 Okay, welcome back again to Big Talk from Small Libraries 2018. I am your host, Krista Porter, here at the Nebraska Library Commission. We are at our three o'clock central time session and our topic right now is, Can You Hear Me Now? I hope you can hear me because I'm talking, yes, everyone can hear us. Library Advocacy for All Libraries, on the line with us is Lisa Valerio-Nok, is that how you pronounce it? I didn't ask before. Yes. Awesome. And she is from the Royal Oak Township Library in Royal Township, Michigan. And she is the library administrator and director there. And she is going to talk to us about how she is doing advocacy, which is a big topic in all libraries. And I think very especially into our small and rural ones, who sometimes are either from either extremes. They have a ton of support from the community because they are a core of it, or are maybe not so known, which is sad. So I will hand it over to you, Lisa, to tell us how to do this. Thank you, Krista. And thanks for having me. Today, I'm going to be talking to you about Can You Hear Me Now? And Library Advocacy for Libraries. And I think one of the best things about being a librarian is that we always get to talk about our profession. People are always asking me questions about books, programs, and so forth, and my biggest passion has always been for small libraries. I've worked in small libraries for a while. So I'm going to tell you a little bit about what I've done and where I'm from and so forth, and what you can do in your own libraries and communities. But first of all, I wanted to give a shout out to, I heard there was a library cooperative in Michigan, and I'm from Michigan. So a shout out to you guys. Okay. So, number one, who I am, I have worked in libraries for over 25 years. In that time, I have been in a county library, a small college library, a college prep private school librarian, and directors of two different libraries, vastly different. One was rural, way out in the countryside, and one, urban, and the one that I'm in right now is an urban library. We're right outside of Detroit, and we serve a population of just under 2,500. Royal Township Public Library began in 1965, and that was due by government grants and pushed to for urban renewal back in 1965. And it is a vibrant community, but unfortunately, I've been there now only for a year. They used to be 40-hour library, 40-hours-a-week library, now it's down to 21-hours-a-week. And I'm the part-time library director. I have two employees, but that's kind of a misdemeanour because one part-time employee is paid by Urban League, which gives seniors a chance to get a part-time job, and Urban League pays them, not my library, and the other one is employed by the township to work in the library with me. And we have numerous volunteers, so I'm very lucky that I have a community that has found a home in my library. Now, if you go over to see this picture over here, that is the outside sign for my library in Little World Royal Township. We are located in a very different setting. The township offices are in an old school building, and we are in the old school library of that old school building. And it's kind of nice because it's small and cozy, but by the same token, nobody knows we're there. We're in a community of 2,500 where everyone says, oh, we have a library, and I'm like, yes, you do. Come to the second floor and you'll find us. So that's when I got into this job as a library director, my biggest thing was that I wanted to let everyone know we are here and that you can hear us. You can see us. You can visit us and come and visit us. So with that in mind, a few facts about small libraries that probably everyone already knows, but it's nice to keep in mind that small and rural libraries make up 80.5% of public library systems in the United States. Small and rural libraries continue to provide substantial electronic resources, digital resources for patrons through access to eBooks, and publicly accessible computer terminal. This is despite the fact that budgets continue to be strained. In my library right now, we have about 19 computers. And it's all done through grants, help through e-rates, and so forth. And we're still able to keep up as best we can with the needs of technology. And then even though revenues have decreased over the year, visitation and circulation have been increasing, which to me would tell me or should be able to tell people in higher positions like mayors and business leaders that libraries are very much needed in every community. But sometimes that just gets overlooked. And we are the lifeline for the community in which we serve. A lot of times the children that are coming into my library, this is the only place they've got to go to after school. It's either this or an empty house at home where they're waiting for mom, dad, uncle, and grandparents to come home and help them with homework. I remember way back when I was very young and when I started out in libraries, everyone was saying that the internet was going to destroy libraries. There would be no need for libraries after the internet. And actually, thank goodness for the internet because it actually helped us a lot more in our advocacy and getting out there and showing a need for our library. So we have access to online databases now through the state. The patrons have access. The things that I never really considered that you would need a computer for, they're using our computers for, like for their own email because that's the only way to get communications with their child's teacher to the school district. And they have to fill out forms for their