 All right, I'd like to welcome everyone to the planning commission meeting for Essex town of Essex. This is January 25th 2024 and a few weeks since we've been here in this room. So it's a new year new new new night Same old night. Sorry Shoes here Yeah, yep Okay, so I Don't see any Call for additions or changes to the agenda this evening Correct Then I guess we're gonna play by the rules a little bit. I'm gonna like motion to accept the agenda as presented To lay motion by Georgia seconded by shoe all those in favor of accepting the agenda as presented John mangan Motion carries Six zero so first item next item on our agenda at this stage is public comment Before I do that I would just like to ask anybody who is going to be offering any comment to us this evening to and any of these items to please stand raise your right hand and We'll swear you in for the night Do you swear that any testimony you're gonna present this evening is truthful to the best of your abilities? This is the time This and I do will suffice Online can I know you hit your hand up? Did you want to give a verbal approval agreement? Okay, I just wanted saw your hand in one ignore you Okay with that Gonna open the floor for public comments Please be wreck waiting to you are recognized by me before you offer anything and Let's keep it to items that are not on the agenda and things that are on the agenda We'll have opportunity to discuss when we come to them. So with that is there anyone that would like to make a comment Sir he was in the room first can go ahead The reason for my comments today is to add kennel to the rvd-1 use of zoning areas is to allow for a second It be built in the Boston court development Both there are four warehouse spaces that are being corrected there and our Or redesign before correction. So the opportunity Really important to me Currently it's not known for that use That is a quick introduction. I thought to create a scape and make last year after I've been here and Not carpet baggers from out of the state do that here and work together all the That I tend employees right now more in the summer of Looking to Retain our employees and the change owner Charitable donations are about the reason for this site why it's important for us Business don't require a loading box that Other space around it People high trees Is a growing community here in Asif Milston before moving their hand going back to work Originally when we started this project So capacity in the area has decreased And it's it's a needed service. We can also provide jobs and tax revenue Our jobs pay $20 an hour as a minimum and up we have to pay time off other benefits soon to offer health care for Okay, things like that We have felt for okay already and we have career and part-time short-term opportunities available for people Last comment. This is the right location for the area for our business as well There's nothing like this in the immediate area here in Essex As expected just down the road like I mentioned and there's just lots of daily traffic on highway 15 going by in and out of Burlington every day I know that a lot of people live in Jericho under hill you to that area For us, it's an opportunity to kind of split our client base in half kind of a watery Richmond side of things and then more of a Burlington side of things. So there is a self-interest there, obviously But I think that it's one of the best interest of the community. So thank you for your time I'll leave some copies of my notes with you. Thank you very much Sharon or Catherine just more precisely where exactly is he proposing so I'm not sure the term that he'd used It's across the street off Allen Martin Drive. It's when you come off Sand Hill Road. Yeah, basically That first one right there. Okay Okay, thank you Thank you. Thank you, Dustin. I didn't you might have said this Did you mention public comment, right? Oh I did not. Thank you. I completely forgot about that. So this is also the opportunity is thank you, Sharon To provide comments both public and from the planning commission for items for the consent agenda item Which is a boundary line? between two lines on West sleepy Hollow Road So with that I would also Ask for comments again. Thank you. You're right there Paula Actually, you're here first. So if you want to move up by Catherine to see the screen better, you're welcome to We have an open seat tonight, so yep Yes, at this point Paula you are a voting member. Yes Okay back to the thing Ken your hand is up, please Thank you I'm gonna take it down. There we go. So I just wanted to bring to the your attention and Anybody else who's interested as attention that h518, which is the bill in the House of Representatives For our charter change has passed the house Is now in the Senate? It contains the DRB specification and currently the date specified is still January the 1st 2025 So I would like to encourage Mission if it wants to be involved in the transition, which I would think it would be Maybe come up with a plan for how to transition to the DRB Something as simple as suggesting that the select board appoint the DRB. Let's say by July 1st So they could start on July 1st Set a cut-off after which any applications going to the zoning board or to the planning commission start going to the I'm sorry You do Keep talking, please Constituted self have its first organizational meeting in July like all other commissions and committees set a cut-off date After which any applications that would have gone to the zoning board or the planning commission instead go to the DRB That would give you folks some six months to close up any Applications in the manner that they started and the DRB has plenty of time for you to participate I would hope participate in the training. I assume