 Hello, everyone, and welcome to the, ooh, wrong show. This is Spotlight Live, everyone. This is a show that we're doing on a biweekly perspective that we're talking about the topics and trends of the CNCF. Before we get started, I wanna tell you a disclaimer. This is the official live stream of the CNCF and is such as subject to the Code of Contact. Please do not add anything to the chat or questions that'll be in violation of that Code of Contact. Basically, as we all know, please be respectful of all. So I kinda wanna tell you about what this show is about. Again, it's basically, again, the topics that are happening from a CNCF perspective and the groups, the things that are going on until I couldn't have asked for a better start for the show for episode one, and that's in talking about CubeCon, past, present, and future. Now this week for CloudNative TV, when we were putting together a group, we wanted to do things that are technical, but also entertaining. And I'm so proud of this week. We've done so many great things. It's been awesome from the support perspective and all that. But you have to walk in the shadow of amazing giants, like the folks that are working on CubeCon and Coaches. They do such amazing stuff. So I'm so excited for this week. Without further ado, I want to kinda introduce one by one and have everybody talk it, but I wanna make this interactive you all. So please, go ahead and follow CloudNative.tv. So first up, I'm gonna introduce our new person who's awesome. This is Jasmine James. How are you, Jasmine? Doing well. Thanks so much for having me. So excited. Can you tell the audience a little bit about yourself? Yeah, absolutely. Definitely excited to be a part of the show today, Jasmine James. I am an engineering manager that works at Twitter. I lead the developer experience organization there, which is essentially responsible for making sure our developers have an amazing experience with the tooling in just their day-to-day jobs. So my experience with CloudNative spans from my time at Delta implementing Kubernetes and re-architecting model with the applications to leverage that. So I'm really excited to be a part of KubeCon and as a co-chair working with such great people. Awesome. How many Delta miles do you have? That was the first question I have. Wait, let me kinda hold on. Let me hold that thought. We're gonna talk about that. Okay. All right. So I'm gonna bring in, this is Constance Caramonolis. How are you doing, Constance? Yeah, I am good. I got my tinfoil and I had been ready for everyone. So yeah, hi everyone. I'm Constance. I've been a co-chair since KubeCon EU 2020, which feels like four years ago. I'm a principal software engineer at Splunk and I am involved in quite a few things. I work on a product called Realtime User Monitoring on the backend, but I'm also on the open telemetry governance committee and I've been involved in open source, I guess for several years now, previously to open telemetry, I was an envoy. And yeah, it's been fun and co-chair. Fantastic, so good to have you. And again, I'm dressed today. The part I'm playing this week is I'm Constance's Greek uncle, so that's who I am today. So that's the part I'll be playing. Alrighty, next up we have, I don't know if you all, I don't know this person. Like I'm so excited to actually meet this person for the first time. So this is Steve Augustus. Hello, hello, how's it going? Nice to meet you all for the first time. My name is Steven Augustus. I am an engineering director and head of open source at Cisco. I've been a KubeCon chair for, again, time is so many time right now. I've been doing it for a little bit, but alongside Constance and really excited to have Jasmine join the crew now. My day job is, well, my day job is a lot of cloud native technology. So I'm one of the release managers and one of the co-chairs for SIG Release in Kubernetes as well as a DEX maintainer and one of the co-founders for the Inclusive Naming Initiative. Fantastic, so now we have you all. And again, what I wanted this show to be for the past, present and future, let's talk about the history of KubeCon, like as you, like the first time you all went through KubeCon and like, you know, and just kind of have that chat about it. Cause I think KubeCon is a special place. We all know we like, you all are co-chairs because you feel so strongly about cloud native and all of that. So I kind of want to talk a little bit about that. So we can go around the horn, but I don't know who wants to volunteer first. I'll go, I guess, cause I have an interesting story to tell about my first KubeCon. But yeah, I was recruited by Priyanka who works for Linux Foundation now to talk on a panel just about tooling selection when embarking upon a huge migration journey. So I talked on that panel. It was awesome. It was in Seattle. So it was really, really great to like meet the community like for the first time. And that was my first sort of exposure to like all of the great people. And I learned so much. And like after that panel, it's crazy that I met Constance, like right after I went off stage and she handed me a card and I was like, Hey, if you ever want to come work out lift, here you go, hit me up. And like, so I joined the coach here like a few months ago and I was like, Oh my gosh, Constance, do you remember me? And she was like, Oh yeah. So that was just a great connection into making this. The community is like just so small. It's such a small world, but it's large at the same time. So it's just really great to kind of connect and like spend the block and meet people again, great people again. So yeah. So Constance, like, so you're giving out cards that I want to know more about this. Like, so do your side of the story on that one. Like, you were like, wow, this is an awesome person. I really want to like work with this person. Yeah. Okay. So it's gonna be, cause this was coupon 2018. So it's gonna be fuzzy on the details. But