 Welcome to Crossroads in Learning. I am your host, Keisha King. It is always a pleasure to join you on this platform. However, we are still in the midst of the COVID-19 pandemic 2020. In fact, we are nearing the middle of April and we are facing numbers of over 20,000 lives lost due to this pandemic. Our hope is that we can flatten that line and that we will see a decrease in the numbers of those affected by this disease. But we haven't so far and in fact the numbers that we are continuing to receive are shocking and most alarming. We are faced with realizing now that over 60 percent of the deaths that have happened during this pandemic are of people of color. African-Americans and Latinos and others are dying at alarming numbers and it is not a genetic problem. It is not an alcohol or drug problem or it's not induced because of anything other than the fact that healthcare in America is not what it should be and that is due to policies, that is these prices on your basic needs and perhaps in some ways due to challenges in the education and the systems that pertain to healthcare. Mentioning education we also want to state that we have plenty of people who are on the front lines. I'm so proud to say that we have doctors and nurses who are on the front lines caring for those who have COVID-19 and have been affected in some way because of it but they are not the only people who are on the front lines. In fact today on our show we have people who are the literal boots on the ground. We have educators and an activist working daily to make a difference in the lives of ordinary folks just like you and I. So please welcome with me my three guests for today. We have Pastor Michael McBride, the pastor of the Way Church and Live Free Faith and Action Campaign. We have Derek Govan who is an educator right here in Honolulu, Hawaii for the Department of Education and we have wonderful Ms. Lindsay Robertson also an educator and special ed right here in Honolulu, Hawaii. All three of my guests it's an honor to have you welcome to the crossroads. Great to be here, great to be here. Thank you Kisha. So indeed indeed so I'm just going to jump right in and say I was thoroughly surprised and saddened that the death rate has been what it has been for all people all across the country and all throughout the world but being of African-American descent I am also alarmed by the number of African-Americans and people of color in general who have been diagnosed and have passed away. Initially when we were going to go on the air it was 50%. As of today I've gotten statistics that say it's 60% of the 26,000 people are of people of color. So Pastor Mike I'm going to turn right into you and say what in the world do you think of that? Well I think I'm grateful to be here with you and be able to talk about this with all your listeners and comrades and loved ones in Hawaii. I've not been to Hawaii yet so I guess I got to make a trip once we can get back flying but no the impact of COVID-19 coronavirus has been devastating. It is indeed an expression of the already underlying inequities the underlying vestiges of human hierarchy racism discrimination exclusion that Black communities, Brown communities, Indigenous communities have felt for quite some time. This crisis is sitting down heavily in our communities for I would say several reasons. The first reason I mentioned already is racism and it is an expression of racism around the way that race plus power has coalesced to decide how resources are needed out to people over the last couple of decades. We know that in states with Republican governors they have intentionally withheld Obamacare dollars and opting into Obamacare so the cause then has been hospitals shutting down. People do not have access to health care access to preventive care so the underlying conditions that are result of lack of access to health care food deserts the daily stress of just being in an anti-Black anti-Brown society has really allowed this virus which was already lethal and deadly to become a pandemic of epic proportions disproportionately borne out in Black communities and so it is indeed a great great tragedy. Many of our communities were already dealing with a catastrophe now we have a literal tragedy on our hands and it is going to be up to people of good will to do all we can to reverse through targeted interventions the kinds of impacts that we're seeing all across the country. I couldn't agree with you more and I want to bring Lindsay and Derek into this conversation but before I do I want to say that you know I was watching I believe it was Roland Martin and a guest of his who said this is an epidemic within the pandemic that has been going on forever so the ideas behind systemic racism as it pertains to health care is not new that was an epidemic that was going on and being overshadowed and overlooked and undercared for and now it's just being magnetized by the pandemic that we know of as COVID-19 on another note however I'll say Derek Lindsay you are on the front lines on the education front we are now faced with children having been out of school here in the state for a few weeks now going into a month and it's happening all across the country teachers are now feeling from what I've heard there's a sense of adventure because they have a new challenge but Lindsay some teachers are feeling overwhelmed can you tell us what tactics regarding self-care have you implemented yourself and shared with others to help them so that they can make it through yes absolutely thank you Kisha for having me of course so I'm a huge advocate for self-care and mental health especially for teachers especially during this time it's a difficult