some of you folks would probably be on the DRB So that might not be even the very necessary But just having a good plan in place so that by January 1st 2025 the DRB is up and running and ready to go That's it. Thanks. I'm pulling from the tape, but I like to That would be great Thanks Ken Is there anyone else that would like to offer comment this evening on the this includes the planning commissioners on the consent agenda Or any other items? It's not on the planning not on the agenda this evening Hearing none We're gonna move on to the consent agenda item We had no discussion points So I look for a motion to Approve or deny the consent agenda What does look like we have our In discussions we'll invite you to be able to participate in discussions, but because we have the seven you will be a Non-voting member tonight. Thank you, Paul So I'd like a motion for the consent agenda. I move we approve the consent agenda I'll second that move by shoe seconded by Trevor Any additional discussion? All those in favor? Motion carries seven zero Onward next item. We have is business items capital plan 2024 planning commission work plan and then Minutes It's written as approval of the November 9th and November 16th minutes Okay Who's gonna be discussing with us the capital plan? Oh bunch bunch of us. No, no, no, no, no Okay, you have two minutes each All right, so I am actually gonna start us off so the Four of us are part of the capital What we called team now Working group whatever so We've been meeting For the year to talk about the capital budget So thought it'd be great a great thing to have everybody here So I think normally it's in the director of public works Discuss the budget And also keep in mind too, it's a five-year plan that we have much more specifics for a Current fiscal year than we would five years road from it But there there are projects that you'll see in the plan you know going out five years and And the reason why the we're having this discussion is that as a State statute allows the planning commission actually says that a plan And we're allowed to have a capital budget The town plan I you know really should be part of the guiding document for what how the town In your packet I included the word clouds from the town plan Just as a way to remember what we heard from the public You know really what our town plan is based on what we heard from the public about what they In our town how old they want to see us grow or not grow and Just keeping that in mind At that is sort of my a little spiel I'm gonna turn it over to I think mostly Dan at this point to talk through more of that details Okay, thank you Catherine. Thanks for taking the time this evening I can walk you through the capital plan a little bit especially for fiscal year 25 There's you know a lot of kind of larger subgroups, you know buildings highways vehicles equipment park facilities Stormwater projects a wide variety of things that happen in a capital plan like this Okay, can I interrupt just for one moment? I apologize, but I don't I've never met you. Sorry. I'm Dan Roy I'm not financed. Okay. Thanks, Dan. My apologies Everybody to speak up Okay, I can do that as well Okay, thanks. Yeah, um So as of the end of fiscal year 24, we're anticipating overall for our capital projects fund a balance of three million dollars Going forward with that our fiscal year 25 revenues are going to be about 484,000 generated from capital tax $470,000 of transfers from the operating budget And then there's a line for about 1.6 million of grants and interest revenue and other things like that The grant revenue item is connected to the the church of Latter-day Saints upon conversion project So that's you know really is a big impact on this overall budget for fiscal year 25 The fiscal year 25 estimated spending is almost three million dollars Most of which about 1.7 million is that project was which I just mentioned which is Offset to a great degree by the grant revenue The Ending point for that fiscal year 25 capital projects fund balance is 2.85 million so combining all the grant rev all the Combined revenues and netting against the expenses There's a difference of about 135,000 dollars that the capital projects funds would be reduced by During the course of fiscal year 25 Obviously, there's a lot of spending in other areas primarily replacing vehicles and equipment for fire department public works things like that continuing with payments on on that for Vehicles that we own that are on multiple year payment plans things of that nature But they the biggest item in there is the stormwater project for the upon conversion To expand the look to fiscal year 26 through 29 We take a preliminary look at the new town municipal complex Costing out possible road additions and a fire department building as well These are all very preliminary early estimates of costs For fiscal year 26 through 29. We're trying to show them as kind of in and out which is certainly an accelerated plan to to You know have such big projects occur, but we wanted to Try and show those amounts netting out and and be able to analyze other aspects of the budget Long term without those elements kind of clouding up that picture Just to kind of continue with fiscal year 26 through 29 we're still Expecting to use a three cent tax rate for capital tax revenue The budget here still reflects $470,000 of operating transfers which has been a Legacy number from the most recent fiscal years Most of that number is made up of supporting our vehicles and equipment expenses as I mentioned for fire and and public works On an annual basis overall we expect to generate 1.15 million of revenues Toward the capital project plan and With the impending reappraisal, you know that we know there's going to be a