it was, yeah, I had all about like being cognitive and Kubernetes and I just like Jasmine and Jasmine's answers were really, really balanced between it was like adopting the infrared but also being really human related. And that's usually my like big issue is that when we're trying to adopt technologies or forget about like the human adoption, it's like, you know, now I'm a vendor and this is kind of funny, but it's like we're trying to sell things. It's like, we forget that there's such a human cost to it and Jasmine was taking that into account in her responses. And so I was actually with my friend, Jose, and we're just like, oh my goodness, she's amazing. We're like, we want her to come work with us. And so that's why I'm saying, and also there's another woman in fact, I was like, I was really excited about that. Yeah. And that's the one thing I love is the diversity aspect of the community as well. It's just fantastic. Again, it's just we're inclusive and we're just, we're doing the right things that we need to do to just uplift people. And I just love it in general. So it's fantastic. Yeah. So Constance, I mean, it's kind of the same question, right? It's like, tell us about like, you know, your kind of first KubeCon and that kind of thing. So the first KubeCon I went to with the year before was Austin 2017, the year it snowed. I definitely just remember looking around like going, that was much smaller than what it is now. And just being in a room to see like, there's so many women around and people of color and just like, there's actual diversity and attacking a little, like, joking around with that. Especially because a lot of my teams that have been on the past were like, I was once on a team of one, one of two women on the team of 60. So at least to see more of that representation was really great. It was overwhelming and just really fun. And I just ended up having, it was also the first KubeCon at Envoy was that and like with really big presence. And so it was just really fun to like talk to people about Envoy and like we debug in the hallway, like pulling up code. And after like doing many white board sessions and I've actually made some friends from that KubeCon that I still talk to whenever we're in the same city and it's really fun. I want to ask this question though. The snow was probably the worst one, but I'm going to ask this question Constance in terms of like, for folks who aren't privy to our world, right? What is Envoy in general? What is Envoy? Envoy. Oh my God. I haven't described it in a long time. The TLDR. Yeah, the TLDR. It's a networking proxy, but it's all focused on making network transparent to the end users and users being like application developers, infrastructure. Why this was so critical at the time is that like microservice is coming a hype word, but there's a lot of limitations around say if you're using a load balancer that's provided by a cloud provider, there's really poor visibility into it. You wouldn't like, it wouldn't be able to break it down by like, hey, how many HP errors you're getting by 500, by the ones you just say, sometimes there's an error and it wouldn't always catch that. And Envoy, there are other proxies around that are really good too, but Envoy was so focused on observability in terms of like, we would joke that there's a metric for that. So like, if there was a weird edge case you would have a metric for that, you can see it later on. And like really clear logging and that helped accelerate its adoption. And you can also say like, accelerate the like microservice service mesh terminology being thrown around. And again, for folks who aren't like privy to the, you know, there's 600 projects in the CNCF. Again, it's a wonderful project. Envoy, if you all want to check it out, obviously go to, you know, there's the CNCF landscape. If you Google it, you can see, you can see little service meshes and those type of things. All right, I'm going to ask the next question, or ask the same question to you, Stephen, right? Like, let's tell me about like, you know, your first KubeCon. No. No. Okay. Tough crowd. My first KubeCon was actually same as Jasmine's. So Seattle 2018, I believe 2018, right? And that was an interesting one. So first KubeCon, I had, at this point I had met a bunch of folks in the community. I'd been doing it for a little bit. And I walked in kind of the way that we do the maintainer track sessions. We have, you know, but prior we have like intros and deep dives. So at that point I was co-chair for SIG Release and Kubernetes as well as SIG PM and SIG Azure. And I was doing all of the intros and I was co-presenting on the intros and deep dives as well as presenting in like one of the tracks itself. So my first KubeCon, I was doing like seven or eight talks. And yeah, so it was pretty exciting. So I was meeting people that were previously like only squares or like circles that I knew from like GitHub or Slack. And wanting to have these like really deep connections. So like we had, this was the KubeCon where like KubeCon came out. And so we had like the, we had the mailing list that we created. We created like a KubeCon mailing list and all the folks that were like in on the joke at the time, we were like sending like, hey, we're going to go get lunch over here. We're going to go do this. So it was like lots of action, lots of moving around, lots of definitely excited about it, but it was definitely like stressful because the like the amount of time that you had to spend in certain places. I was like, I got to go run to the talk. I want to continue this conversation, but like, so I do less of that now, thankfully. So, you know, the one thing I'm going to say, and by the way, I turned off this distracting background. So you all, everybody complaining at home, it's done. Okay. Just keep, put a look in my put them. All right. So anyway, so let me, I'm going to tell you all about this. So let's talk about this in general. Like