time for you know all of us as educators to kind of flip the whole script of how we traditionally teach in the classroom and navigating that has been very difficult I will say one thing that is important I think is following a routine and a structure obviously when we are in the traditional classroom we thrive off of routine and structure and when we work from home we can also create that routine and structure and I think within that routine and structure it's also important to make sure that you're taking care of yourself and your body making sure that you're eating right you're drinking enough water I'm also a huge advocate for exercise and getting outdoors obviously with taking the proper safety precautions such as wearing a mask and maintaining that social distancing I think that those are important things some resources that I've actually used since this whole pandemic has begun and since we've been out of school there have been several live workout classes that actually have been taking place virtually so it's nice to tune in there and get your home workout or go into your backyard and get some fresh air of course go out and take a quick walk around the neighborhood is always good and then also I think it's important that you're also centered within yourself through meditation things like that I think are important to keep yourself grounded during this very difficult time thank you so much so we have various tactics that we can use that do not require a doctor do not require prescriptions your gym doesn't have to be open and it isn't anyway so you have to do things on your own and in fact we are all forced with doing things alone and on our own and in our houses I had a meeting this week where I said man I hardly ever see you guys outside of my office and now here you are in my living room you know it's like you're up close and personal in my space you know um Eric I'm going to talk to you because you found a way to help help your colleague collaborate in the midst of this what some consider isolation and I want to talk because uh using that word kind of makes me cringe because this is not isolation this is not lockdown we're going to talk about prisons and in fact I'm going to talk more to uh pastor Mike as he is called affectionately pastor Mike but we're going to talk to him about what is really lockdown and and solitary confinement this is not it but we want to address that and what you're doing to help that but well then we want to touch with you I call you affectionately by the way but we want to talk with you about how have you been able to collaborate in the midst of what we are doing this social distancing sure thank you kitchen again thank you this is nice um so there's two parts so it's about collaborating how we're collaborating with our parents and how we're collaborating as teachers and professionals how are we um empowering each other and supporting each other during this time to support us during this time because it is challenging um and what we found most often was our parents needed a sense uh in support to get a sense of normalcy and get a sense of routine so same like lindsay was saying for us as well um our kids need that and we are serving students with special needs some of severe special needs and they need that normalcy and they need that routine and so when we think about being told to stay in our homes and being told to do virtual sessions with our kids and support them from home we start to think gosh this is really hard how can i do this but i found that when we put our teachers together and give and be solutions oriented uh teachers have it in them to to be the change agents to really um come up with outside of the ideas come up with the ideas outside of the box and to come up with these beautiful things and share resources amongst each other where they can support each other and they can support their teachers um in their schools and support the students at home as much as they possibly can good deal now you know when i talk about education i did my master's uh dissertation on the um school to prison pipeline and i talked about how a disproportionate number of african-american boys were diagnosed with special needs and if you were in third grade and you couldn't read very well and pastor michael how many of you with this because it says if you couldn't read very well and you got into a fight and were suspended from school in third grade essentially they built a prison cell with your name or number on it and so that was when i found out that i was devastated i have a young boy who at the time i was writing this dissertation and he was young enough to have been in third grade now my son was actually graduated high school with 4.6 GPA so he could read very well this is not him but not everybody fits that bill and it was devastating to find out that that was actually how they did it okay how they determined how many jails to be built and what it seems like to me and i could be wrong was that they put our young men in jail and forgot about them case in point here we are in 2020 with a pandemic that says stay away from each other and order not to get it and you cannot do that in any jail that i've ever seen on tv or in person okay you can't stay away from someone six feet apart and in most jails there's no pump for okay no one's coming to visit but should they come i have sanitizer they don't have that in jail and they hardly have enough soap how can they keep away from each other okay and not get this and does our government even care so pastor mike i want to address that to you what are your thoughts on that how should they or is it even possible they protect themselves and what are you