 We could just get started because this may be a very quick meeting. Reworking the OKD base repository, Brian had started making some PRs I think and will continue making PRs and the gist is that we make PRs to make modifications to the current repository as it's going to get moved over to the new location so that it meets the watermark of Red Hat folks who had put their efforts into it to get started. Meeting docs, I'm going to start posting them like making individual MD files in the new repo for each meeting so that folks can just navigate to a particular meeting and see the respective notes and agenda and then as I upload the videos, the description will now have a link to that particular meeting's document. I had been just doing like a generic paragraph about OKD but we'll actually be able to specialize now. Website styling, Brian is still working with Brandon I think, there was some back and forth in chat but I don't know if they finished in that or not. I think that it's still a work in progress but Brandon is still doing some work on it and will probably have a proposal site for us or probably not this week but when Brian comes back they'll have something for us to look at to see if he's forked it and is playing with it and coming up with some suggestions so I think we'll review it in the docs meeting and then present it to the group or the docs meeting loves it or whatever. You can figure out the process for accepting it but the work is being done. Excellent and that's very useful work. Issues, let's see there are five issues but these are all sort of old ones in terms of the OKD.io, nothing new there and pull requests. There are no pull requests for website content. New business so this is probably going to take the most of the time to this. I don't know if folks noticed but Vadim actually stepped away from OKD development for a short period of time. He's put in a lot of extra hours and wants to maintain a good work-life balance and community contributor life balance type thing and so I think it's encompass upon this group and the larger group to come up with a contributor's guide. It's actually like if you want to contribute in terms of code or debugging or anything like that, this is what you need to do because we've talked now for a long time about how having it rest on the shoulders of Vadim is just not, it's not tenable for the future. Yeah, totally support. So I threw out the idea that we do a contributor's guide. I think that that is awesome. I think we could probably look at maybe even the Kubernetes contributor guide and we've got a few other sample guides out there. I think Stack Rocks and Ansible have nice ones as well. That would be an awesome thing to do. I think the other piece of the coin besides the contributor guide is the built process. Currently we can't build our own distros, our own images and stuff and I think longer term for the viability of OKD as a standalone open source project, we need to figure that out and I'll have a conversation with the folks internally but finding a place where we can set up a CI CD process for us and manage it ourselves. I don't want to be an open source purist but as a true open source project building our own stuff. I don't know if Michael Burke has heard that the term operate first group inside of Red Hat is a whole initiative that's supporting other open source projects with hosted open shift that I've been having a conversation. I have a conversation with Karsten Wade tomorrow and I'm going to broach the subject of them somehow using that initiative inside of Red Hat or OKD but what that means is we really do need the contributors guide and we need people who will take on the role of building it. I'm always concerned that at some juncture the engineering resources will get pulled. We're beholden to Red Hat and I say that as a Red Hatter, we're beholden to them to do it so that is the risk for us. The other alternative is maybe pushing it over into Fedora Land and building and seeing what they have for resources too but I think the contributor guide is definitely something we need and I would, there's another phraseology called a contributor contribution ladder which Kubernetes contributor group has worked very hard on how you get to become a maintainer or a maintainer or maybe a builder is a term that we need to. If the operate first conversation doesn't work out in terms of finding a place to build OKD ourselves and that's a lot of work and down the push of maybe Dato, Neil and the team over there might have hosting capabilities but I think that is something we definitely need to. The first step is the contributor guide and the contribution ladder portion of that. What we need actually because if we want to ask folks to provide resources, we need a clear sense of what resources we need to ask for to be able to do builds and stuff. Yeah and I think it's time because we're even, you know, we have this conversation over and over and I was talking with someone earlier today about we've probably been through a half dozen, maybe a dozen different vet teams over the nine years that OpenShift has had an open source version of itself and they always move on. It is like the greatest training ground and they always get promoted. It's a great training ground but we lose them. You know, there's a half dozen people