what is in it for somebody coming to a KubeCon for the first time? Let's, I'm going to go off script. I gave you all some questions, but you know what? I'm a provocateur. That's what I do. I want to get some questions. Get the crowd going. Get the crowd going, right? Yeah. Mix in the pot. Yeah. Stir it up. All right. So this guy, this, I just want you all to know, this guy, we do the pre, we do the pre round and everything. He's like, Hey, are you, are you good with the agenda? Or is everybody locked in? You're really, really excited. We're like, Oh, we got this. And he's thrown out the script. Listen. I love that. But I, but I'm going to ask the question though, like what's in it for people coming in? Like, you know, like, why do people come to KubeCon? I talk a lot so someone else can start. Well, I, yeah, I'll, I'll say that I came to KubeCon because I was faced with like a kind of an insurmountable like challenge of taking like an organization that developed like these huge applications in formulating into microservice. And I was like, where the hell do I even start? Let me go talk to some people that know what they're doing and are in the community and try to at least get some like advice or a direction. So that's why I joined. I do think that one of the biggest like gains from coming to a KubeCon event is the community and the people you meet because I've been able to leverage those relationships when I'm having like just a challenging conversation or I'm talking to leadership about the why. There's people that have done this before that you can leverage in the community and talk to you about it. And it really is a great thing to lean on or even just vent about like the challenges that you're going through. And a lot of times I, you know, when you're coming up with solutions, if you talk to somebody and like throw it against the wall and have to have a sounding board, you're able to get the solution. So I think that that's a great benefit of coming to KubeCon. How about you Constance? Constance? Yeah. So definitely like the collaboration part, right? It's getting to meet other people who are like, because I think we forget, especially, I guess this is what's really cool about like things being more open source now is that we forget that a lot of people are solving the same problems. And this is a great venue to go like, what is it, BrainShare? Like solve these things, issues, right? Like I actually think we should have whiteboards everywhere at KubeCon. Maybe we'll see if we can get that done for the, hopefully if L.A. is in person and things keep on being good. But yeah, it's definitely like the community, the collaboration. I have been more involved in projects that actually get to see people in person, right? Like just like I've been messaging you, talking to you on GitHub and like a few like virtual meetings and to actually get to know that person, like, you know, like share a coffee and or drink or food and get to know them at a more personal level and build that community. It's also a little bit of like celebration, right? I think for like either as a speaker or like contributor, you get to see how impactful your work was, is like for me, so in 2018, I was a part of the keynote for Envoy when we graduated and just like realizing like, holy crap, like I'm a part of something that is so big and I never like, one, I never realized that it was possible and two, just seeing how much people appreciate and how much people want to engage with it. It's just like, it's really fun to get to see your hard work be celebrated. Celebrate with others, yeah. No doubt. How about you, Steven? So I guess my first like cloud native event-ish thing was actually like tectonic summit, maybe back in 2016 or something, 2016, 2017. Shout out, shout out, Eric Parker, shout out. What up? So that one, I think Redbeard was MCing and at the time I was a customer of CoreOS. So the event that I went to after that was CoreOS Fest and at that point I was a CoreOS employee. So it's, so really at that point, it had become about friends, right? Like there are people, there are friends and coworkers that you've been kind of like in the community minds or something kind of, you know? But, you know, outside of that, I, you know, to what Jasmine and to what Constance were saying, like it really is about the community, it really is about like being able to connect with these people on a deeper level. Like you, you know, whether you're working in one of the cloud native landscape projects or you are a consumer of one of these projects, being able to like meet up with someone and go like, I was stuck on this thing and like you helped, like are you the one who approved my PR or something or like you sponsored me for, you know, Kubernetes member org membership, something like that. I never, as a, I know it's like sacrilege, but I never, I don't attend a lot of the keynotes. I, and when I was rather, when I was on- Stop annoying revelation here. I'm not like live. Me too. Steve and I talk about this all the time. But I, you know, so as a, as an attendee, I wasn't really attending the keynotes as much. I was spending more time like going to a co-worker's talk or a friend's talk or like hallway track, hallway track all day, you know, SIG late night, SIG karaoke, all of that stuff because it really is, it's one of those times, like once a quarter, you know, maybe even once a year if you're not traveling to all of the cube cons that you get to actually connect on a really deep level with the folks that you work with every day. So definitely from the maintainer side, it's that. I think from the end user side or the I'm just getting started side, we built an entire track for this because we thought it was that important, right? Coming in for the first time, like this is daunting. There are, you know, there are memes about the CNCF landscape and like the puzzles and all of the stuff. It is, it is crazy daunting. So if we can provide