bridge cards or their government assistance or assistance to the consumer's energy or heating belt or electric belt. And they're filling out the paperwork to make sure they can still have heat and electricity in their home. That's what they're using our computers for. And we are very much needed for them for just that alone. And for computers for homework, kids don't have the computers that they need to add home to be able to do their homework. A lot of times their teachers are now asking kids to do PowerPoint presentation, basic word processing like reports. And those kind of programs or computer programs are not accessible to them because of financial need. So we're there for them. So having the internet and having the computers and all that other wonderful capabilities had actually helped us. And what I've always found with advocacy and in every small library that I've worked in, advocacy means telling the stories, library story over and over again until it clicks. You can tell your story at least once to one person and they're like, yeah, yeah, it's fine. I get what you're saying. You have a great library. You have a great program. But maybe on that day, they're not listening for some other reason. They're preoccupied about something else going to a concert that night or whatever. The next time you see them, you tell the story again. And again, until they finally get it like, hey, you know what? That program that you were telling me about in the library, are you still having it? Are you going to have it again? I would have liked to have come and think of that nature. So you've got to tell your story a lot of times. And sometimes you have to tell it in different ways. I'm always reminded of the elevator speech where someone said, you have to give your elevator speech in two seconds or two minutes to get someone's attention. Well, you can give that elevator speech and have it practiced and down to a science. But sometimes if you mix it up a little bit and tell it a little bit differently, they hear you. And I have, I've always said never refuse anyone to help to promote what your library does for the community. I have a gentleman at my library who comes in quite often. He's deaf and he's an advocate for the deaf. And a lot of people find him to be a little bit pushy about his wanting to help deaf people, like he'll talk to anybody. But when he comes into the library and he wants to talk about my library to people, and he's getting the message across, not only to the hearing patrons, but also to the non-hearing, the hearing impaired. And it's getting them into my library. So I could say easily, like someone at the, when I first came into the job like that, don't ask him to be, you know, around in the library, talking about the library that much because, you know, he gets people upset. He may get one person upset, but he actually started to bring more people in the library with the group that he started to teach sign language to. So I didn't want to refuse his help. He's passionate about what he believes in, helping the deaf. And if he feels that the library can help him, help his deaf community, then I want to be there for him. And I want him to bring these people in so that we can help them. So I never refuse anyone's help. And if you look at Webster's Dictionary, they define advocacy as the act or process of supporting a cause or proposal. I've always said, no matter what library you're working in, if I'm working in a Memorial Township and I have a day off and another neighboring library is having a program where promoting them and promoting libraries in general, I will go over to that library and I will join them if I can. I will, you know, lend a hand. I will volunteer because libraries really need to and library and we do this very well. I have to admit we need to really help each other out in this area. We need to be able to not only sing our own voices or sing our own songs about our library, but we should be doing it for all the other libraries too. The more we band together, the better. So the big question is why do it? Why be an advocate? Why throw yourself out there and always talk about library? And it always has come back to me at least that your community depends on the library. Everything that you do for that community is the whole reason why they're coming to the library. It's the whole reason why things might be going for a better day for them. They're depending on you to do it. And your library depends on advocacy. I guess in a way I'm trying to say that it's a joint commitment between you and your community. If you don't do this for your community, your library is going to die. And if your library dies, your community is now left without any resources. So it's a joint operation there. So where to start? Start with your staff, start with your peers, start with your friends. Let them know your passion. Talk about the library. Talk about what your library is doing. Talk about what another library is doing. Sometimes that helps by even me watching the other two presenters before me. I was getting ideas of what I could do in my own library. And so I'm going to be bringing this back to my friends, my peers, staff meetings that I go to. And tell them about what other libraries are doing. And that's where you get started by talking. You go to your local leaders in your government. I go to my township supervisor, the clerk. Anyone that I can get into our corner and willing to help me out to do what I need to do as a library director, I will reach out to. Business leaders, you will be surprised how many times business leaders will overlook a library because they