 Waterway? So that is a culvert that would be county, but does it dump, there's a holding, very old holding area back behind where the big tree fell down. And depending on whether or not it's a county pond or who knows, it could be either one and no sense putting energy into somebody who's not responsible for something, right? Okay. So at your convenience. Thank you. Pardon, Chair Ravinovich, I just wanted to let you know that you do have a quorum, so you will be able to start the meeting at nine o'clock. Thank you very much. And we will get started right on time. I don't see enough people yet here, but it's good to know. It's quorum four. We're just gonna look that up. I know she's got the roster handy, so. Either four or five. Pardon, I had myself on mute. So because the board has seven seats, four is a quorum. Even though we haven't filled one or, well. Correct, yes. So one, two, yeah, four. I see four names. Morning, everybody. Good morning. Morning. Good morning. We'll start in what looks like three minutes on my clock. Got a chance to take some walks on the Prince Greenway during the rainy period we went through. And wow, that was really something. How high was the water when you were there? Well, it just overflowed a little bit on a couple of the low line pathways, but it wasn't near going over the top. Right. Thank goodness. Yeah, which is good. That would take a much, much larger storm. But it was interesting walking there with all the waters rushing through there. One of our new planners is Nancy Walterine, who you may remember Nancy Dakin, Walterine, and she helped do the environmental analysis for that project. And so we took a few walks and remarked on how that's how it's supposed to function. So very, very full. Haven't seen her in a while. That's good to know. Yeah, we're really happy to have her on our team. Yeah, you're getting some good folks back. Yes. Jessica and others. Yep, we have a great team. Tech committee member, Dikey, good to see you. Hello there, staff waves on Lyle. How are you? I'm good. Morning, morning, morning. Has your hair always been so reddish, staff waves on Lyle? No, committee member, Dikey. I think I haven't seen you all for so long. I feel like it's been like this for a while, but... Okay. Yeah, it's attractive, it's nice. Thanks. And my hair wasn't always this gray either. You still got hair up there? One or two. One or two. Okay, here we are. Good morning. It's great seeing you all back here. I'm going to call the meeting to order. January 26th, the meeting of the Waterways Advisory Committee. I want to say hello to the committee again. Welcome, Eileen Cleary. And I see Janden Briscoe is here as a planner. Happy to have him aboard. So with that, I would ask our secretary to do the roll call. Good morning. Let the record reflect that all members, with the exception of committee members C, are present. Thank you. I have been asked to read the following statement. The city of Santa Rosa is committed to creating a safe and inclusive environment. We will not tolerate speech or actions that disrupt a public meeting or may be perceived as aggressive, demeaning, or harmful towards staff, an applicant team, or other meeting participants. Staff will be monitoring this meeting and ensuring that everyone is participating respectfully. If staff determines that a meeting participant is acting in a disruptive or disrespectful manner, they will first be muted and given a warning. If the behavior continues, it will then be removed. If necessary, we may also end the meeting. If participants have added questions or concerns, they should reach out directly to the project planner or the applicant team. And with that, I want to also mention that if we go past 1030, I will probably have to leave and ask, let's see, committee member, vice chair, Dike, commonly known as Art, to go over for me. If I'm still in that position. Ah. Okay, I'm gonna ask now for public comment on non-agenda items. We're now taking public comments. This is the time that any person may address this subcommittee on members not listed on the agenda, but which are within the subject matter jurisdiction of our committee. Chair Ovinish, we have no hands raised at this time. Okay, well, thank you very much. Okay, we'll start our committee business. The role of the Waterways Advisory Committee is to review development projects, both public and private that are located adjacent to creeks and waterways for consistency with the goals, policies and regulations for creekside development identified in the Santa Rosa General Plan, zoning code, design guidelines and the Citywide Creek Master Plan. While the committee does not take formal action on projects it does provide advisory comments to the decision making body. All development projects located adjacent to a creek or waterway are required to be reviewed by the Waterways Advisory Committee prior to proceeding through the entitlement process. Okay, first item on the agenda is the committee reports and which I do not have one at the moment, but we can go around and see if others do have reports to give. Welcome, Kevin, any reports by any members? Not hearing any, we'll move on to the next item which is the selection of the vice chair. Amy, do you wanna take this? Yes, thank you, Chair. So because the mayor has not made appointments to chairs of any of the committees yet we can't elect a vice chair yet either. So we'll