an experience on a single track where you can just come in and get a, you know, get the Alucard menu of like these really great things to take home with you, that's huge. So I think being able to like come and learn from people who are creating the thing every day, like that's an experience you can't beat. No doubt. I'm gonna talk to you all about just something that I'm thinking it's been a pretty, I feel so like in my heart, I feel so sorry for you all for one respect. This has been a really difficult for a live event that like, you know, people go to, it's been hard to be a co-chair and like, I'm friends with you all. Like that's the reality of it. And I, you know, I wanna make sure that like, you all get that moment where you can keynote and be in stage and see in front of people because that to me is, you know, you all deserve that. Right? And I just wanna say that I'm off the script again. Somebody rip up some paper. But so like, you know, to me it was like, that is a challenge in this pandemic, not being able to do that. Like, let's talk about some of those challenges. Talk about, again, like not being able to do these live and just doing virtual and hopefully an LA will be able to do this, but let's talk about that a little bit to challenges. One side note, wait, Steven, one thing, if people have ideas for like, cause actually as you were talking to Steven, I was realizing like, we're gonna start thinking about the in-person aspect if it happens, if people have ideas of like fun ways to interact with each other in like in-person, please put them in the comments so we might be able to leverage that. I was just thinking about that. I was taking notes for, go for it, Steven, sorry. Yeah, I'm just noting that Jason, what's up, what's up, Jason? Also has some great- Yeah, yeah, yeah, we'll get to Jason's question. He had some, he's now in purgatory after that. He's setting you up, he's setting you up. I see the- Oh, the Hawaiian pizza, of course, is the two-con pizza. So, yeah, so for me, I think that we are, there's an aspect of resiliency, right? Figuring out how to be resistant to a lot of the things that are happening today. And I think part of that is, part of that is realizing that you're not alone, realizing that you have the ability to kind of leverage this community, like they're not, everyone is pretty friendly, I would say. And happy to help you out how they can. So I think, you know, a lot of, a lot of like, I think one of the hardest things that we have to do was start the shift in Amsterdam, right? As Amsterdam was going from physical to virtual, and it was kind of like, at that point, it was unknown. Like, what exactly were we going to do? And we were like waiting for the day-by-day feedback from the Netherlands to maybe shift gears. We threw a lot of ideas at the wall, right? I mean, even what we're doing right now, right? This is one of your ideas that we kind of threw out the wall and you're like, wow, this is brilliant, right? But going a little further back, then you've got like Twitch, right? Even having a cloud native, you know, a CNCF Twitch channel is a new opportunity for us, right? And being able to bring perspectives from whether it'd be a maintainer or whether it'd be, you know, end users into the picture, like that's what we're here for. So I think the going virtual has been, has been a win for the community overall. Does that mean that, does that mean we should never go physical again? Absolutely not. I miss your faces. I want to go grab dinner with you and do karaoke and just, you know, all that good stuff. But what it allows us to do over the course of the year, if you look at the changes to like the, having the Kubernetes community days, right? And kind of extending beyond the need to only be at one of the three events for the year or one of the two events for the year prior, right? So I think it's enabled, I was gonna say forced, but it's enabled us to be more imaginative in the way that we build a program for the foundation. I think as being like kind of an attendee in all those things and also being a speaker, like one of the things I thought is like, there's new, like you said, there's new opportunities and new things that popped out of it. Again, I pride myself on the hallway track. I loved being part of that. That was fantastic. And that, you wouldn't, I mean, we have a physical hallway track, but having a virtual one just was, it just added to that piece. And we had to adapt to that. And that's the whole thing I think we adapted to it, which was fantastic. Again, going around the horn, is there any thoughts on that piece? So. Jasmine, anything? I came at the end, like so Stephen and Constance, they had to like adjust like very, very like violently, you know, when I'm on set of the pandemic. So I'm kind of coming like after, like everything's a little bit normal, you know, hybrid is kind of like we have an understanding that this is the way it's going to be. So I honestly feel like, although that was a challenge, it's like, I feel good about lowering the barrier of entry for folks to attend and access this information. You talked about hallway track, like that's something, if I wasn't attending KubeCon in person, I would not be able to experience that. And like the Europe like conference, I was like looking at the channel in the morning after it was already done, because I was like Stephen and Constance were up late at night. I just looked in the morning and I was like, wow, like this is the same thing in person, like on Slack. And I can read all of the conversations that are happening in references. I think that it was really great. So I'm looking forward to how we can leverage that going forward to just make attending and this information more accessible. So. Without. Hey, I'm going to pop this question up here. I'm sorry, Constance, did you want to answer that as well? Or, but I kind of want to put this question out and ask you all to go. Yeah. I'm