them come, but we were very happy to see them leave too. Most of our visitors were not that way. We had visitors that blessed us in many ways that took an interest in our life and really got involved in the ministry that we were doing and we knew that they cared about us and that means a lot. Another thing that churches can do when they have workers overseas is be specific in asking questions about their finances. Every mission organization handles finances differently where there are different approaches to handling finances and so don't assume that your worker has the worker that you have sent out has all their financial needs met. Maybe they do. Maybe they have surplus, but ask questions about that. You can be specific and like so are your needs being met? Are you pulling from your savings account that you have in the US? Are you pulling from your savings account just so you can sustain your life there? So you can ask questions about that. Don't just assume that well, because we commissioned them and sent them with this mission organization that they're taking care of all that. I think the home church can can ask that question as well. When someone who's been serving in a cross-cultural setting returns back home to their home church, there's a pretty serious re-entry process and I know I mean you went through this, but it's something we don't really think about. We think of culture shock when you go, but then when you come back, it's kind of the same thing or maybe a reverse culture shocker or whatever you want to call it. How can the church help with that? Because it's a completely different animal because now the person's back home and everybody's like, oh, hey, you're back home. Everything is like it always was, but it's not. So yeah. That is something that we don't talk about nearly enough. And it's something that we do care about. I care about a lot because I know how painful re-entry can be. We often put a fair amount of emphasis on culture shock when you go into another country, but not nearly enough emphasis is put on reverse culture shock when you come back. For us personally, when we moved overseas, we went through culture shock when we entered that particular culture, but not that bad. Coming back was many times worse. It took us a couple years to get through that. There are practical things when workers are returning. Just practical things that you can do. Before they are coming back, find out, do they have a job lined up? Do they need work? You can find out, do they have a place to stay? Do they need a vehicle? Do they have finances to buy a vehicle? Sometimes I think people tend to forget that a worker has been gone for seven years. And while they were staying at home, and yeah, they might have been supporting them financially, but they're staying at home and they're saving money $200, $300, $400 a month or more depending on who they're saving that money, setting it aside, the person that's overseas, they might be pulling money from their savings to do that. And they come back, they have very little cushion, maybe no money to start a house, to start a place to live. So you can ask those questions well in advance before they come back. You can ask questions like, who's going to pick you up at the airport? The church can send a welcoming committee. I meet them at the airport. It shows value that you care about them. I'm sure their families are going to be there and meet them at the airport. But if there's church people that meet them at the airport, or when they're going, when they take them to the airport, that means a lot to people. Find out if they're coming back in the wintertime and they were serving in a warm culture, find out do they need winter clothes. When we moved overseas, we had a four-month-old baby. When we came back nine years later, we had four children, no winter clothes for our children. We came back in February and people met us at the airport with coats. And like that means a lot. And it's a practical way that the church can help. I think in that case, it's more a family, that they helped us with reentry. Talk about emotional support for workers that are coming back. I talked about some of the practical things. And sometimes I think that too often our people in our home churches, they forget the emotional support that's needed too. Unless someone has gone through reentry themselves, it's going to be hard for them to identify with it. And there's a certain amount of that is natural. Until you've gone through something, you won't fully be able to identify. But many people don't even think about the emotional support that's needed as well. When someone comes back, reentry is a process. It's not just an event. They come to church the next Sunday and people are like, oh, I bet you're so glad to be back. That might be true in some cases, but that's not always true. They might be going through a grief process very similar to the death of a loved one. If workers go overseas and invest well in the lives of the people that they're serving, when they leave that, it's like losing a friend. It is losing a friend. It's like very similar to a death. And we expect a widow to grieve if her husband dies. She'll grieve for months. And we expect that that's normal. But I think we fail to recognize that a very similar grief process can be happening in workers that are coming back. So being there emotionally for emotional support, I think is really important. Depending on their role overseas, they might feel completely lost. When we left our work overseas, I went from being a well-loved pastor that everyone knew me as Pastor Joel. I came back and I was a nobody. And I think we cried about halfway to Jamaica, literally. Like we cried about the first hour and a half on the plane. And I kept asking the question like, I don't know who I am. I know who I was, but that's not who I'm going to be. When we land, who am I? There's a certain amount of having your identity wrapped up in your position that's unhealthy, but it's also reality that a lot of returning workers face. So being there to support your returning worker emotionally, take time to listen to him. I remember a pastor asked this this was after we moved back. He asked us how it was going. And I forget exactly our response or even exactly his question. But his response was like, you know, I actually don't know what that feels like, but can you tell me more? Like I would like to know more. And that meant a lot to us because instead of people just kind of smiling like, oh yeah, must be nice. Or just kind of this blank look on their face and checking out. Like he took the interest to recognize that he didn't understand. But he's like, tell me more. I would like to understand. Help me understand what you're going through. And that meant a lot to us. Just like it's emotional support that people can give when workers return. A lot of the emotional support is very similar. I mean emotional support that is needed is very similar to the emotional support that they need when they first go into new culture. But I think in many cases it's even greater because they go expecting it to be great. Expecting the the challenges to be great. And so they're prepared for it. And they're they're digging into that when they come back. Being there helping someone walk alongside that check in with them every couple weeks. How's it going? Re-entry as I said is a process. It's not just an event. I might be okay today. I might not be okay in two weeks. Like if I just came back. So if we're having a conversation and I've been back for a month