don't think they have anything there for the library. I have now reminded many of our business leaders that we have resources for businesses to use that will help them start a business. We have resources for tracking business trends. We have a Melcat, which allows people the databases for business, Wall Street Journal and Forbes and all of that. And they think, wow, you're a small little library, but you can do that. And that really impresses them. So go out to your businesses and write them in to visit the library. And then your patrons, your die-hard patrons. I will use my kids in the library to have them tell their parents or their grandparents or their classmates or their school what a great time they had at our library and whatever programs we have. Use them and they get excited too and they will tell you if they think something was a total downer or if something was the best time they've ever had. Kids are very, very honest with you sometimes. And sometimes it's a little bit too honest, but I would rather take that too much honesty and be able to use it for the good for the library. And when you start to do advocacy for your library or for a cooperative, you have to take away the excuses from yourself, from your library board and from your community, especially from yourself and the library board. A lot of times I've heard that we can't have another program that just focuses on the needs for funding of the library because we don't have time. We don't have the staff. We don't have the energy. No one's really interested in it. And they keep finding all the excuses of not to do something a little bit different that will promote the library. And even from the community, sometimes they'll say, oh, you know, you're going to have a read-in. Oh, that sounds like it's going to have to take too much time. I don't have all day to read a book. And things like this that may be little hurdle that you need to take away the excuses and show it more in a positive light. And even for myself, I've often found that as a library director in a small library, there are days when I feel like I have to do everything from the plumbing to checking out books, to reading the books, and then do my state statistics. And sometimes when you feel all that piling on you, you start to think, oh, yeah, I could do one more thing. Let me write a letter to the editor because I've got nothing else to do, right? You got to take away those excuses because then you realize in the end it's more worth it to have that letter written to the editor or to ask someone, one of your patrons, to write a letter to the editor to show the benefits of the library. So what do you need the most? And most people think it's going to be, oh, you need lots of money to do this. Not really. Most of the things that you need are things that you can just be able to do over coffee. You need ideas. You need energy, and you need manpower, and I like to say librarian power. For those moments when you're thinking you can do a program that's simple and effective, get that energy going, that librarian power mode going, and get down with just a couple of people and get the ideas out instead of flushing something out. Advocacy, just like anything else, needs to have a plan and a way to put it forward. You can't just say I'm going to advocate for the library starting tomorrow, and you will have a program just on it. If you're going to be doing a program on advocacy, then you're going to have to plan ahead. But if you're going to just be doing advocacy in the way of, oh, I'm going to talk to my neighbor tomorrow and tell him about the library, that's easy enough to do. That's the lazy person's advocacy. But I'll take the lazy person advocacy over doing nothing at all any day. So planning is everything, and even if you're going to do it the way I said, just talk to a neighbor or talk to a coworker, always stick to a message. If your message is the library is important, stick to that. Know your audience. Know if it's a coworker, you're going to be telling them. You know about them. You know what they like. You know what they don't like. Talk about programs that they might like. And when you're doing something bigger, like if you're doing library advocacy because you need a new millage, because you need a new building built for your library, and your audience is going to be the taxpayers, so any taxpayers that you are going to be reaching, you're going to have to go to their level, what they're worried about, what they're thinking about, oh no, another tax increase. Show them how that tax increase is a benefit, not a negative. And you craft your plan to fit the message, and always think about getting outside help, wherever you can get it, and the show must always go on. Every day I say, what is something new that I could do for the library, or if I have a program that I'm having my doubts about, it's always better to go with the flow than just to say, you know, maybe we should just cancel the program because I don't think enough people are going to be coming. And the five dudes of library advocacy do respect everyone, even the politicians who don't agree with you. And I have found my ways into politicians office from state rep. I've gone to their town halls, I've even talked to my own political leaders in the township, and even when they don't agree with me, I always shake their hand, smile, and give them a positive feeling afterwards, because even if we don't see eye to eye now, we will down the road because I'm not going to give up. And always keep positive, work hard, and that's the hardest part of this, in knowing that you're going to have to