sorry, good. One thing it kind of jinxed. I was going to say, one thing actually kind of forced us to like think about a little bit more too is that like Kukon kind of sold itself because of the in-person aspect and also a little bit of like the marketing. And like, there's also like, you know, like the promo videos or something new and just trying to think of like, you know, how we track as an example, like gauge you without the people and also then to like Jasmine's point too is just like becoming more accessible. So like we have like Kukon has committed to always like they're being a virtual aspect of it. So like there should still be ways to like engage if you can't be there in person. And now they have before Dan. Yes, thank you. I apologize. So, you know, one of the questions popped up. And again, my nemesis Jason D. Tabiaris has this question out there, but I think it's a very legitimate question. Pizza. The question, yeah, pizza. How do you handle the challenge that no matter how much work and effort you all put into curated schedule will always be vocal folks that publicly criticize the end result. So, I'm going to answer the pizza question first. And it's bacon pineapple and jalapenos. Bacon. I'm going to abstain from this. I think we should move forward. Let's move forward, everyone. Let's move forward. So 2020. Just for reference, Dan loves Hawaiian pizza. Like loves Hawaiian pizza. This interview is over. This interview is over. Okay, but seriously, I'm going to take a harsher approach, I guess, with the response here. Over time, I think especially this year, or this year in change, I've realized that you will drive yourself insane if you try to please everyone. You cannot please everyone. As much as you strive to make information available, as much as you strive to create opportunities, there will always be detractors. There will always be people that do not understand what you're trying to do. There will be people who impute what you're trying to do without having all of the information at hand. So one of the biggest things that we are trying to do over time, and definitely like it's a matter of like sustainability to you for the program long-term, right? Like when Constance and I leave, when Jasmine, when we bring in two more chairs, when Jasmine leaves and so on and so forth, it's about transparency, right? How do we create a set of assets and a program that can be introspected pretty easily, right? So whether it's through, whether it's about program committee selection, whether it's about chair selection itself, whether it's about how we build the program, what's the actual process behind the scenes, what each of the, what the program chairs, what the program committee is expected to do, what the track chairs are expected to do, what the program chairs are expected to do, like how, like if we could pull back the curtain all the way, what would that look like, right? And as we, I think, you know, as kind of engineer-shaped people as well, when you see a bad process, you go, no, I'm like, I'm automating this, I'm deleting this, I'm doing something to this, right? Whether it's like writing an app to get rid of it or bouncing it off of a few different people, open sourcing a component of it, so on and so forth. So, you know, we have, we spend a lot of our days in like spreadsheets, right? Huge spreadsheets, multi sheets that are doing, like there's a diversity dashboard, there are all these things going on. So like one shout out to Nancy Lancaster and Brian Lyles, because at some point they sat down prior and just were like, no, this has to be just a little better than what we're doing today. So that's the, you know, that's the content that we get to work with. And hopefully we can leave something that's even better for the next round of chairs to deal with, right? But I think the answer is transparency. So we can make things more sustainable. If anyone else doesn't wanna add to that, I think that's a perfect segue into my next question, to be completely honest with you all. Like, what do you see is like, what's some advice for Jasmine, to be honest? And also other co-chairs that would come in to hear that may be watching this and being like, okay, you know, we wanna understand like, what are some pieces of advice you all would give? One, just taking a heart that, right, you're not gonna make everyone happy. And so like we're making these decisions, right? There's no such thing as a perfect decision, especially when it comes to using talk. So like you're gonna just make a decision with the information you have. And that is the best that you can do. And you can't really, you can't hold that against yourself or anyone, right? Cause the amount of time that Stephen and I have like spent like on one talk, like comparing two talks and be like, what about this? What about these things here? And like, you know, and it's like, we have probably spent on some talks like 40 minutes going back and forth and comparing to everything else. And it's like, it's just, it's a very difficult to choose all these, choose talks. I would think have fun with it. I think one of the things like, if especially we're talking about the future, I remember one thing when I was talking to Dan, hello Dan, a long time ago, was talking about how to make this like, a little more fun. That's why like, you know, that's why I'm wearing the tinfoil hat. Is that we're all like, we're here to learn and have fun. And so like, be playful with it. Like, you know, like provide a theme that or something like that. It's, there's a lot of flexibility to kind of take it where you want to go and just see how it goes. Stephen? Same, same feedback really. No, no, it's not. The, I agree. I agree that there is like, it is hard, especially the more time you spend in the community. It is, your name is on this. So it's very easy to feel like negative reactions are personal, right? It's not, it's, it's not personal. It's