 The aftermath of the APC primaries leaves one question unanswered. What is next for the former ministers? And many killed houses raised as communal crisis breaks out in Korgi state. Well, this is Plus Politics. I am Mary Anacorn. Four ministers have become politically stranded, if you'd ask me, after their defeat in the presidential primaries of the all-progressive Congress APC, which was held in Abuja. Former Governor of Lagos State Bola-Ametin will eventually won that primary by taking about 60% of the votes and will be flying the flag of the APC in the February 25, 2023 presidential elections. The ministers who were forced to resign last month after obtaining forms were Emeka Majuba, Minister of State for Education, Gotswil Aqabiu, Niger Delta Affairs Minister, Ogbun Naya Onu, Science and Technology Minister, and Roti Miyamechi, Transportation Minister. And the big question tonight is what is next for these gentlemen? Well, joining us to discuss this is journalist Carl Cinedu and legal practitioner Digi Awopide. Thank you so much, gentlemen, for joining us. Thank you. Great. I'll start with you, Digi. Now, all four of these men who were seemingly forced to resign and some resigned of their own free will, even before the embryo of whether they should stay or not. Many people had wondered if it was even a good move in the first instance, looking at their political pedigree. I mean, I'm talking about all of these men that I've mentioned, aside from maybe the Transportation Minister and the Science and Technology Minister. Let's start from there. How great an idea was it for these men to leave their jobs in pursuit of this presidential bid? Well, thank you, Marianne, for the question. You recorded a few weeks back you had your program, and I did wonder why these ministers were running, unless they had some sort of assurance from the president or from somebody I own, saying that they had the confidence of the party to secure the ticket. But now the primaries have come and gone where it looks very clear to everybody who can see that it was a very ill-advised decision. I mean, all the means of transport was able to muster some votes, came second in the primaries. The others, basically, Wajima did not show up in priority convention. The minister, Minister Onu, went on a ramp at the convention, but did not secure any votes. We got on a patio, maybe the widest of them all, was able to quickly pitch his tent with the eventual party's flag bearer. So I don't know, maybe it was some form of importance that they attached to themselves, but clearly they did not have the political capital or the political mozoon to get the party's ticket. So it was a very ill-advised decision, and I just hope that for their sake that the money that they spent on the party's form would somehow, someway be either refunded to them or given back to them at the reduced price. A compensation of sorts. Well, let me come to you, Carl. Carl, can you hear me? Let's look at the second runner up, which is the former governor of River State and of course the current, well, former now, minister of transportation, Rosimi Chibike Amici, who also was one of the presidential aspirants on the platform of the APC. Let's stop by looking at his performance, not just as minister, but let's take a look back at him being governor. Could this have also played a role in his shorty of wanting to run for this office and even taking that leap of leaving his current job? So, I will say that we have to look at the two types of methods for system development. The one thing that we have done at the time was to look at the two types of method for system development. To look at the other two. I mean, we were all like... I'm so sorry, Carl. I'm so sorry. It's very difficult for us to hear you. We're going to try to get you on another line so that we can clearly hear what you have to say. That would make the conversation flow better. So, I'm going to come back to you, Deji. Same question. Let's look at Chibike Amici's career and the trajectory. A man who became a speaker in the legislature in his state moved from there to become a governor of his state. I mean, he's had some form of a steady trajectory, which he also presented on the day of the presidential primaries, making a case, in fact, that he had also been two-time governor, two-time governor, a two-time D.G. for Mr. President. He seemed to have had so much confidence. But now that he's no longer the minister, no longer governor, he does not hold any office. And then, of course, let's look at what's happening in the APC in his state. Where does he fall in right now? Well, I think that the former minister of transport, Reto Nerebu Chibike Amici, has the credit, we no doubt, to seek the ice of peace in the land. I mean, having such a very robust resume as it progresses, nobody can define him for as priority to greater office. However, as you know, when it comes to internal affairs of the political party, those decisions as to who become the party's supply bearer and the primaries is left for the party to decide. And in this case, the APC opted to go through the delegate system. And the person who had the most support from the delegates in returning one, although he came a very decent second to Mashua Duvala Tsunubu. Now, I haven't said