ask you to continue this item and it'll most likely be the March meeting where we'll be able to do the vice chair election because we anticipate the mayor making chair appointments on the February 14th meeting. But with that said, the chair and the vice chair can remain until that point of time. A question kind of associated. We all now have expiration dates of 31 December of this year which is awkward, right? I mean, potentially we could see an entirely brand new committee in January. I think that was because they just couldn't get to it, right? And it was extended, we were all extended. Yes, cause there have not been formal appointments. So that is something I can look into with our clerk, but I believe that's something you'd have to work on with your respective council members as well. We don't have, we're at large, except for the ones that are appointed from other committees, right? So we don't have specific, we're not specifically appointed by a council member. Right, but I think there needs to be some formal appointment made by council. So I'll look to the clerk's office and get back to you on what that process is. So I just, yeah, so I just like to emphasize it would be good to have some type of staggering. I know it looks like that's going to be awkward this time around. Oh, because everyone's at the same time. Yeah. And then we're of course still waiting on an appointment from the design review board as well. Yeah. Has there been a new chair selected? Oh, is that full committee now, the design review board? No, we received two more appointments Tuesday, but they do not have a full committee yet and no chairs have been appointed to any of our boards and commissions. Okay, so that'll happen as you said, February 14th. And then after that, I do hope that that's on their agenda or appointment. Well, if you have any say on it, I'd like to see chair Steve continue if there's an opportunity to make that statement. Well, thank you, Arthur. Thank you. We did actually through our director, Claire Hartman, emailed the mayor and moved forward the recommendations for chair based on who was interested. And so chair Bennewish did express interest. So I haven't heard anything otherwise, but we'll hear more in February. Okay. Well, it looks like we're kind of plunging into the department reports. Oh, Charles. Yeah, I just, how's my audio? I haven't checked this morning. Can you hear me? That's good. Yeah, I know I'm getting a new assignment from the planning commission to the subdivision subcommittee. So I may be transitioning out of the waterways advisory committee. I don't know if I can have two subcommittee assignments. So just thought I'd let you know in advance. Well, if you can, we'd love to have you continue. So. I like the committee and would like to stay apart, but I don't know if it's procedurally okay to do that. So we have, we all have political connections. So we'll see what we can do. Enough of that. Okay, Amy, we're on to the department reports now. So is there a report from your department? Yes, thank you so much. It's really great to see you all again. It's been a long time since we've met. So just some logistical things. First, you've probably heard Eileen Cleary. She's supporting our committee right now. We've had a lot of changes on our admin team, but Eileen's been our constant since she's been here working within our planning economic development department for a very long time. So we're happy to have her helping support our planning team. And so I noted the chair and the vice chair situation. So we'll wait to hear on that. And then also an update on our hybrid meetings and the Brown Act. So the Brown Act flexibility is gonna be expiring. So we will be back doing in-person meetings starting in March. So I'll be sending out an email with more detail on what that means for you all as committee members because we will be asking you to come in-person. So we will have to have an in-person quorum for those meetings. We will still be offering a Zoom option for participants, applicants, consultants, but staff and committee will be in-person. And that's for all of our boards and commissions as well. Where will we be meeting? Eileen mentioned earlier, I believe we'll be across the streets in the chamber building. Is that correct, Eileen? That is correct. Okay, that seems like where we met last. Yeah, I don't know if I've been to an in-person meeting with you all. So that'll be. We really, we do exist in the flesh. But only from the shoulders up. That's actually a good meeting space because it's very roomy jammed in. Like we used to meet near transit department there. That was pretty small room, but this is a good one. And of course all the meetings are moving back in-person. So there's gonna be some room availability issues. So we might be a different place one month and then back in another. So we're just gonna go with the flow on that. And Eileen's already reserved most of our dates and in that room. So we should be good, but there might be changes. And we'll try to make sure to alert you if there's a change to what we've normally been doing. I'm wondering, do the committee members ever get parking vouchers or anything like that? Yeah, so that's one thing we're checking on. I believe we do offer parking passes for you all to attend. So we'll be checking on that and getting back to you as well. Wonderful. But we hope you take public transit to get here also. Ride your bike. Oh, you do, huh? Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. All right, and then as far as what's happening in our department, it's been a long time since we've seen you all, but we have a lot of new planners on board. I think we've hired six new people. So most of those people are in a limited term position due to grant funding or one-time funds provided by the council, but we're really excited to have a full team and there's a lot of work happening. So I won't provide you a full update on all the projects that are happening around, but I can certainly provide an email update if that's something you would like. As far as things that are going to be upcoming or things that have happened since we last met. That would affect this committee? Not necessarily, indirectly, perhaps. Okay. Yeah. That would be great. Great. And then one of the projects that just because of where I sit in the building, and I'll let you know our housing element is moving to the planning commission this afternoon. So that will be heard by the planning commission today and then city council on February 14th. So that's part of our general plan update, which we move the housing element out of that larger project due to timelines and state law deadlines. So that will be exciting if you all are able to listen in on that meeting, which I know committee member Carter will be there. Also, when the email I will send you is that we have launched a couple new online dashboards, one related to our pending development and another related to our housing work. So those are somewhat new. We do have a grant to do a lot more related to housing dashboards and transparency on projects and where they are and what's happening. So that'll be happening over the next year. Committee member Quinn. Thank you. This could predate me. The Canary project, which is finally getting off the ground is that's something that either came before or will be coming before this committee or is that outside of the distance? Thank you. Yes, that project was actually approved in a ministerial or by right process. So that was approved under SB 35, which is a state law that requires local jurisdictions to not exercise any discretion if there's a certain amount of affordability within the project. So that was approved with no decision-making bodies or staff discretion. I do have a suggestion since Carol brought this up. There's also the smart site development north of the Canary project. There's a connectivity that should be on where fourth street is extended to the west toward the creek there. And I'm curious about whether there will be a direct connection made as part of these projects because it would be a bike and pedestrian connection to the greenway. And also there is the project that will be extending the bike path from the Radota Trail Creek, San Rosa Creek, and also the smart bike path across third street to the smart station. And I'd be curious to get an update on that and see what exactly that's gonna look like just to understand the connectivity because it really is a kind of a crossroads, if you will, of potential bike or bike system. So maybe that we could get a little update on that. That sounds good. Do you remember the name of that project or maybe describe that location a little bit more? I have it in my email. I will forward it to you. Okay. Somewhere. Thank you. Sounds good. Happy to look into that. I'm sorry, I mean, do you have it? Nope. That's it for me. Thank you. Any questions of Amy before we move on? Well, thanks for all your work, Amy. Oh, I see one hand. Committee member Kwan. Oh. I was gonna ask on a similar note the Canary, the college park, the college, the old water agency building, again, outside of the distance or because of the type of house housing that's being built outside of the purview. I can look into that for you. I think that was approved a few years ago, but let me look into that and I'll email you directly. It's very exciting to see all of these projects finally getting out of the ground, but it highlights their proximity to the waterways. Thank you. Are there any department reports from regarding the water department or Sonoma water department today? Yes. I am Claire Myers. I am the stormwater and creeks manager. Welcome. Thank you. Yeah, I just, ordinarily Steve attends this meeting and he was unavailable today. So I thought it was a great opportunity for me to jump in and just give, reintroduce myself. I've been to these meetings before, but it's been a long time. And so I think my face might be new to some of you. So first I just wanted to introduce myself and say hi and then give you a few updates. I have some great news to share. The city has recently been conditionally awarded two grants for our lower Colgan Creek restoration project phase three. Not sure if you've heard about these yet. The first was from the Sonoma County agricultural preservation and open space district. We are looking to get one point five million dollars to put towards the purchase of the last property that we need for the project. And so that's been conditionally approved. We are in escrow with the property owner. Everything is moving forward. So excited about that. And that grant is for both the water department, our team and then also parks because that site will be both where the creek is restored and then also a future park for the city of Santa Rosa. So