keep doing this. As I said earlier, you're going to have to keep telling your story over and over again until it collects. Don't give up. If one way doesn't work, try another way. And as you can see, there's a theme here, I'm always asking for help. And what I should have put there instead of do ask for help, and what I should have reminded you of is don't be afraid to ask for help. Don't think that you can't go up to the mayor to ask him to do a story time because if you think they're going to say no, okay, that's the worst he's going to do, say no. And find him to the library, do a story time with him, have him read to the kids, have him see for himself how the kids like to be read to you, and the positive influences that are happening through this interaction. And if he says no this time, keep asking. Keep telling him that he needs his library just as much as his library needs him. And always keep it simple. The more elaborate I've tried to get in some program and some advocacy where I'd write these long essays and, you know, to try to prove my point about advocacy, people are too dark by that. They don't want something long. They don't feel like they have something long to read. So if you keep it simple, a little handout, say this is the value that you're getting for your library. You tell me what other value you would like in the library. And make it very, very simple and very much patron or people-oriented, because you want these people to come into your library. And these are five ideas where you can turn the talk into action. One of them I've found as a group hug for libraries. Very simple thing that you can do. It's like holding hands around the library. You form a chain around your building. And it's just a hug around the library. You're a group hug for the library. And you can do this on a summer reading program. You can say right before a tax increase or not taxing straight. I should call that right before a millage where you need a new building or you need more money to keep the building open. Make it visible for everyone to see outside the library. So as they're walking by the library or driving by the library, they see people gathering together to make a statement. Children's Rally, one of the cuter things I've seen, I have not tried this yet myself, but I will, is having kids make their own little signs about the library and what they love about the library and have them do a mini walk around the library then. You don't have to take them anywhere far or do anything fancy. It's just enough that people that are coming into your library are coming to see. Lucky for me, and I believe in a lot of small towns and townships, the township halls are nearby. So if there is going to be a meeting for the township where the leaders are gonna be there and my millage is coming up, you better believe I'm gonna get something really cute to advocate for the library. Have these cute little three-year-olds walk by with the sign that they, I love story time. How can you say no to that? It's like saying no to a puppy. People can't resist the kids. Can't, can't, yeah. Yeah, you know, and you'd feel bad because you would feel like you're kicking a puppy. You don't wanna do that. So make it effective and it's simple. Kids love to do that. A mini read-in, I did that once when I was a children's librarian in St. Clair Shores where we did it through Summer Reading Club and the kids just came in. They signed up for a slot and their parents too. So this was intergenerational. They came in and they had a little sign that said they were part of the read-in and that they'd love to read and they read for however long they said they were gonna read, like for a half hour or an hour. And that turned to be very effective because people were coming in all throughout the day just to read a book. And that was the point that I was trying to make then when not so much about how important libraries was was that reading is very important and very fundamental. And yeah, people should take time out of their day to read. It was, it was perfect. Mini March was a mini March around your library with sign that pickets like they used to do in the protest days. And I think they still do. You can do that in a small scale and doing a library art quilt. It's not really a quilt. It's usually construction paper or pieces of paper with artwork on it that you can put together and make it to a big quilt. I wish I had the picture with me for Valentine's Day. We did in our library what you love and we had little hearts and we put it all over our back window and we got this great big back window in the library and we filled it all up with hearts. And some of them were very cute and very decorative but the one that I really loved the most was one of the boys who is a regular of ours made a little heart and he just real simple said, I love here. And I said, this is perfect. I go, you could have put the library. And he said, yeah, but I didn't know how to spell the library, so I love here. And I went, okay, good enough for me. And we had that right in the center of our window. And I thought that was a perfect testament of what our library means to the community. So I have people saying that if they do advocacy, what if the program or the advocacy effort failed miserably? So what, move on. You find another idea, another avenue to go down. Don't be afraid to fail. One, if you have a advocacy program where you're talking about how great the library would be if they had the millage, you have unruly gas. Like people who are totally against libraries and library millages and any taxes of any kind. What if they show up? Fine, let