that. Right now, the minister is, I wouldn't say that often, but without a political office, somebody who has held a political office since 1999, was picked up for eight years, was governor for eight years, was minister after he left his office as governor. And so he's been in the limelight for several years. So this is perhaps a shock to him that he is nowhere in terms of national politics directly as he used to be. He's only got a front-runner. He does not have a table based on a political office for now. But I reckon that his journey in the wilderness will not be for too long because if things go the way the party has planned and if things go the way other people have come fast, that he'll be allowed to come back to his office and do some transport to complete all the projects. You heard Shaywusoni say in the past week that he should be allowed to complete all his ongoing projects. This is one minister who we can say has really done well under the Guarvi administration, although the stain on the CV is the Kaduna bomb attack. That's the stain on the CV. But aside from that, if you've been to the International Airport in Abuja, if you've seen other rail projects that have been completed, you will see that he's done a lot. He's one of the shining lights of the Guarvi administration. But as it relates to political issues now, it might need to do some realignment. You showed that Ashiraju visited his house a few days back. So I think that some international realignments will call to see what the critical potential for the former minister for transport. Carl, I think that we have you on a clear line. I'd like to hear your thoughts on the former transportation minister. For most of the ministers that resigned, they are appointment to contest the ADC primary. I would say that it was simply pure opportunism. Because most of them were counting on the fact that other would be annihilated because of the plumber and litigation that the governorship should come to the Ashiraju political zone. It would make. Go ahead. So it was simply the issue of court defense was not there. Even though most of them have served in various capacities and never really had much to show for it. But the big concerns Nigeria should be asking remains this. Most of these guys have been in and out of governance for the past 24 years. In the 15th start of the Bundayon, who has been in the military era up to now. I mean, they should, they should also, they ought to have a second address as people were always free. Politicians, it's not their main occupation. They should also give way for others to also come and bring in their competitors and also move the country forward. So I don't think that there should be any big deal about what they should do next. They should also go with life. Again, I mean, you can't really say that. I mean, again, it's your personal opinion to say that, you know, these people should take a sit for others to, you know, you know, have a fair chance to play in the ring. But then there are people who would tell you that this is, this is something that they do. This is the fact. This is their capital in terms of politics being continuously in the mix. Because I mean, I think Daisy made it a very interesting point. The man who was supposed to, who was the first to resign and say he had a political ambition did not show up at the Eagle Square to even make a case for that ticket in the first instance. And I'm talking about the Minister of State for, I think, Science and Technology, if I'm not mistaken. And he didn't show up. So people would ask, of course, even if he knows how to do his job, even if he doesn't know how to do his job, or rather, if he did his job really well, what about what happens to him in the future in terms of politics? And I asked Daisy another question. For a minister, Amici, whose APC in River State is divided, has been unable to have any proper elections or primaries or congresses because there are two factions in that party. And then, of course, at the national level, whether he has been, you know, in meetings or in talks with the flag bearer of the party, that is one on one hand. But what is the political future of Rotimi and Amici? Will he be able to say in the future that I am, you know, the father of the APC, or I am the leader of the APC in River State, these are the people that I'm grooming, because it's one thing to say step aside. Who are the people that these people have fathered that they can say, OK, well, I'll step aside and let you run? Carl? Yeah, Muzio. If we want to talk about the problem, the most of these guys had that the APC primaries was that they really got to discover that they were superstars the way they saw themselves. Because like in the instance of the former governor, who was working at Amici, who was speaker for 80s, governor for 80s, leader of APC in River State, but the surprisingly, the irony remains that in the past two elections, the APC has not been able to shoot candidates in River State. As we speak now, APC is still a marching crisis in River State. So that will also put the question back on the leadership and the general identity. In the case of people like Wajoba and the rest of them, I still maintain that these are people that just came out for the election because they believe