business. Again, you can't, you can't please everyone. You have to again, like do the most with the information that you have at the time and try to please the most people. And then you, you know, you take the feedback, you take the feedback and see how you can improve. As you go deeper and deeper into the community, you'll find that like, if people have started off as, you know, for the other hopefuls out on the stream right now, there are people who have started off as program committee members. There are people who have gone from program committee members into track chairs. One of the hardest things for me to do is like, call out a conflict of interest, right? Because like at first it's like, it's on the program committee, super easy, right? You're like, this person works on my team. Very obviously, like, or this is my project, or you know, or I'm a maintainer for the thing that is in conflict, like very obviously a conflict of interest. And then as you go deeper, you become a track chair, you know, and then it's like, I can't really call that out now. Like I have to, you know, I have to do my best to put any personal feelings aside and do, you know, again, that's what the information that you have at the time, right? And then once you're a program chair, like this is, you know, like you're looking at the short list, you know a good chunk of the people who are on it, right? So then it becomes like very much a compartmentalization exercise of like, friend, okay, over here, like as much as I would like to see you do this role or have this opportunity or do this talk again. It's hard because you have to reject, you have to reject C level people. You have to reject, you know, your best buds. You have to reject talks from your company. Like it's like, it's hard. It's hard and it's okay. I love the crazy ideas idea because some of the best stuff that we've done, I think have been like crazy ideas. Like all of the, any of the promo content you've seen, that is off the cuff. That is off the cuff Constance and I just like noodling in a room going like, you know, it'd be funny. And then we do it and we get a bunch of like creative license to do that. So again, necessity there, right? Like, you know what I mean? Cause you all were like, it's like, hey, we have to come up with a video to kind of promote this versus like doing the normal thing beyond a soundstage or whatever, you know, do the things that you normally had. And I think you all did a fantastic job considering what the hell happened out there? Like, you know, I got to give props to you. And like I said, I said it earlier, I cannot wait to be the first person to just stand up and give you standing ovation when you all do that keynote together. I will be that first person. I want you like, I want you front and center. I'm right here. I'm gonna go like this. Front and center. Constance, do it. Yes. Slow clap. I'm probably gonna cry. I'm gonna be crying too. Like I'm also like such a like an emotion. Like, I like, I'm an easy crier, especially when like all spectrums of the emotion, like I'm kind of a middle of there. They were like, just straight back. Like, when you start crying, I'm gonna start crying a little bit. So, we have another, we have another question. This one's from Puerto Rico recently, tech lead, release tech lead. Bravo to you. Bravo, congrats. Carlos and Adolfo. Well, I wonder how things are looking for in-person attendance. Are folks getting ready to get together and travel or does it look like the majority still prefer to stay at home and or can't travel? Ooh, it is, I think the answer to most things, it depends. So, there are lots of factors at play for folks, especially it's not just if you want to go, can you actually go, right? Or like, who is in your bubble? Are you immunocompromised? Do you have shots? Are you comfortable like social anxiety? Are you comfortable being around people where you don't know their immunization status? The, a lot of companies have travel bans, right? You may not even be able to go because you won't be reimbursed for attending or your company just does not want you to do it. So there are lots of things at play that doesn't make that an easy answer. I am personally like, I'm vaccinated, I'm ready. I'm like, I'm itching to see you all. Yeah. How about you, Jasmine? Yeah, what's your thoughts on what Puerto Rico said? I like, plus one, everything Steven said, like everyone's situation is different. And I think that we're doing our best to accommodate like all different situations and make sure that everyone can have a great time. I'm gonna be there. I am going to have a lot of fun and I'm excited to like see all, everyone in person and to like have all this great collaboration in, cause I've been, I've been like, like Steven, I've been itching for like the highlight of my year was like going to conferences. I have an eight year old and that would be like my adult time. I haven't had that in a whole year. I need it. So I'm excited to go. Is everybody like, she's got an eight year old. You don't look like you have an eight year old. You're gorgeous. I'm sorry, I'm gonna throw it out there. You're beautiful. So in terms of in general, like that's fantastic. Let me, so let me, let me ask you this. I wanna again, double click on Jasmine a couple more seconds. Like, what is it like, you know, from, especially from a co-chair perspective, like what is it like some of the things like you're like, wow, I'm so, I'm so psyched about these things coming in as a co-chair that I wanna help, you know, foster and even grow even further. Yeah, I think that Stephen alluded to it, just the transparency, right? Like making sure that everyone knows the processes that we have in place as co-chairs and can input improvements to it. So exposing it as docs, right? I'll put it out there because I would just wanna make it better. I think you should always leave it in any environment you in better than you found it. So just making