and you say, how's it going? I'm like, and it's tough and you know we talk through things and I feel like I'm okay. In two weeks from now I might not be okay. So check back in again and see you know how is it going. Just taking an interest in your life. And the longer they're back then that that how often you check in can reduce that frequency can reduce. But still stay engaged with them. I think it's really really important. I think it's important to get someone that would be like a mentor maybe. I don't know if mentor is the right word. But someone that would be assigned if you will to be responsible to check in and and connect with this person on a regular basis. Because our pastors want to. They intend to. But I know from personal experience we can run into a week and into the next week and a month goes by and two months goes by. I'm like, oh man I was going to check that person. I was going to see how they're doing it. I never, well I didn't for a long period of time. Another thing that I think the churches can do is just allow them time. Allow returning workers time to to grieve their losses. Allow them time to adjust in the process this. And if you can be there just lend emotional support. Show that you care. Even if you don't fully understand. Taking the time to say hey help me understand. I want to I want to know how I can care for you. Just taking time to listen to them. Asking them to tell you stories from their time overseas. Sometimes that can be therapeutic for workers that are coming back just being able to relate stories and talk about some of their experiences too. So you've been talking about what it's like to re-enter to come back home I guess you can say for some of these people. But just walk me through some of the common struggles that people face as they return. And then also what are ways a church can step in and ease that pain. I know you mentioned some of that already but try and tie those two together. I'm glad you put home in quotes because for some workers it is coming back home. But I maintain that the deeper you engage in the in your host culture like the the more you invest in people there the harder it's going to be to leave and the more that's going to feel like home. The longer you're there and the deeper you engage the deeper you invest in people's lives overseas the more that's going to feel like home. We came back to the U.S. and well-meaning people like oh I bet you're so glad to be home and I'm like actually I'm not. Like this doesn't feel like home. Home was where we were that was our home church. I mean it wasn't but that's what felt like home. And for us in reality we raised our four children our first four children we raised there. We left with a baby we left here with a baby. We came back with four children. I didn't even know how much money it would take to raise a family here. We never raised a family here. Wow and I had to ask my dad I was like so I'm trying to find a job. I don't even know how much money I need to raise a family. Even answering a simple question would seem simple but that's actually a pretty significant question that's one way the church can can help out with with re-entry. Reverse culture shock is just as real and in our case as I said earlier was even deeper than the initial culture shock so how do people feel when they come back? It varies with people I understand that. I can speak more from us from my experience than everyone's but I know that I'm not alone in some of the feelings that I had. I just a feeling of of lostness like I don't know what I'm doing. And this is what kept me going when I came back. I knew beyond a shadow of a doubt that God was the one who brought us back here. God sent us overseas and we stayed there until God very clearly told us to come back. I don't to this day I don't understand why all of the why's that God brought us back but I knew that God brought us back so it wasn't the question of whether I should be here I just didn't know why I was supposed to be here. That was like a lostness that I felt to some degree it's like I didn't know what I'm supposed to be doing. I knew we were supposed to come back to our home church for at least a year and that we had a future ministry somewhere but God didn't say where. It's a long story I don't have time for that on this particular episode but sure just feeling lost for a while and having people just walk alongside me and say hey tell me how you're feeling help me understand that meant that meant a lot when people would do that. Just almost an openness maybe from these people like them not coming to you trying to have answers but coming to you wanting just to hear. It showed me that they cared. They weren't just saying oh I bet you're so glad to be back and it's been two weeks and you know everything's cool and you got your house set up and now you're ready to go. It's much deeper than that because sometimes people can feel insignificant. When they come back they are very very involved in ministry where they were overseas they come back and they come back to a large church they're not really needed. People don't even really notice if they show up at church or if they don't. That can feel people can feel very insignificant in a setting like that. Another feeling that is also quite common if they were serving in a poor country a third world country they come back and you can feel overwhelmed with the just the affluence that we have the amount of money that people throw around. I think a common feeling or a feeling that's quite common is either frustration or even anger at the church people at their indifference. I don't think it's always fair I'm just saying these are sometimes feelings that returning workers have. They see people more worried about their $60,000 pickup truck than they are that their neighbors dying and going to hell. I don't know that they technically are more worried about their truck but when a worker has been very involved in ministry comes back and you hear those conversations on Sunday after church it can lead to frustration. It took me a while to realize that actually there is a lot more spiritual depth in our home church than I first saw when I first came back and yeah I was critical I just I know that I'm just saying that these are these are real feelings that people sometimes feel when the home church can walk alongside them that can help them get past that sooner than if they're just kind of left to flounder and say oh yeah like we had a housewarming party for you and now everything you're good to go and you just kind of drop off the radar and the new crisis becomes the new news and you feel very alone and forgotten. Thank you very much for sharing that especially sharing some of your own story there that's that's a lot to think about. It sounds like we as churches have our work cut out for us and we need to take this more seriously and we need to be intentional and that's yeah that's that's a good message for us to hear. Most of the time I would say probably 98 percent of the time it's not because people truly don't care it's just because they don't know. Yeah I think the what you're saying there it's not that people don't care. I completely yeah it's they just don't know maybe right and that's what this is about you know raise that awareness and tell people hey this is this is a real thing you know. Wow yeah well thank you for taking the time to share and for yeah just exploring these things hopefully this creates a lot of conversations among pastors and church leaders and yeah I really appreciate you taking the time.