change in how the capital tax is how much it generates and You know we'll have to wait and see what kind of effect that has on the overall budget Long term for fiscal year 26 and 29 after that reappraisal work is done for the town So that's kind of a quick synopsis of you know Where short term and long term kind of lie? I don't know if you have any Questions based off of that And I can also project Without opening documents and getting into looking for details and so forth. I'm just curious where or what? Other than the potential municipal offices and fire up a station. What if any? Capital might be targeted towards the ETC Area because I know we've talked about needing different things Before any of that can really go is it do we have any of that infrastructure on the target list? They're talking about water sewer lines are We just got bids in we will be constructing a 12-inch main from Billy Butler on Which would be the Northwest really side of 15 from Billy Butler all the way to Essex Way We're looking for that project to begin break ground probably Late April early May This will provide that 12-inch water line between those two rows along that side Providing the additional flows that we will need in that area to accommodate the growth and the height of growth that The density that we want in that area As of right now We do have some sewer updates and upgrades that we are doing in the area We'll need to take place as part of Any build out out there? We do not have any Scoping or plan as of yet to look at suing that a new portion of the town center that we're looking to Have developed in the future, but it's on the radar I think the next step we're going to be looking at will be looking to looking at the allocation That's the finite element up there and that's going to definitely drive what takes place Not only in the town center, but the rest of this That will be a priority moving forward in the future Okay Because that that will sort of help guide you know when we can dig into you know really Making the changes that we're looking for in the town center area It's it's the enabled into the primary enablers What about Pioneer drive area and stuff like that has that been mitigated I may be I may be missing projects here and so forth, but we've had an ongoing issue for Decade or two With pioneer drive and I may miss something we've got the folks that are not pioneer drive Pinecrest We had the development going in out there and there's been a lot, you know Challenges along that is that infrastructure and stuff at a solid point. Yes. Yes. I believe we're talking about the The new pump station that went in Yes, so if y'all remember we we had the developer pay for and install Gravity manhole out towards the edge of our right-of-way As deep as he possibly could in order to facilitate picking up as much of The pinecrest Painesville area With gravity sewer in the future we do have old plans that could be dusted off and Re-looked at to come up with a soaring project in there, but again That would definitely be based off of board approval and the need of the residents I'm just trying to dust off the big hot topics from the last few years It's awful dusty, so I'm not gonna stop one another thing related to Somewhat the ETC next area, but I think it's really for the whole town We have a pretty old bike and pedestrian plan That's all shared with the city and so we're hoping through the regional planning Commission Do a date or right of that and That will give us a better idea of priority sidewalks trails that we want to Funded I think we though that'll be a public process that and hopefully that would be starting Are there any? I'm gonna push back to your direction a little bit Are there any of the projects that you you went through a general outline, but are there any of the project you specifically want to put on our radar? That maybe didn't start with us or start with development. Is there anything that you feel is something we have to accommodate in planning initiatives and development reviews and so forth this I'd say the town excuse me the town center is going to be an important one and it's You know the land that the town acquired 8090 upper main street It's obviously the part of the goal there is the municipal facilities town offices fire station Potentially library community space recreation space stuff like that But it's it's our our idea is that it's more than that. It's really kind of the Hope for a town center. It's going to facilitate development up there help make it a vibrant place So I think as you get into the ETC next plan and look at the zoning that ETC next recommends That's going to be instrumental and and what can happen on that property not just the municipal side of things But also any other private element for the private partnerships and getting into the planning about what What are some of the goals of the town plan that the community wants around? Density of homes Commercial space stuff like that. How do we tie that into recreation space? Whether it's those sidewalks that connect elsewhere trails that lead up to Indian Brook trails just on that property Green space. I think that that's going to be central to the whole bigger town center area Developing and coming really the hub for the community Other than that I think yes sidewalks After mentioned the bike head plan and perhaps an update there But sidewalks roads a lot of the capital that we have now is maintaining Replacing heavy equipment maintaining roads the water sewers separate item, but Yeah, a lot of a lot of what you see in here is is what we have already Of that town center stuff is going to be some of the sidewalks and trails. That's going to be what's next All you had a question Processed what you would do with the existing