doing about it yeah well it it is a great question and it it displays the kind of moral drift that our country dare i say you know the society has the scriptures that i follow talk about that we will be judged by the way we treat our widows and orphans and those who are in jail will we visit them will we care for them in a pandemic no one should be deemed disposable we should not be picking and choosing whose lives are valuable to save and so mass for the people which is initiative of the live free campaign is so so blessed we were just awarded a one million dollar gift from jack dorsi the ceo of twitter to help yes but i wanted to get to that i i have to cut you off because i wanted to kind of give a lead into that but i'll just say it now that you did have a very special announcement today you had a very special guest that was on uh my facebook live is where i saw it with you today and that announcement was something that ten days ago was a dream a thought an idea in your mind and now here we are ten days later with one million dollars so please tell us the idea yes yes one million dollars and the connections are out of this world go ahead i'm sorry well i i'll just say you know that we had a vision that i think was like a bolt of lightning just just just just zinged us because we were hearing these stories about people in jails and prisons prisons and and uh soap was being rationed to them if not withheld certainly a medical care was being withheld people were dying in the prison cells next to their their cellmates and being left in the bed unattended to already expired they would take the bodies and dump them outside in in the courtyard in a tent this is the way our loved ones were incarcerated were being treated we had loved ones other frontline workers who did not work in hospitals but maybe drove buses maybe were outreach workers in urban neighborhoods interrupting violence where they were serving food to kids all being sick because they didn't have masks now we recently just saw some loved ones in philadelphia being pulled off the bus physically by a police officer because they don't have masks so we're seeing that there are certain parts of our country in our community who are not over who are not only over diagnosed and dying from this illness but they are also being rationed and and if not eliminated from the equation of care so this one million dollars will help us be able to buy hundreds of thousands of masks that we can give away free to folks in urban communities rural communities that have experienced a dearth of resources we're going to be in Detroit, Milwaukee, Chicago, New Orleans, Columbus, Newark, Orlando, Tampa, Los Angeles, Oakland, Dallas, Birmingham just to name a few and this million dollars is going to go a long way in being able to help us get this stuff out mask and sanitizer so our folks can have some preventive care and slow down the virus the spread of this virus and hopefully give the country and the medical doctors and others a chance to catch up to the care needed to hopefully save as many lives as we can that's awesome to hear yeah thank you thank you so much and and i'm hoping that we we can keep raising more if you want to donate you can go to livefreeusa.org livefreeusa.org and just donate $5 $10 $25 $100 whatever you can give a little bit adds up to a lot and prayerfully you know the gift that jack has given come out bill said he's now going to launch a billionaire challenge he's going to he's going to call on all the billionaires that are out there that want to help respond in a humanitarian effort to this crisis to donate to mass for the people or other organizations like this to help us be able to address these issues but i lost you guys for a minute i had to reboot you are amazing 10 days ago this didn't exist this this wasn't going on and now here we are jack dorsi CEO of twitter and what's the other he's CEO of where where we all use both and so he has donated very generously one million dollars and i must say that i found this out through kamal bell who i follow on twitter and uh well i didn't find it out before it happened i just followed you both and you both posted that you had a special announcement to make today so i was thrilled when i found out that this was happening and this is what we're talking about people boots on the ground now today during your live announcement you had a guest and you just called her i think it was miss queen which i have to tell you that's what they call me okay they call me queen and um he said that she almost she heard that i think it was detroit was one in five right uh talking about the death and then she said one in ten and or ten of every one in seven it was one in seven in the warlands yeah right yeah and i just thought my goodness that's horrible and so you know you cannot you cannot underestimate how tragic this is um you know i read a story today of a woman who lost her entire family in one week due to this virus so what you're doing pester mike is so necessary you know when i know these communities okay i know that it's extremely hard for them to for your average families who live in an average community and they are getting they have stories like family dollar dollar general they have to drive a ways before they get to a major store like walmart and a specialty store that has these items are even further away but dollar general uh family dollar they ran out of masks and gloves and hand sanitizer a long time ago and they just don't have it and so for someone to be dragged off the bus because they didn't have it because they didn't have access to it it's more than just a little bit unfair it's almost inhumane and yet it's so what you're