that was our first grant. And then just this week we officially got confirmation that we are moving forward with a department of water resources grant through their urban streams restoration program. This is a grant we've also gotten for the other two phases. And we were really excited. We sort of shot the moon with the grant application and are receiving almost 4.4 million to put towards design and construction and mitigation. So we're just thrilled about that. We were still trying to close the full gap for the cost of the project, but that takes us a large percentage of the way there. And it enables us to start, pick back up the design and do some of the things to get us shovel ready. So just wanted to share that good news with you all. A brief update. It's been a really busy month for the team with all of the storms. Oh, did you have a question about that, Vice Chair? Well, on that subject, but I can wait till you're finished. Okay. Just wanted to give you all a storm update. It's been a crazy month for the team. As you can imagine, starting, I took the day after Christmas off and then on the 27th came back and it has been go time just until about a week ago, but thought that you might be interested in just hearing that the creeks in town did by and large really well. We were nervous with the wildfires and the effects that that has on potential for flooding. And we spent just about every day dealing with small debris plugs and working with public works and making sure that things were flowing. But by and large, the creeks did well and we were really excited to see Colgan restoration phases one and two do really well. And I don't know if you recall, but part of those projects was to expand the flood capacity of those creeks from 25 years to 100 years and they did their job. So that was pretty thrilling for us. And then the only other thing I wanted to update you all was that we will be back in March. Excited to hear that that's in person and we'll be doing our annual update on the Creek Stewardship Program. Kyle Spongberg who you've probably seen but haven't met in person will be there for that as well as Steve will give you an update on that. We'll give you an update on Colgan phase two, phase three, all of the restoration work and everything across the board. So real excited about that and also the possibility of maybe a field trip in the future if you all would like to see Colgan, I know I keep talking about Colgan. It's a really interesting time out there right now. Phase one was completed in 2015. It's grown up, the trees are big. You can really see what an established restoration area looks like. Phase two is new, things are coming in but you can see what it looks like when it's just restored and then because we haven't touched phase three yet you can see what it was like before and kind of this unique opportunity to see everything all lined up at different stages. So Amy and I have discussed that and if there's staff interest we'd be happy to delete a tour out there. So with that. That sounds wonderful. Great. Thank you, Claire. Do you have any other items? That is it. I see Art has a question. Go ahead Art. Yeah, so a couple on the Colgan phase three and the DWR grant that was awarded. Is that information public for review and how I'd like to see what the bid packages look like? How do I go about doing that? I can send it to you. I can send you like our actual grant application itself. Okay, that'd be wonderful. Yeah, I will send that to you. And then my daughter sent me an article from KQED and it was about drain inlets in San Francisco. And I wonder if you've heard of this where they have an adopt a drain program. And I'm wondering if it looks like you have and I wonder if this is something you guys are looking at or considering? You know, we saw that as well. I laughed out loud because somebody named their drain Iqabah drain. And you know, it's definitely on our radar. We're, you know, the drain, the state of our storm drain infrastructure in the city is something that we're focused really heavily on. Right now we've been focused more on we're doing a flood study with FEMA on Santa Rosa Creek and its tributaries to update the FEMA maps for a hundred year flood in the city. We'll be talking with you all, you know more about that as well. And then we're also doing a storm drain master plan that contract is going to be P you next when Thursday, I guess that'll do a whole overview and analysis of the state of the storm drain infrastructure and state of the infrastructure looking at prioritization of projects and then how to get funding to pay for it. So that's that's really more where our storm drain energy has been spent but we did see that and it's piqued our curiosity. So it's something that we would definitely look into. Right, great. Thank you. Sure. Thank you, Claire. Very, very interesting. Very exciting about Colgan Creek. Yeah, thank you. Are there any reports from the water, Sonoma Water Department today? Don't believe they're, they've joined the meeting today. Okay. Any members of the public want to ask questions or make any comments at this point? We have no hands raised at this time. Okay. Thank you. Okay. Our first scheduled item is going to be seven and our only scheduled item really is 1760 Piner Road Security Fence. And we have Janden Briscoe here who will give us the staff report. Janden. Good morning. Ali, can you stop