them show up. But if they become unruly, you have someone there, you have a plan to put into place to get them removed, security, okay? What if the weather is bad and you're having an outdoor readathon? That's okay, make provision that maybe you might have to have a tent to be sure that the weather is bad. But this is the question that I always ask librarians who are afraid to do anything outside the box for advocacy, what is the program in a total success? Wouldn't that be wonderful? We've got to stop thinking about the what if everything is awful to making what if everything turns out okay or better than we expected? And a lot of times with the advocacy, even if you change one person's mind about the library, you're one step closer to getting what you need to help your patron, your library, your community to be better. And I always see that as a step forward. So if you have advocacy going on in your library, it should be every day because your staff should be on board with this. I have little talking points that I will put on the circulation desk and even in my own office. This is when people ask me, why do we need libraries? Why should we fund libraries? Why should we even give our tax dollars for it when everyone has their own computer? Remind them, we are there for help for small businesses and job seekers. Where else can you be able to go into a building and just use your computer to type up a resume or print up your resume that you've already done like that? I mean, you know, you can't even do that in King Codes anymore. Libraries are the community storykeepers. We're the ones who remember the past, keep the past alive because we have the records, we have the old yearbook. People come to the library to remember what they used to do in the library with their story time and they bring their kids. We're very much part of the culture of that community. Libraries are cost effective and help the community households save money. I'm always telling the parents, kids need to read, read, read, read. If they tell me they can't go to Barnes & Noble every day or every week to buy a book, I totally get that. Come to the library, check out a book or two or three and read it that way and that way you're not spending the money as much money as you would have going to Barnes & Noble. You just return the books. And one of, especially in the area that I'm working in right now, libraries offer safe places for kids and teens. This is so important to me because those kids need to have a place to be after school instead of going to God knows where, playing out on the streets. Roaming the streets wild. Roaming. Roaming the streets wild. Roaming the streets wild. Roaming the streets wild. Yeah, I mean, if I have a hula hoop, I will certainly throw it out the window this summer if I see them hanging out in the parking lot. If they're not doing anything else, at least they'll get their exercise. And libraries are Democrats. And that is to say, anyone is allowed in the library. We don't make any judgment. We don't say you can come in, but he can't. We are very democratic and the doors are always open and the doors should always be open. So, for library advocacy, social media, and all of you know, Facebook, Twitter, Snapchat, Flyers, talking points to keep for you and your staff at the front desk and checklist. I always go, if I'm ever having a program where I'm trying to promote a more support for the library, I have my little checklist going and I have a camera. And now that we've got smartphones, I am so thrilled with smartphones because I would always forget my camera. 10 years ago, 15 years ago, I would say, oh my gosh, I'm having a program or I'm advocating for libraries and we're having the big militias coming up and I wanna show how many people are there. I would forget my camera at home. Or the camera at the library, we would forget to change the battery and the battery is dead and we didn't have the camera. So now for smartphones, thank goodness for them. We can snap a picture whenever we want. So these are things that you probably already know and I'm assuming, but with social media, I always keep it fun. I always ask for people to respond back too. Click like, say hello. Tell me how you like to story time. I don't get any with fasted back, but at least I'm asking for it. Flyers should always be very positive and very bright eye catching. And as I said, I used the talking points that I showed you in the previous slide at the desk. So then my, so then I can be focused as well as my staff and my checklist. So right here, I am going to show you, these are pictures of my library. Picture is worth a thousand words and this is so true. Right over here, you see one of our little patrons dictating to the kids what kind of Valentine she's going to make. And if you look in the back, you'll see how we started decorating. This was the beginning of our decoration. So they were just having a ball with crayons. You name it. By the end of that, they conned me into getting glitter, which I'm kind of sad I brought that out because it ended up kicking into the carpet and I've been vacuuming ever since. Right over here is one of our story times with the moms and this little child learn and they were having a great time doing the craft after the story time. And right here, this was one of our best programs that we had this past summer and it was with the solar eclipse glasses. I told the kids how to use the solar eclipse glasses because it was coming August 21st and it was a partial eclipse. So I explained to them what an eclipse was and how long the eclipse was gonna be and you will not believe how