facilities that you So for this building at the city of Essex Junction has a right of first refusal on it if we do go to sell it We haven't you know, we've talked very high level about how do we fund new facilities? What happens with these facilities? Best guess at this point as we probably look to sell some of the stuff that were we would I think Whether that holds up. I mean that is people mentioned should we should we lease it out? Keep a revenue source in there B. That's another I was a building of land lording and I was thinking more of things like the Arming fire department There it makes a statement. Yeah, the library. I think is It is this beautiful building. I I think that would warrant more Conversation about if and when that moves or the library moves what happens to that building We have given some thought to the fire station and you want to Yeah, if it if fire does Have a new facility elsewhere. I didn't want to construct it in the in our in our property. They're at 80 90 Obviously right next door to our buildings there Likely move would be to expand some of our operations into that building and repurpose it both for public works admin offices Things are getting pretty tight over in our little white building there on the Essex greens The old library. Yeah, the old library and then use some of the bays as Of our trucks or for mechanics Bay Basically stay intact Right I'm gonna date myself. They put the ice ring back. We put the skating rink back It was right immediately to the left of the fire station as you're looking at them. Oh, yeah Anyways, ring down on Foster Road to escape the foster road has a couple of rinks on That was always easy to walk over to Okay, quick any other commissioners questions Josh John Okay, all right, so I have one question for you. Yes Thinking ahead to next year's planning for the capital plan and budget or any way that you would want to be involved more or See updates more. I would actually suggest we put that on our discussion points for the planning Commission the revised planning Commission Duties to find out if that would be more appropriate. I think if there is an opportunity to focus Speaking off the cuff here that if there's not if there's an ability to be somewhat synchronistic with the capital projects What we're looking to do we get the capital we do the zoning or we do the zoning and get the capital whatever needs to come first but it just seems like that would be more of a an Opportunity to be more in sync and maybe get things a little more efficiently push through Well, I just have the question so there's this fund right now with three million dollars in it and it's gradually going to be spent down by the 2029 what's how do you Anticipate replenishing that in the future. Yeah, so I mean the the immediate answers are Addressing the capital tax rate when reappraisal happens so that's kind of a stone that's left unturned at this point and Obviously the reappraisal could have you know a significant impact on on the revenue line there there is always the option of Incorporating operating transfers from the regular fiscal year budgets It's not really an avenue I would like to increase because I think it's better to have them as two distinct pools So, you know, those are kind of the two main drivers Obviously, we're trying to keep some degree of interest revenue in there And then often with a lot of the public works programs, you know, we try and Find grant or loan forgiveness opportunities wherever we can as well. So those are the immediate channels to try and Yeah, thank you. Sure I can elaborate on that. We have presented like board with this information the past couple of years When we lost the S extension tax base last year, that was about 41% of our tax base. So We we presented a proposed increase to the capital tax the select board pursued going from two cents up to three cents, this is where is that now that the voters were very supportive of that We've talked about increasing More than that, but as Dan said the the idea is to wait to see what happens at the reappraisal They had mentioned the revenue side of things just to give him some credit Credit investing some more of the town's money and some higher yielding accounts That's generating quite a bit more interest than we ever have in the past the recent past impact fees is another one the Fire departments doing an impact fee study. So that might help generate some revenue on the fire side of things That's that's always an option Recreation has impact fees that might be due for an update Okay the good You Go ahead Is there so do you have a target? Date in establishing As far as building facilities Not really I think that's Catherine and I were just talking about this this afternoon We're getting ready to do kind of spend this next year doing a lot of planning work and figuring out What can go up there? Trying to put some some cost estimates better cost estimates to things already have some cost estimates But then figuring out, you know, how do we pay for those things? I don't Catherine if you want to speak more to the planning process No, I think I think you heard to say We need to do good planning first Point you probably Putting change with ET I think we need to have a discussion on how quickly did people want to see it you haven't really had a lot of comfort parcels with the Hearing like let's do a or wait. Let's take some time and think this through Believe and I think it would be great to do it sooner rather than later What goes there? Good impact Is due to the best you Perhaps So the Yeah, and that that's part of the Yeah, yeah Definitely can see that side of the road having interconnected Properties Daniel To good. I think we're good. Thank you very much for coming in. Thank you Bring