doing needs to be applauded needs to be recognized and after you made your announcement this is the first place you came i know this is you got my immediate reaction i'm on cloud nine be like jesus tonight and walk on some water somewhere you know this is a good time to compare yourself to jesus but what i've heard is a lot of people compare you to uh a young martin lucid king and i heard this well and indeed that is a compliment but i've heard this because not just this this is not your first walk in the park so to speak uh you've also done a lot with gun violence in your state and you've worked with gangs can you talk to us a little bit about that work because that's been going on for years yeah yeah yeah so the live free campaign um was launched in 1999 um as a response to urban gun violence and mass incarceration um when i was actually a youth pastor back in 1999 um you know i was physically and sexually assaulted by some cops and i had a lot of young people in my congregation who were saying this happened to them all of the time and uh the young people said you know we just didn't think pastor mike we could bring this part of our life to the church and it would be addressed and and i heard god just kind of challenged me what is it about my ministry that i can uh be trusted with the saving of their souls but not the protection of their bodies um from that point on we began to really build out a series of interventions around gun violence less than half of one percent of your city's population will drive almost 60 percent of the gun related shootings and homicides so what we started to do we built off of some models that came out of boston and chicago and we just do everything we can to engage the less than half of one percent of the gun offenders and victims and perpetrators because we often find that there is a false line of distinction between a victim and a perpetrator depending on when you come into the life of a young person they may be a victim or a perpetrator of gun violence but they always need healing and they always need some love and some and some support and so thankfully we've been able to scale this up in oakland and richmond california stock in california detroit michigan newark new jersey um uh chicago illinois detroit a number of different cities birmingham and baton rouge and we have seen in at least half of those cities a 30 drop on the low end a 70 drop on the high end within 18 months which just means that some of our cities had 100 gun related shootings one year and after our work that dropped to as low as 50 shootings and homicides in one year it's a public health approach we believe that you get out into the neighborhoods you love on folks you help folks you give them some some strong uh you know sometimes you got to get folks to time out you got to give them you know that that that strong push to to change to get off that trajectory but i love our people i love those who find themselves caught in these cycles if you love them oftentimes they'll get right off that ramp it takes me to god for the last 10 years we've been able to cut gun violence in a lot of cities across the country without sending people to jail and for us right um you know being able to do both at the same time is a great great a testament to the work of both those who are caught in violence and those who are doing the peacemaker work on the ground that's right it's about relationships and when you have a relationship with someone if they like you enough they'll listen and they are willing to change their behaviors but if you don't build those relationships there won't be changed they're not willing to change their behavior simply because you baston or you say the statement for them regarding that you all know that as educators on the front line if you build relationships with children your students and with colleagues then you start to have the ability to affect change why don't you address that a little bit as you see it in your line of work either lindsay or derrick derrick you have a little bit yeah i'll let lindsay go on that part i just wanted to give you a shout out and just really it's an awesome testament to the work you're doing pastor i i find it very inspirational and being from southwest virginia hence the southern accent that comes up when i get nervous so um but from southwest virginia being a white man and learning more as i age and learning more of my privilege and not understanding even the half of my privilege now i have to tell you i'm very inspired by the work you're doing and i can call to action for not only the african-american population to support the people of color but us as as white individuals especially the white men how do we make change and how do we how are we to become change agents for for our people of color and supporting our inequities and or our changing inequities doing what we need to do for society i just hats off to you this is amazing work thank you thank you dear brother and and yeah we need everybody getting this this fight for liberation of freedom as dr kane says what affects one directly affects all of us indirectly and uh we are all caught in an inescapable mutual network and uh you know quite as it's kept many many more of our white brothers and sisters um are incarcerated and caught up in um addiction and drugs that lead to death and um and suicides and so we got a lot of mutual work to do um but i certainly appreciate the opportunity to partner with people of good will from all across the lines of difference um this is one creation one world we have been gifted and may we steward it all together in love and solidarity right just great yes i agree yeah no thank you too uh