that, oh, because the climate that has come to the South East, oh, the house and the death position to take it. None of them came to that context on their own steam and that was why the collapse rule, so at this moment in the primaries. Let me come back to you, Daisy. Let's talk about Goswyl Aquabio, who also seems to be having the same situation in Akwaibong State as Rosimi Amici, where there seems to be some uncertainty for his party and if they would be able to even participate in the elections, being that there are cases that are in court right now. Aquabio, for some, would be a governor who was very... articulate to someone who was able to do certain things and put Akwaibong State on the map. Some people might say different. But he's also a very good orator. You know, he speaks very well, he's able to, you know, get people to join his team. But we were unable to see that happen in his bid for presidency. Again, some people would say, just like Carl, they were just there because they thought that, you know, their level of, let's say, fame would one way or the other get them the ticket. But for Anakwaibio now, who's also almost on the same boat with former Minister Rosimi Amici, do you see him playing his way back into the game as compared to a Rosimi Amici? Well, I think as it relates to... Governor Gontrilo Aquabio, he was the first person to declare support for the eventual flag bearer of the party. And that was the very strategic move. Perhaps he saw the handwriting on the wall that he would not be able to get the party's nomination. But I don't play that hand. Of course, it also means that if should ABC go ahead and win the general elections, it would be in good state to at least lease of claim to the party's victory. I haven't said the borrowing for the various governors and other aspirants who chewed their weight behind Ashwajibor-Latin. So for Aquabio, I think, well, quite on the national stage, he may not have an office as minister. But he's still very much relevant in the South South. And due to for Right Honourable Chibuki Amici, they both are very relevant politicians in their respective states. For Governor Minister Amici, the problem that he has is that he has a very formidable opposition in Governor Yesou Miki. Governor Miki has proven twice that he's not a pushover. And don't forget also that Governor Amici is always quick to remind you that Governor Miki was his mentee, so to speak. So of course it's the case where every tactic that the minister has in his ass now, Miki has almost twice on that. So that, and he also has the power of equivalency going for him. So that's why I think he's been handicapped in rivers. But Governor Aquabio has not been so handicapped in Aquabio. It's still a very, very prominent position in the Aquabio state. However, you will understand that when it comes to politics, there are not interests at play. And those interests are at play in Aquabio. And that's what I have in several court cases. Even though at the convention it declared that the three delegates of Aquabio would vote for Matiago to know who. But apparently because of the court injunction that was served at the convention, they could not really add their votes to Italy because it commands the reality of these people and is still very much relevant in national politics. Unfortunately, they may have to go back home because a lot of the time when these positions go to national state, they forget that they need to also have that back in the court. And I think that's what is lacking in both the case of Governor Aquabio and Dono Amici. But for Amici, I still insist that he has a very formidable position who has the power to go for him. I do not see that if Governor Aquabio leaves office in 2023, I think that he will have a more level playing field to be able to expand his political ideals and be basketball. Okay, Carl, you are in river state. I just want to point to both gentlemen. Notice that these ministers who stepped down in pursuit of their presidential bid were from the south. I am talking about Obonayano, Majuba, Aquabio and Rotimi Amici. Now, last week a reverse politician Tonya Princeville did speak about Tinibu's win as a lesson to the south and not just the south, he talked about the southeast, he talked about the south-south and the middle belt saying that there are lots of lessons we need to learn from the politicking of Asiwaju Abola met Tinibu. Do you agree with Tonya that there's a lot that the south needs to learn from Tinibu's politicking? Yeah, absolutely. I quite agree with that position because what played out in the APC primary was the flag that Carl, are you there? I think that we lost Carl again. Carl, are you there? Can you hear me? We lost that connection, unfortunately. The connection on his end is really bad. Back to you, Deji. So, Deji, just as I said there's a lot to look at. There's a lot to learn from what has transpired. Again, like I said, these four gentlemen are from the south. The southeast and, of course, the south-south. And we see that some people would say they've lost out. They shot themselves in the foot. Some people would say, well, it was strategic. Some who have declared allegiance for the flag bearer, some of them would say they're winning. But what Tonya Cole said about the fact that