my video for me please? Yes, I'll do that right away. Thank you. And welcome, Janden. Appreciate it. Share my screen. Okay. Can everyone see my screen? No. Thank you. This is what I'd go through when I teach my classes at the junior college. Are those going to be in person? I'm zooming again. Oh wow. Yeah. There we go. All right. Y'all can see it now? Yes. Yes. All right, cool. All right. Good morning, Chair Rabinowitz and other communities of the, of the WAC, I mean, other committee members of the WAC committee. I'm Janden Briscoe and I'm here today to present to you the 1760 Piner Road Security Fence and the applicant is proposing to install the 285 feet Lineal Chain Leak Fence along the rear of the shopping center. And here's an example of the proposed fence. The fence will be eight feet high. And like I said, it'll be 280 feet, 285 feet. And this requires a design review and a minor condition and use permit. Here you can see that the location is at the intersection of Coffee Lane and Piner Road. And that the business abuts Piner Creek and Russell Creek. This is the site plan and the applicant delineated where all the trees are. And no trees will be cut down as a result of the building of this fence. And the general plan destination is light industry and a zoning destination is general or commercial. And it is recommended. I mean, the planning and economic development department request that the Waterway Advisory Committee by comments and direction for the security fence located at 1760 Piner Road. And here's my information if you have any other questions. Thank you. Thank you, Janden. I think what we'll do is ask the applicant to give their comments if they are in attendance today. The applicant is not in attendance today. Not in attendance today, thank you. So why don't we ask the committee members here if they have any questions for staff? Art? Yeah, thank you. So I have, so on the staff report which was one of the attachments, it provides the site project history and it states the staff reviewed the original submittal and formed the applicant that chain link fence is not allowed in the general commercial zoning district. And so that's confusing to me. So could you first, can you explain that? Yes, sir. In the staff report, I was in that staff history, I mean, project history, I was taught the first submittal of the project was a barbed wire fence. I was talking about a barbed wire fence is not allowed in our general commercial barbed wire fences are only allowed in industrial districts. Okay, so it's just a typo? Yes, sir. Okay. And then there appears to be two fences and the fence is adjacent to the building is the one we're talking about? No, sir. The fence is closed, is that the rear of the shopping center? Yeah. And it's along the unpaved Sonoma Water Agency path. So it's on the creek side of the path? Correct. So what happens with the inner fence that's right up against the building? I don't know, that's a question for the applicant and I can write that down and get back to you. Okay, so that's all broken down and has barbed wire on it. So it's kind of, so I was kind of confused about what fence we were talking about. That's understandable. Thank you, Art. Carol? Jayden, thank you. Good morning. I walked the property yesterday and did not walk adjacent property. So I don't know what the fencing along the creeks or other commercial properties are. If you could give us some updates on that, I would appreciate it. And is eight foot fence within normal requirements or is it six feet? Is the additional two feet something that is requiring our approval or approval by the city? That's my first question. And in walking it, the property's on a bit of a slope with the creek and the road being at the lowest point. Is it eight feet out of the ground from the lowest elevation? Is it eight feet out of the ground from the slope? If you are within the property, the commercial property itself, you are two feet up from the roadway. Where is that eight foot elevation planned from? I know what they're trying to accomplish. And unfortunately, I understand what they're trying to accomplish. The answer to you, well, let me go back to the first question. So whenever offense, in accordance with our zoning code is above six feet, that triggers the minor condition and use permit. And the reason why this is in front of you and in front of the Water Race Advisory Committee is that this is along a walk path along a creek. And for your second question, in accordance with our zoning code again, the fence has to be measured from the lowest point of the property. Thank you. You all are. All right, Steve, can we show the revised site plan on here? Because I still don't understand where this fence is. I'm sure we can. I've got that up, Jan's any of you'd like? Yes, can you share it for me, Ms. Lowe? Thank you. And then can you zoom in on it? I'm interested in the fence location, which appears to me to be adjacent to the building and not on the creek side of the path. So that's what I'd like to find out about. Yeah, that was my impression as well. My zoom in tool was behind the share tool. So let me. All right, let me share again. All right, is that a little bit better? Yeah. Okay. So, Jaden, can you explain that the fence location with the gravel recreational path is labeled? Yes, I'm sorry, I probably misspoken when I answered your question the first time. So the fence, I wish I could have put the, the site photos that the applicant provided with us because we all can have a better understanding where it is. But the fence is going behind those trees, which and the applicant did that on purpose so we don't have to cut any of those trees. So it's gone along like the 7-Eleven store and then like, yeah, diagonal towards the various retail stores. Well, we do have the pictures as attachment too, if that would help you to explain. Yes. If all. Hold on, let me go back to the agenda. It's going. Okay. There we go. All right. Let me see which ones might be the best to zoom in on here. I think that's center one. Yep, number 10, South wall. Okay. Yeah. This one right here. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So I'm looking at this photo now, I think this fence is going to be replaced with the eight foot fence. Okay. So I didn't see distances from the center line of the creek or for the top of the bank on any of the maps or have those been measured out? No, sir, they haven't been measured out and those fences were already there and I couldn't find any records of a building permit for that fence. And that fence is less than six feet high. So we wouldn't have a conditional use permit for that anyway. Well, isn't that part of the requirements on these setbacks? And that's one of the reasons why it comes to our committee. The setback is 50 feet away from the creek bank. So that's where those existing fences from 50 feet from the set, so on the top of the bank or from where? From the top of the bank, sir. Okay. I think there's some exceptions, aren't there for channelized creeks regarding that setback line? I don't recall it specifically, but. Well, normally we get a staff report that pulls all the things from the creek master plan and talks about setbacks and everything else. This was kind of an abbreviated report. Well, I was curious why it was so abbreviated. Yeah, I can respond to that. So this happened last year when we met, I want to say early last year, we did make a pivot in the way that we bring information forward. And now projects are in memo form instead of staff report form. But we of course are ready to answer questions related to the creek master plan. But I think the Brookwood Medical Project, that one you might remember was more memo form, which is something we do for all our advisory boards and committees. Okay, so I guess given that, I would think the site map would identify the top of the bank and it would identify these setbacks. And I think that would be a requirement of the submittal. Given all that, it's kind of a straightforward project. The only other question I have is that the fence appears to stop short of getting to coffee. Is that correct? So if we look at the site map, we go to the north, northern most corner. Is that the north? That's not the northern most corner. It's not orientated north. So we go to that top heart there where the triangle is, where the fence ends and to the right, yeah, right there. So what's going on right there? It looks like that defense ends right there. Is that correct? Yes. And so is it, oh, because that's a building right there. That's that martial arts facility or whatever it is. So it's just going to go up and stop right at that building. Is that right? Correct. Okay, all right. I don't have any other questions. Thank you, Steve. I just have one. I was looking at the Creek master plan and it appears, and this is something perhaps to look into, that on Piner Creek, and this is map seat, section C of Piner Creek, it does say habitat enhancement involving removal of invasive species and replacement with native vegetation is recommended. And I'm wondering, it talks about aquatic habitat as well. And channel can be enlarged, make room for low flow channel, which I assume it's not going to happen here, in street habitat structures and planting of native vegetation. I'm wondering, and this is kind of a more general question than just this proposal, but what it's something to look into maybe could report back to the committee at some point as to what we should be looking at when we're talking about something like this on creeks that have already been channelized as far as providing native habitat along those creeks. So this is just a general question. I don't know specifically if there is a more specific policy on this. Amy, do you happen to know? I don't, but that might be a great question also for the water agency staff. So I can certainly look into that and get back to the committee. Yeah, it'd be helpful to have kind of the an understanding of what should occur in these kinds of situations. Just so we have it, you know, rather than case by case, it would just be helpful, I think to the committee. Carol, do you have a question or comment? Yeah, could we go back to the photos, please? So again, we'll go to number 10 where we have the south wall, which has the oak trees, the current fence, and the building. My concern and hope is that those oak trees are gonna be given space to grow without having their trunks be embedded in the replacement fence. I don't know if that has been talked about at all, but there's a lot going in that section. Is there wiggle room for where the fence can be to protect the future growth of the trees? Has there been consideration of the fence possibly budding the back of the buildings and the back of the buildings acting as the fence since