snacks next time All right, let's roll into our 2024 work plan All right So I will pull this up on the screen But I I do have a couple extra copies of people would like to see it. Okay, so So this was my stab at just thinking about what what I see in the future In the community development plate as well You know some of this was Information that are things that we had that were on the work plan last year And the work plan, you know included more than just one year So there was kind of an overlap with multiple years. So that's some of it is why and I I think you know looking at what what I have up here the first thing is the Town plan update Really the heavy lifting is done with that. But that doesn't really need to probably take a whole lot of time But the next thing Is that the voters will get a third chance to weigh in on it on town meeting day? so You know, I think we could consider how to get the word out about the town plan and supporting the town plan and That's a worth worth the discussion at least at part of the planning commission There's not that much time before town meeting here Do we know where town meeting is going to be town meeting is at the middle school. Okay, and town meeting is actually Really on Tuesday, which is all it's all by Australian ballot this year So there are no floor votes, you know nothing nothing is being voted on on that Monday night It's an informational meeting that they're having a or we're having a An open house Format before where there'll be tables so we could set up a planning commission We need a development table there and just to let people see the town plan Is this on Monday Monday Monday before it will that be at the middle school that's at the middle schools I think we're booked at the middle school for the next. I don't know how many years ever many years So Then the second thing You know speaking of what Ken Signorello brought up the DRB transition That really does need to be at the forefront of Everything and whether or not it's gonna take I have it listed here taking the whole year whether or not it will take the whole year I don't know but it's something to get started on right away and you know figure figure that out Now I already have been doing a little bit of work on that reaching out to some folks who have had experience doing a transition Including the city, you know, they recently Transitioned over to DRB. So I had a meeting with Regina Mahoney that their city manager this week to talk about it Talked with the regional planning commission Dusty and I have done some talking well and really wanting to pull in the zoning board into those discussions So it's not just the planning talking about it. So we're gonna have it all So we've had a brief conversations with their chair Nick Martin He'd have more discussions with them and try to solidify a plan including the zoning board I'd like to maybe take that if the commission agrees at least as a starting point for us to come up with a not necessarily a full draft, but a draft draft of The way we might go about this and you know to recognize Ten's points from earlier. There's this is really all on our discussion plate already So like to be able to bring back to this commission and the zoning board as much as they're able to join us and maybe even do it in a group session of combined workshop to present this so that we can then present our thoughts and You know, maybe some guidance up to the select board because I believe that's where the actual decision has to come from right and they are looking to You all in the zoning board and staff and to make the recommendation how to go about this too you know my understanding is that You know the final decision like you said is theirs, but they're looking for recommendations and guidance Go about it Well, so what's going to happen with the planning and zoning go out of existence and the DRB Half of that's true So that the planning commission stays that the zoning board goes away and the development review board takes the place of the zoning board, but also takes the Development review side of the planning commission's job. So any sort of you know site plans or subdivisions With waivers that would go go to the DRB for the planning commission would do Discipline To that I guess this will be a part of the workshop or discussion With this body being a combined You know group for the planning commission right now is there a talk of you know folks transitioning to the DRB or you know Is there an opportunity for discussion about that? Absolutely. Yeah, I think that's got to be a big part of the discussion There's no we don't have a roadmap not yet. We don't have a roadmap. We don't have an expectation that you know I Would like to think that anybody who's currently serving a role on the zoning or planning Would have the opportunity to choose to choose to continue I guess would be the way to continue in the capacity that they're most interested in but then that's I think Part of the recommendation that we have to make to the select board Or we ought to make to the sling board. I don't think we have to but I think that's in our best interests Well, and typically the planning Commission in in that Framework deals more with long-term planning Legislative Judicial right Yeah, continue to do So, I mean, I think this is all it will all be my expectation is that this group in Conjunction with the collaboration with the zoning board will come up with a proposal of What we feel the Planning Commission makeup the DRB makeup the duties the expectations the flow so forth should be or could be And using contacts outside of this group and just come up with a recommendation Well, if not Devon if not that then how right how can that communication because that I think will be part of