many people came into my library to number one, get solar eclipse glasses. Number two, they went, oh my gosh, we didn't even know you were here and they have since come back. And number three, the kids had a ball with glasses. When I told them to try the glasses on, they were amazed that they couldn't see anything, not even their own hand in front of them and I said, that's because it's supposed to protect your eye. So here's a picture of them with the solar eclipse glasses and I thought they were gonna be serious and instead they decided to be a little bit more of themselves and show how cool they were. And they said, these are my peeps. And like I said, after when I put this picture up on Facebook and said, at the library, you can not only get books, you can get solar eclipse glasses. I had tons of people come in and as a bonus, I wasn't expecting this. I had donations to the library, monetary donations to the library because they said, wow, this is a nice little library that you have here, we wanna help. So that was a bonus that I didn't expect. So my checklist is always this. I'm the director and someone would come up to me and say, I wanna do something to create advocacy or attention to the library and show how great it is. I would say, yay, go for it. I will help you in any way I can. And also go to the library board. I'm fortunate enough that my library board is very active and interested in seeing our library succeed. So getting the okay from them is like second nature to me. I don't even have to think about it. I know I'm gonna get it. But there are some library boards that are a little bit worried about doing this. Like they don't like asking for money or whatever. I don't know. But always get them on board. Tell the world about how great libraries is. Not once and not even twice. I would say, tell it until you're blue in the face. Because people need to be reminded. And remember friends who can help. Right now our library does not have a friends in the library group. And I am looking into getting one because they can be so helpful in getting more money for the library and not only that, and also being your advocate. And don't overlook the obvious. There are people that come into your library that are very, very quiet. They don't say much, but they use your library a lot. And sometimes you forget to use them. When I got into the job a while ago, there was this one gentleman that was coming in and he never said anything. He just said hello and goodbye. And when we were gonna have a representative to our library, he was gonna come by. And he said, well, I wanna come, but I don't know. I hate talking to politicians. And I said, why is that? And he goes, well, they don't wanna listen to you anyway. I said, well, come on down and come. And just say what you like about the library or just say hello to him. Let him know you're a voter. He'll wanna get your vote, at least if nothing else. The next thing, he came to the program that we had with the state rep. And he ended up talking like for 15, 20 minutes to the state rep about how great this library was. And I went, okay, I should have asked him sooner. And so always have everything ready to go, even if you don't have a program coming up, or even if you don't have a message coming up, but you still need to promote the library. Have something that always have people walk out the library with a bookmark with your hours on it, things that you do, the return of investment for businesses, things of that nature. And so when I was talking about the politician, here he is right here, that's our state rep for the area. Right over here is the MLA, Michigan Library Association Executive, and me and some other community leaders. This is a general superintendent of the local school district. It doesn't matter what political parties that they are in, I'm inviting any politician into the library. And I have gotten, as I said before, I've gotten to know the local city leaders and state reps, but I never have turned them down publicly. Now this gentleman right here, I have praised publicly profusely too, because he helped with a bill in Michigan that allowed libraries to get some of their, the recapture money back from taxes. And that was a huge help and a big win for Michigan Library. And I was happy to work alongside Michigan Library Association to bring attention to local and state leaders who helped libraries. And so this was a chance for us to get our state rep into our library and to thank him personally. And I think that is only the plus. If you have time or have the ability to thank your state rep in person, do it and even do it in a letter. That's another way of advocacy. They'll keep, it'll keep them on your side. For the media or the newspapers, always know who the person is to contact. Know your in guy to get your programs on their community calendar, so to speak. And I make my releases quick and concise and especially when it comes to advocacy, like for getting funding and so forth. Recently, everyone should have gotten an ALI email that said, you know, let your congressmen know that we still need funding and that President Trump should not be cutting a lot of funding to the museum, the library. I even shot something out to the local paper to say, you know, Royal Old Township stands behind ALA and asking the president and the Senate and all congressmen to not stop funding for libraries because it's so vitally important. Did I get any response back from the newspapers? No, not yet. Perhaps I need to say it again. And this is, I'm gonna sound like a broken record. Always tell the story over and over again and until they finally