it known, right? And then we'll take that feedback, incorporate it from all directions and then making it better. So I'm looking forward to that mostly. Fantastic. All right, so let me ask you about this. Just KubeCon and joining, this is the future part, right? Future events. We talked about some things that would be cool, but let's like put our hats on, like no, like Priyanka, look away, okay? Hear muffs, hear muffs. If there was no budget restraints and you were having the perfect KubeCon, tell me about, who wants to take that one first? You gave us too few parameters. Yeah, I need that constraint. There's no restraints, like this is like the perfect, let's plan the perfect KubeCon. Unlimited access, right? You know, again, going back to the whole like, people can't attend for various reasons, right? There are already various scholarship opportunities for people, but like if you said you wanted to go to KubeCon and you were a maintainer for literally anything in the landscape, like done. The idea of, like I personally love Contributor Summit for the Kubernetes side, that is like a day zero event. And essentially what happens is like, we plan a cool thing and we, you know, we have some food, have some drinks and just kind of all the Kubernetes maintainers hang out. We also have like new contributor, like there's like a current contributor's track and then there's like a new contributor's track. So we haven't, I feel like we haven't done the, a version of that, like to the same energy that we have if we were in person in a little bit. And like having that be a multi-day thing would make me excited. The day zero events have, there are too many, there are too many things to do. That is awesome and it is terrible simultaneously, right? Because for any one person who is kind of involved or has multiple hats and they're kind of in like multiple day zeros, but they're also in like events or they're running a sponsor booth, or they're going to be on stage. It's hard to like split yourself in that many pieces and give the same amount of attention to each of those pieces. So multi-week, I don't know, like have it too much. Are we going too crazy? But like spreading the day zeros out into, you know, and giving them the attention that they would need, right? Yeah, there's so much cool stuff going on that I don't see, right? Occasionally I'll see something cool, I'm like, cool, retweet, like, oh my God, what is this, this is happening. And sometimes you straight up, you miss it. Like this week was like maintainer week and there were various events that they did for open source maintainers. I didn't get to go to any of those. I don't really want it to, right? So it's one of those things where like, now we have all of these events that are kind of stacked on top of each other and it's hard to like give that mental energy to each one. So you're forced to choose. So giving more space for that when we go back to physical. And I know this one's in LA. Doing a cool event that's outside of like the conference center, right? So there's a previous cube kind of, I think, of San Diego where folks went out to Disney land, where land, is that the one? Bibiland, okay, yeah. So they did like Qubiland. So I think it was like Justin Garrison and a few other folks worked on putting that together. Yeah. All right, so Constance, well, again, dream cube on perfect coupon. All right, so when initially I was thinking it'd be really nice if we're like in an all inclusive resort, somewhere like in like warm weather, but it's also cause now like Canada announced that they reduced restriction for the vaccine, Canadian, so like my family might be able to come down soon. Very excited about that. But I actually think one thing kind of like, at least like more related to content is like actually like really good trainings and workshops, like trainings around like, you know, maybe like, let's do even like CFP submissions, but also like, you know, really detailed workshops and I don't know, just like evenly training about like, you know, like better mentorship things. Like we have to like, especially if we have like a million budget that we can get like some really high profile people to kind of give these workshops and trainings and I think that'd be really fun. And yeah, better coffee. I'm gonna say it better, better coffee in the morning and better snacks cause as a Seattle coffee snouts. Okay, counterpoint, counterpoint. Counterpoint, we just made the conference at night. Like that is where I can't say at the late anymore. Not everyone is on a Steven and Augustus time zone. No comment. All right, Jasmine. Yeah. Jasmine, question? Yeah, yeah. So I'm definitely on the same wavelength as Constance. Like just, you know, obviously we have great diversity in the open source community, but just continuing to push that, right? And making things more available, you know, supporting people from non-traditional backgrounds to be exposed to cloud native, like them through mentorship, through classes, things of that nature. Contributor summit, also a fantastic idea because I do feel like one of the ways that a lot of people get involved with coding and development. So leveraging open source, but not knowing how to contribute to that. So inviting those folks to make, build relationships and then find mentors so that they can become contributors within the cloud native environment. I somehow, I pictured like a better version of the fire fest meets cube con. So you're setting the bar really low. What? Well, the fire fest, not the actual, not the implement, like the reference architecture, not the implementation. The implementation of the fire fest, we all would be eating like nothing, a cheese sandwich. Do you ever see that? Like oh, she had a blurb here. Yes. Yeah, yeah. But yeah, all those thoughts and great coffee is always a win. So yeah. But like the hype factor, the hype factor, like the festival vibe of that, like yeah. I mean, we're, you're