now still inside a red hat who started out as the OKD technical liaison. So that's kind of important. So if anyone's watching this recording, that I think is really the roadmap vision that we have to discuss as a group, how we do our own builds and how we host this separately if we want to be viable as a through open source project. Michael, we've been kind of dominating this conversation. What are your thoughts? I can certainly help out. Definitely sounds like a good idea. There's Neil. Speak of the devil. Hello. Is that a two for one, Neil? Yeah, two for one. Our system here is Zoom instead of BlueJeans so I can't use the fancy conference equipment but here we are anyway. Okay, cool. Well, we were just talking about creating a contributor guide. Yeah, so we end incorporating a contributor ladder similar to what the Kubernetes crew has done and, you know, easily lifted and ported, I think, for us. But the other piece of the conversation that I was, I brought up to is that I think for the, and we talked about it at the larger group before about creating our own build process and hosting our own build process. And there's a couple of initiatives inside of Red Hat that I'm going to talk to to see if we can get space on the cloud. It's called operate first. And they're helping open source projects do their builds and testing. So I was going to broach the subject of them helping us. So there's, I think they even have a landing page. I think it's more about the offside of things rather than hosting and building processes, but it's a possibility. But the other possibility is finding someone with some cloud resources that we can leverage to do our own build processes. Is this building OKD itself, building documentation site, all of the above? Building OKD itself and all of the, yeah. I think that's, you know, I think it's time to start doing that. And the reason your ears were burning deal is because I mentioned that, you know, that data might be a place or Fedora land might be a place where we could do that. But it would be, you know, something, something we could think we should start talking about. Yeah. So I don't know what you have for resources, but, and I'm not going to put you guys on the spot, but. Well, I think, you know, as I was saying, I think first we need to figure out as a group what resources actually needed before anyone could commit any resources. Yeah. That's the big one. I want to go and say I need undefined amounts of stuff. Right. That's, that's the conversation goes very poorly. Yes, exactly. So that's where we are with that. So I'll add that as a task. I will, for all of us, pull your ideas and then I'll bring this to the general group next week and we'll start putting together just a guide in Git. People can make merge requests and we'll have maybe a group of approvers that, you know, maybe three people that are approvers or something like that, any one of them can approve just that we have some semblance of organization to do it and we'll just keep building on the contributors guide and then we will, I'll reach out to Vadim and Christian as well and maybe see if I can get a meeting with the three or whoever else wants to join to have a conversation about what actually resource-wide, resource-wise is needed to build it, right? And then we'll go from there. So any other thoughts on this? So I don't know enough about the build process. Is it that we need somewhere to run containers? Is it that we need VMs? Is it like what level of computing resource do we ideally more? I don't have the answer to that. I think that's the question we might have to interview Vadim with the intent of creating a, you know, not just a contributor guide but a builder's guide for OKD. You know, and so then we might know what the requirements were because it's pretty, you know, we're just being, we're part of the CI CD build process for OpenShift and it's just an output of that right now. So that's a pretty intense build process. So, you know, do we need that whole thing? Probably a good fair portion of it and I don't know what those resources are. I never have gotten my head around that part of it. So, yeah, there you go. Any other thoughts on this particular topic? Then moving on, our task list is machine OS repo discussion. I didn't make it to the last two main meetings I've been out, but I don't think that actually came up. Diane, did that come up in the last main meeting? Machine OS repository stuff? I don't think it did. So I'll make sure it makes it to that. Move community docs out of the community repo. Brian's going to do that. Try registering with Matrix. Guides, formats. How are we on the guide stuff moving? Oh, sorry, go ahead, Diane. I was just going to say I have heard from the Ansible community that they've had much success with Matrix. So I think we have to do a little bit more practice. And I did it before we voted down or something. I reached out to the Carol Chen and some of the folks who run the community around that and they have been very successful and happy because it integrates both with Google chat and Slack. So yeah. So do we have anybody here who had trouble registering who can talk about, okay, which home server did you try registering with? Well, I have to go back and try. It was like three weeks ago. I don't even remember. So what I'm saying is I