that but that's but I agree. I think it's ideal to have overlap There's a significant amount of domain knowledge that really exists that may or may not, you know Have a role in the in the upcoming Reformation So if I may I think there are actually Complications with having people Volunteer on both right the the point of splitting the DRB from the planning Commission is to have a Division of labor that doesn't put anyone in a position where they are making the plans and executing them At the same time right and so like it gets fuzzy, you know one may be sure To three how where does that line get cut and when does it become? Kind of redundant to you know or Undermine the entire objective of dividing the groups anyway Some degree the objective of division isn't clear. So I mean the the objective right now is May also have to be clarified But the fact is that it will happen at this point with legislative final legislative approval It's it's it's a done deal. So now it's what it what are the two group? What are the two groups? Responsible for where's the division of responsibilities and I mean I'm not sure I quite agree with the fact that we that a person can't do Both hats because we do that now. We've been doing it in you know going back From now to whenever this began and it's been successful. So I actually I'm a slightly different No, I think the knowledge of how the rules that are developed are applied I think is key in developing the rules correctly Revising the rules you need to know the the challenges with the application. So to me There's a level of there's a facet of this has got to be a communication path Between the DRB and the planning commission for those items that work those items that don't work What do we need to focus on what's going to drive the changes? What's going what anyways, so this is all the pieces. No, no, I understand Yeah, and we're probably if I continue we'll just get into it I think so we're planning to have this discussion later and develop a draft. Okay. Yeah, so I will withhold But but but in those mind as you're thinking this stuff through don't lose these thoughts I would encourage everybody as these thoughts are coming up note them You know because they either somebody else may be thinking about them or nobody may be thought about and we should so It's it's a it's a new frontier for this for this community There's a lot of there's a lot of neighboring communities effect almost all neighboring communities have done this So it's it's not a it's not a big unknown. It's just an unknown for this group Well, and a lot of communities have transitioned to separate boards or commissions Primarily because of the ethical concerns, right? It may have been successful. I don't know Essex here It has certainly been Corrupted in other places and cause problems, right? You know when someone is in charge of making the plans and approving the plans that Is suspect to Challenges remember that the approval is through the select board. Yeah, it's independent of this body Of these bodies. I'm not let's let's won't argue the point. I mean, I see where you're going with it but I We need to figure out how to get there. Yeah, we know where we need to be We need to figure out what it is that are the the division of duties is and it may be exactly that That may be part of the reason for it, but I don't know that that's been communicated It really just do it. I mean what I've heard from most people and like in other towns is that especially that Having a planning commission read up of the development review side allows from our planning, right? And so that that is a I had not heard about Questionable kinds of things going on so much as the division of labor and and focus Yeah, I actually had a really great conversation with Meg Staliff down in southern Vermont. She's with BDCC I believe the Regional Development Corporation down there and she was pointing out a variety of reasons why it's not particularly Safe or you know, there there are risks in all problems With having them combined and she's seen that firsthand. We had a longer conversation about it and why it's Challenging together If we want to say it's a good thing the reason right now that it's The why is almost it's not irrelevant It's almost irrelevant because the decision to me now we need to figure out how to implement So write all these you get thoughts question things we need to understand write them down so we can bring them back And and address them as a group and then we just can have a good Recommendation to the select board the timing of it the whole line yards. We can we can figure out what makes sense As a as a body as two bodies, so I mean we can get this the zoning board to participate with us on this We already have one Yes Okay, you can be a advocate for this for the rest of the group, okay Okay, happy to do it John or Josh any thoughts questions This was separated to give planning more time to do pure planning, but I also I'm open to the idea that maybe there were some issues that happened when they were combined, but yeah open-minded right now Yeah, I don't really I mean, I don't know enough about this to ask any questions and tonight's the first night I even heard that it's happening. So Is there is there a link to the state statue or something that we can read up on like what are the requirements so on so forth? Some of the information we're trying to gather and we can publish as we get it Okay, I'm sure You can see what what bill we're talking about thank you and then then I can also share the state statute links that explain the function of the planning commission We should discuss that too The the real short version is this is gonna be a this isn't gonna be something that's gonna be delayed our efforts are gonna be