all, you're all superstars. Like why not, why not do something that's indicative of that, right? Yeah. So the only thing I guess, like more of the quiet spaces, cause like, so I'm an extra introvert and I could be extra for like an hour or two and then I need to hide. And so we need to make sure too, it's not so overwhelming for those who, you know, appreciate a more introverted interaction. So maybe more puppies and kittens and like, you know, maybe like some hypoallergenic ones and other little type of those like comforts and overjuvenating experience. Cappy boroughs perhaps? There you go. Is that a go in? No. But are, do they, can they really be petted though? They probably can. Can we get Cappy boroughs? Like is that a, can we put that on the list? Yes. Someone, please. Someone? Anybody? Who's got that one? Goats. All right. Goats and this are also apparently Cappy boroughs as well. So with that final question here, closing thought, who had just our closing thought here, who has their kind of, what are they thinking? What's, what's something they want to kind of impart with it in the world right now? I don't know who wants to take that one first. About cube Connor in general. General. Okay. So I guess, I guess the biggest one is I've been noting, I've been noticing and I think a lot of people have like just the people around edge a little bit, right? A lot bit actually. Interactions that you would normally have with people seem harder to do. So hashtag be kind, right? Take a little bit more time to try to understand the situation that you're in or the perspective that people are coming from and ask the question sometimes, right? Like if you're in, if you're in like a weird situation and you're like, we've never been in this situation before. Like what's happening? Like actually say like, are you okay? Do you need to talk about something that might not be this thing? Because that's coming out in a lot of our communication right now. So take a little extra time with how you communicate, be clear, like have intent and try to bring your, try to bring that honesty into everything that you do. Like even if it's a, like it's an issue, it's a pull request. It's a, you know, even if you sound a little snarky on something like try to, try to pull that back. Constance. I need another minute to think. All right. Jasmine? I was kind of formulating this more of from a like cube con perspective. So maybe I'll approach it from that angle. I just, my closing thoughts are I first want to make sure I give a public shout out to Steven and Constance just for embracing me and the co-chair just circle of love. It's been great. I'm really excited to kind of take, I'm really excited to take this on with new co-chairs and like you all have created a great culture and you've done a great job over the past couple of years. And I'm just looking forward to what comes next. We've already seen like a lot of growth, like I'm coming from an end user perspective. We now have three co-chairs. So I'm really excited about the different perspectives and how that's going to just really evolve cube con experience for everyone. So yeah, I just want to say thank you and looking forward to it. The only thing I can say right now is everyone get vaccinated. Like let's make it safe for everyone to be out in the world. Cause I think it's very, one thing I'm kind of realizing is like how privileged we are, at least if you're in the States, any in North America and place that have access to vaccines we're so privileged to have those vaccines. So let's not waste those and make it a safer place for everyone. Fantastic. Cause I think part of the thing we're talking about was people being able to come to LA, right? Like if they don't have, if they're not vaccinated, it's gonna be really dangerous for them, right? And so like let's make sure that we know all that stuff there. Take care everyone. This has been great. And that helps too. Yeah, I would extend that and say like consider someone else's risk profile too, whether you are or aren't. Exactly. Don't bring that to the conference. Don't bring that to other people. Like you, you can have your opinions. Like we're trying to protect everyone. So don't bring that here. And with that everyone, I want to thank you all for being on the first, my first show, appreciate you all. I mean, again, we put this up in the, you know, I, I love you all again, really amazing people in Jasmine. Nice to meet you. Like, you know, like, and, you know, again, any family of these, these folks are folks of mine. So appreciate you. And I wish you nothing but success. So thank you all for being on the show. KubeCon, when you're here, your family. All right, y'all. Well, I'm going to close with this, everyone. So next week, we starting on Monday with, with Duffy. Duffy is being taken over this week in cloud native. I'm really excited about that. Duffy Coolie is fantastic. And you're going to see some really, really great stuff. We have another action packed week for you all on cloud native TV. Please do, do us a favor. Follow on Twitch, follow cloud native TV. We have a lot of content we have planned for you. We have amazing guests and, and, and amazing shows that we have planned for you all. But next week on spotlight live, I'm going to show a video here real quick. Before I do that, like this is going to be talking about, I'm going to be on with Dan Lawrence. Dan Lawrence is something called the six store. We're actually doing a key ceremony. Very cool. We're actually signing six keys that are five to six keys that are available for like signing for like the, something that's set up for the SIG store. It's very, very cool. It's like a once in a, like a generation type of thing. So it's very, very cool that we're covering that. And Dan's a fantastic guy. So we have a really cool show planned for you all. So take a look at this video before you do that. Listen, remember cloud native, the spotlight is on you.