it is so close? Have the trees and their future health been considered in this planning project? Thank you. I don't think there would be any, I think there's not that much wiggle room for the fence to be moved back closer to the building. And I think that has been consideration of long-term health of the trees. That's why the applicant went out of his way to delineate on a site plan what the trees are. Thank you, Janet. Just as a follow-up on that, how much room is there between the current young trees and the proposed fence line? I will have to get back to you on that, I'm not sure. Charles, did you have a question or comment? Yeah, as soon as I can get myself unmuted. Thank you. And sort of in response to one of the issues Carol raised earlier, I did ride the trail on Russell Creek coming down to the confluence with Pioneer Creek there to the subject site. And there are numerous six-foot-plus chain link fences with barbed wire and even concertina wire along other properties abutting Russell Creek here. I'm not sure if we're getting ourselves into a code enforcement situation here, but there certainly are other properties that have bigger and more, should we say, more repellent fences than what the current applicant is proposing on other parts of the creek very nearby here. And I believe the zoning is the same. So I, for one, have no objection to the eight-foot fences. It's clear that there's been a lot of trespass and destruction of the smaller fence. But a couple of the ideas that I would put out to the committee is that we would endorse the fence as there's clearly a trespass and problem. But where the walkway goes between the retail stores and the 7-Eleven store, it might, I don't know if the applicant would be receptive to the idea, but maybe that's a location where a gate could be added. So there's access from the pathway up to the retail services that I assume some path users must be using if they're crawling over the fence there. But that's just an idea I would like the committee to consider. And I think the intent here is to locate the fence as to avoid the trees. And I think it's not clear on the plan submitted, but I think if you are able to study the plans closely that the location does avoid the trees to the greatest extent possible, given the site constraints of the site. So my general view is we're asking this applicant to do something that other property owners in the area haven't done. And I'm not sure what their permit status is on those other fences, but if there's an opportunity here to create access between this retail cluster and the creek in a way that doesn't promote destruction of the fence or improper use of the property, that might be a recommendation we would consider as this goes forward for a design review. And it's user-friendly. Thank you. Thank you, Charles. Any question? You have another question, Art? Yeah, just one real quick one. How does the lake correspondence pertain to this project? I guess this is more for you, Amy. It was put in inside this agenda item. Yes, are you talking about the disclosure form or the comment letter? A comment letter. Okay, let me go back to that. Because when I looked at it, it didn't seem like it was germane. I think it's another project. Yeah, that was my recollection, but I don't see it in the, let's see, I don't see it on the agenda. Let me go back to my email. I think it's in the attachments there. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, I'm not seeing it right there. So in the revised agenda, under 5.1, under the attachments, it's the very last link. I'm getting in there from our legislature site and I'm not seeing it, but let me have it in my email, but Janet, feel free to jump in if you have it handy. So I just found it, it looks like it's something on the old Prickett's nursery site, out on Snowmah Highway. I am not seeing it. It was in the agenda that was sent out. I can share my screen, Amy, if you want me to show it. Actually, pardon, Amy, I just forwarded the email to you, should be at the top of your email. Oh, I see it now. All right, let me share. This one is about the Mahoyak Pahona Glen project. So we can get back to them specifically about this. Yeah, I think that's something for the staff to look into. Yes. Can't really comment on that as a committee. Yes. Unless I'm misinterpreting that, you remind me committee members, if you feel differently. Are there any more questions of the staff regarding the project? If not, I'm gonna ask if there are any members of the public who would like to make a comment. And I don't know that we have any, do we still not have any members of the public? We do not. Okay. Why don't we go around and give our viewpoints? Charles, you've made your comments to, I don't know if you wanted to add to your comments. We really appreciate what you're saying, but did you have anything else to add? Just to clarify, I'm in support of what the proposal is and I think we should, if we need to add some statements saying that there should be some assurances that the proper setbacks are met and that the fence is placed, so as not to endanger the trees. But in general, I'm in support of the project, but I do still have the question about what do we do about other properties that have fences that appear to not be consistent with the zoning? Kevin, do you have any comments on this? Nothing further. I think Charles put it really, I would echo