hear it. Like, can you hear me now? I keep writers in the loop, not only what I'm doing in my library, but what is happening nationally and I'll get, you know, or statewide. And I always treat them as if they're my best friend and they're with respect because I know their time is valuable and sometimes they're looking for a nice little human interest story, maybe something that I'm doing at my library that can promote my library will be of interest to them and they may take the time to come out and take a gander. Last but not least, I have my contact information here. I was going to share some of the handout that I've made for a library and advocacy, but unfortunately, and I can't, the file got corrupted and I'm trying to fix it. But if you guys would want to get to me, I would be more than happy to send it to you. And I have two emails address and I have a blog, this is now flippering at large. So are there any questions? Great. All right. Thank you very much, Lisa. So if anybody does have any questions, type them into the question section of your GoToWebinar interface or if you have any thoughts or ideas or I'd like to hear from some people to successful advocacy events or projects you've done or even unsuccessful ones, you can get some tips or ideas from other people about how to redo it again potentially. So please do go ahead and type into your question section there. I thought that, you can, oh, there's your website, awesome. Okay. I didn't know I was going to do that, sorry. That's okay. No, that's great. Cause you can share anything that's on your screen there. Yeah. I thought it was very good to hear that, especially about how hard it can be to advocate that to be an advocate for your library and that it can sometimes be overwhelming, discouraging when you're saying the same things over again and people still, it appears like they're hearing it for the first time that the library is there and what the library does and there's a adage for children and for teaching, you have to repeat something seven times before they get it, which seems like a lot, but that's exactly how it works. You just keep letting them know that it's there, we're still here and we're not going anywhere. And that's a good news. Okay, here's some questions. This is a good, this is something I've obviously coming in new to a community. How do you advocate as an outsider in your small community? Maybe if you are new and you don't know anyone yet? I made one of the better decision, I think when I hired in my library assistant, she is someone from the community and she has been in the community for a while. So as an outsider, as you can see, I'm working in a predominantly African-American community and I drive like about a half hour to get to work and I'm new to this area. I've never been in that part of the county. And so when I hired her on, she had been in the library at a patron. So she kind of knew the flavor of what it's been like before I got there and she knows the community around her. So everyone would come in and say, oh, it's my good here. And I'll say, no, we've done here today, but I can help you. And they've gotten to see how we work together and then how she's helping me and I'm helping her learn about library stuff. And as an outsider, I can tell them what I would like to do for their library, for their community. If I show an interest in their community and I show that I want to help them make changes, they are ready to take you in and listen to what you have to say. If I were just going in there to get a paycheck and some people might say, they would know it. And I think by your actions, by the way, you treat people, they can see what it is you want to do and they accept you. And like I said, I do have a lot of community help and I have some volunteers that, thank God I have them because otherwise I would be lost. I wouldn't know whose kid was who. And that's the other thing I learned in a small community. Everyone knows everyone and so it's been kind of nice. It is, it is, it is. And that's what we're talking about here today is the small libraries, the rural libraries or just the community itself at the library. The students in the university, it's a small community that they do know everybody. And I think that's a good tip, get connected with one of them. And eventually you won't be an outsider if you just keep getting involved, attend the meetings, your city council meetings. You know, get your face out there as if people realize who you are. And that's also how you can find out, I think, what is going on in your community. What are the needs of the town if you are new there? Attends the city council meetings, other organizational meetings, school board, any like community organizations that have meetings and open meetings show up everywhere. Yep. Absolutely. All right. Any other questions for Lisa before we move on? Type in your question. If not, you do have access to her email it was on the presentation. Check out her website. After the session, everyone's presentations, they will be emailing to me. So if you didn't get any of the websites for many of these presentations or the email address was the end of Lisa's here, you will have access to those afterwards when the recordings are all done. And along with the archives. Oh, would you have a comment? Really good presentation for you. Thank you. Good and all caps. Thank you. Very important information. Yes, absolutely. All right. So it doesn't look like unless somebody, like I said before, unless somebody's writing a novel for a new question, I think, I think we're good. Thank you very much, Lisa. I am going to. Thank you.