they're gonna have to be pretty constant and and We don't have that long of a window. We really get down to it Yes, you mentioned earlier, I know other I would agree I think it's just a matter of As you said we don't know what we don't know yet I think that's this is trying to try to get the effort to to This is just trying an effort to get that to get ourselves on a good starting platform But I think we can try to approach this as simply as possible so that we don't over complicate I think that's a really good point Yeah, like I said, I haven't blocked out for this whole year. It doesn't mean it's gonna take us this whole year And If we get it into workshops, we may actually have to entertain the idea of having you know discussions outside of the normal planning commission cycle and In which to allow for a zoning board in maybe we use zoning board nights if they're not if they don't have active material to cover But More to follow Okay, so let's move on to the next item if we've if we're good Catherine or do you want more of yeah Well, there's there's several other things on here There's the the bylaw Going on and that's with the regional planning commission and looking at increasing density for housing outside of the ETC next Kind of in a slow Process so there's really not a whole lot going on right now next week The regional planning commission is meeting with Aaron and To talk about sewer capacity It's kind of they've stalled a bit needing to understand more Limitations so that will be coming back just you know at some point for some give you one Well, at least if it's not review it would be at least be Informing Some kind of a change to try to take the teeth out of act who could That is yeah with With the state right now in the legislature. Yeah And you know from what I've heard some of that is really in more of our designated areas In the state so if you know, there's the village center or new town center There would or towns that have robust zoning, maybe so I don't know But the thought is that in those areas where there has been a lot of planning and there's a lot of good zoning stupid I will not we'll Know what's coming down the the pike and tell probably like Hey, or yeah, it wasn't it was pushed from the federal government We should get push the states all across the you have to try to loosen up Particularly for housing So I haven't here this is actually I added it new since what I provided for you In your packets, but we need to do a zoning update related to this DRB change And it's that's not gonna be like I got really heavy lift on that But right you know right now it the zoning talks it and the subdivision talk about The roles of the zoning board the roles of the planning commission, you know, who does what so we're just cleaning that up I had a thought at the same time of unifying our bylaws so putting the Subdivision and the zoning together into one I think that would be easy we've talked about that already And then act 47, which is that the housing act that the home act all of that was last year We need to really do a deeper dive and update our zoning Thinking the three of those could go together. What about in in the in the We had talked about doing zoning changes more rapidly easily What about if we're gonna do anything like that to look through and see if there are any low-hanging fruits Or example the use that the gentlemen talked about I'm not talking that one specifically, but Something like a use or something like other things that we could Bring in and do, you know small subset of Zoning changes in addition to the things that we have to do. We're not just waiting and doing a big bucket It's your point. I think that's definitely worth the question. I think I Another line item here is bigger zoning updates Don't talked about and I think the RPDI It's beauty. Those are big so that maybe those don't get wrapped in But maybe they do. I don't know. It's I mean, it's I'm not looking to mislead. You might but if we have opportunity Excuse me in separate distinct efforts. We're gonna put some zoning changes through for X Unless we're gonna wait and combine and do one packet up to the select board. We're gonna do them separately Let's look for opportunity to knock off some low-hanging fruit things that are of a like scale So that if we're doing a number of small things we can do maybe a few more small things Yeah, so my my list there was Some some things I threw in knowing that we really have to do It would be nice if we could do plan on, you know zoning changes every six months And that that's that's including getting it reviewed and getting it Evaluated and put in front of the public if that's not feasible, but if we're doing very small packets I would think that would be a manageable by even for the select board And then I think especially well, and there is planning commission DRB. There'll be more Yeah So I guess I skipped over the 8090 upper main Street Street site planning so that's what Greg I were talking about earlier. So we hiring a consultant up with that work Really, that's gonna be a big public engagement process You know trying to figure out what what's gonna go on that site So we know there's municipal facilities, but we don't know if what they should look like or Do they all happen at once is it phased? there's other Area on this site for other uses. So discussing what those uses be so housing or commercial uses There's space for recreational areas probably more in the back Wetlands, so you can't really develop that part, but it could be great for a boardwalk or around the wetlands or as So just engaging the public in that and then like the planning commission to be a part of that at at some scale Walk that through with you How you would want to be what form is the