will make another valiant attempt and I will go back through the email thread or the docs and try it again. I think we all need to make another valiant attempt and come back. And I will have some downtime. I'm away the next two weeks on business in Israel. But that does mean I have like a 15 hour plane ride to reach it and test again. But I think from what I can, if I sniff the wind, Matrix is kind of getting some good groundswell of adoption out there and other open source communities. And it might just be our, or my predilection to just keep the easy Slack channels. Slack is not necessarily easy to onboard onto if you're not already using Slack either. Correct. And one of the... I'll turn this around because it looks a soft core when I don't speak out of the voice of God or whatever. But one of the bigger challenges, even I as an experienced Slack user have a problem with is like pretty much everybody's method of getting onto Slack is unique because Slack itself is not designed for open collaboration. It's designed for closed workspace stuff. And that's... And we run into this impedance mismatch a lot. I mean, the Kubernetes people are just kind of adapted around it because most of them are people that are paid to work on it for their jobs. And they're not really community centric in that regard. And so they just kind of are okay with whatever. But like as someone who like his community first and then company man second in this space, it is kind of bad that we have that problem. And I'd like for us to have a much more open community first default interaction model for the OKD project. So Neil, what would you say is the best link for people to use to find out about getting into the Matrix channel? Do we have a dock of any kind or just using the door? I don't have a dock of hand. Although if you go to element IO, they have a getting started guide on their website. Element.io slash get dash started. And it kind of helps you figure out how to get started or whatever. But I think, I don't know, someone might want to check with Marie Norden in Fedora. I think she was working on a dock for people to get started using the Fedora project matrix server. And that might actually be a good starting point. Our matrix room is hosted there. Yeah, I think that's some surgery and whatever. Yeah, I think maybe that's if I mean, I know I'm I'm ridiculously busy. So if you can track Marie down, Neil, you know, I think she knows who I am, but she knows you better that and then maybe bring that to next week's meeting and re ask everybody to give it an attempt. I think I will not be there. But so I just I would be hosting a gathering in Tel Aviv. I won't be able to back you up on that. But I think we need to I did because I was worried that we were ditching it too soon. Or there was a lot of grumbling. So I reached out to a couple of other open source projects and I know if you know Carol Chen from Ansible or Robin Bergeon, they were both. Yeah, that matrix is really helpful for them. So I value their opinions. There might also be someone in the Ospo group at Red Hat. That is a matrix expert. So I'll ask there again today to if they have some stuff. So and for it. For it to Jamie and see if we can get that going. Yeah. Do you have the link to the. Matrix server on fedora so that we have it in the. Yeah, I don't think we have that in the docs. Here. That's a door project. Okay. That's the that's the. The front page. Yeah. We can throw that in. It's chat dot fedora project dot org. And you just. And if you want to link to the room directly. Yeah, that's. Okay. I think that's the, that's the correct thing here. That's the one I was looking for. If we can put both of those in the hack MD. I will put them in my. I think that's the right one. To do when you have Wi-Fi on a plane. Yeah. That should be right. Yeah. Okay. That's correct. Got it. Yeah. So. Yeah. You want me to put those in the hack MD or something? I thought I just put them in. In an issue. Oh, you already did. Cool. Yeah. Maybe we'll, we'll, we'll do that. Yeah. Maybe we'll, we'll, we'll do is we'll create a discussion item. Out of it or something like that or actually put it up in the website. And people can try doing it themselves. Yeah. Put it on the website. Any other thoughts on this one. I think we just go forward test and see what we got. All right. And that brings us to our task lists. So guides Daniel. Yes. So, um, the, it looks like the format I proposed for the guides. People seem generally positive about that. Um, So would my next step to be. Write up a document in our documentation about the form of the documentation. For the guides. Yes. Okay. Um, where, where should that go? Do we have a docs about docs section or. In contributing. We do not yet. What I would do is. Um, I would say, let's see. As a, you could put it as a page within the guides. Holder. Oh yeah. Yeah. Just as the like guides. Read me. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I'll do that. That makes sense. Does anyone have a different thought? Would there be a different way to do it? But yeah, I think actually. Cause there isn't actually a read me. In the guides yet. So maybe you could create the read me. Sure. And, uh, And then yeah. And then put it in like the format there. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Sounds good. And then we should be ready to start assigning issues out to people who said that they would rewrite guides. Saying, here's the format. Here's what we want it to look like. Go, go forth and update your guide. Yes. I love it. Cool. Okay. We'll do. Excellent. Uh, security liaison. I reached out again and haven't heard anything. I'm going to try a different way. It might be that the person who volunteered is not getting on slack. So maybe I'll send a LinkedIn message and we'll see if we can get that. And then that's it. Uh, And the other upcoming events besides coupon EU. Um, Well, at coupon EU, there will be, um, an OpenShift Commons gathering on May 17th. So if you have any questions, we'll do, there will be, um, an OpenShift Commons gathering on May 17th. So if any of you are, Neil from data or anybody's coming on both Christian and Vadim are going to come and there's going to be at least a lightning talk on OKD there. And, um, they will also be, um, part of a presentation on micro shift because micro shift, um, which is in, you know, POC or tech preview. Um, I'm not sure what that nomenclature is. Um, uses, um, OKD. So I'm going to make them be part of that talk too. So there'll be a lot of OKD on the menu at the gathering. Um, and depending on how all things go, we may even find a room to do, um, an OKD working group, um, meet up there as well. But. I had an idea. I just wanted to quickly float. I just wanted to make sure that that productizes that and it stops being based on OKD at some point. I proposed that we call our version micro KD. I love it. Yeah. Uh, I think that would be good. Um, I, I. Yeah, I don't, I don't know. Um, I'm sure there are plans, um, in the offing and, um, we will hear about them at the gathering in, um, a, so I think everything now is part of the emerging tech, um, group at the office of the CTO. Um, and two of the guys that are at the core engineers on it are based in Spain. Um, so they're luckily Ricardo and Miguel are both going to be the speakers for that. Um, and then we'll make the demon, uh, the demon Christian answer any OKD or or OS, OS issues, because I think there will be some conversations around that, because if I listen to Sally O'Malley at the last OKD meeting, it's using a variant yet again of REL-COR-OS. Did I get that wrong? Instead of Fedora-COR-OS, I'm not sure. I got it wrong. I believe it is. I'm going to watch that video again. Yeah. Yeah, there's so many variants of variants of things that I don't want to misspeak for anyone who's watching this recording. Just go back to the last working group meeting and watch the presentation before I look at the slides that Sally O'Malley shared. That will be... She is the definitive person on that. All right. Do we have anything else before we sign off? Yeah. I'm wondering if there is someone, if there's a way to go through the docs.okd.io site to make sure everything that's in there is applicable. Right. Like sort of a triage to see anything that needs to get pulled out that is not in there. Yeah. I think last meeting, there were a couple of operators, cluster logging operator is in the docs, but it's not in OKD. So let's at the next meeting, what we'll do is because we'll have more people at the next docs meeting. At the next docs meeting, let's actually like assign out different tasks to different folks and just like as a group just say, okay, in the next two weeks, you take this section, you take this section, you take this section, the people who are really knowledgeable about OKD and documentation. I think that's a great idea is just like comb through it and bring to your attention anything that needs to be removed or modified. Yeah. Yeah. That would be good. There was one other thing speaking of triages that we talked about is hosting another testing and deployment OKD summit. And so I just wanted to put that on our radars and basically I would, if we're going to pick a date, I would, from my schedule, it would have to be post-cubecon EU. We could promote it at post-cubecon EU at those events, but I'd like this group and maybe Jamie drive it through next week and see if there's a date. And then I'll just create, like I did again, another hopping event and we can promote that. And maybe one of the subtopics, Michael, could be a room for people to triage the documentation. Yeah. But that would be probably sometime the end of May beginning of June. So if you need something prior to that, we better do it ourselves. Maybe we could do a higher level one now, not have to go way, but go line for line. Yeah. And then May or June. Yeah. To the deeper dive. Yeah, it's perfect. All right. We did that in a half an hour. Yeah, not bad. Of course, we're missing one of our primary people. So yeah. Yeah. Well, yeah. Well, you also got an unexpected, you got an unusual guess for one. So yes, this is true. You are one and you lose one. That's okay. All right. Is there anything else that we have? Yeah. So Neil, yeah, so Neil, just an ask if you reach out to Marie Norton and she's writing a guide. CC, Jamie and I on any response or forward it to us so that we can make sure that I'll have. I'll check with her and have you guys in the loop. Perfect. Thank you. Thanks for all your efforts on that, Neil. That's much appreciated. Well, all right. Take care, guys. Thanks. Thanks, Jamie. Bye. Bye-bye.