pastor mic i appreciate it and it's actually very like Derek said very inspiring to listen um to you know these statistics and how you're addressing um you know this pandemic and other things that are going on within the world um but kisha in terms of your question regarding relationships i would agree i think that building relationships and rapport is the number one thing in order to get um anything out of you know anyone um so like for example within the education world um i've been i've only been a teacher for about three years i've been at my school that i'm currently at for two um but last year it was my first year at the high school level teaching students with disabilities and i knew the minute i walked in the classroom door that i was going to have to build rapport with my students in order to get them to be able to learn you need to love on students and love on all individuals like pastor mic said i agree until you can get them to listen and to comply with what you're asking and i think that those relationships are what are going to keep us strong especially during this time as well thank you so much it is about relationships and you know i have to thank you i thank you for the work that you've been doing you know you said since 1999 and you know i have um reflected in a previous show about what was going on in 1995 back in 1999 uh you two were babies but the rest of us were so scared about y2k you remember that's the mic we saw it absolutely right the clock was going to wind down and what was going to happen the banks the money was going to be gone and you know we were petrified and we thought what is the world going to be like we had no idea and yet when it happened you know because most people i won't say maybe pastor mic wasn't and i'm an angel so i wasn't partying but most people were out partying and nothing happened nothing happened it was it just rolled right into the next year and it was pretty flawless and here we are 20 years later at the turn of a new decade a hundred and some years after a different type of pandemic happened spanish and you know that goes to tell you that if you don't know your history you're likely to repeat it so we faced that pandemic nearly a hundred years ago the racism that we were talking about that systemic was put in place over a hundred years ago and it's still going on so you know pastor mic we're about to close but i wonder if you have any words of encouragement so that people can know that i know scripture i want to seminary as well the scripture says you know we talk about lack of knowledge and without knowledge people will perish can you give us some tidbits of information or encouragement that would enlighten the hearts and minds of people so that we don't repeat this again we don't want to go through this again all of it can you help us out with that yeah yeah i'll just be glad to just say you know we are for all of us who are christians we are just coming out of easter if you're jewish you're in a Passover season if you are Muslim you are you know heading into Ramadan real soon and if you're just a humanist or agnostic you you appreciate that there's a through line around just moral uh compassionate but also faithful stewardship or care of the earth of everything that is created so i just want us to always remember that it is our responsibility to care for one another it's our responsibility to not be a historical about the struggles that have come before us it's also our responsibility to remember uh as jesus said that he has overcome the world and so since god has overcome the world so then can we overcome the world that we are a people um on this kind of uh day after resurrection we can live as resurrected people people with new eyes new imagination a new politic a new economy a new set of relationships we don't have to go back to a normal that was literally abnormal we can actually craft and forge a world uh the the prophet said i see a new heaven and a new earth um then we don't have to wait until we die to see a new heaven and a new earth you can create heaven right here on this earth and that looks like uh a guaranteed basic income that looks like our ability to make sure everyone has food and shelter and clothing that this world created with abundance and enough can be shared equally among all who inhabit it so i just compel all of us love justice do mercy walk humbly with god and all creation let's keep doing what we know needs to be done to eliminate all of these uh systemic and structural evils that afflict the soul the mind and the body stay strong be encouraged uh love yourself love your neighbor love all that has been created and know that it is through our love uh that we can cover a multitude of mistakes challenges and problems will end will always win you hit on many key points the number one being love love i love what you're doing pastor mike please keep it up the world needs you i love what you're doing lindsay love what you're doing Derek our students need you in the classroom as i said earlier on these are boots on the ground you're doing the work so thank you so much for what you're doing congratulations pastor mike one million dollars one million dollars god bless can't wait to come to Honolulu or Hawaii wherever we are currently in Honolulu where all of these are beautiful but we just can't go to them right now yeah hang in there we will come back we'll bounce back and and get it be able to enjoy all of the creation so hang in there shelter in place stay home so we can get get get out sooner that's right all right you've been watching crossroads and learning i have been your host kisha king and we will see you next time at the crossroads love