outreach going to take surveys meetings. Yes, I Don't know actually. I think part of we're working on the RFP Request to go out for proposals and part of it is like tell us what you think is Gonna be a good process So it definitely needs to be in person Get your hair roll up your sleeves kind of work versus just to serve it in my mind, but I think surveys are So hopefully it's a nation of different ways the other couple things on here is the official map which Is probably I'm thinking starting in the winter need to clarify that with Regional planning commission, but the official map is part of a state designation town center It's a requirement and we did not get the meniscus planning grant or the work for the new town center unfortunately It sounds like there were Only half the projects essentially in the state could be funded in Chittin County, they could only fund to 10 So we we were not one but the state's designation program is also in flux right now as well the legislature is likely going to be retooling it so The requirements for a new town center designation might be very different that might not be I Don't I'm thinking there's not they're gonna have different different buckets So you have like a like a main designation. It doesn't really have anything like it does now and then you have designations that So I Went away Maybe it's good that we didn't But possibly Village center designation Something we could think about on the earlier side if if that's not changing Like it's that is a quicker process. I did that when I was in cargo Just the requirements for that are small Relatively if things don't change we could jump right into that summer. So that would be for the Essex Center the historic Essex Center area And I believe in the ETCX plan that was a recognition Center So then the last thing on the list here is development That'll just continue to happen on your first meeting Every month We've consensed Sometimes yep In both spots probably Good questions from anyone for Catherine awesome Okay, it's gonna be a busy year Already the end of jane and he'll It's crazy but hey That's what we're here for And just think we can sit here and smile. No the staffs work it all the time Actually they are working all the time Okay, so the next item on our agenda is the approval of minutes from november 9th and November 16th We're gonna do them separately because I don't remember them at this stage I'm gonna bring them up. So I'd like a motion for the minutes of uh, november 9th from 2023 So All right, I move we uh prove the minutes of november 9th 2020 Move by shoe seconded by john's anyone want to offer any comments to the minutes as presented Okay, those don't count Get that all those in favor of the minutes as presented posed Did you want to abstain one abstention? So that's six one Six zero one six zero one. I wasn't here I still get but did you read the minutes? Yes You're you're absolutely able if you've read the minutes and feel comfortable you're Absolutely able to vote on the minutes as presented You don't have to and I'm recognizing folks. It's absolutely at this point. It's a choice. I don't generally offer abstentions as an as a as an offer during the calling of vote certainly request it Okay, I'd like a minutes pass six zero one I'd like a motion for the minutes of november 16th 2023 Second move second So I have a question not yet go ahead go ahead Since I was here and was a voting member at that time, but you are not a voting member this evening We have a we have a full sitting member of the commission on the board. I know but this is So even if somebody wasn't here as an alternate you were not at this point if there were six six other commissioners You would be a voting member If there are we have seven sitting members of the commission. I mean, I don't I don't really care I just it just seems like I Some people weren't at those meetings. So They're approving where I can't but the dissent the the delineation with the alter And this is a good conversation to have but the delineation with the alternate position is They're a voting member on any given night if The seven if there any member any of the seven Regular commissioners are not present if the seven commissioners are present. They are strictly an advisory Um position so the regardless of what's in front of us Um And if we need to change that we certainly can address it But at this point we we I don't feel we can make that that change on the fly Yeah, as I said, it's not like it's a valid point to discuss But I then we're starting to get into who is on this app who who was here for that app at this point It's really just who is here for this evening And that's what that's what we determine who the voting members are We're going to leave it at that for now Yes, but I think if when we get into discussion about operating procedures Maybe we can fine tune this a little bit or see if there's a need to we can discuss if there's a general need for that Okay, thank you for the clarification. No, that's again. This is this is new Um We have a motion in a second for the minutes of november 16 2023 Do we have any commentary or any requests for changes on the minutes of november 16th? Hearing none all those in favor of the minutes from november 16th 2023 signified by saying aye. Aye Opposed Extension abstain 601 motion minutes pass Okay, do we have any other business to address this evening? Uh No, um, I think that We did mention that the capital budget and plan are Before the select board next monday for that the public Budget as well Staff do you need anything from us at this point in the short term? Okay Then I would take a motion to adjourn so moved Moved by shoe seconded by trevor all those in favor. Aye Opposed that'd not be anybody motion carried