Charles comments in support of the fence interested in the, and always interested in the setbacks. That's very helpful to see that in the background materials and otherwise, I think it looks reasonable. Mark? Yeah, I really have nothing to add. I think the questions and the discussion we've had so far pretty much answers any questions I may have. So I too, I'm in support of the proposal to put in the eight foot fence. Thank you, Carol. I agree with everything Charles put forward. I would like to eventually use this as an opportunity for staff to walk all of our creeks to look for non-compliant fences. I think it is detrimental to applicants who do play by the rules. And this goes back to the canine companion project where they bought the fence lines and they were compliant where so many other landowners. And I, again, I appreciate the situation that all these property owners are going through. I do not envy them their desire to protect their properties, but at the same time, it would be nice to bring everyone into compliance and address ongoing issues that seem to be spreading further from the city core rather than being isolated to the city core and the trees. If we can keep those trees healthy and people walking that path, then everybody benefits, that should be the goal. Thank you. Thank you, Carol. Art, any further comments you'd like to make? Yeah, it seems logical to plant the new poles into the existing potholes for this fence, but then when you add the height onto it, how that's gonna interact with the trees, I think that's a concern. So hopefully care is taken for those trees, very tight space, fences definitely needed. Interesting idea about that opening between the 7-11 and the main area. Maybe there is an opportunity for access there. So other than that, as far as the projects concern, I think it's needed and should go forward. I do have some concerns about the way this project was presented. We can probably take that offline or something later. Okay, I concur with the comments made. Generally, I have no opposition to the fence. Makes sense to me. Of course, it's important to make sure it doesn't adversely impact existing vegetation trees, but it looks well thought out to me in general. I really appreciate Charles' comment about access and I'm thinking that it would be something again that would be perhaps something to look at and whenever there is a project that is of this sort, I mean that would provide public access potentially. We wanna get people on the trails. We want them to walk, be able to have open space that they can access. We wanna have a continuous bike path system to the degree we can. So I really appreciate that comment. So with that, unless there are any further comments or anything else anybody would like to say because I think this is the last item on the agenda. Anything else Amy that we should know about? Carol has a hand up. Oh, I'm sorry, didn't see it. Carol. Yeah, I am seeing in my mind's eye small signs. They're kind of like no parking signs that say Poppy Creek or Santa Rosa Creek, like it's a trailhead of sorts to highlight and encourage people to walk. Do we have those out in that neighborhood? Is that something reasonable to look into or because this is a channelized creek, is it not something that we feature to that extent? I think there's a lot of sections that don't have that and that would be considered wayfinding and a work plan item that would have to be added to our, probably our Claire's team or Creek's team. So that's something I can note to them but that's usually a council driven work item unless there's some available grant funding to be able to accomplish that. Well, we also have to get approval by the water agency, don't wait for individual access points to channelize creeks if I'm not mistaken. I think that's true. For access, yes, but if it's a signage piece that could be done in coordination as well. And then also, since I'm talking, I just also wanted to respond to the non-legal fences that are out there. Our code enforcement team can respond and enforce but they're complaint-based. So it would be up to someone to file those complaints in order for that to happen. Okay. Well, with that, thank you all for participating on the side and thank you, Jan. I'm looking forward to working with you in the future. You have one more hand. I do, Kevin. Thanks, Steve, just briefly, Amy, I think you mentioned the possibility of a field trip to Colgren Creek. And I love the idea of seeing those, the three stages side by side. If we could do something like that, like we did at Roseland Creek, I would really welcome that. That sounds great, thank you. Yeah, we'll definitely work on what month to do that. Amy, we can talk or you can think about what month that might make sense weather-wise. But that would be really an interesting one, I think for us and very timely. And a very positive project, which is always nice to see firsthand. Okay, with that, I'm going to adjourn the meeting and I assume we're still possibly going to meet in February, depending on things or are we looking at March, Amy? So far, we don't have any projects meeting review for February, that could change, but I would definitely plan on a March meeting. So we'll work on that potential field trip and you'll be getting some emails about moving back in person as well. Perfect. Okay, all meetings adjourned. We'll see you next time, thank you.