there's a lot more that we need to learn in terms of alliances and political pragmatism, do you share the same sentiment? Well, absolutely. I think what you said is very apt to list that constant because what we can see is that Ashwajibala Tunubu is a politician who has been on the same for well over 30 years. He has several mentees, several political godsons and goddesses that he can point to. Many of whom are limited to the limelight who have played a very prominent role in the national development. So, and the man was built bridges across the Niger far north. He has his back in there. Even the title, Jagaban is a title that he got from the north. Jagaban is from the north. So that tells you that he's a very diverse politician who is also very, very competitive in his approach. Very pragmatic. And as when it all seemed as though it was not going to get a ticket, I mean you will see that on Twitter, a lot of people were just saying his ambition was didn't arrive out and they played off the chances of the vice president and other people's chances have been anointed by the president and nobody really saw Ashwajibu getting the ticket eventually. As a matter of fact, a lot of people were waiting for the convention so that you can be put to shame. But eventually it turned out to be the reverse. It turned out to be the major flag bearer given it doesn't have the consensus about anything else. It was still able to pull off the great escape. And I think that it's round at Abebuta perhaps would be the most historic round in the history of Nigeria. Because that round eventually I think forced the hand of so many people and eventually you saw that he got an overwhelming support on delegates. What you may say that those delegates were very satisfied to cast their votes for him but all of our experience also had the same level playing field they could have also gone ahead to do what needed to be done to secure the ticket. Like I said those of them were... I'm not disagreeing I'm just curious when you say they had the same level playing field did they stand a chance against the tinibu? When you say they could do what he did what exactly did he do that they could have done? So what I mean is if you pick up a form to run for the office of the president that's the eyes of the president. You must believe in your chances you must believe that you have the same clout the same persona, the same charisma, the same pockets to be able to win the nomination. So it wouldn't be foolhardy to pick up a form knowing that you had no chance. I wouldn't say that Governor Mechit is not filled to see he had a chance. I'm sure he felt that he had a good chance of picking the party's nomination detailed for the vice president. They must have believed that he stood a chance or they must have believed that the delegates were people of conscience like Pastor Sudevac had he said he said he sent out SMS to us delegates I mean he believed in the ability of delegates to see beyond financial motives and vote for him based on his passion for the country and I believe that even all the other experienced would also say the same that they have a passionate about the country and that they would give him a chance to take the country to greater heights. So if you pick up a form to run for office then you must really believe in your chances otherwise it was a foolish thing to do but those of them who felt that they could no longer have the same right on the wall would not wrestle the ticket from the Jagaban they decided to step down their ambitions in the state, that's my state he did mention that he had a young man as a long way to go and he also had a former speaker as a representative Mr Dimitri Bankoli saying also that he's also a young man and went to cross streets on the Jagaban so a lot of people looked at their current state and their future and aligned that we aligned their position some of them you need to step down like Pastor Sudevac had they got zero votes they did not step down but I didn't get zero votes I'm not very sensitive now but he also went on a round a national round as to justice and conscience and all of those things but politics is politics politics is a kind of politics that requires you to not only have deep pockets it also requires you to have friends in across the country okay finally I hope that Carl you can hear me just to wrap this up Deji has said that a lot of them had level playing field even though Obonaianu had come out to say he felt that there was no justice in terms of power being ceded to the south or the southeast but do you see any mass movement out of the APC or do you think that there has been some calm within the party and that maybe there have been patched and people are holding hands and kumbayaing their way to 2023 Carl can you hear me unfortunately Carl cannot hear us well I want to say thank you Deji for being part of the conversation Deji Abwabiyide is a legal practitioner and of course Carl Cineju is a journalist and thank you gentlemen for being here thank you for having me alright and on that note we'll take a quick break when we come back we'll be talking with minister in Kogi state there have been several clashes within the states which has also led to the loss of lives and property we'll be talking about it after this break